#aspd tendencies

[vulgarcunt]

So sick of people with violent tendencies being censored because it’s hard to infantilize someone who wants to rip someone else to shreds or kill/torture them in any horrific way 😪 or something because that’s easier than treating people who are neurodivergent as humans.

[system-of-a-feather]

@uszkovo (This is probably toxic and maladaptive thinking but I'm using this to make a point and whatever)

Cause while I agree with that, I'm talking about long term. Firstly, in a SoCiETy with laws, solving the problem is the only long term way to get people to shut up. People will always be mad and whinge if their needs aren't met and other that killing people, the only way to make them shut up is to meet those needs. Yeah its more efficient in the short run to hurt or scare someone silent or to leave, but then they will either come back and be loud about it again, make the environment and vibes shit, or cause issues elsewhere thatd bother me again OR Ill have to forfeit an area I want to be in if I just regularly leave.

If you can't remove them from the area, then the only long term solution is to, well solve it and often solving that is just making needs get met.

Secondly, I have resources I am not using that others are whining about not having. I don't know about you but if we are talking abput easy and efficient, moving my garbage to someone else who wants it rather than the actual trash that will pollute the earth is a lot easier and more efficient then mind games, manipulation and the energy it would take to maintain any form of negative reinforcement to get them to shut up or do what I want.

People respond better and more reliably to positive reinforcement and treatment

Plus if we are looking in the long run, if you establish a positive rapport with people by providing them shit they are much more likely to listen to you in the future and respect your wishes and requests than if you have established a negative rapport to get them to respond

In short, its a long term solution cause I don't have the energy or will to keep biting heads off of people that only mildly annoy me with whinging

This however does not apply to people that greatly piss me off. I don't have the self restraint and impulse control or level of emotional regulation to put aside my personal annoyance and hate to rationally handle people who excessively piss me off and thats just real honest talk.

Writing this on short time so it might not be the best response but its what I have to give atm

EDIT: Reading back on my original post, my simple response now that I know what this was responding to in the first place is simply

Why wouldn't I? My garbage is just sitting there rotting, whats so difficult about moving my garbage 10 ft to where it won't rot and ALSO make someone shut up.

My main issue aint whingey whining people. My main issue is the inefficiency of people. Solving whining people is a silverlining and secondary bonus to just doing what makes fucking sense. Im not motivated inherently to make whining people shut up. Im motivated to not let my trash rot pointlessly when it can be doing something with 0.2% more effort.

-XIV

Riku's clowning over the fact that despite me being the largest NPD/ASPD trait havers in the system, that I am also the most """charity""" motivated - and I put that in big """ """" cause I really hate calling it that and framing it as that - cause everyones like "People with NPD / ASPD are inherently EVIL and inherently abusers yee haw oui oui I'm so special I have empathy"

And I'm gonna try to exercise some cognitive empathy and assume the reason empathy-havers are like that is because (in my experience and opinion who has felt guilt and remorse like, once or twice and never want to again) empathy is a fucking curse and horrible thing to feel and experience. Its such a negative motivator to do things and its very good at making people feel so bad that they feel the need to "do something good" to relieve the tension and misery that having empathy is. So I don't think its to much of a stretch that people with empathy and "eMpAThS" are so used to having their empathy holding them at fucking gun point 24/7 that they don't understand that you don't NEED to feel like shit to see that shits flawed and stupidly broken for literally no reason.

Like I have very very very low empathy - may that be due to autism, trauma, or whatever, I literally could count the times Ive experienced what I think is empathy on one hand (albeit I do have memory issues so do with that what you will) and the reason I try to help people and donate shit is the same reason I literally do all my shit - positive or not - and its simply cause I don't see a good answer to "why not", "why shouldn't I"

Like back when I was younger and a lot more immature and in the depths of trauma, yeah I never would have because my question was "why SHOULD I do anything nice for anyone" and I'd look at people struggling and go "lol you just suck get good at life why are you struggling lol you and your stupid decisions and shut the fuck up your whining is annoying"

But like, you grow the fuck up and you actually see how shit in the world works and that question of "why are you struggling get good mate and shut the fuck up your whining is annoying" gets answered with a "yeah life sucks people are corrupt the system is broken and they've been trapped in a quicksand pit of poverty so the rich can get richer and the poor can get poorer"

Which then, with my chronic "why are you whining do something about it or shut the fuck up" ass to better or worse I go "okay then why are they having to whine, feed them so they can shut the fuck up" cause like, so much fucking food is thrown away from every household of people who buy too much and don't eat it or buy food that they find out they dont like

So like why the fuck aren't we putting 5 minutes out of our day when we clean out our fridges to bring it to the local homeless person / family / impoverished individual who has to beg for survival shit to get them through the day?

Like literally Why Not?

And like I think a lot of other NPD/ASPD havers are sometimes caught up in the fact that being angry, mad, dominant, and "uncaring" is this huge defense mechanism and crap to make them feel secure - at least to some level - and so the thought that being """charitable""" sounds anti-intuitive to their sense of self, but like, whats edgier and more anti-systemic anti-societal normas anti-capitalist and ""punk"" than looking at the stupid shit we're conditioned to and being secure enough in your life, identity, and ability to care for yourself that you can casually help someone struggling

Like empathy havers are like "UWU IF YOU DONT FEEL BAD FOR THEM YOUD NEVER DO ANYTHING NICE" like

No like, its just fucking STUPID to not. It's inefficient. Like I'm not gonna act like I don't care about helping out cause like I'm not a fraud and yeah, giving someone something nice is a small pat on the back - but largely for me its literally just a matter of WHY NOT.

Like WHY. What reason is there to NOT do it? Like completely valid if you don't have the money, spoons, physical ability and all to do it - this is not a matter of "give out more than you can" but a comment on "if you HAVE excess and more than you need and more than you can use why NOT give it out to some who will use it"

It literally just does not make sense on a completely and purely logic / rational basis. If you are going to let your shit sit, rot, and join a trash pile in the middle of the Atlantic, why not give it to someone who could use it - let their day and maybe multiple days be good for a bit, give them less of a need to work hard and sit baking out in the sun and lessen the amount of waste and garbage polluting the earth.

Like I don't fucking need empathy for this to be so frustratingly stupid to see being a "norm" in the world where people just DONT. I don't need someone putting a fucking emotional gun to my head to be motivated to do something that just makes basic fucking common sense and I don't need to be baited with intense feel good dopamine to do it.

Like Imma be fucking Ben Shapiro here and come on guys its fucking FACTS and LOGIC, it doesn't have to be this whole uwu empathy uwu think of the children uwu shit. It can literally be "this is a broken system and it just fucking pisses me off so to be a little less pissed off at how stupid and irrational the system is I do what people SHOULD be doing because I CAN and why the FUCK would I perpetuate the stupid normalized ideas that are FUCKING STUPID."

Ugh. Jesus fucking christ I hate America and Capitalism and just this stupid fucking country honest to god. I don't know if its as bad elsewhere (probably) but jesus christ.

-XIV

[autopsyfreak]

the question is do i fill my chronic boredom with destructive decisions or with sex

[multiplesillylittleguys]

My god complex makes life so much easier for me

It also makes me want to violently murder anyone who acts like they're better than me in any way.

-Maia

[psychiatricwarfare]

i see so many posts on this site being like "i want someone who is obsessed with me" "get me a partner who will smother me" "i need you to want to crawl inside my skin" etc etc etc but what about those of us who want to lovingly sit near each other without speaking and just exist with each other? what about those of us who aren't very traditionally romantic but still crave intimacy? those of us who wont remember to text you 24/7 or always be okay with touching or talking but still have so much love in our hearts and want to be able to express that in our own way? those of us who hate most romcoms because theyre too cheesey and sappy but would be delighted to watch some dumb comedy or a movie thats so-bad-its-good so we can make fun of it the whole time?

i consider myself a romantic, but my version of romance is so far off from what ive seen anyone else talk about, but i Know i cant be alone in this. so if youre a non-romantic romantic, just know you are worthy of love and if i can manage to find not one but Two partners who love me for who i am and my lack of traditional romance, then so can you

[ladynicte]

I really wish I could understand what the hell is wrong with Andrew

like with Ashley it's so easy for me to see a traumatized girl whose parents didn't love her enough who lands pretty high end on a sociopathy scale and therefore has got an awful time trying to fit in into the groups around her

those around her can tell there's something off about her and wind up leaving her alone making her see herself as forced to manipulate and abuse her brother into staying with her to the point of creating a codependent emotionally incestuous relationship

but like its not just her

theres something wrong with andrew too and i cant figure out what it is like he isn't just stuck into the caretaker role with Ashley beyond purposefully choosing her to keep taking care of her

like he kills people too hes alright with screwing anybody else over if it means staying with her

like what's wrong with him he definitely doesnt seem to be the same as Ashley because he did have a girlfriend and apparently some friends before they got locked away into their apartment

and before Ashley harassed them into abandoning him

so does he just see himself as intrinsically linked to her like his whole identity has become just being able to take care of her

is it self loathing as well that he's different from the rest and he needs her to be there to be able to keep blaming her for his own misdeeds

Does he just love her so he doesnt want to let go of her and is willing to stand through everything for his love

and i guess they are trauma bonded together as well as only having each other maybe he is also afraid he wotn make it on his own without ashley by his side without some motive to live

is he that haunted by his own actions that he literally cannot bare to live if he doesnt have somebody else to take the burden for him so he cannot let go of the only person who helps him with that

Ashley also said its because shes the only person he can be real with that he cant bare to lose her but beyond the 'you cant sleep withouth me' claim andrew didnt dispute her

god i dont get that guy at all i love him so much

[thevoidshere88]

My little sister is a bit h a stupid one at that

She's so fucking annoying she ain't sh t she tries to act like me be like me and it infuriates me she can fuk off

Trying to act like a fighter or violent person pssh fucking hilarious she's a pussy if she actually got into a fight she'd piss herself scared

I've fought since I was a child my mom literally had to put a lock on her bedroom door (not proud /just for reference)

I've fought a grown ass man when I was just a teen and won the fight granted I spent

a whole whopping month in juvenile jail but whatever (my fault)

I'd at this point i'd love to fight her and put her in her rightful place (bloody n on the ground)

I've done it with one sister I'll do it again

If she doesn't stop disrespecting our mother and being a cvnt I will definitely do so gladly

[devilbimboy]

I’m still in the process of stopping myself from regurgitating ideas just because I was told it was a moral obligation.

“You shouldn’t NOT want to be with people. you need to not be lonely” and “killing is wrong” is somehow carried with the same emphasis, so my brain automatically goes, “yeah, they carry the same moral weight!” since I cope with antisocial tendencies + very very bad homicidal ideation.

Turns out, one is a preference of a way of living and the other is just “no you shouldn’t do that. It’s illegal.”

[lilliryth]

Seeing as I just got my diagnosis of level 1 autism (what used to be called “Asperger’s”) coincidentally at the same time that my partner and I started watching NBC’s Hannibal series, I’ve been having a couple thoughts about neurotypical vs. neurodivergent experiences regarding “toggling” different emotional responses. Motivation, empathy, fear, etc. are malleable to some, fixed to others; and sometimes, to those who aren’t born with an automatic reflex in one area or another, it’s a little like breathing or blinking on purpose.

Sometimes (and I think this is the autism at play, now that I have a chance to reframe most of my behavioral tendencies in a new light), someone will tell me a joke, or mention something funny—you know how it is, something genuinely funny—enough to “tickle” my internal sense of humor. But sometimes, even though it does, I feel no physiological urge to laugh.

So, when that happens, I kind of just … pull one out manually.

Sure, some people might think it’s disingenuous. One might make the claim that I don’t actually feel any appreciation for the joke, and instead it is societal pressure to placate the other that motivates me to do it. But the thing is … it’s not. It just isn’t. Even if it doesn’t sound like amusement without dialing up my affect, I do find it funny. It’s just that sometimes a wire in my brain doesn’t quite connect, and I have to push to make the appropriate Human Sounds in order to indicate that I just experienced humor.

The sensation is there, but the action is mindful. Even if I slip up or forget or aren’t diligent enough with how it sounds, I know for a fact that I did find the joke funny, even if the teller thinks I’m only politely going along with it. From what I understand about identifying emotions, it would seem that there is no difference between a choice and a reflex.

This is one example. There are many others, and they all relate to different experiences and emotional deficits. Fake laugh? Ehhh. Intentional laugh? Oh, definitely.

And I think sometimes, for certain individuals, loving is a bit like that, too.

[bloodcxlt]

need advice for aspd homocidal tendencies

(vent below, cw gruesome animal death)

i only disassemble dead animals. i never kill animals. dead bugs and roadkill and natural deaths i will cut apart but holy shit. this morning has been so fucking awful for no good reason

i feed the birds and squirrels, so there’s always a busy backyard. it’s perfectly legal for me to set a trap on my property. it’s legal to kill it humanely, but as i thought about feeding them peanut butter rat poison, i saw that “two blows to the head” is acceptable.

i can hear it screaming and it curdles my blood in such a good way. i want to hear it shriek and try to run away from me, i want it to scramble in the trap, defenseless, and i want to see its brain head under a rock.

i’m too keyed up to dissect it, and i would have to get rid of it relatively quickly. i can spend some time getting all of my anger out, stabbing or blunt force. if i killed something, i may as well go all out. what if im not fully satisfied at the end? what do i do, kill another? no. i have to keep it contained.

i’ve spent more time than i’d like to admit researching squirrel traps. i don’t want to kill an animal. animals haven’t done anything wrong. i can’t kill a person.

[npdfaust]

the borderline symptoms in early to mid-teens to npd sublimation cope pipeline

[coffinsister]

no idea how you are irl but at least on here you come across as needy yes but like in a cute ashley kind of way? like idk maybe im just into that but like your whole vibe is well... needy little sister and also based and gay anti-corpo. i dig the whole vibe

Aww, are you saying you are into me~?

Jeje sorry I jest, this message is just really nice though. I vibe with your vibes too ^-^

I am really needy tbh, irl I do my best to not be so needy and be as normalpilled as possible, with mixed success, but you know, the attempt is made.

I do my best to stay based, but also, genuinely, I really do hate corporations and capitalism as a whole with a burning passion. I'm actually an unironic anarchist as well, so yeah, I'm just queer and disabled and with a bone to pick with the State.

[toon-topaz]

Been playing a lotta Lethal Company lately, so what better to do than combine it with my main "acclaimed indie horror game from October 2023" hyperfixation? Slay the Company AU: The Voices are all a ramshackle crew of employees getting into deadly schenanigans, accompanied by the perpetually annoyed Narrator AI who pilots their ship. He "personally" wrote all these entries. Text under the cut:

SHIP LOG

EMPLOYEE PROFILE

Name: Harlow Brine Role: Captain Age: [REDACTED] Gender: Transmasculine Non Binary Pronouns: he/they

Favorite animal: Crow

Height: 168cm Weight: 65kg

Physical health: Severe vertigo, dyspraxia

Reasons for seeking employment: "Seems like an important job"

Significant behavior reports: -Always willing to aid a coworker in danger, even at own expense

-Refuses to leave crew stranded

-Little to no patience for behavior that puts fellow employees in jeopardy

-Responsible leader

-Has been known to become insecure if too many missions go poorly

-Responds well to praise

Relevant psychological profile: Autism, PTSD

Notes: The most heroic employee

-------------

SHIP LOG

EMPLOYEE PROFILE

Name: Ches Bishop Role: Hazard Disposal Age: [REDACTED] Gender: Transgender Female Pronouns: she/her

Favorite animal: Hyena

Height: 170cm Weight: 90kg

Physical health: Evidence of multiple insufficiently healed fractures causing pain

Reasons for seeking employment: "Whatever game you're playing at, I'm going to win. One of these days I'll be the one holding the cards."

Significant behavior reports: -Extreme anger at any perceived injustices, regardless of whom is the victim

-Reckless behavior in the name of "winning"

-Obsessive focus on securing circuit beehives, concerned with acquiring the "best loot"

-Persistent belief that some force is conspiring against her, erratic behavior in response to perceived confirmation of this

-Often sustains the most injuries

-Foul language, namely directed at the Company and the local wildlife

Relevant psychological profile: ASD, Anger Issues, Issues with authority

Notes: The most cheated employee

-------------

SHIP LOG

EMPLOYEE PROFILE

Name: Koi Harlequin Role: Scouting Age: [REDACTED] Gender: Nonbinary Pronouns: they/them

Favorite animal: Lemur

Height: 157cm Weight: 69kg

Physical health: Hypermobile

Reasons for seeking employment: "Got nothing better to do and hey you guys need someone to check your authority right?"

Significant behavior reports: -Lackadaisical and cavalier attitude towards danger

-Destructive behavior, has been observed "playing" with dangerous artifacts (refer to "Mask Incident" log)

-Blatant disregard for orders

-Always quick to crack a joke or humorous comment

-Fond of "noisemakers"

-Lazy, frequently goofs off at work

-Has been observed to act more subdued around Captain Brine

Relevant psychological profile: ADHD, ODD, Pathological disregard for authority

Notes: The most contrarian employee

-------------

SHIP LOG

EMPLOYEE PROFILE

Name: Verglas Givral Role: Body Retrieval Age: [REDACTED] Gender: Agender Pronouns: any/all

Favorite animal: Jellyfish

Height: 176cm Weight: 66kg

Physical health: Undernourished, poor circulation, extremely high pain tolerance

Reasons for seeking employment: "Bored."

Significant behavior reports:

-Total disregard for own bodily safety, acts on impulse and little else

-Tendency to disappear from radars and sustains poor if any communication with team

-Highly efficient at job, presumably in an effort to get it done faster

-Has put fellow employees and self in dangerous situations for "fun"

-Total apathy to danger of any kind

Relevant psychological profile: anti-social behavior, possible ASPD, ASD

Notes: The coldest employee

-------------

SHIP LOG

EMPLOYEE PROFILE

Name: Penelope "Penny" Cassandre Role: Medic Age: [REDACTED] Gender: Transgender Female Pronouns: she/her

Favorite animal: Moth

Height: 163cm Weight: 48kg

Physical health: Undernourished, arrhythmia, asthma (requires pacemaker and inhaler functions in suit)

Reasons for seeking employment: "You're my last option, but that doesn't mean I trust you. I know you don't have our best interests in mind."

Significant behavior reports: -Extreme paranoia, frequently checking over shoulder for threats

-Tendency to panic if left in stressful situations

-Panic attacks can seemingly only be resolved by repeated chanting of the following: "Heart. Lungs. Liver. Nerves."

-Has on several occasions claimed to be stalked by a "ghost girl wearing a porcelain doll mask"

-Contact is often unable to be made for several minutes/hours after such claims

-Tendency to become snappy with coworkers when stressed

-Exemplary at corralling coworkers out of danger via walkie-talkie and radar usage

Relevant psychological profile: Hallucinations, extreme paranoia, delusions, possible psychosis

Notes: The most paranoid employee

------------

SHIP LOG

EMPLOYEE PROFILE

Name: Striker March Role: Combat Age: [REDACTED] Gender: Cisgender Female Pronouns: he/him

Favorite animal: Honey badger

Height: 182cm Weight: 81kg

Physical health: Muscle and joint damage due to chronic overexertion

Reasons for seeking employment: "To surpass myself, throw everything you've got at me."

Significant behavior reports: -Disregard for physical injury, even an affinity for danger

-Easily provoked into physical altercations

-Always the last to remain on site

-Despondent if idle for too long

-Has on multiple occasions survived fatal injuries, apparently through sheer force of will

-Insists on remaining on site to fight the local fauna, going against direct orders to do so

-Has attempted to fight the Company with a shovel, more than once

-Frequently returns to one location specifically to wrestle one specific Thumper, for unknown reasons

Relevant psychological profile: Anger issues, possible ADHD

Notes: The most stubborn employee

------------

SHIP LOG

EMPLOYEE PROFILE

Name: Acorn Fissure Role: Medical Assistant Age: [REDACTED] Gender: Agender Pronouns: he/they/it

Favorite animal: Woodlouse

Height: 130cm Weight: 45kg

Physical health: Dwarfism, requires mobility aids

Reasons for seeking employment: "Nowhere else would take me."

Significant behavior reports: -Chronically upset, especially on missions

-Defeatist attitude, will lie down and await death if cornered

-Sleeps whenever not working, rarely leaves ship unless required

-Struggles to carry even light objects

-Despite danger avoidance, is frequently injured

-Fanatical obsession with Company, to the point of deification

-Intense self loathing and mood swings

-Seeks out comfort wherever possible

Relevant psychological profile: Severe Depression, BPD, C-PTSD

Notes: The most broken employee

------------

SHIP LOG

EMPLOYEE PROFILE

Name: Scorpio Sophus Role: Research Specialist Age: [REDACTED] Gender: Cisgender male Pronouns: he/him

Favorite animal: Octopus

Height: 173cm Weight: 70kg

Physical health: Myopia

Reasons for seeking employment: "Something's going on here, and I want to get to the bottom of it."

Significant behavior reports: -Questions everything, always seeking more information

-Scans everything and logs it into a personal database

-Slow to trust

-Slow to take action, hesitant to do anything until he believes he has enough information to make a decision

-Mathematically precise, highly intelligent

-That said, often lets curiosity get the better of him without considering risks

-Iron grip on ship's budget

-Able to bypass security doors and hack systems, does so liberally

Relevant psychological profile: ASD, High intelligence

Notes: The most skeptical employee

------------

SHIP LOG

EMPLOYEE PROFILE

Name: Philip "Sakura" Smith Role: Repair Specialist Age: [REDACTED] Gender: Amaregender (gender mirrors that of peers) Pronouns: he/she

Favorite animal: Dove

Height: 160cm Weight: 70kg

Physical health: Benign cardiac irregularity

Reasons for seeking employment: "Alas I must venture far away to support my beautiful wife."

Significant behavior reports: -Extremely dramatic and theatrical

-Takes any opportunity to talk about his wife

-Angry outbursts at anybody speaking ill of said wife

-Has proven to be emotionally unstable

-Willing to sacrifice self for crewmates

-Responds favorably to romantic advances, states this is acceptable within his marriage (wife has verified this)

-Very willing to forgive if one plays into his fantasies

-Intense rivalry with Verglas Givral

Relevant psychological profile: emotional instability, intense attachments

Notes: The most smitten employee

------------

SHIP LOG

EMPLOYEE PROFILE

Name: Orion Quicksilver Role: Pilot Age: [REDACTED] Gender: Genderfluid Pronouns: any/all

Favorite animal: Ferret

Height: 171cm Weight: 67kg

Physical health: Scoliosis

Reasons for seeking employment: "Who doesn't want the honor of working for the greatest company in the nebula? Even before it was the only one, I knew it was the best, I just had to get a slice of that pie, I'm something of a go-getter. A businessman if you will--" [continues on for 20 minutes, removed for archival convenience]

Significant behavior reports: -Follows the group no matter what, keeps opinions to self unless beneficial

-Sucks up to figure with most authority

-Struggles to form strong bonds with crew, despite being friendly with everyone

-Acts extremely guarded and insincere, almost seems to be a pathological liar

-Ready and willing to leave coworkers for dead if it means securing own escape

-Excellent fighter when all nonviolent options have been exhausted

-Rarely takes risks, yet always first to take credit for success

-Obsessed with appearance of being a "team player"

Relevant psychological profile: ASD, possible HPD

Notes: The most opportunistic employee

------------

SHIP LOG

EMPLOYEE PROFILE

Name: Holly Faun Role: ?? Age: [REDACTED] Gender: Unspecified Pronouns: it/its

Favorite animal: Mouse deer

Height: 158cm Weight: 50kg

Physical health: Signs of starvation, vestiges of parasite infestation

Reasons for seeking employment: [DATA LOST]

Significant behavior reports: -Was discovered on abandoned planet in semi-feral state

-Rarely speaks aloud, prefers to communicate through gesture and clicking

-Drags around a mass of leaves, supposedly for camouflage

-Skittish and territorial, especially over crew it has decided to protect

-Certain crew members, who shall remain anonymous, suspect it of being nonhuman, notably a "Bracken in disguise"

-Theory is unsubstantiated, although it wears an outdated suit and helmet model

-Despite nervous disposition, it is open and honest with those it trusts

Relevant psychological profile: Stunted psychological development, further screening needed

Notes: The most hunted employee

GREAT ASSETS TO THE COMPANY

[antisocialsharky]

Hello! I just wanted to say that I've been using some of your posts talking about ASPD to help me better understand it to write an OC I'm writing. I have a question though, do you mind talking about more symptoms of ASPD that I should keep in mind when writing her?

Hi! Very glad to hear that my posts have been helpful and its cool that you are aiming for good representation!

When it comes to how ASPD symptoms should be written and which ones should make it into literature, theres different opinions, so this is gonna go a bit beyond your question I guess? Just to get a roundabout view.

1. Recovery Position

• First thing to rly keep in mind is that the intensity of the symptoms, the way they present and the way the character would deal with them, absolutely depends on where they are in recovery.

• It also depends on what you understand as recovery, be that the reducing of overall symptoms so they are less often present, the act of reducing the harm that is done by your symptoms (ex: trough redirection, or actively learning prosocial behavior) or just learning to find a way to live in society the way you are. No ones view on recovery or the way they go about it (or if they decide not to) is in any way better or superior, but it is an aspect that does change how many symptoms you show in which way, so its important to think about when writing a character.

2. Covert/Overt Symptom Presentation

• Another thing to think about, depending on what fits into your story, is the question as to whether your character is very obviously antisocial, or whether they go about it in a more covert secret way. Can they control which symptoms they show when? Or are they lost to their impulses and emotions? Do they come from a background where hiding their symptoms was essential, or were they able/forced to present obviously?

• Theres also a more mixed presentation where some symptoms are more obvious and others are not, depending on stuff like what meets your needs best, how much control you have and whether or not you've done any active work on the symptoms yet, etc.

• Then you can also think about the personal opinion of your character on symptom presentation. Do they believe that they should get to just be themselves? Are they of the opinion that people just have to deal with their symptoms and accept them that way? Or do they think that they have to hide some symptoms in order to fit into society better? Have they potentially adopted some prosocial ways of thinking and model their presentation after that? Depending on what it is, it will obviously look different.

3. The Causes of their ASPD

• Depending on the type of trauma they went trough that made them develop ASPD, presentation will differ. Its highly individual of course, but theres some themes, like people who come from violent households often being violent themselves, people who were neglected struggling with the social aspects like empathy & remorse, people who were lied to/manipulated/berated all the time adopting similar manners, people who had to commit crimes and/or witnessed those often continuing to do so because its normal to them, etc.

• The other aspect is genetics, where certain tendencies can be given from parent to child or grandparent to grandchild, such as impulsive tendencies, the type of temper someone has, access (or denied access) to certain parts of the brain that are responsible for prosocial emotions, etc. Those genetics mix with the trauma and sometimes push the presentation in certain directions, so its a thing to keep in mind.

• Some CD/ASPD symptoms can also develop/be made worse trough bullying, intense experiences in childhood/teens, hanging around with people who engage in/normalize certain behaviors, etc. (ex: kids with delinquient tendencies who hang around other kids with those, may be more likely to develop that as a continous behavior). So its also worth thinking about who your character was around while they grew up, who influenced them how and what was normalized to them.

4. The Current DSM-V ASPD Criteria

• When it comes to the core symptoms of ASPD, theres 3 out of 7 DSM criteria points your character should meet. It doesn't matter which ones, but it has to be at least three! Your character should also be older than 18, have shown conduct disorder symptoms before they turned 15 and have their ASPD symptoms even in absence of other comorbidities, substances and/or episodes (Criterion B-D which I am not quoting, but thats it summed up)

• The 7 criteria points recognized in the DSM-V are (and I quote):

A. A pervasive pattern of disregard for and violation of rights of others, occuring since age 15 years, as indicated by three (or more) of the following:

1. Failure to conform to social norms with respect to lawful behaviors, as indicated by repeatedly performing acts that are ground for arrest.

2. Deceitfulness, as indicated by repeated lying, use of aliases or conning others for personal profit or pleasure.

3. Impulsivity or failure to plan ahead.

4. Irritability or aggressiveness, as indicated by repeated physical fights or assaults.

5. Reckless disregard for safety of self or others.

6. Consistent irresponsibility, as indicated by repeated failure to sustain consistent work behavior or honor financial obligations.

7. Lack of remorse, as indicated by being indifferent to or rationalizing having hurt, mistreated or stolen from another.

• Everything after "as indicated by" is an example of a possible presentation. The DSM-V acknowledges that there are other possible ways in which symptoms can show up.

5. The Alternative ASPD Model in the DSM-V

• This is not used to officially diagnose people with ASPD, but is one idea, as to how personality disorder classification could work in the future. It looks at the symptoms as dimensions, under which possible experiences could fall and mentions quite a few things the current criteria doesn't, so I'll quote it below as well:

A. Moderate or greater impairment in personality functioning, manifested by characteristic difficulties in two or more of the following areas:

1. Identity: Egocentrism, self esteem derived from personal gain, power or pleasure.

2. Self direction: Goal setting based on personal gratification, absence of prosocial internal standards, associated with failure to conform to lawful or culturally normative ethical behavior.

3. Empathy: Lack of concern for feelings, needs or suffering of others, lack of remorse after hurting or mistreating another.

4. Intimacy: Incapacity for mutually intimate relationships, as exploitation is primary means of relating to others, including by deceit and coercion, use of dominance or intimidation to control others.

B. Six or more of the following seven pathological personality traits:

1. Manipulativeness (an aspect of antagonism): Frequent use of subterfuge to influence or control others, use of seduction, charm, glibness, or ingratiation to achieve ones ends.

2. Callousness (an aspect of antagonism): Lack of concern for feelings or problems of others, lack of guilt or remorse about negative or harmful effects of ones actions on others, aggression, sadism.

3. Deceitfulness (an aspect of antagonism): Dishonesty and fraudulence, misrepresentation of self, embellishment or fabrication when relating events.

4. Hostility (an aspect of antagonism): Persistent or frequent angry feelings, anger or irritability in response to minor slights and insults, mean, nasty or vengeful behavior.

5. Risk taking (an aspect of disinhibition): Engagement in dangerous, risky and potentially self damaging activities, unnecessarily and without regard for consequences, boredom proneness and thoughtless initiation of activities to counter boredom, lack of concern for ones limitations and denial of the reality of personal danger.

6. Impulsivity (an aspect of disinhibition): Acting on the spur of the moment in response to immediate stimuli, acting on a momentary basis without a plan or consideration of outcomes, difficulty establishing and following plans.

7. Irresponsibility (an aspect of disinhibition): Disregard for - and failure to honor - financial and other obligations or commitments, lack of respect for - and lack of follow trough on - agreements and promises.

Note: The individual is at least 18 years of age.

6. Other Common Experiences

• Theres a few experiences that quite a few people with ASPD report, that have not explicitly made it into the criteria. Sometimes these are examples for certain symptoms and/or are implied, sometimes these have been studied but haven't been written as a requirement for diagnosis and sometimes these are not supported by science/still debated by science.

• Apathy, a total lack of emotion, overall muted emotions or having trouble to access certain emotions, is something some people with ASPD talk about a lot. There is no scientific consensus yet, as to whether this is an ASPD symptom. Some theories suggest it falls under PTSD (absence of positive emotions & tendency to experience negative ones and/or having dissociated away from the emotions and/or having put up a sort of non permanent barrier as a form of protection), depression (common comorbidity, anhedonia & apathy can both be part of it), other PDs (schizoid, borderline episodes, etc.) or something else entirely. While its not sure whether its caused by ASPD, or not, a lot of people with it seem to report differences in their capability to feel a full range of intense emotions.

• The criteria talks about aggressiveness and physical fights, which is not the only way in which this symptom seems to commonly present. Harming animals, homicidal ideation, dealing with aggressive thoughts & urges without actually acting on them, verbal aggression, taking out aggression on self or property, etc. are also often reported.

• The current criteria doesn't mention it at all and the alternative talks about a complete inability to form bonds, but community consensus seems to be, that while forming emotional bonds is harder & happens more rarely, it is still possible. The intensity differs (some describe the bond as a logical construct, some only do platonic bonds, some only do romantic bonds, some describe deep obsessiveness, etc.) as does the number of people they find themselves bonded with. Theres also a significant amount of people in the community that describe a phenamenon similar to BPDs FP (aka a bond to a person that is defined by the symptoms of the personality disorder).

• There is some debate on whether or not an absence of prosocial inner standards makes it impossible or more difficult to define personal morals and understand how morality works. Some people with ASPD say they have no difficulties, some report that they struggle with the understanding part, some say they struggle with upholding those norms and others struggle with both. It seems like ASPD could make it more difficult to understand and/or respect the way societies morals work for some, which makes room for conflict.

• Personality Disorders are what we call egosyntonic, which usually means that they are in alignment with what we as people think is the correct way to feel, think and act. This doesn't mean that its inherently impossible to change the way you think/feel/act and that recovery is impossible, but it may make it more difficult to break out of the patterns (if that is what one wants). Some people show little problems in this area, some need a lot of outer assistance and others either can't or don't want to change.

7. Other Things To Keep In Mind

• You should probably think about whether your character fits the psychopathy subtype & if yes which definition of it you want to use (theres different theories)

• ASPD can influence every aspect of your life, so it may interfere with things in such a roundabout way that you wouldn't even think about it at first (ex: Disregard for safety of self => Disregard for your own health => You get ill carelessly => You dont take ur meds responsibly, or put off a doctors visit for months/years => You end up with longterm damage => You don't treat it responsibly => You get more ill => Death. Which happens to ppl without ASPD too, but can indeed be a presentation of that symptom.). Additionally comorbdities interact & interfere with ASPD symptoms and may alter/add onto presentation!

• You could also always add the ASPD stigma into the mix and how your character responds to it/how it influences them. Does it make them not wanna recover? Does it make them wanna recover even more to prove everyone wrong? Are they trying to get into therapy but no therapist wants them? Is it on a court record and causing problems that way? Do they lose relationships/friendships? Does it change the way they see themselves or others? etc.

• The key with ASPD characters is not to just make them into good people or portray them as angels and also not to always make them into the cruel villain. The key is to show that they are an individual, a human being, a single example for what this disorder can present as. If you can somehow portray that the presentation of ASPD in your character is just how this specific character is and is not how the disorder inherently presents itself, you nailed it! Cus u'll have ASPDers who want to just stay the way they are and who are exactly what you'd imagine a cruel villain to be like, you have ASPDers who you couldn't ever distinguish from a prosocial person, cus they learned to blend in and you've got ASPDers who decide that they wanna do a 180 and behave in the most prosocial way possible and then you have everything in between and beyond. So as long as your character would meet criteria, as long as you're not spreading misinfo and as long as its clear that its just one example of a possible presentation, you're good in my opinion (but this is indeed just my opinion and others may disagree).

Note: If you need examples for the specific symptoms, you can ofc send another ask, this is more of a general overview of what exists, cus going into detail on each would make this post wayyy too long.

[ghostr0tz]

Thinking more about this.

I feel like Alastor is similar to Vox with his own delusions of his capabilities (Stares HARD at the Adam v Alastor fight) but probably didn't indulge Vox's TOO much and maybe even got to the point of discomfort of Vox's...

And i feel like Valentino indulges them completely and helps fuel the grandiose self perception, which is maybe why Vox absorbing Valentino and Velvette into it went smoother than when he did that with Alastor..

Hi! Hello, just another local Vox in the neighborhood that wanted to say he loved the disability. Headcanons, questions and thoughts on if Vox would suffer from either Cluster-B either BPD or NPD and/or Fibromyalgia. As a liver of both of these, they certainly suck, but they do add to my experience as a Vox. Also Gosh it sucks that side blogs can't ask questions. Thank you and have a good Day!

Hello!!! Thank you that means a lot that people like my silly headcanons.

I very much think Vox is cluster-b coded, but my original post was getting so long I felt too bad to add other things...... (rambles under the cut)

I said in the notes that I felt like Vox felt BPD coded but I can DEFINITELY see him having NPD as well.

He displays a lot of grandiosity and self-importance, making WALLS against his true self and his public image, or whatever kind of person he needs to be for any given scenario.

MASSIVE superiority complex. Hes got so much shit under HIS name. HIS products. HIS show. HIS company. Its all Vox.

I feel like that complex completely warps once Vox actually considers you as your own Person and not some sort of consumer to sell something to though...

I could see the break in Alastor and his relationship being a Bad Result of Vox absorbing Alastor into his grandiosity delusions and Alastor reacting badly to it. And maybe The Vee's being a Positive Result of the same thing.

Extremely fragile image of himself that is prone to fracturing with criticism. Vulnerable to those he cares about (good or bad) and takes things very personal easily as we see in Stayed Gone....

Very Copedendant to people he lets in

Hatred for Alastor being vocalized so much and so publicly due to his NPD self-importance and need for approval and attention. Unable to understand why nobody cares as much as he does about Alastor being back.

Under the lens of Vox having BPD it is so clear that Alastor was in the position of being his Favorite Person:

Vox mimicking Alastor in SEVERAL ways

Obsessing over him for years, and even their relationship break could very easily be seen as Vox splitting on Alastor? or at least to me

His immediate fixation on Alastor again once realizing hes just walking around....

I feel like Valentino and Vox fuel each other's BPD and Vox and Velvette both could have NPD together,,

His obsession over Alastor feel like a man who has yet to get over his favorite person........

Interesting to think about Alastor being his First person he obsessed over and depended on which is why hes such a touchy subject and so personal.

ALSO Vox with Fibromyalgia is VERY real and definitely can see it. Vox is some sort of chronic pain is very based i think. I just KNOWWW his legs are bad but so is literally all of his body and hes SOOOO tired of it but theres things and work to do.

I dont think hed let himself have a lot of Bad Days to nurse his pain too much unless its Genuinely unbearable or hes being physically pulled away from his desk.

Thank you for the ask i loved writing these!!

[moony-2001]

Narcissistic Personality Disorder and Psychopathy: a Critique on Hades' Character and Personality pt. 1

TW: grooming, abuse (financial, physical, sexual, emotional), violence, manipulation

It is imperative that everyone reading this takes into account the fact that I am not a licensed psychologist. This is purely my own (unprofessional) opinion based on the knowledge I have. When I use the term "diagnose", please take it lightly.

I would also like to note that narcissistic personality disorder and psychopathy are usually misrepresented in the media and there is a lot of stigma surrounding these disorders. I would like to take the time to point out that just because Hades is an abusive groomer that I am “diagnosing” with these disorders does not mean that every person with NPD or psychopathy is an abuser or a groomer.

Hi. I wanted to start by saying that this post will cover many upsetting topics (listed in the Trigger Warning [TW]), so please read at your own discretion.

Straight up, this post is not going to be pretty. It is going to be long and technical and full of me blabbering away about XYZ. Based alone on how long this intro is, it's probably going to be split into multiple parts. If you don't want to read this because of all of the aforementioned things above, that's okay. If you don't like what I have to say, that's okay too (but be respectful). But if you do want to read this, I would be so grateful. I hope at the end of the day, you can at least appreciate my efforts. I will try my best to not get snarky, however I apologize if some snark does come out.

The way the sections are going to be broken down consists of the following:

The disorder + definition

What the criteria is that must be met for the disorder

Other known personality traits those with the disorder have/what are other traits people with this disorder have in common

Examples from Lore Olympus that (in my opinion) would cause the character to fit the disorder

"Honorable" or "Dishonorable" mentions

Final Thoughts

Additionally, I will talk very briefly about Hades being a groomer and an enabler. These are not mental illnesses and thus will not be taking center stage. With that being said, let's begin.

Antisocial Personality Disorder (ASPD)

I must clarify that psychopathy is not actually a category in the DSM 5. Psychopathy falls under Antisocial Personality Disorder or ASPD. So you wouldn’t be diagnosed as a psychopath, you’d be diagnosed as someone who has ASPD with more psychopathic (or sociopathic) tendencies which the DSM 5 does specify. So, even though I can't actually "diagnose" Hades with psychopathy, I can "diagnose" him as someone who has ASPD with more psychopathic tendencies. Again, I'm using the term "diagnose" here very lightly.

The Disorder

Antisocial Personality Disorder (ASPD) is a Cluster B Personality Disorder in the DSM 5. Cluster B Personality Disorders are typically marked by inappropriate, volatile emotionality and behavior that is often unpredictable.

The diagnostic criteria for ASPD is as follows ->

a. A pervasive pattern of disregard for and violation of the rights of others... as indicated by 3 or more of the following:

failure to conform to social norms with respect to lawful behaviors, as indicated by repeatedly performing acts that are grounds for arrest

deceitfulness, as indicated by repeated lying, use of aliases, or conning others for personal profit or pleasure (i.e., to obtain money, sex, or power)

impulsivity or failure to plan ahead

irritability and aggressiveness, as indicated by repeated physical fights or assaults

reckless disregard for safety of self or others

consistent irresponsibility, as indicated by repeated failure to sustain consistent work behavior or honor financial obligations

lack of remorse, as indicated by being indifferent to or rationalizing having hurt, mistreated, or stolen from another

b. the individual is at least of 18 years of age

c. there is evidence of conduct disorder with onset before age 15 years

d. the occurrence of antisocial behavior is not exclusively during the course of schizophrenia or bipolar disorder

When these traits were expanded upon under the diagnostic criteria, these are the traits that stuck out most to me:

"... may repeatedly perform acts that are grounds for arrest such as destroying property, harassing others, stealing, or pursuing illegal occupations."

"... decisions are made in the spur of the moment, without forethought and without consideration for the consequences to self or others."

"They may be indifferent to, or provide a superficial rationalization for having hurt, mistreated, or stolen from someone (e.g., 'life's unfair'); they may minimize the harmful consequences of their actions or may simply indicate indifference; they generally fail to compensate or make amends for their behavior."

Associated Features

Those diagnosed with ASPD may also exhibit other behaviors that are not in the diagnostic criteria but are commonly associated with the disorder. These "features" include:

"Frequently lack[ing] empathy and tend[s] to be callous, cynical, and contemptuous of the feelings, rights, and sufferings of others"

"Irresponsible and exploitative in their sexual relationships"

Have a history of many sexual partners and may never have sustained a monogamous relationship

"May also experience dysphoria (tension, inability to tolerate boredom, and depressed mood), associated anxiety disorders, depressive disorders, substance use disorders, somatic symptom disorder, gambling disorder, and other disorders of impulse control"

"May also often have personality features that meet the criteria for other personality disorders, particularly borderline, histrionic, and narcissistic personality disorders"

Additionally, ASPD cannot be diagnosed before age 18 and is more common in males. Males with ASPD often have some kind of substance use disorder.

Abuse or neglect may increase the likelihood that [a] conduct disorder will evolve into antisocial personality disorder.

Common Examples within Lore Olympus

Irritability and Aggressiveness

As listed above, two of the possible behaviors indicative of ASPD are irritability and aggressiveness, something that Hades seems to have endless amounts of. The two beings that are frequently at the receiving end of this behavior are Thantos and Demeter, though really, Hades behaves inappropriately to anyone who isn't in his innermost circle. This, in my opinion, makes me believe that his abuse of others stems more from narcissism rather than ASPD but I am still unsure.

Throughout the comic, Hades treats Thanatos, his adoptive son, cruely. Even though the panels I used as an example are primarily from the trial and post-trial arch, there are plenty of other examples of Hades talking down to, belittling, or humiliating Thanatos, especially in public. Hades later tries to excuse this behavior by saying that due to the abuse he suffered as a child, he "didn't know what to do" with Thanatos. So, in a genius act of parenting, he resorts to *checks notes* either icing out Thanatos or verbally/emotionally abusing him until he could survive on his own. At which point Hades functionally abandons him. And remember when Thanatos asks Daphne if she's going to break his phone? Odd reaction to someone asking if they can see your phone, right? We know that Hades can be violent, often resorting to physical harm or destruction of property. So what's to stop him from smashing Thanatos' phone as a form of abuse? Granted, that last part is speculation, but don't forget Hades ripped out someone's eye and broke both his legs. Breaking a phone isn't above Hades.

Though the reader doesn't see a large majority of Hades' abuse towards Demeter until later, Hades openly admits that he and Demeter never got along, claiming that Demeter "always" found something to argue with him about. I suspect the actual details of their dislike for each other wouldn't make Hades out to be the victim of Demeter's "nagging". My theory, though wildly unsupported, has some stock to it due to Hades not just belittling but being outright cruel to Demeter in the panels below. But of course, Hades is suddenly worried about making a terrible impression on Demeter after thousands of years of bad treatment now that someone they both care for is involved which reeks of narcissism.

Failure to Conform... to Lawful Behaviors

Something that goes hand in hand with Hades' aggressiveness (and is another required "trait" for ASPD) is his failure to conform to lawful behaviors. Obviously, he's not the only character who does this in Lore Olympus, but I'm not talking about the other characters today.

Three situations that go beyond irritability and aggressiveness and turn into a breach of lawful behaviors (among many) are his brutal assault on Alex, his assault on the nymph to get back Persephone's comb, and the threatening of the pawn shop owner after being denied information about Persephone.

I remember when reading the chapters about Alex’s torture, people either cheered Hades on or felt indifferent. I honestly don't remember my reaction when reading these chapters the first time, but looking back now, Hades majorly overreacted. Paparazzi are generally a scourge upon the earth, and I do understand when celebrities get aggressive with them for wildly overstepping boundaries for the sake of a story. However, Hades' punishment (and reasons for the punishment) is extremely cruel and unusual, especially given that this story is supposed to be a MODERN retelling. I know the core cast are gods, so cruel and unusual is kind of their thing, but that archaic attitude of the ancient world clashes with upheld societal norms of today's times. I've seen videos of celebrities flipping off, getting aggressive, or even shoving away paparazzi but never ripping out their eye or breaking their legs.

I don't think Hades nearly killing Alex was the white knight moment people thought it was; clearly he doesn't know Persephone as well as he thought he did if he thought that nearly beating her classmate's roommate to death is something she would give him a treat and a pat on the head for. Not to mention, Hades did it for his own ego, not for Persephone's sake, something Persephone calls him out on. AND HADES ADMITS IT. Sure, Hades claims that Alex put Persephone's scholarship at risk, which is true to an extent, however, he quickly turns the situation into a "how dare you do this to ME" situation, something I pointed out in one of my previous chapter critiques as a major flaw of Hades.

And if you think "cannon" Lore Olympus Hades is a scumbag, wait until you read the pilot episodes of Lore Olympus. I thought Hades' brutal torture of Alex was bad in the officially released episodes, but if you go on the Lore Olympus Wiki where the pilot episodes are posted, you will see it's... so much worse. Imagine it like this: if Hades being shown about to rip out Alex's eye made you grimace, what he does to Alex in the pilot comic will literally horrify you.

Another character Hades assaults and harasses is the unnamed nymph in the underworld who had purchased and was wearing Persephone's comb. Again, she had purchased the comb i.e. it was legally no longer Persephone's, and therefore Hades had no right to take it back. It doesn't matter whether or not Persephone "would've never sold the comb if she didn't have to". Regardless of whether or not she had the comb, Hades as king of one of the three realms has no right to treat his citizens like that. It is unseemly.

It is just as unseemly for Hades to threaten the pawn shop owner because she refused to give Hades information about Persephone. Privacy policies are extremely important. This owner doesn't know if Hades is an abusive partner or if he's trying to hurt Persephone. It's the same reason why in real life, most places of employment are legally not allowed to give out any information about their employees. But sure, Hades can throw a temper tantrum because he doesn't get his way and when the temper tantrum doesn't work, he can try out his little sob story and magically get the information he wants.

Persephone once argued that as a king, Hades has a little more wiggle room to do what he pleases. However, I disagree. I think as a king, he should have less wiggle room because he is the face of a realm. He needs to set an example for his citizens. Instead he is allowed to run wild and do what he pleases, with Hecate either barely reining in Hades or aiding him.

Exploitative in their Sexual Relationships/Non-monogamous Relationships

Quick note: the DSM 5 hasn’t been updated in about 10 years (with minor changes made in 2022) and non-monogamy will likely no longer be included in future ASPD criterion since the rise of polyamory. A better descriptor for non-monogamy would likely be serial cheating, but for now, it is still regarded as non-monogamy in the DSM and I will be referring to it as such here. Keep in mind that not every person who has ASPD is going to be exploitative in their sexual relationships or participate in non-monogamous relationships and it is deeply unfair to make that assumption of someone who does have ASPD. However, there is usually a reason that certain traits or associated features are listed in the DSM-5 (or on other sites about the disorder) so keep that in mind.

One of the biggest critiques in the anti-LO community concerned Minthe, Hades, and the nature of their relationship. It was made abundantly clear from the very beginning that their relationship was incredibly unhealthy and involved themes like exploitation, abuse, and power dynamics. Obviously, Rachel wanted to portray Minthe as the toxic, jealous ex which worked in a way, given the fan base's treatment of her. However, the moment it was revealed that Minthe was nothing more than Hades' PA with whom he slept (which is a gross behavior still seen in the real world today), I felt it went downhill from there. As more and more details about their relationship came to light, it became clear that the abuse happening in their relationship went both ways, starting right from the moment Minthe became Hades' sugar baby. Please remember that financial abuse is just as damaging as verbal, physical, or psychological abuse. To clear up any confusion, here is a rough timeline of Hades and Minthe's relationship:

Hades and Minthe meet for the first time at the car event where she is working

Minthe storms into Underworld Corp. because she didn't get paid for the gig and was angry at Hades for (unintentionally) screwing her over

Hades fires his current PA and Minthe becomes his new PA

Minthe becomes his sugar baby either immediately or not too long after that

Hades blurs the line first and their relationship is no longer "no strings attached"

Years of on-and-off relationships, abuse, and fighting

Hades was planning on proposing to Minthe (which she discovers beforehand) despite knowing that his family hates her and she never wanted to be queen of the underworld

Hades meets Persephone and begins an affair with her, despite never officially breaking up with Minthe

Hades eventually breaks up with Minthe after she hits him

Hades immediately moves on to Persephone, a 19-year-old whom he's only known for a few weeks

Once again, in the pilot comic, the way Hades treats Minthe is worse. After she seemingly doesn’t come to the party with him (or claims that their relationship “isn’t working”), he immediately cancels her phone plan and doesn’t pay her rent as, what, petty revenge? Again, this is a form of abuse; Pilot!Minthe is now homeless and stranded because Hades took away essentials from her, leaving her scrambling. Hades shouldn’t have to lie down and take Minthe’s treatment of him, but he inherently has power over her as her king, employer, and a god. Their relationship was never one of equals.

Side note: The reason I also included the panels of Minthe talking about what Persephone “gets to look forward to” with Hades is that often, people with ASPD will have a “glib, superficial charm” as stated in the DSM-5. We often see Hades turning on the charm with Persephone, but again, I have a feeling that what Minthe is saying in an attempt to hurt Hades isn’t far off from the truth. And she gets turned into a plant because of it.

*inhale* Emotional 👏🏻 affairs 👏🏻 are 👏🏻 affairs 👏🏻

Not to mention that Hades also got physical with Persephone (and Hera) even while he and Minthe were still together. Like Persephone said, MINTHE DID NOT DESERVE TO BE CHEATED ON and yet they both go ahead and have an affair anyway??? I don’t understand why Hades felt the need to have an affair with Persephone when he had the resources and support necessary to leave Minthe (like seriously. I’m sure there would’ve been a massive party thrown by his family and close friends because they all look down on her). If it was Minthe who decided to leave Hades, she would've had a much harder time with that process.

I will admit I am biased on this topic. I despise cheaters. If you’re going to cheat on your partner, you should just leave and spare them the emotional pain. Instead, Hades drags out their relationship while being involved with Persephone, then gets to play “responsible” so he can sweep Minthe under the rug.

Let's not forget that Hades' relationship with Persephone is exploitative, too. Persephone is a sheltered, naive 19-year-old who hasn't once left the mortal realm until the beginning of this story. She doesn't even know what a butt dial is. Persephone is practically the poster child for the born sexy yesterday trope. And, like every titular story where this god-forsaken trope exists, there also exists a creepy man who is much older than the female protagonist and is totally okay with taking advantage of her so that he may end up with the ideal woman. Like Hera said when chewing out Hades: she's young. Easy to impress. Won't argue with you. And even after Hades finds all this information out, he goes, "Aw damn, that's a shame. Guess I'll pursue her anyways". Luckily for him, Persephone hasn't been around the block, which makes her the perfect target for his grooming and manipulation tactics. Disgusting.

Additionally, there are other moments after Hades and Persephone get together where he exploits her. Some of these moments include when he proposes to her. In this instance (and other situations), Hades exploited Persephone in a moment of distress where he framed himself as someone who could take away her pain. While I won't stick up for the way Demeter treated Persephone, Demeter was correct in the sense that Hades only asked Persephone (and Persephone said yes) to spite her. Of course Persephone was going to say yes, but Hades knew that. That's why he asked in the first place. That was his work around to Demeter's promise of preventing Hades from having something of hers that he truly desired.

Reckless

Hades' recklessness wasn't something I initially picked up on when first reading this comic. However, when doing a more thorough read, it is evident that this behavior is behind many of his actions.

The sleep dive chapter bothered me so much because not only was he not listening to his wife at all, but he acted like they were somehow the victims in this situation which was… certainly a choice. And she had to talk him off a way by having sex with him which just felt so icky to me. Not to mention, he initially wanted to confront Kronos without a plan because HIS pride was at risk. Both of these situations can also be classed as “reckless disregard for safety as self”.

Hades was also reckless in rushing into his relationship and marriage with Persephone. She says she wants to take it slow, he pushes boundaries. She says she wants to live in her own apartment so naturally they move in together 3 episodes later. She wants to take time for them to date and know each other? Nope, he rushes right into that god-forsaken proposal. I don't think I have much else to say on this topic without sounding like a broken record, but this is a behavior that should raise a warning in readers' minds about Hades' ability to make good choices, not only as a person but as a king.

Dishonorable Mentions

There are some “dishonorable mentions” that I think could’ve taken the main stage but I’m not going to go in-depth about them for a few reasons (such as Tumblr's 30-picture limit). They include:

Excuses/Lack of Remorse about the treatment of characters (217, 253)

This mainly concerns Thanatos and Demeter, the two people Hades most often antagonizes. In my opinion, neither party got a proper apology from Hades, just half-assed excuses. Hades blamed his childhood circumstances for the way he treated Thanatos (which funny, Kronos does the same thing with Hera) and his way of making up for that is offering him a sandwitch which just.

Wow. Truly inspiring parenting skills right there.

Not to mention that in the finale Rachel writes that Thanatos and Hades barely talk with each other?? So much for making amends or whatever.

As for Demeter, Hades makes an excuse about how by Demeter "taking away his volcanos", she would remove his only tie to the mortal realm which... I guess we're supposed to feel bad about? As if Hades frequently visits the mortal realm anyways. I suppose it's the principle of the matter, but I still think it's a half-assed apology, especially considering it's been hundreds of years since Demeter was screwed over as queen of the Mortal Realm. And I know Hades also brough back Demophoon, Demeter's "son", but let's be real, it was just to get brownie points with Demeter.

Inappropriate treatment of Persephone in the workplace (40, 41, 44, 59, 88, 107, 178)

Now, I'm unsure if the way I'm interpreting "consistent irresponsibility, as indicated by repeated failure to sustain consistent work behavior..." is, in fact, correct, but I'm going to err on the side of caution and mention Hades' treatment of Persephone in the workplace. This is something I mentioned in Minthe's section, but it is irresponsible and inappropriate of Hades as Persephone's boss to treat her the way he does. The private lunches, the tours, hours spent together not working, the list goes on. Not to mention Hades keeps swinging back and forth between trying to treat Persephone as an employee under him and trying to get her under him.

Alcoholism

Hades' alcoholism goes without saying. It has pretty much been known from the very beginning that Hades has an issue with drinking excessively, to the point where Zeus even snarks to Persephone that where Hades is, there's likely booze. Which... is he wrong? Is he? I don't have a whole lot to say on this subject, I just figured I'd bring it up since substance use disorders are frequently associated with ASPD.

Final thoughts

It’s incredible how Hades got older but never seemed to grow up. Granted, something might have been stunted due to the abuse he suffered as a child, but this is also the man who called his therapist a quack so I can only feel so much sympathy for someone who bemoans their situation but refuses to get help *cough*the afterward chapter*cough*. It's very clear that Hades as also been enabled and coddled to the point of being able to unlearn his behaviors and anyone who tries to stand up to him or does something to displease him suffers his wrath.

Overall, while I was not in Rachel's head while writing Hades' character (and I frankly didn't want to be), this is one of my best guesses about what is wrong with Hades. It’s pretty obvious that Rachel never intended to write Hades as someone who presented with anything other than PTSD, but it’s still kind of shocking how many boxes Hades checks off for other psychological disorders. Again, I'm not a professional psychologist, I don't have any kind of degree, I just know a lot about the subject and I love throwing myself into research. All of the information I have gathered has come from credible sources such as the DSM 5 and other similar sites that cite the DSM 5 in their sources. I will see you soon in part 2 when I discuss Hades and Narcisistic Personality Disorder.