#and this is coming from someone who literally loves shipping

[rostekhorn]

I don't know where it stands when compared to Campbell's Hero's Journey idea specifically, but I've always loved Star Trek II: The Wrath of Khan (and the preceding episode of TOS, Space Seed) for going against a hell of a lot of established conventions when it comes to heroism and lone men saving the world.

Khan's entire backstory is that of a guy who thinks the hero's journey is real, and he's the hero, except life stubbornly refuses to conform to his narrative. He's literally the product of an attempt to make superheroes real, and he's internalized the idea that because he's stronger and smarter than everybody else, it's his destiny to rule over them for their own good. ... And real life keeps getting in the way. First, the stupid little muggles back in the 1990s refused to obey him and overthrew his empire. Then, he was unfrozen in the 23rd century, thought he had a second chance, only the stupid little muggles took that away from him again. Then, his attempt to build a new world from scratch on Ceti Alpha V also failed because of a freak natural phenomenon that none of his superior strength and intellect could handle. And then of course, the movie. His hero's journey keeps getting thwarted by, well, the fact that the world isn't actually a superhero movie, and he isn't actually its main character, and the more it happens, the angrier he gets.

But that's just Khan. Then there's Kirk. Who has more than a little of the same ego and hero complex that Khan does, and in this movie, it's all for the worst. His arrogance and belief that he's above the rules gets a whole bunch of his crew killed, ultimately including his best friend, who has to sacrifice himself to finish cleaning up his mess. The entire situation could have been avoided if Kirk had simply followed routine Starfleet procedure (kept the shields raised when encountering Reliant). The only thing that allows him to escape and stage a comeback is more routine Starfleet procedures (Reliant's command codes, and the "for God's sake use codes when you're on an open channel" rule). And when he finally comes back for round 2, the reason he wins is simply that deep space combat is something he's been doing all his life and Khan has never done before. The whole movie celebrates bureaucracy, training, and experience, over innate special individual ability.

If you go back to Space Seed, there's also the whole story about the ship's historian who falls in love with Khan but then betrays him once she realizes what he's about. I don't love all the gender politics that are wrapped up in that storyline, but I recognize the point they were trying to make. She's someone who's completely bought the romanticized vision of past figures like Khan, and has to learn, through exposure to the real thing, that people like that in real life aren't Campbellian heroes, they're brutal thugs. (It also softens the gender politics a little bit that Kirk, McCoy, and the rest of the humans have also swallowed a lot of the romantic kool-aid - not as much as her, but enough to seriously disturb Spock, the only one in this episode who sees clearly right from the start - which kind of foreshadows Kirk's flaws when they next encounter Khan in the movie).

In any case, color me unsurprised that when we got that thoughtful pushback against a bunch of our traditional heroic tropes, it came from Star Trek.

alright, I’m annoyed with the class that I’m taking. it’s about writing novels, and I thought it would have cool stuff about balancing your narrative and developing themes etc, but instead she spent the first class talking about how every book fits into the Hero’s Journey (the monomyth template). and I was somewhat of a contrarian, and said “can you give us examples of books that don’t fit into this template?” and she said “no. because all books fit.”

but I dunno man, I just finished reading this Korean book where the plot is just the character having a string of hookups and reflecting on them without changing in any way. I don’t know if it’s possible to contort that into the Hero’s Journey.

[n1ghteeea]

Have there been any headcannons of the fellas and Janine that you personally disagree with or don't make sense to you?

Ooooh, that’s fun.

The fandom is dead and I’ve only been here since August, so I can’t say I saw a lot of stuff to either agree or disagree with tbh (which is why I ask ppl to send me their hcs and ideas bc I wanna see at least SOME content) buuuut there are a few character interpretations that piss me off.

1. “Janine would be jealous if Egon got in a relationship with other guys” she literally would not. If it was someone else? Maybe. The guys? No. Dude, they are a family. He constantly spends time w/ them instead of her, they sleep in the same room, they are BASICALLY an old married relationship already, and she dgaf, she loves all of them and she wouldn’t mind. SHE set them up to meet in EGB on Egon’s birthday, I swear. If she was jealous she’d constantly drag him away from them to spend time with her instead, but she doesn’t bc she doesn’t mind. They are grown adults and they can share perfectly fine. Stop putting them against each other. Pictures related.

2. “Peter doesn’t care about his job or his friends and really only wants to gain fame and a girlfriend” I WILL KILL YOU!!! But like that is FACTUALLY not true. In the show we see him having MULTIPLE opportunities to leave ghostbusting behind and go on to do something more fun, but he ALWAYS turns them down like it’s obvious (ex: “Banshee Bake a Cherry Pie?”). Plus, he cares more about his friends and his job than about any girl, AND he cares more about them than his infamous movie counterpart!! Movie Peter turned down work when he had a date. RGB Peter? Yea, he whined for like 2 seconds but then went anyway and forgot about it like immediately. I mean hell, in EGB HE was the one who after TWO MINUTES back in the Firehouse went “wow guys, we stopped early with this, maybe we should reconsider and become Ghostbusters again?” HE LOVES THIS JOB AND THESE PEOPLE!!

3. Not a fan of when ppl separate the guys into 2&2 ships, just let them be poly. All of their dynamics are written with the same depth, they all care about each other and have sweet moments, like come on. It esp irks me when ppl only care about Egon/Peter, idk, smth smth picking only the two conventionally attractive white men to ship and talk about from such a close-knitted group is an odd decision to me 🤷

4. Hate when ppl ignore / exclude Janine from the group. She’s just as much a member of this family as the guys are, and they love her, leave my goat alone. But also don’t like when they ship her with other guys besides Egon. Maybe it’s cuz I see her as a lesbian, maybe not, idk. Not my thing.

5. Idk don’t like when ppl can’t separate the movies from the show? Saying RGB guys left Egon alone like the movie ones did is plain wrong. They didn’t. It was a mutual decision to split up and they were all miserable and clearly missed each other. In Afterlife (as much as I like it) it barely seems like the guys gaf about Egon dying at all, but in RGB? Boy oh boy, they are the happiest people ever when they meet. Separate them!!

6. PPL NEED TO LOCK IN FOR EGB!!! If you like RGB but never saw EGB you don’t see the most heartbreaking tragic part of their relationship and how it affected all of them, ESPECIALLY Egon. As I said before, EGB literally has everything ppl wanted from the sequel movies PLUS it’s actually good.

But overall my fandom experience was positive (cuz the fandom is dead) yay!!!

[caiusmarciuscoriolanus]

I’m about to literally yeet myself off of the bear tumbler until after I watch season 3. Like most of you guys are really super cool and I’ve had some genuinely awesome conversations about meta and characters with really cool mutuals. That being said.. SOME, AND I MEAN SOME NOT ALL, ARE WAY WAY TOO INVESTED IN THE PERSONAL LIVES OF THESE ACTORS AND YOURE NOT SEPARATING THE ACTORS FROM THEIR CHARACTERS. This I feel like mostly applies to Sydcarmy (as I’ve observed). Like I said, SOME of you want sydcarmy to happen so bad (which is fine) that you would go as far as to push the same narrative onto the actual actors. Why do you care so much about what they do? Why speculate on the nature of their relationship? Why hate or obsess over it? If they haven’t come out and said “yeah we’re a thing” or some shit then it’s not really anybody’s business what they do or don’t do. Whether that would be together or separately as their own people. I completely understand the love for shipping the characters but literally leave the actors alone.

And also while I’m at it, I think having favorite ships is fine and shipping in general is fine, but I’m almost kinda to the point where I’m tired of digging through all the shipping content for the bear (all ships really) to try and get to the actual stuff people post about individual characters, plot lines, meta. Like yes, I think shipping is fun and I generally don’t have any thing against it all, it’s just that at this point within the plot the relationships and priorities of characters feel like they need individual focus. We literally ended last season on close up contemplation for each individual character within the show. They are all trying to grasp their own personal struggle with the chaos and all feeling different about it. There needs to be more of that. They all have stuff to work on individually. I just don’t think we need these characters forming romantic or intimate stages to their relationships with each other or others until they settle the situation the storyline took us through last season. I may be the only person that feels that way but idk🤷🏻‍♂️ like I need so many other plot points explored before any sort of romance or intimacy. I need carmy to fucking get his shit together and figure out if he wants to do this restaurant shit. I need syd to do the same thing just in a little bit of a different font. I need Richie and Carmy to fix their shit. I need to see what Marcus is gonna do. I need carmy and Nat to lay more of their Mikey shit out on the table. I need more syd taking the reins and being acknowledged for said effort. I need Carmy to call his fucking mom. I NEED CARMY TO JUST FUCKING SAY SOMETHING AND IT NOT BE A TOTAL DEFLECTION. BRO I NEED HIM TO LIKE ACTUALLY INTAKE OXYGEN FOR A MINUTE. AND I KNOW THERE HAS TO BE MORE MIKEY FLASH BACKS. THERE ALSO HAS TO BE MORE WORLD BUILDING IF THATS THE CASE. WE’RE ONLY TWO SEASONS INTO THIS SHOW AND THERE IS SO MUCH MORE SHIT I NEED TO KNOW ABOUT.

[sukibenders]

Racism and misogynoir are so apparent in fandom, especially when it comes to shipping because why is it when a white male, sometimes female but I see it more with the former, character is on screen with a love interest, particularly woc, especially if they're black, and even with all the emotional scenes or just moments where they look at one another in ways different from the rest, it's met with "No, they aren't dating/the show is not going to put them together" but let the other love interest be white as well and suddenly it all makes sense? Heck, the examples I mentioned above don't even have to exist between the latter for some to STILL go and believe this rhetoric (eg. some Jace and Helaena shippers because, even if these two only interacted with a dance but yet we see Baela console Jace, after he seeks her out, apparently it's to far fetched to believe that Jacela could be a thing?!)

Sometimes it could be a headcanon that, largely, would make sense (and oftentimes was birth due to lack of respect that the poc characters could have been given by the writers *cough* TVD *cough*), and yet you'd still have people dismissing it left and right and spewing hate. At a HEADCANON! And I'm not saying that just because the other person in the ship is poc that you have to ship them, I'm not, but it's very apparent to many poc fans in fandom that unless the characters are swapping spit and doing the nasty, the possibility of them being viewed in any romantic lens feels too much of stretch even though their white counterparts don't have to jump through the same loops.

[chirpsythismorning]

The way fans on the st sub are almost all in agreement Nancy ending up with neither Jon nor Steve wouldn’t be the worst thing in the world, and how they can even come up with a sleuth of reasons as to why, honestly pretty valid and fair reasons, but then are absolutely gobsmacked when fans merely speculate something along those lines for El is, quite something.

[ozcarma]

I’m actually so upset over the grimmons resolution I’m tempted to start a YouTube channel and make a whole video breakdown of their fucking queerbait

[tenwhiteandalusians]

pertaining to the idea of tenax’s band of strays i do think it’s touching that the kids are the ones who saved him and waited outside the door to make sure he’s okay. for all tenax claims to be harsh and cruel it’s a fine indicator of his character that the kids won’t rest without him and are there every time he’s in danger.

[supervicious]

People who complain about ships getting more attention than others are too blinded by bitterness to actually make content for the ship they believe is getting sidelined, worsening the problem theyre whining about.

[ritzcuit]

i always feel so embarrassed and defensive when i see posts like "you ppl only like characters for ships" cus im like Mannnnn i ship things. i guess i have to go die! HELPPP

[burinazar]

It's a bit funny that to parts of my circles I'm 'the fandom one'/'the fanfic one'/'the shipping one' as the person they know most prominently into such things

because as much as i love writing my fics and shipping my ships my interest in both of those things is, I think, very narrow and specific compared to most people who are into them? due to my habits being like. very particular

[saph-yells-into-the-void]

every once in a while I think about the whole teru-akane-aoi love triangle thing.

bc I genuinely don't think teru is into aoi. it just all feels too weird, his 'crush' is only ever built upon when teru mentions it to akane, and I'm 90% sure he did that solely to fuck with him.

but the thing is that we don't see him even try to forge a relationship w aoi outside of akane. sure, maybe a few friendly interactions here and there, but for the most part he doesn't go out of his way to be closer to her. or to know her better.

it just doesn't feel like teru treats aoi any different than everybody else.

but you wanna know who he does act different around (besides kou and tiara ofc)? akane. totally different. more free. more arrogant but that's just him being himself. it doesn't feel like he's putting up an act at all like I feel he does w everyone else.

teru even said it himself. he has no stress talking to akane.

so if anything it feels like akane is the one most appropriate for teru to have a crush on, or for him to like. (which even if that was the case it would still make some of his behavior weird but idk maybe having exorcist blood makes you more violent to your crush and want to tie them up???)

or maybe I'm totally wrong about everything and teru just woke up one day and decided he wanted to be a homewrecker, who knows really

[so-long-soldier28]

can we talk, for a minute, about how badly jeremy treats bonnie?

i'm sitting here, writing a fic, and it's occurring to me just how bad of a boyfriend he is to her. like, we have the obvious example of him cheating on her with anna, which is just heinous, and lasted way longer than it should. and i liked anna, but i hated how jeremy treated bonnie in his attempts to connect with ghostly vampire girl. and then further in the series, their relationship is just so off and on, and bonnie deserves better than that (obvs she dies a couple times so it's not always his fault, but still).

but the thing i'm focused on right now is how jeremy reacts to kai. and like, i get it, kai was his only way to see and help her in the prison world, so he had to be nice to him, but jeremy seemed to have minimal ill will towards the man who repeatedly hurt his girlfriend in the PW. like there's no way that damon didn't tell the two gilberts of all the shit that went down, but jeremy's just like 🤷‍♀️. he shot kai with an arrow for elena, but when it comes to bonnie being tortured by kai, he's just, "what's he doing here?" and that's it

i don't know. these thoughts are kind of scattered, so i'm not sure i'm making sense, but i needed to get them out of my head. anyone agree about it, though?

[crimescrimson]

First and final warning guys! Don't tag my stuff with any type of Cleon tags please! Someone just did and the ship makes me very uncomfortable! I don't like blocking people because of this kind of thing but I have and will do so if you refuse to listen to me. It's the one and only boundary I have for now when it comes to my gifs, please respect that!

[cutebunnys50]

idk if I ever publicly yapped about how much I love SV Teto but I really truly do lmao, I love both UTAU Teto and SV Teto immensely, which is a lot. Basically whatever Miku x Teto brainrot anyone can imagine me with, just multiply it by 100 and you're marginally closer to just how much I love them lmao

[shidoukanae]

I also have so many thoughts on Paris/Helene in the light novel based on this newest chapter ngl

on one hand im nervously laughing because holy shit Paris is NOT okay

but also on the other hand im giddy as fuck because the light novel is redeeming itself with this one chapter alone and now all my fears of this ship being handled badly got thrown out the window HELL YEAH

[boogiewoogieweeb]

#he's good at his job! #crozier likes him! crozier chose him! #and any enabling of crozier happens because he lives and works in one of the most strictly hierarchical systems to ever exist #where dissidence can be a hanging offence! #and he's so! fucking! angry! about it #also having to deal with a spirit bear on top of everything #that makes you question the very fabric of the assumptions you once had about the world #also his cabin door is stuck!! #we talk a lot about jopson finally snapping and beginning to bite and kick #i really think he should invite edward to the inevitable breakdown - @maedhrus

listen i don't think edward little was actually a bad first lieutenant. when we see him in the first episode he's calm and confident. he does not say much but he's amiable enough. crozier likes him, and i don't think crozier would like anyone he doesn't think capable in some way. generally he's dependable and knows what he's doing. however unfortunately for edward he has these qualities because he has a major case of eldest daughter syndrome, which means he both wants to please his mum (crozier) and has an overdeveloped sense of responsibility for his younger siblings (crew), so when they get stuck in the ice and crozier starts going (more) alcoholic, he enables his mum bc he doesn't want to disappoint her even if he doesn't agree with her, and he has to pick up the tasks and care for his siblings she's not doing, but he can't let his siblings know about their mum's situation because they'll get worried and restless. and like a true eldest daughter he has to bear the brunt of mummy's anger for being a disappointment but he also doesn't want to seek refuge with the man she divorced (fitzjames) because that feels like a betrayal. also while this is going on there is a giant bear who hunts his siblings for sport so they're dying left and right and also a changeling master manipulator who's making his siblings mad at their mum and who wants to fuck said mum before eating her like some sort of praying mantis. anyway i think i would start being miserable and anxious too.