#or be ableist by calling them delusional

[controversialcoven]

This might be a hot take on this website but

No matter your stance on syscourse, don’t harass people?? I feel like it’s a given but it’s so crazy scrolling down system tags and seeing systems being genuinely ableist to people

[satyrradio]

me when I'm definitely not an aspenfrosten burner account. actually pathetic

[seaweedstarshine]

RIP Krakoa 🌹 I can’t lie I’ve been kinda behind since midway through Fall of X I’m gonna catch up before my first SDCC this summer but I hear Vulcan didn’t see much action anyway. Anyway my hand slipped and I found myself looking into the eyes of my canonically psychotic son the best Summers brother who’s never done anything wrong in his entire life, (he’s done lotsa wrong things but I love him more for it)

[angeltism]

when did we as a society start w the "doubles of me don't exist uu guys are just crazy and stupid" / "if uu think uu love [character] uu need to check uurself into a psych ward because they only love me" all over again

[autistic-katara]

how do u nicely ask someone to stop using the word “delusional” in That Way w/o it sounding like an accusation or smthn

[sanguinaryfreaks]

It's so funny to me when en/dos call us ableists when they're the ones saying they aren't disordered

[t4tdanvis]

I hate it when people police the language you use about yourself. People are going to use crazy and insane and a whole bunch of other words normally. Why am I not allowed to use a word people use on me.

its understandable when ppl are using like. "psycho" or "narcissist" as meaningless insults. but like if i (as someone who has been called crazy derogatorily before) say "im fucking crazy" as a joke literally how is that The Worst Thing In The World

[anti-transphobia]

Holy shit op you're clearly the asshole here. YTA YTA YTA. Yes it sucks to be reminded of something that triggers you but when your trigger is a disorder or a minority group it is 100% on you to recognize that and understand that it's not an excuse to treat people of those groups poorly.

There is a difference between saying something in the moment and defending/seeking validation for it. Yes, calling a person with a delusional disorder crazy is an asshole thing to do. Yes, even if you're triggered. I don't think being an asshole in one situation makes you a bad person or anything. I think it would be excusable! However, you took it too far, even for someone triggered. Not taking someone's delusions seriously and saying you think that if they don't move out they'll try to KILL you? Asshole. If I were your roommate I'd never forgive you for that shit

HOWEVER your saving grace here is that you acknowledged that what you said was bad. You seem to know it's fucked up. The WRONG thing to do was go to aita about it. If you want to know if the way you treated a delusional person was wrong, don't go to a blog for literally everyone to comment on regardless of how much they care about human rights. Those are the sorts of people who say delusional people deserved to be locked up for truly harmless beliefs. Go to schizospec advocacy blogs. Go to actual psychotic people. Don't seek validation from people who would do far, far worse to your roommate if given the chance

aita for calling my roommate crazy?

I (28f) live with 2 other people, a former college roommate who I’m pretty close with (29f) and 2nd roommate (28nb) who we both met when we moved in together 2 years ago.

Let me start this out by saying, this isn’t a fandom aita, it’s going to sound a bit weird at first, but bear with me.

I have a medical condition (relevant later) which stopped most of my bones from maturing past puberty (growth plates closing, cartilage not hardening into bones, ect.), so my skeleton is basically stuck somewhere between 13-19, (I look about 17-19, but the last time I tried to buy hard cider, the cashier thought I was 14, so that’s how young I can look). I also have very pale skin (unrelated to my disorder, just a ginger), and (related to my disorder) lack some liver enzymes so I need eat meat or I get sick (the same reason why cats need to eat meat), I ended up in the ER when I lived with my vegan sister for a week and ate the same veggie diet as her.

Trouble is, Roommate 2 is really into conspiracy theories and other fringe stuff. Nothing alt-right or anything, just like, (for example) they fully bought into that Mermaids: the body found show, and wouldn’t be dissuaded, even when Roommate 1 googled it and showed them solid proof that it was fictional. Wholeheartedly believes the US government preformed 9/11, does alternative medicine (homeopathy, ect), wishes there were ‘all natural’ vaccines (still isn’t an anti-vaccer though, just needs to be persuaded that Bill Gates didn’t put microchips in them).

Anyway, Roommate 1 and I have a recurring joke that I’m a vampire because of the meat thing and the pale thing and the not aging thing. Roommate 2 overheard us and laughed, but weirdly. She kinda joked along with us, but she seemed...odd. About a week later, they start asking me stuff about being a vampire. But they seemed friendly and not nervous then and I was hoping they were just joking and I also sincerely thought they were just asking me about how vampires work on one of my shows (I’m a big fan of Carmilla and the Originals), so I tried to explain, but I cited each show when I’m explaining a thing. This continued for several weeks, but getting worse and more weird every time, eventually culminating about 2 and a half months later into them asking me more stuff about life as a vampire and I really realised that they were serious. Bear in mind, Roommate 1 and I were trying to be very clear that we don’t believe in vampires this whole time because we both know how Roommate 2 is about this. As a result, this was the first time I really registered that they seriously seemed to genuinely believe I was a vampire. I firmly told them that I am not a vampire and that vampires aren’t real, they’re fun to joke about, but they aren’t real. They implored me ‘to be straight with them about being a vampire,’ and that ‘I could trust them,’ and I’m ashamed to say, I kinda freaked out at this point, cuz I was afraid that they would be scared of me and maybe try to hurt me, since they seemed kinda unstable because of this.

This is where I think I was an asshole, I am usually very sensitive to mental health issues. I have some c-PTSD myself and there are a lot of mental health issues in my family (unfortunately, I think some history with my own mentally ill father may have made me react this way, since he has very similar issues to Roommate 2 (vaccines, alternate medicines, specifically involving me in his delusions) and I had a very bad experience in my early teens where he thought I was a demon and ‘sent to destroy him’). Anyway, I got very upset and I yelled at them, I told them they were completely crazy and needed to get mental help and said I thought Roommate 1 and I needed to move out because they might try to stake my heart or something. I feel really bad for calling them crazy, especially because Roommate 2 has some very mental health issues and words like crazy make light of and stigmatise that and I’m very big into not blaming people for their mental health problems, but this was very triggering and in this moment I was very distresssed.

So, aita, all things considered here? I’m still gonna feel like the asshole no matter what, since mental health problems aren’t to be taken lightly or blamed on the person, but I’m curious what the internet thinks.

What are these acronyms?

[thesylverlining]

Okay, this is likely the only thing I'll post on the Bad Batch finale situation:

Tech fans, I would like you to stop calling yourselves "delusional." (Or delulu, or any variant.) I would sincerely ask others to stop as well.

It is both ableist and quite literally inaccurate from a storycraft standpoint.

(Especially because we're talking about a likely neurodivergent character and definitely many neurodivergent fans.)

You weren't. We weren't. The signs were there. The foreshadowing (falling into clouds, the goggles, CX2's Everything) was real and consistent and *intentional.* You are not delusional for LOGICALLY FOLLOWING writing convention patterns and leading where the writing is directing you. (If there's something the majority of autistic story-enthusiasts are good at, it's logical storycraft and pattern recognition, both in creating and consuming! We know how to follow basic steps!)

They can say "oh it was just a red herring", and that is Technically (ha) true, but it is one of the most blatant and frankly cruelly marketed ones, that smacks of stringing fan emotions along to keep us watching when they know many would stop watching if they knew what lay ahead. (Using a basically-confirmed-autistic character's death for shock value and little else, and then using the ambiguity of Is He Really Dead Or Is He This Extremely Similar Looking Guy We Brought in Right After' to keep churning up social media buzz. I might have.)

You were not delusional to have hope - that's what Star Wars is about.

You are not delusional to think this is wrong, a writing fumble, or simply them yanking the football away when *it was there all along.* The road signs were clear, they were just... lying, for lack of a better term.

You're not wrong for being upset about this, the latest in a long history of autistic characters treated as plot devices and catalysts for neurotypical characters' development rather than their own, and fans taken advantage of.

Please treat yourselves better. And if you're on the outside, or neurotypical, please treat us better. I promise, we have actual reasons for feeling pain right now, and delusions are not at all among them.

Thank you.

[the-multiple-prism]

do not interact with us if you support aspenfrostEN or any of their associates. we're still very much strongly anti endo, but we also do not support the harassment, slur calling, or suicide baiting of endogenics and their supporters. please for the love of lucifer no harassing endos and calling them schizos and delusional and the r slur and trying to take the plural/pluralgang tags isn't going to do jackshit nor is it going to make them listen to us anti-endos anymore than they're already willing. YOU ARE ACTIVELY MAKING IT WORSE FOR US BY GIVING THEM A REASON TO BELIEVE WE ARE IN FACT ABLEIST SLUR-SLINGING SUICIDE BAITERS. jesus fucking christ

[lamp-shading]

Oh god dude thank YOU for this response /gen I had a person in the replies literally throwing around calling them delusional again which rlly does prove the point. If we wanna engage in discussions like these we must be civil and kind and to NOT FALL BACK on ableist and bigoted rhetoric by calling someone LITERALLY SLURS AND DEROGATORY TERMS to "prove them wrong" or "prove youre right"

idrc what your personal stances on plurality is as long as youre respectful and not hateful/harassing others but you cant go on saying some shit abt this towards endogenic and mixed origin systems. Like you really cant claim youre all for mental health advocacy and call people "schizos" for having experiences you dont agree with (even though theres definite proof of their existances being real. look into astraea's web and lived experiences of non disordered plurals in early 2000's spaces i beg of you this isnt a new concept.)

Also before yall get on my ass yes I know in aspen's description they say theyre schizophrenic but by calling others schizo in a derogatory and insulting way you are being so fucking ableist. Just cus you are schizospec doesnt mean you can throw around these fucking words towards others. I hate involving in syscourse but theres no way in HELL you should be getting away with this.

again, idrc what your stances are as long as youre being respectful, anyone can interact with this post but just know that if you say this ableist shit (calling endogenics schizo, delusional, etc) to justify your stances, congratulations, you fucking suck!

[pluralhottakes]

As a schizospec system, anti-endos are EXTREMELY ableist when they say endos are delusional, and it's even more infuriating when no one calls them out on it

.

[armydreamersys]

It's funny (not) to me when I see anti-endo's that are screaming and crying (exaggeration.. mostly) that endogenic and non-traumagenic systems are "delusional" and "attention-seekers" and "insane" and send them threats but then say they're for disabled rights and liberation. You have got to be kidding me. You call people slurs (and imply that people with delusions are lesser than and gives you the right to and them threats and insults which is, idk, ableist) and said that their experience isn't real and force them to experience suffering and pain in order to be valid and you're for disability rights? No. No you are not. I'm sorry but that is not helping any disabled person. Ever. (Not to mention how terrible anti-endo's are to traumagenic systems that are normal about endo's, like you do not care for helping struggling people, or you might feel that way but you got played so hard into thinking that the way you treat people with experiences other than yours is the way to do that.)

Bc uh, last I checked, we want disabled and disordered people to have long and happy lives. Is it so "delusional" to think that a lot of plurals (disordered or traumagenic or neither) are/want to be happy and love their plurality, however that looks? Isn't it good for the disabled people who HAVE suffered significantly?

Idk. Idk. I just don't like them at all. (Not to mention the not-so-subtle racism and anti-theism when talking about tulpamancers or other forms of spiritual plurality, like good going guys, you've disrespected thousands of years worth of culture and tradition, don't you feel oh so good about yourselves, hm? Good job!)

[cripplecharacters]

Probably not an ask you'd likely get I assume, but...what re your thoughts on people using the word "delulu"? What exactly does it mean to say that?

I'm asking because it almost feels like a slur, but most people who use is are disabled, so idk what to personally think of it

Hello,

Okay, so before I get into answering this, warning for uncensored use of ableist slurs, though briefly and to compare histories.

Objectively, yes, "delulu" is a slur. A slur is defined by the Merriam-Webster Dictionary as an insinuation or allegation about someone that is likely to insult them or damage their reputation or a derogatory or insulting term applied to particular group of people. When using the firts definition, the word "delulu," derived from delusional and meant to act as though someone is merely delusion rather than being worthy of being listened to, using the misrepresentation and incorrect public image of people whoe experience delusions to discredit the person they're attacking. In calling someone "delulu," they're basically using a medical symptom as an isult. It basically says "This person is severely mentally ill with delusions that make them paranoid (or other things,) so they have absolutely zero valid points and we should not listen to them at all." They compare people they don't like to a stigmatized group to both drag the person they're arguing down and to further perpetuate the stereotypes around delusions and thus impacting the lives of people who have them.

When using the second definition, it's a bit more complicated. My research has showed that, while some people who have delusions are fine with the word or even use it to refer to themselves, it's generally seen as an ableist insult when used by an abled person against them. For example, like how the term cripple is regarded by the cripplepunk community- we can use it, maybe even to describe ourselves, because we know the weight and struggles behind that word. When someone who isn't physically disabled uses the word, they don't ususally, if ever, understand the history behind the word and what it used to be used for, as a weapon against the physically disabled.

"Delulu" is a slur, yes, but it's not yet a major one. It's a very new thing and, while it certainly has done damage to the community, doesn't hold the same weight in innocent blood as a lot of the bigger slurs do. Cripple and retard have some incredibly disturbing history and a horrific amount of innocent blood spilled using them because they've been around for so long. "Delulu" is only one of many pop psychology terms that are becoming slurs when used by those to whom they don't apply (for example, the term brain-damaged is quickly becoming a word used against people with TBIs, and is slowly becoming something people without TBIs are learning they shouldn't use, but those of us in the TBI community can use it should we so choose.) I don't know if they could progress to the same severity as cripple and retard due to how different medical science is today, but I think everyone would rather not take that chance.

Anything that uses a sign, symptom, or name of a mental disorder as an insult is a slur. Such as the word autistic in certain contexts. It's very much not a slur on its own, but when used by one person to insult another, it becomes a slur. If you see a weird word like that, or a psychology term being used like that, it's probably being used as a slur.

Other things you might want to look out for are the context behind people using words like narcissist, psychopath, sociopath, deranged, psychotic, compulsive/pathological liar, etc- those are the ones I see most often being used in ableist ways (at least the only ones I'm allowed to say,) because they're easy to villainize. If they're basically anyone other than someone with the corresponding disorder who's using the term to refer to themselves or the comunity should be considered untrustworthy until you can find a legitimate, science-backed reason for them to say what they did, and as long as they aren't misusing the terms and speculating on what shouldn't be speculated about, like the mental health of people they don't know and can't possibly accurately diagnose. It's best to avoid using signs, symptoms, and conditions as insults, even when replaced by cutesy terms (delulu, restarted, aucoustic, etc.) Tha's basically turning that word into a slur and one really shouldn't do that.

When in doubt, take a step back.

Mod Aaron

[the80srewinders]

I've kept this in for a very long time, but with endos continuously attacking us, and with "the future is plural" getting more popular, I have to say this.

an open letter to endos and their supporters.

fuck you endos for making me jealous of you for having a "perfect" and "cool" system origin. fuck you for making me feel like I wasn't special bc I have DID and making me feel "shattered by trauma"

every day I wished I was an endo so I could be cool and have a system origin with no toxic people, not knowing y'all were the toxic ones, then when I'd see signs I'd be in an internal war with myself because y'all hide behind the "acceptance" disguise and make it seem like anti endos were toxic bullies

because of y'all, I hated anti endos and wished bad shit on them. I thought they deserved their trauma for being bullies, I will live with that guilt forever because of you.

because of y'all, I felt like my trauma wasn't real or not severe enough for DID/osdd, and feared I was endo and "not valid" because anti endos rightly called out endos as fake and after I became anti endo, I felt this fear even worse. this time, I felt like I was delusional and like my alters and trauma were delusions. i fear being a trauma faker and a disorder faker because of y'all.

because of y'all I have felt so much mental pain, anger, and had internal wars because y'all divided the online plural community and made it pure hell to be in. I hated being a system bc of y'all. the whole reason I got tired of the plural community and thought it was toxic is because of y'all.

endos and your supporters, you fucked me up for good in ways that can't be reversed. you gave me yet another fear, and more intrusive thoughts than I already had before I even knew what being "plural" was. it's because of y'all discovering my system has made my mental health worse.

all this shit about myself aside, y'all overstep dnis, steal tags and mock tags, flags and more by anti endos, mock trauma survivors and spread misinformation about DID and OSDD when theres already too much.

fuck you all. you're all just ableist pieces of shit.

[pokegyns]

a lot of the more extreme & “doomerist” blackpill radfem spaces are so heavily ableist, and this ableism shifts into transphobia. transphobia & ableism are very intertwined in themselves (which is something mainstream tras have a hard time coming to terms with), and given the way that the “rudefem” crowd tends to treat otherwise disabled & ill folk, it is no surprise that their terrible treatment of the mentally ill & disabled (both physically & mentally) will apply to trans people. what gives them even more leverage & “feelgood” thoughts about their own selves is that this time, they can cover their ableism up under the coat of feminism. they can get away with calling people mutilated, confused, delusional, psychotic, narcissistic, insane & other saneist & ableist terms; because this time they know that they won’t face as much of backlash from the people they hang around with. they get to feel morally superior for not having to deal with the very mentally exhausting & draining condition dysphoria is, and what is even sadder is the fact that a lot of them are dysphoric themselves– their internalized ableism manifests in a, “i know how to cope with this better! others who don’t & cannot find a way other than by transitioning are narcissistic, self-centered and delusional! i’m Better Than Them!” way. if radical feminist spaces are apparently safe for dysphoric people & are meant to offer better strategies & treatment than mainstream tra spaces are, then we need to get rid of all the ableists invading our spaces. ableism is anti-feminist. dysphoric people need real solidarity & community. we are tired of being treated like shit & being used as political weapons by both sides. our existence shouldn’t be reduced to “object that can be used to prove a point” between two ideologically conflicted sides. at the end of the day, the more nuanced corners of radical feminist spaces should strive to analyze the ways that both radical feminist spaces and trans rights activist spaces tend to nihilize dysphoric people & use them as guinea pigs. both radfem and tra circles can be unhealthy, the former being repressive while the latter is anti-recovery. true allyship is necessary, and true allyship means listening to dysphoric voices.

– mod zoroark