#like. i'm not a fucking man. i'm not a fucking woman. i'm nonbinary. gender is absurdity as a concept. i'm done with it.

[this-is-exorsexism]

not me specifically obvi but whenevr a content creator comes out as nonbinary and everyone starts "truthing" them as another gender

oh that person isn't a cis man theyre actually NB? well OBVIOUSLY they will be a trans woman next. its the next logical step, this is just a transition period to that /s

like what the fuck. why can't people just exist? any nonbinary people we have to look up to IRL have some bs reason for people to say why theyre 'not actually nonbinary' and i hate it

this is exorsexism.

yeah, this is why i'm not a fan of "egg culture", because the assumption is always binary transness.

[thefishdeath]

Never feel more masc then the times I try to look fem

[zerodaryls]

it's so funny (read: sad) that if bigoted fuckheads didn't insist i was a woman simply by virtue of my body at birth, i'd probably be chill with she/her pronouns in addition to he/they. if my mom didn't insist i was her daughter, i'd probably let her call me that, and we could still have a relationship.

i'm nonbinary and 'gendered' words are hypothetically meaningless, but because there are so many people who are more interested in telling me who i am rather than lovingly and curiously letting me express my own sense of self, those words carry trauma.

there's no reason a nonbinary person like myself can't be a son and a child and a daughter. there's no reason a nonbinary person like me can't go by he, they, and she.

'she' is not a slur. 'daughter' is not derogatory. 'beautiful' 'pretty' 'gorgeous' 'feminine' are not insults.

to the contrary, they're parts of language that express certain facets of a multi-faceted human existence, like mine.

and i have this sad, mournful feeling that if it weren't for unloving, condescending people, i'd probably be down to be called any of those things alongside my usual masculine/neutral terminology.

but i'd rather die than let anyone tell me what i have to be called.

[magical-xirl-4]

the way that i truly am just non-binary still... idk, surprises me? like, i forget that i am, so i have to remind myself that while i am trans, i'm not a man. at the same time, i'm not a woman. i'm just floating out as something else. something totally new.

but that's why it's so hard for me to affirm myself. there is no exact language to describe me that truly encapsulates my experiences. there's very little representation about what it means to be non-binary. it's why i think about it so much, it's why i fixate on it.

the world is extremely binary, and it's influence over my thoughts is still very strong, despite my gender identity.

it can be lonely. it can be confusing.

my bodily dysphoria is so strong but my social dysphoria is ten fold. to a vast majority of people they will never see me as non-binary no matter how many times i say it, and that haunts me.

i know not everyone will be able to instantly see me as my true self wherever i go and whoever i talk to, but the two binary genders are something that we are innately trained to recognise.

if a person recognises me as 1 or 2 and never 3 instantly, it feels. wrong.

why can't you see me as that? no matter how hard i try; why?

maybe HRT and top surgery will get me there, maybe, hopefully, one day. i want to be seen as androgynous, ambigious, first and foremost. someone who perfectly toes the line of masculinity and femininity. i feel like i am that as a person already but i just want people to be able to see that as soon as they see me.

but ultimately what i truly want is reformation of society. i want- no, need, trans acceptance, and abolishment of gender roles and heteropatriarchy. it's the only way i'll ever be able to thrive and feel comfortable. it's easy for you to people to see man and woman, but i wish it were different. i wish it were more that that.

i still haven't changed my name legally, or moved away from my family, so i'd say i'm in the worst of it. i'm just barely getting enough air to breathe. when i change my name, when i move out, when i go on HRT and get top surgery i will feel better.

but those systems put in place to hold up cisheteronormativity will still exist. i'm not sure how i will feel once i'm up to that point. i'll definitely have more air to breathe. but i can't even picture it right now. i'm still looking up from the well. why do i still have to endure more darkness once i'm fully free to be me?

i really hope for a day where that well won't exist and we'll be able to be on equal level a plain and open field. where we'll get to sit next to each other in the warm gaze of the sun, feeling loved, safe, protected and cared for. where we don't have to fight to exist and feel like ourselves. no conflict, no fighting, no hardship. just ourselves and the purity of it.

[nowendil]

i should be getting out of bed but i keep thinking about the cursed fact that I'm trapped to be seen either as a man or a woman by the general public for the rest of my stupid baka life

[twerkyvulture]

brah i have like at LEAST 3 genders in my libarary and once i get more confident with displaying and using them all. this town is toast

[bidokja]

i know the translation is partially at fault but y'all cannot look at jang hayoung and think she is not a trans woman like. of course they aren't good about handling her identity. of course they aren't explicit about it. do you really expect the "men in dresses are predators that deserve to be killed" web novel to have well handled trans women in it?? she "doesn't care about gender" but basically goes by she/they, doesn't want anyone referring to her as a man, and literally learns from ngmy who only teaches the skybreaking sword art to women. like. Hello.

[feralparsnip]

.

[here-there-were-dragons]

and god help you if you're not binary trans and then god DOUBLE help you if you're not nb "the right way" aka "so basically i'm a third binary gender that looks exactly half way between girl and boy also i'm completely 100% human and 100% desire to be human and only human and just as invested in picking Gender Team to be on as everyone else because we all know the only thing that exists or matters in the universe is baseball and exactly what baseball team role you define your existence by permanently without ever even considering anything else right?"

the Trans Experience in our society is being treated like schrodinger's gender. you're a woman when they wanna deny you agency and a man when they wanna deny you support. this is an experience that unites nearly all of us, whether transmasc, transfem, or something else.

[marieaqua]

I'm halfway to an identity crisis bc I'm looking back at stuff from when I was in middle school and 9th grade and I'm finding multiple things referencing me being nonbinary, but as far as I can remember I didn't figure that out until my 20s. I have memory loss from that period of my life due to medical problems and trauma. Did I legit forget that I'm nonbinary/genderqueer and re-come to that realization years later??? I do have memories of being a young child and thinking that "tomboy" meant being both a girl and a boy and I would go around very confidently calling myself a tomboy so I know little me knew what was up but for years I thought that I didn't realize what was actually going on until I was an adult. I think I may have always known and actually went though so much physical and mental trauma in a few years period when I was like 14 that I forgot and had to come to the same conclusion again years later.

[xxacidnekoxx]

I am actually nonbinary (it/it's) but Everytime I had neutral pronouns people treat me like "woman lite" they will completely ignore everything masculine about me and it fucks with me .. also people love to flutter eyes at me and say "see? ^^ you look so much better the more girlier you present 💝" 🤮🤮🤮 so I just default to he/him trans man , say I'm a femboy and call it a day. I really really really wish I had a dick my life would improve so much 🥺😔 but I'm technically nonbinary and that's why I like the name Midnight because it's very gender neutral to me

[anonymouscain]

for every time someone calls 8 my son I will inch my hand closer to the blend button on a blender while my head is in it

[bookwormbynight]

Do you think either L or Light being a woman would change the story in anyway?

It definitely would. 100%.

Let's see... Taking away the context of the people writing the story, (Ohba and Obata very obviously fucking HATED women and did not try to hide it 😭) and attacking this only from an in-world perspective...

Let's start with L. What I've always taken is that he doesn't have a particular attachment to the idea of gender, gender roles, gender expression, etc - he doesn't pay any particular attention to his appearance and I'm fairly certain his neutral clothing is the way it is simply because he finds that the easiest and most comfortable. However, I think he's perfectly comfortable with being perceived as a man because he is cisgender, just kind of detached from it. (I would take an argument from others about apathetic nonbinary L tho.) This would probably translate if he'd been born female. I don't think, at her core, she would act any different at all, but she would likely be more aware of her sex thanks to the fact that everyone else would pay more attention to it. The fact that L was male automatically removed barriers that female L would have to face. It would probably take longer to get Watari to listen to her than it did in canon, she would probably allow people to assume she was the wrong gender and not correct them for ease's sake when she contacted people as L through the voice filter, and when she met the Task Force face-to-face, she might spend a hot second fielding weird awkward bullshit, because the Task Force knew and trusted her before, and this doesn't really change who she is, but it would definitely shift their perception at least a little and that dissonance likely wouldn't be handled tactfully. If she acts the exact same as canon L, though, which I imagine she would, whatever 'fears' would be generally dissuaded fairly quickly and she would have their respect due to the relationship they had already built, just like what happened when they saw canon L's appearance, although the Task Force would likely end up assuming she's a lesbian even though she isn't. (This would also probably mean that she's equally as subject to accusations of perversion as canon L.)

Light would be. SO FUCKING AWARE OF HER GENDER. Canon Light is 100% a very cisgender gay man with a good heap of lightly gay-flavored perfectly in-line gender expression, publicly adhering to gender roles as best he perceives them, and a disdain for the opposite gender. Female Light would have a double whammy of suspicion and dislike of the opposite gender (now men), and also internalized misogyny. How nice <3. She would likely go out of her way to be much more publicly sweet and demure, downplay her confidence much more than canon Light bothers to (so as to not be seen as a bitch), and have a good heaping of bitterness about her 'societal restraints' (that she's consenting to be stuck in because she'd be one of those 'play nice and eventually they'll respect you' motherfuckers). She'd probably honestly go for playing Kira even quicker than canon Light does, simply because her future prospects are not as bright as her male counterpart's and she would be very frustrated about that and this would be an outlet, and while canon Light was NOT afraid to murder a rapist on sight, female Light might end up even seeking them out when looking for 'the worst of the worst' (I doubt canon Light did), because she would now be a part of the population that lives under that fear, and those actions might skew her statistics. I think the face-to-face introduction of L into her life would fucking rock her world.

Moving to the topic of sexualities and romantic subtext, I think Light would be a gender-conforming femme closeted lesbian (I like to think she would have a particular weird thing about boobs and that would be the only thing that sticks out about her to her friends, because aversion to sex with men is not considered particularly notable in women in this patriarchal society - which fucking baffles me but whatever). If Misa's still a girl, I can't decide if she would decide that she's in love with this Light, or rationalize her devotion as more of a platonic thing, but since she would be part of the gender Light trusts and relates to more, even though she hates how vapid Misa appears (internalized misogyny + superiority complex!), their relationship might end developing to more closely resemble canon Light's relationship to Mikami. If Misa's a guy, their relationship would stay the exact same, just with the assumed gender roles swapped, and the imminent threat of Misa getting down on one knee and proposing to Light out of the blue at any time (and also maybe being more overtly sexually aggressive because society would have let him feel entitled to that). I personally think canon L is bisexual and as such female L's sexual bullshit would not have changed in the slightest.

The way Light is treated by the Task Force might start derailing the story when they begin to intertwine. Also I would not at all be surprised if male!Misa tries to babytrap Light by poking holes in the condoms and switching out her pills because he thinks she, a female with biological urges, will grow to appreciate what he did. (She will not.)

[catboybiologist]

Be honest: do you think there are femboys who aren't just eggs?

Yes, and tbh I resent that their existence is questioned so much. And I know this is gonna be considered a Bad Take by many people I've fostered a community with, so uh. Yeah.

As a former femboy, and current dykey/tomboyish trans woman, gender nonconformity within your actual gender is an essential part of a trans or genderqueer identity. In a lot of ways, my transition goals are the inverse of being a femboy- I'm going from a feminine man to a masculine woman. And yet, the trans community doesn't question my feminimity as a masculine woman in the same places where many people would question the masculinity of a feminine man. And don't even get me started on where NB identities fit into all of this. This is largely coming from the same place where people are okay with women wearing pants, but men or AMABs in general wearing skirts is Bad (tm).

Like don't get me wrong. The caricature of the Bad Trans pushing all the femboys to become eggs is a wildly overexaggerated, and I've met many, many femboys online that used that caricature to excuse rampant transphobia. But. I hate that there's a but. But.... I literally experienced it myself many times during my femboy days, especially online. Here's a short list:

-Had a transmed bombard me with harassing messages and comments on reddit telling me that I was a "fencesitter" and I just needed to "fucking transition already and stop making trans people look bad"

-Had a trans woman I knew irl shove an estradiol pill in my face, and try to order me to take it, in front of a group of people I wasn't even fully comfortable presenting as a femboy to, until she was eventually asked by someone else to stop.

-Had several comments indicating that I should be force femmed in femboy subreddits

-Had many, many DMs trying to tell me I was a "failed man" that should just transition already

And to clarify- all of this is so, so mild compared to transphobia that myself and others face. But it is a very real thing that happens. To many femboys, I think this is the first time they've received any kind of queerphobia or questioning of their identity, so it feels far worse in their heads than it really actually is. And, to be fair, I think it mostly happens from the more gender binary minded cis community than it comes from trans people- but as I've said, I've had it coming from trans women both irl and online.

I've also tangentially noticed that it seems to be transmed adjacent. Not saying that this anon is, or others who try to encourage femboys to explore their gender, but there certainly is a correlation. If its difficult for you to acknowledge cis gender nonconformity, then its easy to see that extending to a lack of understanding of nonbinary people or others with different trans experiences.

Every time one of these things happened, it didn't put me any closer to transition. It made me feel unsafe. It made me feel on the spot, and scared, and almost outed.

I've said this before, and I'll say it again- if you want historical parallels to femboys, we have a perfect example in drag. Drag is performative, over the top femininity that has become its own artform, style, and means of expression in a way that is intrinsically tied to gender nonconformity. Being a femboy is also all of those things. And guess what? Many drag queens have used it as a way to explore their own gender and realize that they're trans. There are also many who are cis, and remain confident in that identity. Is the percentage of trans people among people who have done drag at some point higher than the general population? Of fucking course- its one of the few places where exploring gender is encouraged and celebrated. Of course trans people flock to that. And the exact same thing is true of femboys. Are a higher proportion of femboys trans or eggs than the general population. Of course. It's a great venue for trans people to explore their identities. But even more of them are

Am I saying you're a bad person if you encourage femboys and gender nonconforming people to consider the possibility that they're trans? Of fucking course not. It was the gentle, affirming pressure with respect and care for my comfort levels from several incredible trans women I know irl that eventually made me confident enough to start HRT. Their continually support is a key factor in my social transition plans for the future. I needed that pressure, and I think everyone, including people who aren't actively engaging in gender nonconformity, needs some push to question their gender and start unlocking cis+. But to be blunt, questioning whether cis femboys even exist is not gentle, comfortable, and affirming pushes.

[chadchadsonthesnail]

Hey! If you are queer and you don't think bi people, pan people, asexual people, or aromantic people are valid? Go fuck yourself! If you don't think Heterosexual Aromantic people and Heteroromantic Asexual people are members of the LGBTQIA+ community? Go fuck yourself! If you say "I wouldn't date a bisexual/biromantic person because they are attracted to/have dated [the opposite gender]."? Go fuck yourself! If I see any lesbian say that shit, I block them! Because guess what? There are also lesbians who have dated guys! I'm one of them! I did that before I realized I wasn't attracted to them! So go fuck yourself! If you say that trans people/people under the trans umbrella aren't valid? Go fuck yourself! If you think that alloromantic asexuals are not valid? Go fuck yourself! If you think that allosexual aromantic people aren't valid? Go fuck yourself! If you think someone isn't a valid lesbian because they think some men look pretty/are aesthetically attractive? Go fuck yourself! Same for the other way around with gay men finding a women pretty/aesthetically attractive! And anyone who says "oh you aren't bi/pan because you are in a relationship with a man/women, or because when asked you listed more men/women that you were attracted to than the other gender, so you are just gay/straight!" No! Go fuck yourself! If you say that being nonbinary, or having any gender identity other than trans man or trans woman doesn't make you a part of the community, and that the only valid gender identities outside of cis woman and cis man are trans woman or trans man? Go fuck yourself!

We are ALL facing hate, and we do not deserve to get hate from within! Because we are all valid!

If you hate on people like this, you are just as bad as homophobes and transphobes, because JUST LIKE THEM, you are hating on someone for their attraction, or for their gender identity!

It's fine if your attraction is mainly towards cisgender women or men because both the gender identity AND the physical body parts are part of your attraction. You didn't make that choice, you aren't excluding them out of hate. But if it's towards cisgender people solely to exclude trans people? Yeah, go fuck yourself. Because you don't control what factors into your attraction, so having something like that be part of your attraction is fine. If your attraction is towards both people who identify as female AND people who have a vulva, or vice versa, yeah, you do you, you didn't choose for the presence or lack of a primary or secondary sex characteristic, that's just a part of your attraction. But the MOMENT the intent is to exclude trans people, you are just being an asshole.

So yeah, if you think that any of the identities I mentioned aren't valid? Let me know so I can block you!

Everyone else, if you are part of any of these identities, as someone who falls under a few of these categories, (Asexual, Asexual Alloromantic, Falling under the nonbinary umbrella) I will always accept you. As long as you yourself are not being exclusionary. You are JUST as valid as anyone else!

Signed, an Asexual Lesbian Demigirl

[genderkoolaid]

I'm sorry but you people have demeaned the word lesbian so badly... the LITERAL definition of a lesbian is a NON-MAN who likes NON-MEN. How is that so fucking hard to understand? Not you specifically, but people like you have made it into something it's not; the whole "bi lesbian" and "straight lesbian" shit, saying trans men can date lesbians (which is literally just transphobic), straight up just saying lesbians can date men???? MEN???? DO YOU NOT HEAR YOURSELVES?

And now the whole butch discourse lmao. Sure, maybe in days long past it was a broader term, but today when someone hears the word butch, I can guarantee their minds will jump to a butch lesbian. If y'all want it to be the GBT community so bad then just say so

Also I can guarantee that you were one of the mfs laughing at lesbians who used he/him or he/they pronouns back in 2020 lmao performative ass bitch

Definitions of words do not descend from Heaven straight from the lips of God. We make them up! So I simply disagree with your definition of lesbian, as do many others. Personally, I enjoy the definition of "queer love/desire for women." For one, it centers lesbianism around women, instead of centering it around the exclusion of men. And two, "non-men loving non-men" is a definition which utterly erases nonbinary people. If an agender person is dating a neutrois person, they are not lesbians- or gay men- simply because y'all cannot get your head out of your binary asses for five seconds. "Non-men loving non-men" is a definition that attempts to be nonbinary-inclusive but only succeeds in making nonbinary & genderqueer identities palatable for radical feminism and political lesbianism. Honestly, I would prefer someone who defines lesbian as "woman loving woman" but understands that many people have complex relationships with womanhood while still feeling attached to the label of lesbian, than someone who uses this "NB-inclusive" definition and goes absolutely feral over genderqueers who are Doing It Wrong.

Anyways, speaking of radical feminism: acknowledging male lesbians and mspec lesbians is not "making lesbianism something its not." It is just recognizing the beautiful complexity that has always existed within lesbianism.

The lesbian community- which I'm using to refer to all kinds of communities organized around queer relationships to women & womanhood- has always been a haven for a lot more people than cis women exclusively into other cis women. The idea of sexuality-as-identity is very recent, and the idea of drawing a hard line between people who only like people of the same gender and people who like the same gender and more is also extremely recent. Beyond that, trans men and nonbinary people have always taken shelter under lesbianism. "Butch" in the context of lesbianism has always been a trans* identity, a way for people with a queer gender to find community and safety.

The reason why we have this idea of lesbianism as a strict category with hard borders is..... you guessed it..... radical feminism! And specifically "political lesbianism," which essentially placed woman-only relationships as the only true feminist relationship you could have. "Lesbian" became a political identity because of its focus on woman-woman relationships. But that meant that, for political lesbianism to be acceptable to radical feminism, it needed to conform to radical feminist beliefs about what makes a good feminist. Which meant:

No trans women or fems (because they are too male and probably predators)

No trans men or mascs (because they are too male and also traitors)

No bisexuals (because they are too male by association and are also traitors)

No penetrative sex, or at least no strap ons (because it imitates men)

No kinky sex (see above but with bonus "kink is evil" flavoring)

No butch/femme roles (because they imitate heterosexuality; everyone has to be neutrally androgynous).

I believe that much of modern lesbian discourse comes from trying to marry lingering radfem beliefs with modern attempts at trans-inclusivity. So you adapt the blatant transphobia: now, trans women are allowed in (as long as they are palatable to cis women), because they're women! And nonbinary people can also be allowed in- at first they were woman-aligned, and then later as long as they weren't man-aligned. Being butch/femme is Back In Style, but we have to soothe the gender anxiety that butches cause by assuring everyone that only True Lesbians can be butch, and butches are always women, even if they kind of aren't, but regardless they're definitely not men, because butch has always been a lesbian term (except it hasn't.) The discourse is haunted by the ideas that lesbianism is constantly under attack, more than anyone else, and that lesbian culture is unique and special and must be guarded from (male/-aligned) invaders who are probably also sexual predators.

To say that this is all just "days long pasts" ignores both that, in physical queer spaces there very much still are male lesbians and bi lesbians who are accepted parts of their local communities, and that you only see those days as "long past" because of the impact of radical feminism on lesbianism. The only reason you see these changes as a good thing is because you've swallowed radical feminist ideas without realizing it.

Also, "if you say butch most people will think of butch lesbians" is an extremely silly argument. Literally who fucking cares. If you say "man" there are still a lot of people who will immediately think of exclusively cis men (see: every feminist who says shit like "if men could get pregnant). Does that mean that trans men should just give up their identities because other people don't understand them? You dork?

Anyways. The funniest part of this ask is how damn confident you are that I was apparently hating on he/him lesbians three years ago. Idk how to tell you this but I'm a boygirl gaylesbianbisexual and have identified this way for years. I have been personally terrorized by shitty lesbian identity politics, the same ones you are repeating now, which told me that if I was even 1% male then identifying as a lesbian made me a disgusting predator. Which caused me years of suffering because no matter how hard I tried, I could not ignore my multigenderedness and how that affected my sexuality. Sowwy but you look silly as hell and your argument is bad and you should feel bad </3