#i don't. use aro or ace specifically. because I don't like to use specific labels (i'm just queer. that's it)

[bookwyrminspiration]

can normal josh be aroace as well as autistic. a triple a battery if you will. as a treat for a fellow triple a battery?

Normal Josh can be anything and everything we want him to be! Simultaneously! Even when contradictory!

Aroace autistic Normal Josh, the triple a battery--I wonder how this affects his perception of the love triangle drama going on. Unspoken feelings everyone's picking up on based on subtle body language and non-verbal cues? About feelings of attraction? He doesn't know what they're talking about he's just happy to be there and happy to spend time with his friends <3

That is only a surface level interaction with his triple a status, so there's infinitely more to interpret and explore in so many other ways, but I very much like this proposal, treasure!

[aroposting]

no but it genuinely does kinda bug me that the aromantic experience gets bundled under the asexual label so often.... like yes they are similar and often intertwined experiences, but asexuality so often being described as a "desire to not be in a relationship" gets me. hhhh. angry

[notherpuppet]

Do you think there's a right and/or wrong way to handle QPR? I know it's a tricky relationship, but it feels like most/some people kind of just slap the label onto a ship while depicting the ship as just romantic/having no difference with a romantic relationship. (this is why I was a little surprised when you said you do radioapple qpr when it reads a lot more like normal romance). Not meant as an attack or anything on anyone, just genuinely curious more than anything. Again, tricky relationship

So Imma put this link to info at the top of this post: https://taaap.org/2022/07/16/qprs-part-one/

Alright, so please take what I say with a grain of salt, because that's exactly what it is. One small bit of perspective in a mass of many people who experience QPRs in their life and/or are on an aro/ace spectrum. I also have NO QUALIFICATIONS on gender/sexuality theory, so my opinions are shaped by what I've learned and experienced personally. While people may identify with the same term, we are all still individuals with our own experiences. Words can help describe a phenomenon, but it doesn't make everyone who identifies with the word into a monolith.

So I've stated a few times that I navigate shipping Alastor similar to my own experiences as an aroace person. (I guess I'm sharing about myself with this post, but I think that can be helpful to just spreading awareness of an "alternative lifestyle"). So I'm romance-repulsed and sex-repulsed LOL but I'm also "positive" about those things. Like I view romance and sex as lovely, fun experiences people can have, but I've never been into it personally. It's fun for me to consume media about romance/sex, but yknow, it's also fun for me to consume media about violence or isolation. Doesn't mean I want to experience or engage in any of those things lol.

Anyway, I'm a huge people person and I love to party and yknow it seems most people are really wanting to fall in love or fuck or whatever pretty much all the time, but especially at parties hahaha. Normally, I'm pretty touch-averse, but I love dancing so much and it's a blast to dance with a partner (salsa especially!! i don't care for grinding for probably obvious reasons). And to connect the two previous sentences, people (whatever gender they are) would be very kissy-touchy on the dancefloor. Which i honestly dont really give a fuck about hahaha. I don't really get anything out of kissing but I also don't mind it. I just like to dance. It's all a pretty superficial--but still genuinely fun--experience for me.

When it comes to my deeper or more intimate connections, I have had friendships that have felt SO on the line of what was viewed as a romantic relationship. They were exceptional friends and we connected on a level that was deep and true, but it wasn't romantic. Sometimes we'd slow dance, sometimes we kissed, and it rocked. But it wasn't more than that, it was all that it needed to be. I didn't want more and neither did they (except one situation and so we had to stop being friends lol whoops). From the outside, people would even refer to us as partners in a half joking way, but we really were just friends. And I love those friends!! And a huge part of what made those relationships (which at the time were described as 'situationships' because we didn't know any of these terms haha) was their convenience. We either lived in the same building, worked together, or were neighbors LOL. I'm still friends with those absolutely lovely folks, but we don't live around each other, so our QPR just appears a lot more like any ole regular friendship. But it's not like there was a feeling that we transitioned into something different than before. It twas what it twas! (Had to take a pause while I was typing to reminisce fondly for a second, okay back to hazbin hahaha)

SO, whenever someone asks or it comes up, MOST OF THE TIME I do ship alastor through an aroace lens and experience with QPRs (specifically, MINEE because they were fun and I've never felt like doing this before I met a character like Al). And my XP is: "this isn't gonna be a partnership and we ain't fucking" LMFAO. so yeah!

When it comes to using a queer term like QPR, I just hope folks are considerate in their writing, but I also am inclined to just believe them if they say that's their intention because QPRs can look very different. Again, aroace and ace folks are not a monolith. The terms help to describe a human's experience. I'm inclined to think people are writing in good faith.

And all this being said, I want to just emphasize that I really don't think it's necessary to consider any of this shit if you want to ship a fictional character. I understand wanting to be protective of a character who shares an identifier with you (I personally don't wanna see romance/sex with Al in canon). But shipping is a fun thing a fandom does that often does ignore canon. Tale as old as time. I don't think anyone needs to be beholden to canon when they're writing fanfiction or having fun. If we did, I would have like--5 artworks on this blog hahaha. These characters are like dollies, do whatever you want. It's cool if people don't like it and I think it's cool if people do. It's just not that serious. There are ships I'm not particularly into or dynamics that I am not enchanted by, but whatever. I can just scroll or close my eyes.

TLDR; shipping in fandom doesn't need to be taken seriously at ALL. It can just be fun way for someone to play with fictional characters they like. That being said, I think it's good practice to use queer terms thoughtfully.

[lovelessrage]

A post made me think about this again. No fault to anyone who does this out of complete ignorance, but I do hope if you do realize it you don't continue to do it anyway.

I need aspecs to specify their allos. Need them to start specifying really bad. Some use "allo" to mean "not aro/ace". So, are you included if you're alloace or aroallo? Or do you count towards "home team" more? What if you don't like that division? Is it allorose or not?

Either way, allo isn't even just on the romantic and sexual spectrum. Plenty of people who say "the allos" or similar blanket phrasing are, themselves, allo! They're alloplatonic, allofamilial, alloalterous, etc.! At least, they often tend to be. They just don't think about them, because if you've always had them and never questioned it, you don't really see yourself as "allo", you see yourself as "standard". Not always done out of malicious platonormativity and other normative ideals, but typically out of ignorance. Plenty of alloroses are not "just allos", they're alloalloapls or alloalloafams, or any other assortment of things. They're still aspec, but also allo. This isn't even getting into spectrum labels that can be both allo and aspec at the same time for the same attraction. So, can we get specific? Because really, in a community this big, it's necessary.

I just... need aspecs to realize "allo" is a prefix. You may use it as a word, but it is a part of a word that plenty of things shorten to! It is not that much more effort to type "allorose" or "alloromo" or "allopl" or any other assortment of abbreviations that specify who the hell you're talking about.

[ugly-anarchist]

I've said before that I accept contradictory labels and I still stand by that. However, not all labels are the same and some have significance beyond the average queer label. You need to be both well-informed as to what these labels mean and the historical significance and come at them in good-faith.

Unfortunately, "ace-spec alloaro" is not a good-faith identity nor is it a well-informed one.

I’ve been in the alloaro community for a long time, like 8 years as of 2024. The label alloaro has always meant “aro who isn’t ace” because it was coined as a reaction to the erasure of aromanticism and prejudice towards non-acespecs within the aspec community. Non-ace aros are often assumed to be asexual and our sexualities are completely erased because our sexualities make people uncomfortable. The label alloaro was our way of making a statement. It was us saying "We're not ace but we still belong here".

The current flag we use, the green and yellow one, was created with this in mind. The yellow was used specifically to be the opposite of purple, the color that represents asexuality.

Since we have started breaking off from the asexual community and rejecting the asexual label that was forced on us, a lot of stereotypes and misinformation have been spread about us. A very common alloaro stereotype is that we're just always horny and we've got high libidos and all we wanna do is have sex. And, unfortunately, people think this is true and a defining experience of alloaros.

Every single person I've seen identifying as an "ace alloaro" specifically does so because of this stereotype. They think because they have a high libido or they want to have sex that it makes them alloaro but it doesn't. Some alloaros do want to have sex and do have high libidos but anyone who says this is "The Core Experience of Being Alloaro" is spreading around an alloarophobic stereotype as fact. Some alloaros are sex repulsed and have no interest in sex and this doesn't make them any less alloaro.

I've talked to several of these people and every single one has resorted to denying the history of the label alloaro and claiming that all acespecs are alloaro or telling me that they have alloaro experiences because they have a high libido. Both of these things are wildly alloarophobic.

Like I said, I like contradictory labels. I think people can do whatever they want forever. But if the only way you can identify as something is by basing the definition of that label on stereotypes used against that community and ignoring and denying the history of that community then you’re not identifying with it in good faith and you’re just contributing to misinformation about that community.

Edit: There's a difference between the people calling themselves literally "ace alloaros" and, for example, someone who identifies as a label that's technically on the acespec but in a very allosexual and non-ace way. Like abrosexual is typically considered an acespec identity but there's people who fluctuate between sexualities that are never ace ones. There's probably others of these "technically acespec" identities that I don't know of and I can't account for every single experience known to man and I apologize for making such blanket statements. However, that doesn't mean the behavior that I listed above (spreading stereotypes and denying our history) is okay or the good-faith version of this grey-area. I still stand by my innitial statement that "contradictory labels" have to be well informed and good-faith.

If you reblogged this post before the addition then please delete it and reblog this version.

[am-i-the-asshole-official]

Aita for not making any of my characters, that I have to crank out daily, pansexual/polysexual/omnisexual specifically and only making them bi?

🏳️‍🌈👶🏼 so i can recognize this later lmao also I'm not panphobic or anything, this isn't about the validity of the label, pan is fine.

So i (20snb bi) have a project I'm working on where I take all the characters from a specifc media I'm into and pair them up with each other to make every possible ship kid from every possible ship(excluding characters who are kids themselves or are related or something, that shit is gross). Basically taking every character and pairing them up with another and creating a kid I think they'd have. Its a big project with lots of characters and I'm easily over 400 at this point. I really enjoy this, even if I'm not even 25% complete.

However I set a schedule for myself that at least one ship kid needs to come out each day which, considering I draw them, color them and give them some development and some even have siblings, (The refs themselves easily take me an hour to an hour and a half) I have to make lots of them quickly to keep up with my daily grind. I've been doing this project for over a year and although it's stressful, I can get them out quickly with breaks for myself.

Their character sheets all have some pretty basic info like their name, gender, pronouns, personality and more but it also includes their sexuality/orientation. I have a pretty basic list of options for what their sexuality will be: straight, lesbian, gay, Enbian, bi, Aro, ace and aroace with a few random things like polyam, WLW and a good amount of the something-loving-something/juvelic terms. I did this because, well, there's not many entirely unique orientations outside of them and although I love mogai/xenogenders and complex identities, I dont want to potentially drag up discourse or bring problems to my budding art blog over it. Its just not worth it to me to turn something I really care about on its head, even if I like microlabels.

In this case, I'm using bi as an umbrella term as most of the other terms share the same definition with slight variations in wording or action but not much difference in practice. We all like everyone, it's basic stuff. However, apparently this is a problem.

I've gotten one or two anons asking me questions about my guides asking some kind stuff like is this lesbian ship kid a butch or femme or Is this picture of them now or just at the age you put on the ref and other harmless stuff. Then things got rude with some Nbphobia but thrice now I've gotten asks:

1. Asking snarkily if im a panphobe

2. insulting me for not specifically writing pan or Omni and just writing bi.

3. Saying that I "clearly dont care about pansexual representation." Then brought up how my primary oc is native american so i clearly care about representation but that oc used to be a sona and I'm native?? Its confusing. (And Lowkey racist shit to just assume any native character is a "diversity quota" character instead of just a person existing but I digress-)

Im not pan, im bi so ig these people assume I'm not cool with pan people which isnt true? I have nothing aginest them, they are just pretty similar and I dont feel like it matters if they are specfically bi or pan or poly or any other label. I don't go into details like that for any other sub-group, not even pronouns and I included combinations and some common Neopronouns. I understand the importance of representation but my project has less than 50 people looking at it every day, Im not netflix or something. I'm one guy on the most LGBT blogging site with a big project and very little audience, I'm not showing people who wouldn't already know what pan is that pansexuality exists.

This project isn't that deep considering the characters in question aren't human/dont have human characteristics.(no it's not hazbin/helluva) Also ive never spoken about lgbt discourse or stated anything remotely close to it beyond the guides just passively having characters who are an LGBT identity. I've not even mentioned all the potentional orientations they could have so I'm not sure where/why this came up in the first place. The most politcial things ive said are calling out a creator in my fandom who outed themselves as a transphobe and mentioning im pro-palestine. That's it.

I mean this is pretty low stakes, I can just block these people and be done with it and this some seriously online shit but I just wanna check.

Am I being an asshole for just writing bi instead of specifying their mspec label because I have to produce characters quickly and I don't see enough of a difference to warrant a change/specification that would ultimately slow and clog an already stressful and complex project?

I dont think I am but idk lol

What are these acronyms?

[paradoxcase]

Someone posted on one of the reddit asexual communities a bit ago saying that they thought they might be ace for XYZ reasons which were completely sensible reasons to think that, but that the idea that they might be ace made them feel sad because they felt like they wouldn't get to experience sex or sexual attraction the way most people did, and was that feeling sad thing an indication that they weren't really ace? And a bunch of us responded that, nah, actually that's a pretty common experience

But it made me wonder, like, is that actually a primarily ace and/or aro experience, because those identities are kind of necessarily about things you don't experience, or do other queer people feel this way, too? Like I've heard of people who start out with negative thoughts about being queer, but it's usually stuff like, I'm afraid I will be the victim of a hate crime, I'm afraid my parents will kick me out of the house, I'm afraid I won't have enough money to transition. I haven't heard as much stuff that's like, I'm sad that I didn't live up to my expectations for being "normal". I don't mean like self-hatred stuff, either, like not stuff like, there's something wrong with me, or I'm broken, or I'm gross, or I'm sinning against god just by existing, but just like, I'm sad, I'm mourning some life experiences that I thought I would have that I probably won't have after all

So, I'm curious what other people's experiences have been. Polls have limited options, so I necessarily had to condense a lot of identities into a few groups, hopefully most people are included here. If you have felt that way about multiple labels, pick whichever one you want. If you have never experienced this, just pick the group you identify most strongly with if you identify with multiple

Please reblog this, because if it only stays on my part of tumblr probably like 90% of responses will be from ace people

[antianakin]

Any thoughts on the Jedi and romantic relationships? I get that they're allowed to love/have feelings and such, but, idk, my understanding is that they generally prefer to have “selfless service to the Republic/Galaxy” as their only major commitment.

I think Jedi can HAVE romantic relationships but they'd look a lot different to what we normally conceive of as a romantic relationship. They'd likely end up feeling closer to a friends with benefits sort-of deal or maybe a queer platonic relationship (without the necessity of being queer, obviously). They can't HAVE a commitment to their partner beyond like... the basic compassion and respect they show to everybody, so the relationships would always end up relatively casual. A lot of people interpret the Jedi as being a basically aro/ace society, so I think that using aro/ace relationships as a basis to understand how they might approach romance is probably a good place to start. One of the things I really like about looking at romances from that perspective is that it really breaks down some of the expectations of what's necessary in order to qualify as a relationship, romantic or otherwise. Sex, intimacy, living together, etc. These are all things that often end up a dividing line between friendship and romance, but aro/ace relationships can blur those lines a lot. So while those things CAN define the difference between friendship and romance, they aren't the ONLY things that could do so and, for some people, might not qualify as a difference at all.

I think that Jedi in general are okay with the idea of relationships being ephemeral and ever-changing. A lot of relationships these days work on the concept that people are always growing and changing and so the perfect partner will grow and change WITH you over the years. But I think the Jedi would accept that that's not always possible and that it's entirely natural and normal for the relationship not to remain romantic forever, but that that doesn't make the relationship meaningless or that any friendship would have to be terminated along with the romantic relationship. Relationships aren't meaningful because they last, they're meaningful for any number of reasons the people involved in them might decide on. Maybe someone went through a difficult mission and what they needed from a partner was very different for that moment, but as they healed, their needs changed and the relationship ended but the fact that this person was there for them would still remain very meaningful and the relationship remains important regardless of whether the romantic/sexual portion of it stayed. Maybe certain people come in and out of romantic relationships with each other, and it's not a will-they-won't-they type of deal, it's just that they gravitate towards each other during different periods of their lives and they allow themselves to just... go where the Force leads them, but it's not what they need or want ALL the time.

I also imagine the Jedi are just impeccably good at long distance relationships because they don't put all of their happiness into a relationship with one person and the relationship is never their top priority anyway, so they can manage being away from someone for long periods of time without it negatively impacting the relationship itself and could probably start the relationship up again years later without it feeling like a big deal.

I personally headcanon that the Jedi don't even necessarily have specific labels for their relationships and there's a lot less of a firm line between things like friendships and romantic relationships for them. A romantic relationship is going to look very different for different people and all that matters is that the people involved in the relationship agree on what it is and what the boundaries are. So two people might be in a relationship that could seem like a romantic relationship but that both people insist is NOT romantic at all. Or the opposite, two people seem like there's nothing romantic between them from the outside but if you asked them they'd both confirm that that's exactly what it is. Labels like boyfriend, girlfriend, (romantic) partner, husband, wife, spouse, etc all tend to come with specific expectations attached to them that the Jedi would probably agree with on an ideological level and just plain be uncomfortable with on a personal level.

This opens the door for the Jedi to have any NUMBER of different kinds of relationships with different people that allow them to remain very fulfilled in their life without needing constant access to a romantic partner, hence being a lot better with the long distance relationships. Maybe they have one person they really like doing more romantic stuff with but there's someone else that they have a more friends with benefits style relationship with and tons of other people that are friends without romance or sexual additions to it that can run the gamut between being mentors, peers, or students of their own. I imagine they'd be pretty open to the concept of polyamory since they don't do major commitments to romantic partners, so the idea of having multiple romantic or sexual partners would be fairly normal and not that big of a deal.

I think Jedi relationships often end up seeming really complicated and difficult to people outside of the culture but, to them, it really is very simple. It's romantic if the people involved say it is and all you really owe your partner is respect and compassion. It's everyone else who has all of these labels and expectations and obligations that make relationships exceptionally complicated from their perspective. If you just open up a little and expand/loosen your definition of what romance or a romantic relationship might entail, there's plenty of ways for Jedi to have romantic relationships. I do think that these relationships end up generally less compatible with people outside of the Order who don't tend to have similar cultural concepts, which is likely what leads to misconceptions like that the Jedi don't allow love or relationships at all (something we see with Padme, who comes from Naboo which does seem to really emphasize familial relationships a lot as something vitally important if that's what you choose to pursue). It might even be easier for Jedi to simply tell people they don't do romantic relationships or to allow people to believe that than to try to explain their ways to people who are just unequipped or unwilling to understand it.

This is also where I think the clones tend to come in as some of the only people capable of truly understanding the way the Jedi choose to do relationships. The clones aren't allowed to form the kind of commitments everyone else would, they can't make promises to each other that they'll be together forever. And I imagine the clones end up prioritizing finding happiness and pleasure any place they can find it above being faithful to one relationship above anything else. Loving someone means wanting them to be happy and if you're able to give them that, even for a short amount of time, then that's what matters. They'd be forced to get really good at long distance relationships and accepting change is inevitable. And while all of this is coming from really awful circumstances, I do think it'd allow them to sort-of build cultural values that end up pretty similar to the Jedi's and would likely REMAIN fairly similar to the Jedi's even in a happy fix-it AU where they gain the freedom to explore more options. So while most non-Jedi have difficulty being in relationships with Jedi because of how different their cultural values towards romance end up being, the clones are actually a lot more able to adjust to that and I think some of them might even specifically PREFER relationships with Jedi to relationships with anyone else.

I'd love to see some sort of Star Wars media really explore this more. The two options that we end up seeing are Jedi who choose to break the rules in order to be in a relationship anyway or Jedi who choose to avoid romantic relationships entirely (either in a situation like Obi-Wan's where he FEELS romantic attraction and has to specifically walk away from the relationship or situations like Mace or Luminara where we simply never see them interested in romance at any point). We see them be friendly with each other and with other people, obviously, and we know from Lucas that they aren't celibate, so the opportunity is THERE to see Jedi in happy romantic or sexual relationships that are simply more casual, but no one's been interested in actually showing or exploring that yet. My aroace ass would LOVE more representation among the Jedi.

[godsfavoritescientist]

I present to you the Bill Cipher flag, for when you are, in some way, Bill Cipher. In-depth explanation under the cut.

I picked the colors based on what felt meaningful to me personally, so I don't expect this flag to resonate with everyone who identifies with or as Bill. That being said, anyone who does resonate with it can use it. Gender, kin, kith, anything under the alterbeing umbrella, serious or casual, literal or non-literal, etc. Whatever form of connection or identification you have, this flag can be for you.

Stripe meanings: (aka a plain text version of the 2nd image)

Black: Eldritch Nature. Can also represent reclaiming demonized identities. Gray: Mystery and Madness. Gray the way the world grays out around Bill in dreams. Also represents neurodivergence and mental illness. 'Mystery' as a catch-all category of Bill weirdness Yellow: Genderfuckery. Yellow's meaning is tied to gender because it's the only primary color that isn't associated with a specific binary gender. Turquoise: Magic, Mischief, and Chaos. Whimsy, being just a lil guy, getting silly with it. Dark blue: Liberation and Destruction. The capability to be both a creative and a destructive force. Dealing with harmful/self-destructive impulses. Pursuing constructive outlets for expressing oneself.

Further meanings and associations:

The black and gray stripes at the top are a nod to the ace and aro flags, because so many folks who identify with Bill in some way (including myself) identify with one or both of those labels too.

Black and yellow are, of course, the main colors on Bill himself. Gray has a strong association with dreamscapes, especially when Bill visits them. I also associate gray with static. The dark blue and turquoise stripes are based on Bill's magical flames. I also associate dark blue with the portal blueprints.

Final notes:

I tried to fit in a magenta stripe or accent in the flag design somewhere, but couldn't make it look cohesive. It would've represented rebirth and second chances, and the color itself would've been a nod to the axolotl, and color picked from one of Bill's weirdness bubbles. It would've also been a fun addition due to magenta being a color that technically doesn't exist. I think a separate kin-focused design featuring magenta would be worth making sometime (not even necessarily by me--anyone can use this idea if they'd like to).

Use and share this flag however you like, with or without credit, as long as you're not outright claiming to be the one who made it lol. In my opinion, a successful flag should belong collectively to the group of people who use it just as much as (if not more than to) the creator. Of course if other flag makers feel differently then it's only polite to respect their wishes, I'm just saying that for this flag, you can do literally whatever.

[damnfandomproblems]

Fandom Problem #4680:

Outrage over shipping (or lewding) canonically aromantic and / or asexual characters.

I definitely understand the frustration of people just refusing to recognize or acknowledge their identity, since there's so few of them already. But i also see a lot of inflexibility in NOW aro / ace people are viewed or expected to behave. (Mostly either naiive and childishly innocent, awkward quirky teens, or cold robotic and unfeeling). And being aroace myself I rarely see any that actually resonate or feel compelling. Not to say those can't exist ever or that aspec people who ARE happy with them are "wrong" in any way, but I wish the perception what or how an aro / ace person can be wasn't so limited (and honestly---boring).

More of my characters than not are SOME flavor of aspec and all of them have very, very different ways of experiencing it. (And it's not all just "for the representation!!" they just feel natural to the characters and a lot of them are experiences I personally relate to) This includes:

a clout-obsessed social climber who uses relationships as a way of getting what she wants and to boost her ego, and nothing more

someone who's obsessed with the IDEA of romance and really really WANTS to fall in love with someone but it just never happens

someone completely repulsed with sex and romance althogether

an asexual person who wants to try it just to know what it's like but that's all

a sex worker for whom sex is quite literally just "showing up to work" for her, not awful or traumatic or anything, mostly just kinda boring

an aroace person who is so codependant with someone (who's allo) that they basically just form a relationship (along with all the things that usually go with it that the ace person doesn't mind going along with for their sake) I guess what people may call a QPR but that's not a term I personally like to use or find any use for it's okay for others though

someone who's still figuring themself out who hasn't really landed on any specific labels but also isn't really stressing on it that much

someone who takes longer to realize they're aro because for so long what they assumed were romantic feelings was really just feeling flattered, so thought they were "in love with" anyone who was nice to them

aliens whose anatomy includes no sex organs

And sometimes, characters are hot. And characters that are hot get shipped with other hot characters, often with no rhyme or reason other than "hot". Regardless of their canon sexualities. It kinda just comes with the territory of fandom.

(And again I'm really really tired of people using us a a shield to hide their ship hate and sex negativity. Seriously, don't.)

[codywanweek]

How to write aro/ace codywan for the non-aspec

Want to write something for the aro/ace codywan prompt but you're not sure how or you're afraid you'll offend someone? Here's a hopefully useful post to help you out.

Disclaimer:

I, Yellow, am only one aromantic* person and opinions may differ. This post is to be taken as suggestions for possible configurations of codywan being aro- and/or ace-spec. At the end I'll mention some pitfalls to avoid. *formerly used the label ace for 1+ year, so is fairly familiar with pitfalls for acespec characters as well, but again ymmv.

These suggestions are focused on aro/ace people in relationships. The reason for this is that this is still a ship week, but obviously there are also aro/ace people that are not interested in partnering at all.

Suggestions and pitfalls under the cut! If you, an aro/ace-spec person, have suggestions as well, feel free to reblog them on this post, or to DM/send an ask and I'll add them!

Suggestions:

Note: a QPR = queerplatonic relationship is a relationship type that "queers the platonic". There is no defined list of things that need to or shouldn't occur for a relationship to be queerplatonic. In general you could think of it as being platonic lifepartners, but it's not strange for a QPR to be sexual or even romantic as well.

These suggestions are formatted as: Codywan's specific identities and then a (fluffy) idea for their relationship. There are infinitely many options for how relationships work, and you can definitely mix and match between these "flavors". Angst is a bit more difficult to write, but you could look at the pitfalls and use those to go for a self-doubt/acceptance route.

Flavor: Any. You're more than welcome to write a platonic relationship as well!

Flavor: Codywan are both aromantic and asexual and have no interest in romance or sex: QPR Idea: They have such a close bond as commander and general that they feel like they are integral parts of each others lives and continue on like this after the war.

Flavor: They are not aromantic and one or both of them are asexual: romantic relationship/QPR Idea 1; they don't have sex: "basically" write a romantic relationship without sex. Maybe you can write the conversation they have about their expectations in the relationship. Idea 2; they do have sex: ace people can have sex if they want to, maybe they like the closeness of it or that it feels good, but they may not feel a need for having sex.

Flavor: They are not asexual and one or both of them are aromantic: sexual relationship/QPR Option 1; no romance: Maybe they are friends with benefits and do not consider themselves in a committed relationship. Or maybe they are in a QPR and also enjoy having sex together. Option 2; romance: Maybe they are in a romantic relationship and the aro character enjoys the "romantic" aspects just because they are pleasant to do/experience, but they may not feel a need to do these things with their partner. Here are some ideas from another aro person!

Flavor: One or both of them are demiro and/or demi-ace: anything Demi = you only feel romantic or sexual attraction to people you are already close to (does not mean you feel the attraction to everyone you're close to). Idea: Maybe codywan reaches a certain point in the war where they fully trust each other and have gotten close on a personal level and they get an "oh" moment where they suddenly realize they're attracted to the other.

Flavor: One or both of them are grayro and/or gray-ace: anything Gray- = you only feel romantic or sexual attraction very rarely or weakly (below the "average" for allo people to the point that you relate to aro/ace identities) Here you can have the fun "wait this is what you people have been talking about??" when someone has their first crush ever, but in general you can assume suddenly feeling attraction like that is very unexpected and maybe they find it very impractical to be happening right then.

Flavor: Anything! I am not a spokesperson for the whole aspec community and you're more than welcome to do your own research about identities and relationships.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Pitfalls:

CW for implied ace/arophobia.

Note that these things can be explored when dealing with self-doubt and self-acceptance, but please do not present the things stated below as facts.

When writing aro/ace codywan getting together: do not imply that something has been "fixed" about them.

Do not imply that being a virgin is bad.

When questioned about being aro-/ace-spec, do not make statements such as "but I can still love!!" as this throws people that don't love/are distanced from love under the bus. [see Lovelessness. Originally from the aro community, but valid to use when you're not aro as well]

In that same vein: "love is what makes us human" (or sentient in star wars I suppose) is a no.

Another in that same vein: "But I can still X" statements in general get icky very quickly, as it feels like you need to make up for a lack of something.

Don't portray an ace character as "innocent" or "childish" due to their aceness. Don't portray them as not knowing anything about sex by default unless you have good (relevant) in-story reasons for it. (e.g. Cody doesn't know anything about sex because the clones had no sex-ed and he wasn't interested in learning anyway, or Cody/Obi-Wan knows the anatomical basics but nothing further because they were Not interested.)

Addition by @data-plays-viola: Don't portray ace characters as sex negative by default, unless you have good (relevant) in-story reasons for it. Sex negative asexual people exist but the two are not connected (though some may use their asexuality as an excuse, unfortunately.)

If you write an ace character that has sex, do not imply that this is a redeeming quality. Same for an aromantic character that does romantic things.

Note that not all ace people are sex repulsed and not all aro people are romance repulsed, they may also be indifferent or favourable to the idea. (X repulsed is usually being repulsed by the idea of participating in X, though for some it means being repulsed by X in general.) Do not imply that being sex/romance repulsed is the standard for aspec people.

Note 2: some aspec people see a clear event in their past that had an effect on their sexual and romantic orientations (such as trauma), but for most people being aspec is just as random as e.g. being gay or being trans. Do not attach a reason to a character being aro and/or ace without doing your research into people that feel like that.

[ryanyflags]

anspec / anattspec / absolspec / absolnispec : anattractional/absolnian spectrum.

[ explanation ]

So I use non-sam ace mainly, but anattractional fits me too. The problem that holds (or used to) me back from using it is the language, or lack thereof.

Like say, what is the -spec version of anattractional? I think most would just answer aspec (that's what I would say before too), but aspec isn't an anattractional specific label, it's for all a- orientations. That's like saying the spectrum version of aromantic is aspec, instead of arospec. It's correct in a way, as those identities would be included under aspec, but you could get more specific.

I don't think aspec should be redefined, it should stay a broad umbrella term, and I also don't think anattractional should just be a second definition for aspec, it should get it's own specific spectrum label too, like all the other a- orientations. I don't like the lack of clarity with using aspec for both definitions, I feel like it pushes anattractional to the side, and I still like aspec more as a general, non specific term.

-✦

(First) I came up with anspec. Based off of aspec, as that's what typically thought of as the spec version of anattractional. But with an- in front, like how anattractional is prefixed with an-.

(Later) I asked @isobug for a short version of anattractional, Isopod came up with anatt (and also anat, though I prefer the double T version because anat has other unrelated meanings).

Isopod later also came up with absolnian, an alt term to anattractional (similar idea to terms like anodiean), and the shortening absol/absolni.

-✦

I both terms, anspec for it's simplicity, and absol-spec/absolni-spec for how it matches with other aspec terms (like ace-spec, aro-spec, apl-spec, etc.), so I'm posting this with both names.

[ flag explanation ]

There are no specific stripe meanings for the flag. I just followed the general gradient style of other a-spec flags, and the way they're more colourful than their base flags (instead of using plain white, they use pastel coloured white, or dark colours instead of black/grey, for example).

Here's why I chose dark, almost purplish, blue: For main a-spec flag colours, like aromantic and aplatonic (purple blue green cream apl flag), the colours chosen are the "opposite" of their a-attraction (aromantic green is the opposite of red, which is associated with romance, and aplatonic uses the inverse of multiple colours associated with platonic). From there, I generally have this idea in my head that a- colours are cool/cold colours, the opposite of the warm colours colours associated with attractions. Of all the colours, all with the same value+saturation, the dark blue in between regular blue and purple is visually the darkest/coldest colour. So I felt that would fit as a colour to add to the -spec version of anattractional. (Colour wheel for reference)

Though I still think black is the best colour for representing anattractional. You could think of it like, black = no light, like how it's no attraction. Or subtractive colouring, where if you mixed all the main aspec flag colours (which is the probably the full rainbow at this point) together, then you get black (or at least a very dark colour). It's also just kind of iconic, like the more I look at it, the more I think the use of pitch black as the main colour is really unique/distinct/cool.

[aspec-paradise]

Figuring out if you're grey-ace/aro/platonic

Notes: I am referring to grey- as the umbrella term. In addition this doesn't mean you have to identify as a grey- term like demi or -flux. This is just to help those who are struggling

Perhaps you're struggling because you do experience some level of attraction that feels "weaker" or different than what you'd expect with allos, or maybe you've noticed a potential pattern in which you experience attraction, but you're feeling doubts or confusion. It's completely normal to feel confused or anxious about this.

I won't tell you that labels don't matter so don't worry about it since that mindset doesn't work for everyone. I will say to take your time and allow yourself to breathe. There is no time limit in figuring things out and the beauty about being aspec is that you can easily just call yourself aspec, grey-, or unlabeled while you figure it out. You also never need to use any specific identities should you choose to use any labels. For example some people may be greysexual + aromantic, asexual +greyromtic, or grey for both and just call themselves aroace. Some people call themselves demi even if it's a bit more complicated than that.

"but how do I know if I experience attraction differently than someone who's allo?" It's a bit complicated but it boils down to asking yourself if it feels differently to you. Does it seem like your experiences don't really align with a lot of allos? Is your relationship with attraction complicated? Do you feel attraction but it's not a big deal to you, seems weak, or another circumstance that feels "different"? Then you're probably aspec.

As an allo-appearing aspec person, this is something I've struggled with, too. A lot of the reasons I identify as aspec is because of how my attraction usually forms and my own experiences compared to many allos. For example, while I do enjoy adult content, it's because of the mental fantasy aspects instead feeling attraction to the people shown. I don't feel comfortable with seeing sexual content without warning or consent..I don't relate to the desire to sleep with people I don't know well. I don't view platonic relationships in the typical way, in fact it's hard for me to form platonic attraction and then it's 0 or 100.

There's a lot of aspec identities out there, and aspec people CAN experience attraction strongly at times! -spike identities cover just that. You can feel attraction constantly to a specific person or specific people (like when you're demi).

And remember, it's okay to try a label and realize later that it's not quite right. You may think you're completely without attraction until suddenly you find a circumstance in which you do. You could be in such a long relationship that when it ends, that's when you realize you don't always experience attraction to people who are typically your "type", so on and so forth.

Aspecs can enjoy the form of intimacy associated to an attraction, aspecs can have attraction but not enjoy those things or only enjoy them sometimes. One piece of advice I have is to not focus too much on how much you do or do not like those things when you're in the early days of figuring this out. There are identities related to this, but in my opinion it's a bit less complicated when you focus on the attraction aspect first, and then your relationship with those acts later.

[the-delta-quadrant]

i wish allo queers could speak out against paedophilia being a legit sexual orientation without using word for word talking points from ace discourse.

"orientation is about gender and nothing else"

*chuckles in demiromantic (and really, also asexual)*

this was and sometimes still is one of the most common arguments against labels like grey or demi, because if a label doesn't describe which gender you're attracted to, it's not valid. and since demi and grey describe how someone experiences attraction rather than to which genders, well tough luck, i guess we don't exist anymore.

this argument goes hand in hand with people thinking greysexuals are just bisexuals/homosexuals/heterosexuals with a preference or something.

it also goes hand in hand with erasing the aromantic and asexual spectrums and reducing aromanticism and asexuality to singular orientations.

when in reality, aspecs and especially greyspecs have defined our orientations by things other than attraction to certain genders for literal decades at this point. asexuality and aromanticism as spectrums rather than single orientations isn't new. grey and demi identities aren't new. defining our orientations by how we experience attraction rather than to which genders isn't new.

there are so many aspecs who simply identify as "demisexual" or "greyromantic" and don't use another label to specify which genders they are attracted to. heck, a lot of greyspecs experience attraction so rarely they aren't sure which genders they can be attracted to.

even when talking about strict asexuality and strict aromanticism, "attraction to no gender" as a definition isn't really used anymore either. so even ace and aro as specific orientations aren't even defined by gender.

like, my asexuality is very much defined by my lack of sexual attraction and my relationship to sexuality as a whole and not by not being attracted to any gender, or "exclusion of all genders" or whatever the fuck allos think. my demiromanticism is very much defined by how i experience romantic attraction and barely, if at all, by which genders i'm attracted to because i have only experience romantic attraction ONCE, but don't fucking call me monoromantic.

like, you can literally just say "paedophilia is not an orientation" or "orientation isn't about attraction to an age" and not push aspecs into an allosexist view of orientation once again.

[aroacesafeplaceforall]

really long rant sorry it's not the rant day

I think i'm more lesbian than I thought and for some reason it's hitting me kind of hard? Like I feel like this shouldn't have come as such of a shock to me, i realized this year that i'm pretty much perceived as a lesbian by most of my friend's parents and probably a lot of the school, to which i was like 'yeah, cool, i definitely like that i noticeably am dressing masc, plus lesbians are cool as fuck'. Honestly thinking about it recently i'm probably the most lesbian seeming person I can think of out of the people at our school that I know... but of course I'm aroace so just kind of not really thinking about if that may be true or not. Like i wasn't really expecting another attraction crisis but here we are i guess

So then there was this whole thing with my friend, who liked me and I was unsure about but thought maybe...? but I figured out pretty quick that yep, still not interested in dating people, straight guys specifically because I definitely feel like I need to be with someone who can understand my queerness.and then I was listening to Chappell Roan, girl in red, and thinking... do I kind of get their point here? and thinking about if i could be romantically interested in girls and realizing that... I think I could? And i was thinking about all these times that are very easily interpretable as me being gay. So i was like woah and looked at myself in the mirror and said aloud "am I gay?" and it was WILD how weird that felt!! I really would think this possibility wouldn't be such a big deal for me but it really is, and it's interesting because with realizing i'm aroace, it was more like feeling like I finally understood, and like i belonged with the label. It felt really good. Plus I discovered the ace before aro and the ace was really not a shock so I kind of eased myself into it. But I guess this lesbian possibility was very sudden? idk

I think maybe i was also keeping that comphet possibility that I could date guys in the back of my mind and the idea of just completely abandoning that now is affecting me, especially because of the recent thing with my friend which I thought would be something. And there's also the possibility that i'd try to date a girl (which!! is a possibility!! because someone has expressed interest oh god i'm excited about that, interesting) and it'd be the same thing as with guys, where I try to date and am kind of thinking i'm feeling romantic attraction and then it gets maybe a month in and everything shuts off and I feel so icky with it. I really don't know and i'd definitely be worried to try that with this girl who may have expressed interest because I really really don't want to hurt any of my friends like I think i did with this other guy because I feel like i Kind of used him to figure out if I like dating, even though I told him i didn't know if i'd like it.

Argh idk but this prospect of possibly being lesbian and aroace is very intriguing and exciting and mystifying and I guess I'll see if it is the case

<2

[sharpth1ng]

You think Billy ever discovers the ace and aro spectrums?

So as far as I know the term "asexual" was coined in the 1897 (wow?? so early?), while the term "aromatic" was only first coined in 2005 (how?? feels wild that its that recent?). Even with the relative oldness of the term "asexual" I wouldn't say it broke out of academic and feminist circles and into more mainstream, accessible vocabulary until the 2000's after online communities had started to grow around it in the very late 90's.

While it probably would have done him a world of good, I can't really see Billy spend time in queer internet spaces so I don't think these terms would become something he's even aware of until later on. Also because I don't see Billy as entirely lacking sexual and romantic attraction I think it would take time for him to understand his experience as being on the spectrum. It took me a really long time to understand my identity that way as well, I just assumed that because I experience and desire these things at all then I can't identify that way, and it took more research and talking with aro and/or ace folks to understand.

Like really though, the way I see Billy is as some sort of grey/demiromantic & demisexual, and honestly? It's very confusing to be this way, especially as an autistic person! At least for me lmao. It took so long for me to figure out if I even was experiencing these types of attraction because I felt like I was supposed to, so I just did anything I could to understand myself as allo. I was allo but just picky, or I was allo but just introverted, allo but just autistic ect. And because I thought I was allo I didn't bother to investigate any further for a really long time. Other labels that ring true to me are autiaro/autiace, because similarly I don't know how to understand my sexual and romantic attraction outside of my autism.

So with Billy I'd say maybe he'll come to identify himself with these kinds of labels someday, but I think he's also not super likely to do the research. That said I do think that he will come to understand his sexual and romantic attraction in this way, even if he doesn't have those labels to apply to it.

Billy's demisexuality specifically is going to be something he's discovering and navigating over the next several chapters of WoM. He has a high libido but it's all directed at Stu and he's going to have to come face to face with that fact. Billy won't be using ace/aro terms specifically because he doesn't have access to them, but he is going to come to understand himself as someone who needs a specific kind of connection to experience sexual and romantic attraction.

I'll say it though: Debaser Billy is demisexual. He's also some flavor of grey or demi-aro.