#trans women are women. trans men are men. they have different experiences than cis women and men.
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hey there! i don’t mean this in bad faith at all, and i’m not trying to use a term that’s a fascist dogwhistle. i promise i’m just confused😭
so i’m not a guy, nor have i ever been perceived as one, but in one of your recent posts, you said that men can’t experience oppression solely based on the fact that they’re men. which was kind of confusing to me — i don’t think you’re wrong, i think it’s me but i don’t know how to get to how you see it like that.
because in my experience, men can experience oppression because they’re men, although i don’t know if i’m saying that right or conflating the meanings of certain terms. i’m probably wrong, and would just love some clarification?
for example, my brother and i were always held to different standards growing up — it was expected of me to always cry and be emotional, and i was a ‘stone cold bitch’ if that wasn’t the case, but if my brother wanted to show negative emotions like sadness he was treated like there was something wrong with him too. and i know it wasn’t my brother — i spend a lot of time working with my high school’s diversity team, and in a lot of the events we organise, guys talk about how they feel enormous pressure to be angry and never sad, and to have stereotypically masculine interests and never deviate from that norm.
i also know men who’ve struggled to get jobs such as teaching as those are viewed as ‘female’ jobs and it’s a common view that men who want those jobs are ‘only in it to be around kids’. i’ve heard many women around me perpetuate sentiments like that, so i know they’re not making it up, even if it isn’t equal to the systematic oppression women face in almost every aspect of their careers.
i’m not providing these examples to prove you wrong, since i do think you’re right. i’m hoping that a window into the way i’ve always thought might help you clarify this in a way that can help me to change my mind, since i just think i’m lacking some clarity or context here. i think i’m conflating abuse and stereotypes with oppression, but i’m really not sure. any advice would be really appreciated!
i’m so sorry if this comes off badly, i don’t mean it that way. i’m just trying to learn, i promise i’m not trying to promote the kind of hate and close mindedness you’ve been seeing in your inbox as of late.
Hi! As always, I do not mind answering genuine questions!
The things you're talking about growing up and seeing boys around you pressured to present only certain emotions, that's part of the patriarchy!
Certain emotions are supposed to be "feminine" and thus boys shouldn't show them, while girls are often always considered "emotional" in some fashion. That's not oppression based on those boys being men that you're talking about.
It's the backlash that the patriarchy, and by addition trans/misogyny has on men. It's boys being pressured not to show certain emotions because those emotions are "feminine" and they're supposed to associate feminimity with weakness and shit.
What you're talking about there is also trans/misogyny!
The idea that men who do things perceived as feminine are predators, the idea that specific jobs are "female" jobs [while even in those specific female jobs, men are generally paid better and find it easier to get into those jobs than women trying to get into traditionally "male" jobs"]
[Though obviously this varies based on race and whether they're trans, etc, etc.]
To be a little more clear, all of the things you're talking about don't primarily affect cis men/boys. They fuck up transfems, because it's trans/misogyny.
You're right! It's not systemic oppression.
You might wonder if it's social oppression, which is also a no. Social oppression would require a historical/systemic oppression behind it. But that doesn't exist in this case.
What it is is the common issue oppressors run into. While they benefit greatly from oppression, there is also backlash they face from their own systems of oppression.
Like white people who fall into suicide cults trying to work towards white supremacy, or TERFs who fall into groups where they slowly pick each other off as they discover they're not all exactly the same and wind up accusing each other of not being "real" women, systems of bigotry simply do not work out perfectly even for the oppressors.
They never do.
To create the patriarchy, you must establish trans/misogyny, you must establish intersexism and you must push people to conform to those ideals, even if they hurt your own.
It's similar to how white supremacy can harm white people, despite white people obviously not being oppressed racially. The backlash of oppression hits even the oppressors sometimes.
Suppression, as a term, would honestly work far better to describe what you're talking about.
So yes, it's stereotyping, yes it's abusive to tell your children not to show/feel their emotions but it's not oppression based on these guys in your life being men! It's part of how trans/misogyny, transphobia and intersexism are enforced.
I understand exactly where you're coming from! It doesn't sound bad and I genuinely don't mind answering questions! Especially since you've got some good ones!
I'm not sure if I rambled too much to explain this properly but I hope this helps! Let me know if you have any other questions and/or need me to clarify anything here. <33
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Sometimes i remember a comics moment i randomly came across somewhere, where Sam Wilson mentiones a musical and Steve Rodgers says he doesn't like musicals, to whitch Sam goes "Guess that means you really are straight" and even tho i don't care about Cap America or the Avengers, the moment stuck in me for that quote by Sam. And like....Sci, any ideas if straight men actually don't like musicals or is that bullshit?
actually i think i know more gay men who hate musicals than i know straight men who hate musicals. i've had a drag queen stop me point blank when i was about to sing a barbra streisand song, and i know so many gays who pointedly hate abba. so based on my experience i think the inverse is true. most of the straight men i know are kind of impartial about musicals, but gay men? hate.
my theory is that a lot of gay men don't want to fall into stereotypes, maybe. but thaaaaat's just a theory! a gay theory.
#sci speaks#i'm trying to understand the gays. they are a mystery to me.#i've seen a lot more toxic masculinity coming from gay men than i have from straight men.#i think it makes sense. they have less women in their lives. so they reckon with a lot more masculinity. more dick measuring.#also gay men have some of THE most unhealthy romantic relationships i've ever seen in my life.#this isn't a blanket statement on everyone but just from what i've seen. it's such a strange pattern i've observed.#lesbians? healthy. straights? usually healthy. gay men? universally a tire fire that makes me say “if you hate each other so much ??”#“why are you together??????????”#i have never met a cis gay mlm couple in real life that was healthy. every single one of them made my eyes widen in horror.#i want them to be healthy. please treat each other better.#the number of bitchy bitchy fights i've seen between mlm couples in public that make me so terrified#but i know mlm relationships in general are usually less... affectionate than wlw relationships. even and especially friendships.#just an observation.#i hate to say that there is a definite difference between amab vs afab experiences when it comes to relationship dynamics but.#of course there is. there is. as much as i want to say gender and sex do not matter. it really does.#it makes a difference. it does.#which is kind of why i'm glad i was born in the body i was. when people say “trans means you feel you were born in the wrong body”#im like.. i don't think that's true. i don't think that's true for me.#i wouldn't be me if i wasn't born the way i was. and i want to be me. but i'm a boy. i'm a boy but in the body that i have.#my body is still a boy's body. because i live in here.#sorry this went off on a tangent.#but yeah i know my brain would be different if i was amab. and i don't want all those other issues.#i think the only reason i'm so peaceful and serene is because i'm afab. and afabulous.#i see cis guys and im like.. yeah i don't want what you got.#once again! lucky to be me! i'm lucky. im lucky i have a vargooba. thank fuck for that!#couldve been so much worse off. could've been born with a dick and would be fighting for my life right now.
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Alright fine I’m gonna speak my mind.
My cis followers, listen up:
Being attracted to trans people is not inherently a fetish. The way you speak about trans people CAN be fetishistic, but 99% of the time when I see cis people calling out trans fetishism it’s literally just. Someone being really horny for a trans person. That’s not inherently fetishistic.
Sorry but it actually hurts me a little when I see cis people claim that a content creator is being fetishistic for drawing a trans guy with tits and a pussy, or for writing smut where a trans guy really enjoys using his pussy for sex, or God forbid said trans guy is fem. Trans people like that exist, you know. I myself have a pussy and fuck yes do I want people I’m in a relationship with to be attracted to it. And the same goes for many transfemmes who keep their natal parts, especially butch transfemmes.
Trans people are not a monolith. We don’t all hate our bodies or experience dysphoria or express our genders the same way. I swear to God cis people are all “allies” until a trans man is fem or a trans woman is butch or an enby isn’t androgynous or we actually enjoy our bodies or we have a kink or sexual fetish you don’t like.
Cis people: I know your hearts are in the right place and I appreciate that, but spouting “oh this content is fetishistic and Bad because trans men NEVER like their vaginas and are NEVER feminine” (or something equal to other trans people) is seriously not the allyship you think it is.
There is absolutely a conversation to be had about fetishising trans people — chasers in particular — but it’s quite a bit less black and white than hating certain FICTIONAL portrayals of trans people because these types of trans people exist in real life and we can see what you say about us.
I love my dick and my pussy (because I have both — are you aware we can have both?) but I saw a post today by someone I really like that actually made me feel kind of shit about myself because it was a cis person essentially saying that smut that describes my genitals in any particularly horny light is fetishistic and that really kind of hurt me. It made me feel like people think I’m undesirable due to my body only it was said in some backwards attempt to be an ally which is almost worse than deliberate transphobia lol.
I guess my point is: not all trans people’s feelings and experiences are universal. Call out obvious transphobia when you see it, yes, but please stop speaking for us about complex situations you just can’t fully understand unless you’re trans. Trans identities and experiences can be so much more complicated than what mainstream celebrities and articles will tell you and I just really need cis people to stop behaving as though the issues we face are a quick and easy fix. It never is. Sometimes the best allyship is to listen to how WE feel and take it into consideration instead of saying whatever you think we want you to say — because a lot of the time, we don’t.
#Sorry for popping off but that really upset me and I had to say something#I don’t usually speak up about things like this because so many cis people just can’t take a criticism to save their lives#Also I know some trans people WOULD find the things I mentioned fetishistic but that’s part of my point#Is that we all experience and feel different things and don’t all have the same beliefs#And implying it’s inherently fetishistic to be attracted to us harms way more trans people than not#Also transmeds and truscum please stay away from me you’re part of the problem 💜#Hope at least one cis person sees this and does some reflection#long post#text post#trans#transgender#transphobia#trans nsft#trans ally#trans discourse#trans men are men#trans women are women#enby#nonbinary#intersex#gender essentialism#bioessentialism#gender roles#gnc#gender nonconforming#rant#vent#nsft
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should I remake my discourse vent blog lmao
#i just need somewhere to scream in all caps:#THE FUNDAMENTAL PROBLEM WITH RA/DFE/MS IS NOT THE TRANSMISOGYNY#THAT IS A SYMPTOM OF THE GENDER ESSENTIALISM#THE PROBLEM IS DEHUMANIZING WIDE SWATHS OF HUMANITY#specifically: you cannot take the transmisogyny out and have a good worldview.#you can’t magically say ‘trans women are women and therefore perfect innocent victims’#and ‘trans men are men and therefore brutish subhuman oppressors’#which… is a very common viewpoint on this website#trans women are women. trans men are men. they have different experiences than cis women and men.#all people are people who are capable of good and evil#like. come on guys. men are human beings.#most of the men I’ve known have been kind and thoughtful.#most of the shitty men I’ve known have had reasons for being shitty that are not ‘being a man makes you evil’#and the same thing applies to women - who are equally capable of causing harm.#don’t use scapegoats guys. it keeps you from making any actually useful progress.
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conflating sexual orientation with genital preference is just so weird to me. I told someone I was gay last night and they asked if I was into dick or pussy, and it completely short circuited my brain as I tried to explain that it's about gender, not genitals. It feels like if instead of asking someone if they liked coffee or tea, asking if they liked opaque or clear hot beverages. Like, I like tea with milk and also without, and I like coffee with cream but also espresso, but not black coffee? And in that same way, if someone is just squicked out by tea with milk that's completely valid for them, but to then extrapolate their own experience outward and define a tea drinker as someone who doesn't like milk is both a logical fallacy and reductive of the human experience. Gender and sex is so much more complex than that and I can't fathom trying to reduce it down to such a false binary.
#this was something I felt even before I realized I was trans#there's no difference in my attraction to cis or trans men#and it's weird cause it was at a queer party but several comments throughout the night were people equating gender and genitals#like a lesbian saying she was put off by seeing dicks in a movie#and inside I was like “well were they straight male dicks? lesbian dicks? gay dicks?”#as a gay man I am attracted to the latter by association#and when it's either of the former it puts me off because that's not who I'm into!#but to see it as this separate thing feels weirdly dehumanizing#again: genital preference is a valid thing for people to experience#but to equate that to gender preference just feels like a completely unfounded comparison#my sex is so much more complex than that and I can guarantee someone interested in women would not find what they are looking for in me#I used to think sex was a much more solid thing#but learning more about biology and then transitioning have taught me that it is a highly mutable and complex phenomenon#this is sort of a vent about feeling somewhat dysphoric from people's comments but moreso than that just genuine bafflement#t
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internalized transphobia is fucked up. i started transitioning 6 years ago and there's still shit i'm only now starting to accept about myself
#america needs to be dismantled board by board i think#i can't speak on anything but my own experiences living in massachusetts but#i interact with a lot of 'hate the sin love the sinner' style transphobia and people don't even realize they're doing it#so for me personally i don't fear violence from others but have struggled a LOT with like#trans identity being humored rather than actually believed and understood. like 'her pronouns are they/them' type shit#and reflecting on the messaging about gender i grew up with and see children continue to replicate. not good!#a lot of WEIRD ideas about men and women and other. what they are and what they aren't and how desirable they are#cis ppl are lying when they say there are only men and women and they can't change btw. they KNOW that's not true#look at the way they treat and talk about gender nonconforming and trans people of different genders#i know people make jokes about or seriously believe homophobia and transphobia aren't appropriate names bc it's not about fear#but they are afraid. i think they're not so much afraid of gay and trans people as they're afraid of being gender nonconforming themselves#displays of gender nonconformity and homosexuality make them think about their own gender nonconforming traits+desires and that scares them#they see us as threats and lash out at us bc it's easier to do that than face their feelings. and the fear doesn't excuse their retaliation
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There's something so specifically infuriating when someone uses one of your experiences or your demographic in an argument, especially if said argument is about spreading hatred or is just so wrong. They "speak on behalf of the ___" to say such fucked shit.
"You're not thinking of the ___!"
"I literally am ___. You saying that adds nothing as you do not speak for me or for other ___. Shut up."
#I really really hate it. It angers me in such a specific way that just skldjf ksdl#...#vent below. idk. I'm really sorry#Mad rambles#Terfs will be like “oh think of survivors! 'MEN' can share women's spaces!” like shut the actual fuck up. SHUT UP. Shut your damn mouth#A terf is so much more dangerous than a trans person. Me. a tiny cis woman is so much more dangerous to a terf than a transperson is.#Because I will obliterate you. How dare you say you speak on MY behalf? As if I don't know what I'm fucking talking about.#as if you're “protecting me” by spewing such bullshit? by treating someone as a danger when they're not?!#Especially when they believe it's a fucking TRUMP CARD. Like mentioning it means they're right!!! when obviously they're not!!!#Or when they think the fact that I'm cis will make me agree with them! I'm cis simply because I am. I'm not better or worse because of it#being cis doesn't mean I'm fine with bullshit though!#I really hate feeling almost as if like...idk I'm “known” for talking about this but it's just so so infuriating. people will act like they#know when they don't. Obviously every experience is different and terfs who are survivors I hope you find peace and my heart goes out to yo#but you also need to get your fucking head outta your ass. Saying such things isn't the way to heal and you're hurting others with it.#It's NOT about hating men or trans people! the “men are always violent/women are always victims” mentality needs to fuck off#as if it's just the script of life and that it's inescapable no matter what. that it's the truth even if circumstances say otherwise.#...I'm going to possibly block the epic tag for a bit. I have the name of the saga blocked but like... It's just genuinely upsetting.#my story got picked apart too on how it wasn't actually that bad. that I'm actually the fucking worst. “Men are just like that sweetie”#BULLSHIT!!! Gender doesn't dictate a person's morals. Being good and kind does. It doesn't matter what form that takes!#not even saying HE'S good and kind as he's horrible and wonderful at the same time but about this stuff? Do what you want but#I DO think you're insane if you see it as otherwise and it makes me wanna lock my door. You're not a bad person probably but also 🙃#I get that there's history but there's also the fucking TEXT.#I don't know. I'm really sorry#tw trauma#tw sa mention#I'm not necessarily against reblogging this (I don't care) but don't post with tags. please
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remember when the big discourse on here was cis people loudly telling other cis people that genderbends are inherently transphobic and if you do them you're The Bad Man
that was dumb lol
#anime life#keep in mind i am literally trans#i have seen genderbends that are boring and ones that are good#but ive also seen trans headcanons that are boring and ones that are good#i think it's boring to not investigate the way this experience would fundamentally change who this character is#like... the lived experiences of cis men are different than cis women are different than trans women are different than trans men#there are overlaps certainly!!!!#but like. 'what if this cis man character were a cis woman' would result in a different life than 'what if they were a trans woman'#personally for my own taste#i would prefer someone imagining if a cis man were a cis woman (or vise versa)#more than someones trans hc that basically boils down to 'this character passes so well and experiences to friction from being trans'#that's just my preference!!!!!!#but i certainly don't think imagining a character being a different kind of cis person is transphobic
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I love calling people cis adjacent. Trans card revoked without straight calling them a trender. Good work boys.
#cis-adj and trender mean different things#trenders are actually traditionally very NOT cis adjacent#gnc and cis adjacent are not antonyms/ tho they usually dont mesh super well together#cis adjacent mostly refers to someone who does not take any active steps towards transition#which is why i think its a helpful and sensical term??? if they are literally. not. taking steps to TRANSition. they are cis adjacent#listen. cis adjacent trans people are good. or/ better than cis people at least.#they can have a lot to say about what it feels like for them to be trans. but they should also have a lot to say about being cis adjacent#intersectionality means so much more than just Oppression/Oppression it is subtle experience/subtle experience#and the difference between being visibly trans and not even wanting\needing to take transition steps is Not Subtle#even tho they both theoretically could fit within all the same identities and intersectionalities down to being trans#a subtle difference is something like not wanting vs not needing to take those steps#idk im jus rambling nonsense at this point i didnt think id end up full hearted defending the term cis adjacent#basically. nobodies getting their trans card revoked that was obviously a joke.#cis adjacent is kinda like the term straight passing for bi people.#it can be used horribly and it can make you feel bad but imo? it has its use#sometimes people are straight passing and sometimes people are cis adjacent.#the biggest problem seems to be how broadly people apply these terms#a lot of bi people literally cannot pass as anything but queer and the way a lot of monos act like#bi people are just like a monolith of fem women and masc men is very fucking weird????? and that is objectively biphobic#i dunno what im talking about anymore
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[id: the first image is a reply by @.demilypyro that reads: That doesnt sound very cis
the second image is a reply by @.homosexualmorelikehomiesexual that reads: respectfully adding to this in agreement with op: i think its true that no, it DOESNT sound very cis, but thats bc according to the very same gender system that sucks so much, anyone who disagrees or complains about it is Other, and i think thats......part of the exact problem op is talking abt..? so yeh idk. speaking as a trans person myself- op youre valid youre right and you should say it i support you go cis boy go
#this is what i call cis+ #youre cis but youve seen the void. the truth. and then you pulled back and went Ok Got It. Keeping My Gender Though #which i think is just as respectable. like amen #consciously opting into your assigned gender when you know you don’t actually have to..... #thats cis plus. cis prime. cis upgraded. you feel? /end]
I’m a cis man sure but i also wanna opt out of the gender binary. None of that shit is my fault or my responsibility and i don’t want any part of it
#text#lgbtag#may actually add something to the post eventually but it's late so just putting some thoughts in the tags#saying this as a trans genderfuck person . it's incredibly reductive to tell anyone who questions the gender binary or desires to break it-#-down that they Have to be trans to do so#you see it a lot with gnc cis people but tbh . applies to even gender conforming cis people and even non-queer cis people !#because in doing so you reinforce that trans people are Magically Different than cis people and that we're the only people who want to-#-question and break down the gender binary#but like . if you want to acknowledge that the gender binary is made up & people have complex relationships with it that fall outside of-#-the socially dictated binary & that ''man'' and ''woman'' are socially created categories not based in biology#and that there's no concrete definition of what a man or a woman or someone who's both or neither and etc beyond personal identity and-#-social category / cis-enforced societal roles#... you also have to realize that some people will break down the concept of the binary and recognize all of that . and still identify with-#-their assigned gender and be cis#expecting anyone who breaks down and rejects the gender binary to automatically also be trans not only cuts us off from cis allies who want-#-to help trans acceptance and break down those social structures#but also ignores intersectional groups who have complicated experiences with gender based on those identities while being cis!#(ex as a white person with privilege i don't feel confident speaking on it on my own but reading about black perspectives on gender and how-#-black women especially have historically been treated by largely white feminist movements how black women are degendered how the sex-#-binary has been leveraged in a racist & eugenics-based way etc imo is really important for breaking down the gender binary even when it's-#-discussing specifically cis people. bc discussions on marginalization are never in a vacuum)#and there are plenty of people Esp queer people who may not solidly fit in a cis or trans box esp when it comes to gnc people!#ex the amount of butch lesbians and fem/me gay men whose connection to womanhood or manhood is through being a lesbian/gay man#but who have more complex relationships with their gender and expression than Just womanhood or manhood#idk long rant and none of this is to say that there's a Cisphobic Trans Agenda to Force Poor Cis People to be trans bc a woman likes suits-#-or a man thinks the gender binary sucks#just . again as a trans person who experiences a lot of joy from my relationship to gender and being trans#i love seeing cis people who can find joy in their gender through breaking down the binary!#gender is complicated and i think accepting it as something Anyone can have a complex relationship . cis or trans . is a big part of-#-accepting that gender is a social construct and not a biological fact
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the biggest tip i can say about trans inclusive language when discussing anatomy is to just say what you mean without trying to find a euphemism, and to be specific to the conversation that you're having. if you're having a conversation about childbirth, say "people who can give birth". not everyone who can give birth is a woman and not every woman can give birth (both trans and cis), so don't say "women" or "mothers" or "females", you don't even have to say like "womb haver" or whatever. "person who can give birth" is specific and clear if you're talking about childbirth.
if you're talking about penis and testes, just say that. "men" in that context is cis-centric. "amab genitals" means nothing, since trans women can have bottom surgery, and intersex people exist in all kinds of physical expressions of sex.
avoid sexualized terms like tits/boobs (use breasts) or dick, balls, etc. those terms take on a context that can make folks feel uncomfortable about their anatomy due to the sexual context. I feel uncomfortable when people try to be inclusive and say shit like "pussy haver" but if I'm reading a medical article about vaginas I'd much rather it be addressed to "people with vaginas" rather than "women"
the more we separate language of body parts from gender identities and actually start speaking frankly and respectfully about anatomy without acting like its some taboo, the better it will be for trans and intersex people. it can help cis people too. you can be a cis woman who doesn't have a womb, you can be a cis man who doesn't have penis or testes. imo this kind of language is inclusive not only for gender non-conforming people but everyone with a physical difference in their sex characteristics, due either to genetics or a lived experience!
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there really is a cultural pressure for transmascs & men to detransition, and it comes from all sides. it comes from the queer community too, not just terfs and cishet transphobes.
it took me a while to realize why transphobic people and transandrophobic queers utterly despise trans guys & mascs who are over the age of like 25- it's because it pisses them right off that we've resisted their attempts to make us detransition. it makes them so angry to see they were unable to groom that person into a life of self-shame and repression. it really seems like MOST people believe that trans men will just detransition eventually in life? people NEVER think about older trans men, only teenage trans boys and trans men in their very early twenties.
when i was involved with my local punk scene i was addressed with condescension, almost everyone around me didn't accept transmasculinity as a legitimate identity and thought that we would've transitioned by now in life. i encountered folks who would talk about transmasculinity with subtle disgust that made me feel like i was doing something wrong, and people who expressed overt disgust, saying in plain english that they were disgusted by breasts and vaginas because they were gay men. all along the way i was literally mocked for not having a penis, and one of my roommates started treating me differently once they found out i didn't have one (because they were attracted to me)
i've been on T for 9 years, and been out as a trans man for a bit longer than that, and i noticed as i've aged i've also attracted a lot of folks who have tried to deter me from identifying as a trans man, either through directly telling me that trans men are inherently dangerous, or by implying that women or another gender are safer, quieter, calmer, "less traumatizing to be around," etc. one of my exes told me they were terrified to date me (despite literally going out of their way to do so for over half a year) because they were scared i would be transphobic to them because i'm a transmasculine lesbian.
i received pressure from online friends to either detransition and become an intersex butch woman, or to something feminine adjacent or nonbinary. for years i dealt with a few friends who kept subtly hinting that i should stop identifying as a trans man or trans masc because of how awful transmascs are- going as far as to sending me screenshots of transmascs speaking, complaining about them and calling them whiny, annoying. talking about how all transmascs are entitled, how all transmascs take things too personally, how we complain too much, and so on.
people make no effort to make space for transmascs and men. i met 0 transmascs in my local punk community that i was able to stay in contact with. none. i met a few in passing but none that actually were introduced to me in a capacity where i could actually try to befriend them. it really felt like other punks in the scene were desperately trying to keep the transmascs apart at times. excuses were made as to why i couldn't hang out with other transmascs i liked, but i was constantly being forced to befriend transphobic cis gay men and transandrophobic transfemmes who outwardly expressed hatred and disgust of us. it really felt like it was on purpose... almost as if other members of this community wanted our attention, but never wanted us to give each other attention or a sense of community. like we were objects, not people to be included in the community for real. satellite friends, if you will.
i'll be honest with you. i was at my lowest at this point. i realized i wasn't just a trans man and that i'm a genderqueer person who experiences multiple genders, including womanhood and an "other" gender, which was great. however now i was being forced to completely stuff down being a man for the sake of other people. instead of folks telling me they'd rather not hang out with transmascs, folks rather just attempted to guilt me for identifying as such in the hopes i'd stop identifying that way. i was being told daily that trans men and mascs are inherently violent and terrible to be around. i was in discord servers where transmascs were being kicked constantly for getting even slightly upset about transandrophobia, or being unfairly targeted by staff.
it's violence, but nobody wants to call it that. i pulled myself out of there and am now able to contact other transmascs and trans men who are proud of who they are and have elevated me back into a headspace where it's okay to truly be myself. just keep in mind that if you feel like you're in that situation, you're not alone. people who attempt to groom others are often very subtle it's not always up front. they will start slipping in hateful sentiments very slowly and make you feel like maybe they're the ones who are actually right.
it feels good to be an almost 32 year old trans guy. there's nothing to be ashamed about there. people project their feelings on to my gender and that has nothing to do with me. it has nothing to do with you, either. people will just project on to you for whatever reason- hatred is usually the motivator there. if you encounter folks who keep trying to badger you out of identifying as your gender, no matter who you are, transmasc, transfemme, transneutral, trans anything- they are not good for you. they are not your friends. they do not accept you as you are and you deserve so much better.
#transmasc#trans#lgbtqia#lgbtq#lgbt#queer#gay#lesbian#bisexual#genderqueer#non binary#nonbinary#enby#ftm#transmasculine#trans man#trans men#transgender#transsexual#ftm gay#trans gay#trans lesbian#transmasc lesbian#butch#butch lesbian#dyke#genderfluid#intersex#about us#our writing
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Thinking of this post again in terms of how wildly people just cannot understand intersectionality and like. Im boggled every time I get a notif and peek and see More People have come along to say "how can a cis woman have privilege??? Cis women are not privileged" which like. You're totally right. Cis women aren't privileged, they have privilege, which is the privilege of being cisgender. No one IS privileged in terms of their identity, because identities have more layers than just "is privileged" "is oppressed". A trans woman can still have white privilege. An intersex person can still have able-bodied privilege. This should be baby steps here but apparently we need to go back because people can't fathom that a group that they see "as privileged" (men) might also experience oppression (being trans, a MOC, disabled, intersex, Jewish, a million different things that could intersect here)
I think it's a huge huge issue that people use privilege as a weapon to beat people with in leftist spaces to the point of abandoning reason. To wrap this around to the thing Im always talking about; Trans men don't have Cis male privilege because we are not cis. You cannot slot any and all men into "privileged" if you believe in the existence of intersectionality.
And using this perceived privilege to power jacket trans men and beat us into silence is the exact same thing terfs do to trans women constantly. You are perpetuating this violence with a borrowed weapon. This is not new. "You're a dangerous man exerting your privilege to invade women's spaces, you're not oppressed, you're pretending to be so you can speak over the real victims here." is rhetoric that should not be coming out of the mouth of any trans person with an iota of understanding of where this sentiment stemmed from.
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There is no universal "AFAB experience" and there is no universal "AMAB experience" and cis people using these terms are often just using them as a way to misgender trans people but dress it up in a veneer of seemingly progressive language
i think we need to put a moratorium on cis people using "AFAB" and "AMAB." they're getting a bit too comfortable with it.
#i particularly hate the idea of 'afab/amab childhood' being presented as something that's real or a useful thing to specify#trans people will very often have a different childhood experience than their cis peers#that and when people are like 'well men---i mean AMABS-- are just SOCIALIZED to be pushy and awful and aggressive'#you are literally just misgendering trans women to assert your beliefs and prejudices
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I think in honor of pride month and also in general forever we should stop trying fit queer people into the identities we think they should call themselves.
And I know no one is going to see this because no one ever does but I'm going to talk about it anyway because this is important.
Bisexual doesn't mean you don't date trans people, it doesn't mean you like men and women, it doesn't mean you can't have a preference. Someone can identify as polysexual or bisexual or omnisexual and have no preference and you don't get to say that that means they're pansexual. Because no, if they don't identify as pansexual then they're not pansexual.
Transmasc doesn't mean you use he/him pronouns. It doesn't mean you identify as a man. Transfem doesn't mean you use she/her pronouns. It doesn't mean you identify as a woman. You can be nonbinary or genderqueer or agender or any gender that isn't binary and not use they/them pronouns. You can use any of those labels and still identify as a man or a woman. You can use different pronouns than is typically used for your birth sex and not consider yourself transgender. People can be gender non conforming and not he trans. People can be trans and not gender non conforming.
A trans man can be fem. A trans woman can be masc. Nonbinary people don't owe you androgyny. Intersex people don't owe you androgyny. Intersex people are people, they deserve way more attention than a way to one up transphobes. Intersex people face discrimination and body altering surgeries without their consent and then are only ever talked about to say "some cis women have penises" or "some people have an extra x chromosome" and then we never talk about the struggle they face as part of the queer community.
Asexuality and aromanticism is a spectrum. Some aces like sex, some aces are repulsed, some aces only experience sexual attraction to one person or once in their life, some aces need a deep emotional bond, some aces their attraction changes. Some aros change identities. Some aros are repulsed by romance unless it's a fictional character. Some aros have romantic feelings until they get to know someone. Some aros crave a romantic relationship but never have romantic feelings. You don't get to say someone isn't asexual or aromantic enough.
Asexuality and aromanticism is having a unique relationship with romance or sexual feelings and impulses. Someone who is transgender has a unique experience with gender. You don't get to decide that they don't have a unique experience. But guess what? You don't get to decide if they do either. Someone can have a unique experience and still not identify as asexual aromantic or transgender. You can cross dress and still fully feel like a man. You can use he/him pronouns as a cis women. You can have trauma around sex and not identify as asexual. You can never have a romantic relationship and not identify as aromantic.
You can have "contradicting" labels. I don't know as many of these because I don't personally identify as any but please fell welcome to add in reblogs. There are trans men lesbians and gay women. There are sex loving asexuals. I know there are others I just genuinely am not educated enough.
YOU DONT GET TO CHOOSE SOMEONES LABELS
ANYONE CAN EITHER IDENTIFY OR NOT IDENTIFY AS QUEER
Please feel welcome to add anything in reblogs. I'm sure there's things I've missed. I haven't talked about neopronouns I haven't talked enough about "contradicting" labels. I haven't talked about queer platonic relationships or kink or polyamory or enough about intersex people or pronouns vs gender. There's so much important things but at the end of the day it's just so important to not choose other people's labels.
#queer#lgbt#lgbtqia#pride#pride month#bisexual#transgender#intersex#asexual#aromantic#pansexual#lesbian#gay#nonbinary#genderqueer#agender#omnisexual#polysexual#polyamory#queer community#lgbt pride#lgbt community
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Lately I've been dipping my toe into the mess that is transandrophobia discourse, and in the process I've been presented with one question in many forms:
"Do trans men experience misogyny?"
My initial answer was "these terms are all theoretical frameworks for a vast range of human experiences, why would you choose to frame your pre-transition experiences as that of a woman?" This makes sense to me, but clearly isn't satisfactory to many of the people sending me anons. As much as I might want to use my own life as a case study, I can't very well tell these people in my asks box "no, you've never experienced something that could be categorized as misogyny." Still, the question bothers me.
I think that's because the question obfuscates the actual debate. It's clear to me the question we are debating is not one of "experience" but "authority." That is:
"Do (binary) trans men understand what it's like to be a woman?"
My answer? No.
How can I justify that when we have, since birth, been raised as women? Well, because we also have, since birth, been trans men. If we cast aside the idea of transness as a modern social construct or anything other than an innate and biological reality, this has to be true. Even before you ever came out to yourself, you were transgender. Transphobia has dictated every moment of your life. Your idea of what "womanhood" is is not at all the same as a woman's, be it cis or trans. Why? Because a woman does not react to "being a woman" with the dysphoria, dissociation, and profound sense of wrongness that you do. [If you do not experience these things, a cis or trans woman, at the very least, does not identify as a binary trans man.] A woman sincerely identifies as a woman, and identity plays a pivotal role in how we absorb societal messaging.
Let's take homophobia as an example. While any queer person has probably experienced targeted episodes of bigotry, the majority of bigotry we experience must necessarily be broad and social. Boys learn to fear becoming a faggot as a group, but the boy who is a faggot will internalize those messages in a completely different way to the boys who only need learn to assert the heterosexual identity already inherent in them through violence. All of them are suffering to some extent, but their experiences are not at all equivalent. This is despite the fact that they've all absorbed the same message, maybe even at the same moment, through the same events. Still, we don't say that a straight boy knows what it is like to be a gay boy. Similarly, cis women do not know what it is like to be a trans man despite being fed the same transphobic messaging in a superficially identical context. It isn't a stretch to say the same can apply to misogyny.
Because I can't speak for you, I'll use myself as an example for a moment. I'll give my bonafides: I am a gender-nonconforming, T4T queer, white, binary trans man. I am on T, and I have recently come out to my family. I do not pass. My career as a comic writer is tied to my identity as a trans man. I can confidently say I have never been impacted by misogyny the same way as my friends who actually identify as women. This manifested early on as finding it easy to shrug off the messaging that I needed to be X or Y way to be a woman. In fact, most gender roles slid off my back expressly because breaking them gave me euphoria. I was punished in many ways for this, but being this sort of cis woman did help me somewhat. It's easy to be "one of the guys" in a social climbing sense if you really do feel more comfortable as a man. It also helped me disregard misogyny aimed at me or others because it seemed like an shallow form of bigotry. It was something you could shrug off, but it was important for building "unity" among women. I thought this must be the case for all women, that we all viewed misogyny as a sort of "surface level" bigotry. However, for whatever conditional status I gained in this role, there was a clear message that if I did "become" a man, every non-conformist trait about me would just become a grotesque and parodic masculinity.
That was the threat that was crushing me, destroying my identity and self esteem. That was what I knew intimately through systemic, verbal, physical, and sexual abuse. I could express my nonconformity as a cis woman, but if I took it so far as to transition to male? I would be a pathetic traitor, a social outcast. I truly believe that throughout my life people were able to see that I was not just a failed woman, but an emasculated man.
I do partly feel that the sticking point for many is the idea that the sexual abuse suffered by trans men is inherent to womanhood, and therefore inexplicable if trans men are men from birth. While this disregards the long history of sexual abuse of young boys, especially minority boys, I do see the emotional core. I'll offer that the sexual abuse I suffered was intrinsically linked to my emmasculation, my boyishness, despite the fact that I was not out to myself or anyone else. I believe many trans men have suffered being the proxy for cis women's desire for retribution against cis men, or for cis men and women's desire for an eternally nubile young boy. I also believe they have suffered corrective assault that attempts to push them back into womanhood, which in itself is an experience unique to transness rather than actual womanhood.
I'll note quickly that many, many trans men cannot relate to the idea of feeling confident and above it all when it comes to womanhood. Many of you probably tried desperately to conform, working every moment to convince yourself you were a woman and to perfectly inhabit that identity. I definitely experienced this as well (though for me it was specifically attempting to conform to butchness) but I can concede many of you experienced it more than I did. I still believe that this desperate play-acting is also not equivalent to true womanhood. It is a uniquely transgender experience, one that shares much more in common with trans women desperately attempting to conform to manhood than with true womanhood.
One key theme running through the above paragraphs is the idea that "womanhood" is synonymous with "suffering." A trans man must know what it is like to be a woman because he suffers like one. It should be noted that actual womanhood is not a long stretch of suffering. It often involves joy, euphoria, sisterhood, a general love and happiness at being a woman. It wasn't until I admitted to myself I had never been a woman that I was able to see how the women in my life were not women out of obligation, but because they simply were. The idea that you are a woman because you suffer is more alligned with radfem theory than any reality of womanhood.
When I admitted my identity to myself I was truly faced with the ways that my ability to stand up to misogyny did not equate to being anti-misogynist. I was giddy to finally be able to admit to being a man, and suddenly all that messaging that "slid off my back" was a useful tool in my arsenal. Much like cis gay men feel compelled to assert their disgust for vaginas and women after a life of being compelled towards heterosexuality, I felt disgust and aversion to discussions of womanhood as an identity. I didn't even want to engage with female fictional characters. I viewed other people's sincere expressions of their own womanhood as a coded dismissal of my identity. Like many people before and after, I made women into the rhetorical device that had oppressed me. Not patriarchy, not transphobia, but womanhood and women broadly. It wasn't explicit bigotry, but the effects were the same. I had to unlearn this with the help of my bigender partner, who felt unsettled and hurt by the way I could so easily turn "woman" into nothing but a theoretical category which represented my personal suffering.
This brings me to another point: I sometimes receive messages from nonbinary trans mascs telling me that it's absurd to think they don't understand womanhood and identify with misogyny in a deeper way. I would agree that, if you sincerely identify in some capacity as a woman, you are surely impacted by misogyny in a way I am not. However, why are you coming to the defense of binary trans men like me? Less charitably, why are you projecting a female identity on us? Perhaps my experience frustrates you so deeply because we simply do not have the same experience at all. Perhaps we are not all that united by our agab, by our supposed female socialization.
So, no. I do not believe that binary trans men know what it's like to be women. I don't believe we are authorities on womanhood. I do not believe that when a trans woman endeavors to talk about transmisogyny, your counterargument about your own experiences of misogyny is useful. I ESPECIALLY do not believe that it is in any way valid to say that you are less misogynist, less prone to being misogynist, or-- god forbid-- INCAPABLE of misogyny because you were raised as a girl. I also don't believe your misogyny is equivalent to that of a woman's internalized misogyny in form or impact.
For as much as many in this movement downplay privilege as merely "conditional," those conditions do exist. They do place you firmly in the context of the rest of the world. Zoom out and look at the history of oppressed men, and you'll find the same reactionary movement repeated over and over. Attacking the women in your community for not being soft enough, nice enough, patient enough, rather than fighting the powers that be. Why do I believe your identity is more alligned with cis manhood than any form of womanhood? Because this song and dance has been done a hundred times before by men of every stripe. Transphobia is real, and your life experience has been uniquely defined by it since birth. This is a thing to rally around, to fight against, but you all have fallen for a (trans)misogynistic phantasm in your efforts at self-actualization. You are not the first, and you will not be the last. Get out of this pipeline before it's too late.
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