#trans men are men obviously and should be looked at the same way

[c00and]

Uncertain flame of hope I found

Will you lead me back on the right track?

uncensored version under the cut

[perilegs]

i pass pretty much all the time but hm. ive heard interesting stuff from drunk ppl i know who dont know im trans

[spaghettioverdose]

Sure maybe you wanna say that the "suck my dick and stop being a baeddel" copypasta anons were originally sent by a couple of trolls or whatever but the amount of people I see defending them is very clear fucking proof that the sentiment exists. There is a lot of preaching about trans unity right now, but as is often the case, if someone demands unity while refusing to do even the bare minimum for you (in this case disavowing the horrifyingly misogynistic posts and calling out some of the people who maintain such positions instead of defending them) and only call for unity when you speak out against their abuse, then they're not looking for unity. They want you to shut the fuck up. You never see these same people calling for unity when there's a harassment campaign against trans women. You don't see them defending trans women when our words are misinterpreted in as bad of a way as possible.

And before someone accuses me of being a baeddel terf or whatever: I am not saying we need some kind of transfem separatist movement or that trans unity is impossible or undesirable. I am not saying that transmascs are doomed to be violent misogynists. I do have some very nice transmasc mutuals (all of which uncoincidentally are communists lol) who I do appreciate and feel actual solidarity with because they aren't transmisogynists and because I can expect them to have the backs of the transfem community whe the newest transmisogynistic harassment campaign starts on this dogshit website.

A growing problem on here is the continuous dilution and rejection of feminism and even some of the most basic feminist positions in favour of positions that would be perfectly at home in a 2016 antifeminist mra youtuber's videos if it wasn't for the pseudo-progressive tone of the message. It is what has lead to "you should shut up about transmisogyny and suck my dick", a position championed by "genderpunks" and transandrophobia truthers. The drift from understanding the basic premise that we live in a patriarchal and misogynist society to "well, men have it bad too, so who's to say what the real gender dynamics are like" and even "men have it bad too, specifically because they are men" has erased a lot of progress on this website and allowed this kind of thing to happen.

The way to close the gap and achieve trans unity is not to ask for silence from trans women speaking against the abuse done to us or to pretend that gender dynamics do not exist politically, but to take steps towards solidarity with us and speak out against transmisogynists and to push back against antifeminist rhetoric.

This post, obviously is aimed at people who are genuinely interested in trans unity, not people who scold others about trans unity whenever trans women have a problem with the way we are treated.

[velvetvexations]

you’ll see a trans boy be like “i dont personally have the power to oppress you” and then later the same day 3 of their little trans boy friends will start calling you out for making the first trans boy cry so hard he almost died (by disagreeing with him) and then all the cis women in the space will instantly side with the fragile little boys against the scary big [t-slur] who uses intimidating words like “transmisogyny” and thats how the whisper network against you starts, leading to far reaching professional and social consequences that never leave you

This didn’t happen.

Not this way, at least. All marginalized people are at all times at risk of being canceled unfairly. Their marginalization tends to play a major part in that, obviously. Trans women get hit with it a lot and that fucking sucks, and some transmascs are in TERF-y circles and can theoretically use that against transfems should they feel the need to.

This that I’m quoting, however, is a fantasy. It’s a page from a dream journal. People are giddily imagining things like this happening because they live in a world where trans women are feared and have their reputations ruined by lies, and they want to exploit that for their own benefit. The best way of doing this is putting themselves above other trans people, because cis people don’t give enough of a fuck to care or get involved with these bullshit arguments, but if you whine about other marganalized people they will actually be affected by it and forced into the conversation you created out of thin air. It’s not so much a victimization complex as it is a death cult fascination with the misery of transfemininity identical to the TERF obsession with fymyl suffering, defining ‘trans woman’ as 'the thing that feels pain always and forever.’

It’s disgusting and I can’t imagine identifying with such a sniveling and pathetic vision of what being a trans woman is like. It’s so undignified it makes my skin crawl. It’s embarrassing. There’s nothing in this crying little effigy covered in pins and needles I can relate to. I can’t tell if these people need more self-esteem or less. I’m so fucking tired of this wounded gazelle shit.

But for the TRF, transfemininity is all about the abuse. Just look at the beyond absurd assertion, made over and over again, that trans women are maliciously called the t-slur by other trans people. That’s just. No? No. But in claiming that the t-slur can only ever refer to trans women, and that transfeminine suffering takes priority above all else because everyone forever at all times hates trans women more than anyone else, it again becomes necessary to construct this false vision of intercommunity dynamics where “scary big t-slur” is a stereotype that exists within the community in the first place, and which trans men are constantly using against trans women.

It’s just so blatantly selfish for one to act like a transfeminist when all one does every single day is bitch about other trans people. We’re all about to get fucked harder than ever and there are people who profess to sincerely believe they’re fighting the revolution by making up lies about their siblings. I’m easily triggered by transphobia outside of the community and yet even I manage to engage with actual transphobes and make them considerably less transphobic, yet people who don’t even know enough about what TERFs believe to understand they hate men too will fritter the day away on how they could theoretically be canceled if they did something bad ,and wouldn’t that be the worst thing ever? Oh, what if I broke up with someone and our mutual friends believed I was the jerk, because that’s a situation that exclusively happens to poor helpwess twans women and the mere suggestion I could possibly be a jerk in the first place is unthinkable? Hate to keep saying this, but trans women are being actually murdered and this obsessive fixation on “social murder” within the trans community exists purely to spice things up with a feeling of danger because the spaces we’ve managed to carve out for ourselves are otherwise a little too safe and it feels more authentic to the Laura Palmer Ultimate Victim narrative. Massively popular transfems with over ten thousand followers will happily sic them on people for the most upsettingly asinine reasons and then cry-type about how they’re the underdogs in every possible social situation.

But most obnoxious of all is the implication here that, because this can only happen to trans women, gossip and slander does not happen to other trans people, or other marginalized people in general.

That’s fucked, considering how much this discourse has attacked specific targets. It’s most maddening to see that “the coiner of the word transandrophobia has dykebreaking+detransitioning-of-transfems kink” has evolved to “most people who believe in transandrophobia have those kinks” because I constantly see TERFs making huge compilations of transfem blogs engaging in cis dykebreaking kink from the dom perspective. Just transfem dom blog after transfem dom blog enthusiastically into cis dykebreaking, which TERFs use to paint us in a way that fits their narrative.

Literally the only example they can ever give of a transandrophobia-connected person* being a dom for dykebreaking with transfem subs is someone who was being paid by a transfem. Detrans kink is overwhelmingly non-transfems, but almost exclusively as subs to either transfems or cis men, and those transfems aren’t getting paid for it, they actually are just in it for the love of the game. There’s nothing wrong with that, but people want to act like there is when it’s anyone else, and that’s not only weird but also setting up a bear trap to step in later.

Which gets to the point that, hey, wow, I’ve noticed a lot of cis women in particular who self-identify as TME are super into anti-shipping. You cannot possibly imagine you’re safe for trans women if your big issue with trans men articulating their oppression is “they masturbate evilly.” Popular transfem blogs will talk at length about how you shouldn’t judge transfems for their kinks but cis women are so eager to kinkshame transmascs that they not only make shit up out of thin air, but specifically copy and paste kinks almost entirely made up of transfems onto transmascs. Someday very soon a TERF is going to show them it’s much more convenient to be a general transphobe and not make special exceptions for the ones that use the same pronouns as you. They’re going to show your anti-ship cis lesbian friend one of those transfem dykebreaking blog compilations and she’ll take Trans Rights Are Human Rights out of her bio within the hour.

Like, even if you didn’t care about being monstrously inhumane to others, all of this is so against transfem self-interests in the long run, but people who consider themselves the most transfeminist transfeminists there are, of a radical nature, one might say, care more about notes than helping anyone, least of all the transfems they’re feeding into a grinder of paranoia and isolation. Especially the isolation.

It’s a little hard to take it seriously when I get accused of calling all trans women groomers for thinking it’s bad when people talk about “curing” other trans women’s “comphet,” how “TMEs” are obligated to bottom for them to compensate for transmisogyny, and writing long treatises on why it’s one’s moral responsibility to throw forcefem kink at random men because they may like it. Like, am I saying trans women are groomers, or am I saying some people use being members of a marginalized community to be kinna gross? People somehow find it in them to be angry at gay men who cross boundaries in spite of the messaging that they’re all sex abusers for the past two hundred years. Especially since 90% of the concern is for other trans women.Like, sorry, but I care enough about trans women that I’m going to say something if I think you’re putting them in a bad situation, and someone being a trans woman doesn’t make them immune to that. But oh, it does if you assume that this is all just common sense transfeminism, and I am in fact making this accusation of most trans women instead of an extremely niche group.

Never mind that in the screencap people use to accuse me of calling trans women “rapists” I was saying something a self-identified TME said was coercive, and whose identity as a Not a Trans Woman I explicitly noted.** Never mind that I’m the not the one telling people to name their blogs after the original transbian separatist group that famously fell apart after resulting in heavy sexual abuse. Never mind that I have said over and over again that TRFs act no more entitled to people’s bodies than lesbian TERFs who treat people they perceive as women the same way.

But I’m supposed to believe that those cis anti-shippers who post things like “every time someone says kinks are fine they’re just protecting predators in the LGBT community” is a great ally and I’m a traitor because they hate men and I don’t?

Sorry, no, not a traitor. A “pickme begging to be beaten to death with hammers.” Who’s probably not even actually a trans woman. Great transfeminism, yall. You’re really fighting transmisogyny.

It’s especially galling now that TRFs have taken to calling transandrophobia “reactionary,” the most bullshit possible way to call a group that includes a huge number of PoC, who they constantly accuse of tokenization, a pack of Nazis. What is transandrophobia reacting to? Bigotry? Golly gee, I guess so! Or maybe it’s “reacting” to transmisogyny as part of the completely absurd idea that trasnmascs steal everything from transfems. Like, yeah, sure girliepop, and we stole misogyny from cis women, right? Sorry you failed to not sound exactly like a TERF yet again but maybe try again tomorrow and you’ll finally earn not being called a radfem.

But isn’t it sooooo mean of me to compare a small amount of trans women to radfems? Like their oppressors? Well, first of all, they regularly refer to Jewish people as Nazis, discourse aside that they do that is simply a true fact which shows they indeed think it’s possible to justify comparisons like that, although in their case it’s just because it feels like getting off a sick burn and rhetorical W to go “ah, but what if this Jewish person…was a Nazi? Checkmate, Zionists.”

Secondly, for as much as TRFs want to claim TERFs only hate them, that’s simply not true and I have conclusively proven this with basic use of Tumblr’s search function and the tag “radblr.” Twice. If you believe they love transmascs and only want what’s best for them, congratulations dipshit, you fell for their propaganda so hard I’m surprised they haven’t managed to convince you you’re not a woman. Or is it only an obvious lie when it’s about you?

Most annoyingly, just on a personal level, is the way TRFs get pissed off at non-transfem feminine AMAB people for daring to exist. The idea that femboy is a slur for trans women would be laughable if it weren’t grotesque in it’s ignorance. The things I’ve read people say about how transmisogynistic it is for an anime character to be a crossdressing man instead of a trans woman are just infuriatingly racist. Not everything is about you and it’s not actually a big deal if people talk about others once in blue moon.

The constant posts about how non-transfems are evil for not making more transfem headcanons, or for headcanoning the TRF’s favorite canonically male character wrong, are particularly childish. I can’t even go into MY favorite blorbo’s tag without seeing people call transmasc headcanons of him inferior literary analysis completely without irony, and every single time they shit like this, they do it while making up the most convoluted and nonsensical explanations for why the character can only be transfem instead, as though the hostility is defensiveness born out of their particular blorbo requiring a lot of creativity to headcanon that way, necessitating going to war to prove they can’t really be a man to assert it as The One Truth. Then they’ll complain until the fucking heat death of the universe about how everyone loves transmasc headcanons because of transmisogyny.

It’s the same unbearable on-sight hostility as when a TERF sees a child on the subway and goes home to type up a novel of a post on how he had the eyes of a future wife-beater, and it’s so irritating to see it spread from one corner to another. Literally, TRFs say that trans men will always turn on trans women and eventually detransition to wield their wymbnly power against us, and I’m expected to not see that as having severe hang-ups about people born into what they want to transition into and have denied to them by society’s transphobia?

What about the fact that they constantly mock AFAB trans people in ways specifically targeting that trait, calling non-binary people “theyfabs,” joking it’s easy to misgender trans men when they have large breasts, and reduce transmasc stereotypes to feminine “soft bois?” Like, yeah, okay, you’re not projecting any gaping insecurities you may have about assigned sex and gender roles when you say transmasc music is ukuleles and transfem music is heavy metal, next tell me about how transmascs all enjoy tea parties and transfems all go to football games.

But it’s not even mostly trans women who keep this shit alive in the first place. A higher percentage of total trans women on this site are into this framework, but the total number of non-transfem trans people and cis women so outweighs them in the first place that it cancels that out. Like, if x is higher than y, and x% of trans women on Tumblr agree but only y% of “TME” people do, that’s still a movement mostly consisting of “TME” people. The full separatist angle would very quickly reveal how little air it has to burn if trans women truly only had themselves to watch out for each other. Unfortunately, self-identified TMEs are much more likely to get TERFier rather than simply less TRF-y when the spell breaks and they realize how fucked up this shit is, while the people who’ve been batted at continue to exercise the patience of a saint and continue to fight for trans women anyway.

And that! Is what hurts! The most! The fact that people do not care about transmascs and in particular the ones who believe in transandrophobia are constantly tripping over themselves to defend and help trans women as much as they possibly can. I wish people saw that. I wish that mattered. It’s like watching a black hole suck up an endless font of goodwill and love. And then going “lol reactionary transandrobros hate trans women.”

That’s it, though, the great irony of it all is that if it were true, it’d never have become popular in the first place. It’s kept aloft by self-identified TMEs who are well-meaning if not especially good at critical thinking, except for the the contingent that are convinced trans men are all misogynistic because they personally are, or even outright seem to get gender euphoria from the idea they have male privilege. But for whatever reason, if “TME” folks didn’t care? The people making up elaborate tales of their potential (social) murder would have to find some other way to get attention.

I suggest throwing on a big red nose and joining a circus.

*and I specify “transandrophobia-connected” but you’d have a hard time rustling up transmasc doms in general from those scenes

**also, despite it being something I saw with my own eyes, I notably did not even feel it hit the level of needing to directly name someone as being who I was basing my assessment of sexual coercive behavior on as being sexually coercive, because I think it's much more a prevalent attitude of pressure in sexual contexts than individual behavior

[plaidos]

As a cis woman, I don’t understand how you can say that femininity in men and amab people is less accepted than masculinity in women and afab people, and then that women have much higher standards to abide to, than men? You’re right on the second statement, but doesn’t it contradict the first? Women lose out on jobs if they don’t wear make-up or heels, which are literally performances of femininity imposed by society, that take effort, and, in the case of heels, literally hurt and have longterm consequences. And let’s not even begin on shaving, that is throughly unacceptable. Women get shouted at, harassed and spit on for going out in their natural hair. And this is not even close to “masculinity”, it’s just a natural state of existence. A woman could be wearing a wedding gown, and if she had hair on her legs and arms, she’d still be relentlessly attacked. I feel like we can’t even exist in our natural state, let alone a masculine one, without being threatened and become almost unemployable. This goes for trans women as well of course, though it’s definitely more relevant to them if they pass (I suppose).

first of all, you should try not to make “rules” to understand society through amab/afab as sex categories, because they aren’t and wont make sense to analyse that way. like, an out-the-closet trans man does not have a social expectation to shave his legs, obviously, because he is living as a man who if anything are expected to NOT shave their legs. and for what it’s worth, this is all totally relevant to trans women regardless of whether we pass or not, because trans women who don’t pass aren’t seen as men, we’re seen as trans women. like do you really think that trans women pre-HRT are easily getting jobs without shaving their faces/bodies are going to be getting the jobs that cis women aren’t getting? be for real, think this through seriously.

secondly, you’re conflating gendered beauty expectations with gender presentation in totality. obviously they’re overlapping but they aren’t the same literal thing. do you think cis men can just wear skirts and dresses to interviews and walk away with the same likelihood of getting the job as other cis men wearing trousers? etc.

what you’re noticing is that masculinity is culturally considered to be the default. women have to wear makeup in interviews because otherwise they’re masculine. but look, get this, trans women are both punished for EXPRESSING femininity (“look at this stupid tranny trying to be something it isn’t”) AND for NOT expressing femininity (“look at this stupid tranny not putting enough effort in”).

like you are right that cis women are refused jobs for not dressing a certain way, not shaving their legs/body/face, not wearing makeup in interviews — trans women are punished for not doing those things AND for doing them. We are punished for both removing ourselves from the default.

the gendered double standard of perceiving masculinity as the default is even present in your ask!

[genderqueerdykes]

tbh your (and other intersex bloggers') posts about how agab is simply an event and means nothing in the way of body parts has helped me a lot in self acceptance? idk if I can really say that because I'm a perisex trans boy, it's not really my relief or validation to have... but its helped me like. idk. hate how I was born less. I hated thinking of myself as AFAB until recently, I already believed it but your posts really just helped me properly internalize how little it means. it's helped me more appreciate the trans part of my transmasculinity. idk hopefully that isn't appropriative or offensive to say. I just wanted to tell u

i don't think that's offensive, i've met a few people who are in a similar line of thinking that really opened my eyes to how broad perisex experiences can be, too. i've met several trans guys who were assigned female at birth, but did not identify with it. they identified as cis men with male bodies, already as they were, no hormones or surgery required. that they simply already had male bodies. i've met trans women with the exact same identities. i dated a trans woman who saw her body as a female body, without needing any modifications.

like hear me out, but i think in order to totally free ourselves from the biological sex binary, we have to give perisex people wiggle room, too. obviously, a perisex person shouldn't identify as intersex, but i think you're allowed to say. no, the doctor was wrong actually, my body is (this). you're not denying the parts you're born with or the hormones your body produces, but you are challenging the notion of what a "Female" or "Male" body is and looks like- which is exactly what we need to see more of in order to progress forward with intersex and sex variant liberation.

we need to be encouraging people who are willing to deconstruct what "male" and "female" bodies are and look like. we need to understand that this benefits all trans and intersex people. we can and should care about liberating perisex people from this binary as well. it helps perisex people interact with and learn more about intersex identities as they learn more about their own. it's an exchange. it's a dialogue. i'm really glad you realized that about yourself, you deserve to feel comfortable in your body! take care of yourself

[biohorror-human]

Trans people may or may not have popped off with the "block every radfem you see" idea because holy shit. You are all some of the most pessimistic and spiteful fuckers on earth. You all claim not to be bio-essentialist, and then turn around and say shit that is, at its core bio-essentialist. All of your ideas, in some way, revolve around hurting someone else. Want to destroy the gender binary? Certainly attacking trans people will help. Want to destroy child marriage? Tell people not to marry brown people, just, ever. Want to destroy the patriarchy? (This is the best one) Never organize, never protest, never coordinate, just sit around and cultivate a nightmarishly toxic environment and then have the GALL to ask "why are people so open about their disdain for radical feminism?"

Because all your ideas are rooted in hate. The last time I've had discussions this fucking bleak with people is when I got into an argument with an actual self-described Nazi. Btw, I know you radfems are super exclusionary and refuse to cooperate with any other social group, but maybe Nazis would be up your alley? Considering they also have an affinity for eugenics and wanting to eliminate general swathes of the population, I think you'd be great for each other.

I mean, just to list some of the bullshit you people constantly say which doesn't line up with any of the other shit you say: "trans and GNC people destroying the gender binary (which is good because we radfems don't like the gender binary) is actually BAD now because we were using that gender binary to call all men oppressors, and now we have to actually confront what specific societal issues enable someone to be an oppressor, instead of just saying that being a man makes you an oppressor (which is bio-essentialism, which we disagree with, unless you're amab, in which case then bio-essentialism is actually something we super-agree with)

And that's just one of the ones that I actually went into the effort of tracking down. In terms of shit that I've just seen on a whim: you say you hate bio-essentialism, but also people born male are naturally more oppressive. You say women should have the freedom to do whatever they want, unless that "want" is dating men, because even if they're happy in their relationship, they're actually secretly sad and lying. Because since when did feminists hold the belief that women could understand their own emotions? Pretty clothes are also bad, because men like to look at clothes. Nevermind what the woman behind those clothes thinks, you shouldn't be able to enjoy anything for any reason because a man might look at it and also enjoy it for a split fucking second.

You know what that last one makes me think of? How abusive husbands tell their wives that they can't wear revealing clothes because it will attract the gaze of other men. But history is obviously not your forte, because if it was you'd understand that the only way social movements like feminism prosper is if they cooperate with other social movements, a concept you could really stand to learn a thing or two about. Another cool historical fact is that segregation is, historically, frowned upon. But I still see you talking about how white women shouldn't date brown men, and how asian women shouldn't date white men.

You know, they actually made a haven for people like you. And no, this isn't going to lead to a "Nazi Germany" bait and switch. It was a place where women could only marry into their own race. Where police were around every corner. Where women actively ratted out people betraying that law. Where women were literally not allowed outside past a certain time. It was South Africa under fucking apartheid. You believe, on a fundamental level, the same shit that traditionalists (nazis) and conservatives believe in. You make yourselves miserable as a form of protest, but because your circles are so exclusive, the only people there to witness your misery are other radical feminists. You're creating a hyper-dense misery sphere that doesn't even take that pain out on the patriarchy, only on other women. You have absolutely, undoubtedly got to be the worst rebels in the history of rebellion. You're literally making the patriarchy's job easier by pre-misery-ifying women. You're streamlining the misery process. I've never seen another social movement do that.

I think the only thing you guys actually accomplished was making men who cared or were curious about your movement equally miserable. You know what I got when I tried to join the radfem discussion? When I made the MISTAKE of trying to learn about your cause to better support it? I got fucking berated. you people finally had a man WILLINGLY come up to you to internalize your ideas. And you know what you chose to say to me? When I had a question, you mocked my voice. You compared me to an ogre, or a giant. You said women SHOULD be scared of me because of the way I was born. You said I was a natural-born rapist. You spoke about how my androgens made me develop into a beast- made me resent my own body, on top of how I already dissociated with it. You demonized any thought of sexuality, shot down any idea of body-positivity. And even then, even after all that I thought it may have been positive. I thought maybe it made me stronger, that maybe I was more like you because I was able to see the flaws in my own biology. Nah. You just wanted me to be miserable, like you. I was your willing punching bag for all of your anger and resentment. You're the femme-fascist matriarchs of self loathing. The only boiling bucket of crabs who not just drags the crabs trying to escape back in, but actively coaxes new crabs to join. You want a revenge story in a world where revenge only leads to more suffering. Your definition of equal is only met when every man is twice as miserable as you. That's not a world anyone, man or woman or anything else deserves to live in.

I have a bunch more shit to say but even thinking about you miserable fucks is starting to rub off on me. Fuck the patriarchy. Trans pride rules.

[neechees]

Hi! You don't have to answer this if you don't want to, that's totally fine! But you talking about Orville Peck's appropriation of indigenous culture with his fashion choices made me realize that I had never considered that there might be some aspects of "cowboy clothes" that white ppl shouldn't wear and that was super wrong of me. Again, you totally don't have to answer this, but I was just wondering what ways a white person could wear "cowboy clothes" in a manner that wasn't disrespectful? Or perhaps, should we not wear them at all? I can't afford T yet, but when I can finally get it I was planning on getting a cowboy outfit to embrace my trans mascness, but if that would be wrong of me I can scrap that plan no problem!

Ehhh again this is actually SUPER HARD to answer because almost everything about cowboy fashion & the cowboy "aesthetics" are lifted directly from Native American fashion and culture, either because a lot of cowboys back in the day were Native American themselves (including Afro-Natives & Indigenous Mexican vaqueros) or they were White & just kinda. stole the look from the Native cowboys due to a number of factors.

If you google "cowboy jewelry" the first thing that comes up is silverwork & belts & turquoise jewelry, which is taken from Navajo metalwork. Fringed leather clothing? Again, many Native tribes did that (& in some tribes the fringes could mean something, its not just for looks), most popularily with vests, jackets, and pants. A lot if the leather jackets were a result of Native women just sewing their clothes the same but in a European styled cut. Compare this "cowboy" look below to a Lakota war shirt: both have hair embellishments dangling from the arms.

Studded belts? Inspired by Cheyenne mirror belts, which often also have metal studs in them & you'll still see Native pow wow dancers have this in their regalia. Floral vests? A lot of the inspiration comes from Plains floral beadwork. Geometric patterns and blankets? Came from Southwest or Mexican Native American blankets & designs, ask any Navajo weaver & they'll tell you the same. Feathers in cowboy hats? Who else is famous for wearing feathers on their heads--? Native Americans. The look is still popular with older Native men.

Hell, if you visit this site that sells Western/cowboy fashion, you'll see a SHITTON of appropriation going on, taking Native imagery & designs, including one taken from Native American ledger art, all on White models.

The appropriation of Native culture and fashion in the cowboy/western sphere is ongoing, and the influence that Native fashion & culture has in Western/cowboy fashion as it is is absolutely MASSIVE. I once said in another post that the cowboy/western aesthetic essentially belongs to Native Americans, Latines (especially Mexicans), and Black people. And the history of White cowboys has been one largely of colonialism, racism, and displacement of Indigenous peoples, and the masculinity associated with White cowboys especially is also steeped into racism & American patriotism (think John Wayne. There's a reason he's an American icon who played cowboys & killing Indians in films.). I think the only thing that isn't influenced from either appropriation or colonization is like, jeans. Even the style of cowboy boots themselves and potentially chaps were influenced from vaqueros.

So if you're White I'm not sure that'd exactly be a good route to take because trying to seperate Indigenous elements from this fashion/look (nevermind the problematic history of White cowboys) is almost impossible. Obviously I can't force you to do anything, but honestly if I were you, I'd try a different direction, because otherwise I think you'll find trying to do this will be very hard.

[ugly-anarchist]

Alright, anon, I'm not posting your messages in 3 different posts so lets just break this down here

[Indented text is the anon message. This is going to be long as hell]

butch women and trans men are not oppressed for being masculine, they’re oppressed for being gender nonconforming females (not saying trans men are women, just stating how a patriarchal society sees them).

So, firstly, the thing I'm talking about isn't actually oppression on a systemic level. You're talking about how non-queer society sees us, I'm talking about how other queer people treat us. Butch lesbians have been pushed out of sapphic spaces for a loooong time. Butch lesbians are seen as scary, mean, violent, and inherently abusive within queer spaces. Which stems from a demonization of masculinity. I should know this. I identified as a butch bisexual sapphic for years. I know what this feels like. I was once told that people with "high T levels" are more likely to be abusive, which includes me because I'm intersex and have naturally high T.

Secondly, maybe don't try to define trans men's oppression for them? I'm not a trans guy either but I experience a lot of the same bullshit from society that they do and it's not just "being a gender non-conforming female" it's a lot more complex than that. And also just, in general, a very weird way to say it.

i’ve never heard a masc cis gay man complain about being welcome or not in queer spaces, to the point in which feminine cis gay men have complained about them writing “no sissies, masc4masc” in their bio on dating apps.

I have. I've heard plenty of stories about masc gay men and specifically bi men in queer spaces feeling very unwelcome because they were being treated like a threat. And some gay men being transphobic (because s*ssy is a transmisogynistic slur in this case) or having a preference for other mascs also isn't indicative of mascs being treated well?

Like I know a lot of butch4butches that have that preference specifically because they feel unwelcome or are treated badly by femmes. I don't know how you personally not hearing about it or what some people put on their dating profile proves here.

Also your complete lack of acknowledgement of bi men in this makes me doubt even more that your perspective on this is a valid one because that tells me you either don't know any bi men or you ignore them to such an extent that you forgot they existed.

claiming misandry or anti-masculinity exists is the same as saying that heterophobia exists because straight trans people are treated like shit.

Never said that misandry on its own exists, don't know where you got that.

People are treated like shit based on the fact that they are masc all the time. That is a thing that happens. I have experienced it, I've heard so many stories from other queer people who experience it. I don't know how saying "no you don't, I'm gonna tell you what you really experience" is at all an alright thing to do.

it’s not heterophobia, it’s transphobia/homophobia. in the same way that masc afab people being treated terribly is misogyny and homophobia, and has literally zero to do with misandry/“anti-masculinity”. if anti-masculinity or misandry existed, even straight cis heterosexual men would suffer from it.

So, like, I'm talking about anti-masculinity in the queer community. "If this is true here then it must be true with this different thing" is a really bad argument because you could use that to invalidate anything that is true.

For example: The definition of racism is "prejudice based on race" which technically that definition doesn't exclude white people but you don't see anyone arguing "if racism existed, even white people would suffer from it" or trying to say it's not really about race just to exclude white people. Like, obviously you can't be racist to white people and anyone who claims you can be is just making a bad-faith argument. I am looking pointedly at you when I say that, btw.

also, a lot of radfems are gender nonconforming women/butches and literally campaign for women to drop conformity to the patriarchal concept of femininity. gender critical conservatives are not radical feminists and y’all need to stop conflating the two because no matter what jk rowling says, in practice and in theory, they have very little to do with one another (and hate each other, at that).

There's actually two sides of the "radfem" spectrum and they're both just as bad. There's the ones who hate gender non-conforming women, specifically the ones who go on HRT, and claim they're gender traitors. And then there's the ones which you describe who usually shame women for liking feminine things. Both their beliefs usually go against the whole purpose of gender-nonconformity which is to be yourself and do what makes you happy, society be damned. People who are truly GNC don't judge others for presenting in a way that is typically considered "conforming" to their gender and don't campaign for other people to be like them?

Also... Are you defending radical feminism? Are you a radfem? Because that would make a whole lotta sense.

and one last thing,

Just so you know, this is how this anon began the final message. It is the longest one. Really said "one last thing" then sent me a whole 4 paragraphs.

please stop acting like “people who are attracted to men” are demonized in queer spaces, what a slap in the face to lesbians. the moment they have a little visibility y’all claim they are privileged and somehow bossing around/discriminating against gay men.

Never said that lesbians were the oppressor in this situation. There is no oppressor, it's fully lateral mistreatment. And like.. it's not about just gay men.

Bi women have been pushed out of and demonized within sapphic spaces for decades, actually. I should know. Because again. I'm a bi sapphic. We are seen as a range of things. Pretenders, abusers, invaders, the source of lesbian oppression, tricksters that try to force lesbians to fuck men, or just disgusting. Traitors. Again.

My own mother knows this because before she married my dad she was in sapphic spaces in the 90s. From her personal accounts, bi women were seen as the enemy and a lot of lesbians... weren't even lesbians. They were political lesbians. Women who rejected their attraction to men and only dated other women. Some of them were even straight. And they were considered more of lesbians than bi women were.

Even in the modern age, bi women are expected to shit on their own sexuality. They are expected to say "ew I hate that I like men" and never date or fuck a man to be accepted in queer spaces. Again, I know this because I'M LITERALLY BI.

gay men are literally the face of this community and continually disrespect sapphic/lesbians (see the billie lyric controversy, see the way they’re treating chappel roan, see the way they keep calling women b*tches with no regards on whether we like it or not, see the way they keep fraternizing with straight women that would literally cower in fear if they saw a butch lesbian in real life).

Yeah so misogynistic gay men are in fact a problem but I'm not talking about strictly gay men. I'm talking about the way masculine perceived traits are demonized within queer circles. Come on. I'm pretty sure cis gay men were barely talked about in my original post, why are you fixating on this so hard?

just because somebody who has literally no power over gay men whatsoever and has been traumatized by men her whole life airs out her frustration with her literal lifelong oppressors via tweet or tumblr post, doesn’t mean that suddenly the patriarchy doesn’t exist anymore and has not armed lesbians especially for the past thousands of years.

So I'm talking about the people telling me I'm inherently abusive or more likely to assault people based on the fact that I have high T levels... I'm not talking about people venting about their abuse at the hands of men.

I also never said the patriarchy doesn't exist... I feel like this message isn't about me anyone.

stop painting them as the mean bosses of the community when actually they are a very small, demonized minority who suffers every day at the hands of anyone in the world who likes men (straight women, gay men, even bi women like me).

Fascinating... So... I'm not doing that. Lesbians are not the "mean bosses" of the community. Some are just treating random people shitty for perceived masculine traits with no bearing on truth or reality. A lot of them aren't even lesbians. Like I never said this was a specifically lesbian issue. I said there was a problem in the community in general. So like... all people... not just lesbians.

Also, genuine question: How are you oppressing lesbians for being bi?

it’s such a warped, harmful view and a big stereotype, at that (lesbians are man-haters who hate women’s boyfriends!! what a progressive statement!! never has it been said before, and especially not by homophobic conservatives).

I mean I just didn't say that. I don't know how to respond to this because I just straight up didn't say that.

I just... This isn't about me anymore is it?

Who hurt you?

have some respect for once, a lesbian literally threw the first brick at Stonewall.

So... uh... we don't actually know for 100% certain who threw the first brick. Some say it was Marsha P. Johnson. Some say it was "gay street kids". Even if it was a lesbian... so? Just because one lesbian did a good thing doesn't mean other lesbians are incapable of being dicks to other people?

Idk, man, I never said that lesbians were the source of all evil. I just made a post about my own personal experiences and the experiences of people I know and have seen being talked about. I'm a bi, intersex, non-binary sapphic. I get shit on for the things that people perceive as masculine traits that I have and the fact that I like men. This happens a lot.

I don't know why me saying "hey please stop implying that there is something in my blood that makes me inherently abusive" is lesbophobic. Why is this about lesbians, actually? You made it about lesbians. Why are you using lesbians, a group you've stated you're not a part of, as a gotcha against me? Why are you using lesbians to silence me about my own experiences? Why is that okay?

[habitual-truant]

"Naoto isn't trans! Kanji isn't gay! You obviously don't understand their character arcs at all!"

I'm allowed to be critical of the homophobic and transphobic narratives that are in persona 4. Obviously in canon kanji is straight and Naoto is a cis girl, but it pisses me off when people decide to say "you don't understand their character!" because I do. I KNOW Kanji's arc was about toxic masculinity. I KNOW Naoto didn't like being a girl because she wasn't treated fairly and taken seriously for it. I KNOW they aren't queer. But they should have been.

Throughout persona, a person's shadow has been some part of their unconscious mind, the exact part varying from game to game, but the general consensus being that it's the part of the self that's unknown for whatever reason. In persona 4, its the part that is repressed and rejected. Characters defeat their shadow and gain their persona from accepting that their shadow, a manifestation of the things they hate about themselves, is in fact a part of them. It's not exactly the same for Kanji and Naoto though. Kanji's shadow is the result of internalizing what others say about him as the truth, and Naoto's is the result of rejecting what other people think of her, and repressing the reasons why they think those things. Unlike the other characters who's shadows entirely come from their own emotions and thoughts, Kanji and Naoto's shadows come from how other's perception of the two affects them.

Kanji's shadow is a "gross pervert" that lusts over men. Based off of the other characters and how they defeat their shadows, you would think he has internalized homophobia, and that by accepting his shadow, he accepts being gay. But, its the opposite. Kanji accepts he's straight despite liking feminine things. He accepts that he's NOT gay. I understand the intentions. I know his shadow was the way it was because he was accused of being gay and made fun of for liking girlish things, and he internalized it. I know his arc is about toxic masculinity and unlearning it. But Kanji was attracted to men before his arc. He all of a sudden magically becomes straight after accepting his shadow. "But he had a crush on Naoto, who ended up being a girl!" Yeah, I understand. Doesn't change the fact that Naoto presented as a boy, and was completely socially transitioned. At that point, Kanji had literally no reason to think that Naoto was a girl, he completely saw her as a boy. The writers backpedaled on his attraction to boys. It implies being attracted to the same sex is something you can change, and that it's worth changing. Not to mention, his entire arc is played off as a joke. his shadow is a "pervert queer" because its "haha funny" for a masculine man to like men. It's a mockery.

Naoto's shadow isn't nearly as insulting, showing the main focus of Naoto's arc; nobody respects her as a detective because she's a teenage girl. However, Naoto herself says she doesn't like being a girl when her shadow reveals the fact that she's a girl. Yes, it's because she's ridiculed and disregarded because she's not a man, but she's still uncomfortable as a girl and actively chooses to present as a boy, even after gaining her persona. She is undeniably transcoded, at the very least, before she accepts her shadow. She accepts that she's not taken seriously, that she IS all the things that people look down on her for being, and that she IS actually a girl. Again, while not doing a complete 180, the writers back out of Naoto wanting to be a boy. Even though her arc isn't as abysmally insulting as Kanji's, it still sells the narrative that trans people need to accept that they "aren't trans, just pretending,"

No matter how you look at it, the "moral of the story" for both Kanji and Naoto is that being gay or trans isn't something you should accept about yourself. Both Kanji and Naoto have queer themes in their stories, even if the writers backed out and effectively gave the opposite message. They're queercoded, end of story. For us queers to reject the homophobic + transphobic themes and decide "no, actually these characters ARE gay" is completely reasonable. Who are you to tell us that we aren't allowed to reject the honestly disrespectful writing from a triple A game franchise? Why wouldn't we dislike the way the characters are written? And why do you only complain when its the two characters that are so close to being queer rep?

I 100% understand and respect people who disagree with the headcanons, but those who mock and make fun of people who do consider Kanji and Naoto to be queer? That's something I can't accept.

TL;DR: People choose to interpret Kanji and Naoto as queer because of the queer themes in their arcs. The same themes that the writers completely backpedaled on, and ended up implying harmful things on instead.

[vergess]

hello do you happen to have an explanation/definition of what pinkwashing is? don't trust googlie with a term so new and it does not line up with my understanding of the terms it's made up of (-washing = covering or changing the original or true depiction, pink- = I only know this term in politics from pink-collar and I am 99% certain it does not mean the same thing here)

Oh, yeah, you're absolutely correct about it not being a pink-collar thing.

For my followers, pink-collar refers to paid work outside the home that is traditionally held by women. The "pink" refers to women, femininity, etc. Just girly things, if you will.

In pink-washing, however, the pink refers to pink triangles, a prominent symbol of queer survival after pink triangles were used to mark sexual deviants (that is, gay men and trans women).

Pink-washing is the use of "we have queer rights, unlike those barbaric savages" to justify state violence.

Right now, the term is mostly coming up in discussions of Israel. In that specific context, it refers to the fact that Israel is far and away the most progressive and well-protected place for queer people of all sorts in the middle east. Which the Israeli government often likes to point to as proof that their brutal ethnic cleansing is a "necessary force" to protect queer lives from Islamist extremism.

It's a sort of, "look, I know what I'm doing is bad, but what they're doing is way worse: look at how badly they treat their queers. Obviously I must be violent to help civilize the animals, for the sake of their queers," often while actively killing queer civilians for being for the wrong race.

Unfortunately, pink-washing is itself strong evidence that a state devalues her queer citizens, thinking of them not as vulnerable people to be protected (as the state will insist is the case), but rather as tokens to be trotted out as proof of the state's "goodness." And should any queer person defy the role of "good little token," they are inevitably and severely punished. As they say (they being in this case an Israeli sociologist whose name escapes me entirely), "A trans woman in uniform will be given medical care, but a trans woman who refuses military service will go to a men's prison."

Pink-washing is also extremely, EXTREMELY common in the U.S. though this doesn't get as much air time lately as Israeli pink-washing. But, the U.S. very regularly uses pink-washing around gay (not so much trans) rights to justify both imperial and domestic violence. Even at the per-state level, it is extremely common for people in "progressive" states to say absurd shit like, "well we treat our gays with respect, unlike Alabama!" to thought-stop themselves from noticing how miserable their lives are as a direct consequence of state action (or even state inaction to stop violence, as is often the case with capitalism and policing problems).

There's also a significant problem in Canada with their pretty solid record on queer rights being used as a counter-argument to their mistreatment of indigenous peoples. This too is pink-washing.

Pink-washing also devalues to lives and specifically the queerness of the people being targeted for violence. You know. By killing them and stuff. But also by denying that they deserve the very right to life and safety that is supposedly the mission statement.

If the entire point of pink-washed violence really was queer liberation, they would suck at that because they keep killing all the queer people they don't fucking like.

[kvothe-kingkiller]

okay I want to preface this with: I am Against gender testing in sports, I believe this whole trans panic thing is transphobic/intersexist/racist/etc, and I support trans women and trans people in general being able to do sports.

With that out of the way, I feel like people just....get the facts straight up Wrong on so many levels with all of this. Ledecky would not beat (olympic level) men in any of the competitions she does. Here are the men's vs women's world records on some of the swimming events

100m Free: Mens 46.8 (Zhanle), Womens 51.71 (Sjöström)

1500m Free: Mens 14:30.67 (Finke), Womens 15:20.48 (Ledecky)

100m Butterfly: Mens 49.45 (Dressel), Womens 55.18 (Walsh)

100m Breaststroke: Mens 56.88 (Peaty), Womens 1:04.13 (King)

400m Medley: Mens 4:02.50 (Marchand), 4:24.38 (McIntosh)

The story is the same if you look up running times, walking times, jump heights, jump lengths, throws, skiing times, skating times, etc etc.

here's the gender gap in swimming race speeds and then track and field events over the last century (courtesy of buzzfeed)

As you can see, they get better over time, then plateau. While it's certainly possible they might come down to 0, I doubt it will be any time soon (Nature actually estimated in 2004 that they could become more equal by 2156 but that was assuming an increase over time that has since leveled off). Those slight humps are from before steroids and other drugs became more rigorously tested.

These of course include the intersex and high T perisex women who have competed and will continue to compete so it's not just to do with testosterone, there are obviously multiple factors.

Ledecky beating men was during practice, idk who she was practicing against (it was a comment made by a teammate and didnt say who the men were) but it wasn't phelps or any of the other top male swimmers. Then when you have things like shooting etc, the main reason that's segregated by gender is simply because more men are in the sport. If you have (numbers arbitrary) 1000 men wanting to compete and 100 women and you take the best of all of them, chances are you'll end up with 9 men and 1 woman. Segregating it by gender ensures 10 men 10 women.

Tennis and other things like that are harder to score up against each other since men tend to compete against men and women against women, except for the occasional m/f double match. But I think it's safe to say that with the evidence from power and speed differences from the above stats, men would likely beat women if you're comparing the top vs the top. Yes, even Serena Williams.

Once again, I am against gender testing. I am against the racist and transphobic shit you see in sports nowadays.

But it is simply untrue to say that Cis men and Cis women are on the same level when it comes to top sporting events. I am not saying women are weak or women are shitty and bad at sports I am literally just showing people the Correct numbers.

I do not know the answer to this. I do not know how trans people should be included without excluding others. I am neither an athlete nor a gender scientist.

However, I do know the rhetoric around this on this site is unhelpful given it's entirely based around incorrect facts (that in straight athletic competitions, cis men and cis women are at equal levels) and everyone that tries to say otherwise is either actually transphobic or gets dogpiled as Being transphobic even if they aren't.

(Also, this is just at the top of the top. When we're talking about highschool and Especially elementary school sports, trans kids should absolutely be allowed to play whatever team they want.)

[velvetvexations]

as we all know you are THE popular Tumblr transfems. all of the popular radical feminist transfems on the site are actually the underdogs and definitely don't have huge followings or any social power on this website. don't look at their four-digit follower counts or the way they subtly encourage dogpiling people because they know there's a crowd of people who will do it immediately that's irrelevant

TRFs think 1k and 15k are the same number because they both have a one in them.

Being so many levels deep in the feminism discourse makes daily life amusing sometimes. Like some of the shit I wanna joke about would probably comes off as misogynistic without the context of it being in response to radical feminism but it's so funny. Like saying shit like I love erasing women doesn't necessarily make sense to someone who doesn't know it's in response to terfs talking about gender neutral medical language etc. Or like having to hear constant feminism 101 basic bitch feminism stuff from people around me and just nod cause I know they don't wanna hear about The Nuance cause the average person isn't as interested in social and gender theory as I am. Like to the average level one feminist I can understand how more complex feminism can come off as misogynistic so I don't Get Into It with coworkers and the like but I am always sitting here brimming with Opinions anyway. That and people at work seem to read me as "guy who's kind of gender nonconforming" rather than trans so I don't get interpreted as being a voice of "authority" on anything about gender or misogyny (and I'd rather stick with that than be the Outspoken Tranny tm). It's a silent game of "I know more than you"

lmao you're hiding your power level

How the heck do I not take doing something bad as life ending. I fucked up today bc I lost track of time and missed doing something with my bf. He says he’s not mad but I can tell he feels bad in some way, and I don’t blame him, I unequivocally DID fuck up, and it’s hard not to want to just fall on the ground and rip my skin off ngl lol but I know at this point if I keep apologizing or asking him if I can fix it or offering him shit is just going to come across desperate and weird, and I have to take him at face value that he is not mad, and it’ll be okay tomorrow, but arghhhhhhhh I’m historically horrible at taking people who are clearly upset saying “I’m not mad at you” at face value

please let me know if you find out because that wrecks me too

Fascinated by how much transandrophobia in queer spaces is like, 'youre a Dude and therefore obviously you cannot experience this opression the way you think you do, people obviously view you as a Man and therefore you have male privilege, anyway heres the most wildly specific misogynistic trope youve never seen aimed at cis men aimed at trans dudes, this is not sus at all' Yes this is abt the 'trans dudes on t should go on mood stabilisers' before someone asks.

it's so blatant

i find it very fun(/s) that theres like, two separate groups of trfs where one is super open about hating transmascs n shit and the other is more "guys THEORY" and the second group constantly pretends the first group doesn't exist and actually you're lying literally no one has ever said that ever what are you talking about

Mask on, mask off.

started just instant blocking anyone I see putting trf bullshit on my dash. soon I will have peace.

true inner peace

[this-is-exorsexism]

"oppression has nothing to do with your identity and everything to do with how you're perceived."

this is exorsexism.

by this logic, exorsexism doesn't exist, because there is no way to be perceived as nonbinary without explicitly identifying yourself as such.

not all kinds of oppression work the same way. exorsexism is identity-based. i've seen plenty of people be treated fine when they were perceived as cis men or women, but as soon as they said they were nonbinary, all exorsexist hell broke loose, despite their appearance not changing. i've seen people absolutely turn on nonbinary people because they thought they were "normal, acceptable" binary trans people. i've seen people revoke their "allyship" when someone who previously identified as binary trans came out as nonbinary - all without their appearance changing.

a core component of exorsexism is the erasure of and refusal to acknowledge our nonbinary identities. this has everything to do with identity and nothing with how you're perceived.

nonbinary people can walk through the world being perceived as both flavours of binary trans but still experience a specific oppression based on our identity that binary trans people don't. there's no way to be perceived as nonbinary in a world that does everything to erase who we are.

this logic also applies to other oppression that is mainly identity-based, like bimisia and amisia. there's no way to be perceived as bi+, aro or ace in a world that does everything to erase who we are. the above statement is also bimisic and amisic.

it's also transmisic, as by that logic, trans people who are perceived as cis people would be exempt from transmisic oppression. and we should know by now that cis-passing privilege is a bonkers concept.

this logic would also imply that a cis woman who is mistaken for a trans women experiences the same oppression as a trans women because "it's not about identity", but this is also bonkers.

different kinds of oppression work in different ways. some are mainly based on identity, others are based on identity and outside perception. no oppression, even things like fatmisia, where someone obviously looks marginalised, is purely based on outside perception.

but people want you to think that oppression that is mainly based on identity isn't real, and that oppression can only exist based on perception, because that way, they don't have to acknowledge binary, allo and mono privileges that come with not having that oppressed identity.

[ventbloglite]

The sad thing is - I think it's actually very terribly easy if you're trans femme to believe that trans masc people are out to get you.

We've been raised on 'woman vs man' all of our lives. We've all internalised it as sacred truth.

Why disbelieve it now? Even as trans people it's so very difficult to not see 'woman' and 'man' as directly opposites with no overlap, natural enemies with 'men' as the villain (because there must be a villain, right?). Doing so is so much easier than actually wrapping your mind around and thus trying to dismantle the many systems which exist to enforce the patriarchy and it's narrow definition of 'acceptable manhood' to boot.

And it's not like feminists have never or don't understand that there's many little systems that need to be tackled. We fight for gender neutrality in job titles 'fire fighter not fireman' for example even though it seems petty because we understand that man=default is one of those systems. This is before we even get to the glass ceiling, pay gap, the misogyny of many medical systems etc.

It's just that for many it's easier to see all men as equally privleged and evil and therefore unable to have any issues, so surely faking it for attention or to speak over women if they do.

There used to be such a thing as 'mens liberation'. This involved undoing the misogynistic beliefs men had grown up with and tackling toxic masculinity etc. Basically trying to create healthier, happier and more informed men who would happily defend a feminist cause because they realise the cause benefits all.

It is the direct opposite of 'MRAs' who seek to believe much like radfems that the 'opposite sex' is the root cause of all of their suffering and should be completely wiped out or placed under subservience at best without actually (again) looking at or trying to grasp the many systems of oppression with exist and how to genuinely tackle the issues they're facing.

MRAs = animal rights/PETA types if that helps MensLib = animal welfare (actually caring about animals)

But in that same way trans masc (and even a good amount of trans femme and trans neu people who understand transandrophobia) who speak about the oppression they face FROM CIS PEOPLE AND CISNORMATIVE SOCIETY (with maybe a sprinkling of lamentation about lack of intercommunity support or specific things a specific trans femme has said which isn't any more ok than any trans masc being openly transmisogynistic) are 'animal welfare' types. They know what they're going through and just want a word to describe it.

But like I said, it's so easy, I know, as a trans femme to just believe when people tell you that this is another wave of men oppressing you. That they must be the same as MRAs because men are inherently privleged. That these anons claiming to be trans mascs targetting trans women for hate must be actual trans mascs because ofc men hate women, even though it could be literally anyone on anon including troll shit-stirrers.

It's honestly not a blameable offence to believe it when it's all we've known and been told. Men hate women, so obviously trans men hate trans women, right?

Cishet men are privleged, so obviously all kinds of men are privileged, right?

The hard part is going to be undoing that. Men and women are not opposites. Trans men and trans women are not opposites. We are not enemies with trans neu people being forced to pick sides or stay away and be called ignorant. It's not fun or good to relish in the suffering of another group, and it's not feminist to think that somebodies gender automatically gives them x, y or z negative traits.

[futurevprophet]

you see! the thing is! revolutionary girl utena and the riot grrrl movement actually showed up around the same times, but during the early movement riot grrrl ideology was kind of rocky. it mostly focused on white women and rejecting a general upper/middle class upbringing, plus it has a bad history of excluding trans people and overall sparking a really extremist take on feminism that boils down to replacing the straight white men in power with straight white women that still embody a corrupt system.

the movement has improved itself overtime but the thing is that revolutionary girl utena, for all its flaws that i admit it has, kind of hit the ground running with a take on feminism that was ahead of its time. first of all anthy is a rare instance of a dark skinned character in an anime that isn't drawn like a racist caricature, and also one of the only dark skinned protagonists of that era. (dumb) people can debate that she's a flat character but the truth is that the whole story is for her; it's her life being brought a revolution. no one in rgu is white cuz obviously it takes place in japan, but it still rings true that the story aligns with the complexity of intersectional feminism that benefits to all women today, because what utena thought was empowering to all girls actually harms anthy and so on and so forth; even more so, what utena thinks is empowering her is actually hurting her all the same in the long run, turning her into the man she thinks she's fighting against that want them both crushed under it.

rgu also touched on the fact that putting women in a position of power instead of men wouldn't solve anything, because the system itself is rotten. even more mature of it for its time was that the show had a realistic ending where even after utena dedicated her last moments in the show to trying to free anthy, the coffin still fell away from her reach, and the swords turned on her. to akio this was a failure, and this is how a lot of people see fighting against corrupt systems to end: the system always ultimately wins against the individuals, and people lose hope that change can ever happen. however, utena's beliefs inspired anthy to leave ohtori, and then in the movie you see that the student council is given hope to leave as well. change, revolution, is gradual, but that doesn't make it any less worth it. in a lot of punk media i see this ending where the heroes can alone end the oppression in the movie, but that's just not how it works in real life, but there are moments of victory that inspire others to pick off where they leave off, and a better future is imaginable.

i think finally, in regards to the riot grrrl movement, rgu is way more nuanced with gender. you honestly just have to look at the fans to see that utena's gender expression gave trans people who watched rgu more vocabulary to express themselves. more than that though, i think the show was careful with how it approached both gender and femininity. the prince and the bride are both gendered roles, but masculinity and femininity aren't intrinsically toxic for each other. the show doesn't punish utena for being masc, and likewise even after escaping her role as a rose bride, anthy likes dressing fem. it's the way heteronormativity has made us think of these expressions: that masculinity has to come with aggression, and femininity means subservience. neither is a bad thing for the other, and people should be allowed to present how they want, not how they feel their personality means they have to.

all in all i think revolutionary girl utena is a relic for punks and riot grrrls and it isn't considered as such by a lot of people. the show really was ahead of its time. i hope this was coherent!