#but I will do it bc I need to Adult at some point

[tangents-within-tangents]

Thank you! You're both putting so much into words about why the prevalence of this trend bothers me! And pointing out even more than I had considered.

Even if we put aside the military structure, the clones' in-universe social standing, and the real-world racial implications (which we shouldn't), it just does not make sense.

The Jedi are raised in a wholistic, supportive community; the clones are raised trained as child soldiers. The Jedi are taught to be mindful of their emotions; the clones are told they were "designed to withstand any stress." The Jedi's belief system is basically self-regulation and altruist compassion. The clones are conditioned to believe their sole purpose is to follow orders and give their lives to the war.

It's not rocket science to figure out which of those groups is more likely to be self-sacrificial and neglect their own needs! And yet the overwhelming trend in fic is the exact opposite?

I can also see how maybe the opposite, the Jedi taking care of the clones, could end up weird too if taken too far in the other direction. It could come off as infantilizing or ~white savior-esque (I recently wrote about something similar). But there are obviously ways to handle it without it going to that, too

(Side note, all of this also applies to Omega and the Bad Batch. She is a child, the mental well-being of her adult brothers should not be her responsibility, no matter how caring and insightful she is. The show had enough of that problem as it was)

I sometimes see this idea that the Jedi valuing compassion and service is where this stems from, but I disagree with that take. Like there is a way to be altruistic and selfless without ignoring your own needs, in fact that's the only sustainable way to do it, and therefore I think the Jedi would definitely have figured out that balance. I think it's odd too that often these fics will take meditation, which is literally a way to manage stress and be aware of yourself, and turn it into an avoidance behavior instead. Like idk about Jedi force meditation specifically, but that is the opposite of how meditation works lol

Anyway, I have some recommendations that came to mind along the topics of this discussion:

-imaginary root by electric_dreamer/@jaggerwockyy (799): as the tags say, 'Rex is Anakin's emotional punching bag.' This one shows a bit of the damage a 'clones babysitting their Jedi' dynamic could have, especially with a very volatile Anakin, closer to his prequels-canon characterization.

-approximate solution by electric_dreamer (750): all of their Cody & Obi-wan stuff in this series explores such an interesting dynamic between them (both bc it's so uncommon to see tense co-worker Cody and Obi-wan, and bc it's so layered and complex and mmm), often showing both of their very differing perspectives, which is really cool. This one in particular shows a good-intentioned but overstepping Obi-wan and how unhelpful help can be sometimes.

-The Value of a Life by mothweave/@myidealhousehaschickenfeet (953): delving into the clash between Jedi 'all life is sacred' and clone 'my life is for the Republic' viewpoints. Cody also expresses some frustration with Obi-wan "dispensing wisdom from on high" which I think is realistic to his pov and important to consider in this dynamic

-Food; A Reflection Thereon by mothweave (2k): a really cool (and sad) inversion of the trope, in which Cody concerning himself with Obi-wan's eating habits ends up reflecting on his own relationship with food and the clones' traumatic upbringing

-Remedial Resistance by MagicalStardust/@stardustloki (2k): speaking of traumatic upbringing... Cody has to give his new shinies interrogation resistance training, and Obi-wan understandably freaks out. I really love how they show the gap between Obi-wan and Cody's experiences and the contrast between their pov's, the confusion and hurt from both sides.

-Here we are, We've just begun by OnceUponADream_Cal (23k): Obi-wan and Cody are both de-aged as "the forces version of the get along shirt", eventually helping them to better understand each other. Again shows the contrast between their upbringings, and how it effects their communication and co-leadership. Also touches on an idea @coline7373 talked about above, of how the Jedi are responsible for their subordinates so their wellbeing affects the clones.

-In Good Company by Green_Heron_18 (80k): tackling what a more realistic idea of how the clones would turn out could look like (e.i. not well adjusted, poor mental health and even poorer views of it), with lots of interesting nuance and diversity amongst the clones. The Jedi clearly see themselves as responsible for the clones, and are currently trying to get more info about the clones' situation and figure out how to help them, also facing communication barriers. The series is ongoing (and underrated!) so idk how things will turn out, but it is a fix-it.

if anyone else has any recs I'd love to check them out!

I already wrote a similar posts on how fics of this nature annoy me, but I would like to push it further by saying that while I am fine reading it, I feel kind of weird about fics where the clones like Cody are constantly taking care of and basically babysitting their Jedi General or acting as a major emotional pillar for them.

I think the reason it makes me so uncomfortable is that not only are the clones already going through their own extremely horrific shit, but the Jedi are their superior officers and have a lot more systemic power over them. I will never stop saying that the clones are slaves, and while I don't see the Jedi as being their enslavers, I do think that they are essentially in a "master" position of power whether they like it or not. So it feels weird when the Jedi are more dependent on the clones and the clones need to basically take care of them and are always needing to look after them.

I'm a half-black American who is very passionate about African American history and anti-black systemic issues. And I can't help but be reminded of the tropes involving black characters whose are constantly forced into what is basically a caretaker role for white characters. Think of the Mammy, or the Black Best Friend, or the Magical Negro. The clones are already oppressed, already marginalized, and already forced to constantly back up and support the Jedi in charge of them. And then they are forced to be their Jedi's babysitter on top of all that.

Helping their Jedi out and generally caring about their wellbeing on places like the battlefield? Yes, that can be very sweet and often involves a lot of emotional care and trust.

Needing to force their Jedi to take care of themselves even off the battlefield and having a whole system/thing about how the Jedi "never take care of themselves and simply need the clones in order to do basic self care and not overwork themselves all the time while being oh so self-sacrificial"? Slightly weird and honestly seems to be the other way around based on both canon scenes and their respective circumstances.

I feel like perhaps part of this is just a general desire for angst and classic whump tropes, and sometimes it seems to be used as a way to showcase, "see! The Jedi do care about their troopers!" It seems like an example of the Jedi taking on the caretaker position and being the ones to protect the clones. But it almost always ends up resulting in the clones being forced into a support/caretaker role even when it seems like the Jedi is playing the role of caretaker.

Now, I don't think fics that follow this overall concept are super problematic or whatever. I also think some dynamics like this can work, such as with the Padawans and the clones (though that is for very specific reasons). I really don't want to spread too much negativity or say that anyone who writes this stuff is automatically racist or whatever. It's more of a personal discomfort/distaste than anything and people can write whatever they want, especially since I know the intent behind these tropes are often sweet in nature.

But I do think it's good for us to reflect on the parallels the clones have to real life issues and the way certain harmful tropes and mindsets can be perpetuated through metaphorical allegories (whether intentional or unintentional), and discuss the way we as a fandom treat the power dynamics between the clones and Jedi, especially in regards to things like shipping.

I don't know if I'm making any sense, but please tell me what you think, especially since I think it would be a good thing to talk about.

[royhasissues]

Frost in episode 57 raising his hand at the dead parent question and saying “more than you think” to torbeks parents not missing kids question makes his silence in 58 hit harder.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHHA

Ignore the fact that it took me several days to get to this

Lemme talk about Frost's backstory real quick...

THERE IS NONE. But there is!!! It's so frustrating, bc I love Frost and I NEED to know more, but it never comes up!!!!! Anyway, the specifics have not yet been mentioned in canon, but I've found that there is a fan consensus about what happened to his parents. I've found that a couple different people have head cannoned that the whole village was pillaged and destroyed at some point after Frost was taken the Order and after he leaves, he goes back home only to find that it's been wiped out.

Now, I don't know the validity of this---I used to think this was canon information bc it was so widespread lol---but given the fact that he raises his hand in that moment...

The true fate of his parents are unknown and I don't know if Derek has mentioned anything outside of the campaign bc I don't have patreon, but I'm willingly to bet it was something along those lines. And Frost knows because he did try to go home at one point. Why wouldn't he? He was taken away so young and when he's like "Fuck this, I'm leaving" (was it ever stated exactly why he left? All I heard was that he was on a "pilgrimage," which sounds like an excuse to leave to me lol) why wouldn't he go back home?

So, he's faced with the fact that his parents are dead and he wasn't seen them in over a decade and will never get to see them again. Imagine being 8 years old and being taken away from your family and having no clue that they were killed at some point while you were away. He can't get that time back. He will never truly know his parents (does he remember their faces? Their names? Does he remember his mother's voice? Or the stories they told him? I doubt it.)

Personally, to his "More than you think" statement, I think his parents did miss him. Of course, Frost would not know that bc he never saw them again. Perhaps he thinks they didn't. Maybe he began to feel like they abandoned him by allowing the Order to take him. What kind of parents allows total strangers to take their child? (Ones who think it would be better for him. Who know their child is different and want him to have the best possible life. Frost was a strange kid, didn't get along with his peers, maybe this Psionic Order will be good for him. They can help him in a way that we can't. They're like him. They'll know what to do.) Maybe Frost resented them a bit for it. He doesn't hear from them at all. Nothing for so so many years. That statement may have been borne out of that sadness (bc he can't truly resent them. In his adult life, he thinks maybe they thought they were doing the right thing. His resentment turns to sorrow).

Perhaps that's where his fear of being abandoned comes from. Believing his parents didn't love him and just gave him away (was he too difficult? Too different? What did I do wrong? Did they not love me?). That carries into his adult life through having the same feelings with his friends. He needs to uphold a certain standard so they don't abandon him like his parents did.

To round it back to the ask, he definitely goes into a bit of a dark place for a while there. I mean, his very good friends of 10+ years just beat him ruthlessly with rocks and didn't seem to care about it AND dead/neglectful parents are on his mind bc of the children. You can tell he's very somber in both 57 and 58 and it's 100% a result of these things.

[librarycards]

i'm starting grad school soon (course-based master's though!)!! any tips?

indeed! here's a list

practice reading differently. your reading volume has gone up exponentially since undergrad, and you can no longer conceivably read all of everything you're assigned very closely before class. try your hand at speed-reading, seeking out and highlighting key words and points, and tracking thesis/argument-evidence-implications without laboring over every single word.

get zotero. use it. i am actually bad at this but i know it works because it helps whenever i do. save books and notes and make categories for different disciplines/classes!

make friends in your cohort/classes. you will NEED people you can bitch to who know exactly what you're bitching about. you will probably also need their help/insight on at least a few difficult readings, and vice-versa.

this is obvious, but PIRATE YOUR BOOKS if they are not already given to you.

another great way to get the most out of your readings, especially very "classic" ones, is looking up others' book reviews/criticisms of said readings on google scholar. it helps to be able to draw on others' insights/outside literature, especially if and when you will need to write a term paper on that reading. you'll already have citations locked down.

don't be afraid to ask your professors if you can do something unconventional for an assignment. generally, they want the course to be useful to you more than they want uniformity.

don't be afraid to chat in general with professors, visiting scholars, etc. go to conferences whenever you can. sign up for listservs. network. this will help you down the line, even if you don't stay in academia. i have cool queer, trans, disabled people i can stay with across the country and around the world, in part as a result of academic networking and conferencing.

speaking of which, disability works differently in grad school. in my experience, grad school provided many more opportunities for accommodation with a lot less "proof" needed on your end, because we are all adults with needs who can be trusted to attend to said needs as we need to. i didn't register with my university when i started this program, and instead was candid with my profs about needing my zoom camera off when that was a thing; needing to leave the room at times; and needing flexibility with days off.

some profs will suck. this is why you need friends to bitch with! there usually isn't much you can do, however, being in grad school means you do have more temporal flexibility (and also flexibility in what classes you actually need to take). i've dropped several classes bc the professor just sucked.

have fun and enjoy yourself! grad school is a special time that you get to devote to your very niche thing, and have other people genuinely give a shit about it. your whole job is to be the nichest little autistic bitch in the establishment. it is a challenge at first to get accustomed to the norms, especially if (like me) no one in your family has gotten an MA or PhD before. but it gets easier and is 100% doable, and gets even easier with a strong support system.

good luck and yippee!!

[e77y]

Glad I’m starting therapy so soon after moving out ☝️ I am already feeling the helplessness and loneliness

[nyxi-pixie]

actually incredibly funny to me that ranpos entire thing centres on how his intelligence is not because of an ability or any other great thing, its just him. hes entirely, completely, inarguably human. and Yet, when it comes to dazai, so many people are Desperate that there just Has to be another explanation. his intelligence cant just be that hes unusual, no it must be a marker of separation, of difference so great it disallows the reality of his humanity.

[pup-pee]

the whimsey took me. blame these guys whove had a hold on me since whenever i watched the cartoon as a kid

anywaysssss harpoon mermaid au ^_^ ((if yk that 1 manga ykok))

[deus-ex-mona]

ok yk what. now that i’ve had some time to process nghy canon, considering the current pacing of gen retcon, i think their next step is as ✨clear as day✨

i really like seeing them happy together, but i truly do think that they should divorce and either live the rest of their lives as single besties; partners in hero/heroine-isms, but better off as just friends, or go their separate ways for a bit and get back together when they’re a little older and wiser, staying together for good this time around, as each other’s first and last boyfriend/girlfriend

[du-hjarta-skulblaka]

Some mild existential dread in the house today

[asterbats]

i think for the shitty scorpion family, their entire dynamic is definitely toxic (heh) but also neither dusk nor bruno is an inherently terrible person? its just that they’re a) horrible together longterm as they are and b) people who should not have had kids.

[maybege]

btw i am still alive now that i have recovered from swiftkirchen and i hope you are all doing super well this summer! i am FLYING through my reading list atm which is amazing and i am feeling more and more inspired for things (footballer!paz anyone? roommate!paz as well maybe?) so hmu in the inbox it is TIME TO THIRST

[anotherpapercut]

working with children really will make you examine your thought processes and emotional reactions like nothing else. I've found myself being so much more thoughtful in my daily life about how I respond to my emotions and environment, as well as the reasoning behind why others behave the way they do

[blackjackkent]

Me> [struggling to unravel a very annoying UI bug]

My brain, entirely unprompted> H E Y. IF JAHEIRA HAD USED SOME MORE MINOR VERSION OF THAT RITE OF THE TIMELESS BODY ON RASAAD TO EXTEND HIS LIFESPAN, IT WOULD RESOLVE THE MORE FINICKY TIMELINE ISSUES ABOUT RION BEING THEIR KID.

Me> ...ok? I didn't ask right now but thank you for working that out I guess.

[red-dyed-sarumane]

im trying to think of anything specific that breaks the 3-4 year trend like shuuenpro hit me just. So fucking hard. but then when i think about it my shuuen era was like. 2013-2016 i think. bc szm quit & then i was super into mafumafu in particular. and then 2017-2020 were my utaite years. and of course 2020-now its the aru sekai series years. before 2013 it was okamiden but i dont remember when that started & before that it was pokemon. & before before that it was just animals in general esp horses into giraffes.

so in a general sense pokemon & vocaloid are forever but more specifically yeah i really dont know

[orcelito]

Part of me is like 'I've been a student for so long, how am I gonna handle being Not A Student..!??!' In terms of like. Self perception, I guess.

I think my psyche is already raring for it tho. Here I am daydreaming looking at house listings and writing a damned baby au bc my brain has decided I kinda want one of those, too.

I'll still always be a mega nerd. But fuck dude. I guess I'm an adult, too.

[primordyalsoul]

Vague thoughts of Rei if she were able to grow up...

[altruistic-meme]

sometimes it's nice when you have friends who try and look out for your mental health. and sometimes it's incredibly annoying.