#yes this is about the anti and pro shipper bullshit

[riorsonxaden]

We used to be fandoms. We use to be a community

[epickiya722]

What's annoying about the bk///dk shippers who have infiltrated the tag with their "bakugou is heartbroken and deserves better and deku should beg for forgiveness" bullshit is that these were the same people who said bakugou deserves a second chance after bullying deku for 10 years. That deku loves him too much to cut him off from his life. But one "no" from deku in 431 and they're acting like he's Satan and bakugou should cut him off from his life. The hypocrisy.

Also them writing revenge fics where baku gets with todoroki and TODOROKI of all people starts hating deku for breaking baku's heart. Lol that's his friend too...he'd be upset for both of them.

You know what's wild to me is that some shippers have already refused to accept that 431 even existed when it was just leaks when only like three pictures and a brief summary was shown but then turned around and continued to act like 431 exist with the whole "it got worse 😭" when it was revealed that Midoriya said no to just working at Katsuki's agency.

If the chapter already made you upset, then why continue to look into it?!

And conveniently decide it was worth paying attention to because Midoriya said "no"?

So you agree? So you agree that Midoriya would definitely say "no" even though you claim he wouldn't, right? You claim that 431 is "fake" and "Hori is a BkDk traitor" but then turn around and apply the "fakeness" to fics and agree to them and also being a traitor.

I know someone is going to say it. Yes, 431 has some weird writing but the responses to it is out of line.

I really hated to see BakuDeku shippers going "Deku should give back the suit" just because he talked to Ochako and dapped her up and I knew it was going to go down hill from there as always.

I immediately started unfollowing people because of it. I never thought I would be so disappointed, but I play myself because it's not like I haven't been disappointed before by the fandom and I had to unfollow people I thought I could be happy to see on my dash.

I don't think the shippers who decided that Midoriya is the worst person in the world for being a grown ass man making his own decisions actually like BakuDeku. Just their versions of it they like because no way for either character you're going to treat one character like he's evil incarnate and baby the other and have him hook up with someone close to both of them.

You're right, it's complete bullshit.

So Bakugou can get a second chance, but Midoriya can't say "no" despite that it would make sense given that he is still adjusting his schedule (keep in mind that 431 takes place possibly right after 430, so little time for Midoriya to even get used to being a Pro Hero and teacher), and would have to go back and forth between home, UA and then an agency (like did Bakugou think about that).

Bad writing or not, you can still make sense of it! If you're creative enough to write revenge fics, you're creative enough to come up with the reasons why Midoriya said "no".

It's not like their relationship is forever ruined or anything. Not like they still can't see each other. Not like they still can't be heroes together like they wanted to be!

No matter what, those two have that bond that they don't have with anybody. And who's to say? Midoriya could always change his mind. What happened to headcanons?

Oh, wait! No, apparently the headcanons some of these shippers have is that Midoriya should totally quit the job that he is happy with and just go by everything Bakugou says!

I'm sorry, but that is not the BakuDeku depiction I'm going for. Like, do they know how they sound?!

You're falling right into what antis and other haters say about the ship. By viewing it as something one-sided and unfair instead of equal.

[loptrcoptr]

It’s come to my attention that a lot of people in the BES fandom are new to fandom-culture in general (or lack there of; we denizens of tumblr are residents of a cesspool) and don’t know a lot of general old school online manners, laid down in Days of Yore by earlier generations. So let me bring up a crucial one that is generally being ignored on tumblr in the BES-sphere: ship tagging!

I am not doing this to condescend, I genuinely want to be helpful and to help us all enjoy our enclosure and our enrichment in said enclosure together. I think a lot of grief going around the blue eye samurai world on social media could be solved if everyone remembered one good old cardinal rule of fandom bullshit:

you do not put ship wank in a ship’s general tag.

let me say that one more time in different terms:

If you want to rant about how much you hate a ship, general practice has always been, on tumblr anyway, not to do so in the safe space created for said ship.

once again, lemme be very clear; I don’t give one rat’s ass or 800 collective asses of rats what you ship, why you ship it, whether you ship anything at all, why you hate x y z, etc. That’s great, that’s what fandom is for! Enjoy yourself! The issue is that there’s all this infighting fuckery going on that is exhausting to even watch from the sidelines, and I think there’s a lot of confusion as to why anyone is fighting over any of this shit at all as it is 2024 and ship wars are 2011 superwholock garbage that we all collectively agreed to jettison into space by 2015, ya feel me?

(and if you like to start shit and throw hands then obv this post isn’t for you as you know what you’re doing, this is for the folks who don’t know and are confused as to why they can’t rant without blowback)

So if you’ve gotten on tumblr recently and noticed your anti-ship post blowing up for some reason or other and asked yourself “Jesus why are these assholes from that ship always coming for me?? They’re such dicks!!” ask yourself:

did I tag them in my post?

Because when you tag a ship in a post about how much you hate it, it’s not a beacon that says “Hear Ye Hear Ye, Interacteth Not Ye Fuckos From Ship I Hate, This Is About How Much I Hate Your Ship”. For that to be the case, you would need old-school anti-ship tag nomenclature, like this: #anti-[shipname] or #[shipname] wank. Those tags would communicate your intent to rant, which is your sacred fandom right to enjoy doing! It is not, however, your sacred fandom right to enjoy doing it in the wrong space, that’s what’s happening here. A post that tags a ship with its normal tag, but whose content is anti/wank content about said ship, sends the signal: “ayyooo, who would like to debate this with me?”

So, does all that make sense? If you tag your post analyzing all the reasons why you think a ship sucks with #ship, you are encouraging everyone who ships that ship to interact with your post. It’s like rocking up to somebody’s house, ringing the doorbell, and saying “I hate your fugly ass piece of shit house, asshole” and then getting irritated when the homeowner responds with “who the fuck are you, get off my lawn?!”

#anti-[shipname], #[shipname] hate (forgot about that one, also useful), and #[shipname] wank do two very useful things:

1) They let other people who want to gleefully rant with you know that you’re on the level and they give like minded individuals a chance to follow those tags so you can have more rant sessions together, and

2) they minimize likelihood of involvement by the shippers you’re ranting about, who can block the tag, while keeping the ship’s normal tag open for the people who enjoy it

tldr; *swordfather voice* it would be bitchin if people could stop bitchin in the wrong places so that we can all coexist like adults here, touch some grass, and chill. Tag ship hate #anti-[shipname], #[shipname] wank, or #[shipname]-hate and keep it out of the general pro-ship tags :)

if your response to this is “don’t tell me what to do, cuntwaffle” or “I have an unhealthy relationship with the idea of shipping and think no one should have a safe environment to enjoy media except me and people I agree with so I will continue to poison the waters” then ok, cool beans, keep on chooglin’; but know that everytime you walk into a tea party you weren’t invited to and yell I HATE YOUR FUCKING TEA YOUR TEA SUCKS ASS blowback is a bit inevitable

[olderthannetfic]

I haven't been on Tumblr a lot lately, so I had completely missed the End OTW Racism manifesto, but I just checked my fandom tag to see if someone had been participating in it and... yep, it's the same people who are known for harassing others, supporting bullying as long as the bullied ones are writing "badwrong" stuff or dared contradict them, and those who enthusiastically posted lists of "These authors wrote these bad stories! Block them immediately!!!!" before admitting that they had barely skimmed the tags and didn't bother reading the stories themselves.

So far, both here and on Twitter, I haven't seen a single nice person use the tag or support the movement. I know that an anon here mentioned that they've seen people who are usually pro-shippers reblog that stuff, but on my side it's all well known antis who try to hide their American Evangelical thinking by saying "It's not that we claim you're racist because you write this top/bottom dynamic! We say you're racist because of the implicit dynamics that come from making one of the guys in the ship the woman and making the other one the man! How dare you say we're ignorant???" (and yes, before anyone wonders if they understood this correctly, they absolutely did go on tirades about how the bottom is the woman and the top is the man. In a gay relationship. But they're the good, progressive guys).

When your entire movement is supported by people like this, I'm just gonna skim through your manifesto and laugh at all the bullshit these idiots are writing to support it.

--

To be fair, I've seen a few people I like and respect supporting it, but yes, a lot of people who are more like this are also supporters.

[a-hell-of-a-lot-of-muses]

𝘒𝘕𝘖𝘞𝘐𝘕𝘎 𝘠𝘖𝘜𝘙 𝘗𝘈𝘙𝘛𝘕𝘌𝘙 𝘞𝘌𝘓𝘓 𝘊𝘈𝘕 𝘗𝘖𝘛𝘌𝘕𝘛𝘐𝘈𝘓𝘓𝘠 𝘔𝘈𝘒𝘌 𝘞𝘙𝘐𝘛𝘐𝘕𝘎 𝘛𝘖𝘎𝘌𝘛𝘏𝘌𝘙 𝘈 𝘓𝘖𝘛 𝘌𝘈𝘚𝘐𝘌𝘙. REPOST DO NOT REBLOG !!

NAME : Jo

PRONOUNS : She/Her, or She/They.

PREFERENCE OF COMMUNICATION : Discord, Tumblr IM's

NAME OF MUSE(s) : https://docs.google.com/document/d/1N_bZL5nHtn--02sWXaGDwXljAmcrqXqvG__Fw1O7bk4/edit I have too many so here you go!

BEST EXPERIENCE : Honestly the early 2010's, but on this blog I don't have one best experience.

RP PET PEEVES / DEALBREAKERS : Anyone into incest and pedophilia, bigotry of any kind (racism, islamophobia, antisemitism, lgbtq phobic, especially lesbophobic), pro/anti ship discourse/bullshit (and labelling yourself as such. I do not mess with proshippers or anti shippers so please miss me with this shit I am begging), forced shipping though it hasn't been an issue in a long time, fetish mining/farming through magic anons/anon asks, dragging me into callouts and/or drama (warning me about dangerous individuals in private is fine though), assuming you know my muses/trying to force your hc's/preferences onto my muses? Basically I am too old for fandom nonsense, discourse and people being shitty ooc.

MUSE PREFERENCES: Lesbians, emotionally constipated smug intellectuals (with glasses) depressed clowns? Iykyk

PLOTS OR MEMES : Memes. I am horrible with long term plotting or on the spot plotting.

LONG OR SHORT REPLIES : Short because my attention span has gone to hell and my energy levels are low.

BEST TIME TO WRITE : Evenings, days off

ARE YOU LIKE YOUR MUSE(S) : In some respects for some of them? Yes.

[ourladyofmaplemurder]

Ok. I'm just gonna pop in here real quick because this exchange pissed me the fuck off.

@jemilyjam, you did nothing wrong. You used the tag correctly because your post was examining a angle about Choni.

The original post was not "anti-Choni". It just wasn't pro-Choni and if you can't tell the difference well...I dunno. Look into that. Log off.

I hardly ever use the tag myself (and certainly not on Ao3) because it's just not worth dealing with the shippers and their bullshit.

Honestly, this is just obnoxious behavior and I'm tired of it.

It is so deeply irritating.

And the "arguments" presented by Choni shippers in general and in this post thread are so fundamentally flawed that I'm not going to bother responding to them. Deeply delusional.

Like, shut up!!!

You don't need to swoop in on every person who doesn't believe Choni is the greatest ship ever. So perfect. UwU

They were NOT perfect. They WERE DEEPLY fucked up and always have been.

Extremely toxic. From the weird obsessive nature of Cheryl's "love" for her to the outright gaslighting/emotional abuse that was ONGOING.

Should we even get into the racism that Cheryl benefited from and perpetuated with both Toni AND Josie??

And yes, Cheryl and Toni DID end up together as soulmates. There's a lot to unpack there, but even attempting that discussion is a waste of my time.

There is no nuance in the Choni fandom. There is only "Choni soulmates!!!" and everyone who has ANY other opinion, even a neutral one, must be snarled at. (And you want to talk about media literacy?? LMFAO)

(And no, I will NOT debate with you on this, so don't bother. I am here to blow up on your shitty behavior @chonidale. That is it.)

And I love Cheryl. She IS one of my favorite characters of all time. I even lightly enjoy Choni (though the fandom has absolutely soured that). But I do NOT see their relationship as romantic no matter how they feel or claim to feel about it. It's a dysfunctional relationship.

A surface level reading of their relationship IGNORES its toxicity and GLORIFIES abusive behavior. Come ON.

( Even in the 50's! It is certainly less toxic than casting curses, sure, but let's not pretend their problems were actually solved. )

And hey, I love a problematic ship. (I'm a Cheryl/Jason shipper and enjoyer, so there is some easy fodder for you to go after btw) But part of enjoying a problematic ship is ACKNOWLEDGING that there are fucked up things going on.

Anyway. I'm sure this post will earn me some hate. Bring it on. We've tango'd before.

I am so fucking tired of this shit.

(Sorry to blow up on your post @jemilyjam but I have had ENOUGH.)

did people seriously hate cheryl with heather bad enough that the show broke them up? bc i’ll tell you rn im furious bc i LOVE them. i haven’t even gotten to their breakup yet but i got it spoiled and im dreading it because they’re ??? so perfect ??? the way cheryl is actively being a better person and finding a part of herself that she’s never known when she’s with her is so beautiful to watch, and like it reminds me so much of season 2 choni before they got all toxic and weird. i’ll firmly stand by the statement that cheryl hasn’t been that happy since season 2 and she deserves to have that joy and experience a healthy relationship like the ones she’s perceiving around her (okay so One. barchie. but like i digress). give my girl something to grow for damn stop having her regress by chasing after someone who doesn’t want her

[mywitchcultblr]

I'm done with your purity

I'm fucking done with all of you westerners fucks who take your freedom for granted. AO3 was banned in china because pissy fans reporting RPF TO THE GOVERNMENT UNDER FALSE REPORT OF PEDO OR WHATEVER thus making life a living hell for Chinese writers and fans. ALSO LET ME TELL YOU that fanfic and AO3 is a safe space for many oppressed LGBT people outside of the west

I can't fucking say that I'm trans and bi without having people beating the shit out of me, but I can fuckin' write that I'm gay as fuck in fanfic or writing gay shit about my fave with fanfic

Imagine some people defending state wide censorship over fanfic, because they don't like icky fanfic, that's a sign that either you are brainwashed or fucking privileged and taking your freedom for granted. You know why Asian and other non western USA-European are more chill with fanfic and fandom?

Why we are less prone to make some stupid callout over fanworks?

Because most of us doesn't have the same information and expression privilege like the west, we take any freedom that we can have

That's in 2017... There's probably more than one million websites being censored rn. I cannot even buy pride pin here because NO ONE outside of internet selling it! The censorship always begin from "banning information to protect children and moral from nsfw" down to censoring Spongebob Squarepants

You don't like something? Just don't fucking read it, it wouldn't stop the author to write and when they do stop writing usually after they are harassed so bad to the point of mental break down or suicide. What the actual fuck...

Defending and supporting state wide censorship because you want to feel superior on the internet is beyond stupid and it showing your privilege... Also yah fuck you who defend china aggressive state wide censorship because adult x adult RPF icky or whatever, I like reading Tom Hiddleston x Reader, because I'm lonely and it's fun. Don't lie that you never thinking of marrying your favorite celebrities or dreaming about dating Gerard Way.

What the fuck you gonna do about it? Crucify my ass? So long you are not shoving it to the person's face, who give a fuck? It's not a justifiable ground to cheer for government mandated national wide censorship. A lot of westerners are so privileged and terminally online to the point their mind revolve around online discourse 24/7 I'm not saying discourse has no damn merits but you get what I said...

Some people particularly white westerners are so privileged they have the chance to goes back 180° and agreeing with conservative mindset they claim to hate so much... Also your kink critical bullshit and your bullshit crusading over dark stories? Yeah. Heavily influenced by TERF and conservatism. Newsflash...

I'm not a person who agree with all ship or stories, i don't claim any moral high ground. I was so scared of getting cancelled due to the hostile neo puritan fandom culture, but seeing people defending China great firewall and aggressive censorship finally broke something inside of me and I cannot stay quiet

I don't give a fuck about your fanfic discourse, If i don't like something i just wouldn't fucking engage with it and wouldn't read...

I'm done, I'm tired. Fucking tagging this shit as anti vs pro because i need to get the message out there and LET THE CHAOS begin

( When you want to escape your country censorship to the internet but then you see the supposed liberated westerners people wanting censorship because they want to feel moral. Yes there are even westerners who don't want to see anything even remotely 'problematic' example: they will attack Zutara or fuckin' Reylo shipper whatever. See? You are terminally online and so privileged... Congratulations... Here's your fucking medal and gold star)

[leianaberrie]

“Yes, I read the article and I thought to myself: why Enzo when Kai was right there?”

I didn’t read this article everyone is talking about. But I am not even surprised Kai/Bonkai isn’t mentioned. Even though Kai is the first and only man to ever want Bonnie (and not have to “settle” for her cause his first picks didn’t want him) Kai gets excluded from these conversations in the media. And Plec made sure of that when she made him link Elena and Bonnie. It’s the first and only Bonkai scene she wrote and she made sure to undue the creation and development of other writers. And she made sure to push this “Kai is the worse” narrative, while protecting men who are actually worse.

Really people are just eating Plec’s bullshit and not really analyzing anything. Cause if they were actually analyzing the show and not just Plec’s B.S: then the man who was willing to die so she can be saved, the man who she had the most chemistry with, the man who she didn’t have to compete for, the man who she had a family/witch history with, should be the first man that people mentioned in these articles when talking about Bonnie’s ships.

It’s frustrating how people can’t see Bonenzo for the contrived, disrespectful consolation prize that it was. It’s also frustrating how people think Damon is a good friend to Bonnie that should’ve been her love interest.

Kai is and always will be the best Bonnie ship that never happened. Too bad mainstream articles don’t talk about it more. If at all.

I remember that there was some media coverage of Bonkai pre-Red Wedding episode. I remember that there was a social media/entertainment website called "Wetpaint" that ran a lot of pro-Bonkai articles, speculating about the ship, comparing it to Bamon etc.

But I agree that once the Red Wedding episode aired, there seemed to be .... well the best way to describe it is a publicity campaign to denounce Bonkai and make the shippers seem delusional and immoral. I remember when the cast started tweeting anti-Bonkai stuff on twitter, "Bon why?" Then during the BNC convention, a fan brought up Bonkai, and Chris Wood started with the usual "how can you sh-" nonsense but Kat Graham, who was probably fed up with the BS at that point, quickly shut that down. And he finally admitted that yes, the show had almost gone there.

I think there's a lack of critical thinking in the media and fandom, where they just consume the narrative that is being pushed both on screen and off screen. But I also think people were a little too eager to accept this spin because of the need to gate-keep Bonnie and Black female characters out of this kind of stories.

[proudfreakmetarusonikku]

me: yeah I used to identify as a pro shipper but I don’t anymore because im not seventeen anymore and realised fiction and reality is a complex issue that cannot be summed up in one or two buzzwords. both sides have really good and really bad people and points, which people on the other don’t realise because it’s weirdly encouraged to send harassment to people and that keeps an endless war going on.

yes, fiction can spread negative ideas and bad messaging, but most of the time it’s genuinely people who don’t know any better and they need education and not shaming. not every depiction is intended to be an endorsement, and there’s a massive disconnect between people who define shipping as simply neutrally finding a dynamic interesting and thinking it’s somewhat positive at least that leads to mass miscommunication. thinking critically about your interests is important and fun but it’s okay to like things in a mindless way. literally like 90% of this whole discourse could be solved if antis and pro shippers literally just talked to each other because this whole thing is primarily severe miscommunication between people saying “dark fic is fine and cool” and “you can spread harmful messaging through fiction and you probably shouldn’t” which are not mutually exclusive and shouldn’t be.

99% of people on both side are lovely people who are biased through having a bad experience with the other side because the discourse breeds extreme toxicity and the 1% of people who are dickheads take advantage of that and turn decent people into harassers and influence them to have bad takes. i've probably had shitty takes in the past when i was seventeen and i appreciate being told that but also people change.

this whole thing is pointless bullshit between two points that both vary from very based to fucking awful depending on the person arguing for them and it’s fucking stupid to get involved which is why i've stopped doing it because it’s literally the dumbest thing and i do not give a fuck. people need to realise this is a complex issue and it cannot be boiled down to approaches that don’t work when followed to absolutes.

also, writing rpf of minors that is sexual literally makes me sick and is genuinely an incredibly fucked up morally bad thing but the worst part of the communities that do it is the fact they’re literally full of grooming and very literal cp not like written stuff as in actual real pictures of real children and i don’t think that should be ignored and kids that escape from that deserve support and sympathy because they were probably groomed.

some people, for some reason: metaru is totally a pro shipper, totally a paedophile despite being seventeen when they identified with that term and totally thinks shipping rl minors is ok and I am going to harass their friends over this. people cannot change ever.

like, seriously, just harass me instead I wouldn’t give a shit about that hate me block me whatever just leave my friends alone please? this has been happening for MONTHS direct the shit into my inbox not theirs.

[androgynousblackbox]

Omg, I finally figured it out. Why Sarah Z absolutely drives me nuts. She's fandom's version of a pick-me girl. Her latest video really was just two hours of "lol silly pro and anti shippers, look how cringe BoTh SiDes are; completely ignoring that only one side calls POC who disagree with them Freaks of Color, as well as evidence sent to me of doxxing. I'm a TaX pAyInG adult who's above this." Like, yeah you pay taxes. But the job that let's you do that is fandom bullshit. You're not "not like the other fandom girls" you've just sunk lower than all of us to monetize the garbage.

The "I am a adult tax paying woman" is so fucking funny because god forbid adult women could have tax paying jobs AND online hobbies for which they don't want to be told slurs or to die! No, sir, that has never been a thing ever! Once you become an Adult Woman(tm) your only source of entertainment and creativity has to be make half assed videos about how silly other people are for caring about things. Also yes, her attitud really reeks of pick me bullshit.

[rjalker]

[ID: A pride flag with horizontal stripes of: cyan, blue, white, purple, and cyan. End ID.]

If you missed it the first time around this was a pride flag in a dream I had about Fallout: New Vegas.

And you know what I’m pretty sure it’s a “”new”” version of the trans pride flag that people in the Mojave wasteland created independantly, and it specifically means trans in a “fuck you I hope you get eaten by a deathclaw” way to transmisics. It’s a symbol of solidarity and defiance, spitting in the face of anyone who tries to to control how people identify, whether they be cis or other trans people. (Yes, truscum and people who hate neopronouns, this is in fact about you. You’re just as bigoted as cis people. You being trans does not negate your bigotry towards other trans people.)

I assume they also used a different word than “trans”, but I don’t know what it was. 

If anyone’s unfamiliar with the Fallout series, Fallout: New Vegas is set in the post apocalyptic future of 2281.

Yes it’s a massive coincidance that the original trans flag even exists at all considering the timeline of the Fallout series, but IDC. The original pink, blue, and white trans pride flag was lost to the dust of history in the region for over two hundred years, found only in the memory of a few of the oldest ghouls, and seemed like it would stay that way...

Until an archaologist/historian named Wild Future unearthed a book about it, and started telling everyone who would listen, using shay skills with paint and fabric to create flags, patches, paintings, and other forms of art with it so shay could share it with the other trans people shay knew to raise awareness about their shared history. It’s proof that “trans” (or whatever they call themselves in 2281) have always existed, despite claims from assholes that it’s a new fad or a phase. 

Here’s the post about Wild :) And here’s a post with other fallout themed flags I’ve made

I guess it needs an official name, since, “go get eaten by a deathclaw” is a mouthful....

Anyways, if you’re trans and not a piece of shit exclusionist, not a truscum/transmed, not anti-MOGAI, not anti-xenogenders, not anti-neopronouns, not any other kind of bigot, and not on my DNI? Feel free to use for icons, headers, redbubble and ect designs, as long as you link back either to this post, the one about Wild, or the one with the other flags, so that other people can find the original.

also if it needs to be said, yes, when I say trans it inherently includes nonbinary people. Nonbinary people are just as trans as binary people. I’m pretty damn certain that people say we aren’t because there’s no set direction for us to transition in, so we aren’t seen as “really trans” because people equate being trans with transitioning 100%, and that’s absolute bullshit.

You don’t need to transition to be trans. You don’t need to be out to be trans. You do not have to do anything to be trans except not identify 100% with the gender you were assigned at birth. That’s it. If you aren’t 100% cis? You are trans, no matter what bigots have to say about it. Congrats. 

and yes I am gonna paint pins with this flag >:)

Feel free to suggest names!

-

DNI:

Anti-MOGAI, anti-Queer, anti-Xenogenders, anti-Neopronouns, aphobes, panphobes, exclusionists incluidng mspec-lesbian/gay exclusionists, people who are “”neutral”” on “”ace discourse””, TERFs, transmeds, transphobes, anti-BLM, anti-endogenic systems, Trump supporters, porn blogs, MAPS/pro-shippers/anti-antis, zoophiles, people who let anyone reblog from them, and people who don’t care who they reblog from, bigots in general, people I have blocked, do not interact. You will be blocked.

[idreamtofmanderleyagain]

If you use terms like "proshippers don't interact", I'm going to be wary of you and what that concept means to you. While I believe it's okay to find certain ships offensive and concerning and to openly talk about those feelings, I would never personally identify myself with the "anti" movement enough to use those kinds of terms unironically, because of how deeply toxic, fear mongering, and sex-negative I find that culture. I don't surround myself with anything that has even the hint of christian fundamentalism, even if it's been repackaged on the surface as progressive.

Here's why:

My main OTP involves a BDSM-themed torture demon from hell and a final girl protagonist. I ship Pinhead from Hellraiser with Kirsty Cotton. I have never seen an anti actually engage with and ask a shipper with a "scary" ship like mine why and how they ship, or what their perspectives are on the nature of their ship. Pinsty is a ship that is easily distressing at face value, because someone on the outside has no idea about the complex context of it's shippers.

In my experience, these types of people do not actually care to talk to people in good faith at all, but distant, disconnected reactionary behavior is always a major priority.

I'm a longtime Labyrinth fangirl (I've been around since geosites was still a thing), and I ship an adult Sarah with Jareth the Goblin King. I'm still very angry and hurt about the deeply ignorant way people have spoken to me and others about this film. I have never met one of those people who has ever engaged directly with the fandom about the film's true deeper meanings (which we have actual information directly from the creators to refer to), what it means to the women who loved it, and what the ship means to them.

Virtually all of my ships are some variation on this particular theme. I like to engage with romantic storytelling that involves some dark themes, like villain/heroine, enemies to lovers, the potential screwy power dynamics within that vein, etc. And yes, I consider many of these types of stories inherently feminist. I strongly prefer my feminist art with some actual bite to it, and for that I have often experienced and/or witnessed disrespect from people who do not understand why.

I have a few other ships with an age difference between consenting adults. I've witnessed some real fandom bullshit over that.

I am unashamedly pro-kink.

The majority of the characters I "stan" are monsters and villains. The majority of my friends have their own faves of this type. Many of them have been targeted by wierd purity culture rage campaigns.

More than once, I have either been personally thrown under the bus or seen my friends/members of my fandom spaces be thrown under the bus, treated on par with the very worst types of people in fandom. I and others in my spaces have been called atrocious things for the great sin of shipping consenting adult characters who aren't involved in any type of real-world-esque abuse situation, and most especially for daring to openly talk about the toxicity of purity culture in relation to our spaces, and name that toxicity for what it is.

So if any of the new people deciding to follow my blog after the DbD influx are a part of that, be very aware that I don't trust that mindset. I'm not gonna block anybody for this alone, and I will assume you come here in good faith, but I have may boundaries, and if you choose to engage with me and my content, do so with respect.

[dedicatedfollower467]

hey friendly reminder that i am a pro-shipper, i 100% believe that shipping is 1) fictional and 2) not aspirational, and that people should be allowed to ship whatever they damn well want.

yes including abuse. yes including incest. yes including pedophilia. yes, for ANY goddamn reason, not just the ones you think are good reasons. yes even when portrayed as titillating or sexy.

the human brain is fucking weird, my dude. the things we are attracted to or interested in or aroused by don't always match up in a one-to-one relationship to reality and that's okay. Fiction is not reality. As long as that shit is adequately tagged and warned for, people should be allowed to write/draw/create whatever the FUCK they want.*

I am sick and fucking tired of having to tolerate anti nonsense and purity bullshit from people in my fandoms. Y'all can fuck right off please.

*this is talking exclusively about shipping-related stuff, yes there's such a thing as inflammatory language and yeah there's a huge fucking problem with racism, islamophobia and anti-semitism in fandom, but like. Frankly i dont trust y'all to make censorship rules and i will probably always err on the side of "too permissive" rather than "too restrictive."

[duhragonball]

Disinterpretation

I finally finished the Sarah Z video about “pro vs. anti”.   It’s pretty long, and I ended up watching it in chunks over several days, but I think it’s worth watching, especially if you’re sort of partially connected to online fandom, but not enough to be aware of all the lingo. 

As I expected, the whole thing was vague and confusing because the people involved in the conflict made it vague and confusing.   In theory, the full terms would be “pro-shipping” and “anti-shipping”, but it seems like it’s more about particular kinds of ships that could be considered controversial.  But that’s a slippery slope, and apparently the whole conflict mutated into both sides deciding that every hypothetical relationship between fictional characters is either equally valid or equally dangerous.  

Long story short, it’s just purity culture, which was what everyone on Tumblr was calling it around 2012.  But now, if you’re a sane person who genuinely asks: “Who gives a fuck about Voltron?”, these people will jump your ass and accuse you of being on the side of their enemies.  “Children have died over the importance of Lotor/Hagger!   Your callous indifference proves that you yourself must have murdered children!” 

I think what Sarah Z really hit upon in this video was that media consumption has become so ingrained in our culture that people feel like it has to go hand-in-hand with our morality.   That is, it’s not enough for me to watch Star Trek, I have to justify Star Trek as evidence that I’m a good person.  Maybe this is where the expression “guilty pleasure” comes from.   Conversely, it’s not enough for me to not watch Dr. Who, I have to somehow convince everyone that Dr. Who was invented by the devil.

I’m pretty sure the Reylo ship has a lot to do with this, since it’s kind of understood to be a dark, problematic concept, and fans either embrace its flaws or recoil in horror because of them.   Star Wars itself is a dumb story about space wizards, so people try to give the debate more weight by linking it to freedom of self expression and/or enabling real world harm.   Suddenly it’s not enough to just think two actors would look cute making out instead of fighting.   Now it’s this battlefield for the soul of civilization or something.

I grew up in the 80′s, when “concerned parents” and grifters would accuse the Smurfs and metal bands of promoting satanism and witchcraft.   I used to hear stories of teens going out into the woods in the middle of the night to do occult stuff, and all I could ever think about was: “Why would anyone bother wandering out in the woods in the middle of the night?”  Which is why “concerned parents” turned their attention to things that were closer to home, like Saturday morning cartoons.   It had nothing to do with the content; it was just about finding a safe, accessible target for their hysteria.   Some people want to go on a crusade without leaving the house, so they pick a fight with Papa Smurf instead of confronting the real evils in the world.  Even as a kid, I knew this was a con, because I’d watched the show for myself and knew it was too saccharine to be threat to anyone.

The pro/anti folks have tried to disguise this with a lot of terminology.   I wondered why they seemed to reluctant to use the full terms “pro-shipper” and “anti-shipper”, and it’s probably a couple of things.   First, the word “shipper” is basically an admission that this is pointless bullshit that doesn’t matter, and they’d like to avoid that connotation.   Second, they seem to have decided that this goes beyond shipping itself, into practically anything else they want it to involve.  It’s all part of the con, which is to make you believe that it’s “us vs. them”, and you can be part of “us” by curating specific attitudes about Steven Universe.

Seriously, “about Steven Universe” is such an incredible punchline.  You can make anything funnier by adding those three words to the end of a sentence.   “Do not interact if you blog about Steven Universe.”   “Hey, what’s up, YouTube, this is SSJ3RyokoLover69, and this is going to be kind of a serious video about Steven Universe.”   “Mrs. Johnson, the results of your biopsy are in, and I have some bad news about Steven Universe.”   It’s a fucking kids show.   “Oh no, all the characters look like the characters in all the other kids shows!”   Yeah, that’s because it’s a kids show.   Marvin looks like Garfield, this isn’t new.

The common denominator here seems to be that both sides try to wrap themselves in the flag of vulnerable groups: impressionable minors, trauma survivors, harassment victims, etc.   The “pros” want to protect those people so that they can feel free to explore weird subject matter on their own terms, and the “antis” want to protect the same people from being exposed to weird subject matter that they might not want to see.   It’s all about establishing a moral high ground.   Back in the day, it was called “sanctimony”. 

But people get roped into this, because at their core, people want approval, and this stupid conflict offers them a sense of community.  As long as you support the cause, whatever it may be, you’ll have this online friend network that appears to support anything you do.   But if you deviate from their norm, you’ll be cast out.    Does this sound familiar?

To use a more familiar example, I still sometimes find people clamoring about Gochi vs. Vegebul.   I’ve never understood this, because both ships were canon, and I never saw much direct evidence of a war between them, but people would still talk about how crazy the Vegebul shippers were, and how crazy the Gochi shippers were, and it was like some huge thing going on just over the hills.   It’s the same idea, since the idea that you could like both or neither never seems to occur to anyone involved.   I never gave a shit, because I used to see the same dumb agendas in the Harry Potter fandom.

Okay, so let me take you back.  It’s 2005 through 2011, and I’m hateblogging all seven Harry Potter novels, because fuck you, that’s why.  The funny thing I encountered was that occasionally fans seemed to want to pretend like my bashing of certain characters was proving them right somehow.    They were like “See?  He hates Ron Weasley too!  That proves that Seamus Finnegan is the coolest guy ever.”   The Slytherin stans would do this all the time, because I would constantly take the piss out of the Gryffindor characters for being self-important dopes.   I think they just liked hearing it from an outside perspective.   But I had to keep reminding them all that I hated all of them.   Every character from Harry Potter sucks ass. Voldemort was my favorite, but only because he was the one guy who wanted to kill all of the others.   But he sucks too because he failed. 

And the shippers were the same way.   I’d say something shitty about Ron, because Ron sucks, and some smartass Joss Whedon fan would be like “Yes!  Boost the signal!  That is why Harry/Hermione is the best ship!”  And I’d be like “No, Harry and Hermione suck at least as bad as Ron does.  They’re all terrible and I hate them.”   I really do think there was some sort of Stockholm Syndrome going on with Harry Potter books, where everyone secretly knows they suck, but the fans sort of latch on to one or two characters and go like “Well, he’s not as shitty as the rest.”   Like finding spaghetti in the trash and picking out the meatball with the least amount of lint on it.   Then you’d go and start a flamewar with some other starving person over whether your meatball is shittier than theirs.  This is what people mean when they say to read another book. 

Anyway, the big thing I picked up from Sarah Z’s video is “disinterpretation”, a term coined by MSNBC columnis Zeeshan Aleem.   The Twitter thread is worth a read, but the short version is that he once remarked that a Julia Louis-Dreyfus routine wasn’t very good, and someone got mad at him for insinuating that women are incapable of being funny.    They just took his dissatisfaction with one performance by one comedian as being a universal condemnation of women comedians in general.  And this sort of thing is all over the internet.   Everyone sees what they want to see and then they take it as permission to overreact.  

I ran into this myself a while back, because someone saw who I interacted with on Twitter and decided that they’re all bad guys and if I have any interaction with them, then that makes me a bad guy too.   At the time I tried to play it cool, but the more I think about it, the more it ticks me off.   And over the course of that conversation, it was said that I don’t talk about myself much, and that’s kind of funny, because all I ever do on social media is write long-ass blog posts like this one.  I don’t expect anyone to memorize them, or even read them all the way through, but when I write all this stuff and someone goes out of their way to say they don’t know anything about me, the message is that they just didn’t pay attention to what I was saying, and they didn’t bother to try.

So I’m a little jaded from that, because I got called out for a bunch of stuff I didn’t even do or say, and apparently that’s just a thing that happens.   People will reject you for completely arbitrary reasons, not because of anything you actually said or did, and you’re left thinking you made some terrible mistake.   Except, no, I’ve seen it happen to other people, people a lore more conscientious than I am, and if they can’t satisfy the bullshit purity standards, then I never stood a chance.   If the game is rigged so I can’t win, then I’m not going to play.  

And it’s that same condition that probably draws people into these online holy wars, because if you declare yourself for the pro or anti side, at least then you’ll have a posse backing you up.   Only they don’t support you, they support your willingness to support them.    Once your commitment to their agenda wavers, even in the slightest, they will turn against you.   

Sarah Z suggests that both sides of the war drop the pro and anti terms, since they lost all meaning long ago.   But that just invites a new set of useless terms to perpetuate the same cycle.   Her more useful advice is for fandom people to broaden their horizons.   She got a lot of flak for tweeting “Go outside” once, but the ironic thing is that it’s sound advice.   I had lunch with my mom yesterday and it was just nice getting away from things for a while.   People need to do that more often, and unfortunately it feels like it’s harder to do than ever before.

But “go outside” isn’t just a literal thing.   It can mean going beyond your usual haunts, reading the same books, watching the same shows, rehashing the same conversations.   I think the reason this stuff always revolves around “shipping” is because there seems to be this deep-seated compulsion to pair fictional characters off like this, and for a lot of folks it’s the only way they can consume a story, so they do.   And they do it lot, and there’s a lot of them, and they do it the same way every time, and lo and behold the same old conflicts start up.   So maybe “go outside” should mean “go outside of that cycle once in a while.”   Just a thought. 

[anti-reader-insert]

Disclaimer:

I’m actually a Pro-Shipper. I’m not here to tell you what you can and cannot ship.

This blog is about anything not a Canon x Canon ship. This includes: Reader inserts, self-ships, imagines, etc.

This blog will also be about how much I hate Polyshipping / OT3+

Basically this is where I dump my personal shipping opinions.

FAQ:

“If you’re pro-ship, why are you anti-reader inserts??”

Because I find them uninteresting, creepy, gross, and a waste of perfectly good shipping potential for canon characters. Also because I have no emotional investments in your shallow excuse for a character. Be it OC, yourself, an imagine, or a random reader there’s no pre-existing emotional attachment there. I’m interested in seeing canon characters I care about bang, not a shallow faceless uninteresting generic excuse for a character I can’t relate to or enjoy the tiniest bit getting it on with a character I love who already has so much wasted shipping potential with literally any canon character in the source material. So yeah.

“Okay, so you don’t like it, why ruin the fun for others??”

Because there are certain fandoms where reader inserts make up the bulk of shipping fics and even sometimes, fanart. As tho no one gives a fuck about the canonical character dynamics. If there was more balance of content, I wouldn’t be so annoyed. If people tagged their shit properly I also wouldn’t be so annoyed.

“What about polyships then??”

That’s involving a personal trauma. Plus I just find them emotionally gross and a pack of lies. The only exceptions are, for both OCs and polyships, are straight up Mob x Canon because I like to see my faves suffer. So yeah.

“So you’re a pro-shipper, meaning you’re okay with all sorts of nasty shit in fiction but you choose to take issue with harmless reader inserts and loving polyships?? Why??”

Different strokes for different folks. Plus I’m not claiming anything moral about my stance. I’m not saying you’re a bad person for liking the shit I hate (boring, maybe, shallow too, but not bad). I’m very much pro freedom of speech and even tho I despise reader inserts and polyships to my core I will still defend your right to read / write them. But this doesn’t mean I can’t talk about how I fucking hate them personally. Basically, I’m not on a high horse casting moral judgement on anyone here. I’m all in favor of there being more nasty shit in fanfiction actually. That’s part of the wasted potential for me, personally, among other things. So yes that IS what I’m doing, in a sense.

“Why label is an anti blog if you’re a pro-shipper then?”

Because while anti’s are generally garbage people with garbage opinions and garbage dispositions who do terrible things... I cannot deny it’s a clear cut catchy shorthand for saying you don’t like shit. So it’s shorthand really. I do not condone harassment, death threats, or anything of that nature. Ever. I may rag on people and what they choose to ship, but I will never pretend to act like I’m morally superior for it. So while I am, sorta, anti certain things - I’m not an actual anti-shipper. Again this is due to the fact that I believe you can like whatever you want and I’m not trying to stop you.

“So what is the point of this blog then??”

Venting my frustrations. That’s pretty much it.

“Stop ruining my fun!!”

You ruin your own fun, bro. If my opinions bother you just block me. Personally I’d love to block every single reader insert, imagines, etc blog but it’s rare people accurately tag this bullshit. But if my opinions ruin your fun then your fun seems pretty fragile. Personally, if someone gave me shit about what I liked I’d just go read the shit they hate and move on with life. But hey, usually the people who do that to me are harping on about how terrible I am because of what I enjoy. I’m not doing that to you.

In short, welcome to my blog! If you happen to share my opinions then congrats you’re not alone after all! If you don’t share my opinions then perhaps you can take something away from this blog, or maybe not. If you’re here to give me shit because I hate your shit — why bother? I made it clear I’m not trying to stop you or anything.

If you have anymore questions or want to ask me personal shit, feel free.

As for the what to call me, eh idk, I guess “Chiyo” since that’s the name of my pfp character (from Murcielago in case anyone cares).

CLARIFICATION: As for the title “canon ships are always superior”, I mean canon x canon ships. Not just ships that are canon in canon.

[intersex-ionality]

I don’t know how this is still such a big debate, but if your show consistently presents cops as the only people capable of dealing with police corruption, and presents outside investigators and defense attorneys as monsters, that’s pro-cop bullshit, and yes, this is about B99, and yes, B99 is still one of the best shows I have ever seen. I will never tell people not to watch it. I will not stop watchign it myself.

But holy SHIT why is everyone so fucking allergic to considering the very obvious statement of fact that a show in which cops are the heroes, defense attorneys are comically villainous, and actually using your fuckign rights to silence and attorney is considered ~*~guilty behaviour~*~, then that’s a bad thing?

That’s not great?

We can admit that things aren’t great?! Without demanding that it be cancelled!?

God, I fucking hate every white person who has ever reblogged or commented anything to the effect of, “B99 can’t possibly be cop propaganda because it’s too good and they had that one expisoe about racial profiling.” I see you.

I see every last one of you.

You’re not fucking clever.

I don’t trust you as far as I can spit you.

You can’t even admit that an otherwise very good show has a few fuckign flaws inherent to its premise.

That’s not allyship. That’s performative gag-worthy whining about how your faves are unproblematic.

And if any one of you absolute shit sucking bastards dares try and say I’m a fucking purity policing anti-shipper because I’m pointing out the fucking pro-cop bias inherent to a COP. SHOW?

Fuck you extra.