#toh discourse

[thousandyearphantombunker]

the finale designs where also not that great. Wtf is going on with Lilith, Amity, Eda, and Willow?

All the dark colors on Lilith and Amity make them look like a blob onscreen and it all looks muddled together. Lilith has it worse than Amity though because while I don't like Amity's hairstyle much (I think it's the crown on the ponytail that really it's me) but OMG Lilith's bright orange hair clashes so bad. It's too bright. Eda just had too much going on with that ugly scarf and gold chest thing and her gem- it's top heavy (though atleast it's not a blob and the colors look nice together). Like all these little details are too much! They had a lot of elements to work with so they decided to use all them at once and it looks bad. Did Amity need the crown and the swirls and the undercut dyed hair ponytail thing? You couldn't have just chosen one or two elements to explore?

What is with the lower half of Willow's design. Those shorts are okay but why only one knee pad and one sock? Her shirt has a weird stitching detail and her headband feels weird? Like it's cute but idk about it here. The worst part is her color palette. Idk I just don't like it like these colors look nice together but there's too many! That being said Hunter had the worst finale design

Camilla and Luz are a bit over designed but not awful. Hunter had too much going on. The coven patches the yang Xiao long volume 4 patchwork where the straps and other parts have to be different browns the details on his shoes etc

How the fuck did Raine get the best finale design? There was barely a character to work with!

Gus got a very mid design. They didn't do much with him.

It's like they didn't have a clear idea of what they wanted

So I can’t help but think that some of the owl house designs are sort of weak at times because since they could gone a bit more to look none human instead of them just having pointy ears and the poc as well could been better especially for Gus, luz, and willow since they’re supposed to be black especially willow.

i agree! i've seen some other people talking about this too, for a show that claims to be about “accepting weirdos”, the main cast sure looks very Normal™. like„ the boiling isles is a place full of monsters and demons and a lot of characters with interesting and unusual character designs, but luz's friends are all very human-looking?? except for vee, i guess, but even she takes a human form 99% of the time.

and honestly none of luz's friends are that Weird™, they're all mostly normal with normal human problems like getting bullied or being taken advantage of. not that that's a bad thing but i expected the show to delve deeper into the abnormality of the boiling isles.

if anything, i would have expected luz to immediately befriend someone like hooty, but in s1 and for the first half of s2, she seems to find hooty annoying just like eda and king does. what was all this talk about weirdos sticking together then? i guess you can be weird but not too weird because that's annoying. /s

and yes, i was really surprised when i learned that willow was supposed to be blasian because she has no black features at all?? they could have given her something, darker skin or curly hair, anything that indicated that she was half-black.

i didn't really know how the magic system in toh worked when i was watching s1 so i just assumed that willow was either adopted or one of her dads was her stepdad. idk they just made her look asian and called it a day.

[hikaaa-bi]

whenever someone says they dislike huntlow, the usual comeback from toxic huntlow fans is that “you're a misogynist and you don't want to see the woman in a relationship being stronger”. so i want to address this issue today. is huntlow bad only because willow is stronger than hunter and isn't a damsel in distress?

in my opinion, absolutely not. that's not the case. i myself am a fan of subverted tropes and relationships where the woman isn't just a passive damsel with no personality. i like seeing independent women and i like seeing men being vulnerable for once.

to demonstrate my point on why huntlow doesn't pull off this trope well, let me compare it to a ship with a similar dynamic: sokka and suki from avatar the last airbender.

let's go through each of the reasons why sukka works as a ship where huntlow fails.

1. Does it make sense for the characters?

the first question here is: do the roles of the strong independent woman and weaker man suit these characters?

sokka was introduced as.. just a guy. he was a regular teenager who wasn't trained in combat. he could fight well enough if he wanted to and being the only man in a village full of mostly children and elders, he was the best warrior in his village (if we are even to believe his claims in s1, that is).

suki, on the other hand, was a trained warrior. she had spent her whole life training in combat and fighting to continue kyoshi's legacy. in her very first appearance, suki is confirmed to be a skilled warrior who is much stronger than sokka.

this setup makes perfect sense. it wouldn't come as a surprise later on that suki is stronger or a better fighter than sokka, and would have to rescue him or help him out in a moment of crisis.

now let's come to huntlow. in s2, hunter is introduced as the emperor's right-hand man who is young but powerful. while most of his intimidation factor came from his artificial staff, it was clear that he was not an amateur and had decent combat skills.

this assumption is only solidified when we see him go head to head with amity, only losing because 1. he was using a new staff 2. he was sleep deprived and 3. he was in an extremely erratic emotional state.

willow, on the other hand, was the sokka in this relationship. she was a regular teenager who grew up in a normal family and went to a regular magic high school.

she was certainly incredibly skilled in plant magic but she was not a trained child soldier like hunter. she had a lot of potential to be a good fighter but she had only recieved the education that every other student had recieved. not to mention, most of her stronger magic came from her emotional outbursts.

so.. does the whole girlboss-malewife dynamic work with huntlow? no. it really doesn't. even if willow trained and grew as a witch, there's no reason why she should be stronger and more skilled in combat than hunter, who had to pass seemingly impossible trials in order to qualify as the golden guard. especially since after the first half of s2, hunter was not only weaker than willow but just weak in general.

i get it, he doesn't have natural magic like the others. but he was still shown to be a very competent fighter. he was also shown to be cunning and strategic, being able to find a way out of any situation if he wanted to. but after joining the hexsquad, he is dumbed down to willow's shy and pathetic boyfriend, who doesn't really do much on his own.

2. are they in character when in a relationship?

when writing a relationship, this is really important. if you write a relationship where one or both characters have to act wildly out of character to make sense for the relationship to happen, those characters are not compatible. it's like when your friend acts uncomfortably different around their crush or partner.

let's start with sokka and suki.

sokka is goofy, cynical and quick-witted, with or without suki. his relationship with suki doesn't drastically change his character, but it does improve it. suki helps sokka change his misogynistic worldviews and respect women, but apart from that necessary improvement, sokka is still the same. he is not out of character when he is with suki.

as for suki herself, we don't see a lot of her away from sokka but it's still safe to assume that she is being herself around sokka. she is not forced into a new role in order to be in a relationship with sokka. the times we do see her on her own, she is pretty much the same rational, independent and nonchalant person that she is around sokka.

and yet, both of them have incredible chemistry and very clearly care for each other. it's not one-sided and it doesn't feel unnatural.

but huntlow?

hunter is introduced as a sarcastic and bratty but deeply traumatized teenager. he is quick to start a banter with whoever he is with, he tends to talk too much, and he generally has a nonchalant attitude to cover up with trauma.

but with willow? hunter is not just shy or awkward around her, he is a completely different person. i can understand that being attracted to a person can make you act strangely sometimes. but with hunter, that awkwardness never fades away. he is always blushing around her, he is often portrayed as pathetic and helpless, and constantly needing willow's support and guidance.

as for willow, she is introduced as this insecure and good-natured teenager. after her confrontation with amity, willow is pushed to the back for a while. all we know about her at that time is that she's the supportive mom friend of the group. she builds her confidence after a while but she is still shown as a kind person who doesn't use force on someone else, unless necessary.

but with hunter? willow is suddenly not just confident but also dominant and forceful. she basically snatches him from the sky and drags him to the ground, just to invite him to her flyer derby team. hunter is practically terrified at this point, but it's played off as a fun cute-meet. later, when hunter wants to leave the team for understandable reasons, instead of respecting his wishes, willow once again forces him to join her again.

i wouldn't call willow toxic or abusive, because she isn't. but i would say that she didn't respect hunter's boundaries in the slightest. she doesn't treat anyone else the way she treats hunter. she's not exactly mean to him but she also does not seem to respect him as an individual. again, she is written wildly out of character just so that she could fulfil the role of the “powerful girlboss” in the relationship. and it doesn't help that a dominant and forceful figure is the last thing hunter needs, considering how he was controlled and abused by his uncle his whole life.

3. Equality

it is my opinion that in a relationship, both individuals should play an important role. and they should balance each other out, instead of clashing with each other. it doesn't necessarily have to be an “opposites attract” situation, they just need to have qualities that brings a balance to the relationship.

in sokka's and suki's relationship, we've already established that suki is the brawn. she's the trained warrior and her agility, skill and speed are her strengths. sokka, on the other hand, is the brains. suki is still a rational and smart person but sokka is the strategist, the “idea guy”.

here, there's a balance. neither sokka nor suki are weak or incompetent, they're just skilled in different areas.

but when it comes to huntlow, willow is the brawn while hunter.. does close to nothing. after meeting willow, he's basically useless. the most impactful thing he does is stand up against belos in “Thanks to Them” and rescue willow from a short fall in the next episode. otherwise, he is mostly pushed to the back despite, again, having a personality and his own strengths prior to meeting willow. the problem here isn't that hunter shouldn't be weak or vulnerable, but rather that he is forced into the damsel role when it goes against his original character.

4. Screentime, interaction and development

one thing that huntlow and sukka had in common is neither ship had too much screentime together. suki wasn't officially part of the gaang until s3 and before that, she just gets two interactions with sokka. but these interactions were used to their fullest potential.

when they first meet each other, sokka and suki do not get along well. sokka was convinced that women aren't good warriors and his pride is hurt by the fact that suki is stronger than him, while suki is understandably put off by sokka's misogynistic and condescending attitude. after he tries to teach her how to fight and is consequently defeated by her, sokka rethinks his worldview. he goes back to suki and asks her to teach him how to fight, apologizing and admitting his mistake. suki agrees to teach him and through this, they bond. it is revealed at the end of the episode that both sokka and suki may or may not have a thing for each other. afterwards, sokka has to leave and suki has to stay behind.

their next meeting is a lot more brief but even here, we see a clear demonstration of their dynamic. sokka is overjoyed to see suki but he still hasn't moved on from yue, so when suki confesses to him and tries to initiate a kiss, sokka rejects her. suki apologizes to him later for what happened, and sokka kisses her as a confirmation that he has now moved on and likes her back. we see a clear respect of boundaries and personal choices from both sides.

finally, after suki is captured by azula, sokka frees her and they are reunited again until the end. at this point, they're basically a couple. there's no more awkward blushing or stuttering; they're just a pair of teenagers who are in love with each other. they have a bit of playful banter and they're very casual and comfortable around each other.

suki was originally supposed to be a one-time character so it's incredible that they pulled off on the best ships in atla with her and sokka. their chemistry was undeniable from the beginning, and the writers knew how to expand on it.

now let's come to huntlow. hunter and willow meet each other for the first time in the s2b episode ‘Any Sport in a Storm’. willow is looking for candidates to join her flyer derby team and she sees hunter flying on his palisman. completely unprovoked, the willow who normally never attacked or forced something on people for no reason, decides that the best way to scout this random guy she doesn't know is by encasing him in vines and dragging him to the ground, destroying the concrete in the process. this may have been portrayed as something of a slapstick comedy, but that kind of humor never stuck with me.

after willow explains herself to hunter, he agrees to join her team, thinking it would be an easy way to recruit students into the emperor's coven. fast forward, they get a few members to their group.

hunter notices that all of these members are visibly slacking off and gets discouraged. he turns to leave and willow stops him in his tracks. when she tells him to give them a chance, hunter ‘opens up’ to her a little, by telling her that he had to earn chances, especially as a “half a witch”. this comes out of nowhere because we never see hunter being referred to as half a witch by anyone prior to this. there were certainly characters who disliked him, like lilith and kikimora, but they called him names like “golden brat”. in fact, it's not even clear if anyone other than hunter and belos knows that he has no magic. the whole half a witch line was added so that hunter and willow would have something in common.

willow, instead of reasoning with hunter or respecting his choice to leave, drags him to the ground once again and seemingly teleports him back to the flyer derby team. while this may not have been done with malicious intent, it was still another instance of willow invading hunter's boundaries and forcing him to do something.

hunter is convinced that the team is, in fact, competent. he plays the game with them and has fun doing it. after getting the team captured to join the emperor's coven and saving them from darius, the episode ends with darius turning out to be the good guy and hunter getting a penstagram (or whatever they call it, i forgot).

after this, the huntlow scenes are very scarce. we barely see them interact, especially not alone with each other. in the next episode, we see willow standing up for hunter and hunter blushing and recognizing that the fake willow isn't willow. while this would be sweet for an already established couple, since hunter and willow barely had a bond at this point, it just comes off as hunter being observant. which is somewhat in character for him.

afterwards, there's just a sprinkle of this ship, most of it consisting of hunter being shy and nervous around willow. and willow treating him like she treats everyone else. there's no sign of willow liking hunter back until literally the episode before the finale. where, instead of focusing on hunter's recent trauma with being possessed by his abusive parent and losing his best friend, the show decides to focus on willow's issues instead. of course willow deserves her own arc, but she already got it back in s1. there was no reason to give her ANOTHER issue to work on, just so that hunter can comfort her and give her a reason to like him back.

overall, it was really forced and these two characters never had the kind of natural chemistry that sokka and suki did. their interactions were either awkward or surface-level wholesome. we get exactly two (2) episodes where they interact properly and even that isn't done well. it just feels like these characters were pushed into a ship dynamic that they didn't naturally fit into.

[flower-boi16]

Istg people in the toh community be PRAYING on the downfall of huntlow for no damn reason 😭😭🙏🙏 like my brother in christ are you that serious on sending full blown paragraphs on how you wish to see Hunter in agony and pain because he got rejected by willow? Mfs need mental evaluation, need a check in with the therapist, mfs need to unpack some hidden trauma of them being rejected themselves, and these are the same idiots who be shipping LUNTER, half of my disrespect to that ship since it's absolute dogshit and the shipper are the most insufferable and obnoxious people on planet earth (from interactions dw I'm not shitting on them for no reason) you can't convince me otherwise, but like fr I lowkey wish the toh community wouldn't be so quick to hate on ships because of it being a bit rushed and not having much chemistry, like don't tell me to my face you're an huntlow anti and are proud abt it, like girl you want a cookie? An award? You're not different for being the weakest link in the community

I'm really just going to say it; Huntlow discourse is some of the dumbest discourse in this whole show I've ever seen. I'm not a big Huntlow shipper but the sheer number of terrible takes I've seen for the ship is insane, then again it has Hunter attached to it and Hunter is a magnet for awful takes so why am I surprised.

The amount of times I had to defend this ship is embarrassing.

[daystarvoyage]

Hey hoping y’all get the chance to see my video essay on luz noceda May be my last one if I feel like fighting toxicity and reading the show to filth.

The masculization of luz noceda it’s a reference to this the lauryn hill album

ANWAY NEW THUMBNAIL

TIMESTAMPS

INTRO & CULTURE REP 2:50 MASCULINIZATION of BLACK WOMEN 8:41 Fashion features feminism 17:48

VIDEO GAMEs how it sees women Geek incel how poc & CONCLUSION 27:06

[waywardsunlight]

You shouldn’t draw Willow if you can’t or won’t draw her fat. Almost every drawing of her I see is her skinny and I’m so tired of it. Willow is consistently drawn wrong including IN THE SHOW ITSELF where she’s off model skinny for a minute and I think fat people have a right to be upset about how everyone portrays and draws her. She’s fat. Willow is fat. And she isn’t Hunter’s and Gus’s mom, or making Amity mean to her again intentionally bc that misses the point of her character/arc.

[catgirl-catboy]

God, in one of the ToH discourse things you reblogged op literally came back just to say "um I only read half of that but wrong. Don’t defend yourself why do you even care? you just wanna argue bye" Like she cared enough to start talking shit! OP was in her 20s 😭

Yeah. The biphobia and casual fetishization of wlw makes the fandom pretty damn inhospitable to me. Ironically, every time I try to comment on Amity's writing and how my girl was reduced to a sexy lamp in late s2 and s3, the cries of lesbophobia can be heard for miles.

Not all Lumity fans are like that, but enough of them are that I try to stick to reblogging art of the less common ships, even though I want to RB SO MUCH ART OF LILITH AND HUNTER, YOU FEEL ME?

[daystarvoyage]

Ok promoting a stereotype trope that’s been done in numerous shows

Honestly this is played out and very stereotyped,

I feel it does more harm then good, for people need to start being mindful what they put into media, and how to perceive things this kinda defeats a purpose of your going to have Hispanic representation.

Just my opinion.

(Plus couldn’t get a better pic of Camilla)

Camila is the most powerful character in the owl house

[itslilacmoon]

mods are asleep, post forbidden myosotis hexsquad polycule

[spop-romanticizes-abuse]

lilith should have stayed a villain honestly. her dynamic with eda was so interesting, her devotion towards belos was a stark contrast to eda's disdain for him, and while lilith wasn't always the most efficient or intimidating villain, she served her purpose quite well.

but not only was her redemption absolute trash, with everyone forgiving her immediately, but she also serves no real purpose to the story going forward.

there was so much you could have done with an ex-member of the emperor's coven. she would have known belos a lot better than any of our protagonists (except for hunter). she could have been a very valuable member of the team, but instead she almost immediately leaves to stay with her mother. which, sure, on an emotional aspect, it's good but it doesn't really drive the plot forward.

the one time she was useful was in the time travelling episode. and honestly?? this could have been done by anyone. we didn't even know lilith had an interest in history until that episode. she could have been replaced by any other character who also knew a bit about history, and the episode would have been the same.

hunter was also underutilized as someone who knew belos on a personal basis. but at least he has the excuse of joining the protagonists late, and there wasn't enough time in the show for him to really put his experience in the emperor's coven to good use.

[hikaaa-bi]

i find it funny how people praise the owl house for breaking the trend of redeeming the villain when the show instead took the laziest path with dealing with their villain. i mean, i get it. not all villains need to be redeemed and sometimes, it's just fine to kill them off or defeat them. no character is irredeemable, but sometimes the point is that people refuse to change.

but what they did with belos was just lazy. he didn't need to be redeemed, sure, but his ending was way too anti-climactic. he was such a complex character to just be labelled as Pure Evil™ and killed off at the end. he didn't need to be redeemed, but he at least deserved to be acknowledged as the three-dimensional complex character that he is. he wasn't just a disney-esque villain who did everything for power and had no depth to his personality. he was a symbol of religious trauma and how it affects people. he was a horrible person but also a sympathetic one, because i can only imagine how harmful growing up in the puritan era would have been.

like i said before, the show being cancelled is not an excuse. i was so excited to see all the religious and spiritual themes in belos's past, and all the theories that fans were coming up with. hell, some fans did a better job of representing belos than the show ever did. i just feel like it was a whole bag of lost potential. belos could have been one of the most insanely complex and well-written villains but the creators of the owl house wants to impress its fans, so they pull a "haha we're not like other shows because we can't sympathize with the villain!" newsflash: you don't need to redeem the villain in order to portray them as sympathetic. azula from avatar and simon from infinity train are good examples of sympathetic villains/antagonists who don't get redeemed.

it's even more ridiculous considering how rushed and badly written lilith's arc was, even though she cursed her sister, tried to kill a literal child, and almost got her sister turned to stone. you'd think if the show despises redemptions so much, they wouldn't give lilith a lazy and rushed redemption arc like that, only to render her useless for the rest of the show.

[spop-romanticizes-abuse]

huntlow definitely isn't as bad as the other two, but it's far from healthy in my opinion. i think the main problem with it is that it completely erased any development hunter could have had after escaping belos, since he seemingly found another person to worship. they were also so ooc with each other, they were basically two different characters and that doesn't bode well for a ship. not to mention, willow invades hunter's boundaries several times and there are even clear parallels between the way she treats hunter and the way belos treats him (i'm not calling her abusive but idk why the writers thought it was a good idea to make her and belos drag hunter into the ground the exact same way).

another thing that frustrated me was that hunter's trauma was completely pushed aside so that willow can have another mini-arc about her self-worth (which was already tackled in s1, mind you). basically, hunter was grieving over flapjack's death, willow shows him a picture of flapjack to comfort him, and hunter understandably looks upset. and to this, willow just runs off and makes it all about herself until hunter has to go after her and comfort her instead.

he was the one who got his body puppeted by his abusive uncle, almost died and lost his best friend in the span of a few hours, but i guess willow's whole half-a-witch crisis was more important?? he had to put aside his grief and trauma, so that he could make her feel better about herself.

also, it was really iffy of the writers to make a connection between willow and hunter by calling them both “half-a-witch” when willow was a late bloomer and hunter was.. disabled. these two things are not even remotely similar.

willow was still capable of magic, she just wasn't good at abomination magic. hunter was completely incapable of magic because he wasn't a natural witch. this connection just seemed forced because i guess the writers knew that hunter and willow had no natural chemistry, and they needed to relate to each other in some way.

simply put, huntlow could have worked as a healthy relationship but the writers fucked it up. willow was generally a really sweet person but she acted so ooc with hunter that she became kind of unlikeable. and this ship was unnecessary and forced anyway, especially for a show that was already cut short. that screentime could have been utilized for more important plot points like belos' backstory or the collector's origins.

Can somebody please explain to me why Huntlow is in the same tag as Stolitz and Catradora? Like??? I have my own issues with Huntlow but that ship is LEAGUES better than Stolitz and (from what I've heard) Catradora. Like I completely agree that Stolitz sucks but like. Huntlow???? Unhealthy???? Huntlow is a masterpiece compared to Stolitz lmao its not even REMOTELY comparable.

Yeah, I was never a big fan of Huntlow, it's not bad per say it's just kinda boring, but it's definitely healthy, it's not even comparable to catradora or stoliz, my guess is that some people find it unhealthy because Willow is in a place of power over Hunter or something like that, I do not know.

[slowpokedragon]

fellow huntlow hater. roast them

YAAAAYY OK HERE I GO

fandom ruined it - why is willow commonly hotsexy fat girl w huge boobies OR extremely ooc shy when we know her personality changed after her memories were burned. why is hunter always uwu shy boy when hes got pretty fucking severe anger issues, theyre just leashed.

boring - literally zero taste ship. what do they even have in common aside from flyer derby. fucking amity and hunter have more chemistry (does anybody remember eclipse lake CAN ANYBODY HEAR ME)

comphet nightmare - WILLOW... WILLOW YOU COULD HAVE BEEN A BUTCH LESBIAN... WILLOOOOOWW!!!! WILLOWWW!!!!!!!!!!!

no chemistry - LITERALLY THIS. fuck man idek what else to say they just dont have shit in common! willow literally triggers him in FTF w the flapjack photo and then shes like "ohh... im sooo sorry i did this... im gonna run away and cryyh....." HUH? why is she making it about herself ?? literally forced to be ooc for sake of ship... why is hunter comforting her abt this during her ooc as shit breakdown when by all right he has a right to be angry and has been shown to be the type to hold a grudge? and for that fucking matter, willow has never actually been the type to "smile and hold it all in" in the same way that luz is. she WOULD actually rely on camila and talk to her, because shes used to having good parents she can rely on. (not to say camila is a bad parent, but clearly she and luz struggle communication wise.) I MUST ALSO COMPLAIN... WHEN DOES ANYBODY CALL HUNTER "HALF A WITCH"? HE IS LITERALLY A TEEN PRODIGY. people dont even know hes powerless without his staff, we LITERALLY SEE LUZ REALIZE THIS ON SCREEN!!!? why the FUCK is canon trying to tell me that they can bond over being called "half a witch"? BULL FUCKING SHIT

stupid, in an annoying way - willow and hunter are both in turns forced to be the damsel in distress for ship moments when theyre both extremely competent combatants and the struggles they face that enable those ship moments are Fucking Dumb.

how tf is this even a ship? - literally forced to be ship by the show... hunter my beloved you could have been the lumity homewrecker (and i have THOUGHTS on how Nothing the lumity ship is and how dirty they did amitys character)

keep that girl away from him! - ah yes willow, the forceful character who tends to impose her will on her friends post memory episode, and has even used magic to restrain hunter before (flyer derby episode); im sure this will be great for hunter's self actualization and cause zero backsliding in regards to him being used to being the caretaker for belos who bends to his will under every single thing and is a people pleaser and has only been shown to be himself properly around luz (and gus to a lesser extent)!!!!!

i can fix them if i actually cared - this would require a real huntlow based episode where they talk things out and willow becomes uncomfortable with how hunter is willing to do anything for her and even gets her things before she asks (like, if she mentions being thirsty, before she even gets up hes already back with a glass of water and an expression akin to a dog awaiting praise.) this compounds over the episode until she freaks out a bit and then sits him down and asks what His Fucking Deal Is and hes forced to confront his people pleaser nature, and resolves to change for the better.

its genuinely just bad. - REEKS of "oh shit we gotta pair everybody off except not gus cuz hes a baby but we will also shiptease him and matt btw youre never getting a proper mlm ship Fuck You". ...also i must once again complain about ooc willow. why does she only reciprocate hunter's crush after he isnt disabled anymore (unable to use magic)? like, its not a good look. yikes! once again i must also complain abt the writers turning hunter from bratty and sarcastic to the malewife for the girlboss x malewife trope... why did they do this to you king. i will not deny willow becomes a girlboss though, she genuinely changes as a person, but why does she become so over the top aggressive towards hunter specifically, mandhandling him w magic like she does to NOBODY else, and forcing her will on him?? its fucking weird

i need the shippers to die - INSUFFERABLE! FUCK MAN who give a shit whats canon!! fuck off and leave me alone i will ship lunter, willuz, amillow, and huntmity as i please!! why must you harass us! "weh weh luz and hunter have a sibling relationship" if you dont fuck off and leave me alone they are LITERALLY JUST FRIENDS why must everything be nuclear family tropes to you people. do you understand that found family does not mean any ships within that dynamic become incestuous? the entire point is that it is a Found Family which dynamics differ from a traditional familial dynamic!! I Am Going To Wring Your Neck.

better as friends - everyday i think about the ending credits of WAD and willow leading hunter down the hill... how cute would that have been as a friends scene... i wouldnt even have been mad if it was shiptease post canon w zero other shippy content

NO ONE GETS THEM BUT ME!!!! - ohhhhhuuuuhhhhhggggghhh... huntlow i ship you under such specific circumstances...... adult huntlow my dream..........!!!!!!!! LESBIAN BUTCH WILLOW FEMME TGIRL HUNTER HUNTLOW???? GAAAHHHHH

just make ocs atp - re: being ooc as shit in most content. someone please give hunter his anger issues swag back. also im just gonna tangentially complain that I Do Not Like Tboy Hunter. just... puts a hand on the fandom's shoulder. think about how that would work in canon for a minute. why would philip create a grimwalker meant to mimic his brother and then not give it an AMAB body. be so fucking for real right now. i dont wanna hear shit about "what if caleb trans" in a serious argument sense. no he is not it was the 1600s and they were already ostracized from gravesfield upon moving there and became witch hunters to fit in! his ass would have been lynched for being a witch bc "only witches have gender nonconforming properties" was a real and actual thing back then. BE SO FOR REAL!!!!! and i dont wanna hear shit about "well what if hormone changing potions" because ONE hunter has completely different physiology and we do not actually know how potions work on him and TWO are you seriously trying to tell me philip wouldnt scrap a grimwalker with a completely incorrect set of genitalia. ARE YOU REALLY TELLING ME THAT THE WHITE CIS PURITAN MAN -

its too popular - literally i have the tag blocked and its just allllll filtered posts in hunter or willow's tags all the way down

[flower-boi16]

Shipping wars are embarrassing in of itself. TOH is a magnet for these kind of things, I personally really don’t care about canon ships since I stick to my own bubble but good god.

Don’t harass people over their ships, the best you can do is block that person and get on with your life.

LEGIT tho. TOH is a magnet for horrendously shitty takes and critiques, especially when it comes to the show’s ships.

[daystarvoyage]

NEW VIDEO EVERYONE I PUT MY ALL INTO THIS! ENJOY

The library is open on ths voyage

TIMESTAMPS INTRO & CULTURE REP 2:50

MASCULINIZATION of BLACK WOMEN 8:41

Fashion features feminism 17:48

VIDEO GAMEs how it sees women of poc, Geek incel how poc & CONCLUSION 27:06

Discussing Luz noceda feminine & ethnic features not being prominent diaspora issues and todays female standars of not being beautiful enough next on Kyoko cane crack down

make sure to comment subscribe.

[bi-ship]

apparently, this is how aggressive first meetings go in the owl house fandom:

siblings

not siblings...?

[alex-rambles]

I don't even ship Luz x Hunter but some of yall are genuinely awful about how adamant you are about this ship being bad. Yall will be screaming "sweet home alabama" if you see Lunter art bc "tHey'rE siBLiNgS." No. They are not.

It'd be one thing if Luz's mom adopted Hunter. But if your excuse is "Well in Thanks to Them-" then Lumity is also incest bc Camila said "I never expected to be a mother of SIX." Which counts Amity.

If you're saying "well they ACT like siblings," genuinely just stop because my boyfriend and I have the same dynamic??? Relationships have more to them than "heehee handholding and kissing and blushing." Sometimes there's arguing (playful and otherwise). Sometimes relationships are more relaxed.

And if you're saying "but Luz is dating AMITY," cool, in canon, she is. Multishippers exist. AUs exist. Poly ships exist.

Just because a ship can't be canonically possible because another relationship is implied (Huntlow, which I ship) or active (Lumity, which I also ship) doesn't mean that anyone shipping outside of canon is bad.

So on that note, if you're crying about it because "it's just not canon," you better not have ANY ships outside of canon in other materials. You can't have your cake and eat it too.

It's one thing to have a ship you don't like. I don't like Lunter either. But yall need to stop accusing people of being proshippers or endorsing "incest" because they drew two characters who are not biologically (like shipping, idk, Dipper and Mabel) or legally (as in the case of Gumball and Darwin) related.

Have your headcanons. Have your ships. Stop shitting on people who don't follow them.