#like I think that's a very important distinction to make when people compare him to the 1000 years old lolis or whatever
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four-rabbit · 5 months ago
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Not getting into the dumpster fire that is the shota chilchuck discourse but I think one very important thing that sets him apart from the average "looks like a kid but is much older" anime character, shows that his portrayal was made in good faith and with actual thought put into it is that Chilchuck is completely in control over his sexuality throughout the manga, it doesn't feel like he exists to be appealing to the viewer or the other characters.
Like, he's not sexualized, but he's still allowed to be sexual and do whatever he pleases with his sexuality, whether it is sharing it or keeping it to himself.
It never feels like a performance for the audience, when he makes a sexual joke the gag is that's its pathetic and awkward and doesn't land, he sees the succubus as a horde of hot blondes because of course he does and all we get is him there in the corner of the panel getting his dick sucked we don't see anything because its not for us to see.
It's just a normal, almost boring detail, because that's how he prob sees it, just a normal part of his life, has been for the past sixteen years or so.
I don't really know what I'm getting at. I guess I'm glad Chilchuck is allowed to be horny in a tired middle-aged divorced way.
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kazz-brekker · 4 months ago
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hotd episode thoughts
listen, as someone who enjoys some good dragon drama, i feel fantastically well catered-to by this episode
the confrontation between rhaenyra and addam was fun, i liked that it's apparently kind of inspired by western face-offs but with dragons instead of guns
that conversation between larys and ironrod while they were watching aemond sentence men to the watch definitely implied to me that, unlike with his brother, the council is so wary of/intimidated by aemond they don't even want to talk to him about possibly important war developments. which does not bode well for team green's stability in the future, tbh
jace stop being mean about mysaria that's your mom's girlfriend you're talking about :(
i did find the conversation between rhaenyra and jace really interesting, i hadn't considered that the sowing of the seeds plan might bring out so much of his insecurities about being a bastard. he and rhaenyra have probably the most functional parent-child relationship in the show, but they really DON'T talk about this aspect of his life at all, and it really shows
oscar tully unexpected mvp of the episode perhaps? holding his own against that whole council of river lords…calling daemon loathsome…making him execute willem blackwood to atone for spurring on those war crimes…king shit!
i enjoyed getting to see viserys again, i've really missed his actor this season and seeing daemon's reaction to his ruined face was quite interesting
daemon you are SO close to realizing that you don't actually want to be king and would make a terrible ruler, i'm rooting for you to figure this out by the season finale
the scene with aegon and larys talking was probably my favorite from last week so i really liked that we got a follow-up on it. very impressed that aegon is capable of walking even the tiniest amount after what he's been through
rhaena running off into the mountains…she's getting that dragon by hook or by crook
ulf trying to get out of claiming a dragon by claiming he had an injury made me laugh
i like that hugh and ulf have totally different reactions to being possible dragonseeds, one boasting and the other hiding it
alicent was serving real ophelia by john william waterhouse vibes this episode
loved that the dragonkeepers had a huge fight with rhaenyra over the sowing of the seeds, they're in the background of so many dragon scenes but we've never gotten much perspective on what they think of dragons or the targaryen right to claim them before
i do admit to saying "wow, those are some toasty boys" out loud when vermithor was torching those poor dragonseeds
love love LOVE that we got to see both vermithor and silverwing this episode, they look so cool and i love their distinct designs
i have been waiting ALL SEASON for the payoff of hugh and ulf claiming those dragons and it was such an exciting sequence, you could really feel the adrenaline and the danger the whole time
ryan condal on the inside the episodes comparing the death of the dragonseeds to ritual sacrifice was also super fun symbolism
another daeron mention, hi daeron and tessarion :)
also house beesbury making problems for the hightowers, love to see it
after aemond has spent so much time this season intimidating and terrifying other people it WAS super fun to see him do a hard swerve into fear when he saw how many dragonriders rhaenyra has now
that final shot of rhaenyra standing on the dragonmount with syrax, vermithor, and silverwing behind her DID get to, i must say. it's house of the dragon! and we have the dragons!!!
okay yeah i am super hyped for the finale and whatever it may bring, seems like it's gonna be epic. the triarchy! the dragons! the riverlands! helaena in the war effort, apparently?! what fun!
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splatsvilles-fashionista · 1 year ago
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The appeal of One Piece
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I know everyone's a bit sour on One Piece after the clown stunt tumblr pulled, but with the live-action series out and the anime popping off on social media, there's more eyes on this goofy pirate story than ever, and I've been dying to talk about it, so now's the time.
A lot of the conversation around One Piece is steeped in hyperbole, and it's hard not to be hyperbolic when you're talking about a work of almost unprecedented length and popularity. With that in mind, I wanna try to explain what makes One Piece so good in a way that is concise, spoiler-free, and that will give you an idea if this might actually be a story you'll enjoy.
And I do actually think a lot of people who would enjoy One Piece are currently writing it off, and I think a lot of the blame lies on assumptions people have about shonen as a genre. One Piece is no doubt a shonen, with young and teen boys as the primary demographic, but it is also first and foremost an adventure story about a group of quirky outcasts setting out to follow their dreams, despite (or often in spite of) the crushing weight of reality.
But you can't have an adventure story without a world to set that adventure in, and what a world Eiichiro Oda has crafted. One Piece manages to feel like it has fully realized an entire planet, with every island we travel to having a very distinct sense of culture and visual identity. A lot of care has gone into building the history and politics of these places, and the mechanics by which their more out-there elements, like the sky-high ocean geyser or the mountain with an upside-down waterfall, function. As such, it is a setting that afford its story a lot of variety, while also being able to tackle a lot of very heady topics like authoritarianism, racism, and abuse in intelligent, nuanced ways.
But just as important as all of islands we visit are the wonderful characters we meet. A lot of people aren't into One Piece's exaggerated cartoon aesthetic, and I respect that, but it does lend itself to a lot of very unique faces and body types that make its cast of 1000+ characters a joy to behold. This is admittedly less true of the more conventionally attractive women, many of whom look very similar, but this is does not extend to their writing. Oda is very good at imbuing his characters with life, pulling on their histories to give them personalities and quirks that are often as funny as they are sad. Everyone I know that reads One Piece has a side character that they stan hardcore for, be it the lovable klutz Donquixote Rocinante or the petulant ghost girl Perona.
And all of this is especially true for our protagonists, the Straw Hat Pirates, each one of which is a deep, multifaceted character whose drive and dreams can be traced back to their often heartbreaking origins. I know I mentioned it at the top already, but at its core, One Piece is ultimately a story about a group of hurt, lonely individuals who find in each other not just friends, but a family that will support and protect them as together they chase their dreams in the face of a world whose systems have been built to squash them underfoot.
All of this is brought together by Oda's exceptional artistic skill. While as mentioned earlier, One Piece's cartoony artstyle isn't for everyone, it's by no means an accident. One Piece is a story set in a cartoon world, and Oda is able to give even his most ridiculous characters and places a tangible sense of physicality, making everything feel real within the confines of the page. While Oda has a team of assistants to help him, he still does the brunt of the art himself, and his dedication to his craft means the comic is full of panels that are breathtaking in their complexity and visual density.
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But it's not just his technical skill that makes the art of One Piece so good, it's that Oda is also very good at letting his art speak for him. Compared to a lot of other big shonen manga, One Piece doesn't lean as heavily on the dialogue to give the readers all the necessary information, but can convey a lot of what is happening and how characters are thinking and feeling through its artwork. There's some sections where this doesn't hold as true (and they are frequently less well-liked as a result) but it makes One Piece a far lighter read than its soon to be 1100 chapter-count would make you believe.
But the thing I think makes One Piece the most exceptional of all, and what makes me recommend it despite its length, is that as a story, One Piece has a remarkable clarity of vision. One Piece has a stance and a worldview that it does not waver on, and it is present from the very beginning. It's is romantic story, about the power of faith and dreams, about people's right to be free and be who they want to be, and about how the beauty and wonder of the world makes its worth its danger and uncertainty.
One Piece knows what it wants to be from the very beginning, and because of that you don't have to wait for it to get good. A problem that a lot of longform media struggles with is that the opening hours are a slog to get through, because it doesn't show you its hand early enough for you to know if it's something you'll like, and that is not a problem One Piece has. It is exactly what it is going to be from the beginning, only in a simpler, cruder form that it is going to expand upon to become the sprawling pirate fantasy epic it has grown to be. This clarity of vision also makes One Piece very rewarding for attentive readers, as it frequently hints at future places and characters, and plants story seeds that it pays off hundreds of chapters later. It does a lot to make the world feel big and interconnected, and makes One Piece very fun to re-read as you pick up on things you missed the first time around.
It is frequently recommended that new readers start with the initial 100 chapters, the East Blue saga (which is what the live action series adapts, for the record), to see if One Piece is right for them, and that's the note I am going to end this post on, as well. East Blue uses its 100 chapters to tell a fairly self-contained story that introduces the first half of the core cast, setting the stakes and building its world while giving you plenty of interesting places, bizarre creatures, and wacky action all the while. It is One Piece showing you its hand, with the promise that if you like what you see, it'll have so, so much more in store for you
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weirdmarioenemies · 1 year ago
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Name: Bulbie
Debut: Pikmin
Pikmin 4 has a doggone good time being as doggy of a game as it can! I'm sure you are well aware by now of the new Funny Weird Dogs!
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And I love these weird dogs! They are wonderful. I'm glad they are so important and beloved. But I would like to focus on a different dog, the very first Pikmin Dog, who we have known about since the very first game! Olimar's dog, Bulbie!
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With this, I have shown you both official images of Bulbie that exist. I wish there were more! Bulbie is a dog even weirder than Oatchi and Moss, a whole different kind of critter that also happens to get called a dog. Isn't that great? These people have the concept of "dog", and so far we've only seen it used to refer to these funny bipeds! Olimar has no problem referring to both Bulbie and Moss as dogs, so I am led to believe that "dog" is more of a category of creature to these people, rather than a distinct species. Like how "mole" is a category of creature to us!
We know a precious little bit of Bulbie Lore. He is lazy, and able to sleep anywhere. He loves carrots. He farts a lot. That's about all we know. Awesome! Sure sounds like a Dog to me! And of course, Olimar loves Bulbie very much. Just like he loves his whole family! He is a Family Guy, complete with Funny Dog!
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You may already know, or you may have noticed yourself, but Bulbie looks quite like a Bulborb. This is because Olimar named these creatures after Bulbie, due to their resemblance! It is also for this reason that they are members of the Grub-Dog Family. You see? Bulborb is just like a dog! While it is sweet of Olimar to name the species after Bulbie, it must also make his encounters with them even more disturbing. Not only is this a (comparatively) massive, hostile beast that could easily eat him whole, but it looks like his beloved little friend! That's like a nightmare! Especially with other, scarier Bulborb variants! I am happy to know that his Bulborb experiences do not affect his love for Bulbie one bit.
As much as I love and talk about invertebrates and funny fish, dogs have always been among my favorite animals, and always will be! They're an extremely conventional animal to love, and for very good reason. They're wonderful! And on this post about Weird Dogs, I would like to talk about how dogs are, in fact, weird in their own ways.
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They're always sniffing with their wet noses, which they keep wet to smell even better. They love to lick, and lick to show love. And that love is such an important thing! Dogs are creatures of love! It is our love for dogs that shaped them into what they are today! It is what drove us to shape this single subspecies into countless distinct caricatures of its noble ancestors. All still members of the very same species! The amount of dog customization that has occurred is ridiculous. Need a better way to hunt badgers? Make a Long Dog. Yeah sure! Why not!
Obviously, most dachshund owners today aren't interested in hunting badgers. They are interested in having a Pet. And a Pet Dog is such a truly incredible thing! There are not many animals that should be kept in a house around humans, but then there is Dog, literally born to be among humans. Born to be loved, and born to love! If you don't think that's one of the most wonderful things ever then get outta here!
This is an animal that runs around and spins in circles because it sees an ape that it loves so much. An animal that ends up learning snippets of human language, because those are the snippets that make it happy. An animal that gleefully exposes its vulnerable underside, because it trusts a member of a different species to rub it in just the right way that feels so nice.
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Even with the general consensus on dogs being pretty dang favorable, I feel that it's easy to take a lot of their behavior and history for granted, to see them as the "default animal", when they SO aren't. The default animal would be a parasitoid wasp, silly!
If I was not able to convince you that dogs are weird, then just look up canine transmissible venereal tumor, obviously using your own discretion, because there will be graphic photos. If you ask me, this one medical anomaly easily makes dogs a contender for one of the weirdest animals EVER! Bet you didn't know dogs could be contagious!
I like funny dog Bulbie
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jeonscatalyst · 2 months ago
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When you actually watch them and listen to them, you actually get to understand just how complex human feelings and relationships are because so many people spend time arguing about who Jk is closer to when the truth is, he is close to Tae and Jimin in very different ways so you cannot even really compare
could you explain what you mean by this a little more?
Hey anon,
For so many years, tons of people have spent time fighting and arguing about which pair is closer, Taekook or Jikook and this is because most people imo haven’t been able to understand that Jk who is the common person between these other two is extremely close to them both just in very different ways. People don’t seem to understand the complexities of human relationships and emotions and how we can need different things from different people. It’s not always going to be a matter of “pick one” or “choose one” because sometimes the different friends or loved ones we have provide us with very different things that we need which makes us feel closer to them and asking Jk to pick between Vmin is like asking someone to choose between their lover and best friend for over a for 20 years. It’s impossible because even though these two people mean very different things to you, they are equally important.
Jk has very different connections with Vmin and imo, taekook have a more social and outgoing dynamic. I think with Tae, Jk feels more socially confident and comfortable in public and i’m not just saying this for the hell of it. Jk has spoken a few times about Tae helping help break out of his shy shell and when taekook were younger, I noticed that Jk had this habit of wanting to be around taehyung when they were in public or in situations where he felt shy or uncomfortable. Some friends just provide us some distinct social needs and seeing how it was thanks to Tae that Jk got to break out of that shy shell of his, it makes perfect sense why he would seek him out when he is in certain uncomfortable or unusual environments or settings. Tae excels in group setting and he can be extremely outgoing, quirky and fun. Tae and Jk also share common social interests so Tae might be the preferred choice in environments where group activities or interactions are involved. I can remember a few instances of Jk picking Tae over everyone else to play games with when they were younger or how Jk said he wanted to share a room with Tae and when asked why, he said so they could play games all night. If you really look into Taekook’s bond and just pay close attention to when they gravitate to each other the most, you notice what I am saying.
Jimin on the other hand provides distinct emotional needs for Jungkook based on everything I’ve observed over the years. Jimin is the person he goes to talk to when he is unsure about what part to take in his career. Jimin is the one he prefers to spend his down times with outside of any social or fun activities. Jimin is the one he thinks of going to when he craves comfort and companionship. Jimin offers him deeper emotional support or companionship in more private or vulnerable moments, making him the “go-to” when he is bored or lonely, or disturbed or sad or happy or any moments of high emotions. This is not to say he can’t have fun with Jimin or can’t be vulnerable with Taehyung but he might just prefer to go to Tae in more social or outgoing occasions while he goes to Jimin in more vulnerable moments when they need emotional support. We have seen how chaotic and fun Jikook can be together and how much fun they have when they are together regardless of what they are doing but comparatively I think his go to person when he thinks of fun is Tae.
So Tae and Jimin are both important to Jungkook but he needs them and connects with them in very different ways. That’s why I said it is difficult to compare because these two people are extremely important to Jungkook so while some people think it only has to be one person providing him with everything like companionship, or social needs, I say that doesn’t have to be the case. It’s just like in our lives, we have different people whom we connect with in different ways and even our partners cannot be everything to us. Jimin cannot be everything to Jk and vice versa no matter how much they love each other. Tae cannot be everything to Jk no matter how much he loves him so in those moments when they connect the most, you would see Taekook probably gravitate to each other more while in the moment when he connects with Jimin the most, you will see him and Jimin gravitating towards each other more. That is why when you pay attention, you notice that in most social and public settings, Jungkook is more likely to gravitate towards Tae than Jimin but in more private, intimate and vulnerable moments, you would always hear of Jikook being together.
In essence, this behavior suggests that Jungkook sees both people as important, but in different ways. One provides more emotional depth in more private and intimate settings, while the other offers a connection more suited to social and public contexts. This balance is natural and reflects the multifaceted nature of relationships, where different friends fulfill different needs. That is what I meant anon.
I do have to mention though that even though I said it is useless to compare, it goes without saying that out of the two, Jk clearly has a deeper emotional connection with Jimin and does prefer to be with him in more vulnerable, intimate and private moments (based on all we’ve gathered through out the years) which means if at all there is any romantic relationship in the mix, it most likely would be with Jimin than Tae.
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woodsie · 3 months ago
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Shadow Yosuke’s Symbolism
I recently got a friend to play Persona 4 and we were talking about the symbolism of each of the character’s shadow selves, when we came to the realisation that neither of us really knew what Yosuke’s was meant to represent.
Chie’s represented her relationship with Yukiko. Yukiko’s her desire for freedom but lack of action in taking it. Yosuke has… a ninja frog…?
So I’ve done some digging.
Official Statements
The first thing I did was look at the official concept art sheet for shadow Yosuke. This primarily detailed that as the first of the shadows, they wanted it to be very obvious that their shadow’s and persona’s were the same thing.
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This is done quite well and tells players subtly that they are the same without being obvious.
Jiraiya does look a lot like shadow Yosuke. The main body’s colour is inverted from black (evil) to white (good), the frogs eyes are added to Jiraiya’s head and the frog’s mouth becomes a chest piece, with the frog’s skin pattern carried over to the cuffs of Jiraiya’s clothes.
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Jiraiya is easily the most similar persona to shadow. Important for early game. This idea is also helped by Tomoe looking very similar to shadow Chie, and allows the idea of persona’s and shadow’s being the same to be cemented into the players minds before they meet shadow Yukiko who is visually very different to Konohana-Sakuya.
Jiraiya In Folklore
My next step was to look for any symbolism between Yosuke and the story of Jiraiya himself. Granted, as a white woman™️ my knowledge of Japanese folklore is limited but I will summarise my findings and compare them to Yosuke’s story directly.
[Sorry for the weird formatting, I’m working around the 10 image post limit]
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Both stories open with a character from an influential background and moving to a new area.
Jiraiya’s stance as a robber could be in reference to the fact that Junes is taking business away from local businesses and their families.
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Saki could be taking the place of the woman in the house. Regardless of if she actually likes him, she is kind to him when others are not. This is something Yosuke admires greatly but it still doesn’t prevent Junes from ruining the Konishi’s business.
His shadow self is then a reference to the old man/magic frog. It recognises him from who he is, and although the shadow is hostile its intention is to teach Yosuke about the parts of himself he is trying to hide so he can reconcile with those feelings. This is what allows him to gain his persona, or in other words “teaching him magic”
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Gaining his persona is what helps set Yosuke’s resolve and desire to avenge Saki and the others who have suffered due to the killer. He shows a distinct intelligence and is often the one to piece together vital information. Without him insisting they investigate Saki’s murder, the Investigation Team might not have ever existed. In that sense you could consider him a hero.
A good portion of his social link is devoted to him coming to terms with his situation, both around the murders and his place within Inaba. He frequently talks about feelings of loneliness and a desire to be valued, and he finds comfort in having his persona and being able to do something about what’s going on, it gives him some control over his life which he lost by coming to Inaba in the first place. Overtime though he does come to love Inaba as a whole and recognises that it’s the people around you that really make a place special. He’s not alone anymore and he’s far happier for it.
Other Potential Inspirations
In my attempts at seeing what others online think about potential symbolism for Yosuke’s shadow, I found that most people also did not understand what his shadow was meant to represent. However, I did come across a few older threads of people sharing possible ideas.
One of which was of a Chinese story about a frog in a well. The story related to narrow mindedness and limited perspective as the frog is unaware of life beyond the well and is amazed by it when told what it has to offer. This could be a potential reference to his dismissal of country life and him growing to love the town.
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jokeroutsubs · 4 months ago
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[NEW ENG TRANSLATION] Bojan Cvjetićanin, Joker Out frontman: The world's being destroyed by unhappy people, so we should try to bring happiness to as many people as possible
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Original article Written by: Sonja Javornik 28.11.2021 English translation by: @varianestoroff proofread by: @flowerlotus8
With two sold-out concerts in Ljubljana's Cvetličarna (the second one will be broadcast on TV Slovenija on New Year), Joker Out proved that, after a long time, we have new idols for the youth. The two concerts in Cvetličarna sold almost 600 of their CDs.
The majority of their audience are girls, which isn't surprising, as the band consists of handsome, talented and smart lads. Bojan Cvjetićanin is the frontman of the band and also the author of most songs. The Sociology student fascinates in many ways, as, despite his young age, he's an excellent and knowledgeable interlocutor.
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I was surprised by how enthusiastic senior fellow musicians are about your success. They say you bring hope that the music scene will spring to life again. I'm glad they don't see us as a threat, so it made me extremely happy to see their honesty. Last time, Boštjan Meglič¹ came up to me and told me with a genuine smile that we reminded him of their early days.
Yes, we can definitely compare you to Siddharta - but, after them, there hasn't really been a band to cause such hysteria and excitement. I can say that everything has worked out really well. COVID-19's impact on us was positive, as we couldn't wait for the first album. It was a big thing for us. Since it didn't make sense to release it when there were no gigs, we polished it and changed it in a way we're really satisfied with, and we can finally say for ourselves that we're a really good band. We have a great energy, we're all good musicians and our arrangements are good. We're a solid team.
Nowadays we don't seem to have as much patience as we used to, so it's good that this long pause hasn't demotivated you. Do you feel like there are other younger musicians who are willing to be patient to be successful, or are you more of an exception?
¹Boštjan Meglič is a founding member of Siddharta and plays drums in the band.
I dare say we've taken a very mature approach, covering all the aspects needed to make it work. We're always willing to play for free as opening act for exposure, without any financial demands. That felt like an understandable investment, and I think a few others are doing that too - bands like MRFY, Koala Voice... We also started to acknowledge how important the overall image is, because you also have to externally portray what you represent in the music. I think a lot of people underestimate that, or think of it as showing off, but clothes on stage are actually important, as we also act differently by putting on specific stage clothing. We put on things we really dig, and we don't look for inspiration in fashion magazines.
For sure, rockers in Slovenia tend to underestimate their image - maybe they're afraid of looking too pop. On the other hand, serious rockers have always put a lot of emphasis on appearance and distinctive clothing - think of Bowie, Freddie (Mercury), but also Guns N' Roses or AC/DC, who can't be counted as pop artists, for sure! Or Siddharta, for Slovenia. Could it be that you've made such a difference compared to other young bands because you don't do music as amateurs, instead you understand that also this business has its rules?
For sure. We realised that there's no shame in saying that this is our job. As long as being a musician is perceived as a hobby in this country, it'll remain a hobby. You're no less an artist if you make a living out of this!
When did you start taking care of your appearance? Would you have looked the same on the stage of Cvetličarna even before the COVID-19 epidemic?
We'd have a similar style, as we knew from the beginning that Joker Out had to work as a whole. For Cvetličarna we went to RTV studios and borrowed clothes. Our stylist Suzana Juršič was with us and helped us choose the right items.
On stage as sex symbols
When I met you backstage before your concert at Cvetličarna, you warned me not to miss the intro. And it was brilliant - you prepared a video intro. How so?
We hoped for an epic intro, but we couldn't picture what that would look like. Mark Pirc, who shoots our videos, quickly intuited what we thought, so we let him design the whole visual concept. Afterwards, he called us and told us that we needed special outfits, in which we then filmed the intro a few days before the concert.
You always mention regular colleagues, you must have an extended team, which is unusual in Slovenia, as everything tends to follow the 'do-it-yourself' principle - I'll do it myself, so I can spare the fee.
This comes from the 'hobby vision' I mentioned before. Everybody can do everything themselves to save money, we left other aspects to people who know best. We quickly realised that we needed to be surrounded by people who love us and understand what we want to become. Joker Out isn't just the five of us, but there's Mark, who makes videos, there's Sandi, the sound engineer, a lighting engineer, a photographer. The permanent part of the team is small. We also have a guy who helps us carry and set up the equipment, and we used to have a photographer for a while, but we don't anymore. We also have a PR rep.
What does it financially mean for you? Are you already in profit or do you still have losses because of the team?
Absolutely. The deficit's a big part of our narrative, and we still go deficit if we have to. We often have a headache when it comes to certain amounts, but we still go to the ATM as we believe in our story. And we go to the ATM a lot... (smiles)
All successful stories started with the band members investing their money because they believed in themselves - like Čuki, Siddharta... But really, not many are ready for a financial investment.
It could quickly happen that the risk's high and the reward's low. We're lucky we've never believed in failure. Our dream was to play on big stages, but the process never was a necessary evil for us. We enjoyed the climb. Well, there are still a few more climbs to go! We've made it up the first climb and are now on the first top cap...
Aren't you afraid this might already be the peak?
Honestly, I'm not afraid of this as I feel a lot of creative energy in me. With this album, we haven't said everything we want. Also, nobody's worried next album will be less successful. I dare say that, out of almost all alternartive artists, we're the ones who do the most ourselves and work like a well-oiled machine. Even our first album was successful commercially, which makes us very happy.
The album is available online, and you've also released a CD for fans. How many CDs have you sold?
I don't know the exact amount, I know we sold around 500 to 600 CDs just at the two concerts in Cvetličarna, which seems a lot to others.
We're surrounded by people who love us and understand what we want to become
Worry not, that's a huge number given the times. Do you feel like a sex symbol as, already by the second song, bras were flying on stage?
At first, we were very scared on the first night, as we waited a year and a half for this mythical moment. This certainly increased expectations, but also stress. I had a million different scenarios playing in my head, and then it happened...
Did you have any stage fright?
I had a weird stage fright. I wasn't afraid of going on stage, I didn't know what would happen afterwards. As we stood and waited, we heared everything happening on and off stage, so we went on stage quite scared and shocked. We couldn't realise all the enthusiasm was just because of us! The second night we went on stage already as sex symbols, that's how we really felt.
Are you the most popular with girls because you're the most exposed, probably?
Different sides have formed, so we're all satisfied. (smiles) When we post, we can't wait to see who people are rooting for, who's the sexiest...
Bigger stages than the one in Cvetličarna are waiting for you, but you've already played on smaller Slovenian stages over the summer. Was there such response as in the capital?
Everywhere we went, the response was really good. In Cvetličarna, people already knew lyrics that aren't even online yet! This didn't surprise us, as we knew that those who came to our summer gigs would also come to the other side of Slovenia for our concert. We have some fans who've been to more concerts than Kris, who missed two shows because he was travelling with his girlfriend! (laughs)
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And you let him do it?
As at the time he had everything already booked, it couldn't be otherwise.
But I was angry at the time. Luckily, there's a fellow guitarist in Fat Butlers who we're very close with, and he was able to quckly jump in, as he knew our repertoire.
When someone really succeeds, that boosts the entire music scene. Even when Siddharta made it, the overall rock scene was in great shape, everyone was performing a lot. Do your young colleagues realise that you created opportunities for them too?
I know that the entire scene has really grown, but I can't say we're the reason for that. When we announced the Cvetličarna concert two years ago, our opening act Kokosy had just released their first songs. We chose them because they sounded extremely amusing during their performance at Škisova tržnica and had good energy. At the time, few knew this band, today they're already well established performers with quite an audience. Now also our audience knows them, so the vibes were really good during their performance.
Parents listened to Indexi and Bijelo Dugme. You come from a family of doctors. Are your parents upset that you didn't follow their path?
No, they're very happy. Mum's glad I didn't choose medical studies, dad would've been happy if I'd become a doctor too. But there's no hard feelings, as, with grandma, she's by far my biggest fan. Both go on YouTube every day and tell me how many views we make, when we'll be on the radio... I also have an older sister, who's an extremely diligent lawyer. She too is very proud of me.
So will your sister review all contracts to make sure some label or promoter doesn't scam you?
That's right. (smiles)
Your parents moved to Slovenia due to the Yugoslav Wars. Do you feel any bitterness, any trauma in your family because of this?
Both graduated medicine in Banjaluka, and came to Slovenia during the war, here they did their specialisation. Both consider Slovenia home, as here they felt accepted when they needed help. They never felt like foreigners. Sure, it was hard for them at the beginning, being foreigners in a shared country until recently², but, despite that, they successfully finished their specialisation and started a 'new life'. I never felt like a foreigner myself.
Have you ever been subjected to prejudice?
I went to a primary school with a few 'čefur'³. In Grade 8, only two students had excellent grades in Slovene - besides me, a classmate whose surname ended in -ić⁴. They probably didn't even know who came from where.
Nowadays, Balkan music's very popular among the youth. How did you keep up with it? Were you fond of it due to your roots?
Pretty much. When I was little, at home we had albums. As children, we listened to the music our parents listened to. Whether it was Indexi or Bijelo Dugme, we listened to that too. When I got my MP3 player, my sister too downloaded some songs, by Siddharta, Big Foot Mama, Trkaj and Murat & Jose. These four artists were my favourites and I could say they still are today, I still love the ex YU rock scene, especially the new wave.
²Bojan's family moved from Bosnia around 1992, the year in which the Bosnian government declared independence from Yugoslavia, a statal entity that administered the western Balkan peninsula for much of the 20th century.
³Čefur is a word with a pejorative connotation that denotes people from Slovenia who originate from other countries of the former Yugoslavia or are descendants of such immigrants.
⁴The suffix -ić is a very common way to form surnames in Slavic languages. It is a patronymic suffix, indicating 'descendant of' or a certain personal name. As in most cases, people with these surnames are Serbs or Croats, or descendants of these, said suffix turned into an indicator of one's ethnicity.
What we couldn't realise was that all the enthusiasm was just because of us
Did you start writing the texts in Slovene right away?
The first song was in English, and Martin still keeps its paper at home. The melody was good and I can use it, but the lyrics were terrible. I've never been able to write lyrics without a melody, so I write the melody first. Also, I've never written lyrics to a melody made by someone else. Except for the first one in English, I've written all the others in Slovene, and I only write when the inspiration hits me. That's when I sit and start working, and a new song comes out of that. I discard very few songs, if something isn't good, I usually find out after the first lines. I usually get carried away to the point where it progresses. I wrote the song 'Gola' differently at first, but I didn't like the chorus. Later Kris reminded me of it, and I knew immediately what to change to make it sound right.
So, are you quite self-critical?
It's true. Sometimes I like something a lot at first, but within a week it doesn't satisfy me. Then I'm sad, because I disappointed myself, and I discard it.
But the Serbo-Croatian language market is much bigger than the Slovenian one. Have you also written songs in Serbian or Croatian, which you certainly know thanks to your roots?
Not all of them, but I'm working on adapting the whole album. It's easier to write songs in Slovenian, but it's true that I never started writing songs in Serbo-Croatian either. I tried to write one song in Serbian, but it sounded so bad melodically that I quickly gave up.
How often do you visit Banjaluka?
I used to go there a lot as a child and teenager, but not much since the epidemic, so I miss it a lot. I miss my grandmother who lives there. We live partly in the city and partly in the country, and it's the country that I miss the most. Everything is so pristine there. Everything is the same as when I was a kid, even the people are the same. In rural Bosnia, there are no things that can hurt or disappoint you.
Well, politicians continue to fuel nationalism in Bosnia, so it's always tense.
I love Banjaluka, but, since I grew up, the atmosphere has been tense all the time, so I don't like that environment. I'm worried for my grandma who lives there, as times aren't looking good and things can snap quickly. In the countryside, luckily, you don't feel this.
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Can music and your message help improve this world? Do you think you can change something with music?
Unhappy people are destroying the world, so we can try to make as many people as possible happy. I think spreading love and positivity is the best we can do. Goran Bregović⁵ said in an interview that he stopped believing that music could change the world when all the musicians and cultural figures united, but were unable to stop the war. I think it isn't the job of us musicians to spread world peace, but we can try to make people happy, as happy people won't cause wars.
⁵Goran Bregović is a Bosnian musician and composer.
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xiao-come-home · 11 months ago
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Can't stop thinking about Neuvillette not liking christmas at first and you finally warming him up to it & realizing whats important :(
A/N: next day update lmao as soon as i posted it i saw official Christmas fontaine art skull emoji there might be some mistakes bc i was very focused on writing the original idea i had in my mind. i really hope it makes sense in the end bc at this point i kinda fried my brain. merry Christmas!
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Christmas time is surely a time that is treasured by many people. For Neuvillette though? A time when people pass him by so many times and greet him so much, that the judge has a hard time keeping track of how many heard him saying them back.
Green, red, blue, orange - the bright colors used to give the poor, young dragon a headache, when he first appeared on this world. The jarring sound of bells rang in his head many hours later, in the dead of night. Furina’s Christmas-loving attitude certainly made it more challenging, as „the Christmas spirit,” like she always called it, had to be present every year.
The young dragon yelped slightly when his hair got tangled in some Christmas ornament; Neuvillette can’t say how much time has passed until he finally got that damned thing out of his long hair. Once stepping past the familiar door of his home, the judge plopped on his bed heavily, letting out a defeated sigh. The moonlight from the tall window kissed his face gently, making him stare at the mountains far, far away.
„Just what is this holiday about?” Little did Neuvillette know, but this question was about to remain unanswered for a very long time.
Years, if not centuries have passed, having now the chief of justice has fully accustomed to the human tradition. He passes shop windows and stalls decorated with colorful Christmas lights, and now they don’t seem that hurtful to his eyes. „It is simply a human tradition,” is what occupied his mind every year during the gift-giving period.
Neuvillette sat by his desk, his orchid eyes concentrated on the paper in front of him; the pen in his hand danced between his index and middle finger.
Christmas lights - check. Ornaments - check. Christmas carols that lady Furina loves singing - check. Christmas gifts - check. Sweet pastries for lady Furina (decorated accordingly to the holiday) - check. Additional clothing provided for the patrolling melusines - check.
For Neuvillette, this is what holidays were for a long time. Nothing changed, nothing appeared new or grew old. And for some reason, despite everything staying the same, gave people the same amount of joy every year.
Neuvillette expected it to go the same way as before. Well, mostly - because now, he’s spending his holidays with you, therefore making the tradition a little bit easier to understand. The smell of the finest Fontaine dishes was the most distinctive for his nose whenever he entered his home, the blinking lights could be seen from the other side of the street. He knew you wanted to decorate the house like you always used to, but this year kept you extraordinarily busy compared to the last one, so Neuvillette offered his help with the matter; your joy was more than convincing, giving the dragon’s heart a lovely squeeze in his chest.
He didn’t know that he owned so many ornaments until that day. He examined various pieces with caution, the way they glittered in different angles, and truly experienced how much of it stayed on his hands later on instead. He more than often paid attention to you rather than decorating, noting to himself that your eyes shine even more vividly than any other plastic sprinkled with glitter. He discovered how much your smile grew even more heavenly whenever you found a good spot for your wooden reindeer.
It would be a lie if Neuvillette said he didn’t enjoy preparing for this year’s upcoming celebration.
Now that he was the one ruling the nation of Fontaine, it was going to be his first Christmas without Furina and Focalors’ active presence.
And the day has finally come.
The fireplace kept crackling gently, hugging you two with comforting warmth. Neuvillette watches you rummage through your gifts, smiling to himself when you gasp blissfully, exclaiming that none of it was necessary, but it’s clear you’re enjoying it more than he ever could... except it's a lie.
Your eyes are absolutely mesmerizing with the shining lights around the room. Green, red, blue, orange - every color accents something else, that he yearns to watch over and over again. The bells that hung on most of his doors ring every time you move, causing his head to turn to the direction the sound came from - it means you’re nearby. Although he got better at avoiding his hair getting tangled in wintery trinkets, nowadays a laugh can be heard, before your hands swiftly take it out and place it on a table nearby. An unwise thought appeared in his mind, to clutter his hair with some other accessories, if it meant to hear you laugh once again. Instead, his hand travelled to one of his gifts - a thematically accurate hair clips - that held his hair nicely and allowed him to come home with fewer unwanted bibelots.
Earlier that day, Neuvillette’s eyes softened at the sight of melusines’ fluffy clothes embracing their tiny bodies. Some of them waved their gloved hands at the Chief of Justice during his walk to provide Furina with her favorite cakes, some of them scolded him for not wearing a scarf, while offering their woolen hats - to which Neuvillette politely declined. He kept thinking of Furina possibly overdoing her sweet tooth - so made a mental note to remind her to eat sensibly and not to open her gifts right after he leaves.
It takes him a while to truly realize in what state he’s in.
He did not need to have any list this year, no - it seemed to come naturally.
And it no longer felt like a chore.
„What’s got you smiling so much, hmm?” Your playful tone is evident in your voice, and the feeling of your elbow nudging his side is present right after. Neuvillette embraces you tightly, placing a sweet kiss on your forehead, and lets out a relieving sigh.
„I suppose this is what the holidays are truly about. Merry Christmas, ma chérie.”
As simple as it sounds, the kindness and small things matter more than anything when you have someone’s best interest at heart.
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daisy-daze17 · 4 months ago
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Omori Manga Thoughts cause it was uhhh
OK so like. The thing is I only got into the omori fandom in February of this year so take my opinion with a grain of salt.
1. I'm mostly a fan of the art style-- a lot of people said that Sunny always seems to have a panicked expression so it's hard to read into him, plus the characters look a lot younger than they're supposed to (Which I find odd). But other than that, I think it does a really good job representing the scarier parts with very abstract drawings of Mari/Something. They coloured it well and thank god did Kel's skintone right. There is one particular panel that I especially love:
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So much detail and it captures the feeling of seeing faraway for the first time really well ^^
Some nitpicky positive thoughts:
Sunny could have looked more distinct from Omori because the only difference I see are their outfits. Maybe make Sunny's features softer and have less contrasting values so we can see an immediate difference.
I like how they did everyone's eyes-- Sunny/Omori's are just dull and black, and everyone else with dark eyes are shown to have a light in them. (Just a nice detail i appreciated)
I like how Omori is clearly less expressive compared to sunny, but I think Sunny could have benefitted from having more emotions than surprised/blushing.
2. The pacing was weird. like really fucking weird. The basic structure of the game Omori is: Omori is in whitespace -> Omori plus the gang (Hero, Aubrey and Kel) meet up with Basil and Mari in headspace -> everyone minus Mari goes to Basil's house and learn all the combat stuff along the way -> after fixing the photo album it suddenly shifts to basil in a panicked state before glitching you back into white space again. The moment when basil shifts the mood from calm to terrifying is REALLY important.
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It forces the new tone on you very suddenly and also sets up a lot of mystery surrounding Mari when Basil can't finish what he was going to say about her. By now we know that something is very wrong and it has to do with Mari, but we don't know what.
The manga is kind of all over the place the whole time. First we see the christmas scene when Sunny gets his violin. But then Mari does her whole nightmare thing and we know somethings up from the first few pages. Next we wake up at night as Sunny in the real world... yet it shows the little "THREE DAYS LEFT" as well? At this point I was super confused because basically the entire nighttime sequence is shown through a sort of montage with Sunny's mom's voice message in the background before transitioning into the day when Kel first knocks on the door. A cool thing they did was parallel Kel's knocking with the creepy knocking we get from Mari Something. HOWEVER for reasons unknown they just completely cut out the fight against something on the stairs??
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Something I was really excited about was seeing how they would integrate the combat into the manga. And they do it later with the Aubrey fight (more on that later), but not now? So now I'm wondering if they'll include Sunny's three fears that he has to overcome.
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So next we find our boy (KEL!!!!!) and he is asking Sunny if he wants to come to Hobbies. I did find the dialogue here pretty awkward as Kel bounced back and forth in demeanor, but that's to be expected since Sunny isn't talking. (And I appreciate how he shows some kind of reaction to seeing one of his best friends after 4 years lol)
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I mean compared to this when he just jumps straight into his hobbez idea without much reaction to actually seeing Sunny lol.
The most notable thing after this is the Aubrey confrontation with Basil and the other hooligans. I DONT KNOW WHY but they chose to not show the hooligans in that scene!! The hooligans are aubrey's little gang/posse who she hangs around with all the time and the people we always see when she's bullying Basil.
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It's very important to note that Basil is talking to KIM here. He starts the conversation begging for her to tell Aubrey to give the photo album back. Aubrey is actively ignoring his attempts to get it back, with basil claiming "She won't listen to me."
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In the manga she appears out of seemingly no where and proceeds to beat Basil directly with her bat. Prior to this we get no setup or explanation as to why Aubrey's attacking him or what the situation is. WORST OF ALL, It's only Aubrey alone attacking him and NOT her gang of the Hooligans. The hooligans are important in showing us just how isolated and ostracized from society Basil really is after Aubrey began bullying him. He literally has a whole gang of kids who call him a creep and attack him regularly. Here it seems like Aubrey is insane and is just beating him selfless for kicks. (not that I'm justifying Aubrey's behavior in the game, but the lack of context makes this situation even worse.)
I think It's also important to bring up how they switched around the order of events because in this situation, it's not working. We're supposed to first be introduced to younger Aubrey and Basil in headspace-- their younger counterparts. Aubrey is strong-willed and excitable and Basil is calm and kind. And most importantly-- they're VERY GOOD FRIENDS. So seeing Aubrey revealed to have been bullying him these past 4 years shocks the player and makes them understand how much things have really changed. Doing it the other way around will automatically villainize DW Aubrey since we already know what goes on in real life.
And then something interesting happens-- Sunny blacks out during the fight and returns to Headspace. This is SUPER weird as we've only ever seen Sunny go into headspace while sleeping, because it's an escape mechanism he uses to avoid The Truth. Does this mean he isn't aware he goes into headspace unwillingly sometimes? And what does this mean for the continuation of the real world story? Are we going to go through the entire Space Boy quest just to get back to that scene?
Anyway, I'm interested to see how they take it from here. Maybe they'll do a continuous switchover to the real world where they jump between it more frequently. But I question what that would mean for the timeline because the events of headspace happen in between the three days while Sunny is sleeping-- so he can't be in two places at the same time. Maybe they'll write more and more random ways for Sunny to black out to do this?? They defiantly are trying to take a step back from following the game exactly. I can't say I don't like it because I don't know how it'll turn out, so I'm excited for chapter 2!
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izartn · 10 months ago
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So, about how I see Link Click's Lu Guang and Cheng Xiaoshi relationship:
As it stands in canon? Queerplatonic partners. And it's convenient for the plot that they're like this.
Because of Chinese censorship it can't be explicitly romantic, yes I know it. Let me tell why it's queerplatonic for me. The way these two have intertwined their lives and futures together?!
Owning a business and living together, that hint in ep2 (comparing them to the subtextually older lesbian couple who also came across as queerplatonic bc censure) where Xiaoshi wonders/fears if years down the line he and Lu Guang will separate/break up implying their partnership is for life as far as he's concerned (the parallel can be taken as a subtext romance too but follow me we're talking text), the way they were already going also on vacancies together three years prev in canon, etc...
Without entering on their complimentary powers and the way the dives need both of them if they want security in not screwing the past, and the inmense trust and vulnerability the dives themselves require?
They're not simply best friends either.
Those aren't the actions of normal, totally not queer friends. Cheng Xiaoshi checks out women on the dives, sure, (and men too when the host is feeling it which I love bc they can't address it directly bc censorship and then it comes across as Xiaoshi being super confident in his own relationship to sexuality/gender) but I don't think he would ever date bc Lu Guang is already there, filling that place in his life minus sex and romance but all that same companionship and intensity of feeling.
These two meet in what, the last year/s of High School and then proceeded to latch onto each other with a commitment reserved for romantic partners.
And I know you want to say, "it's the censorship! they'd be romantic and canon if not for the censorship!"
Are you sure? Are you sure the story would work if there were explicit romance in it? (I mean, if they could I'm pretty sure they would have nailed it anyways but allow me my a-spec delusions) Cheng Xiaoshi and Lu Guang feel so much like an already established pair, they work like one, and Link Click is not about them coming together like many other stories. Are you sure this would work as BL?
There's a distinct difference on the way they start the show already like six years at least since they're best friends and three or two since they live together. That's not usually how it goes. I'm talking not just romances but every buddy or nakama anime/show, where the protag has to learn to work with who will be his best friend or rival. These stories usually have the same kind of plot progression as a romance which is why they work so well when you make the subtext text.
But a story where the main romance is already established and we're following a plot that has nothing to do with it? Much more rare, even stranger to find them well done although there are some very good ones and with the friendships instead of romo they're more common. For example, Soul Eater, which is all about the trials of it and how they hace to truly come to understand each other. That's Link Click a bit, but not even then.
Link Click juggling a budding romance between Lu Guang and Cheng Xiaoshi with all the other stuff is going on?? Messier for sure. I don't know if people would have liked it as much or if the donghua would have been as well done.
As it is, Link Click has the exact level of emotional connection between our protags it needs to have incredibly high stakes emotionally and at the same time not need a detour by romantic scenes/fanservice that would derail the plot or the other charas importance. That it happens to be pretty queer anyways in a platonic way?
Nice for the aroace-spec folks watching the show xD
Btw, I'm pretty sure in season 3 we're going to get more of Lu Guang's PoV, the origins of their powers and the past between him and Xiaoshi. It'll probably dig more into the aspect of "testing their bond and coming stronger bc of it" which is were the romantic subtext usually comes through...
—unless you're very very good at writing like Arakawa in FMA, who nailed the brotherly relationship without tipping into incest subtext which I've seen more than a few writers fumble. or the latest D&D film for the platonic childrearing and partnership for a no familial example between a man and a woman also very very difficult to get right for writers dunno why—
... but until then, for now I'm incredibly satisfied by the canon.
The other read of course it that they're already a couple since well before the start of season 1, and to mentally edit what we saw in canon with that lens (it wouldn't be very difficult honestly) but reading only the text? Queerplatonic partners!
There also how Xiaoshi and Lu Guang don't have that anxiety/insecurity of their bond that makes it so easy to read the want for something, like a romance for shipping purposes. Despite the disagreements on the Dives or the trials of season 2 or Lu Guang keeping secret Cheng Xiaoshi future/past death they read very steady which is fun. I love some good established relationship, you can go to deeper places when the base is already secure and the risk is higher for the characters. Plus I love domesticity! Yes, I do my angsty/Gothic leanings notwithstanding. Don't you know you need a home for the Gothic to be effective?
#link click#meta#link click meta#lu guang#cheng xiaoshi#shiguang#my thoughts#all of this to say that I don't exactly ship them#Although I've been tagging fanart and meta with their shipname#bc I dont not ship them#honestly?#it's because despite it all I'm very much a canon girl so I can't help but see shiguang on that same romo-not romo limbo#canon present us with#loving the fics though#and Lu Guang is so tragic timetraveler for love coded is not funny#which is the reason I'm sure season 3 will give me that shift towards a more romantic lense to their relationship#also the way they made sure to sibling-fy qiao ling and cheng xiaoshi was fun XD#in conclusion: I think Link Click being a danmei wouldn't have worked#precisely bc it wasnt created as danmei the story as it is works almost perfectly#and right now Im not sure if I would want the romance at the expense of everything else the plot is doing#....qiang jin jiu did it well on the second half though#but it had the first part to go from a enemies-to-lovers and establishing the romance#I don't think I've seen a danmei start with a established romantic relationship bc the genre being a romance tells you that's#what's going to be centered#link click would had to be a just a time travel thriller with queer elements (which it is)#and I don't know#I'd love it but I bet we'll have lots of people annoyed/annoying bc they're here for the romance#Instead of taking the story for what it is#but then romance (queer romance) doesn't devalue the storytelling#ah the conflict of wanting a-spec queer stories VS censorship
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lemonavocado · 10 months ago
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i have many many thoughts about the portrayal of elizabeth (and henry) in adaptations of frankenstein and they need to be broadcasted immediately. feverish incoherent raving about this subject under the cut. tw for very brief mention of SA
so. elizabeth lavenza. by the time of the wedding, elizabeth is rather obviously portrayed to be just as morose and brooding as victor is, she just isn't as susceptible to episodes of mania and psychosis so it doesn't seem nearly as dramatic compared to victor's trauma. she's been through the gutter herself, being an orphan for starters, then being adopted into a family and having to assume the role of caregiver in the frankenstein family because of the coercion of her dead mother to not only take her place as the maternal figure in the family but also marry her surrogate brother (or literal cousin, depending on which version you read). then her surrogate younger brother william dies, and the within weeks she has to watch her closest heterosexual life partner justine be unjustly hung by a corrupt justice system. and she vocalizes, actively, her pessimism and hopelessness in light of these many tragedies. tldr she's fucked up and rightfully so, and while she's a little less crippled by depression than victor, she still has the distinct appearance of being rather ill, listless, and tired, especially towards the end of the novel. anyways my point is in the novel, the most important thing about elizabeth is not that she's a woman and victor's bride. yes, that's obviously the purpose she was created for, but shelley went out of her way to give elizabeth an extremely definite and unique character. she's gentle and maternal like most woman in early 19th century literature, but she's also introspective, intelligent, and perceptive. she displays agency and self-awareness repeatedly (her guilt over the locket, going to the execution of justine even when alphonse tells her not to, waxing poetic on the failures of the justice system, asking repeatedly and rather pointedly if victor actually wants to go through with the marriage, obvious anxiety and solemnity concerning the wedding) we also have to take into account that elizabeth's personality is being relayed to us BY VICTOR, and he wants to see elizabeth as docile and femininely passive, even if a lot of her actions themselves in the novel actually seem to contradict that. also, i am peppering in that many people can (and have) made a genuine and convincing argument that victor and elizabeth are not in love and were groomed to accept their union by their weirdo parents - that they care for each other, but the text includes important nuances that make it evident that victor doesn't feel anything for elizabeth like that. it is a legitimate interpretation of the book - dare i say it's the correct interpretation of the relationship between victor and elizabeth. but that's another essay for another day and it's not SUPER integral to my rant here today. it just highlights the complexity of elizabeth as a character.
so. for some fucking reason, writers do not understand this when they are adapting the novel, and do not want to apply more than eight seconds of critical thinking and the absolute shallowest 3rd grader levels of reading comprehension to this character, so they simplify her from what she was in the original novel, freshly complex, opinionated, and introspective to boring useless incest lady. victor is never portrayed with the same amount of nuance he deserves in any adaptation (also another essay for another day), because adaptations also have a very surface level reading of him as "guy who was ambitious and played god which immediately cements him as an irredeemable self-aggrandizing asshole and/or a raging insufferable narcissist who's a dick to everyone around him EXCEPT for elizabeth" but at least SOME adaptations are able to kiiinnnddaaaa capture the sympathy meant to be felt for the character in the novel. not so for elizabeth. her character in basically every adaptation can be boiled down to this: "omg victor my brother let me hammer in that you are my brother. im just going to stand here and look clueless and annoyingly naive for the entire time im on screen/stage. im just a little girl and idk what's going on victor but im gonna stay blindly devoted to you and ask numerous but completely useless questions 🥺 let me stare at you with tender worry in my eyes and treat you like a child even though we have absolutely no romantic chemistry and you're an objectifying dick towards me and we have nothing in common and the audience is actively dry heaving as we sensually make out for no other reason than to have characters in this movie sensually make out. im basically a carbon copy of original-novel-henry expect super boring and super useless because im a woman which means the doylist explanation for why im here HAS TO BE ONLY for the main character to fuck me and to hold the attention of the male viewership. now time for me to get SA'd by the creechur for basically no reason" we can observe something approximating this in basically every frankenstein adaptation i've ever seen: kenneth branagh's (my enemy) 1994 film, the 2004 hallmark miniseries, the musical, and the ballet. also in the 1931 film, but that one isn't really trying to be book-accurate so it doesn't really count for this rant.
with this understanding of elizabeth, writers then attempt to artificially generate more romance between these characters, mostly by, yes, replacing a lot of henry's role in the novel with elizabeth, hence why we see so many adaptations (1994, 2004, ballet) make elizabeth nurse victor back to health in ingolstadt instead of henry, which generates... so many problems. one problem with this is that it just sorta ruins henry's original role in the novel in one go. writers recognize that henry is supposed to be victor's character foil, but now they don't have much for him to do so he can demonstrate that role in the story since they gave all of the romantic tension moments to elizabeth. meaning that in adaptations you can tell the writers didn't really know what to do with henry because he's reduced to a comic relief bumbling idiot (1994, ballet, 2004 to an extent) with his only personality traits being "random xd" and "morals good playing god wrong!!!! 😠" (2004, musical, several independent stage adaptations). they keep him as a character foil, but just replace all of his compassion, tenderness, and devotion with elizabeth, while effectively draining henry of all of his original appeal and charm and stamping those traits onto their already stripped-of-all-nuance elizabeth. so now both henry and elizabeth are not only extremely different from their original roles in the novel but extremely, woefully less charming and complex. this especially pisses me off because it's explicitly stated in the book that henry was victor's only friend precisely because he was victor's intellectual equal, so seeing henry reduced to a smiley idiot and/or stupid generic male side character with Morals fills me with a visceral rage. writers will also sometimes make victor and henry meet in college (ballet, 1994) and try to strengthen the bond between victor and elizabeth by making it appear as though she was victor's ONLY childhood friend and companion. other times, victor and henry will be friends pre-ingolstadt (2004, musical) but most of the relationship development will be between elizabeth and victor. those two have all of the tender bonding moments while henry is just kinda inexplicably there sometimes. but i digress. this post is supposed to be about elizabeth. but IF YOU NEED A CHARACTER TO BE A SUNSHINE SOFT OPTIMISTIC LOVER FOR VICTOR IN A FRANKENSTEIN ADAPTATION, HENRY IS ABLE AND WILLING ARE YOU STEPPING ON MY BALLS
clervalstein is true. anyway
elizabeth is somehow more complex and powerful as a female character than the literal adaptations produced almost 200 years later. in adaptations, the most important thing about her is somebody else. the development of all of her character traits (which usually never go beyond standing around and looking helpless) are solely dependant on victor. she feels more like an appendage of the protagonist than an individual with thoughts and experiences separate from victor, and her character is loosely defined and flimsy so the writers can have her conform to her actions in the book whenever it's convenient and then change things up entirely that completely contradict her characterization in the book whenever it's convenient. i have no idea why the fuck this keeps happening with frankenstein adaptations (it's misogyny) and because it isn't looking like guillermo del toro's film (from what ive heard) is going to be super book accurate, i dont foresee too much of a shift in frankenstein adaptations.
look i get it. it's a movie/play/ballet which lasts like 2 hours and you have a lot to do and not a lot of time to do it. i understand you have to make sacrifices for brevity and these characters are, frankly, a lot less interesting and exciting than victor and creechur. people didn't come to see john hughes levels of charm and complexity in the side characters, they came to watch the creechur do scary shit and for victor to say IT'S ALIVE 😱 and be an evil mad scientist you love to hate. they came for their values of "it's wrong to play god!!!" and "too much ambition bad!!!" to be re-cemented even though that's not even the original point of the novel. which is why imo if you're going to adapt frankenstein in a manner that does justice to the beautiful and sublime subtlety of the original novel, it needs to be either a miniseries or a REALLY LONG film. it's a short book, but it's very eventful, and imo for an adaptation to work you have to let the audience sit with it. which is why you all need to donate to my gofundme so i can produce an honest to god frankenstein adaptation. in fact, im running for president in this year's primaries :3
just a disclaimer: im not an academic or a scholar or anything. i just like the book. i probably have no idea what the fuck im talking about. but im a very very passionate little guy and this has been my rant
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tallerthantale · 22 days ago
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It seems to be confirmed that Season 3 is now going to be a 90 minute finale with Gaiman no longer having an active role in any element of the ongoing production work. We still don't know if Gaiman was removed via the enforcement of a morality clause, or if he leveraged a behind the scenes deal to be paid off to leave voluntarily without monkey wrenching the IP. We still don't know if Amazon is going to publicly acknowledge the allegations.
I think it is important to separate the distinct decisions involved. Amazon hypothetically could have done a full 3rd Season without Gaiman, assuming the shift wasn't a component of a legalistic compromise negotiation with him. The decision to shorten it was not made as a form of accountability against him, nor does it particularly accomplish that. Amazon's ongoing lack of comment is probably because they still believe it is in their best business interest to keep the allegations as quiet as they can.
My current read on Amazon's behaviour is that they are 'splitting the baby' in an incredibly frustrating way. When things go off the rails this close to the start of filming a huge amount of money has already been invested into production that can't get clawed back. It looks to me like Amazon is trying to make as much of the show as they can while operating almost exclusively off of sunk costs and scrapping the remainder, with little regard to quality, on the assumption that it will flop either way. I'd rather see them publicly denounce Gaiman and make a full 3rd Season without him. If they did so and it was successful, that could demonstrate that it is a financially viable option for them to expose abusers in the industry and show them the door.
It looks like instead of either a summary canceling or a public salvaging, we have a mangled finale with the allegations half under a rug because Amazon is trying to have it both ways. They aren't taking a stand on the allegations, they aren't trying to make a successful post Gaiman resolution of the show, they are quietly liquidating their assets. I am optimistic that the shift to a 90 minute finale will draw more coverage of the allegations, but I'm not going to give Amazon credit for that.
My current inclination is to personally stay in 'not promoting the show' mode until Amazon meaningfully comments, or until after the show is finished and no longer a new release. I want to work towards a world where shows that remove people can be shown to be successful after doing so, but Amazon appears to be setting itself up to learn the wrong lesson. If the finale is being set up to fail, that won't stop them from deciding that it failed due to the allegations, and continuing to decide maintaining silence is good business. If the finale is a success they can still tell themselves their silence was part of why.
I'm not sabre rattling about it though. And to anyone reading this who still has a lot of motivation to try to suppress fandom engagement, please consider instead directing that energy towards spreading IRL awareness of the allegations, which is still very low. Streaming residuals are miniscule compared to book sales and publishing deals. Getting the word out in offline communities will make far more of a difference than marginally reducing the amount of fan works created for a show Gaiman is no longer working on by arguing with people who already know and already care. Let people be disappointed the show is truncated. That disappointment is not an endorsement of Gaiman.
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Note
I see you very much as an expert on all things Rohirrim, so I bring to you this question, hoping I can pick your brain for info to use in my own fics (full disclosure). 😅
It seems to be a popular fanon that the Rohirrim/Riders of Rohan have tattoos, and that body art is a part of their culture. Do you have any thoughts or personal HCs about this that you're willing to share?
Thank you in advance! I appreciate you and your blog so much (if you didn't already know that).
Oh my goodness!!! I am so very honored to be thought of as a person who is knowledgeable about my beloved Rohirrim, and I hope very much that I can live up to that reputation. Thank you!!!
I’m not aware of any real textual evidence for body art among the Rohirrim, and the historical record in the medieval Anglo Saxon and Norse societies that Tolkien used as a reference for them seems to be disputed. But I absolutely understand and agree with the conventional wisdom that tattoos are a thing in Rohan. It just fits well with a warrior culture that has a wilder, dare-I-say more pagan aesthetic as compared to the smooth solemnity of Gondor or the formal elegance of the elves. And since they’re a culture that doesn’t document things in written words, pictorial representations such as tattoos and body art would be one way to fill that gap (along with their songs and oral traditions).
In my mind, tattoos in Rohan are common but basic—they’ve really only got the technology for the “stick and poke” method so the designs are kept simple because anything too elaborate is difficult to pull off well. They’re mostly in black line (using soot) but some have color using powder made from grinding up certain dried roots and plants.
Each village/community has its own distinctive tattoo motif that is worn by all of that community’s members. So you can tell just by looking at someone whether they’re from Upbourn (a fish because it’s a river town) or Dunharrow (mountain peaks since they’re in the White Mountains) or Everholt (a boar in honor of the wild boar that live in this part of the Firien Wood), etc. And soldiers also tend to share tattoo designs specific to their éored—getting your éored’s mark is a formal rite of passage for the younger members when they first get assigned to their company. These shared tattoo designs are important both for group cohesion and as a means of identifying fallen Rohirrim even if the deceased isn’t known to whoever finds the body.
Beyond these ritualized and practical functions, I do also like to think that there are some purely decorative tattoos among them as a means of personal expression and/or to help cover small scars that so many Rohirrim have from battle, riding accidents or other mishaps. Obviously horse-based designs would be very popular, as well as other flora and fauna of Rohan. But they’re a very sentimental people and so I think little emotional signifiers would also be very common (again, especially because they generally don’t have a means to pay tribute to beloved people/things in written form, this sort of symbol would serve the purpose of making some kind of record of those tributes).
In terms of specific people in my head canon: Éomer has a little simbelmynë blossom for each of the major figures in his life that he’s lost (forearm). Háma had a sun to remind him of his wife, who brought warmth and light to his life (shoulder). Théodred had stars in the shape of a particular constellation that is visible every year on his mother’s birthday (chest). Éowyn has a representation of her father’s sword (left wrist) and gets a quill (right wrist) to represent Faramir after they get married. (Faramir got a little running horse in her honor on his first trip to Rohan. He was glad he did it, but he never wants to sit through that again.)
Merry brought tattooing back to the Shire when he showed up with a tobacco pipe on his bicep (both for its association with Buckland and in tribute to Théoden, whose last words to Merry were about smoking together someday when peace was restored). Unsurprisingly, tattoos did not catch on with the other hobbits, but Merry remains very proud of it.
Anywayyyy…I hope that was in any way helpful! Thanks so much for asking!! I remain a huge fan and am so grateful to you for helping convince me to put some of my thoughts and stories out there vs keeping them all in the confines of my own Google drive!
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lloydfrontera · 1 year ago
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this is like. so non-important compared to all my other grievances with the webcomic but like. the reasons kim hyunsoo gives for changing javier's hair from silver to mint. lol. lmao even.
they're so,, lazy,,,,
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that sounds like a skill issue my dude :/
i mean the novel illustrations did it perfectly well imo
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'but nali' i hear you say 'those are novel illustrations, where there's only one drawing per chapter. of course it's more difficult to do in a webcomic'
and sure. you're right. it's very different in a webcomic. in fact i am almost certain that no webcomic has ever had a protagonist with silver hair.
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not a single webcomic ever has done that before. truly. a completely unrealistic expectation to have.
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really it's not like silver hair is one of the most popular tropes in manhwa and almost every other webcomic has one of those
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clearly. this was a completely impossible thing to ask of an adaptation. it's not like it's one of the most iconic parts of our protagonist's design. it's not like it's mentioned almost every single time javier is onscreen.
really. what a truly necessary change.
which. speaking of.
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now, correct me if i'm wrong. but shouldn't your deuteragonist, the very first character your character meets, your second main character's design,,, more important than a secondary character that isn't introduced like,,, more than a hundred episodes later???
like. i don't think we even get told what color lloyd's hair is. but god does the novel mention that habiel has silver hair every five minutes.
i'm sorry i just think that if you're gonna adapt something the very least thing you could do is try to be faithful to one of the very few character descriptions we ever get! especially that of your goddamn main character!
how come a secondary character takes precedence over him?? why not change that character's hair color then???
and even then. if your character design skills suck so much that two characters having the same hair color is enough to make them look too similar perhaps there's a bigger problem here.
i just,,,, i am almost certain i know what character he's speaking of. maybe even two characters. hell maybe even three. but fucking guess what. the webnovel illustrations already did designs for those characters. it gave them all silver hair. and there was No Issue at all because their designs were so distinct from one another that at no point was there any doubt of who was who. because that's what good character design is about.
like. that's such a stupid reason oh my godddd if you're gonna pull that bs then what's your excuse for all those other characters with brown hair. are you not worried they're gonna overlap because their hair color is the same. i mean you made silurian's brown hair darker so now it matches like 90% of your background characters. do their design not overlap like that.
i'm just!! it's such a stupid thing to get mad about!! especially when there's far more egregious changes being made but like!! it just,,, it shows the kind of attitude the people adapting tged into a webcomic have towards the source material
it's not about the hair color. i mean it is but there's more to it. it's about how the artists feel comfortable disregarding parts of the novel and canon because it's more convenient to them. it's about how they prefer to focus on unimportant stuff that gets them a few laughs rather than put a little bit of effort into getting their characters right. it's about how they waste entire panels into making ugly faces and repetitive jokes rather than take a bit of time to get the hair color of their protagonist correctly.
it is,, disappointing i guess :/
and because i'm petty. here.
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that's literally it. that's all kim hyunsoo had to do. it's such a tiny detail and yet. couldn't be bothered to get it right lol
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starlostlix · 5 months ago
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Moriarty the Patriot and Brotherhood
(Adam and Sam Whiteley vs The Holmes Brothers vs The Moriarty Brothers)
[that's a lot of brothers, especially since I don't even have a brother. So, another analysis! This is a long one that's been in my drafts for ages but since my exams are over I can reread and post it lmao]
Brotherhood is a key theme of Moriarty the Patriot, with many examples in the story. Some are quite similar, some are kind of different (looking at you Holmes brothers) but all are important.
First to talk about the slight outlier, the Holmes brothers. Whilst many of the other examples of brotherhood show close and caring dynamics among family, the Holmes brothers seem not only very distant but in conflict with one another. Sherlock and Mycroft Holmes live very different lives. The elder is a close associate of Queen Victoria and is, essentially, 'the government'. He has huge power over the empire's inner workings, enough to set up secret divisions like MI6. He speaks with a stereotypical 'posh' accent used by the nobility and lives much like the nobility in some ways. Sherlock, however, is a consulting detective who struggles to pay rent, struggles to clean, has to wait for cases and seems much more 'immature'. He also keeps his distinctive cockney accent - a reminder of his mother and working class upbringing. And my personal favourite distinction - Mycroft consistently wearing a bow tie compared to Sherlock's almost absolute refusal to do so (and him never doing up the buttons all the way to the top) - a detail that I just find really fun. Sherlock often accuses his brother of cosplaying nobility and the two seem to barely speak, and when they do there's clear animosity between the two. It may be because they feel so different from one another that they don't feel able to connect with one another now.
There is, however, hints that they are more similar than you first think. They both share the ability of good deduction and attention to detail. They both put an emphasis on protection of others - whether it be Mycroft protecting British Empire secrets (and his brother from.. women?) or Sherlock trying to protect Irene Adler from execution. And despite their animosity, it is clear that they do care for one another - Mycroft's reaction to Sherlock's 'd3ath' is a good example of this (he is clearly distraught but tries not to show it). They also both get themselves involved in the Moriarty plan (although that's less their fault and more the Moriarty brothers choosing them), and also both interact closely with the Moriarty family (sherlock with William and Mycroft with Albert).
Their definition of brotherhood is more strained in comparison to others, and for some people can be considered more realistic. To them, brotherhood can be both an annoyance or something nice depending on perspective. In particular, Mycroft seems to look out for Sherlock more than Sherlock does for Mycroft (or himself really). Whilst Mycroft sees brotherhood as another duty like his loyalty to the crown, Sherlock sees Mycroft's care for him as somewhat limited.
[Mycroft and Sherlock are really interesting in the way they interact and act about each other, like I read volume 15 recently and the funeral and Mycroft still drinking the tea that Miss Hudson recommended for when you feel down means he's still grieving 3 years later i'm so sad]
The Whiteley brothers are distinct in their difference in age. Adam is an adult, old enough to be an MP, whereas Sam is likely a teenager. This creates a dynamic where the elder is very very protective of the younger, especially due to Sam being wheelchair-bound. Part of the reason Adam is pushing for equality and changing the world for the better is so Sam can have a better life, with more accessibility like the park Adam designed. This is, of course, all the more tragic when Sam is murdered by Sturridge, an action that causes Adam to murder in revenge and give up on his own plans to make the world a better place. Adam, in response to Sam's death, says "What point is there to changing the world if you aren't here to enjoy it?" It is clear that to Adam, Sam's safety and enjoyment of life takes precedence over his own. No matter the reaction he would face from other MPs and the press and the house of lords, Adam would have kept going and made sure his bill was pushed through. For Sam. But that opportunity is taken from him, as Sam's life is taken too soon.
Brotherhood, for Adam, is protecting his brother and making the world a better place for him. Whilst we don't get to see Sam's point of view much, it is likely that care and support for Adam is Sam's idea of brotherhood. Even in death, all Adam can think about is making the world a better place and finding Sam again.
[this part feels devastating they actually make me so sad they are incredibly tragic]
Then we finally get to the main focus of the story - The Moriarty Brothers. What's most interesting about them to me is that, despite the fact that not all of them are blood related (as Albert isn't directly related to William or Louis), they seem to have the closest bond. One thing about brotherhood for them is that it's not limited to blood relation - it's about the bond they have as both family and accomplices. I have to stage this in 2 parts to explore this well - William, Louis and Albert, as well as William and Louis specifically.
1) William, Louis and Albert - Albert was the one that gave William and Louis a new home and a new life. He took them in when no one else would care for them, and supported their ideas of making the world better when no one else would. Their bond is defined by their shared desires, shared secrets and shared crimes (starting with the Moriarty household fire), rather than blood relations. And they're very protective and focused on helping one another. Albert being willing to go to prison for the Lord of Crime plans is proof of this. Albert is part of their chosen family which you could say also includes people like Moran and Fred. Albert is shown to care deeply for William in particular due to him being the mastermind of the plans and Albert's role in MI6 is usually surrounding in taking missions that are useful for William's goals. There are limited interactions between just Louis and Albert, but they also are presented to care deeply for each other.
2)William and Louis - these two are related and have a history before they met Albert. Louis' heart condition causes William to be protective of him (kind of like how Adam Whiteley is with Sam) and sometimes this can seem a bit too overprotective. Louis seems to have a strong desire to prove himself useful to William, and views William as a reason for him to live (and eventually to go on after William's 'd3ath'). Sometimes it can feel like because he's so wrapped up in William's goals and is quite reliant on him at times, Louis hasn't had the chance to fully develop his own identity and life outside of his brotherhood. William's view of brotherhood is seemingly about protection, but to Louis his brother is his closest person, his world and the only person that makes him feel that his existence is right. This is why his role as Em after the Tower Bridge incident is so important for him as a chance to grow on his own and lead, establishing a new moral code and system for the team. It isn't that William held him back, but that Louis felt so indebted and attached to William that he struggled to find meaning elsewhere. In this way, the strength of his reliance on his brother feels like it restricts him, but his commitment to his brother is also a strength. He sees William's compassion and other positive qualities in a way not many others do (besides the Moriarty group and the Holmes') once he's revealed as the Lord of Crime, and it is that insight that leads him to do whatever he can to save his brother, so much as wanting to convince his supposed rival to try and help him. Louis acknowledges his own selfishness in going against William's plans, but this is also out of such deep compassion for his brother that it shows us how he's such a committed and caring person. Louis wants to help William just as much as William wants to protect Louis.
[the more I talk about Louis the more i realise just how interesting he is to talk about thematically especially his dynamic with William... I've got to make more character centred posts]
So I feel that these differing variations on the way brotherhood is presented really adds to the characterisation of the people on the story and to the world itself. To me it's meant to feel somewhat realistic (despite its fictional characters) because of its historical basis on the empire and 19th century London and its social structure - the differing ways brotherhood is defined can add to this. It's such a central theme that I don't feel enough is said about (and general sibling representation is also big in the series but brotherhood in particular stands out due to the majority male character base, especially within the main characters).
[I told you this was a long one, this may have been in the drafts for around a month that I kept adding to so it's been a while in the making. Since my exams are over I have a lot more I want to do here, including casual reviews and highlight of a few trips i'm going on alongside this style of post so hopefully those will be enjoyable too! Anyways I hope this post was interesting and maybe well written it was hard to read all this over after a month and many exams]
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snowingclouds · 4 months ago
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I need to yap about Prototype, specifically Alex's change in Prototype 2:
Obviously, heavy prototype 2 spoilers:
What the fuck happened, man?!?!? In the first game, sure, the dude is willing to kill on sight. There's a civilian death counter. The scene after the Greene boss fight? That was so good. He didn't care, just slammed her ass. Anyways: despite all this, he sounds remorseful and dealing with some tangled up shit, yk? There's a line in the helicopter mission where he shouts "Damn you! Damn you for making me do this!" Like, hello? This virus in the shape of some dude can and does feel remorse and turmoil! He hijacked a helicopter to make sure the city didn't explode, and nearly died in the process.
But then comes Prototype 2:
And suddenly Alex is all about infecting everyone and their mother, spreading his virus, and has Blackwatch in his pocket through his Evolved. No remorse, no care for anyone anymore. Isn't there supposed to be like a 2 year difference between the first outbreak and Prototype 2?? Did he just lose his marbles in that time? Did the nuke scramble his brain a bit? Like, what happened??
I get that Alex is a mass murdering, people eating, viral biomass with Mercer's face, but I keep thinking back to the helicopter mission in the first game. His VA sounds like his whole body was put into that line, and it takes place even after he finds out the truth of everything (except Cross, for the time being).
Heller and him have a very similar "kill on sight" rage that I think makes the games fun, and comparing the two between games, theres so many parallels. It's just odd how Mercer has this 180 behavior.
Tbh, I don't mind prototype 2. Without it, we wouldn't have a boss fight with Heller calling Mercer an "emo fuck" and "bitch" like five times. I totally did not get my shit rocked the first time I tried that fight and kept thinking "James shut your mouth I'm getting bodied here". But all in all, it was fun. I think it would be more fun to explore their relationship considering Heller was military and trusted Blackwatch so deeply. Mercer (before Blacklight) knew shit was going down, and then Blacklight/Alex is immediately hunted by Blackwatch and literally eats his way through the ranks. They could've had so much potential for distrust and betrayal on a deeper level than just "muhahaha! Infect the town!", you know?
And another smaller thing:
In prototype one, there's a thing about how Alex isn't Mercer anymore. He has his face, but he's actually just the virus, and Mercer has been dead a while. They're two separate but not people. See the whole thing about "I'm not human, I never was". But in prototype 2, James doesn't have that same thing happen. The whole time, every one of the Evolved seem to be infected people, not people that the virus is wearing as a face, and that's an important distinction. Maybe not so important when you're slaughtering Evolved, but in the scenes with Heller and Maya? That's pretty fucking important. Maya is scared of him at first, and I don't think we're given enough of Heller's thoughts during that. Yeah, he looks distraught in that scene, but imagine how much more so it would've been if they re-explored the whole "not human virus wearing a face" thing some more, especially in relation to his kid.
And sure; maybe it doesn't matter. Maybe even Heller's internal thoughts would've been "who cares" as long as he has the memories of Heller and took off right where he left off, but I still would've really liked to see that come up again.
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