#discussions of discrimination

[fumifooms]

do you happen to have that page that talks about the beauty standards of each race?

Yeah sure. While scavenging pics for this I found this neat reddit compilation & chart & theory talk too. I had um, way more to say than I anticipated (I know you only wanted the one page. I have nothing to say for myself. Like most topics in Dunmeshi things snowball because they’re so interconnected. Mercy…) so, many races and observations are only mentioned near the bottom.

Beauty standards and race in Dungeon Meshi

Not pictured there’s also how elven society is harsh on visibly disabled people, and how the demon took away Mithrun’s silver eyes and ears to take away his pride. There’s also how Senshi might have fit in with the orcs more easily because of the dwarven wide body shape, and how they tend to have more body hair too I suppose. In the extra on orcs we see Senshi living with the orcs and he gets judged because of the hierarchy rather than his looks.

What is fashionable also differs from culture to culture, and there’s how tattoos only seem common with elves, though dwarves and others do also sometimes have some. They seem to not raise much brows, which makes sense since for many essentially they’re for professional (magical) purposes especially with elves. Gender roles also differ in type and importance, but generally they are similar to irl ones for the races we see. Elven society seems to be the least gendered, which would be an unsurprising logical outcome of having lesser sexual dimorphism aka they look more androgynous. Comparing fashions and gender roles and how they affect beauty standards would be a whole other compilation and conversation. Kui has great worldbuilding partially because she’s got such a good grasp on sociopolitics and geopolitics. History affects cultures and beauty standards greatly. Kui’s oneshot Distant Utopia was very eye opening on her way to worldbuild and the consideration she gives these things, I do really recommend reading it.

Out of the big 5, we know the least about gnomes, but their sheet does say both culture and region are similar to dwarves’ and they end up being confused together often, so we can imagine the beauty standards are similar to dwarves’ as well.

I wanted to touch on this in a post eventually, but how one daydream hour page said half-foots tended to be curvaceous like in the artwork below puzzled me for a long time, all the half-foot characters we see during canon are rather slender and lanky after all, Chil’s succubi also being more curvy than plump. Economics are for sure a factor in that I imagine, the half-foots characters we see are all implied to be some flavor of poor or malnourished, as are half-foots depicted as empoverished oppressed minorities in general. Even comparing the artwork with the half-foot sheet’s depicted average half-foot, the ones on the left seem bigger. Wouldn’t it make sense though, if unlike dwarves half-foots don’t have similar naturally wide bodies, yet due to idolizing dwarves they work towards having a similar body shape/type to emulate them?

It’s said half-foots tend to stick to pretty ethnically homogeneous regions (aka half-foots-only communities) unless they move to the big city with ambition to try and make it big (like Chilchuck and his wife & kids did), and that’s interesting imo because then that would mean that in a ton of half-foot communities, they rarely see or interact with dwarves whom they try to emulate. Of course, one thing about beauty standards is that when they get adopted, at one point it stops being "this is how dwarves look and so this is how half-foots should look" and just becomes "this is how half-foots should look", most people feel as though beauty standards aren’t learned but innate, so I figure the half-foots wouldn’t have any problem still seeking dwarvish traits when there are no dwarves around.

There’s also stuff you can glean here and there if you want to extrapolate more. Like how in the race swap artworks, Mickbell is only smiling in the dwarf portrait, and Rin’s elven portrait looks very close to her elven one- Rin who is stated to be beautiful in her profile blurb. Benichidori’s extra does teach us tallmen can definitely have harsh beauty standards, but also since the text portrays her as very dysmorphic that’s likely reflected in her thoughts to a much more intense degree than is common, not an accurate strict baseline to go off. Ah, Kabru’s blue eyes are also why he and his mother lived a rough life in Kabru’s hometown, but that seems to be regional. Good post here on the topic of Kabru’s blue eyes and ties to irl history. There’s a lot to be said about Kabru being a man that in many ways is close to elven beauty standards, and how that might have affected or been affected by his upbringing with elves + his persona as someone that can effortlessly charm most people. Marcille’s section here in this essay also goes into Marcille’s struggles to fit in with the ideal image of an elf.

Looking human

Also notable are beastkins and demihumans: Demihumans are all dehumanized which makes people treat them worse. So if you differ from the visual idea of "human" (an in-world subjective categorization just as much as demihuman is) most people do judge you negatively. Elves and dwarves get to fight about which type of human is considered the prettiest, but demihumans are below tallmen and half-foots, they are considered as simply below the beauty contest, incompatible with it.

Onis are perhaps the demihuman people we know of with the least cultural influence on the dunmeshi world, and with the least intensely different appearance than other demihumans—they seem to be technically categorized as human to people not from the eastern archipelago?— but even them are treated as lesser than human, treated as beasts to slain for reputation points or useful strength to have around and command. It’s said their "magnificient horns" and fangs are often shaven off when the oni lives in tallman towns, so you could easily make the argument that onis are denied the right to have their own beauty standards, having to conform to other people’s and going through mutilation to take away features they might otherwise have taken pride in. Inutade was bought by the Nakamotos from a dangerous sumo fighting ring that got one of Inutade’s tooth broken on her first and only fight, and kept as a low ranking servant ever since. Remember when I said different fashions existed in dunmeshi and how those could also affect beauty standards? Like the elves, if you look at the portraits pages which include a lot of characters that aren’t in the story you can see distinct cultures within the same races, for example one young elf is bald which is in sharp contrast with the usual elven long luscious hairstyles, and that’s especially true for onis I think. Maybe not only from different regions but different eras as well… They have a bit of population in the very north of the western continent, so I like to think some of the ogres live in very cold, maybe even subarctic or arctic conditions. The point I’m getting at here is that within a race, culture/ethnicity like with Kabru will also influence them it isn’t just tallmen as a whole, different communities will have differing beauty standards. The oni history blurb and third row first collumn portrait remind me of Mongolia (which historically was a lot of different nomadic communities with different cultural identities as well. Something something, the oni empire experienced a decline and then tallmen overpowered them, and now they’re governed and split apart by stronger social classes & slavers and the richness of culture was hurt for it especially if they have no real community left of their own), but obviously many of them are dressed and look rather japanese, makes sense considering living in/close to Wa, and first row second collumn portrait reminds me of ainus which again would be logical considering geographical placement, though I’m far from an expert. Interestingly, ainus are indigenous people both in Japan and Russia- Perhaps the northern western continent ogres are meant to be closer to Russia than Canada like I imagined? Ok tangent over.

The kobold sheet says they’re especially sought after as slaves because they’re "adorable", but locally in the western continent they’re repeatedly said to be seen more as ferocious and dangerous. The dehumanization is most apparent in the first comic below. The language barrier and conflicts no doubt worsen this by a lot, but I think it’d be hard to deny that their canine appearance makes the dehumanization worse. "They’re ferocious beasts, they’re demihumans, they can’t be communicated with". Most characters in Dungeon Meshi’s world are desensitized to slavery and most characters are prejudiced one way or another. Point being, kobolds are fully removed from human beauty standards, but no doubt for kobolds, other kobolds are more beautiful than humans are. They’re assumed to be an uncivilized bunch, but just like any other people they like to adorn themselves with nice clothes and jewelry and keep themselves clean and groomed; they too take care of their appearance and take pride in it.

And the orcs! This one we have the most contact with in canon, with not only there being foreigner characters from the ethnicity or hearsay of their homelands and culture but full on contact with a community. We get to see up close what they’re like and what they think, and of course in turn they’re our introduction to how demihumans are harshly looked down upon and seen as inferior, less human and thus less worth valuing and less dignified. It’s text that orcs are ugly to most humans and humans are ugly to most orcs. Since I judged they didn’t need accompanying explanation the pictures showing this are in the pictures dump at the top.

God forbid you sell vegetables to orcs my god- but then again they do basically mandate adventurers to kill any orcs they come across so yeah the world isn’t above that even a little bit.

So yes, my main point here is simply that orcs are yet another evidence of the physical ideal of "human" being an important beauty standard for human societies globally.

Izutsumi is our glimpse at how beastkins are treated in the world, and in Wa at least that’s ending up being caged and mistreated as part of a freak show. Izutsumi hates her appearance and wishes she could leave the feline part of herself behind to only be human. Interestingly, not that we have a lot of info on them so this is very much a take with a grain of salt situation, but there seems to be less stigma around artificial beastmen, those who can shapeshift at will. The main difference is of course appearance, that most of the time they simply look like average tattooed humans. Artificially creating humans is an illegal practice, and no doubt it’s not well regarded, but being able to hide that makes them less likely to be discriminated at any moment, or even just discriminated less intensely. Again, looking human is important, not only for belonging but for safety’s sake. Beauty standards rule the world with harsh hands.

Mermaids and fishmen

Ok we’re done now right? Right-! But wait… Wait…! Mermaids and fishmen are said to be demihumans too, special separate cases to the main three demihuman species however, which is also represented by how mermaids and fishmen both are in the Adventurer’s Bible chapter Monsters meanwhile ogres, kobolds and orcs are in the chapter World. They’re an interesting topic because they directly tackle this topic, not only in a meta way for the readers but also making characters themselves struggle to quantify their humanity with the goal of knowing wether they should be eaten or not, especially Chilchuck. Chilchuck’s "is it really just a matter of feelings?" mini arc.

The party asking themselves "Should we eat this?" is very common, and often they end up playing a little loose on morality, like eating the red dragon’s meat despite it having digested Falin. Not unsimilarly Marcille freaks out a little over the vegetables they harvested having been grown with fertilizer, aka largely human poo. Half of the motivation of "should we eat this perhaps sentient creature" is out of consideration and compassion, but more strongly and more often, the characters struggle with a sense of taboo at eating something too closely related to humans. Even, feel uncomfortable because of the deepseated impression that eating it would dirty them in some way. Cannibalism is an interesting and relevant topic in many ways, but what I want to mention is how there’s the more or less universal belief that committing cannibalism inherently taints you as a person and turns you more monstrous, morally but also literally depending on some myths such as w*ndigos and onis in some cases, like in Touge Oni. Marcille and Izutsumi both express a fear of eating monsters turning them monstrous. Maybe this is part of what Laios was hoping for, honestly. There are two fears here, if eating a demihuman monster constitutes as cannibalism or not, and so, will eating it taint you because it’s a human, or will eating it taint you because it’s a monster? You are what you eat, until it’s a little too literal. You morally are the means by which you get your food, and you physically are the result of your nutrition. Dungeon meshi manages to mix an exploration of humanity with the theme of food because our relationship to food is very deep and complex, psychological as much as physiological.

In the end, the characters sort of shrug and accept that they’ll never quite understand the world of mermaids and fishmen and how they operate, and what that means about them. Laios is the one always challenging these notions other characters take for granted, it’s not obvious to Laios why people are softer on mammals than other animals and plants, it’s not obvious to Laios why people would be afraid of eating a monster just because it’s a monster, it’s not obvious to Laios why some food is gross to Marcille but not fish testicles, it’s not obvious to Laios why you should immediately regard orcs and kobolds badly.

"Cows are probably closer to humans [aka closer to being human] than fishmen, though they’re clearly intelligent", dehumanization to lessen empathy towards them to be able to eat them. Meanwhile, mermaids seemingly have a less noticeable "civilization" or intelligence, they hunt in groups like fishmen, but they don’t use tools and such, they feel more primal and similarly instinct driven, and yet… Do they attract sympathy more? Mammals, humans, is it because of their nature or because of their appearance?

Both the nature and appearance of fish are ones people don’t typically sympathize with. "Fish don’t feel pain", "goldfish only have 5 seconds of memory", "it’s okay to keep fish in completely empty bowls too small for them until they die from it", so many lies and misconceptions exist that make people less considerate of them. The average lifespan of a goldfish is 10-15 years, the record is 43, but they’re not seen as lives that really matter, so a lot of goldfish die in a few weeks of bad aquarium conditions. There’s a lot of research on animals evolving to look cute and appealing to make some predators want to kill them less and parents want to care for them more, including humans. First good google research result gave me this credible short article on the topic. In Chilchuck’s weighing wether a fishman is far enough from being human or not to eat, "face is 100% fish" is his biggest argument for it being more acceptable. The face, the most important thing for empathy and recognition. The face, the decapitated fishman one that falls into his hands next chapter.

To quote @room-surprise: "Chilchuck can't explain why it's wrong to eat the merpeople, even though it's NOT complicated. But the problem is Chilchuck would have to accept and acknowledge that the merpeople might be people? And that's outside of the worldview he passively believes, so he can't just say that, because he doesn't think that's true. But that IS why he "feels" it's wrong. And it's all you'd need to say for Laios to understand! But it would require acknowledging that maybe the way they're treating and talking about the merpeople is wrong."

The idea of Chil not being able to grapple with how maybe some monsters are more humans than they seem, him who had been an advocate of half-foots rights, half-foots who get undermined and treated as inconsequential sacrifices… Grappling with how he could relate to the merpeople’s situation almost, and pulling away because it’s so existentially horrifying. I do not want to see myself into an hostile fish-faced warrior I can’t communicate with. In a way this also relates to Chilchuck being the only party member who doesn’t see Izutsumi as a cat in the relationship chart, the only one to treat her with full human dignity. He knows the struggle to be taken seriously, he knows being infantilized and he knows what it’s like to be treated as less than human.

Below, you will see Chilchuck draws the line of where they become not okay to eat as when "they already look like mermaids". Above, there’s speculation that the algae hair is partly to mimic "the mermaids’ beautiful female form". Is it because mermaids are their enemies and the ambiguity might give them extra seconds to attack or flee? Is it to trick adventurers instead? It’s striking to me that this is what works, with the adventurers. Sure the fishmen are intelligent, but explicitly here, what makes them no longer acceptable prey to Chilchuck is that they look close enough to a mermaid, close enough to human. Mermaids who of course themselves have this form to entice and seduce and charm the adventurers they prey on. Chilchuck considers the intelligence due to the tridents, but most of his internal debate centers around their appearance, and the image of a fishman skewered sickens him. The power of mimicry… Mimic being a beautiful human woman. Mimic being cute, babies being wired to make us feel protective and softened. Half-foots, sometimes pretending to be children for scams or help or avoiding trouble.

The mermaids are only concerned by their differences and not their similarities, and have no trouble treating the fishmen as food rather than peers. To an outside perspective like us, the audience, all these categorization of "more human" and "less human" between onis and orcs and elves and tallmen etc seem stupid and unfounded, but to the people living in Dungeon Meshi’s world, elves may as well be mermaids while onis are fishmen, not alike at all, unworthy of empathy and thus fine to eat.

Ultimately, Dungeon Meshi promotes unity. It’s about seeking to understand the unknown and the misunderstood, the dehumanized and the inhuman. It shows the good that comes from seeking to understand what you do not, even when that’s one another.

[aroaceleovaldez]

one of the things that I found particularly interesting in Demigods of Olympus is that it finally gives the best direct comparison we've seen so far between Percy and another character's experiences in terms of academics and particularly ableist discrimination.

The way Zane describes his experiences and what we see in his POV is that, while he is similarly discriminated against for his "atypical" behavior and blame is placed on him, the only sorts of punishments he receives for this are relatively benign, such as an increase in counseling. (It is also notable that Zane is somewhat autistic-coded, such as having the "incorrect" scripts when speaking with adults and Sam explicitly reminding him to remember to make proper eye contact.) Percy, on the other hand, similarly experiences discrimination for "atypical" behavior, but whereas Zane is treated as "too smart for his own good" and given slaps on the wrist, Percy is automatically labeled as aggressive, destructive, and a trouble-maker based on preconceived assumptions about him and is more severely punished, such as being frequently expelled.

We rarely get this level of direct comparison between Percy's experiences and that of another character, particularly such similar experiences, so looking at the differences is really interesting to gauge what their different experiences with ableist discrimination is like - and how it could potentially tie into intersectionality and other forms of discrimination at play for them.

For instance, Zane's parents are generally heavily implied to be middle-class and/or generally financially secure, versus Percy who grew up poor, so it could be classism in combination with ableist discrimination. Alternatively, it could be intersectionality with racial discrimination, as neurodivergent behavior in people of color is significantly more likely to be punished more severely and labeled as aggressive or disruptive behavior due to racist preconceptions - particularly since we know Percy's experiences with ableist discrimination are also somewhat based on assumptions people make regarding his appearance. Both Zane and Percy are racially ambiguous - Zane's appearance essentially being completely unspecified, but Percy at least having some notable details such as having a deep tan complexion. If not racism, it could also be colorism, which in this context often has similar intersectionality. There's a lot of potential options.

It's just very interesting to me! I love having such a direct point of comparison to examine the experiences of two characters within.

[kiruliom]

can we stop the belief that terfs hate transfems exclusively or like more than they hate cisgender men or transmascs and pretending it's just the trans women's battle against them and you're allies for them or whatever. this literally undermines how much harm theyre doing both to the trans community as a whole and even to the people (cis women) they claim to be protecting. terfs hate trans men just as much as trans women, transmascs arent safe because terfs view them as "uwu confused girlies trying to escape oppression", that is a very narrow worldview and inherently transphobic itself (it excludes butches, transmascs who's medically transitioned, intersex people, etc. etc.) transfems arent more oppressed by terfs than any other people theyre oppressing, please understand this. Im so sick and tired of people undermining my transmasc siblings when it comes to harassment from terfs because "well you arent a target to them", why are they harassing them then????

I just geniuenly dont like how the queer community can claim to be transmasc friendly and then view transmascs the same way transphobes view them (again, uwu girlies who are tricked into ruining their feminine beauty, they dont know anything and how lucky they are). feels both andromisic and misogynistic at the same time on top of transmisic idk how the fuck you manage to fuck up that badly

tldr: stop pretending transmascs arent affected by terfs nearly as much as transfems

anyone can reblog, except terfs of course they can fuck off

transfem is used as a way to refer to "TMA"/"AMAB" trans people transmasc is used as a way to refer to "TME"/"AFAB" trans people I know the definition is a bit more fluid now so I just wanted to note that

[pokedash55]

Turbo, Internalized Glitchphobia, and how King Candy is a clever Parallel to Vanellope's arc

So KC is so hateful and derogatory of Vanellope's Glitch in a way that feels beyond simply keeping power and control of the kingdom. There is so much distain in his voice for Vanellope both in public and private. He is obviously paranoid of returning to a life without his rule, but I think it goes deeper. He's also terrified of returning to a life without a game. Returning to a life as a glitched homeless outcast. Remember Turbo was to some degree homeless before 1997, almost 10 years of hiding and game hopping. He's still a power hungry asshole (and I love him for that) so this isn't justification but hear me out (cause angst for angsts sake is my jam)

I love giving him this internalized hatred of glitches because he was one before Sugar Rush. After the crash in Roadblasters, the console crashed and his code was probably damaged. Without his game nothing could repair the code. He was stuck as a glitch and he attacks Vanellope ruthlessly for it as an ego defense. It's almost a subconscious response to her and a reassurance that he's in control and isn't like that anymore. It was possible at one point he was in the same position as her: Alone and worthless, long ago he too had nowhere to go and was a glitch hated and scorned by those around him, becoming nothing but a fear mongering story and a freak to those who should respect him (So the obvious way to heal from this is to make another person suffer the same fate in order to feel the satisfaction of being in control)

Attacking her and labeling her Glitch is his internalized hatred of the weakness that he is running from every day he masks as KC, gaining more and more gratification and ownership of a game he is not apart of. He made his move to usurp the throne on day one and is so psychotic and proud that he has fallen for his own ruse. The King Candy character exists and is just as real as the "Turbo' character. Turbo ended up entranced by his perfect little sandbox world. He had a home and a life again. He had access to whatever he wanted and players who would love him. His subjects loved him and he was free to bask in that attention. It was an echo chamber of comfort and instant appreciation. He could fully accept the narrative he constructed if only SHE didn't exist. But her presence is forever a stain to his new home and a threat to his ego. She will always be there to remind him that he stole this game and without it he has nothing. That the life he has, although still entitled to it, is fake. Her glitching was always a reminder of the decade he spent just like her.

People love to connect Turbo and Ralph, talking about what happens if you grow too selfish in your desires for self respect and how rejecting your role in the world can be disastrous for everyone. I love the parallels with Turbo as the ultimate extension of Ralph's negative qualities. In the movie it also directly connects Ralph and Vanellope with themes of belonging and rejection from society. But what if these thematic Parallels became a triangle?? King Candy is living a lie and claiming an identity that is not his own and doing it with glee. He relishes in the escapism of being the King. He is technically doing the opposite of Vanellope, fully denouncing his actual self and embracing a self created fake persona in a ploy for power instead of accepting his place and being content as Turbo. But once "Turbo" became an outcasted glitch (totally from his own actions but still) from the crash, that "character" wasn't popular anymore he needed to become something else. With all that access to the code someone is bound to grow nihilistic or existential with who they are. He changed every bit and strand of his code just to become popular. But Vanellope never abandoned her true self. Through all the persecution, loneliness and maybe even jealously, she accepted her state as a glitch. Even when becoming royalty she wasn't about to change herself for others. Turbo changed everything about himself in order to become Royalty Vanellope gave up royalty to be herself.

[trans-androgyne]

The tme/tma binary is problematic because bioessentialism and gender essentialism is problematic.

The bioessentialism in its use includes assuming that everyone born with a vulva cannot experience transmisogyny in a meaningful way despite being presented with evidence otherwise. Sure it’s not all in the same way, not all trans women and transfems amab have all the same experiences either, but they can always specify something like “hey I’m an intersex trans woman who was afab but raised as a guy.”

The gender essentialism in its use includes assuming that everyone who identifies as a man cannot experience transmisogyny in a meaningful way despite being presented with evidence otherwise. Drag queens don’t get systemically targeted by transmisogyny even when there is legislation targeting their right to be in children’s and public spaces when they identify as men (cis or trans)? Are you certain? Because I’m not a drag queen and I’m not certain of that, so I can ask drag queens about it instead of assuming what their experiences are.

Julia Serano’s criticism of the tme/tma binary is that it’s use can consist of “boiling down people’s complex experiences with different types of sexism into ‘some people are privileged and some people are marginalized,’” and that’s my issue with it too.

[error501blog]

Race, Live-Action Casting, and Ninjago

I'll start by saying something everyone can agree on.

No Chris Pratt.

Now that's out of the way I want to state my purpose for this rant. It's to spark discussion. I want to hear other people's ideas and perspectives. I'm one Asian American out of literal billions. I know after typing everything out I'll feel bad, but this feels like a discussion the fandom needs to address. Every perspective is worth considering and thinking through.12

I'm not worried about the casting. Warner Bros. is a big studio that doesn't want any negative press. At least, Kai and Nya are going to be Asian. I'm worried about the other Ninja, mainly Lloyd. But I think the studio doesn't want to be cancelled, so that's not my number one worry. My number one worry is Garmadon. If Garmadon is in the movie, will his skin be literally black? his can be sidestepped if Garmadon isn't included period. But the Hagemans love their emo dad. Still, I don't want blackface Garmadon.

My theory is the casting will have a similar model to what Avatar did in it's live action. There were white voice actors, now they're played by a diverse cast. Kiawentiio is amazing, but not as tan as Katara was in the animated series. (That's a discussion within itself) There was a controversy with Ian Ousley. I'm not going to get into those topics, but they did happen.

However, the worry for many comes from the fact Ninjago is more racially ambiguous than Avatar: The Last Airbender. Almost all the characters-with exceptions being the Water Tribes and Sun Warriors-are Asian. Avatar: The Last Airbender has characters with a variety of skin tones and facial features. Ninjago has almost all of it's characters with yellow skin. Which is typical for LEGO, but feels iffy in an Asian inspired world. The fact everyone has yellow skin lends to an almost race blind world. However, names come from countries. Completely human characters have blond/ginger hair. Lloyd and Master Wu have blond hair. Master Wu is especially weird because he has the aesthetic of the Hollywood wise old Asian martial arts teacher there to help the protagonist. But he's blond.

In a cartoon I can suspend my disbelief. In the show I can't see facial features. Everyone in Ninjago has the same eyes, unless if you're a robot, one of the very few women, or Lloyd. I can live with this in an animated show from the 2010s.

In live action films, there are close-up shots. People will stand next to each other. I know what real life people look like when I'll see the movie. This shouldn't matter to me. I shouldn't care so much, but the history of whitewashing roles in media is too vast. We interpret the world through race.

White is the default in the US. Examples being Ghost in the Shell Warriors TV series. Asian roles for media set in Asia for Asian roles are cast by white people with white people since 1961.

What I want to know is the world of the live action going to be Asian inspired? And the better question: should it?

I don't know.

Ninjago since day 1 has had a tenuous at best relationship with race. It is clearly in an Asian inspired world. Everyone knows Ninjas come from Japan. However, it's just an aesthetic.

The worldbuilding is very Western. If we compare to Avatar again, there is no use of any Asian philosophy in Ninjago. Avatar is chalked full of allusions to Buddhism and Japanese Imperialism. But, Avatar is a more well thought out show than the show where one of the main characters gets sent into another dimension and becomes evil, violates the Geneva convention then is given no acknowledgement and I hate it.

Ninjago when giving us culture that seems Asian inspired to me fails spectacularly. (The Kabuki from Chen's Island. That's a Tumblr rant within itself) The most obvious example being the yin and yang marriage proposals. They have Google! The writers could've gone down an internet rabbit hole for a variety of cultures. But we have this clumsy, "Will you be the Yin to my Yang?" It's stupid and I hate it.

However, Ninjago in the Wildbrain era started to move away from the Asian aesthetic. One could make the argument it started in Rebooted, but I'm saying Wildbrain era to keep this post short. We go to a pyramid in Secrets of Forbidden Spinjitzu. We meet the Ice people from the Never Realm which I think are inspired by the Inuit. I'm not too sure.

Dragon's Rising has done away with any resemblance to Asian culture. Sora is Japanese name, so maybe? But all the resemblance is from the old show. It's a fantasy show. They are a soft reboot. They could make their dragons look like literally anything in this soft reboot and they stick to the Western style ones. It's this big fantasy world, why am I not seeing any allusions Asian folklore?

But can't I blame Ninjago when they fumble so hard when they try. It's a lose lose situation. But research isn't worth it. Is a culture too inconvenient to even research? Because everything seems absorbed from other pieces of American media. Yin Yang has nothing to do with marriage-at least to my knowledge. It has to do with Daoism. There is no research or attempt. The show hasn't done a legitimate attempt in it's full run and that's sad.

We're seeing that when the Hageman brothers write they don't shy away from the Asian aspects of the world. Or maybe there was less understanding of Asian representation when the show first aired so they could do whatever they wanted. (And Wildbrain and Dragons Rising are more popular so have higher stakes if they fuck up too bad) This is racist, but it isn't coming from hatred. It's coming from ignorance. If this came from hatred why make a show about ninjas?

The Hageman brothers have demonstrated ignorance in their writing. I've been saying Asian instead of specific countries because everything is so monolithic in the show. It would be amazing to have this world for a big franchise shown to kids around the globe. (Especially to Americans who might not watch a show with an authentic cultural world if it didn't tie to Ninjago) But that's not going to come from them. It's never going to come from them.

Authentic Asian representation was lost when the writers were picked. I have no doubt there'll be sensitivity readers, but there'll most likely be a cultural erasure. I'm not mad at the Hagemans. I'm not even mad at Hollywood. But I'm disappointed in Warner Bros.

Please respond with your own opinion. If you agree or disagree with any of my points. Hell, if I said something racist let me know. I want this post to get people thinking and talking about their own opinions on casting and writing.

[langernameohnebedeutung]

.

[miyulien]

rant.

extremely unrelated post regarding Omori/pjsk or my au!

I am very annoyed by how hoyoverse ultimately refuses to incorporate any kind of melanin or dark-skinned characters in their game(s), especially in genshin, where they take cultures of other people. they take all of the food, the landscapes, the language, and the mannerisms as well as the clothing, (be it over-sexualised at times) but they don’t carry the beautiful ethnic features that the people of those cultures have.

i am aware that hoyoverse is a Chinese company, and its player base is full of Chinese and the standard is very much based on the Chinese standards (pale skin, thin legs, tall stature, straight hair etc.) however, regardless of your country’s beauty standards, you can’t take steal other country’s cultures and proceed to not use the people’s appearances as well, it’s like you say everything they’ve made is beautiful, from the landscapes, the buildings, the cultural traditions and the way they act.. but you. its genuinely so hurtful to see in for example; sumeru,

literally based off of middle-eastern and south-asians, which both of these cultures have predominantly dark-skinned people. but our cultures are being used constantly without our own ethnic features along with it.

the only time I ever see a character with my skin tone in sumeru, is the enemies we have to fight. the disrespect that is, to know your skin tone just isn’t good enough, not marketable enough, so they won’t make you a real character.

the idea that everything we’ve created, things we’ve worked years on, traditions that have been kept and maintained as well as shared over the centuries, is practically perfect and beautiful in hoyo’s eyes.. but, us? we’re not marketable enough, our looks aren’t good enough. the idea of having melanin is jarring nowadays, seeing characters with some sort of “imperfections�� like “dark skin” is disgusting. why must we cast away the beauties of others appearance, the way they look in general, but we proceed to be overjoyed at their creations yet not the creators themselves.

it is genuinely super annoying to see how little dark skinned characters there are in genshin, and hsr, I’m not even talking about just adding diversity just to appease others, I’m talking about adding dark skinned characters and just making them normal people, without simply adding melanin just to make others shut up. why can u make every single light skinned character normal, and human, yet you can’t do the same with dark skinned characters? sumeru, natlan are based off of countries/regions that are filled with beautiful different skin tones, and hair types that don’t fit the Chinese beauty standards.

and it’s fine, beauty standards are present everywhere, but it shouldn’t be an issue to not make everything fit your country’s beauty standards, especially when you are profiting off of another country’s culture. also, can we talk about how there is literally barely any proper significance dark skin characters have in their storylines? there is barely any kind of importance that dark skinned characters have in events or even the main storyline, they appear once or twice during the quests but barely matter afterwards? they are constantly shunned and cast to the side, as if hoyoverse is ashamed of including any kind of diversity…? you can take everyone’s cultural backgrounds and their own ethnicity’s creations, but you can’t take their ethnicity’s appearance too? is it so hard to make a character with curly hair, or wavy hair for that matter.. or even make them black? is it hard to have afros, or braids, or make styles other then just exaggerated stereotypical anime straight hair?

I know it is to get profit, and that these characters wouldn’t do as well from what hoyoverse sees..

but, so many people are longing for these types of appearances, so many people want these representations, for dark skinned characters to be seen in media without simply having to be stereotypical or just added for basic diversity, just.. to be normal, like any other light skinned characters are.

It’s like me taking Chinese culture, the beautiful views, the buildings, the food, the mannerisms, and the traditions.. but not their ethnic features. people would be complaining over it and be totally pissed off, but why do we brush off the issue when it’s regarding dark skinned people not getting representation when their literal culture is constantly used in different games, like genshin, but the people themselves aren’t included?

i am not stating that light skinned people aren’t beautiful, in fact they are stunning, everyone is regardless of their melanin or lack thereof, I believe everyone’s features are beautiful, from dark skin, to tanned, to light, or pale. straight hair, wavy hair, curly hair, or coily hair, or even mixes. everyone is beautiful, and that is the truth, they all have features that make them stunning. but it’s just that the representations are so minimal in terms of dark skinned people, that is why I’m making this post.

as u can see, the literal pyro archon has not a shade of melanin, like what? none of the archons have melanin, not a single one of them? literal archons based off of regions that have predominantly dark skinned people, are all pale? huh??

i love hoyo games very much, and I love the stories but i just have noticed a total disregard and practical disrespect of dark skinned people who have stated that they want more representation seeing as hoyo uses their own culture but not their appearances, its just depressing to see what your ancestors have created, the hard work it took for you to maintain your culture, only for a huge company to swoon in and take that culture, and market it, but change your appearances to better fit their idea of ‘attractive’. As if you aren’t good enough, you aren’t marketable whatsoever.

they can easily incorporate inazuma accurately, which is based off of Japanese culture, they can use their ethnic features, and the way that they look, they can use the culture, the food, the traditions and events and the mannerisms and clothing, but they can also use their features? what’s the difference between Hispanic culture, and Japanese culture? why is it easy to use Japanese features but not Hispanic? it’s no coincidence.

I don’t like complaining in general, especially abt this, but honestly I have just seen this happen so much during the updates that I really got tired of cultures being used and praised, but the people themselves aren’t worthy of the same thing because they don’t fit the ‘beauty standard’

at the end of the day, you can do what you want, but if you are going to use a country’s culture, and profit off of it, the least you could do is also include their ethnic features instead of appeasing to your country’s beauty standards constantly.

hoyoverse is a multi-billion dollar company, it really isn’t that hard to include other ethnicites beautiful melanin and natural ethnic traits that they have, like greek noses, flat noses, upturned noses, small lips, big lips, big eyes and small eyes. thick eyelashes, long eyelashes, mixed skin tones, freckles and more, it’s just features that carry beauty, the mesmerising history of a culture to them. it isn’t that hard to include it, if you are willing to steal a culture, and call that culture perfect, except the people that created that culture.

do better, hoyoverse.

[crazysodomite]

my problem with borat is aside from Everything that's actually in it- i mean...

its the fact that so many people don't even know what central asian countries are, don't know anything about the people and don't care, never mention central asia in any discussions, but when they hear "kazakhstan" the only thing they can mention is that fuckass movie. i dont think ive seen central asia mentioned once by westerners without bringing up borat. shoots myself directly in the head in front of you.

[imakatperson22]

Chat I’ve seen a tsunami (ha.) of some of the worst takes in this fandom surrounding the golf bts photo and some are more egregious than others but I want to address one specifically: The idea that Gerrard would discriminate less against Buck for being queer because he has “cis white male privilege” or even try to seek a rapport with Buck.

Whiteness has never historically been a saving grace for minorities or do y’all not remember how people “with even one drop of colored blood” based on their ancestry were considered nonwhite, no matter how they appeared? If you are ANY sort of minority in the past, that was enough to cast you out, no matter your skin tone. Matthew Sheppard was a white man and if you don’t know that name, I suggest you learn it today. The hate for minorities of any kind was always stronger than the love of whiteness.

Gerrard, as a character, represents the past and its regressive nature. He’s not going to all of a sudden be just fine and dandy with Buck being queer just because he’s a cis white masculine man.

Did we all collectively forget that Gerrard called Tommy, another cis white masculine man, a fairy, which is a gay slur? The man has enough hate to go around for EVERYONE.

[kiuda]

actually no i'm not leaving it in the tags.

there is a thread on twt (a small one at the time i'm writing this) talking about russian being the language of oppressors. don't support it.

first of all - newsflash but that's xenophobic as hell.

second of all - maybe we shouldn't actually judge people for their government's actions? maybe our fellow russian dream fans shouldn't feel excluded? i know, wild idea!

third of all - discriminating anyone based on the language they speak should not exist in the year 2023 and yet!

[azucar-skull]

A major problem in many fandoms, including (ROT)TMNT is when people don't take accountability for when they are wrong about something.

Being wrong doesn't make you an asshole. But refusing to learn and correct yourself does.

[yakkety-yak-art]

not to unnecessarily thinkpiece at 1 am (this might be incomprehensible) but i feel its odd when people talk about spock being half human and half vulcan like its completely literal. like somebody just put two legos together and can just separate them or turn one on or off at will. i know that in tos its explained similarly in that way a lot, but a lot of the times when it is it just seems like a more shorthand explanation for the complexities spock deals with culturally and biologically rather than it being entirely literal.

the reason i feel its weird is for two reasons: 1. spock is quite literally biracial and his personal story revolves around that a LOT. leonard nimoy even spoke before about receiving at least one letter from a biracial girl talking about how she related to spock/wanting advice because she was a "half-breed", which to me points pretty clearly to how spock functions as an analogue for multiracial people or someone of a different race and culture living somewhere where they are a minority and have to conform to the majority cultural/racial expectations. spock is treated as too human for vulcans and too vulcan for humans, but this is entirely due to cultural stigma and not because of his actual biology (and even if his biology was extremely divergent from both, that wouldn't justify bigotry anyways). spock is not actually "worse" at controlling his emotions than other vulcans, and is not more emotional than them (vulcans are very emotional, of course, and they are also quite expressive--they just express themselves differently than most humans), nor is he inherently less of a person and more like a computer, to use bones' sentiments, just because he does not emote in ways his human crewmates do. humans and vulcans both treat him as if he is fundamentally deficient, but it's not that he actually is, or that any multiracial vulcan or human COULD be, but that they are so prejudiced that they are making reasons to mistreat him or view him poorly. the only thing that actually makes him fundamentally different from other vulcans or humans is his physiology, because unlike with the current human social concept of race in regards to skin color, vulcans and humans do actually have physical differences as two different races--as in species. but, in universe, this physical difference in spock's case is nearly as minor (in a purely physical sense) as someone having more melanin than another, and is only important to those who aren't himself, his direct family, or his doctors because of the social construct of race.

this also reflects in how spock views himself; he's not cagey about being biracial, and references it relatively often (though mostly only when it's relevant), and seems to feel no shame towards his human mother herself, but he otherwise tends to exclusively racially identify as vulcan and shies away from wanting to associate his own person with humanity. he was raised on vulcan and "as a" vulcan, and aside from his human mother, he has no tangible connections to earth human culture. yet, most of the humans he meets and even his own mother judge him as being an "abnormal" or "deficient" human in the same way that spock's mixed race status is used as a reason to judge spock as being the same, but as a vulcan. spock is just as emotional as any human or vulcan, and acts in accordance with the culture he was raised in, but even as an adult has internalized racism because he considers his emotions inherently human (aka bad and wrong) even though emotions are not traits which exist only in humans, and himself not really a vulcan in some fundamental way, solely because of the racism he's faced since a child. to put it another way, if spock had been raised on earth, with the majority of his influences being in human community and family aside from his father, would he identify primarily as human, or more generally as biracial, rather than just vulcan, feeling some internal shame in regards to that aspect of his heritage and identity? i think it's entirely possible. his differences are largely based in social responses to his existence and cultural differences based on where he was raised.

(to note: i'm not saying it's bad that spock himself identities primarily as vulcan or that he should identify more as human, i'm simply saying that it highlights how much of his racial and cultural identity is directly tied to how he was raised and is treated rather than some inherent biological trait he has because he's biracial. spock is clearly visibly vulcan, which would be the racial minority on earth, so even then he would face stigma related to his race based on his appearance--on vulcan, it stems more from simply the knowledge that spock is biracial, as his family is very well-known and prestigious, rather than looking human.)

reason 2 is also because spock serves as an analogue for neurodivergent people, but in particular autistic people, people who display with a flat affect or otherwise don't react or emote in a "normal" sense, miss or ignore social cues, etc. in fact, generally, spock is a character which many socially marginalized groups and people who feel like outsiders gravitate towards because his situation as sci-fi biracial in an entirely human crew feels familiar to a lot of these people.

so, treating spock like he's literally split down the middle, fundamentally inhuman and invulcan, only halves that can be separated or a switch that can be flipped where he's "more vulcan" or "more human" feels incredibly strange because then...what does that imply about real people who are biracial, or people who are autistic? i'm sure most people don't think too hard about it, but to accept the reasoning of the people being racist to spock is conceding to the idea that something is wrong with spock. that he is two unfinished halves and not one whole, and that he either is one or the other or is in a permanent gray area where his existence is wrong. spock is different, yes, but almost all of the differences outside of his daily bodily functions are entirely because of the concepts of race that other people have. what is that meant to tell someone who's mixed race? "sorry, you'd be normal if you were just one race"? someone who's autistic, "but you're not really a person"?

again, i'm sure many people haven't thought about it that deeply and aren't meaning to imply those things, just as i'm sure plenty of people have probably written nearly identical thinkpieces in the decades since tos aired, but it's just been bugging me and i needed to get it out of my brain. by the time i'm wrapping this up, it's a little past 2 am, and i've tried to proofread this but it might still be a slog and/or entirely incomprehensible. if anyone has any thoughts--whether you agree with me or not, or felt like something in the post could be added to/reworded--i'd definitely be interested in hearing them (like i said, this is almost 100% unoriginal thoughts lmao).

anyways don't become english majors kids it gives you media analysis brainworms.

[gemsofgreece]

hi ! I apologize if it is a weird or rude question, but as a history buff and mediterranea lover, i'd love to visit greece one day as everything about her seems fire, plus you have great historical relationship with my country, france. The thing is that im muslim and half north african, and i look very arab (plus i have like the most cliché arabic name, so no one would probably see me as french), so im a bit apprehensive about going in greece, because you dont have the most cordial relationship with muslims (i understand tbf), and that in a lot of countries know for their "hospitality", it is actually only for white people. I know that you have a lot of tourists and immigrants but that doesnt really means the average greek tolerate them (like france for exemple were there is a lot of muslims but french dislike them). So i wanted to ask what do greeks think of north africans and women wearing the hijab and how they are treated, bc i wouldnt be comfortable being somewhere where half of the population would be glad to see me suffer. Im sorry if i sound ignorant, racist or rude ^^'

Hello! Before I go into detail I think you should not be concerned about this or allow these thoughts to fill you with stress that could affect your enjoyment of your vacation in Greece.

While Greece is part of Eastern Europe where there are more racist beliefs towards muslims compared to West Europe (or at least so it was, but I am currently seeing far right rising in the west exponentially), Greece is also one of the most visited countries in the world at this point and during the last decade it has been receiving tourists from all around the globe, people of all skintones and faiths. A huge number of Greeks work in the tourism sector and are perfectly acquainted with providing tourist services to everybody without exception. In fact, we also get a lot of tourists from countries with less than ideal relations with Greece and I have never heard reports of something going wrong or of Greeks being unfriendly to them.

Now a few words about racism in Greece in order to help you develop a better understanding of it. First of all, I am sure extremely problematic individuals who usually express the dark side of themselves on the Internet do exist in Greece, however the likelihood of stumbling in real life onto a Greek who would like to see one "suffer" on the basis of their skincolour or religion is incredibly slim. This is neither a prevalent nor even a considerable let alone a normalised behaviour in Greece at all.

Racism in Greece is usually very... contextual. Greeks foster negative feelings for specific nations first and foremost and it usually has to do with historical trauma, about which I assume you know some stuff since you said "I get it tbf". Greeks also may have negative feelings for nations who are traditionally allies of aforementioned nations. The second thing that can ignite racist behaviour amongst Greeks is the religion indeed but not so much due to the religion itself but because a religion may be heavily associated with any of the nations that are on their black list. This sometimes causes biased stances towards all believers of the religion in question, even if they have nothing to do with those few nations. Skincolour comes last in the possibility of triggering racist behaviour in Greece, especially when it comes to tourists. But again I dare say even in an 80% of the cases it is because it is associated with countries that might be viewed as unfriendly to Greece or Christianity than any sort of rhetoric about inherent superiority or inferiority based on skincolour. Again, I am not saying there are no individuals who think this way - there definitely are - but it's not the primary type of racism encountered in Greece and it is exremely unlikely to interact with such a person in your vacation. We had such a type of political party but it was outlawed and its leaders got imprisoned. Meanwhile, the West was screaming nonstop that bad Greece has such a political party and now they are putting theirs in their parliaments or letting them govern. The irony.

Several Greeks are against the immigrants but it is primarily due to the financial and unemployment problems the country has even without a constant influx of new-comers and then because most of these immigrants are again viewed as nationals from countries unfriendly to Greece and secondarily Christianity that only arrive here as a necessity and not because they want to live and contribute to the Greek society. Then there are also many Greeks who rally for the immigrants' rights. But racism in Greece is really SO contextual that a dark Muslim can melt away a suspicious Greek's reservation, if they express feelings of appreciation or understanding for Greece, within the course of five minutes! It's kind of amusing.

Now, you being a woman actually minimizes your chances of an unfortunate racist incident way more. Exactly because Greek racism is founded so much more on past historical trauma or perception of extremist movements in nearby parts of the world rather than ideologies of superiority, nobody considers women as part of the problem or views them as a threat. The worst that can happen to you is to notice that someone may be initially neutral or indifferent to you until they hear your french accent and your positive perception of Greece and instantly warm up or something. But someone could be neutral or indifferent for just about any reason, including having a bad day. I honestly don't think you could get a worse reception as long as you are a considerate polite tourist. The hijab is indeed an uncommon sight in Greece but the worst thing you may get is looks, mostly out of curiosity, not hatred. And that is if you are in a more remote or less touristy location. In the largest cities or the busiest islands people won't care.

Now there's also the other side to all this. Greeks are known to often make good friends with people from the "black list" countries. Greeks are friendly and sociable and they usually only expect from you a positive outlook on their country to discard their reservations. Greece also in fact has very good relations with many Arab countries. Politically, Greece has very good relations with Egypt, Libya (supported the progressive side in the civil war, the House of the Representatives and the National Libyan Army), Algeria, Morocco, Tunisia, Lebanon, Jordan, Saudi Arabia and UAE. So, a great part of the Arab world. In fact, Greeks and Arabs are believed to be friends in general. Now, this does not apply to every single situation or to what every single individual thinks from either side but I am just saying it to dispute any potential misunderstanding that Greeks supposedly have some sort of major feud with Arabs or some Arab-centric racist feelings.

In short, you should not be concerned about it : you are a woman, you are a tourist genuinely interested in Greece, everyone will pick up on your french accent lol and you can freely mention your North African Arab background. Obviously I cannot guarantee nothing will ever happen 1000% but it is not more likely here than it is in France.

[alicenpai]

i kind of want to get back into drawing fma......... every october i see the fanart and it blasts me back to when i was 11 and discovering fma for the first time, it shattered my worldview..

[torgawl]

i have zero respect for anyone that believes shonen animanga consistently having badly written female characters isn't a problem within the industry. anytime someone comes forward with "the target demographic is young boys" i only question myself a) don't young boys have women in their lives they care about or coexist with? b) do young boys live in a parallel universe where women aren't relevant? c) why can't/shouldn't young boys have the right to see well written female characters in media? because that sort of argument to me is just a reiteration of "i don't care about women".