#but I really need to read more about the other batfam members

[weewoow-20706030]

The batfams favourite icecream flavours because I'm always right.

Bruce: mint choc chip or vanilla. Vanilla is very versatile and sometimes having something sweet and plain is enjoyable. And mint choc chip cus of the ✨vibes✨

Dick: Rainbow, or, if he is feeling especially grown up, new York cheesecake. But his go to is always the most colourful, if they don't have rainbow? Cotton candy or boysenberry swirl.

Jason: rum and raisin. Why? The vibe.

Tim: Vanilla, mint choc chip or hokey pokey. Same as Bruce. They bond over it. Sometimes Bruce would just buy mint choc ice cream so no one else can have it, but he ends up sharing it with Tim.

Damian: 'I don't eat that filth' <strawberry

[deaddovedecadence]

if requests are open, i'd like to ask for a fic of yandere batfam caring for a sick reader (i've got 1 foot in the grave rn 🤒) with forced infantilization (if that doesn't squick you out, hopefully) gn reader would be preferred. thank youuu 🙏

They are in fact open and fun fact, ive never done infantilization before so im super excited. I think what I'm doing to do is like a mini fic of each batfam member and how they're deal with you being sick. I'll totally do a gn! reader but they might come across as non binary.

-

Alfred: not the worst but not the best. Fussing over you all the damn time whenever you have even the faintest bit of even a cold because he’s lost enough people, you will not be one of them. He tucks you in bed. and will read to the books he read when he was young, smiling to himself with you fall asleep from the drugged milk. Over all a 5/10

Bruce: Doesn’t really believe in it. Thinks that forcing you to be strong will make you, an oldest daughter even stronger. Still when you get sick he’s so gentle with you, cooing that he loves you and that soon you’ll be all better, that your dad is here now. It hurts so badly because you know who he is and yet he’s so fucking gentle with you. 5/10

Dick: Honestly he’s like this all the damn time. Says that because you were an oldest you ought to relive your childhood. Holds basic respect over you to make sure that you do what he wants when he wants because you know that he’ll go back to that coddling cooing cruelty if you don’t. When you’re sick it’s turned up to the max because he likes taking care of people who can’t fight back. Likes being able to hug you and hold you and love on you all he wants. 8/10

Jason: He’s definitely more gentle with you than he is with his siblings but definitely has rough edges. He sees you as someone that needs to be protected but in the manor you are more equal. He fusses when you’re sick for sure because even though he knows that you have the best medical care, he still remembers all the people he lost in crime ally. He’s not obvious about it because he doesn’t know how to be but yikes does this man watch over you like a hawk. 4/10

Cassandra: Thinks that you’re weak and needs her care in a way that her siblings and steph do not. Cass respects strength and the ability of people to take care of themselves ,and you in her eyes can not do that. So when you fight, she forces you down, humming sweet lullabies from cultures all over the world. When you’re sick it proves her point because the rest of them would have been over this by now. You need her. 7/10.

Tim: uses it to manipulate the fuck outta you. Tells you that you are weak, that your sickness is proof you need their love and attention. Will drug you to be dependent on them will you’re ill and probably made you sick in the first place so you’d learn that you belonged in the family, that there is no going back for you. Calls you a child even though you’re older then him.

Duke: They almost coordinate with Tim, making sure that you never suspect any of them. Duke’s power is words, they know how to spin them and manipulate them and make it so that you aren’t really sure of what’s real and what you dreamed up. A gaslighter to the max. Loves and respects you but thinks that you need to stay here, you aren’t strong enough to be a bat’s lieutenant. 7/10

Damian: While Dami does think that you are weak, he also thinks that. there is a value to you that the others do not quite understand. You soothe the family and act asa merger so that even when they anger each other, they come back for you. Damian is very intuitive and this allows him to understand you better even if he lacks empathy to those outside of his family. Even when you are ill he worries over you but demands you heal because you are strong. 0/10

[bloodyshadow1]

i really love Batfamily stuff, it's so much more interesting than Mary Sue Batman, but I feel like people don't get how the batfam actually interacts with other heroes. Specifically Clark and Diana.

I see so many posts about how the Justice league knows nothing about the batkids and I'm sorry, to me that's the most boring way to do things and completely against characterization and history if it's just the whole league. If you think Clark and Diana don't love those kids as family it's not really my cup of tea (to a lesser extent Barry and J'onn).

I get that there are a lot of batkids and a lot of different comics with different minds behind them so I can only reference what I know and from what I've experienced. Still, I read comics for a while and I feel like my personal headcanons are:

Nightwing should absolutely adore his aunt and uncle, he's nightwing because of a conversation he had with Superman. He was the first Robin and adored in the superhero community. He led the titans, was best friends with Donna.

Red Hood, I think Jason might be a bit more chilly towards Clark, Like everything, after he came back things went to shit, especially after he found out Clark stopped Bruce from killing the Joker to avenge him. but has a lot of fond memories towards Clark when he was Robin. He still has a real love for Aunt Diana, probably avoids her though because she is a reminder of the good times he had as Robin.

Red Robin, things are complicated with him as he was on the Outsiders with Connor and Cassie, and later on the Titans with them. When they were the outsiders, the Justice League probably felt more like the man trying to control them. Later on during the titans, things get angsty so I think that might color Tim's perception of them and favor the way his friends describe them more than what he's seen of them. I think he has good memories, but not nearly as much as Jason or Dick

I don't think I've read any comics about Spoiler, Black Bat, or Signal's interactions with them so I would leave that to those who know more. That being said, I think their interactions would be fun, I think Cass would respect Diana as probably the world's best warrior and I think Duke would really look up to Clark, partially because he's superman, but also he's fun and light, not to mention they both have light powers even if they manifest differently. I don't really know much about Stephanie and her interactions with other heroes tbh

Damian, I think is interesting because I think he actually respects Clark more as a journalist and as Jon's father than he does as Superman. At least at first. Superman has all these powers but doesn't really do a lot of what he sees as big changes so I think at first he considers his powers a waste on small potatoes stuff. He does come to respect him though. Diana, I think Damian adores pretty quickly even if he says otherwise, I think they bond over their love of animals. I also think that Damian respects that Diana will kill if necessary, he was trained by the league of assassins, I understand that as a member of the batfamily he doesn't kill, but I don't think it's right for him to be as antikilling as the rest. I think out of respect for Dick and his father he doesn't kill but he understands that some people need killing.

I'm not trying to yuck anyone's um, your headcanons are your own, but I see so many posts that just don't get how fun interactions with characters are with their canon personalities.

[brucewaynehater101]

every family has a secret stoner and i absolutely need your opinion on who you think the stoner of the batfam is, like,,,,,, who’s sneaking away at thanksgiving to light up?? do they smoke together?? is it an open secret or does nobody know about them smoking??

I just... I need a sec. Y'all's family hides that shit? I kid ya not, my mom's offered me gummies, one of my siblings has a weed desk, and my father swore he'd constantly be smoking as soon as he retires. My other siblings' partner did weed a lot too.

I don't really like weed for myself (the lack of control freaks me out and I've had a few bad trips), but at least one of my siblings very openly uses weed often lmao.

I got off track. Whoops. Anyways, Dick. Dick 100% does weed. It helps with his anxiety and anger (also Discowing).

When Dick "sneaks out" to smoke, some of the others join him. Jason is always there regardless if he's taking a hit, smoking a cigarette, or just taking a moment away from Bruce (Bruce is rarely welcome during these moments. It's more of a sibling thing).

Steph probably bakes brownies and has a weed stash in Tim's room. She'll occasionally join them, but not always. She's usually hanging around Cass, Duke, Tim, or Damian.

Now... I adore the stoner Tim au. It's hilarious and great. For this post, there's two options for Tim.

If he's a stoner, then Dick didn't find out until a hilariously late time. Dick is reasonably upset that he found out so late when it's another way for Tim and him to bond.

If he's not, I'd hc him to be closer to how I feel about it. He's chill with other who do it, but doesn't like the way it fucks with his control, awareness, and ability to think. Instead, he'd rather drink alcohol.

Hmm... I'm curious how weed, alcohol, or substances would interact with Cass's ability to read body language. If it makes it harder or lessens the amount of signals she perceives, this could either freak her out or give her brain a break.

Funny answer for Cass is that she does a *shit* ton of weed and somehow manages to hide it from everyone but those she's told (maybe Steph and Tim?)

I need to learn more about Duke. Until I know otherwise, let's say that he occasionally does it for fun with friends or a batfam member, but usually refrains.

Damian is a kid. Maybe when he's older, he takes a night off every month or so to decompress with the help of weed.

Alfred does weed too. How the fuck else is he supposed to deal with all the stress of the Bats? He'll go out to "tend the garden" which is code for "leave him the fuck alone so he can de-stress and smoke."

Bruce might every once in a while, but he stopped heavy usage when he put on the cowl.

The whole batfam knows and is chill with weed. The substance they do hide, however, is alcohol. Some members have trauma and shit with alcohol. This means the others try not to consume alcohol around those members and obscure their alcohol consumption in general. Whether those with alcohol trauma consume alcohol as well, the others still refrain in front of them.

I can't believe I forgot Barbara! She probably does weed to help with her pain

[lazycats-stuff]

I'd like to see how batfam deal with babybat (not necessarily baby like 4 or 5) that's obsessed with video games? Like first thing he does in the morning is turn on his playstation before he even has breakfast or anything, maybe Bruce takes him out to get some outside time but instead he's just pointing out how some things look like this certain game he played etc, and basically the only way his brothers can interact with him is if they asked to play with him

Alrighty. (Y/N) needs to touch grass also.

Summary: (Y/N) is obsessed with video games. That is not really a good thing.

Warnings: (Y/N) is a gaming kid, obsession with video games, possible addiction?, author doesn't know, Bruce trying to fix that obsession.

Bruce kind of regretted buying his youngest son PlayStation. He thought that it would be something that everyone could enjoy. Bruce however, prohibited Fortnite. Not happening. That was the only game that wasn't going be in the manor.

They had some multiplayer games, some solo games in different genres that everyone could enjoy. But (Y/N) got obsessed with video games. Bruce thought that it was something normal, kids are usually obsessed with them.

But (Y/N)?

This was not good. It was very bad in fact. Bruce was lowkey horrified at how (Y/N) couldn't start his day without starting the PlayStation. Bruce was worried about it. His solution?

Take down the screen time and make him read more. Also, he would have to restrict the time on the PlayStation in order to achieve this. It wasn't going to be easy, but getting him go out. He talked to the rest of the members of the family and they have agreed to help him.

Bruce was going to get ready for a long process. He researched and looked for the ways how to help his son and he was now officially ready. The others were ready too.

It started easily enough. Bruce had set firm boundaries with the play time. There were set hours and (Y/N) was nowhere near happy. But he couldn't do anything.

Also, Bruce said that he would have to read for an hour and go outside for an hour. Alfred would make sure of it. And if there was one person that (Y/N) didn't mess with, that was Alfred. He was tough and strict when he needed to be and (Y/N) knew he stood no chance with Alfred.

And that's why (Y/N) was outside with Jason, who tried to get him to do some sort of physical activity.

" Look Jay. " (Y/N) said, pointing at something at the tree line. Jason frowned.

" It reminds me of a game. "

Jason didn't know what to say to that. His little brother had an obsession and Jason was shocked. Tim is an angel compared to (Y/N). An angel.

" Nice. " Jason mumbled, kind of worried. " How about we look for Titus? " Jason said, running. (Y/N) huffed, but ran with Jason. Jason saw the Great Dane and the Great Dane saw him too. Titus immediately started running past Jason, running towards (Y/N), circling him while the little boy laughed.

Jason stopped, watching as the two ran. He looked at the Garden where Damian was.

" He is going to be running for hours. " Damian said, bringing his teacup to his lips.

" Yup. " Jason said, chuckling.

And Damian was right. (Y/N) ran for hours and was so exhausted that he could barely keep his head up. During dinner his head was dropping and Alfred had to keep his head up in order for Bruce too feed him.

They couldn't let him go to bed without diner. The others were cracking up at the sight.

" I think that the detox is going well. " Alfred said, an amused smile on his face. Bruce nodded, putting the spoon to (Y/N)'s mouth. (Y/N) opened his mouth and chewed.

" It is. Titus is going to be happy with how much more playtime he is going to get. " Damian chimed in and the said dog walked into the dining room. He nudged (Y/N)'s little hand and (Y/N) seemed more awake.

For a second.

" I think he ate enough. " Bruce said, picking his son up. He put him over his shoulder like a sack of potatoes and started carrying him to bed.

Maybe he will finally get enough sleep tonight.

[kindlingkeen]

Hi! I absolutely adore your Asymmetrical Warfare series on AO3 (it’s got me back on a competent Jason Todd kick, which, there’s honestly too little of so if you have any recs pls fire away)!

I did have a curiosity that I hope you don’t mind answering though: are there specific reason why you’re not a Tim fan? And does that extend to other members of the batfam as well?

Hi, anon! I’m so glad you’re enjoying Asymmetrical Warfare (competent Jason ftw!). 🙌

Re: Tim. I should probably be more conscientious with my wording around Tim. A lot of what I say in ao3 comments or here tends toward facetious, and tone doesn’t really come across well online.

Which is not to say there aren’t things about Tim that bug me. For example—canon Tim, there are more than few instances of him being downright shitty to Jay’s memory. Case in point, from Batman #456, Tim imagines Jason’s ghost giving him a pep talk about becoming a hero and Jason says he killed himself because he didn’t listen to Batman.

Ah, no sir, the responsible party was the psychopathic clown with a crowbar and some explosives, not the 15 year old trying to save his newly discovered biological mother.

But is this really Tim the character’s fault? Or is it dc’s fault for creating a narrative that brutally murdered a child and then spent decades trashing his memory and blatantly victim-blaming him for it?

It’s really more fanon depictions of Tim that I have a problem with. In particular, the tendency to project Jason’s trauma onto Tim. Trying to spin the white boy who came from an affluent two-parent household as somehow more neglected than the kid whose parents are dead/incarcerated and was literally homeless is just ??? Jason’s backstory touches on so many important societal issues (the gutting of the social safety net, the industrial prison complex, the opioid epidemic, the criminalization of poverty, the stigmatization of sex work), and this approach sweeps all of that under the rug.

It also really gets my goat how many fics masquerade as being about Jason, but are actually just a vehicle for Tim time. These stories tend to dramatize Tim’s character, whether it’s woobie, touch-starved little Timmy who needs constant reassurance and protection, or smarter than everyone ever, can not be out thought or out fought, is actually a CEO while he should be in high school Tim. My problem with this type of narrative is usually two-fold. 1) It dumbs down Jason’s characterization (which should be so rich and complex) to ridiculously oversimplified motivations and actions. And 2) it turns Tim into a caricature of himself, instead of a compelling character with a balance of strengths and weaknesses and a normal amount of teenaged self-esteem.

It probably doesn’t sound like it from this blog post, but I do really try hard in life not to yuck other people’s yum. Just because I don’t care for how Tim is portrayed, it doesn’t make it inherently bad or wrong. And all of this aside, I’ve read plenty of fics where I enjoyed Tim just fine. For example, I love how @bonerot19 writes Tim in their Something in the Static series. And Tim and Jay’s dynamic in WFA is often amusing.

So, yeah, bottom line. Tim is … fine. I’m just not a fan, per se. I try to at least write him fairly in Asymmetrical Warfare, with both the realistic shortcoming of a teenage boy and the awesomeness of Robin. He’s never going to get the same amount of page time as the rest of the crew is, though.

Re: the rest of the batfam. I mean, I often want to bop Bruce on the nose. Especially canon Bruce who beats up his kids and is completely unrepentant about it. But, honestly, that’s not my Bruce. My Bruce, who I love and love to hate in turn, would never do that. (Compartmentalization, the key to happy fic reading and writing.)

I love Babs and Dick. I want to be besties with Steph, but in reality she’s way too cool for me. Duke and Cass I’m less familiar with, but have no problems with. Damian is growing on me, and if dc would just give up the game and admit that Dami and Jay met in the LoA and are actually super special murder brothers at heart, that would be great. Selina is a queen and someday I will write that Selina + Jay and Dami meet in the LoA fic I’ve been dreaming about.

Re: competent Jason fic recs. One of my favorites is butcherbird, fly away home by e_va @e-vasong. Bonus rec, the same author put out a new fic recently, another way to make it to ten, and it not only features competent Jason, it’s Jason & Tim, and I like Tim in it.

Thanks so much for the ask, anon! Really great questions. Kudos if you made it through the whole post. 💙

[alfredsolos]

Among us Batfam fans, not all of us love every single member.

Some of use don't like Jason, Dick, Bruce etc.

And naturally, there are people who don't like Damian. Be it his personality or his difference from the previous Robins. This is perfectly normal, you don't have to like Damian or any other Batfam member. For example, I don't really like Bruce's personality and his treatment of his kids. (Although that's mostly DC's fault not Bruce)

But there are certain types of people in the fandom that just loathes a character. And most of the time, this character is Damian. And as a person whose favorite is Damian, this irritates me to say the least.

People don't like the fact that Damian is different, and in their mind, not what a Robin should be. They think that Robin should be the light to Batman's darkness. Which is problematic on it's own, but I won't get into that.

They don't like his bluntness which is often percieved as rudeness (I know there instances where he is rude on purpose, but most of the time it's just him being brutally honest.)

No matter how much these haters deny it, Damian is very capable. He is very smart both academically and in-life. He's a good strategist. He can get himself out of bad situations as easy as getting himself into one. He bested his mother in combat at the age of 10 to learn the identity of his father. He was able to tell who his father was, just by reading his body language (In which Bruce was in Brucie mode). He can manipulate his voice to sound as whoever He wants. He is brave and almost fearless. He is not afraid of higher authority and has wicked wits.

Of course the haters don't care for any of that. The probably don't even know half of these actually happened. Maybe they never even opened a single issue of a comic.

What they're focused on is: He's rude to the other members, he is the weakest of the Batfam and gets his ass handed to him, he is an egoist and aggressive person, he is unwanted and so on...

And when you point out that what they're saying is just what they think and percieve of Damian, and not real facts or when you try to show them examples of him being good and a capable fighter they just deny it and go back to just hating him for nothing.

Like I said before in the beginning, it's totally okay to not like a character. For example if you're a Tim Drake fan you may not like Damian because he tried to kill Tim or said rude things to him.

But with that you have to acknowledge that Jason did the same thing. He beat Tim in the Titans Tower and tried to kill him in Battle For The Cowl. Or that time when Bruce punched Dick. Or that time when Jason shot Damian. Or when Steph hit Tim on the face with a brick and so on...

We need to understand that the current Batfamily is very disfunctional and often times hurt each other. So hating on a character for attacking your favorite one is kinda dumb because they all fought each other at one point.

And so what is the other reason why people hate Damian? His personality.

Yet again this rant is for the people who hate him almost religiously and can not have a conversation about him without bashing him.

(It's totally okay to not like his character and instead focusing on your favorite characters without having the need to bash him.)

This is not very well known but Damian technically has 3 origins.

1) His first appearance, in which Damian was given up for adoption by Talia the moment he was born. We don't really know anything of this origin so I can't really say anything of this version of Damian. But what I can say is that this version would be a lot different than the canon one and he would just be a normal kid.

What we need to focus on is the other two versions.

2) The version that was/is considered canon which was written by Grant Morrison. This version of Damian was raised in the League by trainers. This Damian did not meet Talia until he was 8 years old. So he was more intense and aggressive than the other 2 versions. This is also the version who tried to kill Tim and brought a severed head to the cave.

Now think of a kid who was raised and brainwashed in this cult where he had to kill people, learn advanced academic lore, train and master in multiple martial arts, learn to be obedient but also respected. Imagine this kid growing up and doing these things without having a single parental figure that showed him an ounce of love. Where everyone he interacts with is either scared of him or is meant to train him brutally to make him the best. Imagine this child not knowing the fact that the reason why he was trained like this is not to become the Demon's Head or an assassin, but to be a vessel for Ra's when his body starts rejecting the pit. This was a kid raised to die while suffering his whole life. This is the kid who was killed by his own mother. A 10 year old child that was sent to Hell.

And the last version:

3) Tomasi's version of Damian Wayne. This Damian has a different backstory than the other two. He was raised in the League just like the second version but with a difference. Talia was there. So although he was raised in this violent cult-like place, he had the (somewhat) love of a mother. There are canonical instances shown to us where Talia tells him stories and so on. This is the version who canonically referred to the other assassins as his brothers. This is the version who cried after killing the Bat Dragons. This the version who cried at the death of Alfred. He is the one who cried for Dick when he was shot.

Excluding the first version, the other two encountered very traumatic things in their lives and as a response grew up to be cold and blunt to survive that kind of environment.

So when a Damian fan responds to questions as to why they stan him despite his personality with "Because he is a child.", they don't really have to say anything else. Because that's what he was.

An abused and traumatised child. And honestly, we don't really need another reason for liking him.

Even Tim -whose some fans hate Damian for what he did to him- tells and believes this.

"You were just a kid"

[gilbirda]

This mostly stemmed from the constant image of Jason being so disgustingly enamored with Jazz [the twirling-his-hair-heart-eyes-and-being so-unfocused-on-important-shit lovesick] that the batfam finds it bizarre rather than cute

The most I got is Ember rolling into Gotham looking for a bigger crowd [I guess], Jazz, interning at Arkham as the popular saying goes, tries dealing with her and Jason obviously steps in cause Crime Alley business is his business and smth about this new rocker chicks smells fishy.

I'm guessing you know where this is going?

Ember gets away, off to collect a following as she does.

Jazz is prepared for ghost nonsense, but she was not prepared for this vigilant built like a brick house to suddenly be mooning over her. So she reluctantly knocks this guy's lights out and leaves him in some alley [maybe checks him over for what she hopes is a panic button and leaves the bats to it]

The bats find him and bring him home, and thus have to deal with their uncharacteristically goofy, lovestruck family member going on and on about some redhead. He's talking about her long pretty hair, the color of her eyes, the way she kicked ass, her bossiness.

They can't get anything useful out of him.

It's both sickening and blackmail worthy

Cue batfam looking into the whole Ember business all while trying to keep Jason from wandering off in search of Jazz and keep him from potentially exposing himself or embarrassing himself. Meanwhile, Jazz is also trying to deal with Ember and maybe calling in the big guns....

Cue flustered Jazz having some weird ass run-ins with the bats and watching them as they try to keep an embarrassingly enamored Red Hood in check [The dude is probably singing her sonnets and all sorts of romantic shit]

[He refused to stay home, he wanted the chance to see her]

Hmmm, not much room to figure out a route for potential romance there :p

FAM

I THINK YOU HAVE A WHOLE ASS FIC RIGHT THERE

I would read it!!!

I mean, Jazz could acknowledge that this stranger is under a spell and doesn't really like, like her, so she's understanding and kind?

She still needs to deal with the ghost situation without Batman knowing what really is going on, so she has to outsmart the bats while she outruns this guy that's reciting very cute poetry oh my god he should write it down and publish it! and defeat Ember on her own.

She calls the big guns. She is strong, but she knows when she's overwhelmed.

Team Phantom deals with Ember as she deals with the bats. After all, she needs to make herself a distraction from the whole ghost-is-mind-controlling-people, and they are following her anyway, so she just-

she leaves fake clues?

It's actually really fun!!! She has taken a support role when helping her brother, and spreading her wings like this, running around the city at night and testing the limits of her liminal abilities, IS FUN.

And the guy, he said his name was Jay but she stopped him before he could say more, is actually very fun to talk to. When she is caught by him before the others and they get to interact, she sits down and studies him and what he uses to romance - it strikes her that he can quote plays and books at the drop of a hat (that is not the spell, this guy legit has memorized those) and that he is actually very polite?

Spell or no spell, it's been a while since she talked to someone like this. Nerding out.

But then Ember is defeated and the spell is broken and she is bummed that it's over but hey, it's been a fun experience!

And this dude remembers what happened too? He is very sorry and she assures him that it's totally fine and that he didn't say anything compromising about his identity.

And so they go back to their normal lives

except-

she misses him? It was fun and it was all a spell, but she misses him. It's silly, because there's no way a whole ass vigilante with probably a busy life is interested in silly romance?

And then this guy finds her one time as she was going home. He's just checking on her, really, because it must have been stressing dealing with all of that. He says he is sorry about being clingy and, well, she's been cool about it but wanted to make sure it was all fine.

He's being nice, she thinks.

He asks her if it could be cool to keep in touch. Because, uh, books? He wanted to know more about that theory she mentioned and maybe when they had a free schedule she wanted to grab a drink?

Yeah, sure. She gives him her number. How else would he contact her? By being a creep and stalk her to her house? No thank you.

And that's how Jazz ends up being courted by a Bat and doesn't realize what's going on.

Yes I hc her as aspec, what about it

-----

OOF

THIS GOT OUT OF MY HANDS!

If anyone wants to add, go ahead!

[aangelinakii]

YOUNG JUSTICE LOVE LANGUAGES.

characters written about in this piece : conner kent, wally west, kaldur'ahm, m'gann m'orzz, artemis crock

not proofread !

note : if you're looking for dick grayson, as he was a member of young justice ( obvi ) he and the other batfam members are written about in this post ! <3

CONNER KENT — quality time

i can't see conner as an overly (physically) affectionate person, as his other stronger emotions are often more evident within him. he doesn't feel comfortable with physical touch; he's been through a lot, just not his kind of thing. he has a lot of suppressed rage, so doesn't know how to express himself through words in a charming way, poor guy. so i think he finds quality time most peaceful. he can control the boundaries of it; how close you are together, how long you spend it together, what you guys do. obviously he is receptive to your boundaries, too, but he feels most at peace just being in silence and spending time together, even if just doing separate things but in the presence of one another.

his favourite ways to spend quality time : doing separate things, like chores or hobbies, whilst in the same room , cooking together , reading the same book, nodding when you've finished the page so he can turn to the next one , sparring or working out together

WALLY WEST — physical touch && words of affirmation

the way i see wally, he's quite a casually touchy person, implementing physical touch into daily situations with his friends and loved ones. he loves a good, even short, hug upon seeing someone, or a high five, handshake, dap-up with a friend. literally anything, he will take it in stride. i also think he can be quite hormonal and touch-starved, especially as a teenager, so he enjoys casual physical intimacy. i don't think there's a reason for this, he's just that type of person. loads of people are just touchy people, and that's okay.

he also is a talky person, can't shut up, won't ever shut up. sometimes the things he says can be a bit.. off putting, but we all know he's just a lovely guy. without realising, wally will give compliments, or give praise to those he loves. another love language of his is words of affirmation, done in a casual way, not meant to be taken seriously. but when he's in love, or crushing on someone, they're definitely meant to be taken more seriously.

favourite forms of physical intimacy : a hug when he sees you again , a high five after winning a team game , slinging an arm over your shoulder or around your waist as you walk side-by-side , legs tangled as you lay in bed watching a film together

words that he means : "you look so amazing right now" , "you did great!" , "you need to teach me that next time, i want to be just as good as you" , "you have the best smile. you know that, right?"

KALDUR'AHM — words of affirmation

he's reserved in a group setting, even with close friends, but i feel as though kaldur would be extremely romantic, but not outwardly so. he keeps his romantic gestures behind closed doors, away from prying eyes, meant only for the two of you. he doesn't show off, he has nothing to prove. but when it's just you two, he cherishes and adores to no end, but not in an overwhelming way; he knows his boundaries. i think he most likes to use words of affirmation to show affection. he has a great voice, just imagine him praising you and reassuring you. i feel like he also likes to receive affirming words, too, since often his motives are wrongfully questioned. he likes feeling trusted, and being shown that he is.

words that he means : "i'm so proud of you" , "i'm so lucky to have you in my life" , "the universe really took its time with you" , "i would choose you in every lifetime"

words that he appreciates : "do you know how handsome you are?" , "i trust you" , "you're so important to me, i hope you realise that" , "i feel so safe with you"

M'GANN M'ORZZ — acts of service ( && close proximity. )

m'gann is the type to feel like she needs to prove herself, even to those she loves; especially to those she loves. she wants to be enough, feel like enough, seem like enough. and so she tries to show her love, through acts of service. even something as small as picking lint off your clothes, to something as grand as making a whole roast dinner for you to come home to. part of her does these things out of hopes that she will receive the kind acts, too, but part of her does them because she wants to show you what love feels like, because she exists, and she is full of it.

i don't see her as an incredibly touchy person, but i feel that, because she is so positively consumed by a person when she falls in love with them, she just wants to be near them all the time. m'gann can be overly aware of boundaries, and doesn't want to do anything wrong to make anyone uncomfortable, so that's part of the reason why she isn't touchy, as well as her own preferences. but she absolutely adores close proximity, just being in the presence of the one she loves as much as she can be.

ways she likes to show her love : cooking you food , tying your shoelaces , taking off your makeup for you after a long day, if you wear it , starting your day with a warm cup of your favourite drink , peeling the skin off your satsumas

ARTEMIS CROCK — quality time

similar to conner, i don't see artemis as an incredibly touchy or affectionate person. she's private, as shown by the lengths she goes to in order to keep her family background a secret, and would want to keep any romantic relationship under wraps as much as she can. instead of showing her love through hugs or icky sweet words, artemis likes to share quality time with her significant other. she thinks it has a wide meaning; you can do pretty much anything with another person and call it "quality time." she likes that it's not too committal, and she feels like she can leave at any time (not that she would want to, but not that she would say that.)

her favourite ways to spend quality time : playing video games together (she's a naughtydog lover) , sitting in the car or on its hood eating something from your favourite food truck , stargazing , exercising together , calling you when she's on her way home

[internetgiraffekid1673]

Ramblings About Batfam Comics I Read This Week

So. I spent this week reading unhealthy amounts of batfam comics, and I have thoughts!

I have now read the entirety of the Red Robin solo comic, all of Batgirl Volume 3 (Stephanie Brown's batgirl run), Batman: the Road Home because I kinda had to for context, about half of the currently running Batgirls comic (Cass and Steph share the Batgirl role with Barbara as their mentor and also sometimes Batgirl), and The Dark Knight Returns by Frank Miller.

Why these? Simple, I wanted to read Batgirls, I wanted Red Robin Tim, and I wanted Carrie Kelley's existence. So, without further ado, here are my major thoughts!

You know me, my ramblings turn into long essays, so it all goes under a cut and subsections! As per usual, TL;DR at the bottom!

Multiple Comics:

1. Comics are funnier than we give them credit for. Even the edgiest ones I was reading left me cracking up every once in a while.

2. I have maintained this since I first started learning about the BatFam, and I will maintain it till I die---Batman has partners, not sidekicks. They don't follow his orders. He doesn't LET them do anything. He runs around doing damage control while a bunch of absolutely feral children fight crime. Batman doesn't make heroes. He finds heroes and makes sure they have access to a decent first aid kit, training, and some morals.

3. Stephanie Brown is a BAMF who does NOT get the love she deserves. Not only is she smart, determined, and awesome in a fight, she's got something that many batfam characters lack: kindness. Stephanie is sweet and adorkable and nice to everyone while still managing to be a chaotic, hypercompetent, sarcastic menace to society. I'll go into more details under the Batgirl v. 3 section, but I am now a massive Stephanie Brown stan, and I will not tolerate slander! Put some respect on the name of Stephanie f*cking Brown!

4. I am now both a shipper of TimSteph and CassSteph. With occasional HarperSteph. This is unsurprising. I have multiple characters I like together in most mediums, and I don't give a crap about canon, so I can ship whichever one I'm in the mood for! :)

5. In a similar vein, reading the comics very much stoked my already strong DickBabs fire. I love me so Birdflash, RobStar, and Babs/Kara, but I'm beginning to think DickBabs is my favorite combo.

6. Stephanie's OG spoiler costume is her best one, but she's at her best characterization as v. 3 Batgirl.

7. F*CK YOU NEW 52! Nobody likes you, and you ruin everything! You robbed me of my favorite incarnations of these characters! DEATH TO THE NEW 52! BURN, YOU DISGUSTING INSULT TO NARRATIVE CONSISTENCY!

8. Damian and Dick as Batman and Robin are honestly precious together. I only got bits and pieces viewed through Batgirl and Red Robin's eyes, but I really like them and their dynamic with both each other and everyone else. I think my favorite thing is definitely that they have named combo moves where they complete each other's quips. It's adorable.

9. Bruce is a well-meaning a**hole. He really does care about his family, but he needs to trust them more and get MUCH better at communicating.

10. Did you know everybody has a cool base outside of the Batcave? Damian and Dick are based in Wayne Tower, Tim has his Nest, Babs has the Clocktower, and Steph's Team Batgirl has the Firewall which is below Oracle's apartment.

Red Robin Solo Run

1. Tim is one cool BAMF. Man fought the whole Court of Spiders at once---who were killing League of Assasins members for fun BTW---and won and got the civilian bystander out safely. He blew up ALL of Ra's Al Ghul's bases, then fought off Ra's double threat of a hostile takeover on Wayne Enterprises and attempts to assasinate all of Batman's loved ones. He took down the evil, corruptive, hive-mind dark-net that supervillains use to communicate (yes this is a thing that exists). He successfully got evidence that Batman was alive when NOBODY else believed him and then was one of the first to actually know he was back and easily pass Bruce's tests (yes, Bruce tested people instead of telling them he was alive, because he is a well-meaning a**hole).

3. Tim is an edgy teenager. He does at least as much brooding as Batman, but with this sarcasm and dry wit behind everything that Batman doesn't really have. Tim has a consistent "Well f*ck my life, I guess," mentality that is FASCINATING to read, and is the source of a lot of his humor. He has a habit of reacting to really dramatic and serious situations with a deadpan "Welp. That ain't good. Guess I'll either figure it out or die trying."

2. Tim is apparently a chick-magnet. Just in Red Robin, he's got a thing going with Tam Fox and Lynx, Prudence Wood thinks he's sexy, he almost gets raped by Ra's Al Ghul's half-sister, and he and Steph still have feelings about each other that primarily consist of "why does my ex have to be so hot?" I am now incorporating this fact into ALL of my headcanons. It also makes for some fun drama, because all of these ladies (except maybe Steph) are way more into Red Robin than they are Tim Drake, even if they're aware of his identity. I find this objectively hilarious.

3. Tim's cowl is stupid. Apparently, the artist got the memo about halfway through the comic since tim has a pretty cool, uniquely shaped domino mask when he's in the Ünternet. This should be his mask in all appearances. Clearly unique to Red Robin, but not the stupid earless cowl.

4. Tim has SOME sort of neurodivergence going on because my man hyperfixates like nobody's business. He literally has a page where he rambles about how something'll catch his attention and he'll get sucked into it and give it his whole focus and be unable to stop thinking about it, to the detriment of his other commitments.

5. Tim somehow manages to have a thriving social life and no social life at all, and the comic agrees with me. He regularly teams up with the Teen Titans and other Gotham Weirdos TM. He's got a civilian ally/life companion in the form of Tam Fox. He has his guy in the chair, Money Spider a.k.a. Anarky a.k.a Lonnie Machin. He's got Prudence Wood and a couple of other folks with questionable morals on his payroll. And of course, he's got Bruce. He even tells Ra's at some point, "I'm not Batman. I have friends." But he also seems to do a really good job at not telling people things and thus being isolated anyway. He doesn't really doesn't share much of his personal stuff with anyone, especially not initially, so they can't really help him with stuff or provide him with the right companionship. This is perhaps most evident in his relationship with Tam Fox, which he effectively destroys by not telling her that her father Lucius isn't actually dead, and Tim just faked it for one of his plans. He didn't even forget, he just deemed not telling her the best course of action. Both he and Batman are concerned about this.

6. Tim has MASSIVE supervillain vibes. Like, Tim would make the BEST supervillain if he hadn't decided to be so heroic. Lemme. Lemme just give you a list.

Tim has a hit list. And those aren't my words. He calls it a hit list. It's mostly supervillains, and he specifically designs his schemes so that one arrest leads directly into the next. But it also has Robin as a contingency plan and a couple of other people who are decidely not bad guys.

He's a schemer. Bruce's whole test for him involves testing how he does at improvising because Tim has a penchant for creating carefully crafted plans like some sort of maniacal supervillain. And they work pretty much every time.

Tim's subconscious mind manifests as The Riddler. Lemme explain. While Tim is in the virtual reality, Ready-Player-One-esque dark net that the supervillains have set up, his attempt to puzzle out what's going on manifests as The Riddler giving him cryptic clues. The Riddler. THE RIDDLER! This is decidedly his own doing, not the Ünternet's.

Tim keeps his morals because he promised Batman, not because he actually has those morals himself. This sounds worse than it is. It's not like he actively wishes to break his moral code, he just comments multiple times in sticky situations that he would do X thing if it wouldn't be so disappointing to Batman and other people. On multiple occassions (see, blowing up the LoA bases), he actually does X thing because he thinks it's more important than approval.

Tim has ambitions to make Gotham the leader of the world. He specifically starts a number of international outreach programs for Wayne Enterprises with making Gotham the World Hub in mind. He has other altruistic reasons, but this is the one he's most focused on. This scheme also inspires Bruce to start Batman Inc., a.k.a. the thing Bruce has been doing since his return from his vacation in the time stream. Tim acknowledges that he's the inspiration and also that Bruce does not consciously know he was inspired by Tim.

He's manipulative and will work with all kinds of people if it serves his goals. This includes unpredictable people like Anarky, dangerous people like Man Bat, and morally questionable people like Lynx and Prudence Wood. His manipulation tactics mostly come in the form of cutting off other people's options until helping him is their best choice and withholding information until sharing it suits him. Batman in the making.

You see what I mean? Kid would make a GREAT criminal mastermind. Definitely got them villain vibes.

7. F*CK YOU NEW 52. The comic ended really abruptly on an ominous note with an unfinished plot because suddenly we had to do a whole reboot of the universe. Because the New 52 SUCKS!

Batgirl Volume 3

1. *ahem* STEPHANIE BROWN IS THE BEST CHARACTER! STEPH STANS UNITE! WE RIDE AT DAWN!

2. No, but seriously. I mentioned in the general section that Stephanie is a total BAMF who also has SO much heart! I think something really unique about her is her ability to be kind to and befriend literally anyone.

She becomes tentative friends with this absolute jerk girl Jordanna who's really mean to Steph because she's possesive of her friends, who all think Steph is cool. Steph doesn't judge, presses on, and manages to get Jordanna to at least accept her, if not be actively kind to her.

It's due to Steph's efforts that Wendy Harris a.k.a. Proxy a.k.a. Oracle in Training really feels accepted in her new hero role.

Steph looked at Damian in the height of his brat era and said, "You know what this kid needs? A bouncy house! Yeah, I'mma teach him how to have fun and be a kid by forcibly taking him to a bouncy castle!"

Batgirl is noted as. . .not as legal as Batman, but she still manages to make her own police force connection.

She's helpful and chill to Klarion the Witch Boy even though, as usual, all their problems in that issue are his fault.

She beats up a dude who's trying to blow up a train, and her ability and tenacity impress him so much that he becomes the Grey Ghost and tries to help her out. She thinks it's annoying and is worried about him (rightfully so, since he gets shot), but she does listen to him.

Steph will look at almost anyone with kindness and without judgement and has an astounding capability to befriend people because of this.

3. Steph is FREAKING HILARIOUS! Steph is probably the chattiest hero, especially when she's fighting bad guys, and it is both so effective and SO funny! She'll just start totally random conversations about WHATEVER while she's busy beating people up, and it makes me cackle every time. She also literally teaches people banter and gives them turns! It's amazing! Like, I'm not sure I'd call her quippy since she's not actually usually insulting people. She's just making casual, friendly conversation at really inappropriate times for it.

4. That's not the only way she's funny, either. Steph also has "inner monologue problems" where she'll say her thoughts out loud. This becomes a running gag to the point that Babs'll continually have to tell her she's using her "outside voice." It's funny and awkward every time! And then there's her habit of paraphrasing stuff that culminates when she tells Wendy the entire batfamily history in chibi doodles with absolutely zero respect. Never fear, Stephanie is here to make you laugh!

5. Steph is a GRADE A BAD-A**! My girl will challenge anyone, get in over her head, make decisions on the fly, and still win! Technically, this is a Batman Road Home Moment, but when Batman pulls his "I'm testing people instead of telling them I'm back" BS on Steph, she b*tch slaps him and then runs away while saying "I'm glad you're not dead." Bruce's only response is Bruce-speak for "I deerved that." When literally all of Gotham turns into mind controlled zombies that are after her, she outruns them by hijacking an equally mind-controlled ManBat, wrangling him until they crash into the airport, and then hitching a ride with Proxy in the T-Jet that they barely know how to fly. This works. Even when she's getting knocked around, Steph is kicking butt, taking names, and refusing to let her frankly awful lot in life get her down.

6. Steph is an improviser. My girl almost never has a plan. She thrives on the chaos. She's far more likely to disobey orders and go in guns blazing and figure it out on the fly than waste time trying to meticulously plan out something that'll probably go wrong anyway. Like, she knows the value of planning and does it every once in a while, but I feel like Steph would win almost any fight where both parties have 0 prep time simply because she's so much better at thinking on the fly and getting herself out of scrapes than anyone else.

7. Steph doesn't follow ANYONE'S orders because she is an independent adult, dammit! At the beginning of the issue, Cassandra Cain runs off to Hong Kong and hands off the Batgirl mantle to Steph. Literally everyone she comes across gives her crap for not being Cass, tells her to stop, and thinks that she shouldn't be doing that job. Everyone from random street level goons to Barbara and Dick. Steph doesn't listen and keeps going until she finally shows off enough determination that Babs gets her head out of her ass. Even after that, Steph'll happily disregard orders from Oracle, Batman, Red Robin, her mom, the cops and anyone else who tries to boss her around if she thinks it'll help. And the best part is, she's right almost every time. Steph has good judgement. She knows when she's right, and she won't let anyone tell her different.

8. I absolutely loved the dynamics between all the members of Team Batgirl. Babs taking Steph under her wing and helping her come into her own as Batgirl is amazing. One of the sweetest moments in the whole thing is when Babs gifts Steph the original Batgirl costume (she'd been using Cass's up until that point). In turn, Steph helps Babs open up and find joy and purpose in her life again, when she'd mostly been running on spite at that point. They also are so in sync with each other that it's hilarious. My favorite example is, in a situation that is getting progressively worse, Babs and Steph have the exact same inner monologue: "Crap. DOUBLE crap." It only gets better when Wendy's around, with Steph and Babs connecting to her issues each in their own way. It's beautiful and really helps Wendy grow as a person and heal her heart.

9. Steph needs to do more team ups with people. Yes, she's fantastic and compelling by herself, but she becomes downright marvelous when she's got someone to bounce off of, and her natural friendliness makes her a good pick for team ups. One of my favorite issues was definitely the one where she hung out with Kara and they beat up vampires together. It was adorable.

10. F*CK YOU NEW 52! WHY DID YOU TAKE THIS FROM ME?! WTF!

Batman: The Road Home

1. I only really read this one for context on what was going on in Batgirl and Red Robin, but I do have a couple thoughts.

2. Alfred and Co. have basically kidnapped Hush a.k.a. Thomas Elliot and are holding him hostage in a penthouse. They force him to do appearances as Bruce Wayne while Bruce is still missing, and he is soooooooo salty about this. This is objectively funny.

3. Vicki Vale is actually a really cool character who deserves better. A bit lacking in the common sense and self-preservation departments, but cool nonetheless. She's pushy and invasive and catty, but she is good at her job and I would be just as irritated as her if I had fallen as far from grace as her.

3. Bruce, you're an a**hole. You wanna tell people you're home instead of putting them through insane tests of skill and character while disguised as some random and possibly malevolent vigilante? They GRIEVED you! Some of them are probably STILL grieving! Give Dick a hug dammit!

4. Ra's, you're a creepy weirdo. Go back to brooding in your vampire box now please!

The Dark Knight Returns by Frank Miller

1. These books are REALLY FREAKING GOOD. I know, who woulda thought, seeing as how it's one of the most popular and talked about Batman comics ever. But seriously. You should read these. I was reluctant to do so, since a lot of people were like "Oh it's Frank Miller, he's edgy, and his Batman has all the tired edgy Batman tropes." I'm sorry, you don't see him using guns, you don't see him killing anyone, you don't see him being a terrible person. This Batman NEEDS a therapist. Desperately. But he's also still a good person. This is ACTUALLY cool edgy Batman, where his issues are used to create a more compelling narrative, not the "cool" edgy Batman that operates under the "grimdark is cool" principle.

2. I almost cried a couple times! This comic has an overwhelming melancholy feel that I just really enjoyed. Everything and everyone feels tired and sad. Everyone. The best part is that this comic is told primarily from Bruce's perspective and Bruce is SO empathetic and caring, that he feels not only his own melancholy, but everybody else's too, and it's so effective! I think the best example is when Two-Face, recently released from Arkham, goes full relapse and Batman is forced to tie him up and leave him for the cops. He looks at Harvey and just goes "That's a kindred spirit, and I feel for him."

3. The story is told interspersed with TV stations and news radio fighting and bickering and reporting. Nobody is quite sure what to make of the Batman situation, and almost all of them feel negatively about it. The only reporter who actually seems in support of Batman is Lana Lang, and she's also one of the few people who feels RATIONAL during the comic. Like, everybody is reacting very poorly and with panic and contempt towards Batman's return, and it really really isn't helpful. You get this feeling of "it's us against the world," and it really contributes to the vibes.

4. Bruce is an old man. He's technically only 55, but a lifetime of fighting crime, trying (and failing to quit), and becoming dependent on alcohol to keep away the nightmares and the call to dress up as The Rodent of Vengeance will seriously mess up your body. Every time he gets in a fight, he is extremely conscious of how slow he is, how much more he can feel each hit, how much of an advantage all of the youngsters he's fighting have on him. It's to the point that he literally has to plan around his old age and failing body.

5. Alfred is PEAK SASSY in here, and it's beautiful! I actually think this might have the best characterization of Alfred, like, ever. He loves Bruce. That's his kid. Not his master. His kid. He's not gonna leave him alone. But, he also has too much dedication to his role as "butler" to actually stop him from doing anything STUPID, so he resorts to just sassing the man RUTHLESSLY instead. And for all the sass he gives Bruce about being Batman, he's also just as deep into this weird lifestyle. The highlight is definitely Alfred telling Bruce after the first night out that if it's suicide he's after, Alfred has an old family recipe that will be just as slow and excruciating, but less illegal.

6. Commissioner Gordon does not, never has, and never will get paid enough for dealing with this. Commissioner Yindel has no idea what steaming pile of sh*t she's just stepped into, and Gordon tried to warn her. Gordon, even though he continues to not particularly approve, remains one of Batman's staunchest allies through the whole thing. It's actually really heartwarming to see their "brothers in arms" thing they've got going.

7. OHMIGOSH CARRIE KELLEY! That is one AMAZING Robin right there!

Do you know how she becomes Robin? She sees Gordon turn on the batsignal, and she's ✨inspired✨ She saves up two weeks of lunch money, buys a Robin costume, grabs a slingshot and some fireworks, and starts fighting criminals and discreetly following Batman around. Like, that's just some sheer tenacity right there! My girl has moxie! She has grit! She has heart! She's the perfect Robin!

Anytime I do stuff with Carrie Kelley, I will be including the fireworks. Her first act as Robin is to stick a firecracker in a mugger's back pocket. Seriously.

Her first thing she does with Batman is to follow him to a really dangerous fight, find him at the end, drag his unconscious, broken body back to the batmobile, splints his arm with her girl scout training, and get him back to Alfred so he doesn't DIE! Batman, already feeling extremely sad because he misses Dick, decides to train her and take her on.

Poor Carrie! Her parents are awful! Like, they don't remember they have a kid level awful! Being with Bruce might be child endangerment, and he might be a quiet stoic bastard who keeps threatening to fire her, but at least he acknowledges her existence!

Carrie, my darling, my dear, my sweet baby girl, I don't understand HALF the stuff that comes out of your mouth! You and your 80s slang. Sweet mercy.

8. I think this universe had a. . .um. . . Marvel Civil War thing. Like, the whole thing is that Superman works for the government, invisibly, instead of publicly. He has to follow their orders, and he doesn't like it, but it does mean he still gets to save people. Oliver/Green Arrow apparently didn't listen and is rotting in jail (Bruce has to bust him out in the last issue). It's implied to be, along with the death of Jason, the thing that made Batman quit. Now that he's back, the whole government is NOT HAPPY about it. They mostly just try to ignore him with "not my circus, not my monkeys," but, the president does sic Clark on him to try to talk him down. Clark predicts that this'll go badly, but tries anyway. His prediction is correct.

9. Poor Selina! You didn't deserve that. TBH, nobody except Joker deserves what happens to them in this book. It's all just really tragic and sad.

10. Bruce is a deeply unwell man in this comic. Like, he definitely seems at his most emotionally healthy and lucid while he's being Batman, but that kind of obsessive drive clearly isn't good for him, mentally or physically. He's kind of just, purposeless and slipping away before he takes up the cowl, and afterwards, he is so so sad and feels like he's succumbed to his worst impulses. It's a lose lose lose situation for him. Poor dude.

11. F*ck you Joker. 'Nuff said. Stay dead this time please.

12. Batman, you've emotionally adopted Carrie. I know you're actively doing child endangerment and stuff, but you care about this little girl. You can stop referring to her as "good soldier."

13. The shot of Batman on the horse makes me want to write a Wild West AU of Batman, because that was a vibe and a half!

14. Just go read this one, seriously, it's good.

TL;DR

I know I didn't put in a segment on Batgirls, but I wanna finish that one first! It'll probably get it's own post!

Basically, this post boils down to:

Batfam comics are really great. I like reading the comics. At least the outdated ones that I was reading.

Steph is the best, put some respect on her name.

Comic books are funny.

Comics are heartwarming.

Tim has supervillain vibes and sad wet cat vibes at the same time.

The Dark Knight Returns is really sad and really good.

F*CK THE NEW 52!

That's all I've got for you! I still gonna be stewing on these for DAYS, but this at least helped get it out of my system. Now go read some comic books!

[itshype]

My DC x DP Masterpost

Here is my masterpost of works that fall into the category of a crossover of DC comics and Danny Phantom. Mostly, these will be notfics. If any of the links are broken please message me ASAP. Edit: I will not be doing taglists because people are quite frankly abusing the idea.

What's a notfic?

So, this was really common in fandom like 10 years ago but it's less common now so I'm just including this quick explanation in case. Notfic/Not!Fic is the halfway point between an actual fic and a prompt. It mostly sort of has the tone of describing another fic to somebody, or working out an ongoing plot with a friend (e.g. Instead of writing out an entire set of dialogue, a notfic might just put "Jason and Tim discuss why they both want to fake their deaths").

Permissions Housekeeping

I totally don't mind if anyone wants to take all or part of what I've written for any prompt and write an actual fic or create another transformative work as long as I'm appropriately credited. If you're just taking the most oblique inspiration from something I've made I'd appreciate at least a tag so I can read it!

Also if you'd like to tag me in any of your works please do, provided that it's the first if it's in a series and not Jazz/Jason as the main pairing, please.

Works

Kingmaker, Kingbreaker, Crowntaker, Realmshaker

Danny isn't the Ghost King but after defeating Pariah Dark the new king knows Danny has massive political influence.

Navigate any storm, with nothing but the stars to guide you

Danny is obsessed with space so the whole 'superhero' thing is on the backburner.

Please don’t pet me! I am working!

Repeat after me, SERVICE ANIMAL CUJO. (Minor Connor Kent/Danny Fenton)

It's a boy, congratulations... to me!

Danny insists Connor is his clone even though he's really not.

Gaslight, Gatekeep, Girlboss, Godhood

Danny gets caught and tells the JLA that neither he nor Vlad are ghosts.

New type of Vlad just dropped

When a ghost's obsession is destroyed, they get a new one.

Mother of the Year

Talia Al Ghul gets to be a good mother. As a treat.

Amorpho Whomst?

Danny, Dani and Dan trade off on responsibilities.

Halfa? Half a What?

Danny's half human, no one's sure what the other half is.

The second, secret Justice League

There's another Justice League that not even the Justice League is cleared to know about.

Excuse me, do you work here? Danny is sent to represent the first, non-secret Justice League.

Triple Threat

The Champion of All Magic and The King of All Ghosts have a mutual triplet.

Like peas in a pod [person]

Jason is healed of the pit rage but has a whole new problem.

There's a Mr Wight Hood to see you?

Jason adopts Danny instead of being the Red Hood.

The Wight Baby For The Job Sequel to Mr Wight Hood

You Make Miso Scared

Danny's always talking about soup time.

Reverse Bruce

Give baby Jason MORE PARENTS!

Work Experience

Danny has to learn about Ghost culture before he can rule it.

Mansplain Yourself

Constantine probably knows best about ghosts over the Justice League's newest member...

The Opposite of a Golden Ticket

International star Ember McLain is in danger

Haustoria Horror

Undergrowth's got Poison Ivy

Like and Survive!

Danny runs an advice website for young heroes

You're not the Boss of me!

Batman accidentally outs his family to Danny

This is a PSA

Danny's Wail affects the JLA

Floral Fiasco

Poison Ivy errs

How I Met Your Brother

Dan joins the JLA

The Manhunter's Manhunt

There's a miscommunication with the Martian Manhunter

The Green Knight

Jason lives (just this once)

___

The Job

Danny's gotta put food on the table (Also available in DP only version)

Always A King (DC x DP)

The Realms must have a king

Series: The Surprise Obsessions of the Ghostly Batclan (image heavy)

Ghost Bruce HC

Ghost Jason HC

Mini prompts

Danny Phantom vs The IRS ; part 2

Phantom's mistaken identity

Billy and Danny are secret twins

Danny scars the batfam

Superheroes need more therapy

All-caste Jason

Poison Control

[zahri-melitor]

All right analysis of this that I am NOT putting on ink's poll:

Lian Harper: up until last year 100% should have been the vote. Get that child out of Alleytown and into a location where people can actually let her father know where she is. Right now though - she's with Roy, Roy's definitely not moving in, so Lian should be wherever her Dad is.

Dinah Lance: pros to this include the fact she 100% did not actually move in, she's just staying in Barbara's room, or Barbara and Dick's room, or if she does acquire a room it's some Summers Moon Mansion bullshit right next door to Babs' room where everyone is confused as to why Dinah officially has a room. But she's more of a supporting Batfam cast member than at least half this list.

Alan Scott: Does Alan even know Bruce's identity at the moment? Alan has perfectly reasonable housing already in Gotham, if anything he probably has a townhouse in the same neighbourhood as BRUCE'S last townhouse.

Marcus Shugel-Shen: he is on my to-read list and he's actually a teenager I believe? Also my quick glance at his wiki page suggests this is the Drama Pick. Let's not traumatise the teenager further.

Cole Cash: I am trying to avoid learning more about Grifter but also isn't he dating Zealot or something? And used to work as security for the Foxes? Does Pennyworth Manor really need more security? (also if Jason isn't invited Cole Cash is definitely not invited)

Jace Fox: on one hand he's a Batman. On the other, surely everyone would invite Luke instead?

[gffa]

Can I ask your opinion on something? It's about Jason and the way hes written in a lot of batfamily comics, because I can't shake the feeling that in a lot of stories he's in theres is this rather... condescending attitude towards Jason. They are always writing him as this angry impulsive idiot who can't deal with a case or have plan of his own and basically needs Bruce and the others to save him.

For example, take Cheer, a lot of people been calling the best story Jason had, but it still repeats so much of the annoying tropes that Jason gets: He's written tob e really impulsive and dumb and prone to mistakes that the others would never make, and who Bruce to explain him to not attack drug addicts, and them you have to flashbacks that are there to retroactively insert instances of him being a "bad robin" who would torture a random person for no reason and killed someone before he even became robin. And whole story gives the idea that the only reason Jason can be good in anyway is because Bruce stopped from going bad.

then In the failsafe arc when Bruce is praising Tim he has to make a mention about how Jason hated training as a robin, which is not the first time Bruce has compared Jason negatively to prop Tim.

And now in The Gotham War, Jason gets brainwashed by Bruce with that failsafe thing. And it's treated as this big awful thing... until one issue has passed, and then Jason's already resisting the symptons long enough to try to save someone but not enough to actually succeed at by himself, and Bruce saves him by giving him a piggyback ride that treats Jason like child. And Bruce leaves without fixing what he did.

Like compare Jason now with the way he was before the New52 in stories like Under the Hood or the Lost Days. Jason back them as more often than not a villain, but he was a good villain, he was intelligent and competent in a way he is simply not anymore, and makes so mad that nonee these modern stories seem to actually respect him as a character and just make really made and it just ruins most Batfam media for me.

Take this for what it is--someone who is not as deeply into Jason's character as others are and who is more of a general fan (and specifically a fan of my own Blorbo)--but my feeling with Jason's character is that DC doesn't really know what they want to do with his character and so he gets written as incredibly inconsistently by various comics because of it. So often when I look at the bigger scope of his appearances, it's not clear if he's supposed to be a villain, a villain on the way to being reformed, an antihero, a misunderstood hero, or what. And that also tends to influence his relationship with Bruce on a narrative level, how much Bruce is "right" or "wrong" about Jason or even often how he acts around the other Batfam members, especially if he gets an author who is a fan or if he's just there to be the impulsive hothead who needs others to step in. To some degree, that's just how comics are--every character is written as the dumb idiot sometimes when they're not in their own book. I often Suffer as a Dick Grayson fan or a Tim Drake fan or a Barbara Gordon fan, when I pick up another character's book for them. There can be great appearances in non-titular characters' books! But a lot of the time, when I'm reading, I have to look at the title and go, okay, Blorbo's not going to be treated as well as they should because this isn't their book. And I think that's a big chunk of what happens with Jason, one that gets exacerbated because it's not really clear what his role in the group is meant to be.

(Like, there is a VERY noticeable difference in the way Jason is written in Task Force Z--a book designed to center around him--versus when he shows up in a cameo in another book. Or there is a VERY noticeable difference in the way Dick is written when he cameos in a Batgirls book versus who he's written in his own central title. Comics, you know?) So, you're not wrong that Jason gets written weirdly a lot, but I don't see it as totally unique to his character, because it's somewhat just kind of part of the landscape of comics and somewhat just that Jason gets it more intensely than other characters because he never really had the solidification of who/what he was supposed to be in the comics, like even when Tim is written really badly and they refuse to let him evolve, at least you understand what his role is in the family, so a lot of authors have a baseline for how he should be treated. (And I don't know how well he actually does/doesn't sell comics, which is often a big influence in how a character will get treated in stories they appear in, like Bruce is probably DC's single biggest seller, so he's always going to have a baseline of being intended to be cool and heroic--mileages vary on how that comes off, but I think the intention is there, even when writing him as fucking up sometimes--like Jason is tremendously popular in fandom, but does that actually translate to selling comics? I have no idea.) I think it's fair to say that, look at almost any character in the Batfam, and they'll have a period where a lot of fans feel like they're being written the way you're describing Jason being written right now--I could probably find you people who would say similar things about Dick, Tim, Damian, and Babs right now, too, that they're being written as incompetent and like they need someone to hold their hand just to cross the street without messing it up. But also that you're not wrong that Jason is probably getting the worst of it and it's one of those things that I often have just had to learn to roll with when it comes to comics or else just walk away. (Sooooo many times I had to nearly walk away from comics because I dislike what's happening at a certain point and, often times, I have had to walk away. I walked away from DC because of it. I walked away from X-Men comics because of it. I walked away from Thor comics because of it. It's only recently that I came back to DC to give them another chance and, honestly, I'm only staying because I'm getting what I want for my Blorbo. That's kinda how comics often are, if you're here for a Blorbo, rather than here for the entire roster. /says without judgement, as I know what I am too)

[hyperanaemia]

Sorry, I don't mean to disappear for months, but I've been getting back into reading comics after taking a super long break to play bg3. So, I've finally gotten around to reading the Knight Terrors: Robin issues that have been sitting in my 'to read' box months after they've been relevant. I’m sure everyone else had a bunch to say when it came out but here’s my two cents. 

The issues just really fall flat to me. Like, I wasn't expecting a two-shot to be a deep dive into Tim's dead-dad trauma or anything, but I do feel like it misses what the core fear/horror that surrounds Jack's death is. 

Like, the KT issues posset that what Tim fears the most is failing to save people, with his dad's death being the figurehead of that. That this failure is what makes him unworthy of being Robin. I'm not going to say that isn't true, that reasoning definitely factors into Tim's trauma. But it also just feels basic to me.

Like, 'failing to save a loved one' is one of the most basic superhero tropes at this point. I'd be hard pressed to think of a hero who hasn't failed to save someone they know. It might as well be a rite of passage.  

(In fact, here's a panel of Tim thinking as such about his parents in an issue literally called Rites of Passage.) 

Also, Tim has already had a 'crisis of faith' arc after failing to save someone with the character of Eldon Adams (Young El). It had a very big impact on Tim and the fallout of that lasted for several issues.

Identity Crisis certainly has its flaws and at times I question the need to kill off Jack in the first place. But, to me anyway, Jack's death is beautifully written and manages to tie his and Tim's decades-long storyline off in an interesting way. 

The important point to make about Tim in relation to all this is that he chooses to be Robin. He was never picked, he was never fated, he was not born to do it. Robin is something he actively chooses to be. At first, it's an easy choice to make. Tim reasons that since his parents are off doing their own thing it won’t be an issue if he’s gone all the time. But, as time goes on, Jack starts spending more time at home, wanting to spend more time with Tim. The issue "resolves" in this instance by having Jack's time get taken up when he starts dating Dana Winters. But this tension continues to be a major subplot throughout Tim’s series. Tim and Jack’s already strained relationship is constantly made worse by Robin.     

Tim feels guilty that his duty as Robin keeps getting in the way of his relationships. Tim's friends like Ives and Ariana are constantly stood up or brushed aside. Anything that ties Tim to the normal life he used to have is always being balanced against Robin. And for as much as Tim tries to maintain it, for as much as he says his normal life is what keeps him grounded when push comes to shove Tim always ends up choosing Robin.  

The thing that makes Jack's death different from all the other parental deaths in the Batfam, and the Identity Crisis did right, is that they made it a direct consequence of Tim choosing to be Robin. Bruce's parents were killed at random. Dick's were targeted in a situation outside of his control. Jason's mother was killed for her involvement with the Joker, which started before he even met her (and his dad with Two-Face).  

Jack was killed because his son was Robin. In Identity Crisis, Jean Loring targets the family members of heroes. She never would have hired Captain Boomerang to kill Jack if Tim wasn't Robin.  

(Obviously, none of this is to minimize any of these characters' pain or to say one is worse than another.)   

The added twist of the knife is that Tim had been spending that week with Jack instead of helping everyone find the killer. It's the one night that Tim chooses to go out as Robin again that Jack is killed. If Tim had stayed just one more night, even just one more hour, he could have saved his dad. And Jack lets him go because he knows how important Robin is to Tim.

This is more of an aside, I love this sequence of Tim ripping off his Robin uniform. Like obviously the intention is that Tim can't be seen wearing it when the police arrive. But the subtext to me reads that Tim is ripping Robin off, this thing that's come between them at every moment. Tim, before he even knows if Jack is alive or dead, doesn't want Robin to come between them anymore.

And Jack's death is something of a 'point of no return' for Tim. Before this, many of the people who know Tim is Robin have pointed out that he could always return to a normal life if he wanted to. Tim himself believes that he'll probably retire being Robin at some point. (I have my own thoughts that aren't relevant here about how that's more about him being practical as opposed to his genuine wish for his future, but I digress.) But after this, Tim is locked into the vigilante life. There's nothing normal he could return to. If he can’t be good at this, then what was the point? 

KT Robin just feels uninspired. It doesn't try to extract what makes Jack's death unique or interesting. It just picks the most surface-level takeaway you could have from it. Like, it's not just about being not good enough for the job. It's losing everything because you chose to do this job and you still don't know if you're good enough to do it.

[oatlystrawberryicecream]

Noticed that Jason’s loneliness shows itself when he trying to get in others’ heads. His interest in others’ capacity for the same kind of ruthlessness he’s grown into made me wonder how you think that would relate to the last ask you had about Batfam members who would reach out to him or understand him. For example, Barbara Gordon surrounds herself with people who keep her from going to dark waters. Do you think he would pick and prod at those vulnerabilities to bring her down to his level or do you think his respect for her would keep him from doing that? That interest is what I think would put others off him. Stephanie. Cassandra. Dick.

thank you for such an interesting question!

jason and loneliness: i think he has a strong preference for solitude and that he is actually pretty good about reaching out when he wants company. the ways he reaches out are often dramatic and unhinged, and he will lead with whatever indirect message he thinks will get his foot in the door before he reads the mood and determines if he is safe enough to open up. so it is a toss up whether he will get the companionship and support he wants. but he is good at starting the convo or conflict, whichever it turns out to be this time. he is like a cat that knocks your shit over and then when you scold them jumps on your lap and starts purring and making biscuits.

his enthusiasm at others’ capacity for darkness: everyone acts like jason is uniquely violent but he knows these people are no better than him. jason is discerning in his application of violence! i think regardless of whether he killed garzonas or not he learned what unintended consequences are from the aftermath (the dad’s revenge quest) and so he is pretty deliberate and calculating about that stuff now. all that being said the appeal in seeing other people act on their ruthlessness is to get it to click for them that they dont have anything over him. not everyone would have made the choice to kill captain nazi but everyone can feel ok about him being dead. jason would like for people to get off their high horse and admit it. he has always felt unfairly judged going back to being a kid taken off the streets and dropped into old money luxury, he can never shake the indignity of it, it is just for a different perceived flaw this time. plus like it speaks to the traumatized little boy who as a matter of survival needed to know how the people he was forced to rely on would respond in the worst case scenario. so of course he wants to be prepared for what level of danger he’ll see from them when the tides turn and he’s on the opposing side.

would he try to expose that dark tendency? maybe. i think if something arose that called the more upstanding comic book morality into question he would observe and take note. in some situations he will pointedly remark about how ineffective the dubiously legal vigilante shit is. he is a mouthy guy and his convictions are solid so he cant stop himself sometimes. he knows that not everyone is him and not everyone could live with the choices he has made but he doesn’t think that gives them a right to condemn him. it does not mean they can impose their perspective onto him or expect him to cede and conform for their sake.

for all that we love jason and connect to his story he is an off putting asshole at times. there is a part of him that wants to drag people over to where he is but i think he would rather keep them in his life than be right about them. for me a jason story doesn’t work if he has to constantly overcome his own worldview and ingrained morals to match up to what others want him to be. if it is gonna work i need more flexibility and open mindedness from bat adjacent people.

i dont have much in the way of specific character thoughts here other than he really does let his insecurity take a front seat when it comes to dick and ik it is an elseworld but in dc vs vampires when it was revealed dick was the vamp king jason’s reaction was very telling, also like brothers in blood.

[avayarising]

In the replies to this post:

@glitter-stained I’ve been thinking a bit about this.

The fairy tale I’m referring to is ‘The Last Tale of Thyl Ulenspiegel’, which I read in Fairy Tales from Many Lands. The virtues I’ve mapped on to the sins here aren’t quite the same as the ones in the story (which I didn’t quite agree with at age ten and still don’t now), neither do they come from any theology textbook. They are just my attempt to consider: what virtue, when overwhelmed by selfishness, would become this?

I’ve assigned a sin and corresponding virtue to each member of the core Batfam. (Sorry to Steph, Babs, and Duke, but they are quite literally supernumerary here.) Some of them display more of the sin and some of them display more of the virtue.

Bruce is obviously Pride, whose true form is Courage or Strength of Will.

Jason is just as obviously Wrath, whose true form is Compassion or Zeal for Justice.

Tim is, as suggested in the replies to the other post, Avarice, whose true form is Desire. (Yes, Desire is a virtue. You have to be capable of want to want the world to be a better place. Tim wants Batman and Robin to be the heroes Gotham needs, and maybe he wants to be one of them for himself too.)

Damian is Envy, whose true form is Ambition or Aspiration.

Dick is Lust, whose true form is Love. (I’m not trying to sexualise Dick with this. The difference between Lust as sin and Love as virtue is not, in my mind, to do with the presence or absence of a sexual element, but is the difference between thinking that someone’s purpose is to serve your needs and happiness and believing that yours is to serve theirs. Canon Dick is far from falling into that sort of Lust, but he certainly can Love.)

Cass is Gluttony, whose true form is Joy. (This isn’t really a great fit but the others all fitted someone else better. Like Dick, the sin’s not something she’s actually in danger of falling into, but she does very much enjoy nice things and pleasant sensations.)

Alfred is Sloth, whose true form is Peace or Serenity. (No, but hear me out. There’s not a one of that family that could be accused of being lazy. But Alfred has often shied away from the hard emotional work of being an actual parent to Bruce, hiding behind the façade of servanthood whenever he wants to avoid showing vulnerability or calling Bruce or other members of the family to account.)

I will accept arguments for the reassignation of any of these.