#anti elain stans

[theshadowsingersraven]

To be quite clear and disrespectful if needed, if you "can't remember"/ "had to Google to recall" the existence of a secondary character frequently involved with a main character to the point that they were mentioned 565 times in the most recent book, then it sounds like you don't pay nearly enough attention in narratives, and completely undermine the validity of your own opinions. And if I were SJM, I'd never want you to touch a single one of my books again if you were going to be dismissive of my character work--especially in favor of a lackluster ship I'd only created for the purpose of each character to have a rebound before their endgame.

Maybe take notes or something before burdening us all with your "hot takes".

[viajandopelomar]

II received a question about Elain in Portuguese from @hani-yo, so I'm bringing it to you in English so that more people can see it:

"bro, you know what's worse? I can't even imagine what's going to come out of Elain X Lucien. And I like Elucien, to be honest, because I think Elain could be the sweetness that Lucien is missing after all the disgrace this man has been through. But I don't know Elain, I'm not sure about her. Of all the sisters, I've always found her the most manipulative, since she hides behind her sweet personality and no one seems to notice.

She's the kind of person who doesn't say anything but inside must be dying of anger at certain situations. And even though I already knew that, I still didn't expect her to turn her back on Nestha, you know? Because the two of them were flesh and blood, even in the scams of wanting Feyre to give them money to go out and buy things, they were together.... So, after what she said to Nestha, I totally didn't understand her character anymore.

In fact, I think Sarah Janet has no idea what to do with the character of Elain"

For there are two of us, I don't understand Elain's personality as something useful in a fantasy story. She shouldn't be there. I might love this creature if she were in another genre, a warm romance, but fantasy??? She's so out of tune with the genre that she SLEPT during the battles and even afterwards, while the soldiers screamed in pain. She's actually a plant (which makes me think that in vrd I'd hate her in any book, unless she was actually an npc florist).

We don't have any information about her apart from the fact that she has doe eyes (I personally think of them as the eyes of a fool, because holy shit Feyre, couldn't you describe your sister's eyes better?), that she's the prettiest of the sisters, that she likes flowers and that she kept repeating all the time after she came out of the cauldron that she had lost her fiancé. That's all. Oh, and she also learned to cook later in the war, in a comfortable mansion, and not when they were in the hut 😂.

I also think that SJM doesn't know what to do with her. She must have regretted raising three sisters or not killing any of them.

Regarding Elain and Nesta, I have an opinion that will be very difficult for the author to undo in the plant book. Nesta is in no position to offer Elain anything else. When they were children, Nesta was in her mother's good graces and because Elain was her little doll, she saw that and became close to Nesta. In the hut, it's kind of implied that Nesta did all the housework since, canonically, neither Feyre nor Elain knew how to do anything, so next to Nesta Elain had a maid, who, having grown up seeing her mother treat Elain like a doll, had this ingrained thought that she was fragile. Nesta always saw Feyre as the wild girl who wasn't attached to anything (her mother's and grandmother's clutches), so Feyre, who was never as delicate as Elain, didn't need any attention. I'm talking about the context where they were all children, and how they grew up with THAT dynamic, Feyre never needed attention (but she ended up becoming unbearably needy, crying in Rhysand's lap all the time as if she were his daughter), and Elain got so used to it that now she has Feyre's graces, who grew up watching Elain being protected by Nesta.

In chapter 2 of ACOTAR, Feyre herself thinks that Elain simply DOESN'T THINK she could get her hands dirty and help, something like that. As if she was really dumb, on the same level as that boy who went viral for not knowing how to cut a loaf of bread and the beast who cut sausage, but to the characters she's just innocent and sweet.

So now Nesta is in a position where SHE needs Feyre, because she no longer has any authority. She's a war refugee in strange territory, surrounded by fairies she's learned to hate all her life (her sister is even to blame for this). Nesta is no longer in a position to take care of Elain, because her trauma has finally exploded after she suppressed it for Elain's sake, and Elain who was taken care of and protected by Nesta to the point that Nesta went to the meeting of the Grand Lords as a specimen for appreciation because no one would believe Feyre and Rhsyand, only for no one to dare offer the same offer to Elain. Same thing in ACOSF: they talk to Nesta, she denies it, they say they'll go to Elain, Elain shows up saying she'll go because then Nesta won't be able to threaten them (and they don't want that because they know her power is stifled and they don't want to take it up the ass), and then she's coerced into going.

Do we get any mention in that book of Elain actually learning to look for the objects in case Nesta can't? No, we don't, even though in IC's vision Nesta was rolling around in the library instead of just going there and taking a chance. Feyre would never really demand anything of Elain. She claimed that Elain wouldn't go near Eris, but Nesta should simply DANCE WITH HIM AND SEDUCE HIM! Elain is loving all this. She has more perks with Feyre who is married to Rhsyand than she had before with Nesta (I find it funny that she lives with them, by the way. Nesta has at least moved out of the couple's house. Elain also uses his money but still stays in the house 😂).

Nesta protected Elain and wouldn't let any fairy near her from the cauldron until Feyre came back, but Elain left Nesta the moment Nesta said that she had her life, and they had theirs. But Nesta always had her life and always looked after Elain so that she would remain this cute little doll. A life of care, practically, and in return she received abandonment. When Feyre goes to Nesta in that bar I remember Feyre mentioning that Elain wanted to see Nesta, or something, so Nesta said she could go whenever she wanted, and then Feyre said "you know she doesn't like places like that", but the point was Nesta, wasn't it? Why did it have to be about an environment for Elain, who was fine and laughing and drinking wine right after the war, but Nesta who had isolated herself because she couldn't stand how they were just GARGHAMING after leaving the battlefield had to go to a place Elain liked? Wasn't it Nesta who needed the "cure" now? Wasn't she the one who needed to be reached?

In the same way at the Casa, when Elain only showed up out of the blue after having the audacity to pack Nesta's things. And she left crying because for the first time Nesta didn't treat her like a little doll that needed looking after. It must have pained Elain to realize that she would no longer have Nesta's steel spine as a shield forever and ever. She realized that having done things behind her really did have consequences, and that Nesta wouldn't always welcome her (I would have loved it if this had been addressed in the book, but I'll have to make do with the fanfics), Elain even said that "Nesta's even trying", but she was doing everything she was told, training and working without being paid at the library, wasn't she? What is trying? How did Elain try? In the war she slept, then she laughed... I've never understood what healing in acotar is, why characters heal like that. In the spring Feyre was terrified of red, and at dinner with the IC (the first one, the same day she left the spring), she watched Amren drink blood quietly? That's more from the author, who doesn't address anything. She plays up the trauma and makes it seem serious, then a few pages later it becomes useless because it's no longer there, the personality healed with the magic stick. Nesta is dealing with it in the same way as before: sex. She has sex with Cassian to escape, but in the end nobody cares. Rhsyand smelled it the first time he took Emerie to the house and only let it go when one of the reasons Nesta was arrested WAS UNFREED SEX! But it's okay if the sex is with Cassian, the general, and he doesn't go crazy because his bond has been broken 😏. And elain, the cretin, still cried after the invasion of Nesta's space (again, elain and feyre are very whiny. Too much. That's why Nesta is seen as cold, because for IC it might be normal for girls feyre and elain's age to cry a lot, but Nesta doesn't do that, so feyre says Nesta is cold, and they agree) as if she were the victim, and Rhsyand was pissed. RHYSAND who is always talking crap like choices to everyone, but at the first opportunity is manipulating the choices of even her partner. Right from the start.

I laugh every time I remember Rhsyand telling Feyre that although gardening is something that bears beautiful fruit, it's important to remember that you have to get your hands dirty to reach your goal. I always think he's referring to all gardeners, because she's not even a real gardener, she doesn't do it. She uses Rhsyand's account and does volunteer work with the gardens destroyed in the attack on Velaris. I think Rhsyand also wants to use gardeners as psychics and weapons because he's incapable of doing politics using his brain. He has to destroy something and is happy to have a lot of magic to scare off the possible retaliation he might suffer as a consequence.

Elain is an opportunist, a puppy who wags her tail at whoever gives her the tastiest food.

I use a translator called DeepL, so maybe the English translation sounds a bit confusing

[silverflameataraxia]

Nesta coming home bruised and bleeding from the beating she just endured at the hands of her Grandmamma. Standing in the doorway of Papa Archeron's office, tears streaming down her face, hoping he'll look up and notice her. Hoping he'll care and protect her. But he's too busy with his spices to notice his battered young daughter standing there. Nesta quietly heads back to her bedroom so she can cover up the bruises before her sisters get home.

In the heat of summer, Nesta wears gloves and long-sleeved dresses. Elain and Feyre think their sister is a giant weirdo, but really she's trying to cover up her palms that are beaten raw and the bruises marking her body. Because as long as her sisters don't know about the abuse that she's suffering, she can handle it.

Little Feyre constantly interrupting dancing lessons because she wants to play with Nesta. Nesta, noticing the familiar rage on their Grandmamma's face, purposely falls so that their Grandmamma will beat her and not Feyre.

Young Elain going on and on about the flowers in bloom. Nesta notices the growing annoyance on their Grandmamma's face, so she says something to rile her up, so their Grandmamma will rip Nesta to shreds, but leave Elain's heart intact.

Nesta's favorite place is to be alone in her bedroom because only there can she let the tears flow. Only there will she not be beaten or have her heart ripped into a thousand pieces. But as long as it's happening to her and not her sisters, she can endure it. As long as the bruises are on her body and not theirs, she'll be okay. As long as their hearts are whole, it doesn't matter if hers is ripped to shreds.

When their Grandmamma finally dies, Nesta refuses to shed a single tear or lay flowers at her grave. Elain and Feyre think their sister is hateful and horrid, but really Nesta just refuses to cry or lay flowers for her abuser.

Nesta let's her sisters spend their childhood thinking everything is rainbows and unicorns when really it's a court of nightmares.

[kataraavatara]

keep waiting for the part in silver flames where Nesta was like “yeah, fuck it, let elain do it” when the ic kept holding it over her head that if she didn’t find the trove or do xyz for them elain would have to. like this girl packed up your shit behind your back and sent you off to the house of wind before coming up there, provoking you, and then acting surprised and playing victim when you understandably snapped at her, crying about some “she’s not trying hard enough” let elain lie in the bed she made i beg of u

[going-through-shit]

did rhys, cas, az, feyre, amren and mor not do practically the EXACT same thing tamlin did to feyre in acotar in to nesta in acosf or am i going insane?

all just a bunch of hypocrites imo

[thefatesofspring]

You honestly can’t make this shit up…

If there’s one thing Feyre & the majority of her crackhead stans are going to do it’s avoid taking accountability & pinning the blame on someone else.

Blaming Tamlin for Ianthe betraying him as well as Feyre might be one of the most delusional things Feyre & her stans have done yet, why the hell Feyre decided to say in the high lord meeting that Tamlin is to blame for the actions of another grown ass adult backstabbing him & her is beyond me!

In that meeting Feyre told Tamlin not to spin the narrative only for her to turn around & do the exact same thing…SPIN THE NARRATIVE!!

[elucienscourt]

One thing I know for SURE is that if Lucien was given the chance to fight Azriel and had the chance to win…he still wouldn’t do it. Not because he believes he wouldn’t win, but because he’s too mature for that and he would KNOW that Elain wouldn’t want violence to win her over.

My guy would be like “Nah I’ll give Elain all the time and space she needs without needing to resort to physical violence because I’m not desperate, and I actually understand her unlike SOME people…” and then walk away 😭

[maybeiwasjustjade]

I see so many post constantly degrading Nesta for being so nasty and mean and ungrateful; for using Rhysand’s money and staying on his land (not for free I might add) while refusing to play nice or care.

But isn’t that the bare minimum of what he owes her?

The IC and Feyre dragged Nesta and Elain into their world by manipulating them using their guilt over letting Feyre hunt for those 5 years when they were severely impoverished. Nevermind that Feyre doesn’t know how to cook or clean so someone had to have done that, or that someone was bound to do physical labor anyway. But I digress—the IC gave Nesta so much shit for refusing to be Feyre and Elain’s mom, for not being the one to take care of them by any means necessary (which we know would’ve been through marriage).

So the sisters agreed to help with the Human Queens, putting a major target on their backs. The IC sent away their staff and guards, promised to leave protection that failed miserably. Feyre told Ianthe about her sisters; Rhysand let the Attor live knowing that Hybern would have their location. So the sisters were taken—kidnapped and dragged and thrown into something that turned them into something they weren’t.

Murdered and tortured for however eternity it took to melt the flesh off their bones, for their bones to grow and lengthen, and magic to flow through their veins. There’s another word for this, you know? Nonconsensual body modification. And just because they came out young and beautiful and immortal, everyone around them expected them to be grateful. But what is there to be grateful for, if you were Nesta and Elain? Ripped from their finally stable human lives and love? Forced to join a war that had nothing to do with them until it eventually fucked them over too?

As far as I’m concerned, and how it should’ve been if SJM wasn’t so far up feysand’s ass, whatever debt owed by Nesta and Elain to Feyre was repaid in full when they were murdered over Feyre and the IC’s actions.

Elain came out of that Cauldron catatonic for months. Nesta came out something other, even for a Fae, and dripping with so much power that she made High Lords quake at the sight of her and that damned finger. And in order to spare Elain from further suffering, Nesta took the brunt of their missions and scrying, repressed and depressed as she was. Yet it was still them who killed the King of Hybern, effectively ending the war.

The bare minimum Rhysand owed them afterwards was a fucking lifetime of peace, and to be left alone if they wished with enough money to make a king cry. But that wasn’t enough for him was it? Feyre was pushy because she wanted Nesta around even when Nesta preferred to be literally anywhere else. I can understand that to an extent as a younger sister myself. But she went about it all wrong, and let her mate do what he does best: be a complete and utter bitch.

And if getting sexually assaulted and repeatedly nearly dying finding the Troves for the NC still wasn’t enough to repay whatever fucking ‘debt’ Rhysand and his stans seem to still think she owes (despite the dying and kingslaying), Nesta gave up a significant portion of herself to save Feyre, Nyx, and Rhysand. And despite his gratefulness, he still couldn’t help himself from berating her horribly behind Feyre’s back, even when Feyre herself has told him repeatedly to lay the fuck off her sister.

So, NO. Nesta shouldn’t owe squat to the NC and its shitty High Lord. Pretty sure at this point, he owes her more.

[riafalcone1]

Glees believing they ate when they said..."shame the az bonus isn't included means no forbidden love story for the elriels.... "

It's just that...we don't need the bonus for forbidden love...elriel are forbidden every which way.. with or without the bonus. The fact is a whole lot of elriel acosf moments.. him following the sound of her laugh...his shadows ready to defend her...are all elriel moments that build the love story to set up for their book. You can see their attraction to each other without the bonus and elain still has lulu as a mate sooooo yes its still forbidden romance

No az bonus in the new editions tho.. yep that means glees 5 mins of fame is an entirely ignored that her faction cling to as their Bible...

Sooo if it's not brought up again ...how does that line the ginger up as the next female protagonist?

[reblogandlikes]

Self insert Fandom

I've come to realise that most of the toxicity within the acotar fandom is often rooted in a ridiculous amount of self insert. They see a character as them, therefore their actions are absolved. They see another character in their abuser, or worse, 'as' their abusers and so they can never be impartial towards them, thinking the worst because in real life they've dealt with a lot.

I get it. Art can sometimes mimic reality, but they are indeed forgetting that this is a whole fantasy fiction book about human women turned fae getting dicked down with a hint of war and political intrigue. These characters are not, in fact, you or your abusers. Making the series so personal to themselves can then lead to a lack of introspection of the work as a whole made to be enjoyed and critiqued to the readers' preference, whether shallow or in depth.

But because this fandom in particular seem to make these books so personal than reading it as a piece of fiction, they're inflicting real world scenarios onto fictional characters and if their characters face any backlash or reasonable questioning, they take it as a personal attack which for some reason leads to insults and wild assumptions of very REAL people.

"No, no one is saying you should forgive your abuser mum, boyfriend, sister, because this literally isn't about you. I dont know you or your situation. Im talking about *insert character*."

"No, I don't think reactive abuse is OK, though I also don't believe lying about SA is OK either, let alone condoning SA."

"What do you mean it's abusive to lock someone up and then make an excuse to say it's not abuse to lock someone else up?"

The mental gymnastics is truly outstanding. If they're so called morally grey, let them be just that.

Speaking for myself, it's easy to find some commonality in a characters personality. It's written by a whole human who has a personality too, after all. But I do not attach myself to these characters as if they are my family members or those dear to me. They are, in fact, not real, and I will talk about them in the context of a fantasy text, generally.

Now the moment you take their actions out of a fantasy text, every character, and I mean, every character, needs to be dealt with the same scrutiny. Your faves will be called out and dragged. You cannot call real people names, but then think highly of yourself when your faves have done worse. What does that then make you? A racist? A misogynist? An AS denier? An abuse apologist? Someone who endorses apartheid? Someone who's OK with controlling the female body? A war criminal?

You see how absurd that all is?

Honestly, it's not that deep. But again, it's not bad to see yourself in character. Just realise that when people have some reservations about them, they are not calling YOU out. They are strictly talking about that character and that character alone. But maybe if you find so much offence, perhaps you should think about why that is. Look deep and figure out why it troubles you so much. Perhaps they're holding up a mirror, and you simply can not bear to look into it, seeming that that character represents you so much.

I think this is the only fandom I've been involved in where simply daring to disagree with the main MC and side characters can lead to online prosecution and just so much hostility. I've seen some truly nasty comments, and it's boggling. I can imagine how off-putting it may seem to newer readers.

I long for the days when people can talk about the characters and narrative alone without feeling the need to make disclosures about what they support in real life because it's truly unnecessary. I thought reading fiction was meant to be a form of escapism, not defending my moral standpoint.

If I said I enjoyed Katherine Pierce, Klaus Mikaelson and Kai Parker from TVD, what then? They're despicable, but fucking enjoyable. Don't get me started on Game of Thrones characters.

Alright, I'm done now 😅

[bookishwithathought]

[daybreakmusings]

Elain telling Nesta “All you can think about is what my trauma has done to you” was incredibly ignorant and no one can convince me otherwise.

For some reason, Elain thinks the trauma that had resulted from that night belongs solely to her and Nesta is being selfish for trying to take any ownership of it.

Everything in Nesta’s life, has always been about Elain. She came first and she never stopped to think about how it could impact Nesta. Very rarely does Nesta have the time to face her own trauma and learn to heal from it because she was always in environments/situations that put her on guard to protect her sister. And Elain has always been comfortable allowing her to do so while she retreats to the background where it was safe. She has never thought twice about putting Nesta in these positions all her life. 

When the sisters first come to Pythian, Elain completely checks out from the weight of the loss and trauma she has experienced. Which is completely understandable. But she isn’t the only one to have lost so much. So had Nesta. But at a time where Nesta may have needed her support, she wasn’t there. 

All Elain could think about was what their shared trauma has done to her. But Nesta never cared.

Those first few weeks in Pythian? Nesta was there to check on her. To make sure she is eating. To ensure her wellbeing. To see to her needs. To make sure she is comfortable.

In ACOSF, for the first time in Nesta’s life, she isn’t capable of putting Elain first. But Elain is unwilling to confront the possibility that the trauma they both experienced that night may have affected her sister differently than it did her. As a result, she avoids putting herself in a position where she might have to face the full extent of that truth.

I’m not saying that Elain doesn’t have a right to feel greatly impacted by what had happened to her. She went through alot. But she doesn’t get to pick and choose whose trauma that night was greater and warrants more concern.

[ofbreathandflame-archive]

Elain stans have such a weird relationship with Nuala and Cerridwen and I genuinely can't tell if they just choose not to look at the optics of that dynamic or what...

[silverflameataraxia]

People want to hate on Nesta for opening up to Gwyn and Emerie and not her sisters, but yet it doesn't really make sense for Nesta to open up to Feyre and Elain. Nesta protected them from twelve years of abuse. Abuse that they neither endured, nor know about. And to make matters worse, Nesta would come home bruised and bleeding and Papa Archeron would turn a blind eye...all while doting on Elain and Feyre. They were his princesses, they were the daughters he adored, while Nesta was the one being beat and verbally ripped to shreds while Papa Archeron did nothing.

Some siblings go through too much trauma that they can't heal with their siblings and they have to be separated. I've personally seen this happen with some of my family members, and other kids that I've seen in the foster care/adoption system. As hard as it is, sometimes separating siblings is in their best interest.

Nesta can never heal with Feyre or Elain. Not a bash on them, but she just can't. She's endured too much on their behalf. She's kept too much from them as is. This is the same Nesta who was sexually assaulted, and somehow managed to bottle that trauma up so she could try to rescue Feyre from Prythian. She then proceeded to neither tell Feyre about the rescue attempt, nor the sexual assault. That's just who Nesta is.

Meeting new people, being given a fresh start, learning what unconditional love and acceptance feels like allowed for Nesta to finally open up and tell Gwyn and Emerie what she could never reveal to her sisters. What she's spent too long protecting her siblings from. And that's okay. That's a normal part of healing from trauma.

[dameaylins]

on my "anti elain/anti elriels are allergic to reading comprehension" tirade; taking the word of nesta (who is literally proven in the same book to be unreliable when it comes to her perspective of elain with her "elain is like a dog" comment that cassian later disproves) on blind faith about how elain would love the spring court or that it was "made for someone like her" simply because it has flowers when, in the first book, we are explicitly told that there is no gardening done in the spring court- which is what elain actually enjoys about flowers, the actual process of gardening and getting her hands dirty. it's like sjm is trying to tell us something about elain and how fundamentally no one in the inner circle (cough, besides azriel, cough) understands her as a person.

[theshadowsingersraven]

I love actually being pro Elain by developing her character outside of her romance. And she's not even a main character in my fic.