#You also literally tagged this in the critical tags how are you mad at me for being an 'anti' ??????? In the critical space?????

[aromanticannibal]

The pattern is that people straight up do not read™. or they read a 3-5 tweet summary of what happened and treat it as if they did. or because shonen expectations based on "the classics" is bullshit and significantly rotted people's brains when deciding wether an ending is good or not.

Which could be nothing right

yeahhh. i will forever regret reading the last chapter through leaks because it was a dreadful experience, and watching everyone ever shit on it for like a week after genuinely made me want to just get off the internet forever or something because i felt like an idiot for liking the ending (all this is my fault for getting too invested in both tumblr and mha etc etc).

All the "it's rushed" and pacing complaints barely matter to me at this point because you just cannot feel the pacing of something correctly when you're reading it exclusively through leaks. you can't absorb info like that. And don't get me started on the number of complaints and criticisms I've seen of the last chapter that are just provably bullshit (I saw someone say Izuku didn't get a statue lmao. yes he did, you just read the fucking leaks and watched twitter drama unfold instead of reading the actual chapter i fear).

[bulletbilltime]

"Did you hear the stupid bigoted thing this known outrage farmer said? What a stupid thing he said! Let's post it everywhere and make the news 24/7 about that thing and make him the center of attention so more people can see the shitty things he said! There is no downside from giving the stupid bigot more of a platform!"

"What do you mean he is the president now. What do you mean he's the president a 2nd time. Nobody could have predicted this."

[sapphic-storm69]

Asshole skinny people when plus sized people say that they prefer not being anorexic and like to be themselves

[theloganator101]

Vivziepop is an Uncreative Person

As someone who strives in being creative, the way Vivzie handles her stories and ideas just makes me so mad. Sure she can draw, but literally if you have her try to come up with a story, it all just falls apart.

Because first you have the alleged screenshots were she just flatout stole how the pilot goes AND some character design from Ken Draw. Then you get to some of her characters where a majority of their backstories can be summed up as "Having daddy issues."

Oh but we're not done!

The character designs are also pretty lackluster. because apparently some of them are supposed to represent an animal in some way, but it's never translated properly or it just doesn't fucking exist.

How are we supposed to believe Vaggie is supposed to represent a moth?

How are we supposed to believe the main cast are the main cast if they are barely different from how everyone is designed color scheme wise?

Tell me how! How how how!

But back on topic.

And like I said to another person in the critical tags, any chance Vivzie has to do something remotely interesting she just doesn't take it. She would rather showcase her ocs than focus on what she should be developing!

And that's not even going into how she's basically using fan theories to write her story if Vaggie being an exorcist AND the fact that more are confirmed to be in the second season is anything to go by, instead of trying to come up with something on her own.

[angellic-critique]

oh replies are turned off okay heres my two cents then Helluvatired- why is it that even with three writers-there is a lack of balance in the writing/script development and is merely made on a whim of 'oh yeah lets do that that sounds cool!' the series started off as stolas being an antagonistic force and through the use of viv wanting to desperately make a cashcow and realizing how popular stollitz is-again despite in canon over how the first season was potrying stolas as an antagonistic force that belittles and puts down blitzo with false praise- why are they suddenly endgame? Because viv wanted to do fujo and make THAT the focus rather then blitz being the main character it turned into the stollitz show-

Why after season 1 with adam neylan premiering season 2 did it get off the rails as if he has no clue of what to do with the characters i.e. ex's and ooh's, seeing stars, and unhappy campers being the worst rated episode and for good reason??? The fact that there's three writers and none of them can ever decide on actually having a focused a/b plot and derailing to go into c-pots that make no sense?????

I'm sorry but just because queer people are writing does not make them immune to criticism, adam has always worked with brandon rodgers so of course their humor would be first and foremost over an actual plot/doing something akin to season 1 like, hmm, actually having the assassin characters be assassins rather then screaming and crying and dancing around the plot rather then actually committing to a plot.

your argument falls flat because literally all three of these people can't write and it's been proven WITH THE SERIES BEING DERAILED FOR ALL OF SEASON 2 :////

Stop posting positive reinforcement/praise in the critical tag if you aren't aware of what we're criticizing and being mad towards because we're mad and upset that there is no plot. Proving that theres three writers constantly going back and forth isn't proving your point that this is a 'goodly written series' because if it were we wouldn't be as half of upset as the majority of the critical space is.

You can flash credits all you want but it's not like viv actually credits her actual hard working artists behind the scenes :/

and now a compilation of the episode credits:

(note that even though one of them didn't write the episode, the three are still credited as creators of the story in season 2)

[utilitycaster]

actually taking the last bit out of the tags of that post because here is the thing. and I'm going to use specific examples, because I think it's illustrative.

the two groups of people in this fandom who have specifically harassed me have been, as I've said before, imo/dna fans mad I don't find the ship very good, and (to be fair, only on one occasion) shadowido/mauk fans who got mad that I said that tagging ao3 fic about throuples with individual pairs sucks. [hilariously the latter was not even about them at all, it was about me looking for imogen and fearne ship fic that wasn't witchy trio fic and finding it almost impossible to filter].

I do not like these people because they have engaged with harassment. It is not about identity; it is about actions. My closest friend, and the first non-family member I talked to on Wednesday morning, is a bi woman in an open marriage to a woman, with a longterm male partner. I was a bridesmaid in her wedding. The last time I visited her, in September, I was joined by other mutual friends, who are similarly in an open marriage with longterm partners and at least one relationship between two women.

I am entirely secure, in my personal life, that I am kind and accepting to queer women (of which I am one) and to poly people (of which I am not), and so I hope you can appreciate that if someone attempts to attack me on the internet on these grounds because I do not have the same exact opinions on pretend people kissing, my response isn't "oh my god I should go off and die because I'm a terrible person," it's "get a load of this moron making wild assumptions about my personal life based on a single data point in my preferences in fiction; I'm going to make them regret doing this to me, and hopefully anyone else, because this is genuinely a detrimental behavior in the fandom space." And also, you know what. If they were a homeless person on the street and asked for a dollar I would still give it to them if their attacks were merely verbal (yes, I know the idea of someone screaming "YOU'RE A LESBOPHOBE FOR HATING IMO/DNA can i have a dollar" outside the grocery store is rather comical, and I think that is how you need to consider statements like "um actually I won't help pro-shippers." Imagine that conversation happening in an irl activist group. Everyone would be like "uh...anyway, how do we fight back against this hostile bench architecture.")

I think right now it is vitally important to remember what actual bigotry looks like and what needs to be fought, and the reason I tapped the sign of this post last night is literally that I think you are wasting time and energy engaging with people who think bigotry is "criticizing the pretend guy Ashton Greymoore for concrete but pretend choices they made" when I also think most people criticizing Ashton would, if Ashton were real, still toss them change if they needed it, or are people who currently donate to or otherwise work with local programs that assist nb people, disabled people, or unhoused children.

I like to argue and I like to engage in fandom and I will continue doing that because it is a source of enjoyment and comfort for me, but I really urge everyone to ask yourself "am I arguing about genuinely different readings, or do I think that everyone who doesn't like my blorbo ship is a bad person" because if it's the latter, I think you need to nip that in the bud of online fandom before it grows into something darker and worse. A lot of irl hate and bigotry starts from a place of "everyone who doesn't agree with me and give me what I want all the time is wrong and evil" and perhaps I am too optimistic, but I think many people who say things like that in fandom just are caught up in the drama of it all and are capable of exercising empathy when they stop treating shipping or interpretation like a popularity contest that, if they lose, indicates that everyone around them is irredeemable. But I also think it can be the start of a really bad path.

[crimeronan]

kitkat this is mean but i do at this point assume that anyone who gets mad about the aphobia episode of housemd, which is late in s8, is simply and straightforwardly racist, homophobic, intersexist, etc. like if that is the one (1) bad thing you think is worth talking about - a single, one-off episode that was admittedly terrible but nothing like the constant and unrelenting greatest bigotry hit parade that is the show as a whole - i simply don't think that is an opinion i will be listening to. THERE'S BIGGER PROBLEMS!!!!

my perspective on this is, i think, both a little kinder AND a lot meaner than yours -- i 100% think that the Vast Majority of people who never shut up about the asexuality episode have simply..... never watched house MD. like, i really think that's it. they just have not seen the show. the only thing they KNOW about the show is the asexuality episode.

in fact, i'd say that 80% of people who derail my ableism posts EXPLICITLY tag or comment some variation of, "i'd never watch this / i already knew the show was bad / this doesn't surprise me because of the asexuality episode."

so it's not like.... necessarily that they think asexuality is the Only Thing Anyone Can Ever Talk About. it's just that it's the only thing they ever HAVE seen anyone talk about. and they're parroting whatever they've heard.

without. knowing. anything. about. the show.

like. it's just that they legitimately, honest to God somehow think that the asexuality episode was DIFFERENT, and that asexuals were UNIQUELY maligned, because they Literally Have Not Watched The Source Material. and so they don't know how often it happened. to everyone. or how systemic it was. or how cruel the writers were on a constant basis.

i think that this is the truest read of all this discourse. at the very least, it's the only read that makes me Not Actively Homicidal, so it is the one i must cling to.

there are a LOT of viral posts about house MD that criticize the asexuality episode without criticizing anything else. and those DO make me raise my eyebrows, bc presumably the OPs have watched the whole show, and so i'm like. why do you seem to take issue with the asexuality stuff but Not any of the other stuff.

BUT. if i am being good faith and nice to people... i figure it's, like, Ffffine.... for asexual people to make their own posts about house MD. since i am making my own posts about ableism in house MD. talking about one thing is fine. even if it makes me raise my eyebrows. bc as you said, it's one ep late in season 8 that sucks but. is not, uh. it's not the core of the show.

it DOES vex me that discussion of the treatment of asexuality gets SOOOO MUCH MORE VIRAL TRACTION HERE than any discussion of ableism, but it doesn't surprise me, exactly... about 50ish percent of this website is ace (last i knew?), and a MUCH smaller percentage is chronically ill. and on top of that, sooo many chronically ill ppl exist in a weird space with criticism of house MD in the first place, because he's the Pain Blorbo who's a Sick Doctor, he's like the only ornery bitchy chronic illness representation a lot of people have experienced, and that often Means Things to ppl with chronic illness. and so sometimes they feel Weird And Uncomfortable acknowledging that the show is also, um. really really reaaaalllyyyyy mean and cruel.

and just generally. not great. to us.

so. the posts about ableism..... don't circulate. at least not outside of very specific chronic illness circles. bc you have to be Nuanced about the chronic illness stuff, there's a lot of Uncomfortable Feelings involved, and the asexuality stuff is MUCH more straightforwardly terrible ragebait, which is very easy to get mad about & reblog with tags about how you are mad.

With All Of That Said.

i DO think that if people read a post that's being critical of how house MD hurts disabled/chronically ill people, or they read a post about any of the other many many many Many evil bigoted episodes in the series, and their ONLY takeaway is to type, "well, i knew it was bad because i heard about the asexuality thing!"

....i DO think that is thoughtless and cruel. and i do think that people should stop doing that.

and i have locked numerous posts because of people doing that.

and if people start doing that in my notes again, i will be instablocking and possibly locking more posts. because. please.

you do NOT have to say, "i already knew it was bad because X," or, "did you know it was also bad about X??" when the post is not about X. i was not talking about X. i agree that X is bad, but i would like to talk about Y right now, and this kind of smug kneejerk "i consume media the right way <3 i know that it's bad when it's bad" response makes it.... impossible.

like. i am being Earnest As Fuck about ableism and my own life experiences and the horrific structural inequality/oppression/violence/etc in the medical system. it's written about a TV show, but it's not Actually About A TV Show. you know?? my thoughts about house MD are my thoughts about The Actual Real Life Medical System and Actual Real Life Doctors. I'm Trying To Say Something Important .

now is NOT the time for, "oh, yeah, and the asexuality episode was bad!"

NOOOO..... FOCUS ON THE WORDS I JUST SAID INSTEAD. BLEASE,

[chaifootsteps]

I know I did not just see someone saying ArteiceTB is just another “Viv hater” and that she just bitches about people.

I’m actually so sick of stans. Arteice is so much more restrained and kind with what she says and that’s WAY more than those shitheads deserve.

I sincerely had to stop myself from chewing and spitting this person out. Like what the fuck…. They said so much more that I won’t repeat but this makes me hate the fandom so much more. The word anti has become a dog whistle for “I’m a shitty person” in this hellaverse sphere. If I unironically see someone using it to call critics that- I am so done.

also fans need to get their shit covered nose OUT of the critical tag.

sorry for being so mad chai- I’m so sick of this… forgive me 😭

ArteiceTB is one of those critics that, like the whole Limus incident, blows holes in their insistence that Chai did this or HR did that or blah blah blah. ArteiceTB is so restrained and nice, and proof that it literally does not matter how polite you are to this cult. Even the slightest whiff of dissent and they'll tear you apart.

[sideprince]

YOU GET IT. This book is really about Harry's relationship to Snape and foreshadowing that Snape's betrayal isn't all it seems to be. The Slughorn party scene makes me angry actually because Snape’s only purpose in it is to be the straight man in a comedy bit. He serves no narrative purpose (even the message he conveys has no purpose - it’s not like Dumbledore was cancelling an appointment, he’s just saying “we had no plans to meet and continue to not have any. k bye” but doing it through Snape for... some fucking reason ¯\_(ツ)_/¯). In the film ABOUT HIM where he’s only in four scenes one of them renders Snape’s presence narratively functionless. He's in that scene so the audience can get a laugh when McClaggen pukes on his shoes (and the timing of that whole bit is painfully clumsy and slow, because the films don't respect the audience's intelligence and assume them to be clumsy and slow too).

And you know what, I know I didn’t include the Sectumsempra scene and I’ll tell you why: because what’s the point? Snape shows up and says nothing. He heals Draco. He doesn’t hold Harry accountable???????? He doesn’t guess how Harry knew this uncharacteristically dark spell that isn't taught in class or punish Harry or even ask him “hey so about this student who’s bleeding to death in this bathroom where the only other person was you?” Snape's purpose in that scene is to fix Harry's mistake. Which is the complete antithesis of how he relates to Harry.

I’m frothing at the mouth at how Steve Kloves went out of his way to strip this scene of any substance for no discernible reason other than to handicap his own plot and character development??? Severus FUCKING Snape, who spends every book antagonizing and punishing Harry, just lets him go and fixes his near-fatal fuck-up without a word????? And Harry “slashed up a fellow student” Potter just walks away and is like, “that was messier than the time I fully murdered a teacher in my first year but anyway, guess I better do as Ginny says and go with her to hide this book, maybe we can hook up after,” and that’s just… fine. Which tracks with the rest of Kloves' sloppy writing, since he doesn't show Harry getting attached to the book, let alone the Prince, he just carries it around and reads it sometimes. And even when he does that we don't see him get immersed in it, he's still fully aware of what's going on around him and actively participating in conversations while perusing it. If you watch this film (or any of them) and think about every scene in the context of "what if I hadn't read the book and didn't have the understanding it gave me for what's happening or the emotional attachment to the characters" then you'll see how Kloves took a vibrant, colorful landscape and turned it into a hand-drawn cardboard cutout.

The purpose the Sectumsempra scene serves in the book is manifold and complex:

Harry's trust in the Prince is shaken and he sees an ugly side to this unknown person he's anthropomorphized into a kind of friend.

This is paralleled with Snape appearing at that exact moment, because foreshadowing.

Harry, who at the end of the previous book wanted and failed to use an Unforgiveable on Bellatrix Lestrange, experiences what it is to enact violence on someone for the first time and is deeply shaken by it.

Snape DISCOVERS THAT HARRY HAS HIS OLD POTIONS BOOK.

Snape, who suggested expulsion in Harry's second year for being seen flying a car across the country and into the Whomping Willow, punishes him for attempted manslaughter with nightly detentions. I need a whole other post to unpack this one (and while this may not work for the film, the solution isn't to scrap Harry being punished altogether - that goes against Snape's character and eliminates possibilities for tension, exposition, and plot development, not to mention character development).

Harry chooses to hide the book in the Room of Requirement and hand Snape Ron's book instead. This is a crucial moment for Harry's character development: he hides the book with the goal of retrieving it later, because despite the Prince's violent betrayal, he doesn't reject him and is still attached to him [insert meta about the potential parallels to Lily's friendship with Snape, what she saw in him, and why they remained friends for some time even when Snape became more immersed in the Dark Arts]. In fact, Harry wants to go back and get it, and his main reason for not doing so is fear of discovery by Snape, not a rejection of the Prince. This is a hugely important moment once you realize that Snape is the Prince, because it makes Harry's relationship to him - and his view of Snape's betrayal when he kills Dumbledore - much more complex and interesting and cathartic. It also shows that Snape has redeemable qualities, if Harry was able to become so attached to his younger self (the one who was an aspiring DE, before he defected and risked his life to save a friend, at that).

Snape's realization that Harry has his old Potions book is what leads to the moment after Dumbledore's death where Snape reveals his identity as the Prince. If he didn't know Harry had his old book and had learnt from it, why would he do this?

The purpose of the Sectumsempra scene in the film, though? Imprisonable offence after imprisonable offence. Writer's jail for Kloves:

Harry and Malfoy have it out, even though that tension hasn't really been built up (there was the Hogwarts Express scene and then not much after. Fun fact: when Draco gets caught gatecrashing Slughorn's party, it's done without having set up in any way that he's overlooked by Slughorn and insecure about losing his social standing due to his dad's imprisonment. There's zero attention given to his lack of inclusion in the Slug Club, so the fact he's using gatecrashing as an excuse to cover for sneaking off to the RoR is impossible for the viewer to understand, because the fact that he'd need to gatecrash at all is also unexplained, unless they had context from the books).

Snape saves Malfoy, but since neither character has had much screen time or relevance to the plot, it's just a striking visual to see Malfoy splayed on the water logged floor with Snape's robes swirling around them but not much more. Again, without the context from the books, this moment lacks substance.

There are no repercussions for Harry. He and his friends acknowledge that the book is dangerous, but Harry isn't punished, doesn't try to make amends, and basically acts like the self-involved special little boy Snape makes him out to be and who the books show him to be the opposite of. He doesn't seem all that conflicted or horrified and doesn't even hide the book on his own, his friends push him to get rid of it, and he goes to do it because it's a way to hang out with Ginny - who hides it on his behalf, which signals very different things about Harry's character than Book!Harry's choices do. The purpose of hiding the book in the film isn't so Harry can try and get it back later because he's still attached to the Prince, it's so he can be alone with Ginny and they can kiss, which Ginny instigates because Steve Kloves does nothing better than write passive protagonists who don't have to lift an emotional finger (see: Harry going along with being told to hide book instead of choosing to do so himself), and female characters who do all the heavy (and weirdly subservient? I'm looking at you Ginny feeding Harry and tying his shoes at the Burrow) lifting.

Nothing about this scene gives us even a remote hint that Snape is the Prince. When, at the end of the film, Snape reveals that he's the Half-Blood Prince, there is no context for it in the film or reasonable cause for him to know that Harry knows who the Half-Blood Prince even is. It's like if Ron walked up to someone on the street when he was 40 and said "yes, I am Roonil Wazlib." This revelation hasn't been set up, all its foreshadowing has been deliberately avoided, so it doesn't land with the impact it has in the books and definitely doesn't have the same effect if you haven't read the book first.

In short, in the film about Snape, and Harry's unwitting relationship with him, the scene where the biggest clue is given about the Prince's identity and one of the most crucial interactions between Harry and Snape happens, Snape is a sidebar, not a feature. So I don't count it as a Snape scene. He doesn't even have any dialogue aside from vulnera sanentur. Poor Alan Rickman was doing his best to do right by Snape's character with his acting even though the script gave him literally nothing. I hope every bowl of soup Steve Kloves eats for the rest of his life is cold and unsalted. Unless it's gazpacho. Then I hope it's scalding hot and burns his tongue.

Canon: Harry overhears Malfoy intimidating Borgin and figures out that he's been branded with the Dark Mark

Steve Kloves: Harry sees Malfoy meet a bunch of Death Eaters in Borgin and Burkes and figures out it was a ceremony to give Malfoy a Dark Mark

No but what I love about the movie version of events is that it implies that any Death Eater can brand anyone with the Dark Mark or, even better, that Voldemort was there in Borgin and Burkes and no one saw or heard him and he just popped into a shop in Knockturn Alley, tatooted a kid, and peaced out. I know I talk a lot about how Rowling (boo, hiss) was thoughtless with her world building, but she has nothing on Steve Kloves. I'm pretty sure he wrote those scripts with a crayon stuck between his toes.

[scoobydoodean]

In my experience it's been bc deancrit cas/destiel girls can easily ignore most samgirls (at least hardcore ones) because they usually either ship wincest or don't really give a fuck about cas so they're in an entirely different "fandom circle". Whereas deangirls tend to have more crossover because the main ship in our circle is still destiel (while I'm personally kinda meh about romantic ships but I definitely see the appeal), so unfortunately they feel the need to get mad at deangirls they disagree w bc we "affect their fandom experience more".

I agree there's the wincest/samgirl/deangirl sphere and a destiel/casgirl/deangirl sphere and our posts generally circulate within those separate spheres among a completely separate audience. If I was hanging out with bibros, I'd get a lot more complaints from samgirls than I do in the destiel sphere (and many people in this "sphere" are meaner about Sam than I am tbqh).

In addition to that, samgirls and deangirls have been fighting since day one, so while we don't tend to view the show the same way and don't tend to get along, there's a pretty well-established 'Dead dove do not eat" situation between us. Of course squabbles still happen, but I think I tend to write meta in a way that makes our complete lack of interpretive common ground immediately apparent when samgirls do stumble across me. When you realize you can't agree with someone on the interpretation of dozens of basic facts, you often deflate before ever trying to start an argument.

On the other hand, I'm expected to display a certain amount of "loyalty" toward Cas. I actually do recognize this and I do actually respond to it to a certain degree (at the very least for the sake of a few casgirl mutuals). At the same time, I firmly believe that the expectations of deangirls and casgirls in the destiel sphere are not symmetric. In fact, most of the negative experiences I've had were a result of me disagreeing with popular deancrit takes rather than speaking critically of Cas. This is because among destiel shippers, there's an unspoken agreement to blog about Cas and Dean in a certain way, and it isn't all about hiding criticism—it's also about agreeing to accept certain criticisms that I... don't agree with. Me not agreeing with those criticisms is seen as "stirring up drama" by some destiel shippers. The thing is, I think most of the people who think of me that way are basing their expectations of my behavior on the constraints that they face themselves. How we behave on our own blogs is largely informed by who is mutuals with who (i.e., people don't want to upset their mutuals). Destiel shippers who follow hundreds of other blogs have a very collectivist mindset and tend to assume all destiel shippers follow the exact same mix of people that they do, when that is not the case. I follow maybe two dozen supernatural blogs.

I understand that some destiel shippers/casgirls don't want to see my opinions on their dashes, but I have a right to my opinions and I am literally not sharing a community the people who complain the most about me. I'm not going to obscure or change my opinions to make strangers I don't follow and whose posts I am in most cases not even cognizant of happy. Some casgirls avoid me or block me and move on with their lives and that works just fine for me, but others seem to have trouble accepting that I am over here blogging about things they don't agree with and get angry that they can't control what I post. At the end of the day, seeing my posts is a choice that a person has to actively make. I don't use generic fandom tags. I don't even tag my gifsets. I don't skulk around on the blogs of people I don't know looking for things to bitch about, and I never interact negatively on other people's posts. If a beloved mutual is putting my posts on someone's dash and they don't want to see my opinions, they can filter my url. It's literally that simple.

[bangtannism]

Tkkers are the biggest jkkers there have ever been. They're the very embodiment of yelling "I'm not mad" while punching a hole in the wall. If their moments don't mean anything, why are you so mad? But they know that km's moments are significant which is why they desperately play down their relationship, call it fanservice, foist jm off onto other members (liking shipping ymn), anything to make it not real, because they know as well as we do, that if what km do is real and not scripted fanservice, then it blows apart their romeo&juliet fanfiction. For example, if its all real, then jk was drunk spinning jm and jm gave his best friend's "boyfriend" a hickey, and how would that make sense when tae and jm are still so close and loving on each other? If its real, then jk chose to spend the next 2 years with his "boyfreind's" best friend and not him, and how does that make sense?

The problem with tkkers is that they have built this perfectly insulated little belief system where they believe not in what they see, but in what they don't see, which is a nebulous relationship that supposedly exists only in private (I mean they literally brand tk the private couple). They don't even have to be based in reality or think critically because they've come up with convenient explanations for everything. If tk say something that goes against the tkker narrative, well that was the company forcing them. If they say or do something that supports it, well that was them being bold and fighting back. If interactions with another member don't threaten their ship, then that's fine and cute. If it does, well then that's just fanservice pushed by the company. They decide what is the "truth" based on if it already supports what they believe. I firmly believe there would be almost no tkkers today if they didn't stumble upon tkker accounts and become indoctrinated with the ideology because just watching content, seeing their actions, and listening to the boys talk (and believing them) would never lead you to thinking tk are romantically involved.

If its any consolation though, I do think way more army (not just km shippers) do acknowledge km's relationship being unique or sus at times, they just don't say it as much on tkker dominated spaces like twitter, where even using their duo name gets you branded a shipper and makes them mad. Like here on tubmlr, I've only checked the tk tag a handful of times out of curiosity, but the km posts and blogs seem to get waaay more engagement. Or even on reddit, I've see users make comments "like I hate shippers and I would never actually claim they're together, but km do make me questions sometimes LOL" while tkkers coming in hot with their crazy bullshit get shot down immediately there. Also this is anecdotal, but I wasn't involved in the fandom for a long period because of personal stuff (I still kept up with the member's solo projects though), and I was surprised at how much engagement km fan twt accounts get now or just how many big ones there are. At least from my memory a couple years ago, I don't remember km accounts (not just "shipping" stuff, but also accounts for km moments, etc.) getting as many likes and followers as they seem to have now, so I do wonder if the tides are turning (would make sense given recent events, rumors, etc. for tkkers to lessen imo).

They decide what is the "truth" based on if it already supports what they believe.

that's really the entire crux of the problem, nonny. instead of regularly examining their own beliefs and assumptions based on information as it comes out, they simply figure out how they can fit the information into the belief. the ways they come to their conclusions are filled with so many fallacies that it's usually not even worth addressing because if someone is willing to twist themselves into that many knots over their beliefs then theyre not actually going to listen to logic.

and dont get me wrong, shippers of all kinds do this, but i have never seen it with such frequency and aggression as the tkk crowd. once i saw someone on tiktok claim that jk only ever mentions th on his lives. when they were told that jk does indeed talk about other members on live (they'd know if they watched og content instead of just socmed clips), the person actually refused to believe it. that's not only absurd, but it brings me to my whole conclusion about why tkkrs constantly write off and redefine moments from other pairings (and obviously especially jikook):

if tkkrs took in all the information without trying to fit it into a pre-established narrative, their ship would fall apart. even if we assume that every other pairing in bts is platonic only, tkk does not hold up. the things they do for each other, say about each other, the things others say about them, the amount of time they spend together and activities they do, the way they touch and cuddle and joke, none of it truly stands apart from the rest of their friendships. especially when we take vmn and jikook into consideration. so the only way to make romantic tkk make sense is by simply ignoring or rewriting reality.

they have to imagine that jk only cooks for th, only sings for th, only spends free time with th, only does this that and the other thing for th because if they acknowledge that jk doesn't do these things for th exclusively, what do they have? (also it's really fucking weird that their entire ship seems to hang in the balance on what jk does – they really are so threatened with how jk behaves with jm that they're constantly trying to redirect that attention from jk to th.)

as a jikooker, i am sure you have heard so many of us talk about exclusivity and consistency, and tkk just does not have that. 🤷‍♂️ i enjoy seeing tkk together and i enjoy their friendship but at the end of the day, that's all you can glean from their interactions unless you start making stuff up.

as for engagement from army in general on jikook, i do think that a lot of the time the lack of it comes from fear because fandom culture as a whole has become so volatile towards rps. but why is it that jikook comments are automatically seen as more shippy than ones about other pairings? that's what doesnt make sense unless everyone else is seeing what we're seeing. talking about the "sus" stuff between jikook forces people to acknowledge that it is actually sus and that makes them uncomfortable because nobody wants to be branded a shipper in our current fandom climate.

but yes, imo there has been a turn in tides for jikook within the fandom. i talked about it before that jikook began gaining popularity quickly in 2017 which was then solidified with gcft. i think that the 'jikook wave' so to speak probably won't ebb unless we actually see a shift in their dynamics or they start dating other people. i am really curious to see the state of the fandom and jikookers after military service tbh.

[airplanned]

Things that are all true at the same time:

AO3 hosts a lot of fic and gets the most traffic, and therefore is the obvious place to post fic. Seriously, what else are you gonna do?

AO3 has an unmatched search system. A+

AO3 has not adequately trained their volunteers on how to legally and safely handle some of the shit that gets posted. Like--I'm not talking about your anti/pro discourse. Federal crimes are happening here. And they're forcing untrained volunteers to deal with it without providing them adequate support.

AO3 has continuously refused to come up with safety measures against harassment. This is overwhelmingly targeted at people of color, who are already feeling uncomfortable in fandom spaces.

Let's be real. Art can be uncomfortable and disturbing. A lot of people write to deal with their own demons, and that is valid and a way for them to cope. I don't know their lives or the lives of their readers who love their work.

Let's be real. It takes twenty minutes to find a kid who has no idea they've just written and posted an assault, and then they get mad in the comments when someone asks them to tag it. This will be sandwiched between comments from other kids sighing over how in love the characters are and how they wish they had a boyfriend like that.

So, yeah. There is space to criticize AO3, especially in the actual laws they are breaking. There is also a lot of good happening here (especially for me, a white guy who searches "fluff"). Criticizing AO3 does not mean you hate freedom of speech and does not mean you're not media literate enough to know when something's being romanticized or not.

[lara635kookie]

I didn't even watch "WISH" yet because in my country it will only be available at january, but people are saying it's a bad cliche so I probably won't watch at the cinema.

The thing is, even though I am a hopeless romantic, not everything has to have romance. There are princess who are perfectly fine without a prince, like Mirabel, Elsa, Merida, Moana and Raya(I do kinda like the idea of Raya with a girl, just not Namaari). But we were so robbed of seeing Asha and the star boy(he is literally a staR so I don't doubt Disney would call him StaN or something like that, so his name is Stan from now on, I am gonna call him like that, is easier than star boy). Asha and Stan had the potential to be the next Tianaveen and Rapunzel&Eugene (I don't know their ship name). The concept arts are the cutest thing I have ever seen. Also "At All Costs" (bop) would have been a love song between the two!!! Them singing it man. The pain I will feel when I don't see them passionately sing it, very "I see the light" coded, in the actual movie. Somehow, now is not feminist for a strong female character to have a male partner by her side. Like...This doesn't make sense! You can be a strong female character and have a man at the same time! Have y'all forgotten Mulan and Shang? Anna and Kristoff? Ariel and Eric? Jasmine and Aladdin? (There are more examples and I could go on all day, but you got what I meant already) I hate Disney for throwing good ideas at the trash and playing safe just for money(like Hobie Brown/Spider-Punk said "it's a metaphor for capitalism"). And as the guy looked blonde with blue/green eyes in the arts I have seen, and Asha is a black latina, they lost the opportunity of having a biracial couple ACTUALLY DONE RIGHT (Pocahontas and John Smith don't count, he is a collonizer with the most common name in the world, she deserves so much better). Like, if the thing is show how inclusive you are by having a black latina female protagonist for little girls to see and feel represented in a good way, you could have increased that feeling by making someone fall in love for her. Little girls would feel like they are beautiful and desired/desireable in a positive way and that they worthy of being loved and love and be with whoever they want to be with, even someone who has a different skin color.

I am also mad because we could have seen Disney's first evil villain COUPLE with King Magnifico and his wife, the queen(still don't know her name, sorry). Can't you guys imagine the HITS, THE FIRST PLACE OF BILLBOARD HOT 100 WORTHY songs, they would proportionate us? Even if only one song, it would be enough for me. But someone thought having a female villain would be anti-feminist and they discarded an original and authentic idea, which is what Disney built its empire on the first place. Come on Disney minorities don't want to be portrayed as those unrealistic superior beings, they want to be portrayed as real human beings with emotions, struggles, qualities and flaws. Having an iconic female villain like you guys always had(like Maleficent, Cruella De Vil, Ursula, Mother Gothel, Lady Tremaine, etc) and set her up with an iconic male villain(like Gaston, Doctor Facilier, Shan Yu, Jafar, Hans, etc) it would have been top notch, god tier. King Magnifico and the queen could have been like the Gomez and Morticia of evil. You could address so many topics by it. Like the kingdom being ruled by evil would have been a great social critic of some politicians out there, for example. And we could have had an iconic final boss battle between Asha and Stan VS Magnifico and the queen.

Anyway, what I mean by this is that if someone has fanarts or just ANY CONTENT, of Asha and Stan, tag me, reblog this or comment, I don't care, just warn me, because they are my new obsession. I will also write a fanfic about this movie with these ideas, but only after I have watched the movie so until them, please feed my hyperfixation in Stasha (Star boy/Stan×Asha), I'm begging y'all

[nekropsii]

you've been posting hot takes for ages now so i need to know what was the post that finally did it for that anon. was it the dirkri post? the aroace kankri? the fanon davekat sucks? who knows...

It could be literally fucking anything. I've gotten spammed with anon hate calling me queerphobic for saying other real life people's genders and sexualities aren't my business. I've gotten an anon calling me a proshipper for... Not harassing people I guess? Despite the fact that I've made it very clear that that crowd makes me uncomfortable. I've been sent ableist rape fics for saying I don't like Cronus/CroTuna. I've been badgered and called racist many times for pointing out that Hussie is racist, providing proof, and showing how that manifests in Homestuck and their other works.

I cannot ever tell what really breaks the camel's back. People get mad and call people names for any reason. But this especially applies if they have critical opinions on something they enjoy, or simply do not agree with them, no matter how minor that thing is.

My best guess is that some people do not like that I tag my posts appropriately, lol. I use tags as an organizational tool for the most part, but I've noticed some people take someone maintagging any critical - or, god forbid, negative - thoughts, ever, to any degree, at any time, literally ever, like literally fucking ever, as a... Personal attack, apparently? This especially, ESPECIALLY applies to shipping. It's kinda lame. Just scroll past or whatever. You went into a main tag, where everyone posts any content of any kind. I do not post to tags specifically meant for positivity, I do not bother people who enjoy things I don't. I just sit in my corner and talk to the air. If people want to listen, that's their prerogative. If they don't, that's also their prerogative. There's untagged incest in the Homestuck main tags all the time, let me whinge for 5 minutes. Damn.

[fractualized]

hi I sent that last ask and I appreciate you so much. I love how chill you are. I love that you speak up and aren't afraid of others people's opinions of you -- because you talking about that helps me realize exactly what you were talking about about.

my critical online space that shaped my brain was Tumblr growing up, much in the same way reddit or 4chan or anything else was for others, and as positive as it was and as much as I stay here, there were some HEAVY years of thought policing and performing perfectly at all times and I really think it fucked with my head!

not to trauma dump, but the way it related to starting off by policing each other in fandom just happened to spill into every other aspect of my life too. every thing is black and white. every interaction is perfect or you are flawed and not worth anything at all. people literally judging you off stupid fandom shit behind a fake name dressed up in sparkles and curiosity was enough to call you a monster who deserved to be alone. the fuck??

from fandom cops telling me that portrayals of fictional characters in my head were an actual meter that we can base if we're deserving of human connection made me think about what ELSE could be important. aren't there things a little more pressing than fictional characters?? the words I use. the way I behave. move my face. micro express, leave pauses in sentences, judged by everything! I've been taught that the LITTLEST OF INDICATIONS OF HUMANITY were going to be the death of me. I couldn't exist. all because of fictional themes that creators are allowed to make, but fans are not allowed to enjoy unless it's the "right way". even though the people CREATING it are also exploring it. rules for thee but not for me.

it's gross. I felt like a monster and when the only other people who are kind to you are monsters, it really makes you wonder why fandom cops find themselves so much morally superior to others 👹

People have told me I'm chill before and I'm always like, "excellent, they can't tell I'm yelling on the inside." 😂

Sometimes I wonder if I would be different if the show Heroes hadn't ended as such a clusterfuck. And by that I mean that my experience with that show ended on such a sour note, I wound up drifting away from fandom for 5-ish years. And it wasn't because of the Heroes fandom itself! It was because by the end I was hate-watching the show, and that kind of headspace is just no good. I wasted too much energy being mad at something that wasn't going to improve, and my other fandom interests weren't strong enough for fic, etc. I still lurked here and there, but otherwise I focused on life stuff.

At the point I left, tumblr was popular but I was still a livejournal (and journalfen) holdout. As a result, I was simply absent during the most intense tumblr years. I have a general idea of what it was like from everyone's descriptions, but from my point of view, five years passed, Telltale Batman: the Enemy Within came a-calling, I started writing fic again, and uhhhhh things sure were different.

Not entirely for the worse. For one thing, as someone who unavoidably grew older, yeah, I do keep in mind that there are children running around these parts. The increased focus on tagging your work is also good, so people can avoid what they don't want to see. And it's just always been a good general rule to be mindful when getting into sensitive topics, and I was seeing more of that.

Buuuuuuuut yeah, with that it seemed like "don't like; don't read" was out, and witch hunting was in. Some slight mistake might indicate you were actually one of the Bad Ones all the long! And everyone must know! I mean, there's always been fandom police, but fandom's mainstreamification definitely made it worse for a host of reasons. And I actually was unnerved by it for a while, even though the Enemy Within finale had me indulging in fluff. I was probably safe-- but then again who knows what blunder or improper deference to a sensitive subject could bring a swarm of strangers!

But eventually I was fluffed out, and chatting batjokes with people was giving me new ideas that would have me explore and indulge in (gasp) darker ideas. And by that point I was just like, I'm a freaking adult. I tag my shit. I'm here to have a good time with people I like, not worry about a bunch of randos who probably get as much anxiety making a cold call as I do. And yeah, why are fans supposed to be judged on a different metric than the creators?? I'm going to do what I want!

And with that rallying cry… I mean, nothing ever happened. 😂 Not the first time I've built up worries in my head for nothing.

I can see it taking me longer to get to that point if I'd fully marinated in the thought policing, though. I think people get that instinct because of the age-old lack of control elsewhere in life (especially nowadays, with all the… everything). Surely if someone can get everyone in their orbit to behave in just this way, then at least things there will be okay. Nothing bad will happen! (It's not as if rigid mindsets hurt people and their relationships, or performatively good people still do atrocious things. No, surely not.)

I don't have a good closing, so here's an Reno 911 icon from the old days:

[itsclydebitches]

Have you seen the posts going around saying shit like "If a mutual likes Hazbin Hotel I will block them"?? It's genuinely upsetting me tbh, not just the idea that people don't like the show, but that they despise it so much they can't even stand the thought of someone they know liking the show. It reminds me of the Steven Universe hate train only worse. They also say shit like "the show is just someone saying swear words and expecting you to laugh", and if for a second we put aside the fact that that is blatantly not true, what's wrong with that? I'm allowed to like something that's a bit trash, right? I've already seen two different people I follow reblog posts to that effect (and worse, someone saying all a character boils down to is "i love being sexually abused <3" and i don't know how they ever came to that conclusion) and it's driving me mad. And somehow I just know that they don't actually give a shit about any "controversies" surrounding vivziepop, that's just a convenient excuse for most of them. I don't even care if Vivzie is a bad person, that's none of my business. just live and let live, you know?

Sorry for ranting, you're literally the only blog i follow who posts Hazbin fan content

Rant away, friend! Luckily for me I haven't come across any of those posts yet. Plenty of discourse surrounding whether fans are allowed to make romantic and/or sexual content for Alastor, the expected shipping wars, and - as you say - vague references to Vivzie controversies (which I'm too new a fan to even be aware of yet)... but nothing that's a complete rejection of the show itself. That's probably because I've only engaged with blogs posting a lot of Hazbin content though.

I'm a big fan of old school Internet rules which includes an emphasis on cultivating your own online space. You know, the thing tumblr is explicitly designed for. So in theory I applaud anyone blocking users/tags for a show they're not a fan of. Performatively posting about it more as a way to guilt others for liking Hazbin at all... not so much. If you want to block something just block it. If you're mutuals with someone you both presumably like each others' content. Not all of it necessarily, but enough to have followed in the first place, and often being mutuals for long enough leads to friendship because you're both getting interacting with one another a lot. All of which isn't to say that people don't unfollow mutuals, or that you can't drop a mutual because they've started posting something you dislike. Obviously both situations do happen, but it feels like an extreme enough response that these posters probably aren't actually doing this very often. Most people will wait the mutual out until their interest gets hooked on something new, or block the Hazbin tag and keep the friend, or just block without making a big announcement about it. So posts like that feel more like a way to show off how much you dislike the show and guilt others for their enjoyment which yeah, can be upsetting to see. Especially when, as you say, it costs nothing to just let people like things.

Which might sound hypocritical on my part given my RWBY interests, but I think there's a big difference between critically examining a show while supporting others who genuinely love it, and simplistically blasting it. I COMPLETELY get why Hazbin wouldn't be to everyone's tastes and, like with the SU example, anything that gets popular enough is going to develop its haters (especially cartoons trying to tackle non-childish subjects. That's always going to be a fandom landmine). But if you're going to make claims about a show, at least watch it to ensure you can back up your stance? And if your takeaway is still, "This is the worst fucking thing I've ever watched"... cool. Go forth and write about that on your own, personal blog. But no one should be surprised when they're also blocked for bragging about how many Hazbin fans they've blocked.