#SpindleHorse critical

[imaginative-123]

Vivzie my dear, your main ship in Helluva Boss Stolitz is the most Garbage Ship I've ever seen in gay media. Maybe listen to actual fans who want your shows to improve? Shipping is Fun but in the case of your works on how you write them is not.

i can't be the only one who thinks that's a terrible idea right

[chaifootsteps]

'Spindlehorse has multiple transmasc people on staff', ignoring all the transmasc and other people who have quit and said that part of their experience included constantly being misgendered.

They're just dang, dirty, clout chasing liars who need to shut up, says Viv's fandom while pretending they care about trans people.

[lucifertheanalyzer]

I am very normal (autistic) about merchandise and this post from Morgana is hurting my head.

Why are they using only YouTube views to gage what character should receive merch?? Why cannot they do a Billboard and use YouTube Music, Spotify, and Apple music plays for popularity of a character?

Why are using views in the first place? Why not Google Trends because not every fan is listening to the soundtrack via YouTube or/and likes every song. I am in the small minority, I do not like the soundtrack at all because I like good music /lh.

Is this the norm musical or music-based shows to use YouTube views of the songs to see if a character is popular or not?

I know SU does not have a lot of merch but imagine if Cartoon Network did something like for SU by using the YouTube views of certain songs to determine if that character gets merch or not.

Alastor already got so much merch in the pilot era compared to Charlie who is the main character (this chart has not been updated since July of 2024, the percentage is probably higher now).

Call me a conspiracy theorist with a tinfoil hat but I am calling bullshit. Alastor and Lucifer get the most merch because of shipping, and they are Viv's favorites (Al is already a creator's pest to some and Lucifer is slowly becoming that too).

They are the only single characters in the V-Day merch while the other characters are magnetic keychains (even Cherry and Pentious are not a couple), they share a hoodie together like Charlie and Vaggie, and they are included in the friendship bracelets set.

The state of the merchandise is just sad compared to the stuff Sharkrobot was releasing before the show dropped. They have better variety and do more than pins, keychains, shirts, and posters.

I buy current official merch second-hand, and it is crazy how much old pilot-era SR merch goes for (of course it does not help that SR only does limit edition merch and never re-makes stuff).

I feel bad for new fans having to pay crazy, outlandish prices (over $200-$500 for a pin or a desk mat of a character they are a fan of because they barely have any official merch.

[wishful-thinking64]

HH & HB Worldbuilding Part #01

Worldbuilding, a beautiful and vital thing for all stories to have, is, for some reason, absent in the Hellaverse. Let’s change that.

_______________________

“When was Hell created?” ‣ I’ve decided to base Hell’s creation on how long the Earth has been around for which would mean that Hell was made around 4.5 billion years ago. I went this route because it makes the most sense from a logical and theological standpoint as God only made the Earth after he found out that Adam & Eve had disobeyed him by eating The Forbidden Fruit of Knowledge.

“How many Rings of Hell are there?” ‣ Usually there are only Seven Rings of Hell but I’m taking a page out of Dante’s Inferno for this and having there be Nine Rings instead. However, the order of these Nine Rings is rather different. First and foremost, one of the only things staying from the canon Hellaverse is that the Pride Ring is the very first Ring of Hell as I see it as the only Ring meant to house Sinners on account of the majority of humanities crimes stemming from the sin of Pride by believing that they are better than something else whether it be their fellow man, machine, or beast. As far as the other big Six Rings of Hell go after Pride it would be Lust in 2nd, Gluttony in 3rd, Sloth in 4th, Greed in 5th, Wrath in 6th, and Envy in 7th.

‣ That just leaves me with the 8th & 9th Rings which cannot be accessed via regular means (for instance, Hell’s Metro system for Hellborn citizens) or standard irregular means (like The Marked Alleyways in Pride that’s used by normal Hellborn citizens and Sinners alike.) The 8th Ring is known as The Ring of Treachery and very few know of its existence and even fewer are aware of the evil it holds. On the other hand, the Final Ring is one that every demon knows and fears as that’s where those found guilty in The Serpent’s Courtroom are forced to serve capital punishment (yes, there are things far worse than the death penalty in Hell) and go to suffer for the rest of eternity, in the Ring fittingly named, The Abyss. “What are the laws of Hell?” ‣ Obviously, if Hell has some kind of courtroom then there are some type of rules set in place. How said rules work differ depending on four major factors: which Ring you’re in, your place in Hell’s hierarchy, your race, and whether you’re a Hellborn citizen or not. Which doesn’t sound as bad as it could be until you take into consideration that Hellborn groups like Imps have to constantly be updated on and follow the laws in ALL Seven Rings, be "reminded" about their place in Hell by basically everyone around them, and overall be treated less than a Sinner would be because, “at least Sinners EARNED their right to be here.” The only Hellborn groups to have it worse than Imps are Half-Breeds (like Blitzø, Barbie, and Striker) as they’re expected to memorize DOUBLE the set of rules compared to everybody else and Hellhounds who have the most amount of rules while also having the least amount of freedoms thanks to them being often seen as pets or servants and nothing more. “Will the entirety of Hell be some various shades of red?” ‣ Short answer, no. Long answer, each of the Rings will be various shades of their specific Sin’s corresponding color. For example, the entire Pride Ring is going to be some tint or shade of purple. The only Rings I can’t really do this for are Lust, Treachery, and The Abyss. For the latter two it’s because they don’t exist in the traditional sense and as far as the Lust Ring goes, I’ll have to change the color to pink as Lust’s true signature color is blue however Sloth is light blue which means one of them has to change and I don't know about you but a blue Lust Ring just doesn't sound or look right to me.

_______________________

While I was doing this I hadn't realized just how much Vivziepop & Spindlehorse managed to accomplish NOT making Hell feel like Hell. Both Hazbin Hotel and Helluva Boss are solely set in Hell for the sake of being edgy and so that one show can do the done to death trope of, "angels are the real bad guys," while the other show devolved into a convoluted melodrama.

With a story setting like Hell you, as the writer/director, have to understand that you can't just visually show the readers/viewers that this story could only be set in Hell but you also have to make them FEEL like it could ONLY be set in Hell. Viv somewhat grasps the visual aesthetic of Hell but she's completely lost on how to appeal to an even wider audience due to her shows failing to convince people that FEEL like either show truly takes place in Hell. There's no real ongoing suffering happening to the Sinners in Hazbin Hotel (I'm not counting Angel Dust and his problems because they've opted for him to have rushed and off screen character development) as the Extermination only happens once a year and with Helluva Boss, it REFUSES to go all in on depicting high class Hellborn citizens taking advantage of those beneath them in Hell's society (gee, I wonder why/s.) That aside, I hope that you liked the worldbuilding that I've come up with so far and before the day is over I'll probably make a post dissecting Chaggie and why they should've stayed as best friends like they were originally planned to be in HH before Viv changed her mind last minute. Happy Valentine's Day everybody!

[toestychonk]

Hollow

Am I the only one who is kinda worried about Viv's mental health?

She is running 2 shows on top of running a studio (If you can even call it that) and then giving into pointless internet fights when she could be working on something productive like reteaching herself how to draw.

That doesn't even mention that the majority of her friends are on her payroll, ready to be her attack dogs at a moments notice. I'm sure some of them like Sam are genuine but a lot of them just seem to want to keep their jobs.

It all seems incredibly lonely and hollow... Like on a human level, I feel a little bad for her. Not much cuz most of this stuff is very much self inflicted, but I still feel kinda bad.

Sometimes I wish Viv would just unplug for a day or two and just exist. I know it would do her some good, but I also know she won't cuz she's too terminally online for that.

[imaginative-123]

Viv said that fiction has no affect on reality when in reality her attitude reflects her work. She's a proshipper who just denies the TRUTH.

If you ever wonder why characters in Hazbin Hotel and Helluva Boss behave and speak like horny, edgy teenagers, then just look at Vivziepop’s social media. Your question will be more than answered.

[fortunelowtier]

Ok so i saw a post mentioning how Spindlehorse was hiring animators again, and i thought "huh yknow im really curious what the turnover rate of animators is in this studio" because i mean its a genuine question considering how i swear theyre hiring new animators every other week

So then i checked IMDB...

Before i go on i wanna put some context because its kinda needed for what im about to say:

On IMDB there's a section of the cast and crew page labeled "Series Animation Department". This is the section meant primarily for animators and storyboarders among other jobs in the same vein.

Now. Can you guess how many animators/storyboarders Helluva Boss has gone through in less than 2 seasons?

444.

That is four hundred and forty-four individual credits, a majority of whom didn't stay for any longer than a few episodes. I have never in my life seen an animator turnover rate this skewed.

But i saw this and i went "well it cant be that bad right, what about other shows?" because admittedly i didnt know a lot about animation so for all i knew this was normal. So i went to the IMDB pages of other animated shows

RWBY: 164 credited animators over 9 seasons

Murder Drones: 11 Animators over 7 episodes

The Owl House: 88 Animators over 3 seasons

Amphibia: 73 over 3 seasons

Steven Universe: 44 over 5 seasons

And just to be fair let's include Hazbin Hotel, which had 62 in 1 season

This means that for one reason or another Helluva Boss has gone through more animators in less than 2 seasons than shows that ran for SIGNIFICANTLY longer go through in their entire lifespan by several times and that astounds me

[theoddest1]

Lmaoooo

Edit:

Samantha is a Story Artist, Animator, and Animation BFA who works for Viv on both HH and HB.

2nd Edit: Some of y'all need to chill in the comments with certain things you say. It ain't finna make any point come across decently with how you spread some info. I get being mad at some of the reactions, don't get me wrong, but bring it back down slow plz.

[maniwannadiezz]

guys,, guys,… it’s the Hazbin Mrs. Hellluva boss

can’t wait for people to unironically draw her to really get the h8er that is me. Little do you know I can bait you into it while also being critical of the show 🥺😰

Anyways is she annoyingly red enough? Does she hit all the markers? :))

bonus: she’s a zombie somehow. I dunno you figure that out on your own.

[starlight-bread-blog]

I know we aren't supposed to cheer but... TELL HIM!!

[uniquepeanutcreatorfire]

Check out this Sinsmas rewrite

[showtoonzfan]

A recent article came out about the mistreatment and pay of Spindlehorse employees, please spread this around.

[chaifootsteps]

I’m sorry, but her VAs did what??? Who tf is out here telling kids to watch Viv’s shows? They are WILDLY inappropriate! There’s RAPE IN THEM.

I wish I was kidding.

[uninformedartist]

The call is coming from inside the house

Oh she's definitely still salty she got called out for hiring a Proshipper cos she's one too & one thing about Proshippers, they defend their peoples.

[xjulixred45x]

Spindlehorse's lazyness to actually make a scene and not copy-paste/tracing already existing scene FROM THEIR OWN UNIVERSE is Amazing.

[crooked-wasteland]

Octavia: You can have your happy life, I'm just not going to be a part of it.

The fans: Octavia is so in the wrong for that!

Those.... Those are just basic boundaries. It's not even about him being with Blitz, it's about how Stolas abandoned her to die for Blitz and gave her a life that was nothing but a lie. No one is obligated to have you in their life. Not even parents.