#why the fuck is this fandom so toxic

[frooogscream]

So David making the show gayer and listening to his collaborators... is a bad thing. Even if you weren't twisting his words, you're not making the point you think you are.

I did never say anything like that, what I sad is that the show was never supposed to be so queer in the beginning and that pretty much all of the queer details about the characters came from the queer actors. My conclusion was not “David Jenkins bad because he didn’t want to make a queer show”, my conclusion was “it is beautiful that these queer people poured their hearts into it and created something with a lot of meaning for other queer people”.

Yes I also used phrases like “we were never even supposed to have what we got” and “This show was NEVER supposed to give us beautiful things and treat it’s queer characters with “kindness”! It was NEVER supposed to be for queer people!”, implying that I personally felt like s2 made some choices that I, with my personal experience as a queer person was disappointed in (such as cutting all the poly scenes and killing of the older queer characters right after giving him a coming out arc, in doing so removing an actor who is very vocally supportive of trans people which I, as a trans person appreciate and used the opportunity on convention panels to talk about queer rights and removing the only of the three most central characters in s2 actually played by a queer person, etc.).

But that was just a tiny and implied undertone in an overwhelmingly positive post, in which I praise the cast of the show. And for the record, I DO think that it is great that DJ made these adjustments, I work in theater and occasionally in film and know that it is also not uncommon or bad to make changes as the project evolves and actors flesh out the roles more. I simply pointed out that he is not the one who originally had the ideas to make it this queer and that he originally didn’t plan to let the main queer love story end with a happy ending. Firstly this is not a bad thing, there are a lot of shows out there that aren’t queer, no body is “required” to make queer shows. Secondly where the hell am I twisting his words, he LITERALLY said all of the things I listed as changes towards a more queer show himself and you can find all the interviews linked in the source I gave in my post! Again the over all tone of my post was “oh my god, look what crazy info I stumbled upon and isn’t it fucking fantastic that these gorgeous queers have turned this regular show into something that means so much to us”. And that you manage to take that positive post and read something sooooo negative into it, just because someone dares to say that maybe David isn’t this amazing queer rights activist that some fans make him out to be and didn’t plan on making a revolutionary queer show, is honestly baffling to me.

I am also not “trying to make any point”, this is my personal block with barely 30 followers where I described my personal feelings towards factually true information and my personal feelings are:

I fucking love Vico, I fucking love Con, I fucking love Kristian (also Nathan and every queer person who worked on this behind the scenes) but I’m not gonna kiss David Jenkins feet for something that wasn’t even his idea, I don’t “owe” a cis straight guy who dosnt understand half of why the things his queer cast came up with are so important, gratitude. I gladly and freely extend a big fucking chunk of gratitude to queer actors who put their heart and soul into their queer roles way more then they are required to. Hope this helps.

[orengejoshi]

Pregnancy as a kink makes me uncomfortable so man am I glad your pregg Flug stuff is explicitly not kink oriented!

yeah I... don't wanna judge anyone... but it's more than that, it's downright terrifying to me. Blame my hormones bc I'm expecting irl but wow... I'm very sensitive and it feels dehumanizing. but ig that is kinda the point of the kink(?)

it's so common in fandoms!

I'm completely vanilla anyway tho, so not surprising.

I've tried to pretend for a super long time that I'm into kink, but most of them are off putting and I consider them intrusive thoughts, not fantasies. I'm kinda fluctuating between sex-repulsed and neutral (aroace) even fictional... ig kink just isn't for me. I tried so hard to get over it. I know some people in my asks/requests are gonna be disappointed but I'm sorry💔

I'm slightly ashamed of how boring I am and I have serious trouble connecting to anyone in fandoms due to this actually🤕 feel like the most NT autistic person ever.

anyway here's a doodle!

[vivika-ka]

Some instances that I feel show how some messages in MHA are detrimental, especially on how victims react to their abuser, can be gauged by responses that tend to be highly prevalent in the fandom.

(Definitely not every fan, but a great majority).

Endeavor is a great example. Whenever you post criticizing his approach to atonement (and ultimately criticizing Horikoshi’s writing), you get BOMBARDED by people either belittling you for not liking his character or essentially forcing you to like his character by frantically writing “at least he tried” arguments.

If I have the CHOICE whether to forgive his character or not, especially given he goes through an atonement arc and not a redemption arc, why is any form of criticism about his abusive behavior and essentially his abuse of power practically ignored by the story unacceptable?

The message was detrimental because people operate on the notion that for victims to be good people, they must forgive and even help their abusers. MHA presents people who choose not to forgive him as either a monster (Toya) or inconvenient (Natsuo). And if they are still unforgiving, they must admire the abuser for doing the bare minimum (taking responsibility; this is also about Natsuo).

Essentially, they are considered "imperfect victims" because they weren't merciful in their approach to their abuser.

The majority of the fandom tends to ignore the lack of actual consequences for Endeavor's actions because he vows to talk to Toya every day. Insisting that doing the bare minimum, which is recognizing his son's existence and suffering, became his "hell" is a wildly fucked up message, in my opinion.

It harps on the issue mentioned above that if a victim isn't receptive to forgiveness or doesn't act "demure," they are seen as an inconvenience—which is how the Todoroki family ultimately views Toya.

On a less critical note, I'll vent, so if you don't like this, just ignore it.

I'm so fucking tired of stories depicting imperfect victims as people who deserve death and torture. Plus, having to be on the brunt of so many people acting like you're morally fucked because you're not impressed with how a writer handled abuse. Horikoshi is not the first writer to try to atone a character who is an abuser (and he isn't the first to fail at that, either).

I'm not about to dick-ride every decision every author makes. Especially if the message convinces some audience members that victims are inherently broken if they can't bring themselves to forgive and/or admire someone who hurt them.

[onebillionghosts]

man i remember when nevermore first came out i was sad it was so underrated.. but now after all the drama, i wish it had stayed underrated, because a big fanbase (especially one with a lot of minors) ALWAYS brings drama

[reel-fear]

Genuinely so curious who Mike thinks is gonna be buying The Cage or the new DCTL GN bc with the way he tweets as far as he's concerned, it's not gonna be:

The queer people he has actively admitted he will never show any representation of in the games.

2. The POC he has actively fought against representing in his franchise. [Who he also mocked for thinking they would be represented in his franchise]

3. The Bendy fandom which has always been concerned with topics of diversity esp in the sense of queer people since its creation. Who he has responded to really poorly esp in regards to the GN.

4. The fans who critique him. [He blocked me for doing so lol]

5. His fans in general who he tweets about like this currently. [He's being vague about why people were mad at him or sent him 'nasty messages' because if you actually looked into why you'd see he was in the wrong. Either way, a very hateful way to speak abt ur own fanbase.]

Reminder while Mike is trash talking his fans he has always treated them rather poorly. The fans who won the fanart contest for Chapter 5 never got their posters actually in game due to it being rushed. Not only was chapter 5 a big slap to the face story wise, but it was literally so rushed he couldn't be bothered to add in the art his fans gave him for his game FOR FREE. [Meatly blames this on a crazy timeline, reminder him and Mike are the literal ceos of this company. The proposal of future updates here is also pretty cruel considering Mike nowadays happily admits he corrupted Chapter 5's source code and therefore literally can't update it At All currently. Because he is a moron]

At least they got to be in Boris and the dark survival, and by that I mean that was the Only game they got to be in so far, isn't that just treating your fans like you love them? Shoving their hard work into a spin off game almost nobody has played or addresses much. [Hell, who knows if with the Lone Wolf rebrand they'll even stay there. In which case they'll be in None of the games, only in the credits of BATIM]

6. The Bendy fans who just generally disagree with him on stuff. Like the new ink demon design where there is literally a public poll showing people generally prefer the old one.

7. The Bendy fans who can see he is actively lying to them. To their fucking faces.

He says this has always been the case, but screenshots and links to tweets regarding the books being canon prove it was not. Does he really think bendy fans are stupid or something? [Unless he's admitting here he lied to Kress when he told her the books were canon which sounds worse!]

8. Anyone who doesn't like the idea of giving money to a guy who laid off tons of employees then afterwards thought it was a great idea to express his anti-union views! Also brag about how good of an employer he was, according to his employees, he was not!

So in summary; Mike is an awful person who has not learned anything from the awful things he did. I will not be purchasing The Cage because, combined with this and his absolute refusal to take any kind of critique or see any differing interpretation of his franchise, I have no reason to think my problems with the franchise will ever be addressed or fixed. I probably will pirate The Cage along with any future Bendy Products [Including the movie] and will do my best to avoid giving it any kind of monetary support. Unless this changes any time soon, I can't see myself making anymore positive Bendy posts soon.

Mike has just managed to make it so hard to speak positively or optimistically of this franchise when he's so willing to broadcast how little he cares about it or its fans. I'm at the point where I refuse to pull any of my punches with my problems with it. What's the point of trying to play nice with my critique when either way the people creating it don't care?

So with this post, I want to invite anyone who feels similarly about the franchise to tell me, make a post or send an ask talking about how all of this makes you feel. It may not change how things are, but genuinely seeing other people share my feelings of anger makes me feel better. It feels nice to see when other people share our same concerns and worries. I'd also love to know if anyone else thinks they'll be avoiding purchasing Bendy products over this.

I'm not forcing anyone to participate in it nor trying to say anyone who doesn't supports mike but genuinely maybe if we can collectively decide to boycott things like the movie, graphic novel and The Cage... It might at least make the bendy devs acknowledge how much they have destroyed their own fandom's faith and trust in them.

The way Mike tweets about his actions like he had no control over why people were mad at him at least proves to me he takes NONE of it back nor regrets it. If you didn't know about his actions and only went off his tweets, you would be led to believe Mike has been needlessly picked apart by fans over things he couldn't control [or in his own words, had his words twisted and taken out of context]. That is not how you speak about your actions if you have actually learned better from them.

anyway, that has been my bendy dev callout post. This is an open invitation to anyone feeling similarly upset about the way the franchise is going to talk about it. It's genuinely nice to see how people feel about this and the more we talk about the more it's likely the bendy devs are forced to address our concerns. I don't think they will but hey, that's why I'm not gonna support them with my money anymore nor am I gonna be nice to them in any content I make critiquing Bendy. I mean I'm also basically making this post just in case anyone asks me Why I feel this way towards to bendy devs/as a way to respond to anyone who thinks I am too harsh in my critique in the future.

As always, it seems the best part of Bendy isn't actually anything about canon but about what the fan's are creating with the ideas Bendy failed to do anything interesting with.

Also the books, the books slap.

[quietwingsinthesky]

see my brain just doesn’t register the idea of anyone having a ‘one true love’ which is why the common fandom tropes of making canonical love interests terrible in order to justify why your ship is better always bugs the shit out of me. it feels like the only reason you would do that is if the idea of the characters in your ship having any other sort of romantic relationship that was important to them, even in the past, is a threat to their current one, therefore all their past relationships need to be demonized in order to make them ‘not real love’ so that they remain pure and chaste and ready for the True Love of the endgame ship.

[lemonstars8583]

HELLO FIVE NIGHTERS i am back again and you can’t stop me from appearing spontaneously. Hello.

hardly any representation of Sarah here i know i know i’m sorry.. but um 👍👍 at least she’s here

ANYWAY i have. NO idea what to say about this. if you have any question ask (PLKEASE 🥹🥹 PLEEK… PLEEK…?) idk what to ramble about unprompted, normally i can talk on end for hours at a time but rn my brains drawing a blank.

uhm fun fact: Millie has memorized the name and location of every main artery thanks to the plague on society that is funtime freddy

I AM EDITING THIS POST TO SAY THAT UHm millie and sarah were in the same grade at the same highschool. no they were not friends at all. millie thought sarah was annoying for constantly wanting to be like other people and be “popular” (she HAAATES the popular kids after her “bff” ditched her or whatever the fuck happened in the book and she CANNOT understand anyone who wants to be like them), and uhhh sarah thought millie was WEIIRD she thought she was super super weird and carried diseases like rabies or some shit yk. like she’d camp out in the woods and kill frogs or some shit yk. she’d follow flocks of crows to a corpse to examine it yk. rumors like that LMFAO

[fandomtrashfox]

Me, realizing 'Stolitz' is end game for Helluva Boss apparently, and now getting to the point of wanting to avoid the show because these two definitely aren't in a healthy relationship.

Man, why - other than fan service - would Viv want these two to be together? It's so toxic!

I'm not saying Stolas is free of blame, here, but I feel like they're equally bad for each other. They're equally using each other albeit for different reasons. It's a toxic situation for both sides and I don't see how people keep forgetting that Blitzo is constantly doing a 'hot and cold' act with Stolas. Please, do not do this Viv, come on, now. Please make the end be Stolas and Blitzo permanently breaking up and moving on to healthier relationships.

[oceanwithouthermoon]

i think its weird that i have to make this disclaimer but the internet is crazy so wtvr,, anyway,,

if i say i dont like something, that doesnt mean "that thing is bad and nobody should post it.."

i swear literally every time i even mention that i dislike something, people will go "wow does that mean u fucking hate me cuz i post that thing? ur a fucking stupid bitch and all ur opinions r wrong" LIKE ?? er.. no. just because i say i dont like certain characterizations of certain characters (the saiki k fandom is CRAZY about this cuz i can state an opinion on literally any character and a group of people will still go 'well only we're allowed to post our opinions about them because we're always right!1!1!'), or certain ship tropes (mentioned my hatred of toxic yaoi maybe once or twice on here months ago and people STILL get mad at me as if i said toxic yaoi lovers r evil or something), or certain ships, or WHATEVER, does not mean that i HATE the people who are posting them or that i think they shouldnt post them at all, NO, im just posting about my personal tastes on my personal blog and it would be extremely weird and hypocritical if i decided that i was the ONLY person that was allowed to do that,,

i think the only reason people assume that is because there are a lot of other people on here who ARE like that, and a lot of people toe the line between posting that they dont like something and posting that they think everyone who likes that thing is stupid, annoying, and wrong,, so i guess all i can say is, sorry for whatever made you make these assumptions but they arent true about me so plz leave me alone ʘ‿ʘ ur doing the same thing to me that ur accusing me of but i didnt do it in the first place so ur just actively being a dick for no reason

[triglycercule]

normal murder time trio and then the idiocracy that is jk fashion au and the jk!mtt

[thewanderingace]

I'm watching season 5 and 6b of 9-1-1 for the first time (I fell way behind) and it's very....interesting to see what I've already seen on tumblr, what I remember the fandom hating, and what's going on that I had no idea even happened because it never talked about in the tags at all.

Taylor is so not as bad as the fandom makes her out to be. I don't agree with all of her decisions (especially with the Jonah storyline) and her and Buck maybe don't make the best pairing but I like her. And she really was just doing her job with the Jonah thing. Nothing inherently bad about that at all. She reports the news and she never named a source or anything. Just means her and Buck don't make the best match. But Taylor as a character is cool and I like her.

Same with Lucy. She's pretty cool actually. I like her a lot. Why the hell did the fandom hate Lucy so much? I was expecting the bitch from hell based on posts I saw but she did nothing wrong the whole season. She was really great and I hope we see her again. She made good rescues, fit in with the group, wasn't pushy or arrogant, followed Bobby's orders but still voiced her knowledge when necessary. She showed emotions and was humble and fun and kind. Why do you all hate her!? Is it because she and Buck kissed? Once? Mutually? But because she's not Eddie that makes her evil or something? She did nothing like that every again nor did she make Buck feel bad or pressured at all so why do we hate Lucy???? I'm so confused about that.

I'm also seeing that tons of people hate Josh now!?!! HOW!? WHY!? Josh is the best! I love Josh! Is it really for the ONE line he said to Eddie in which he was correct? Eddie was a guest. He's not a dispatcher. And besides it acts as a way to get Eddie to realize he's a firefighter. Josh is amazing and I love him.

And how has this whole ass Jonah storyline just never talked about at all?! He kidnapped Hen and Chim and killed Chimney several times just to bring him back!! He nearly drove Bobby to drink again (I love that scene between Bobby and Eddie when Eddie shows up just as Bobby was thinking about drinking again)!!!! And I saw nothing about it!!!

And how about the surprise Karen/Hen vow renewal! That was beautiful! Saw nothing about it on here.

It's just so very telling of the fandom of what I see on screen versus what the fandom fixates on and how they view things. It just serves as a reminder as to why I need to continue to avoid the 911 tag as much as possible if I want to enjoy the show as much as I do because we are so not on the same page here.

[enchantrum]

I also don't want to hear any bitching and moaning about how squidfans act when we can legit just be posting meta in our little corner with other squids and people will come out of the woodwork specifically to anon us to complain that they disapprove lmao

[userautumn]

++

[butwhatifidothis]

So, why do some people who love Crimson Flower always go on about how the English translation is pure evil? Because they always say that "oh, Treehouse hated Edelgard," but they never do a side-by-side comparison of why the English translaton is significantly more pro-Dimitri and anti-Edelgard (notice who they leave out in that) than the Japanese script.

From what I've seen, it seems to come from early fandom interpretations of 3H saying that it was "mistranslated to make Edelgard look worse" that came from people who, uh. Primarily didn't actually speak Japanese, or otherwise had a fairly severe misunderstanding of it.

You'll see this with pretty much every big-name event that is claimed to have been "mistranslated" in general. The AM parley, the Continue To Kill no u, Faerghus Toxic Masculinity, and "the Dream Interview calls her an antagonist not a villain" are the Big 4 of this thing happening, and all four of them have been thoroughly debunked as nonsense by people who actually speak and understand Japanese. That's probably why the actual MAJORITY of events that get the "this was mistranslated to make Edelgard look worse" card don't actually have that side-by-side comparison you mention (since there's WAY more smaller things that they say this about, for example Dimitri was TOTALLY JOKING with Edelgard during Gronder 1 and TOTALLY WASN'T freaked the fuck out at her "jokes"), because the people who claim this are 0-4 on being correct about this for four of the most important examples of this supposedly happening.

So they'll kinda just say anything is Totally A Mistranslation in the hopes that the English-speaking fandom who for the most part don't speak Japanese will believe them, and through that believe them on what the game is "actually" trying to say. With that being, of course, that Edelgard was completely and utterly right about literally actually factually every single thing she has ever said in the game ever and literally actually factually every single other person who disagrees with her is completely and utterly wrong (unless what they're saying is, of course, in alignment with what Edelgard is saying).

And if anyone who actually knows what they're talking about comes in and corrects them - even nicely! - they'll either go on about how everyone is coming after them (read: people who understand Japanese are correcting someone who doesn't understand Japanese about something that exclusively revolves around understanding Japanese), or they'll accuse that person of being a liar/sexist/homophobic POS who just wants the poor little gay bean that is Edelgard to be pure and utter evil since they totally view all gay women to be pure and utter evil.

All this, from what I can gather, is mostly to serve as a justification as to why they like Edelgard since they view liking her as a villain to be a genuine mark of bad character, for some reason. They want to believe that she's the progressive figure who does everything for the little guy for one reason or another, and so grab for any excuse they can give her they can think of to make their interpretation of her not seem so unfounded against all of the evidence Edelgard provides the player that she really is just an imperialist who doesn't really give a shit about her people if doing so gives even the slightest bump to her goal of forceful unification. All because daring to like villains is just soooo baaaaad lmao

[serxinns]

Anons to Other fandom authors : *sends love to authors* "Hey I love your blog can you do *sends cute requests*

Hotd anon fans to hotd authors: *looks around* Hey you!

@madame-fear: yes? :D

Anon: *says the most diabolical toxic shit*

@madame-fear: 😰

No seriously they they always get on my poor mother like WHAT DID SHE DO!?

[dennisboobs]

if i'm not rambling on here rest assured knowing i am most definitely doing it in dms because saying it here would get me shot and stabbed