#bnha critical

[nyc3]

My reason for calling Overhaul the best Villain in the main series is because he's way more competent, driven and has a real threatening presence to him, compared to the other Villain Leaders.

AFO (Post Kamino) & Shigaraki aren't in his League.

They don't give off that feeling of dread. Shigaraki got AFO quirk to try and make him seem more imposing, but it wasn't enough since having a strong power isn't the only thing Overhaul had going for him.

AFO was decent until after his interrogation with All Might, where he became too comically evil for the sake of it (imo)

Re-Destro wasn't there for long but he did a ok job. The MLA did sell me as a competent group, considering the amount of money and connections they had. As well as their goal of free quirk use.

The only thing that was off was there belief of quirk supremacy, since the organisation's strength came from wealth and connections.

But other than that they were ok, it's too bad they were shoved to the side during the War.

Sorry for rambling

But yeah, that's my reason for Overhaul being the best Villain in MHA

Your reasoning for think that is almost the same as mine.

But also Overhaul ideals and objectives felt different and way more grounded in the sense it doesn't feel like he blames society for everything and his only answer is mindless destruction.

He actually persue change but in way that almost makes sense, and his mindset offers a very interesting perspective about quirks that this series always avoid to exploit. Like is funny how Horikoshi puts constant references to the doomsday theory being something very real, yet no one in verse tries to do something about it and any character who doesn't like quiks is treated as a crazy monster to invalidate their opinions.

Chisaki is also different to other villains in the sense that despite his life is pretty tragic he never gets victimized by the author, something I can appreciate because honestly the most annoying part about the LOV for example is how the story constantly pats them in the back and tries to pretend their are just victims when they passed that point long ago.

Kai on the other hand gets a treatment so harsh that makes me wonder if Horikoshi actually hates him with passion, because holy hell since his defeat Horikoshi really doesn't hold back on try to put him as miserable as possible and with no chance of improve his situation even a bit. It felt like a massive double standard when you see how much the LOV gets glazed.

Well... this kinda became a rant on my part, but I need to express it as Overhaul really deserved a way better treatment because in terms of villains he was the peak and MHA never had something similar again.

[mikeellee]

Sorry for entering your ask but can I rant how much I hate the disrespect Izuku got by the author himself. I know the shonen mangas where the main character get preferred by a much more interesting character (take gojo, or Mikey from tokrev) heck take bsd from dazai or chuuya. These characters are much more popular than main characters but you know what the author respect and care about main character. They have people who outside of these popular characters actually give two shit about the main character or worry about mc.

My favourite example is of Tokyo Revengers, a shonen jump manga. The main character Takemichi family never get revealed. Instead we got more focused on Manjiro Sano, Mikey. The author put more focus on this character and Mikey is the central focus of the story throughout but you know what Wakui still respect Takemichi. He give him character development, people who care about Takemichi as person. When he got down due to plot, people support him. Sure the goal of the main character was saving Mikey till the end to the point he run away from a day before his wedding. Mikey is doomed narration wise and Takemichi want to save Mikey. Takemichi admire and respect Mikey but it is same with Mikey. He admire and respect Takemichi very much. Wakui (author) make sure put these two characters in equal place narration wise. Mikey respect for Takemichi is very strong too. He see him as 'his hero'. Mikey nickname the main character 'Takemitchy' as a nickname. Mikey respect the main character so much it is insane.

There was several plot holes and the way story got rushed in Tokyo Revengers make you desire more but Wakui did give a happy ending for Takemichi. He marry the girl and the reason why the story started, he achieved a goal he wants and is in much better place since the story started.

I don't care about rushed endings or even bad endings. I just want endings at least make sure for main character where they at least respected or in peaceful and happy after achieving their goal after suffering throughout the story. But instead we got this with Izuku canonically and it make my heart ache. Izuku don't deserve this treatment. I don't know what is hori hating his own character so much he give the entire story to bakugou. If he love bakugou that much why not make bakugou main character. Izuku doesn't deserve all this bullshit.

My point is Horikoshi could have easily make a story if he wants to put his shining favourite characters in the centre but make sure to give the respect and care to Izuku like Wakui did with Mikey and Takemichi. But we got this with MHA!!! What the hell?

hi @circles19

First off, I didn't watch the animes you mentioned- yes, I heard about it but never saw it- have heard about their endings here and there and while animes Shonen do have a reputation of bad endings but...let's take a look into Naruto, yes, I promise this will make sense.

Naruto had a really bad ending as the fans label but if we ignore Boruto as any sane fan does and the movie Naruto the last movie...the ending of the manga does make sense. The mc does fullfil his purpose, save Sasuke. Its not ideal, I give that. But as many Naruto meta blogs forget...Naruto is also a victim in the konoha system...him being quiet about the secret of the massacre is not doing him any favours, if anything it does disfavors.

But I always wonder how it would be if Naruto told the secret about the Uchiha massacre. Would people believe? Would they care? If I have made this question a few years ago, many would say how no one would turn a blind eye to such thing....but now I think Naruto may be trying to protect the uchihas in his own way bc imagine if he had revealed everything only for ...no one give a fuck.

The ending of Naruto is not ideal. I would prefer one where Sasuke and Naruto get justice or just leave konoha. But it works for what it is.

Mha is a mean spirit story and lazy. Let me preface saying how ...many mangas in Japan does tackle bullying, and get a hold on this, THEY SHOW AS A BAD THING! So the excuse many hori fans say "Japan sees bullying different" is false. MANY MANY MANGAS SHOW HOW BULLYING IS BAD, HOW YOU SHOULD PITY THIS CHARACTER WHO IS BEING BULLIED, HOW THE BULLY IS NOT A GOOD PERSON.

Izu's origin story doesn't make sense! I'm sure you must have seen some of my posts how I do always say QUIRKLESS discrimination is not a real thing and it's really not. Izu is abused bc...yes, why not? But don't take the abuse too serious. Its just deku.

Izu being QUIRKLESS also adds nothing to the story. What's the matter if he is quirkless? He is abused even when he get a quirk.

He has no friends. No family. No mentor. Nothing.

We don't get Izuku. His abuser? We get why he wants to be a hero. Izu? Shrugs.

Its SMTH I always harpy here. Izu IS the perpetual odd duck. He is not allowed to shine, not allowed to outshine BK. His quirk hurts him (I hate when people call Izu a Gary stu bc "he can use 45% of ofa? Booo" I hate when people say "don't want to make Izu op" like you can't write good stories with a kid who was abused and now has a strong quirk?) and no one in UA cares. No one does anything.

Aizawa is a shitty and malicious teacher.

Am is a shitty and incompetent teacher.

Its like so tiring...Izu is mistreated left and right in the narrative. (I hate ochako. You have no idea she and the rest of A1) and the fandom follow along:

Cucko jokes

Macdonald jokes (he is a teacher in a country where being a teacher is a honour. Leave to hori to do that!)

Im tired. In my fics, I go against fanon and make my own thing. Izu is a woman(bc holy shit izu and women are mistreated fr plus the plotlines I can come up with Izumi is wow) who is allowed to be angry at what she endured.

Fuck ua

Fuck A1.

[embers-of-the-league]

Okay, so here's where we're at apparently

Tomura is dead

Toga is dead (or, let's just call it as it is, she committed suicide) - this is despite the fact that if she died other characters (read: heroes) should have died as well, but didn't (Bakugo and Edgeshot for example)

Dabi is presumably still in the hospital (since we didn't see a funeral), unable to move or do anything on his own

Spinner wrote his book, but where he is and how he's actually doing is unknown - presumably he still has to deal with multiple quirks that aren't his own and are tearing at his body

Compress is alive but where he currently is is unknown - he read Spinner's book (and that's it)

Kurogiri exploded?? And nobody has bothered to mention anything about him since

Twice has been dead for a while, but his murderer is not only free of charge but also the head of the HPSC (which still exists btw)

Other things:

The hero ranking system still exists

Seemingly no real changes have been made which would help victims like the LOV before they felt like they had to turn to villainy to be heard/seen/understood

Deku gets to be a hero again by the power of ~technology~ - kinda making the whole deal about him losing his quirk feel pointless

Not from this chapter, but I still feel like it's very important to point out that it's heavily implied that Rei is just gonna take care of Enji (her abuser) now and probably for the rest of time

The few good things:

Ochako bringing more focus on mental health

That was it, I have nothing else

[nagitosstolenhand]

i don't like the growing opinion that people are being 'too hard' on deku for his failing to save shigaraki.

i've seen quite a few people complaining that a lot of the bnha-critical crowd are being too mean to deku for getting tomura killed, arguing that it isn't really his fault, and that hes a 16 year old child soldier who's been failed by almost every adult in his life, why should we be putting all of this on his shoulders? hes just a kid after all?

and the truth is, they're right. deku IS a 16 year old boy whos had the fate of the world thrust on his shoulders. but the story itself just plainly refuses to acknowledge this.

the narrative doesn't acknowledge how fucked up having a school that trains literal children how to be combo cop-celebrities is. it only tentatively acknowledges the fact that a universe having combo cop-celebrities is fucked up, and even then the only people who ever point this out are antagonists, who are portrayed and treated in-universe as untrustworthy. the narrative doesn't care how fucked up dekus circumstances are. the narrative treats deku like hes a fucking messiah here to touch the hearts of the evil depressed villains with his magical empathetic heart of gold before they get blown up or just sent to fucking superhell for daring to challenge the status quote.

deku isn't a person. he's barely even a fucking character at this point. he's a plot device, and a mouth piece for the objectively shitty themes bnha is trying to spout. the themes that tell you that if you're mistreated by society and want to do something about it, you're a villain. that disrupting the status quote and refusing to repent to some random teenage boy spouting empty platitudes at you means you deserve to get sent to fucking superhell. the themes that portray people fighting for civil change as mass murdering supervillains. the themes that look the audience dead in the eye and can call deku the greatest hero to ever live.

deku, who barely spared a second thought to lady nagant telling him the truth about the hero commission. who spouts meaningless platitudes about heroism and morality at nagant, and aoyama, and toga and shigaraki, when even the thought that he should question the world around him comes up. who's constantly talked about as this truly kind, empathetic person, but hasn't spared an empathetic thought to literally anyone who is classified as a villain. who listened to every authority figure around him except the ones who asked him to question his worldview. who saw la bravas tears, shigarakis various breakdowns, himikos plead for understanding, chisakis catatonic state, lady nagants truth, and barley batted a fucking eye. deku, who killed tomura shigaraki.

people don't criticize deku for failing shigaraki because they just hate deku. people criticize deku because of what he represents. because hes a mouthpiece for the atrocious morals and themes of this ideologically rotten manga. because any character he had was chopped up to bits in favor of the incomplete husk we have now. people criticize deku because hes the main character of my hero academia. theres nothing more damning then that.

[denkisauce]

my growing collection from redacted dot com 🥲

[solitairedeere]

i was never as optimistic about the ending of bnha as some villain stans were, but i never thought it'd end so badly it left me wondering why horikoshi ever bothered to humanize the villains or make them complex characters at all.

like-- i expected that at least 1-2 of the 3 villains who were heavily foreshadowed and outlined by the narrative as people to be saved would be, you know, actually saved. i didn't think that was a high bar. i've been let down before in fandoms where everyone was certain a character would live and then they didn't, so i tried to keep my hopes low. AND YET.

what happened to tomura was upsetting, but i wasn't that shocked after how disinterested the manga has seemed to be in him for like, the past 100 or so chapters. a bit surprised, because you'd think if anyone would succeed in the 'saving' mission it would be the MC, but whatever. dabi, well, they've spent a lot of time showing the way his quirk destroys his body even before this arc, so that also sucked but at least it didn't feel completely out of left field.

........but they're not even letting toga live???

i just-- what have we even been doing here? when zero out of the 3 characters that were marked out for saving were actually saved, you have to acknowledge that something has gone seriously fucking wrong with the storytelling. not even just from the perspective of a villain fan but from the perspective of someone who likes stories to be thematically consistent or satisfying in any way.

you can set up an expectation of these characters being saved and then subvert that and turn it into a tragedy- if done well that could even be worthwhile and interesting. but you can't turn it into a tragedy and then just... keep trucking along with the happy ending messaging and act like anything in the manga has been resolved and that the characters have somehow successfully completed their heroic origin stories.

like, maybe i shouldn't have expected this much from a shounen- at the end of the day it is still a shounen so i didn't expect to feel that it truly satisfactorily wrapped up all the themes it brought up around societal ills. but i expected it to at least resolve those things in a shounen-y way where they punch the problems and help these specific people and then you can feel good assuming that the state of things will continue to improve in the post-canon world of the manga.

instead we got... uh, none of that. the story refused to answer a single one of the larger questions it's been outlining for the past 400+ chapters. in the end, it was all flash and no substance, which again could've been fine, if it weren't for the way the story seemed to spend significant chunks of time trying to delude you into thinking it had substance.

truly makes me wonder what horikoshi thought he was doing the entire time. can it really all be blamed on burnout? the most that can be said for this ending is that it is, well, an ending. fuck dude, it is that.

and that's just... such a sad way to end a project that took up 10 years of your life.

[sanjipussyindulgence]

i havent caught up with bnha in a while but after hearing about the ending... i think we can all safely agree its the naruto of this generation. they both got too distracted writing an accidental gay love story for the ages to fix the fucked up corrupt society that uses child soldiers.

[haine-kleine]

ignoring canon so hard because if I start thinking about Touya ending up as a plot device, a simple prop for Enji's character arc and getting no future beyond being the highlight of his abuser's change of heart, I will set myself on fire

[commander-revan]

Can't believe Toga became the exact martyr that Curious was going to turn her into.

[writerswho]

Aizawa is a terrible teacher. I love Aizawa, but I love the fanon version of Aizawa. Even when he's a bad teacher in the fanfics, he's still better than the canon. But what made me realise what a crap teacher Aizawa is was Kalego. After watching Iruma-kun and starting to read the manga, I realised that Kalego, the uptight, grumpy, tired and kind of sadistic teacher who gives his students extra work just because he can, is everything Aizawa tries to be, but isn't. Because Kalego cares about his students in a way canon!Aizawa would never. Like, yeah, Aizawa would die for his students, but that is not due to the fact that his a good teacher. It is because he is a hero and that is what heroes do. While Kalego would also die protecting his students and even kill for them, he also pays attention to their needs as students. Half of the 1-A need help with their regular grades and the other half need help finding ways to use their quirks without hurting themselves. We all joke about Midoriya and his bone juice, but why does nobody think about giving that kid some extra help? Why didn't his homeroom teacher try to find a way for him to use his quirk without blowing himself? Or a way for Kamimari to use his quirk without frying his brain? Aizawa ignores de most basic things about his students' needs, like finding ways for them to use their quirks without damaging their bodies and health. Or the way Midoriya is around Bakugou, who tried to attack him on the first day and almost killed him on the second day. Kalego-sensei, on the other hand, took his time to make a personal notebook for each of his students and worried about finding ways to utilise their strengths regardless of how seemingly meaningless or nonsensical they may be and so many other things. Kalego-sensei cares about his class, about their growth and their future and is trying to find the best alternative for them. Everyone talks about what a bad teacher All Might is, but All Might is a rookie teacher with less than a year on the job (and nobody knows if he has a teacher's licence or not) while Aizawa is believed to be one of the oldest people on Nedzu's payroll. I am comparing Aizawa to Kalego because when I first saw Kallego, I thought he was the demon version of Aizawa. I now realise that if Aizawa were a third of the teacher that Kalego is, maybe these child soldiers would have a chance. When Iruma tried to do everything by himself/messed up, Kalego scolded him, obviously, but he made it clear that if Iruma had another problem, he could ask for help. Because Kalego is his teacher, and he's there to help him in any way he needs. But when Midoriya messed up/did everything by himself, well, they just yelled at him and made him feel guilty, and think that the solution isn't to ask for help or trust the adults next time, but to find a way not to get caught. Aizawa should spend a few days with Kalego and learn to be a real professional and a teacher who does what's best for the students.

[tardigradetheking]

I actually feel sick to my stomach about what happened to dabi. I'm not being hyperbolic. I was never abused but the fact that Dabi's abuser gets to visit him even though everyone knows what that man did is sick. Endeavor gets to stare at him through a pain of glass like dabi is a goddamn monkey in a zoo and dabi is too weak to even object.

[redphlox]

Shouto's ruined character arc in the epilogue

The epilogue’s toxicity-positivity message about smiling ruined Shouto’s characterization and undoes the growth and purpose of his arc because he’s not allowed to mourn the imminent death of his brother Touya.

Shouto partaking in these tone-deaf, festive activities with his friends in chapter 429 feels out of character, feels cheap and shallow, and is a slap in the face to his family. In the past Shouto declined school-related activities and prioritized spending time with his mom at the hospital. Now the narrative is trying to sell the idea that he would NOT spend every remaining minute alongside his family with his dying brother, who he has always wanted to know, the brother he practically begged to confront and said, "Our paths will cross whether you want them to or not" to. Shouto spent all this manga reconciling his feelings about his family and reconnecting to them to just... not be with them when they’re about to experience loss AGAIN? 

I'm not saying I want Shouto to be miserable, but realistically (since readers are so obsessed with realism in this superhero manga), he wouldn’t be wasting the limited time he has left with his brother by going to a farewell party, or any party. Damn, can the author let him mourn? Despite all the celebration the kids are doing, Shouto didn’t get a happy ending. While the rest of their community is rebuilding and making sense of what happened, the Todoroki family is still going through their crisis. It’s not over for them. At least let them cry.

This is a regression for Shouto’s character because the concept of allowing heroes to cry was first presented through Shouto, literally through his own words. The narrative then picks up this concept again during Ochako's speech at the UA shelter civilians, and then... Shouto isn't allowed to cry in the epilogue, and is forced to fake a smile so his friends don’t worry about him.

It’s not like Shouto has cried in this manga. He cried during the sports festival, during the Dabi reveal, and after Dabi escaped to Gunga to go after Endeavor because he knew this meant he had failed to reach his brother -- so no, it doesn’t make sense that he wouldn’t cry now. Instead, he's the one fake smiling, and only Ochako is allowed to be shown crying and being comforted. The double standard and retcon is astounding.

You can literally see the light not reaching his eyes in this panel from 425 when Deku asks if he’s okay. And yes, Shouto is prioritizing his family in this panel, but like I said, Touya doesn't have much time left... why waste it?

Shouto doesn’t want anyone to worry about him, so he’s putting on a brave face. And yet Deku and the other classmates reaching out to Ochako in 429 is selling the opposite message - don’t cry alone, let us be here for you, etc. Why isn’t Shouto granted the same support, especially from these classmates he claims are there for him?

If Horikoshi was aiming for a happy ending where people smile, then Touya’s grimdark, cruel, second and final death doesn't fit because Shouto has to mourn. You can't have both fake smiling and off-screen assumed mourning… it makes no sense for Shouto’s arc, or for the epilogue’s message about reaching out for help or to help. It doesn’t make sense in any context.

Shouto's characterization feels so off in this epilogue. He’s a shell of the person he was becoming. The story starts out by saying that this character is supposed to process the trauma of childhood and a dysfunctional family that he always wished was different, but now he has his found family in his classmates instead. And I'm not saying he can't have both - I'd say the support from his friends is imperative - but, it doesn't make sense that he has seemingly moved on because the fact is, his family situation was his entire start. 

It's not just Shouto that feels off, but his family too. Their once-considered-dead brother/son is alive, but now is dying in front of their eyes for real this time and they just… don’t try to spend as much time with him as possible? Even the sentiment that Shouto gave the family more time to talk falls empty because Touya can only endure a few minutes of conversation at a time, and it’s not like he’s slowly improving and that time will increase. It will only decrease. And yet, the family doesn’t seem too concerned or heartbroken that they’re witnessing someone they love die a second time, this time slowly. He can’t even communicate with them, and he’ll most likely have many things left unsaid when he dies.

The Todoroki family plot was set up to be about reconciliation, but they’re not reconnecting even with Touya’s upcoming death. This scene of Touya and the other siblings kicking a ball while Shoto looked on from the second story of the house begging his father to allow him to play with his siblings has been addressed like four times, and yet in the end he doesn’t get to spend happy moments with his siblings. His reward for his heroism is Touya’s slow march toward death and the knowledge that he has the same favorite food as the brother who his father neglected to death twice. 

Instead of being shown mourning or connecting, the family is acting cold and distant - only Natsuo is acting with a semblance of his normal self. I know some readers attribute the family’s aloofness to Japanese culture not being very affectionate or open with their emotions, but that doesn’t mean Japanese people are devoid of feelings. That’s so fucking racist. We’ve seen parents express love and concern for their children in this manga, and yet the Todoroki family continues to say “we’ll talk, we’ll talk” but we’ve never seen any follow-up. It’s ironic because Shouto’s whole mentality is “actions speak louder than words”.

For a family that became unstable because of misunderstandings about feeling loved and wanted, the family continues to feel devoid of caring. No one comforts Shouto, no one talks about how they feel except for Endeavor. Shouto isn’t allowed to grieve in front of his friends because Ochako takes priority because the narrative is pushing this toxic positivity message about smiling that works on the surface but fails to address any systemic changes. 

This ending doesn't fit the hopeful tone of Shouto's arc.

RIP Shouto’s arc. We loved you. 

[sammy-the-dead-dumpster]

I mean, listen.

This death wouldn't hurt so much if it weren't for:

-Toga committing suicide -Toga committing suicide in an exceedingly preventable way -Toga committing suicide because she felt like she wasn't meant for this society and like she had no other options, which nobody disavowed, not even Uraraka directly -So many other characters with way worse odds surviving (like Bakugou, Nagant, Edgeshot?? Dabi???) -Seriously, why did she have to die? Let her be comatose, at least?? -Hawks being all like, 'Yeah, I shouldn't have killed Twice, the villains shouldn't have to die' -Hawks being nearby at the time, right? And of the same damn blood type? -Anyone willing to help nearby, actually -Didn't they put her on the helicopter? You're telling me that Dabi survived the stretcher ride, but not Toga? -It being. so preventable. not like Dabi's path toward destruction, or Shigaraki turning his body into a vessel for a greater evil. she was just a girl who was helping someone she'd hurt. and didn't need to give up all her blood to do it. -She didn't need to give up all her blood to do it. (Bakugou survived worse. Uraraka would've been fine.) -Her being seventeen -Her death feeling so meaningless, as the theming could have been accomplished by Shigaraki's death alone, except as a conduit for Izuku and Ochako to hold hands together. Which stings. My film professor would be completely unsurprised. -Bury Your Gays -Bury Your Unconventional Love Interests (thanks, film professor!) -the frustrating positive tone of some parts of the epilogue, with no real address of the character's failures and emotional struggles -Not even Uraraka gets to monologue about what this means for her future? Izuku's just slapping an emotional bandage on this? Really? -What even is Izuku's characterization right now? -Is Shoto really the only one who more or less Saved, in addition to Winning?

[atlasofoverthinking]

The Problem with the League of Villains

this is just me ranting after reading many people say that the lov deserved a better ending (i agree with them don't worry). most of that stuff has already been said but i'm bored and need something to write

so why is everyone disappointed?

by definition, an antagonist is someone that goes against the main character(s) and a villain is someone who does immoral and/or illegal things (wow, shocking)

so by definition, the league of villains is aptly named. shigaraki and dabi are mass murderers, toga is a killer too, and even if the others are 'less dangerous' they're all guilty of terorism and kidnapping a teenager.

not nice, right? then why would anyone would want them to have a good ending?

long story short: horikoshi made the league too sympathetic and relatable

when horikoshi has decided to make them funny, he's decided to make them likeable. that's not enough though. you can find a fictional villain funny and not root for them (for some reason the examples that comes to my mind are the disney villains. captain hook is hilarious but no one wants him to win)

the cause of everyone's disappointment is the relatable part. everyone in the league has gone through stuff viewers can relate. touya, shigaraki and toga have been abused; twice has mental health issues (and stuggling to get a job is relatable too lmao); spinner has been discriminated against... you get the idea

and even without knowing their backstory, most of the league's fights can be considered noble: they want to change society and make the world a better place. to take a more precise example, the league kidnapped bakugou because they thought he had gone through similar struggle as them

(this is mr compress talking in chapter 85) as far as i've seen, most of the fandom either think bakugou being chained and muzzled at the end of the sport festival was just comic relief or agree that it was fucked up

so yeah, you can't put a group of people rejected by society, who just want a better world and expect people to not like them

and that's why their ending is disappointing (the rest contains heavy spoilers of the last few chapters of mha)

they're all either in jail or six feet underground. we rationally could understand it, they're all criminals/villains so of course they wouldn't get a happy ending and face consequences for their actions. the only one who could have gotten away with it is shigaraki because of all the grooming/brainwashing he's gone through and maybe toga because she's a child

but if you relate to a character, you want them to get a happy ending. of course fans would want dabi to be at peace, but instead he's forced to spend his last moments being stared at by his abuser). of course fans would want shigaraki to be free from afo (but instead his only freedom was death). of course fans would want toga to be understood and cared for (but she never had that opportunity)

that's not very 'save to win' out of you horikoshi

maybe it's just a shortcut made by the fandom, but the league are seen more as victims of abuse than actual criminals. i mean, what's more important in dabi's story? the fact that he burned himself alive after overworking himself to get his abusive father's attention, or the fact that he's burned people alive? probably both, but there's more focus on the first element.

and obviously we would want abuse victims to get a happy ending

basically, their ending isn't coherent with what we've seen of them, and that's why people are disappointed

btw, the same logic applies to stain. some fans agree with stain's reasoning bc he's fighting against corruption. of course, his logic is stupid and he's delusional but he's introduced not long after we've discovered shouto's past. you can't say "one of the most popular heroes is abusing + all he wants is to get n°1 to satisfy his own ego" and then follow with "see that guy fighting against corruption? he's bad, don't do that"

the clever way to make sure no one would agree with stain would have been to make the heroes fight against injustice with good methods. i live for the fanfics in which izuku takes down the hpsc

okay i'm done ranting thanks for reading

[linkspooky]

It's not just the fact that Hori decided to kill a lifelong victim of grooming.

My two favorite comic book storylines are New Teen Titans Judas Contract, and Uncanny X Men's Inferno. They both feature villains / victims (Madelyne Pryor and Terra) that die at the end of the story. Terra is specifically fifteen years old and a victim of sexual grooming.

However, both of these stories are clearly written as tragedies. It's clear from the start that these are tragic stories not only meant to get us to sympathize with the victim turned villain but also the failure to save a clear victim is meant to make the heroes look bad.

Let me just list off all the shit Scott Summers put Madelyne Pryor through.

Fell in love with her only because she looked like his ex girlfriend Jean. Even though Madelyne specifically stated before getting into the relationship she didn't want to be jeans replacement.

Married her, and refuses to take time off to the point where he misses the birth of his own son leaving Madelyne at home to deliver her baby on the floor.

When he finally retires and they move to Alaska together he gets a phone call that Jean is still alive and abandons his wife and daughter for weeks to go back to his high school girlfriend.

Madelyne is attacked by a group of supervillains while Scott is away and just barely manages to escape but loses her baby.

She joins up with the x men to look for scott only to find out in the time she's been gone Scott had already gotten back together with Jean.

She is tricked into making a deal with a demon who wants to overthrow ilyanas control of limbo (she thought it was just a dream and the contract to sell her soul didn't matter).

She used her newfound power in order to find her child Nathan only to find Mr sinister there who reveals that Madelyne was a clone of Jean Grey, her entire life was a lie, she was made to breed with cyclops and produce a baby for sinister.

At which point madelyne snaps and decides to burn everything to the ground and kill her own child.

It's clearly telegraphed as a tragedy. The reference to Medea is pretty obvious. Madelyne had no chance from the beginning, however even in this tragedy Scott specifically forbid any of the heroes from using lethal force on her. Jean and Maddie mindmeld at one point and Jean literally begs for Maddie not to die and that she should live on to raise her son. They even throw a funeral for Maddie afterwards because be no one else would ever mourn her.

Not only do the heroes look bad, especially Scott for not being able to save her, they do at least try to talk with her, use non lethal force, and beg her at one point to let them help her.

On the other hand not only did Deku never engage Shigaraki Tomura once, just the vision of a crying child in front of him. Deku doesn't look like a failure for failing in his goal to save him he's still the greatest hero, they don't hold a funeral for Shigaraki, Dekus last words are about how he doesn't forgive Shigaraki (and therefore he deserves to die i guess because deku is the punisher now). Deku doesn't even give Shigaraki the respect of calling him by his preferred name he just calls him Tenko who was the only person Deku cared about saving.

It's not just about a victim dying it's about how the story promised us over and over again the kids were going to save the villains in the final act, that this was going to be an optimistic story about the new generation being better than the old.

Only for Horikoshi to deliver something entirely different. If I'm watching punisher I know what I'm getting into. I'm here to watch Frank Castle shoot mobsters. If Batman picks up a Tommy Gun and starts shooting mobsters that's bad because Batman wouldn't do that shit.

There's writing a story that's tonally inconsistent, or changing your plans for how a character is going to end late in the game and then there's this.

Which is basically narrative gaslighting. Where one thing is clearly happening onscreen but the narrative needs you to believe those gaslights clearly are not dimming.

I know Deku made no effort to save Shigaraki when he explicitly said they OFA is a power for saving but not killing, but don't worry Deku became the greatest hero anyway, and this is still a happy optimistic ending!

Horikoshi isn't looking for treasure in the house. Those gaslights aren't dimming. You're clearly being hysterical, woman.

[embers-of-the-league]

God, this series is ruining my life

--

This whole ending is just so bleak and depressing it's honestly starting to get to me. People are so angry and disappointed about it, and I really fucking get it, because the message we're essentially left with is "nothing is going to change". There will always be children like Toga who are villianised the moment they step out of the norm. There will always be young adults like Spinner and Twice, who are left to rot on the bottom of society due to circumstances they can't control.

Society is going to continue to have its black and white view on heroes and villains, which in turn, will get children like Tenko and Touya mixed up in cursed game, which have been decided for them before they're even born.

Apparently, the only villains worth saving are the villains who'll quietly agree to the suffering life has dealt them without acting out or demanding a change.

Just the simple fact that the Safety Comminssion (also that name in itself reads as some sort of cruel joke) is still operating as before is as much proff as any that nothing will change. Sure Hawks is president of it now, but we've already seen the lengths he's willing to go in order to keep up status quo, he knows the dark side of the hero society but he still keeps going with it because, what he's an optimist??

And in this story that is deemed a good attitude.

For 400+ chapters, 7 anime seasons and the real life span of 10 years we've been shown and told and shown again why this system doesn't work and how people suffers because of it. But for some reason wishing for major changes is apparently not what we, as an audience, is expected to do.

Idk what message this manga thinks it sends, but, as things stands, (and with only 2 chapters left) it's definitely not hope