#this isn’t just about critical role because i’ve seen it in Most real play fandoms i’ve come across

[shorthaltsjester]

listen. unless a character explicitly states that a difference in lifespan between them and someone they care about is a concern of their’s, lifespan angst is the most boring and meaningless trope you can add to a fic/fan work. like, yes it is sad to lose someone but that is not because of a difference in lifespan. an elf with 1000+ year life expectancy might die tomorrow, a goliath might live longer than expected. it feels extremely reductive to look at characters with different fantasy races and decide that the biggest concern is that one will outlive the other when those characters have expressed no concern about either outliving or leaving their loved ones behind. like, i get the fear of death and trying to understand that through fictional characters but just do it with the ones who have expressed an actual concern with it, not with characters who seem delighted to get to love someone at all, even if it is brief and mortal. we don’t love people because we think it will be forever, and it hurts when the impermanence of the people we love becomes clear. but if i spent as much time factoring together matters of health and life expectancy for the people i love to try to predict when they’ll die so that i’ll be ready to lose them, i would have a lot less time to love them and it will still hurt just as much when they are no longer around.

[uncaught-coolfish]

The following post is a RWDE rant that is long, angry and non articulated. If you don’t like that, don’t read it, and leave me be. Thank you.

Warning for mentions of racism, bigotry, genocide and slavery. 

RW//BY, as a show, is… I’m going to say it, actually really racist. Is it the most racist thing ever? No. Fuuck no. Not even close. But I’d daresay at least half of it is riddled with some of the most appallingly ignorant shit I’ve seen in any webseries, and yet… some people will go out of their way to harass any who dare to criticize it. 

Remnant is not real. The characters I am about to discuss are not real. But the writers who wrote these characters and the world they inhabit are very real, and the shit they wrote fucking disgusts me.

so. Rant begin. 

Something the crazies of the fandom will say (I say crazies because, the fandom isn’t all like this. many of you guys are chill and cool as fuck) in defense of RW//BY’s many problematic aspects, particularly the criticism of “75% of the show’s POC and minorities are villains”, is that “well, there’s a lot more POC and minority’s on the GOOD GUY side now! Hooray!”

And they’re technically right. I like Elm and Pietro and I love Maria (in V6 especially she was fucking golden) and Marrow. Them and all the other POC they’ve added in as of V6-7~ are, in my opinion, mostly great additions to the cast. 

The side cast. 

The thing that isn’t usually pointed out is that these characters… they are side characters. Pietro and Maria are side characters. The Ace Ops and Happy Huntresses, while playing a decent role, are side characters. 

Hell that extends to pretty much every POC character we’ve gotten aside from Oscar. They’ve been side characters. Many of whom, we likely won’t see again (Until Volume 10… if RT lasts that long)

But I want to mention one thing. We didn’t start getting characters that weren’t blinding white until the end of V2 and the start of V3. 

One of these characters in question I’d like to point out, Flynt Coal. 

I like Flynt. He’s fine. I think his design is cool. But to deny that his character isn’t extremely racist is ignorant.

One of their first. Black characters. Was basically named… “Dark rock, Dark Rock”…

and his weapon is a TRUMPET😭

Not only that, but he and Neon fight Yang and Weiss in the tournament. Let’s talk about Weiss actually. She is the second oldest child to the megarich Schnee family, whom owns the SDC, which she is heiress to. Earlier in the series she acted extremely racist towards characters of an in-universe minority group, and never really apologized on screen. Instead, we’re given justification for why the rich girl is racist. She’s scared because of the White Fang! Poor little German name “White Snow.”

Anyways, back to the fight. Flynt mentions how it was the SDC who put his father’s own company out of business in their monopoly. Does this go somewhere? Nooooo he’s a side character, who’s beaten by Weiss and her bestie by the end of the battle. 

How come they made one of their first black characters fight and lose a battle with their whitest richest character? (Obs not implying he should’ve won, just asking why they chose him in the first place) How come they named him after black rocks(which is in reference to how, in a minecraft letsplay, one mentioned the name “Flynt Coal” and another replied “He’d have to be a black guy!”)? 

Who knows. But surely this is the last time they’ll make a (minority) character be positioned oppositely from our mains. Surely they won’t ever write one as a villain! 

Surely she won’t be the Lakota girl, either!

Ilia as a character was a big stepping stone (at the time) in terms of RW//BY’s representation. She was the first canonical, on screen LGBTQ+ character. She was a member of the White Fang who, before joining, was able to “blend in” with humans due to her Faunus trait not being as noticeable, being spots on her face and along the rest of her body. Ilia was orphaned due to her parents dying in an SDC mine collapse, and when she saw her school friends laughing about it, she “punched their teeth out.” 

Hell, overall I really like Ilia. Her design is adorable, as LGBTQ+ rep I think she’s good enough (though the fact they wrote their first lesbian character to be… a villain, is a talk for another day), and overall I find her decently written on her own. Plus, she’s fun as hell to write. Love her dearly.

On her own. Because in the story, the more I think about it… the more I’m sad, and mad, about how she was handled. 

Firstly. Her name. Apparently it’s supposed to mean “Butterly Rainbow” (again, naming your first lesbian girl “rainbow” lol)… but nope. They got the name Amitola off a baby named website, when it really means something closer to “Like a blue sky.” From my understanding. Typical RT shenanigans. It gets worse :3

Ilia was also one of the very few villains in the show to be redeemed. How was she redeemed? 

By being told by the much-more privileged, whiter minority girl whom she had a crush on that what ilia was fighting for was Bad. How Ilia was fighting for it was Bad. The White Fang? Baaaad. How dare the MINORITIES FIGHT WITH NEEDED VIOLENCE for their basic living rights against the POOR WIDDLE OPPRESSORS! It’s THEIR fault they’re oppressed, because they’re making the humans uncomfortable and angry! They need to just keep their dirty mouths shut and be good, presentable minorities. 

And upon being redeemed, Ilia is immediately put on a bus. Shelved.

And let me remind you again. Who was redeemed through being told by her much whiter (I say whiter in a way not to demean Blake btw, as privileged as she is she is still a minority obviously. Just… stating facts) friend that “a minority Shouldn’t use violence against their oppressors for their rights. It’s Their fault the humans are still so racist towards them. The Faunus should stop being so aggressive and be peaceful”? 

Not only the lesbian character, but…

The indigenous girl.

The.

Indigenous.

Girl. 

I’m sure I don’t need to point out how fucked this is. Let alone the fact this whole show is written in fucking Texas. 

It’s no secret, as much as some try to make it be, how horribly Native Americans and indigenous people have been treated throughout history. The oppression they have faced stems back centuries. Their land and home was stolen from them. 

Their own culture was all but forcefully eradicated. 

Men, women, children, were all genocided. 

To this very day it’s all they can do to fight for not only their own rights as people, but the very lands that were stolen from them. 

So for this show to write… it’s Indigenous

WOMAN

‘s character being “redeemed” by learning “Peaceful protest is good, violent protest for your living rights bad!” is… sickening. Genuinely. Fucking. Sickening. 

But maybe that violent protest WAS bad! Maybe, it was going nowhere and really causing the problems. Who the hell would ever try and implement that? Who leads the White Fang? 

…You wanna know? 

Don’t bother. 

Sienna is a character we see for. One. Scene. One scene and she’s GONE. dead, stabbed, thrown down some stairs. We know very little about her, but we know a lot of her actions. 

Under her rule as high leader, she got shit gone. Through her use of violence against the oppressive humans, she did in five years what many before her couldn’t in decades: Her methods were working. Her people were being given rights.

But noooooooo!!!!!!!!! We can’t have the Woman of Color in power be CORRECT. Her methods were WRONG, MONSTROUS! How dare she end slavery and fight against oppression?! She should’ve just asked NICELY! Just like Blake told—

Wait… Blake? BLAKE?!

BLAAAAAAAAKEEEEE!!!!!

Blake is one of 4 main characters in RW//BY, and she was easily my favorite. Fierce and a bookworm, an ex-freedom fighter who was quick to call out Miss Rich “White Snow” on her bullshit. She was fun, strong, and like the show said itself, she was Feisty.

I miss that Blake, tails. I miss her a lot. I’ll be back. 

Nowadays, that feisty personality she has has been diminished so she can be all meek and quiet and sweet for her white human friends. 

(and just now in v9, she’s completely fine with being referred to as an animal. Sienna in honorary heaven: she would not fucking say that.) 

White fans and likely the writers themselves were too uncomfortable having to face that all majority people still benefit from a society built on and from deep systemic racism, so they wrote Blake to be an All Lives Matter doormat so she was more palatable Blake saw the error of the White Fang’s ways and how their justified acts of violent protest against the privileged majority were making the humans SCAWED🥺, so she stood before them all and put her status as literal Faunus princess to good use: telling all those like her who’d suffered beneath the humans’ oppression that they were wrong. How could they fight back violently? They did this to themselves. They brought the oppression, the enslavement, the bigotry and cruelty upon themselves because they just didn’t play nice enough. 

Fuck, even when she’s in the “City of Racism” Atlas, she’s too busy being uwu sad and nervous and having to rely on others (funny how instead of ever empowering her again, they write Blake as this submissive docile flower baby immediately after hey reveal she was an abuse victim. Real fucking funny. Laughing my eyes out of my skull with a toothpick.) except for when she jokingly comments how rich the Schnees are and how they own basically everything. 

Past Blake wouldn’t be laughing about that. She’d use it against the Schnees, rightfully. 

But we can’t have that. She’s the good minority, who keeps her mouth shut tight and looks pretty for the camera. 

But… about that bigotry. That oppression, that racism… do we ever see that? 

lol fuck no

We hear of how horribly the Faunus people are treated. Controversial labor forces that keep them as slaves to the SDC. Treated like dirt and beaten and killed and lynched. 

We hear. We hear of that. 

In the show, we get… a No Faunus sign put out in some background places. And the equal opportunist bully bullying a bunny girl.

That’s it. Background shit. Background shit that could easily be interpreted differently, or missed completely if you fucking blink.

There has only been one point where the true extent of this oppression is shown to us. One point which… 

we’ll fucking get to. 

But there’s one thing I’ve mentioned rather frequently throughout this rant. Two, technically. The Schnee family and the SDC. 

Let’s talk. Let’s. Fucking. Talk. 

*sighs*

So this show demonizes it’s fictional worlds only freedom fighting organization, so surely they do the same for the oppressive Amazon company that has a chokehold on the economy of an entire—

In the early volumes, Weiss, another main character, was extremely racist to those who were Faunus. She was also the daughter of the Richy Rich Bitch Family of “CEOs of Racism”. Her older sister was a cop, her younger brother out of the picture until V4, her mother a neglectful abusive alcoholic (she is a victim too but neglect. is. abuse.), her father a racist abusive asshole who looks like I could break him like a bendy straw. But her racism isn’t her fault at all! No, the dirty minorities in the White Fang who were terrorizing the richest of the rich were what made her racist. It was never her fault, only the scary minorities. 

How dare the marginalized be so evil.

But she apologizes off screen and is no longer racist! Yippee! At least we marked “Racist” off her “Racist Blood Purist Rich White Weiss” card! she’s White Savior Blood Purist Rich White Weiss now! Now we can make fun of how much shit her family owns. 

But before all that, she and her girlfriend battle… a black man! Gasp! Who… says before the fight, her family’s company put his family’s business OUT of business! 

A throwaway line before he and his bestie get beaten. Also just realized as I type: not only did Weiss battle a black character who was affected by her family company’s monopoly, but… a Faunus. Another one for the jar.

B-But Blake knows Ilia was affected by the SDC, too! It orphaned her, because in their mines Faunus weren’t given nearly as much safety. Surely she can tell Weiss and have her see—

*Ruby voice* nope. Nope! Ilia was being violent for equality, and that’s no good. So she learns that all their oppressors (likely including the SDC)are really just SCARED of them! So she’s redeemed and becomes peaceful. The Lakota indigenous girl is turned “good.”

But maybe once they’re in Atlas—

Jokes are made about how FUNNY LOL XD it is that her family owns so much, and they’re appalled by how… literally fucking normal Mantle is, as if it’s just an utter travesty to their eyes. She doesn’t want to outright abolish the corrupt SDC, which basically rides on Atlas like a parasite, but instead free it from the dirty-blooded clutches of her father, and return it to the Pure Blooded Schnees, who will use it righteously, in Santa Schnee’s name!

She’s the granddaughter of a hero, after all. A hero who monopolized and capitalized the world’s resources and began a chokehold on an entire kingdom with how vital the Resources became, all the while implementing minority slave labor.

Because we can’t have our pretty princess Weiss face any consequences. We can’t have one of ours mains face consequences. Realize her privilege and try and do something. We can’t make our writers uncomfortable!

And this extends to Winter, too! The woman as racist as Weiss was, but without the “”excuse””, who is also a cop, and who… punches, kneels over one of the characters who is both an in-universe minority of a Dog and easily the darkest skinned character, and tells him; “You want a collar? Fine.”

But the Pure Blood Schnees are good. They’re beautiful and powerful. Even if Weiss has that scar, it’s as tiny as can be so to not ruin her pretty face. Let’s give the rich white family all the angelic imagery. Let’s show Weiss with wings. 

Twice. Twice with white, huge and glowing angel’s wings. 

Looking pure and holy. Pure. And. Holy. 

But Angel imagery? Surely there’s a contrast. Demonic imagery: like the horns, black and red, something to do with darkness and the moon, who should that belong to? If the rich, white, blood purist main girl Weiss gets the angel wings, pretty face and princess aesthetic… who deserves to be the demon of Remnant? 

…Oh, I know the answer to this one! It’s—

Throughout this whole post, there’s been one character I’ve purposefully neglected mentioning by name.

 Adam.

We didn’t see the guy much. Black trailer, V2, V3, V5, V6. And he was really only reoccurring in V5, which… 😶

But from what we did see, we saw the Face of the White Fang. We saw someone who did bad things for the right causes. We saw someone who despised his oppressors, but who seemed to care for his fellow Faunus. We saw…

a fucking lie. A headcanon, perhaps. Badum tss.

What Adam REALLY WAS was an abusive cruel irredeemably evil monster jerkface asshole creep bitch who NEVER cared about his own people, NEVER cared about his people’s rights, NEVER wanted anything more than glory and power and to be lionized. 

The minority character, by the way.

Why did the writers decide to make this guy the hatesink? Why did they decide to make Adam suddenly not care about his fellow people’s rights? 

Why did they decide to make him laughably cruel to his own people whom he seemed to genuinely care for before (like in that scene in volume 3, where he only agrees to go along w/ cinder after she starts KILLING FAUNUS, but maybe that scene was a headcanon too, all in le head)

Why did they decide to make the goals of one of their in universe minority characters to be wanting nothing but fame and power?

Why did they also write him to be a former child slave?

Volume 6 is one of my more liked volumes, with it (for me) easily being the best looking, and the horror stuff was great. Also, Maria. 

But then they threw Adam in last minute. One last kick of that dead bull. 

He comes back in his finest NieR: Automata cosplay and starts spouting some of the most embarrassingly bad dialog this show has had while fighting Blang (basically that one fucking hilarious “Boobs in my mouth please please please hello You’re nothing” post as dialog), and it’s in this that, after 6 volumes, we finally see his face. 

Adam was branded. I’m not putting that shit lightly, Adam was fucking branded. 

And the brand is used to show how evil HE is. He was hurt more by his gf leaving him than ANY scar ever would. Who cares about all the trauma he surely went through in slavery, he sure fucking doesn’t! Okay, Cameraman Mike, be sure to focus a whole bunch of shots on his brand, which is still blood red and grotesque, to really hammer the point in how much of an asshole he is. 

Never mind it’s a brand of the SDC, of which one of our main character’s family owns. Who cares if this is literally the only time we’re shown the true extent of racism against Faunus? 

It’s swept aside! Because the same episode we’re given one of the most honestly depressing reveals for a villain yet is the same episode that villain dies. 

Dies with the brand facing the camera. His death. Entirely. On. Screen. 

Thank fuck Adam was written as an irredeemable monster of a villain(/j), because they literally wrote, animated, and voiced a scene where we the viewers watch a former child slave, branded and blinded over an eye, have his death be entirely on screen. A slow death, entirely on screen. 

Adam, a former slave to the SDC who, sometime during his childhood was branded and permanently blinded, died more slowly… more gruesomely… than Jacques fucking Schnee did. 

Even died before him, too.

But notice one thing. I keep referring to him as having been a “child slave.” Emphasis on child. 

Don’t blame me. Blame your fucking writers. 

I want you to read this. Read this paragraph. Twice, if you have to. As many times as you need to to get the fact into your head that THIS IS FUCKING VILE.

This is in the writers commentary track for volume 7. They tiptoe around with their words, but I’ll translate it to the best of my ability. In it, Miles shared a particular headcanon: in which the 

FUCKING VILLAIN HE WROTE TO HAVE BEEN A CHILD SLAVE TO THE SCHNEE DUST COMPANY GOT HIMSELF BRANDED FOR BEING TOO MUCH OF A LITTLE SHIT TO KEEP HIS DIRTY TRAP SHUT. 

SO THEN ONE OF HIS CAPTORS HELD THIS CHILD DOWN TO THE GROUND AND JAMMED A CATTLE PROD DOWN WITH THE SDC PROPERTY LOGO ONTO HIS EYE.

THAT LITTLE BOY SURE HAD IT COMING, HUH? HE’S ALWAYS BEEN SUCH AN INSUFFERABLE LITTLE PRICK, EVEN AS A CHILD IN SLAVERY. HIS CAPTORS REALLY LET HIM HAVE IT!

LET. 

HIM. 

HAVE. 

IT. 

THEY WRITE AND HEADCANON A FICTIONAL CHILD SLAVE BEING BRANDED IN THE EYE AFTER HE STARTS THE FIGHT. HE STARTED IT. 

THEY WRITE AND HEADCANON A FICTIONAL CHILD SLAVE BEING BRANDED IN THE EYE AND GROWING UP TO BECOME A HORRIBLE, DISGUSTING DEMON.

THEY WRITE AND HEADCANON A FICTIONAL CHILD SLAVE BEING BRANDED IN THE EYE AND HIS CAPTOR JUST “LET HIM HAVE IT.”

“LET HIM HAVE IT,” NOT IN REFERRAL TO A MINORITY BEING HATE CRIMED.

“LET HIM HAVE IT,” NOT IN REFERRAL TO A MINORITY SLAVE BEING PERMANENTLY SCARRED. 

“LET HIM HAVE IT” IN REFERRAL TO A MINORITY CHILD SLAVE BEING BRANDED AS PROPERTY IN THE EYE BY HIS CAPTORS.

And I think this says it all. From the white and the black, blue and the red, oppressor and oppressed and angel and demon, Weiss and Adam almost mirror each other. 

Just look at their scars. Theirs are on the same side. 

But while Weiss’s is the smallest, prettiest scar of all,

The brand of the SDC all but covers half of Adam’s face, in all it’s grotesque, blood red and hideous glory.

I’ll let you guess the implications. 

Killing off a WOC in power the very scene she’s introduced. Showing the Lakota girl the “right way to protest”. Painting the oppressors in a more positive light than ever showing the oppressed be oppressed. Showing your hatesink character had been branded in the eye the same episode he dies on screen. And this is what broke me. 

They’d read in the history books of children forced into slavery slaves being branded

and they’d see the backstory for a villain.

Because we can’t write the minorities fighting against their oppressors to be justifiable!

We can’t face how a member of the majority will almost always benefit from an oppressive system!

We can’t write the pretty white rich family of Fantasy-Amazon owners as wrong for their horrible practices both past and present!

We can’t let the WOC be right about violent protest!

We can’t let the native girl be angry and fight back against her oppressors!

We can’t have a shred of sympathy for the ex slave who was branded while he was a boy!

Because they did this. 

Faunus. 

[thestrangestthlng]

You know, as an “older” fan, a hag if you will, I’m used to just waiting for the show to air. I don’t need BTS or content from the cast/crew. I enjoy it, because it’s fun and a good distraction from things that actually matter, but it’s not needed.

As a person with an advanced education in the behavioral/societal sciences I even understand why these toxic ass Buddie stans act like this. I understand it on a fundamental, scientific level.

As a human being with the ability to think critically and logically and with even just a dollop of empathy coupled with that advanced knowledge it makes me so fucking mad to see the extent of what people having been doing.

Doxxing, hacking, threatening, the rampant queer phobia (from people proclaiming to be queer at that), the racism, the gaslighting, the manipulation, the writing of csa with the sole purpose to trigger BuckTommy enjoyers, the harassing not just of the cast - but their fucking family - is absolutely disgusting and not acceptable.

The fact that some of these people don’t have agents knocking on their doors yet is mind blowing, because I can promise you - I wouldn’t have tolerated any of this shit.

This is a TV show. Buck does not exist. Eddie does not exist. Tommy does not exist. They will never see the things posted about them because they are not real.

You know who does exist? And who has feelings and a heart?

Oliver: whom Buddies bullied off of Twitter and harassed about his photography.

Ryan: who opened up to the world about his journey with his mental health; do you really think this is helpful to that?

Lou: who was genuinely so excited to do this role. Who has been called multiple slurs, faces relentless defamation of his character, whose sister was harassed into privatizing, who had his account hacked, who has had his job threatened, who has had threats made on MAIN, I can only imagine what yall send to him in dms.

Tim: who is literally doing his job and delivering a story that the general audience wants to see and appreciates and feels represented.

This is purely the result of a subset of the Buddie Stans. I know this isn’t all of them, regardless of how toxic that subfandom has gotten.

And save your “both sides” bullshit. BT’s sharing DMs in a gotcha was wrong, but that is nothing compared with everything listed above. If the threats and DMs is true, that’s traceable bestie boos. A team with an iota of computer literacy can find out who you are even if you are using a burner. Most of yall do this on main, you think they can’t trace back this shit to exactly who is sending it? The proof would be in the pudding, loves. The malicious mischaracterization and disingenuous ‘hot takes’ can 90% be attributed directly back to like a couple dozen accounts. And then the laughable “this only started happening once these toxic BT’s started coming around” like this existed in a vacuum. Like you haven’t harassed every single actress who played a LI. Are there toxic people in the BT side? I’m sure. But being annoying and toxic WITHIN FAN SPACES is not a crime. What some Buddies did are literal crimes. Like potential RICO charge crimes.

You wanna yell at someone? You wanna call someone a slur? You wanna be toxic? Yell into your fucking pillow and then go and touch fucking grass. Regardless of your personal feelings of any of them because of whatever you have, they don’t deserve to be treated like this.

This is honestly some of the wildest shit I’ve seen in fandom and I survived the CC tinhatters during the Glee era.

So now, because of the actions of a few to real people who may have to face repercussions for their privacy being violated, to real people that have to have their mental health put at risk over a fucking fanon ship that is never happening, we collectively are going to see the consequences and I’m okay with that.

The wellbeing of the REAL PEOPLE involved in this means way more than a tease at a church or a contextless BTS.

If there’s one thing I’ve learned from being in fandom spaces for as long as I have:

Therapy may not be free, but it’s damn sure needed.

I need the bestie boos to fucking THINK.

This shit started in season 7 when death threats were sent to Tim. Over a certain scene. Then, Lou gets treated like shit, you guys made JLH get emotional on an Instagram live because you yelled at her AFTER she said, "I really don't think the Buck and Eddie thing is going to happen guys. I think we need to let it go."

In a live with Kenny, he said "Eddie and Buck? Looks like it's not going to happen, looks like it's the Tommy/Buck show, don't you think?"

Lou's sister got harassed, Tim's messages got shared in a gotcha, everyone wants to bring up Lou's past Instagram posts or Ryan's past lives, three internet trolls have to constantly tag cast and crew in every damn "horrible" thing someone does that goes against Buddie, some sick fuck wrote csa fics and purposely tagged them wrong just so they could traumatize others.

You use slurs, you harass anyone connected to the show, everything is a damn joke to you.

You get a picture of Aisha, Oliver and Ryan. And what do you do? You gloat. You make fun of people who like Tommy with Buck and call the actor jobless.

And then last night, Oliver shares a picture from his trailer and you unhinged freaks bitched and moaned and threatened violence in not one, not three, but SIX DIFFERENT INBOXES.

Oliver. Lou. Tim. 911 insta. Ryan. ABC.

And in a move so vengeful one of you crossed the line and now we're here.

So please tell me how it makes no sense to protect the talent, to phase out buddie propaganda, to show that mustache 50 times a week and to delete hateful comments.

You've made your fanon bed, now lie down, shut tf up, and suffer the consequences.

[lovee-infected]

hi! could i see your insights about ace? i saw a anon say from another blog that kinda has unrealistic expectations in a relationship and it kinda stuck with me. i mean in his ghost marriage he already knows the things he wants in a partner but he didn't show guilt about dumping his girlfriend, even. i think if you date him because he sees these quality in you and as the relationship last, he'll dump you if you get boring to him lol

I never thought that I'd say this but, wow, I'm impressed. I've been really curious about Ace since I get to see a variety of different content with different representations of his personality, so I decided to stick with his canon stories and lines. This analysis was so much fun to write and I'd assure you all that not only Ace but rather all of the first year characters are WAY more than they seem to be! Many just decide to ignore them and pass away, calling them good boys or precious stupid beanies at first.

Speaking of Ace, we've all seen how trending he's been recently. Many theories, thoughts and new arguments exist through the fandom as many want to get to know this boy better.

Theories like "Ace's betrayal theory" as well have been mentioned a lot lately, some agree and some disagree. While we aren't going to talk about that theory or any other theories in this analysis, I'd like to take time to talk about the reasons why those theories might seem appealing and accurate. In other words, we're going to talk about where they are coming from!

1) Ace is incredibly smart and brave

It's true that characters like Jade or Azul's remarkable genius often stands out as it's clearly visible through their presence in the game, from iconic decisions to stunning strategies. But what we need to realize is how characters like Ace can be just as inspiring while their true intelligence is often shallowed by extras and giving them much of a dumb picture in the game.

To begin with, let us note that Ace's brother himself was one of the considerably strong magicians in Heartslabyul's history and even his presence through the magicshift is still remarkable even though years has passed. As the second child of the family, Ace's change to achieve success is even higher than his brother's as he already has a role model he really looks up to, so in that point Ace isn't one to underestimate. But, let me point that his relationship with his brother also contains lots of jealousy and sometimes negativity. His brother was one to always trick Ace and he continues to do so even nowadays! Ace on the other hand doesn't enjoy being pissed off over and over even as he's used to it. Well, we can say that it's another reason for him to train his hardest and become a greater magician than his brother therefore he won't be the bully material of the Trappola household anymore.

Regardless of how effective his brother might've been on him, Ace himself has shown plenty of strong hints that reveal not only his high IQ but also EQ:

He can solve math problems in second, which is a rather important feature to note because the way you deal with math can directly effect the way you deal with life. Not saying that one has to be great at math to be great at something else but it's rather about the perspective and ability of logical thinking that it gives to one. I'd say that this effect is quite visible if you take a look at the way he speaks in serious situations; he's got much of an analytical brain. Let's not forget that Cater as well confirmed that he's much of a skill stealer, is pretty good at remembering things and is a quick thinker! These are go on to show how much of an underestimated genius he is.

Whenever something goes wrong, Ace would be the first one to notice it even if it's a silly matter. And it always begins with a seemingly childish argument, but ends incrucial matters that not a single soul had noticed before! Just take a look at chapter one, what would've happened if Ace hadn't spoken up? He was just one of the hundreds of students having to be severely punished under Riddle's strict rules and he surely wasn't the first one to go through this. Him taking the urge to fight Riddle sounded stupid and naïve at first, many even told him off because he was just acting like a pissed off child. But as he continued to argue and oppose toward Riddle's way as a leader, even Trey realized how he's been keeping his eye shut on all this problems for so long. The way Ace stood against Trey was iconic, he confidently defended his point not by his personal demands and feelings but with facts and logical comments on why Trey's way of threatening Riddle is wrong. He did the same thing again at he ghost marriage, just think of it! Not a single soul ever cared to tell the bride about true love but Ace was there, and he was the one and only to do this after more than 500 years of the bride's existence! This Ace, this serious and mature face of Ace is something that can surely fascinate anyone. His bravery, the way he puts all that strength through words, hisextremely logical point of view and his enthusiasm to solve the problems no matter how unimportant they seem to be is indeed appreciatble. Seriously though, what would've happened to Riddle is Ace wasn't there? When Ace firstly begun to oppose to him, everyone thought that is was just a childish argument. They had no idea how severe and destructive Riddle's temper issues were and how harmful they were down inside.

2) He's one of the dumbest characters in the whole game

You know what? He is dumb. Yes he's incredibly smart but this isn't going to change the fact that he is dumb as hell, so I'm never going to argue when someone's nagging on how much of an idiot he is. But most importantly, we need to know what's making him so dumb:

His presence through the stories has proved that Ace is eventually pretty good at detecting the main source of problems both on the mental and physical side. He was the first to realize Riddle's issues, Trey's huge mistake with Riddle, Ghost bride's unawareness and Epel's gloomy and sad aura in chapter 4. Ace's also one to easily tell whether what someone is doing is wrong or not, he can see through people and bring their mistakes to their attention. The problem is... he can't be quite the same with himself. That's what makes him awfully dumb.

Back in chapter one, he did have a point about Riddle's way of leadership being so unfair and messed up, but when he decided to challenge Riddle and even take his place as the dorm leader he was a total idiot who didn't how weak and unpractical his own magic was, he was being too dramatic. When he talked about his ex girlfriend, he just talked about how she held him back from doing what he wanted and was too uncool to spend time with, but he didn't mention a single thing about himself doing anything wrong in that relationship. He often fails to realize that he's got his own incompleteness and lacks just like anyone else, or prefers to put an blind eye to them most of the time (not all of the time)

Ace sets the perfect goals, but chooses the wrong path to achieve them. He needs to realize that just like everyone else, he can be sometimes wrong. He should take his time to get to know himself better; his abilities, his attitude, his faults and his mistakes and learn to be more patient and logical in order to achieve his goals. He's still young an inexperienced, by learning to put that brilliance of him into the perfect use he'd be able to become the great magician he wishes to be, and I'd say that in case that he continues to grow stronger and smarter, he'll have a high chance of being hesrtslabyul's next dorm leader!

3) He legit wants to be the "Ace"

This part's more of an attempt to do a name analyis and see how much it's been effective on Ace's personality. It actually makes a lot of snese since the word "Ace" itself has several meanings, and he used these different terms quite a few times in his personal stories. This point would also be explained in part (4) so for now, let's take a look at direct name definitions:

First of, remember what what an Ace is in a card game? "A playing card with a simple spot on it, ranked as the highest card in its suit" This goes on to tell us a lot, it's telling us what an Ace is. A loner yet the most powerful one of its own, just like how Ace wants to be.

Wanting to be an actuall Ace is definitely one of the things that sometimes makes Ace sound so jerky and he's aware of it! If you give it a closer look, you'll see that Ace doesn't really treat his friends like friends, especially with Deuce and Grim. He's often insulting or challenging them, and even during his birthday SSR when MC asked him about what he thinks of each of other first years (Who are basically his closest friends) he mainly criticized them and all, not a single word was said about things he likes about them and he didn't even call any of them his friend!

Well that's much of a jerky attitude to have toward people whom you spend almost all of your time with, especially your best of time.

He to play the role of the bad guy, the type to hang out with everyone without feeling any attached to them as even friends. Seems like our boy is trying to be a loner, a true Ace of cards and hearts. And he doesn't mind his friends calling him a bastard or jerk because of this. It's even confirmed that he's more of the popular guy type therefore he's mainly used to having people around!

On the other hand, he's trying his best to achieve success no matter what the obstacles are. It's true that he often messes up and fails, but we cannot say that he isn't trying. He almost lost his head for real during his SSR story where Riddle's favorite hedgehogs were lost because of Ace's impatience, but at last with the help of monsieur Rook and his own ability to imitate Rook's mole language skills Ace saved his neck one more time, and ended his story with a dramatic "Of course, I always Ace it!"

4) Ace does care, but pretends that he does not

In contrast to the fact that he wants to sound tricky,manipulative and mean, or how he's denying his friends' true worth to him like stated in part (3), Ace is probably one of the most caring and supportive characters in the game. Not saying that he's just as bright as someone like Kalim, but his way of seeing through people and wishing them to be better, wealthier and happier than they already are is surely something. This fact is often ignored because, well...everyone's too busy calling him either dumb or sus/ jk!

Just imagine having a friend or at least, a classmate you know like Ace. How's he supposed to be? He'd realize it when someone's bullying/bothering/ or intentionally harming you, and he isn't going to be silent about it. If you see that you're permanently sad, angry, rude or loud then again he'd speak up, he isn't going to just pull up with anyone's unhealthy habit like nothing's happened. He's got much of a big brain as well so you should expect him to say a bunch of helpful and meaningful stuff when he's using that brain, mainly in serious situations. He may not be a permanently mutual to have around, but when the troubles arrive, know that having Ace around is always an advantage.

To top it off, he's even shown sympathy toward people whom he seemed to like the least at first like Riddle; he wishes Riddle to be happier, to smile more, to be more open about his emotions with other students. At some point he even admits that he looks up to him, he used to overestimate his powers and challenged Riddle, but during the ghost marriage he said that he knows how powerful and strong Riddle is, therefore he should work his hardest to study and train to become strong just like him! He already seems to be more cheerful and bright when MC is talking to him, but when it comes to Grim and Deuce...it gets quite complicated. What we see the most is often Ace insulting them or saying that he's going to kick their asses, but they're also his closest friends all though he refuses to admit to it.

Just wait for Deuce or Grim to get in a serious danger or pain, and see how much of a protective one Ace can be! He isn't going to remain silent when one is in danger, but he's surely going to deny all that effort and affection he gave into action afterwards. When Ace can feel this cautious and understanding toward Riddle, someone who isn't even a friend of his then imagine how supportive and caring he would be toward his close friends like Deuce, MC and Grim!

In his ghost marriage as well, his words and the way he spoke of the meaning of true love left everyone, even Crowley, impressed (Crowley even said that he's fallen in love with this side of Ace's personality), but refused to admit that he was speaking of his true feelings after the ceremony. Someone like Grim is too bold to recognize how much of a different person Ace can be inside, so he claimed that Ace was just rambling nonsense without thinking of what he was saying back then, and Ace agreed with him! This is a continuation to part (3) where we talked about how he wants to be a loner, he doesn't want anyone to see how caring and sometimes, emotional he can be inside! Poor boy is quite shy showing his true feelings we can tell~

5) Ace can be quite tricky and manipulative

This part will also explain some of the main reasons behind famous theories like "Ace's betrayal theory", and I wanted to have a certain part to talk about this point specifically because it's been quite trending through the whole fandom, and many are wondering why theorizers are considering his betrayal a possibility, so here we go!

As said, one of the main factors the makes Ace seem suspicious would be his incredible intelligence. The fact that he can actually be that smart all the time but isn't openly showing his talents and abilities can be quite questionable, more details regarding his intelligence and most likely high IQ and EQ were discussed in part (1)!

Enough with intelligence, let's focus on his personality! This is mainly what this part is talking about, his trickiness. Just like his father and older brother, Ace is pretty good with magic tricks. Small and fun tricks are a convenient yet easy ways to inspire others and Ace doesn't mind showing the crowd what he's got up in sleeve when possible. But the thing is...this isn't just about fancy tricks.

This ability can be expanded into any other field such as mental terms and enable him to indirectly control and play with one's mind. That's more of a possibility though! He hasn't yet shown any signs of being any manipulative but, well, we can't say that it's beyond his abilities. Ace himself can be quite sarcastic and mean at the time, he doesn't seem to mind slightly tricking his friends either. Nothing about him seems to be serious, but the possibilities remain still.

The way he learnt those tricks as well is mentionable; no one ever teached himm any of those tricks, he learnt them through being repeatedly tricked, and learning to copy and redo what he saw. Both Rook and Cater so far have confirmed that Ace's ability to learn so quickly and learn and redo techniques just by watching them is fantastic.

His genius and ability to learn and memorize everything that he needs to learn pretty fast, along side his tricky and sometimes personality can make Ace quite dangerous. If someone like him decides to choose such a remarkable talent for evil purposes, that's surely going to be bad news. That's much and less of what makes Ace's betrayal theory make sense although there're still fans who find it quite questionable. I'm not a supporter of this theory myself as I hadn't seen any signs of Ace having any bad intentions so far, but I do get where the theorizers are coming from and that makes sense. Ace has been trying to put on much of a mean and lowkey evil face on through the story and no one can really say what's exactly going on in that brain. We'll that about this uncertainty in part (7)!

6) His past relationship was...uh

For now, Ace is the only character who is confirmed to have experience in love and relationships, and this was a rather effective factor since many have been talking about Ace's past relationship afterwards. The thing is...Ace did talk about how his girlfriend held him back from having fun and living the life he wanted to live. Well there's actually a lot we should say about this one so I'm not gonna rush to the end, let's think about all of the aspects of this situation logically:

First of, the relationship itself. I'd say that it was a wrong attempt for them to date each other in the first place because obviously, Ace and his girlfriend weren't made for each other. They were total opposites in interests and they couldn't even have fun together. If Ace chose to go on a wild roller coater ride, the girl would've freaked out and when she chose a small, childish ride that she liked Ace instead didn't enjoy it at all. It's surely an issue when you and your partner can't even watch a movie which both of you can enjoy together since their tastes were totally different, just jow was this relationship going to last? Ace wasn't happy, and if he was going to do what made him happy the girl in return would've been sad. They were two different people of two different points, dating at this point was nothing but a mistake.

On the other hand, Ace as well is guilty. First off, she shouldn't have dated the girl in the first place if he was aware of how different her tastes were. Second, from what he said he never showed any signs of dissatisfaction when he had to give up on what he liked to listen to what the girl friend liked. The girl friend obviously told him that she was scared of a horror movie, but Ace just kept his mouth shut and felt awfully annoyed as he watched a romance movie with her while he didn't like it at all. If he'd at least told her girlfriend about this, she wouldn't have felt as injured and cheated when Ace broke up with her. Ace shouldn't have bottled it up, he deserved to enjoy the relationship just as much as the girl did. He shouldn't have expected things to get any better if he wasn't going to solve anything about it in the first place. If he'd talked about his personal desires and favorites as well, and had his uncomfortableness with most of the girl's choices discussed before hand, there could've been a chance of them coming into a conclusion and even not breaking up! The girl could've tried to be braver for him, and Ace could've agreed to be softer because of her. There would've been a HUGE difference if they'd talked about it logically.

Also, keep this in mind that the girl had no idea about Ace's uncomfortableness which was low key naïve of her (It's not cool when you don't even realize that your boyfriend doesn't like something) but this also made him awfully unprepared for a break up! Ace should've st least talked about his feelings and how he was unable to continue that relationship with her instead of just dropping her out of nowhere. That would've also decreased the chance of having to deal with the girl's friends after wards!

Finally, let's say that this relationship was wrong in too many aspects. They weren't each other's type, and we can't really blame Ace for dropping someone whom he couldn't be happy with. The main of being in a relationship is spending time with someone whom you can enjoy your time with. He as well was guilty because he can't just drop the girl like he just didn't care and had gotten tired of her while he had his own reasons for dropping her, he should've let the girl know that it wasn't necessarily her fault, it was about Ace not being able to relate to her tastes and habits.

Also, let's be honest. Not much is expected when a 15 year old is dating. Being in a relationship is an awfully sensitive and important choice and someone like Ace hasn't reached that level of maturity to be ready to date someone, let alone doing it at his 15s! Honestly... they should've learnt a lot before dating each other because it isn't a silly thing. Dating like this is nothing but playing around for a while for fun, it's a childish game of spending some time together until they break up.

For now, Ace is finds love quite silly and meaningless so we can clearly see that his past relationship has pissed him off. Well Ace needs to realize that his relationship with his ex wasn't a serious one, so it's normal for it to seem unimportant and silly. He needs to learn a lot without dating someone again, such as knowing how crucial it is to make sure that his hobbies would match his partners, to make sure tjat they get along, and simply, he needs to find his own type! Not all people are made for each other, and he isn't supposed to fall for anyone with any possible personality that pops up on his way.

Also, I'd say that he still needs to focus on studying instead of dating. He needs to reach the required level of maturity to be ready to start a healthy and successful relationship again. Also, he might end up being totally different from what we've seen about him being in a relationship do far when he grows up! Idealistics do change a lot olin teenagehood.

7) We need to talk about our first years a lot more!!!

This point isn't just about him, but rather all of the first years! If I were to rate the most ignored and shallowed personalities of twst, the first years should've gone on the top of this list. Even when we're speaking of the mischaracterized characters of the game, many consider Ace and Deuce to be the least mischaracterized while they happen to be the most mischaracterized as no one evencares to see through them and feel like we aren't mischaracterizing them just because we're ignoring them! Come on guys, Ace's design and personality is a lot more complicated and harder to read than characters like Vil and even Leona!

Out of all first years Sebek was the only one to get some proper shout outs so far but why isn't anyone talking about Ace and Deuce the way they deserve to be talked about? Their presence through the game is even more important than the dorm leaders as they are the closest characters to MC, and their personality design is just incredible, no just because of how perfectly detailed it is, but also because of giving them this unpredictability and incompleteness which totally matches their age!

Studies have shown that judging one's personality based on how they're doing at the age of 16 or younger is prettyhard and impossible, and it's a totally serious fact. At the age of 16, human's personality is under severe effects and changes until reaching it's final-developed shape. That's accurate toward almost all of the first years except Jack since he seems to have more of a mature personality.

NRC's first years are really complicated, especially a character like Ace. That why I said that we can't yet tell if he's a good guy or not, because at this level of life he can choose to be anything. He can be good, he can be bad, he can be neutral. That's why he's showing too much of opposite actions at the moment. One second he's being the biggest idiot in the whole world, the other second he's planning like a 50 year old genius. One second he's being protective over his friends, the other second he sighs and tells MC how annoying they are.

That's why Ace is hard to read, we can't tell what his true feelings are until he reaches the required mental stability to be judged as a mature and complete personality. 18 year olds like Vil have already reached that level of maturity and completeness, finding their unique magics as well is another sign of it. But our first years still need to learn and experience until they find their real selves, to see who they are.

This is one of the most adorable facts about their design because they really gave him this young and wild and incomplete nature to show that they're still young! This is quite incredible how careful Yana was to remember that they all needed some this childishness in their design, their designs are just as accurate and realistic as a real 16 year old's! They still need to learn, and that's why they're the closest ones to MC.

MC needs to learn and get to see more and more of this world, and so do the first years! They're just as unexperienced and new to this world, and they can relate to MC better than anyone else can!

So please, from now on, let's remember to talk about not only Ace, but also all of the first years more often. Ace and Deuce's designs especially are the most detailed and beautiful ones if you take time to know them better. Remember that after the 7 dorm leaders, Ace and Deuce's roles as the protagonist's closest allies are the most crucial in the game, so let's not just decide to ignore all these creative features and pass by them without thinking how much they can mean.

Woah, this one was quite harder to write than I'd expected! There are way too many things to say about him which made me have to summarize this into just this 7 parts for now. Ace is surely and odd yet interesting one to study, even more interesting than usually famous characters like Leona and Azul, which is partly because of how unpredictable he is!

[potteresque-ire]

Hello. I just turned to be a turtle recently after being a solo fan mostly because of toxic atmosphere of solo fans. May I ask, were relationships between XZ and YB solos always so intense and also bad attitude to BJYX even during the promotion “the untamed”? Or did this conflict start after the events of 2020? Thank you in advance.

Hello, and Happy 2021! I’m a super new fan of the fandom, and so these aren’t questions I’m qualified to answer at all. I’m more comfortable providing some wider sociopolitical contexts to fandom-related events because I’ve been reading about Chinese news for a loooong time. My “investigative interest” (oh dear, that sounds so pretentious) is also more on understanding the CP culture in general, how it ties with the country’s state of affairs rather than focusing specifically on Gg and Dd. While I’ve read back on some history re: gg and dd’s fandoms, Tumblr is the only site where I’ve interacted directly with fellow fans.

But I’ve written up what I’ve understand about solo and CP fans for c-dramas so far, mostly for my own benefit (I have a ridiculously poor memory!). Maybe it can offer some insight? This is very new information to me as well; so, if anyone spots something wrong or wants to supplement, please jump right in!

Wars between the fans of the leads of a CP (“ship” in English; stands for “couple”) aren’t new. Conflicts between solo and CP fans also aren’t new.

Competition is the most obvious cause of wars between the fans of the leads of a CP. Especially in the case of M/M pairings, the person “bound” to each idol by their CP is also, by default, about the most “direct” competitor one can have. They’re likely to be of the same age group, share similar fan demographics. Popularity of young male idols (often called “Little Fresh Meat” 小鮮肉, a nickname I’ve abhorred for the decade or so it’s come to existence) also isn’t expected to last, so the two CP leads must make the most of their newfound fame within the same time frame. The competition is more than fighting for similar roles; in China, another major arena is endorsements, in which an idol’s popularity is by measured by 1) the number they hold and 2) the units they sell. Here in the US, stars choose their endorsements based on how well they fit their image; there, stars take as many as they can as long as the negotiated terms are satisfactory. Hence, dd is the spokesperson of 25 products / services in 2020 (including an insurance company (!!)).

I’ve also read about this norm in the industry, which I have yet to verify: in China, if two stars compete for the endorsement of the same brand product, the one who loses will not get endorsements of same products from different brands — at least, not in the short term — because any brand who uses the star who lost would be seen as inferior. Hence, to lose the competition on one endorsement deal can mean losing the endorsement deals for an entire category of products.

(Someone on Weibo has pointed this out: while Gg and Dd have often endorsed competing brands of the same product: Budweiser (gg) and Yenching beer (dd), for example; they have never fought for the endorsement of same brand product. Again, I haven’t verified this.)

This part is easy to understand.

The next question is: why are solo fans against CP fans? “Girlfriend fans” — solo fans who can’t bear to seeing their idol paired up with anyone other than themselves — only make up a fraction of the fandom. How are CP fans generally perceived? 

My key findings so far: CP fans are *perceived* to be more likely to express negative views about their idol paired up with other actors / actresses, which will affect viewership and ratings, restrict the kind of roles their idol will be invited to play. More importantly, CP fans are *perceived* as fickle — more likely to walk away after their favourite CP drama has ended, because as CP lovers, they’re thought to be equally in love with the romantic gestures as with the stars who perform them on/off stage. ie, When another drama comes along featuring the same romantic gestures, the CP fans are expected to jump ship.

I highlight the word “perceive”, because while it doesn’t matter how solo fans see CP fans, it does matter how the business side of c-ent view CP fans and it appears to share this view. The c-YiZhan fandoms have been unhappy with the publicity of the upcoming adapted BL dramas for this reason — aside from their allegations that it’s copying The Untamed’s BTS, the thing that has offended them the most, perhaps, is the very idea that the marketing departments thought a few “leaked” photos of the leads acting intimately close are enough to woo them away from YiZhan, from Gg and Dd.

Given this, perhaps, prevalent view of CP fans, CP fandoms have been viewed as something disposable, almost, to be made, used and discarded quickly. 

Before and during the airing of the drama, the marketing / publicity teams fuel and encourage CP fandoms, reap the benefits in viewership from the ensuing discussions and hot searches. Solo fans usually aren’t threatened by CP fandoms in this nascent phase—CP fandoms have been far smaller in size and only grow during the broadcast.

More importantly, the norms have been that CP fandoms do not last.

CP fandoms do have a tendency to “self-combust” over time: fans * within * the fandom accusing each other of being partial to one of the leads — spending more money on A’s endorsements, for example, or buying more copies of B’s music. However, this isn’t how many CP fandoms die. Instead, once the show is over, the process of “Breaking the CP” begins. I’m not sure who gets this process going, but my guess is the leads’ management companies, with consent (willing or unwilling) from the actors. Breaking the CP means having the CP leads avoid each other as soon as the drama is done airing, and for as long as it takes for the CP fandoms to dissipate. It means no more appearing in the same drama and shows; no more sharing a stage; and if they happen to be at the same event, they are to communicate as little as possible. This “loosening the bind” between the leads is designed to free the actors up for the next CPs, and its way of execution can be very abrupt, very … cruel for the CP fans. For one of 2020 summer dramas (Love and Redemption 琉璃), for example, a popular character (het) CP pairing was broken up in the last fan meet, 10 days after the final episode had aired. The fan meet was marketed as a CP event (there was even merch for the CP); CPs fans bought the tickets, perfectly aware of the unsaid “CPs are made to be broken” rule and it’d likely be the last time they’d see their CP together. But the organisers denied them even this last chance; the leads of the CP had no interactions, not even eye contact during the entire event. The actor didn’t acknowledge the actress in his farewell speech. The fans understandably got upset; even outsiders sympathised, stating that the CP-breaking could be handled with a little more consideration. Word on the street was that because the male lead already had other dramas lined up, the CP had to be broken up as quickly as possible.

(Weibo Night from almost a year ago was seen as a “Break the CP” event for Gg and Dd. Some turtles still cry at the memory of it.)

There’s a term related to the breaking of CPs: 提純 (“increasing the purity”). It describes the ultimate goal of breaking CPs: increasing the proportion of solo (”pure”) fans by breaking up the CP and having the solo fandoms of each lead absorb the CP fans. Because solo fans are *perceived* to be more loyal (won’t jump ship the next romantic drama comes along), less likely to draw criticisms (especially if the CP is M/M and/or affect the RL lives of their stars), and have more purchasing power (as CP fans have to divide their resources between the two leads and equally).

How does this affect how solo fans see CP fans? Another way to say the above is: one CP fan is one fan the two solo fandoms fail to capture. One more CP fan is one less solo fan. “CP fan” should be a temporary identity. CP fandoms sequester resources from the solo fandoms until they’re broken up.

This sets the stage for conflicts if the CP fandoms refuse to fade, if the CP fans refuse to turn solo.

The conflict between solo and CP fandoms is, of course, even more heated for real-person CP’s, which can, indeed, pose a significant threat to the leads’ life and career. An easy example of the former is if one of the CP leads are in a RL relationship, and/or if the lead is straight but the CP is queer (this is the case for The Guardian (2018), the first popular adapted BL “dangai” drama). Another major issue with real-person CPs (queer or not) is that the media will make frequent comparisons of the leads’ follow-up career. If the CP “bind” remains, the lead perceived as less popular may be viewed as using the more popular one to sustain their popularity. Fans of the more popular lead do not take that well. The management company of the less popular lead takes that even less well, and its PR team will work even harder to eliminate the CP from public discussion.

Overall, the “breaking the CP” strategy works as intended. As long as the CP leads stop interacting, no more new candies are generated for the CP fandoms, and even the best candies have an expiration date. The CP fans move on, often to other CP pairings—the CP breaking process often leave them hurt and disappointed at the leads—and further propagating the perception that they are fickle souls who prefer candies over actors.

With this background, it doesn’t surprise me that the relationship between the fans of Gg, Dd, and Yizhan has been so intense since the airing of the Untamed… it would actually surprise me (much) more if it isn’t.

First and foremost, if I take away my YiZhan-tinted lens (as much as I can anyway!), the competition between Gg and Dd automatically becomes The Battlefield in c-ent. Gg and Dd are among the most popular idols right now, and there’s a strong urgency in this competition as idol popularity is perceived to have a limited shelf life. Now, 18 months after The Untamed, Gg and Dd are not only vying for survival in the same industry—which may encourage cooperation between the two solo fandoms—they’re vying for the throne.

Things are already extra tense that way. Here’s an analogy I can think of—it’s easier to accept losing a lottery by getting every number wrong than getting a single number wrong, and by one count. It’s harder for solo fans to accept being number 2, when number 1 was a co-star, the other half of their idol’s CP.

Now, into this unresolved tension, throw in a huge curveball known as the YiZhan fandoms. A curveball that isn’t even supposed to exist — CP fandoms are all supposed to fizzle out quickly after the show is over. Instead, the BJYX supertopic on Weibo (by far the biggest of the three Yizhan CPs) had 1.5 million members in January 2020. It now has 2.8 million (January 2021).

(For reference, dd’s supertopic has 5.4 million members and gg’s, 7.7 million.)

These YiZhan fandoms aren’t merely living on their last breath, their stale candies. They’re thriving. Self-combustion hasn’t happened. CP fans of Gg and Dd keep finding fresh candies, keep having new things to rejoice and scream about.

If I put myself in the shoes of a solo fan, what does this continued growth of the YiZhan fandoms mean? It means the “binding” between My Idol and That-Other-Idol-Who-Shall-Not-Be-Named, each a contender of the c-ent throne, is strengthening instead of loosening. It means more and more fans of My Idol are exhibiting signs of wavering loyalty, by becoming fans of both My Idol and That-Other-Idol. Fan culture in China is highly organized, requiring strategy, cooperation and obedience when it comes to generating the best numbers for their idol (sells, ratings, viewership etc). Having to rely on the fickle CP fans to generate these numbers means uncertainty and anxiety.

People behave differently when they’re nervous. Some chew on their fingernails. Some attack.

2020, of course, make the solo fandoms even more nervous about each other. Gg, post-227, isn’t a safe person to be “bound to”, and also to have one’s career compared against—given the bad publicity that has circulated around him, given the fact that he has managed to stay on top in spite of it. Dd, meanwhile, has grown in popularity while Gg goes into hiding—while I personally do not, for a moment, believe Dd has anything to do with 227, it is within human nature to ask: if one loses—and in a manner so publicised, so catastrophic that even the Western media reported on it—who has the most to gain? Work culture in almost every industry in China is extremely cut-throat, and securing victory by not-so-clean methods isn’t uncommon with the immense pressure to perform. Fans are bringing in their experiences from RL in how they view their idol’s competition—with suspicion, with defensiveness. With swords sharpened and ready for counterattacks.

The ultimate cherry-on-top when it comes to causing conflicts between Gg’s, Dd’s and YiZhan fandoms is, of course, the fact that YiZhan is no garden-variety, heterosexual, character CP. It’s a M/M real person CP, in a society where homosexuality, while legal, is still considered “non-mainstream values” and explicitly censored from TV; where personal freedoms have overall been tightening and laws can change overnight. It’s one thing if their idol is truly in a queer relationship and chooses to announce it themselves; it’s a whole different story if it’s some fans of another idol who “out” them—who publicise their queerness that, in the eyes of these solo fans, may very well be fictional. 227 has already confirmed that in c-ent, idols pay the price of their fan’s wrongdoings and in this case, all it takes is for the YiZhan fandoms to make a single mistake—to celebrate one candy too loudly, for example (“to dance outside the circle”), and catch the attention of the wrong government official — to not only cost their idols their popularity, but their whole career. To the solo fans, therefore, the mere existence of the YiZhan fandoms pose a huge risk to their idol that should’ve been avoidable in the first place. And when they check out the new candies, what do they see? They see Gg leaving hints suggestive of Dd; they see Dd doing inexplicable things that can be linked to Gg. c-Turtles joke sometimes that solo fans are even better than they are at spotting the connections between Gg and Dd. But while turtles see these connections as evidences of a romantic relationship, what solo fans see is the other idol latching onto their own, whose fame makes it a reasonable act; they see it as the other solo fandom carelessly jeopardizing their own idol’s career for the sake of more noise and popularity.

The solo fandoms end up fighting. They have few reasons NOT to do so without the YiZhan-tinted lens.

That said though, I’m not sure if the wars between Gg’s, Dd’s and YiZhan fandoms are truly getting worse. As I write this, my thought is: perhaps it’s not that the fans are disliking each other more, but rather, more and more people are getting involved, and the stakes, the risks are becoming higher and higher. Gg and Dd both had fans during the filming of The Untamed, but they were a small fraction, quantity wise, to what it is now. Even if, at the time, 100% of Gg and Dd fans hated each other, they still wouldn’t have generated the noise than, say, if 0.01% of Gg’s fans are arguing with 0.01% of Dd’s fans now. The arguments then, however ugly they could be, would’ve stayed off hot searches, and largely within the two fandoms. These days, however, when even Gg shaking a pen can make it into hot search (as he did during the Tencent Awards), every heated exchange is amplified by passer-bys, by antis, by done-for-money re-bloggers. Quarrels snowball exponentially to the number of mouths pitching in; so does the antagonistic sentiments behind the hurtful words purposefully or accidentally spilled. Meanwhile, the c-YiZhan fandoms have reached the size that as much as they’ve tried to keep everything away from the public eye, it’s not really possible anymore. Search BJYX online, and videos after videos pop up for any outsider who wish to get a primer—and there’s no control over that content. Gg and Dd’s commercials hint at it. The Tencent Awards show host cued it. Before, the YiZhan fandoms may still be able to get away with a mistake or two. Now, they can make half a mistake and all the info already floating around will make sure that half a mistake will round to one.

If I were a solo fan, perhaps I’d scream my lung out too. Think of how terrible this all is, if Dd(Gg) is actually Gg(Dd)’s most fierce competition, as his being the other half of the CP is meant to be. Think of all the damages these fantastical speculations can do, if My Idol isn’t queer and tomorrow, the government comes down with a decree that outlaws queerness. Maybe My Idol will be spared if he isn’t at the top. But My Idol is at the top. Everyone will point to him. The hot searches will show his name, make sure the powers-that-be see it. He … his downfall… can be made an example …

Okay, okay, I’ll stop playacting here. Phew. That was scary * pats turtle shell to confirm its presence * :) . But can you see how deep that fear can go, for a fan who really, really loves and is therefore protective of their idol? How this fear, which stems from love, can turn into hate and generally loud, angry yelling across the internet? 

[i-dreamed-i-had-a-son]

Alright so I've seen a lot of opinions floating around and now it's time to add my two cents: the show's Loki is both similar to and distinct from the Loki we remember, and that is, or at least can be, a good thing

We have this idea of the "Loki we know," and we're frustrated that he's not being adapted faithfully--and to a degree, this is correct. Marvel very intentionally chose 2012 Loki as the version to resurrect, because that is when Loki was at the height of his popularity. By doing this, they could get the fanbase that Loki has always had to watch the show, while also avoiding much of the character distortion that came after TDW. A great idea! But then, instead of bringing this character into the show and authentically representing him, they smashed him up with Ragnarok Loki's portrayal. This was mostly done to engage general viewers and to maintain a slightly lighter tone, but both of these are mistakes: first of all, the general viewership has never been Loki's core, active fanbase. But I get it--you want to make money. The second, more egregious mistake, is that you absolutely could have kept a lighter tone with 2012's Loki, and then easily adapted him from there. At the end of Avengers, he's making jokes, and we see even more of these in Endgame. That's humor that's authentic to the character, and doesn't feel disrespectful like Ragnarok was. When we see the Ragnarok style of humor popping up, we immediately get defensive because of how that movie treated him, and we say, "This isn't the Loki we know." But the Loki we know is, to a degree...wrong.

This might seem a bit harsh at first, but I think the fandom as a whole is unwilling to let go of a slightly distorted version of Loki, and that's coloring the fan response to the show. Because we've spent so long with a character that has had relatively few instances of development or even screen time, we've become attached to the version of the character we think we know, sometimes without realizing that collective memory has shifted our perception of him slightly. We're unwilling to let the character change at all, even if at points this growth could be done well--and even if the character was faithfully adapted, he would be met with criticism because he wouldn't be "what we know"; he couldn't be, because we as a fandom created that character, over time and without really recognizing it. To a degree, that kind of misplaced criticism is mixing with the legitimate critiques of the series. It makes us unwilling to look at the good things that are present, even among the flaws.

As an example, let's talk about Loki as a planner, and how his actions in the series compare to those in the earlier movies. A common sentiment I've heard is that throughout episode two (and to a degree, episode one) Loki is just kind of going along with everything. He doesn't seem to have a plan, and this makes people uncomfortable, since the "Loki we know" was a great planner. Wasn't he?

Most of the basis for the "Loki we know," comes from Thor and Thor: the Dark World, so I'll be using those as my "proof texts," so to speak. In those two movies, we see plenty of examples of Loki making spur-of-the-moment decisions to take advantage of a situation; he's a very flexible, adaptable character by nature (as I've discussed before), so this makes sense. The trouble is, I think the fandom memory of Loki has shifted enough that we forget exactly why and how he makes these decisions, and how they turn out. In contrast to what those films actually show us, we tend to think of Loki as a very strategic character, who is too clever to be caught off-guard. That's not the case.

Loki, in those films, has very little grasp or consideration of the consequences of his actions, because his emotions cloud his judgement; because of this, his plans (which are created responsively), and even actions he does not plan, fall apart disastrously. In Thor, when Thor is banished from Asgard, Loki sees an opportunity to step into the role his brother had filled. Then he discovers he is actually Laufey's son, and in response to this news and Odin's falling into Odinsleep, Loki plans to double-cross Laufey and kill him to prove his loyalty, taking the throne in the interim. He does have a plan, but it's one that he developed rather spontaneously based on the circumstances--he didn't plan for Odin to fall asleep so that he could assume the throne, that just...happened, and Loki forms a plan to adapt to it. But when he hears that Thor is trying to return to Asgard, all of his insecurities, compounded by having just discovered that he's actually a Jotun, come back full force; desperate to keep the small bit of identity he thinks he's managed to find, Loki sends an Automaton to kill Thor--whom he loves, and has even said so several times in the film--and then tries to destroy the Bifrost to keep Thor from coming back. These are decisions Loki hasn't truly evaluated; if he had, he wouldn't have made them, because they don't line up with his actual goal, as we see when Thor arrives. When Thor confronts him, Loki essentially has a breakdown, admitting in tears that his real motivation for all of this was just to be considered Thor's equal. He didn't hate Thor, he didn't hate Odin, he didn't even want to be king--he just wanted to be loved as much as his brother. But along the way, his real goal was clouded by his emotional state, and he stopped thinking clearly, instead just lashing out in a desperate bid to protect himself from more pain.

We see something similar occur in Thor: TDW. When Loki sends the guards "up the stairs to the left," he's not thinking about who they might find--he's just lashing out because he's been abandoned by his family, and he wants to exert whatever influence he can over the situation. He wants to do something, especially if it causes problems for Odin and Thor, and he thinks the opportunity has just landed in his lap. He hardly planned for it, but he's not going to pass it up. So he takes it unhesitatingly--and his mother dies. (Coincidentally, after both his father's rejection and his mother's death, Loki nearly dies himself, and at least one of those instances was deliberate. Hmmm...Loki doesn't want to live with the consequences of his actions? It's too painful for him to face what he's done?? Hmm??? But that's beside the point.) Once again, Loki's goals are unclear, and things go wrong because he's just acting on emotion.

All this to say, for Loki, plans are very flexible things that are basically defined as "whatever works best to get what I want," so to say that Loki is just going along with things in the series, and is thus out-of-character, is a bit of an unfair criticism; despite our misremembering, he is, as he's always done, very much acting as a reactive planner. As I've spelled out before, when Loki is thrown into the new environment of the TVA, he immediately starts gathering information, and shaping his responses based off of what he finds. He takes the chances he has to feel things out (at the Renaissance fair, for example), but mostly he bides his time and actively observes until an opportunity arises. This is standard for him, but viewers haven't really been receptive to it, because it isn't what we're expecting.

Now, Loki claims to have a larger plan (something that we think we remember being common), but that's not actually the case. When speaking to Lady Loki/(Enchantress??), he says his ultimate goal is to overthrow the TVA--but he also framed his supposed overall plan as "get an audience with the Time Keepers" when speaking to Mobius. Neither of these are true. In order to more effectively manipulate others, he pretends to have large-scale motivations: with Lady Loki/Enchantress, he knows she will likely only respect him if he claims to have an endgame, since she so clearly does herself, so he manufactures one she likely wouldn't oppose. Mobius, on the other hand, would likely be suspicious without the red-herring Loki throws him; since Mobius believes Loki's trying to get an audience with the Time Keepers, he doesn't become suspicious about how quickly Loki becomes eager to catch the other variant, which would otherwise have been an appropriately huge red flag. But these are just misdirections, further things that Loki is doing to keep himself in the best position possible. That's why his claims of a grand plan (particularly to Lady Loki/Enchantress) sound sudden or unrealistic: they are. But because we think we remember Loki being someone who would have a larger plan, we aren't able to see that he doesn't need to.

This time, unlike in Thor and TDW, Loki's immediate goals are clear: escape the TVA. Be free. Despite Mobius' attempts to get him into a hyper-emotional, and thus, less careful, state of mind, Loki keeps his wits about him. He's intentional with his decisions. He's not lashing out. For once, he's aware of and considers the consequences of his actions--we see him weighing the options as he stands in front of the portal--and he makes the right decisions because his goal is clear in his mind. And this makes all the difference. Loki plays the game expertly, and for the first time, he wins--he escapes.

And I think this is an excellent development, one that deserves more appreciation than we're giving it. It's a good thing that he's not behaving how we think we remember him, as some master planner--that would be being unfaithful to his character. Loki isn't the same as Lady Loki/Enchantress. He doesn't have a grand plan. He just, finally, knows what he really wants. That shows growth, and that is the kind of change we have to want to see, and be willing to accept; so in that regard, it's even good that this Loki is different than he actually was. The Loki we see in Thor and TDW is a highly emotional, and very broken, character, who reacts to his environment often without thinking of the potential consequences; the Loki we're being shown here is still emotional, still clearly affected by what he's gone through, but is now able--or is now being allowed!--to demonstrate his actual capabilities. He ACTUALLY GETS WHAT HE WANTS. That's the first time that's happened, the first time his attempts to protect himself or outsmart someone have actually ended in success instead of disaster. And that's exactly what you should do with a character.

Now, a valid quibble with Loki's characterization is that these things are not obvious, and that is a very legitimate criticism. It's hard to see that Loki is manipulating Mobius by pretending to be helpful, because the show seems to be framing it in a way that encourages us to take Loki at face value. Loki's behavior is an intentional obfuscation, but it can be hard to realize that if it seems like that's what the show is telling us Loki really is. Personally, I justify this by saying that the show is showing us Loki as he wants to be perceived--when Loki is bluffing in episode one, he seems cartoonish and over the top, but certainly nothing like he actually is, and this is what he intends. When he seems too jovial and trusting in episode two, that's because that's what he's presenting to Mobius. It's about whether we buy into the act as much as the other characters do--which is why Loki's most in-character scenes come when he's alone. When he has no one to perform for, he stops performing for us, too, and we see the genuine presentation. But, I could be wrong--maybe this isn't intentional at all. Maybe the writers really are just trying to revamp a character from 2012 and are doing it clumsily, and that's why he seems out of character in moments like those. It's too early to say, and honestly, we may never be sure.

But there are real, valid, and undeniable moments of positive development, the likes of which Loki has never had the space to experience before. They are present if you are willing to look--but they are much less obvious to people who don't want to see them. I agree, they are hard to see, and if I'm being honest, I haven't loved the show anywhere near as much as I would have liked to so far. But I think the fandom as a whole is so caught up in this idea of the "Loki we know" that they don't see the Loki we have for what he is--people are too attached to a misremembering of Loki's previous actions to realize that the change in his behavior isn't a regression or a flaw in his writing but a sign of growth. We're too attached to his brokenness and weakness to let him become strong.

We are defensive about Loki's character because of how it's been mishandled in the past, but if you actually look, you'll find that there is actually a lot of good in what we're being given. I'd agree that the show has to get better about making that obvious if it wants to succeed. But I think some of the harsh criticism the show has been receiving is unwarranted. It might not be perfect, and some of these decisions on the parts of the writers might not be intentional, but Loki has always been a character we've had to think about in order to understand him. Just like this show, there is much good about him beneath the surface. And for as much trouble as it causes sometimes--I'm glad that isn't changing.

[worstloki]

please read the article 'How White Fandom is Colonizing "Character-Coding"' by Shafira Jordan and quit while you're ahead

Okay, so I read it and see the problem, and I’ll try to address all their points in order because I don’t wholly agree with the article. I know it’s a lot to read so I’ve put tldr; sections at the end of each :)

Misusing the Term Reinforces Negative Stereotypes for Marginalized People 

The article essentially argues that labeling characters which are villainous as POC-coded is bad because they’re not morally pure and doing so "reinforces the idea that people of color are naturally dangerous and not to be trusted.”

Which is fair as you don’t want all the representation to be of ‘bad’ characters, but I also don’t believe all representative characters have to be ‘good’ either as it would be equally racist to divide good/bad in such a way. Not that I would place Loki under ‘bad’ to begin with, but arguing that characters shouldn’t be labelled as POC-coded for reasons unrelated to what’s presented in the narrative or because they did bad things is :/ even if lack of good representation is a prevalent issue in current Western and influenced media. 

Ideally there should be a range of representative characters that fall into ‘good’, ‘bad’, and ‘anywhere in-between’ because variety and complexity in character types should, in theory, be treated as common practice (which can only happen with a multitude of representation!).

And a bit unrelated but... within the fictional context of Thor 1, all the Jotnar (sans Loki) are presented to the audience as ‘bad’ by default. They desperately want to get their Casket back to the point of attempting stealing it (from the ‘good’ characters), they fight the heroes and even when the gang and Thor (’good’ characters) are enjoying or going overboard with taking lives it’s inconsequential, Laufey wants to kill the opposing king (who just happens to be a ‘good’ character) and will resort to low-handed methods to do so, etc. The narrative itself is from the frame of reference of the ‘good’ and we only see warriors of Jotunheim though so we understand why it’s like this, because regardless of their race/experiences the narrative carries, even if it most definitely would be seen as racist from our real-life perspectives if the ‘monstrous’ race were presented by actual people of colour, even if it would make sense for the people on on different realms living in different environments to be different from each other, and realistic even for that to be the root of some conflict. 

tldr; not using a specific label to prevent negative presentations of the characters seems a bit strange to do when the coding would be based off the text, but with limited representation available I see why it would be done, even if I still believe minority-coding is free game to expand/interpret.

Improperly Labeling a Character as “POC-coded” Suggests the Experiences of All People of Color are the Same 

The article argues that labeling Loki as POC-coded “suggests that all people of color have the same experiences, when in reality, people of color come from different places, have different cultures, and have different traditions.” And while it’s true that the term doesn’t go into detail about which particular experiences (and these experiences can vary vastly due to diversity!) the appropriate measure would be to remove the umbrella term POC altogether as people of colour tend to also vary. But that’s also exactly why it’s an all-encompassing general term? It’s a way to denote anyone who isn’t “white” and has the associated cultural privilege that comes with the concept of white supremacy.  

And, obviously, in the fictional setting presented, the concept of white supremacy is not prodded at, but cultural supremacy is definitely one that makes recurring appearances, right next to the parts about Asgard being a realm built on imperialism with ongoing colonial practice. 

My take on this is that Loki’s narrative features a struggle with identity after finding out he’s of a different race and was being treated differently his entire life and being Jotun was presumably a part of the reasoning even if he didn’t know it. He’s basically treated as of less worth for inherently existing differently. I do believe that racism is a common-enough POC experience, but that while Loki was born with blue skin he passes/appears white which is why I don’t say that Loki is a POC, just that he has been coded/can be interpreted this way. 

There’s also the entire thing with Loki trying to fit in and prove he belongs by trying to fit the theory and be The Most Asgardian by committing genocide (which ultimately makes no difference as he’s still not the ‘acceptable’ version of Asgardian), and the denial/rejection of his birth culture in destructively lashing out towards them (which even Thor is confused by because Loki isn’t typically violent), and the fact his self worth plummets and he is passively suicidal upon finding out he’s Jotun (internalized racism? general drop in self-worth after finding out he’s adopted and has been lied to? Bit of both?), but what do I know, I’m sure none of those are, at their base, common experiences or relatable feelings for anyone or decent rep because we see such themes on-screen presented wonderfully in different lights all the time. 

tldr; every set of experiences could be different, some types of discrimination could overlap, if you limit an umbrella term to only very specific circumstances then it’s no longer an umbrella term.

Suggesting that White Characters are Meant to be Seen as People of Color Ignores the Actual Characters of Color that are Present in these Stories

I don’t agree with most of this section, but that may just be the way the arguments are put together, which I don’t blame the author for.

“ Implying that Loki is a person of color completely ignores Heimdall and Hogun, the only Black and Asian Asgardians who appear in the movie. ”

Characters such as Hogun and Heimdall which are played by actual people of colour have smaller roles in the films and any prejudice they could face for being POC in-universe isn’t made apparent, while Loki at the very least comes to the realization that something he couldn’t change (race, parentage,) was having him treated differently his whole life and had to come to terms with it. The Vanir/Aesir are also both treated similarly on-screen, and Heimdall having dark skin isn’t plot relevant, whereas Jotnar are treated as lesser consistently and are relevant through the movie (breaking into the vault, Thor and co. attack Jotunheim, Loki’s deal with Laufey, the attempted regicide (and the successful one XD), destroying jotunheim, Loki saying he’s not Thor’s brother,). 

I also see including characters as POC-coded as... more representation? In all canon-compliant interpretations of the characters Hogun being Vanir is always explicitly mentioned because it’s a fact that just is, up to the appearance and even the world-building of Vanaheim in some fanworks use particularly East Asian culture as inspiration. I have never come across a Marvel fandom Heimdall interpretation where he’s not Black... but because these characters are more minor/side-characters of course they get less attention! 

“ In Loki’s fandom, Heimdall’s name sometimes gets thrown in to suggest that it was he all along who was the real villain due to his “racism” against Loki and the rest of the Jotun. It is, of course, ironic to suggest that somehow the only Black Asgardian to appear in the movie can oppress the privileged white prince. “

I... don’t know where to start with this. But the example of theorizing given in the article wasn’t suggesting Heimdall was bad or trying to explain his actions in Thor 1 by saying he is Black... and just looking at a character’s actions shouldn’t be done less or more critically because of skin tone in my opinion. Heimdall may have been trying to do what was best and protect the realm but if the audience didn’t know that Loki was up to dodgy things then the coding would be switched around because he was trying to spy and committed treason and then tried to kill Loki. People... can hold feelings towards others... regardless of skin... and suspect them... for reasons other than skin... although I do still have questions about whether Heimdall knew Loki was Jotun or not. (Even if I personally don’t think it’d make a difference to how he’d treat Loki?)

Some Loki fans have also suggested that because Jotuns have blue skin that this alone makes him a person of color (even if the audience is only allowed to see Loki in his true Jotun form for mere seconds of screentime). This, again, shows a lack of understanding when it comes to race. It doesn’t matter what skin color the Jotuns have. 

Race can differentiate between physical and/or behavioural characteristics!! Not being blue all the time doesn’t make him any less Jotun!! He’s got internalized stuff to work through and is used to being Aesir!! At least 1 parent is Jotun so even if Loki was passing as Aesir he’s probably Jotun!! (I don’t know how magic space genetics work for sure but Loki being Jotun was an entire very important jump-starting point in Thor 1!!). It’s a fantasy text and typically things like having different coloured skin indicates a different race or is sometimes if a species has multiple then is just considered a skin colour. That’s how coding works!! The Jotnar are very specifically the only race we see in the movie with a skin-tone not within the ‘normal’ human range, which alienates them to the audience from the get-go!! They’re an “other” and on the opposite side to the ‘good’ characters.

Both Loki and his birth father, Laufey (Colm Feore), are played by white men, and it is impossible for a white man to successfully play a character of color. 

The specification of men here bothers me, but yes, you don’t get ‘white’ people to play characters of colour if it can be avoided. (And it can be avoided.)

This also connects with the previous point made that people of color come from various places. There is nothing specifically about the Jotun that could be traced to any specific person of color, and even if there were, there would be no way for white men to portray them without being disrespectful.

This is where arguments about the definition of coding and how specificity/generalizations and do/don’t come in. I know I’m subjective and lean towards the more rep the better, but while I agree ‘white’ people wouldn’t be able to respectfully play a POC I don’t think that rule should have to carry over into fantasy-based fiction. I know texts reflect on reality and reality can reflect within texts, but if contextually there is racial discrimination and there are similar ideas which resonate with the audience’s own experiences I’d say it’s coded well enough to allow that.

tldr; Thor 1′s narrative revolves mainly around Thor and Loki, of which race is kinda kinda a significant theme in Loki’s part of the story. Not so much explored with less-developed side characters such as Heimdall and Hogun, even though their actors are actual people of colour. 

How Much of this is Really Well-Intentioned?

In the fantasy space viking world Heimdall and Hogun don’t face any on-screen prejudice and their appearance is not mentioned (which is nice, for sure! good to have casual rep!) but adding on to the roles they play in the narrative the explicit fantasy-racism in the movie isn't aimed at Asian/Black characters, but towards the Humans -to a lesser extent- and the Jotnar, including Loki, who only just found out he comes under that bracket.

The article mentions how fandom space toxicity often “reaches the actors who portray the characters,“ which is true, and it’s shameful that people have to justify their roles or presences are harassed for the pettiest things like skin tone/cultural background, but I don’t see coding characters as removing the spotlight from interesting characters such as those which are actually POC, rather expressing a demand for more rep, since well-written complex characters which are diverse are often absent/minor enough in the media, and therefore can get easily brushed aside in both canon and fandom spaces.

tldr; It’s obviously not a replacement for actual representation, but, if a character is marginalized and can be interpreted as coded, even if they would only be considered so within the context of the textual landscape, I don’t see why spreading awareness through exploring the coding as a possibility for the character shouldn’t be done, even if the media is being presented by people who are ‘white’ or privileged or may not fall into the categories themselves, as long as it’s done respectfully to those it could explicitly represent.

[utilitycaster]

What’s your thoughts on tm9 suggesting working with Trent? Do you think tm9 are being “bad friends”? I have seen a lot of discussion on it and I was wondering what your thoughts are. Apologies if you have already shared your thoughts.

Hi anon,

I have shared at least some of my thoughts but, as always, give me an inch and I will take one thousand miles and then take one thousand more. If you wanted a normal answer, please click on that link and then feel free to stop reading. If you want me to yell about behaviors in fandom that fill me with rage (and also some additional thoughts about the Mighty Nein in this episode, to be fair, which I’ve marked so you can skip to it), read on.

GOOD FUCKING LORD I AM PRETTY SURE A CERTAIN SMALL BUT LOUD PORTION WITHIN FANDOM, AND THIS IS ABOUT FANDOM IN GENERAL AND NOT SPECIFIC TO THE CRITICAL ROLE, ACTUAL PLAY, NOR D&D FANDOM, HAS NEVER HAD A FUNCTIONAL FRIENDSHIP OR RELATIONSHIP IN THEIR LIVES WHAT WITH THE WAY THEY TALK ABOUT CHARACTER INTERACTIONS. LIKE WHAT THE FUCK.

I don’t think that any of the Mighty Nein were being at all inappropriate during this conversation in the first place, and more on that below, but also like, people say insensitive things to their friends all the time! It’s impossible to account for every situation that could potentially upset someone, and sometimes people need to have difficult conversations! I’ve said this before with people in private conversations but there is an exhausting amount of discourse for CR (but also, like, in general about fictional media by people who are Way Too Online) regarding who really understands and cares about whom and it’s like. They are all friends. They have all referred to each other as found family. They all care about each other. And with that in mind, it’s also true that if you or anyone else were to give me literally any pairing of two characters in the Nein, romantic or platonic, I can without considerable effort name an interaction in which one of them said or did something hurtful or insensitive to the other, because this is a thing that happens when different people with different perspectives and experiences talk to each other for any length of time.

A not-insignificant amount of discourse, in my opinion, has nothing to do with how real interpersonal relationships work and is entirely "this is my favorite/least favorite character (or ship) and I think everyone should also think they are flawless/terrible” and if I had to guess this is probably more of the same. But even if it’s not just that, the idea that the only “good” friendship is one devoid of arguments, slip-ups, and even the most minor of transgressions and anything else is “bad” or “toxic” is so divorced from reality I absolutely cannot engage with it without wanting to scream. Which is not to say that a single action by a friend, even a close one, could never be enough to invalidate the friendship. But it has to be a pretty significant and deliberate violation, and in my opinion the events of this episode do not even budge the needle.

With that out of the way before I return to it at the end: I think the overarching attitude of the Mighty Nein on the whole is “this is going to be an incredibly difficult fight, and we need to discuss all of our options, even distasteful ones that none of us particularly like.”

The linked post talks a lot about why I think Fjord brought it up in the first place, but from there, I would say that Yasha was the only one who was consistently on the side of “No,” which is in line with her character. We know Caduceus is fairly sure they’re going to die without additional help and has seen by far the most terrifying visions of what happens if they fail; that Jester likely has some similar ideas to Caleb regarding “if Trent’s with us, at least he’s not going after Marion”; and while Beau brought up the downsides of working with one’s abuser it’s highly worth noting she was still entertaining it: she floats that maybe this could kill two birds with one stone [2:01:10-ish on the Twitch video].

Veth strikes me as the one who came closest to “pushing” Caleb, and this has been a theme recently. I’m not fully sure about this - Veth is often a character I struggle to get a handle on - but I think it’s a combination of her family being at risk in the same way Jester’s is, her own feelings of guilt or shirked responsibility about leaving the Nein after this before Caleb has achieved his goals particularly given how instrumental he was to achieving hers, and a little bit of still seeing Caleb how he was earlier on, when they first met. That last reason is definitely frustrating when it happens in real life, but it’s a very real phenomenon, the first one is wholly understandable, and the middle one is both. Basically, are those actions a little selfish? Yeah, but people are selfish sometimes. There’s a reason why even when I don’t understand her Veth (and, tbh, all the Mighty Nein) feels like a wholly realized person, and it’s because of things like this, where she has real reactions and emotional turmoil in response to an incredibly stressful situation instead of being blandly understanding.

On top of that, anything that denies that Caleb was not entertaining it, particularly after he quite literally says he’s considered it, feels like ignoring his response because it doesn’t fit a particular narrative. It ignores the entire conversation with Essek, in which Caleb is the one who brings it up first, Caleb is the one who continues to argue for it after Essek expresses his discomfort, and Caleb is the one who says he’s frustrated that his attempt to persuade Essek fails.

Returning to the generalized rant but at what point do you (the abstract you, not you the anon) stop overlaying how you think someone should react and actually listen to people? One of the things in this world that genuinely angers me the most that isn’t, you know, atrocities, is when people assume how someone feels instead of asking them and persist in doing so even when told otherwise, and this is probably why the whole “the Mighty Nein are bad friends” statement has prompted such a strong response from me here. I don’t think I’m saying anything revolutionary here but all the arguments in favor of that statement are stupid! If you don’t ask for a hug, sometimes you won’t get one! If you don’t say you’re uncomfortable you can’t assume people will be aware of it! The realest distinction between good and bad friends, actually, is whether they listen to what you’re saying or if they just project what they think you should be saying, and whether they tell you what they want from you or if they make up elaborate unspoken rules that you’re supposed to magically intuit and follow. Not whether they never make mistakes, or disagree, or bring up difficult topics.

Uh, anyway, this is probably a whole lot more and maybe not even related to what you were looking for but really, the idea that a deep friendship can be reclassified into a binary from good to bad based on two conversations, and the related idea that every interaction that isn’t perfectly harmonious must have someone to blame instead of acknowledging the full depth and breadth of normal healthy interpersonal interactions, are both absolutely terrible ideas and I would love if people in general would immediately stop having them.

[threequeensss]

why taka’s ultimate isn’t useless

spoiler warning for trigger happy havoc and taka’s free time events!

HIHI SORRY FOR THE LONG INTRO SKIP TO THE SECOND PARAGRAPH IF YOU DON’T WANT TO READ IT ,, ok lol so i only make an original post like maybe once a year AT BEST so here we go,, anyway, i’ve seen a lot of posts on tiktok, instagram, etc. saying that taka’s ultimate makes the least sense or that it’s a “useless” ultimate. maybe it’s because he’s my favorite DR character overall (which may be surprising if you don’t know me considering how barren my blog is of taka content), but after thinking about it a lot, i personally disagree with that and here’s why. (side note: i know the original translation of his ultimate is shsl public morals committee member, this is an analysis of his ultimate overall, not just the way the english dub titles it, so it can be applied to any translation :) )

most criticisms i’ve seen surrounding his ultimate is that it’s not a real ultimate or that it doesn’t have any practical use. a moral compass one’s means of distinguishing right from wrong and to follow the morally “right” path. taka is the ultimate moral compass, meaning he quite literally acts as a moral compass, guiding his peers. on the surface level, we see this through him scolding the other students for having dyed hair (leon), heavy makeup (mukuro presenting as junko), or for students sharing a room (aoi and sakura). sure, at first glance, this may seem like a silly or pointless ultimate, but if you talk to taka during free time, it quickly becomes apparent that it’s so much more than monitoring halls and scolding his classmates for acting like teenagers.

let’s talk about why taka behaves the way he does and why his ultimate is, in my opinion, perfect for his character. we can trace this back to his grandfather, a disgraced prime minister of japan and a “genius.” his grandfather abandoned his morals as one of the most influential people in the world, effectively shaming the ishimaru name and sending the family into enormous debt that would haunt them even after the former prime ministers’ death. through the way taka explains it and how upset he gets when a well-meaning makoto calls him a genius, unwittingly implying that taka and his grandfather are similar, it becomes abundantly clear that his grandfather’s scandal tears him up inside every day. he’s ashamed to be related to such a morally questionable individual and wants nothing more than to repair his family’s reputation, to step out of the enormous shadow his grandfather cast. 

taka’s way of doing this is for everything about him to be inherently “good,” so that the ishimaru name is no longer associated with scandals and disgrace. this is why he sacrifices any sort of self-indulgence (only wearing his uniform, staying away from popular media, etc.), to remain as seemingly “good” and unquestionably “morally upright” as possible. being a model student and leading the public morals committee are the most immediately accessible ways for him to begin repairing his family’s reputation, alongside guiding his classmates (whether they asked for it or not). this isn’t meant to be a commentary or judgment of the way he interacts with others, but he’s definitely not critical of others just for the sake of it. he genuinely wants to make the world a better place due to his trauma and his own ambitions, which i’m about to delve into next. 

ok so. now that i’ve dumped enough info that hopefully explains his personality and motivations, i’m going to talk about why i believe his ultimate is useful and deserves to be recognized as a legitimate ultimate by the fandom. the most obvious cases are when he takes on a self-appointed leadership role at the beginning of the killing game. if i remember correctly (i haven’t played thh in a hot minute), it was taka who had the idea of the morning breakfast meetings, and he was also the first to suggest that everyone announce their secrets at the beginning of chapter 2 to undermine monokuma’s motive. the latter example was unsuccessful given the events that proceeded, but it was him using his ultimate and position as a leader to the best of his ability. 

i understand that this next part is debatable as to whether or not it applies to his ultimate since it’s his untapped potential more than anything, but i personally believe it’s a central part of it so,, here we go! i feel like it’s pretty much agreed that despite being “super high school level,” an ultimate shouldn’t be a skill that someone can just drop after graduation. it should be able to be applied to the real world and society as a whole, hence why they’re at hope’s peak academy. it may seem like taka’s ultimate doesn’t hold up in the real world, since he’s the president of a high school club, but that couldn’t be farther from the truth. taka already plans to use his ultimate after graduation to become prime minister and establish a meritocracy. 

taka has a vision of a society where it’s an equal playing field for everyone so that individuals can build their lives through their own effort, so the history pertaining to his grandfather can’t repeat itself. (this part is meant to analyze taka’s ambitions and the reasoning behind them, not meritocracies as a whole!) he has been so badly burned by immorality and the concept of geniuses (side note. his disdain for geniuses and ambition to create a society without them reminds me SO MUCH of edelgard’s ambitions from fire emblem. anyway sorry abt that) that he has chosen to take it upon himself to one day reinvent society. he wants to use his experiences and sense of justice, or moral compass, to better the lives of other people. if he has proven to effectively use his ultimate within whatever situation he’s in and has a dream pertaining to his ultimate that will take him far beyond his high school years, then i don’t think it’s fair to call it “impractical” or “useless.” 

taka’s ultimate title may not have the same immediate wow-factor as the ultimate programmer or ultimate pop sensation, but it’s not meant to, taka regards himself to be an average man ! he acts as a guide for those around him and truly wants to make the world a better place. all of these examples can be traced back to his ultimate, which in my opinion, is SUCH an interesting concept and has too much potential to be called useless. 

if you’ve made it this far, tysm and i’m sorry. if anyone has any thoughts at all, please don’t hesitate to share!! i’m the only taka stan i know lol

[yumeerin]

cw // rant ? Ena hate , Mafuyu hate , Mizuki hate , 25ji hate , depression , suicide , anxiety , hospitalization , self hatred

Doing this instead of my homework but I needed to get this off my chest

I hate how people demonize the cast of 25ji Night Code.

The unit represents mentally ill people who make music. People who write about experiences with mental illness. A huge portion of vocaloid songs are about this topic and music plays a big role in people’s lives. So of course listening to music about how your life has so much value or don’t end it all it’s not worth it (e.g hated by life itself, the lost one’s weeping) will play a big role in your life.

The characters themselves represent real issues many people struggle with. They are people with mental illnesses who still have a goal. If anything, they are the most realistic group in the game.

Someone who lost her mother and has a father currently in the hospital, with music as the “cure” to hopefully bring her father and make him smile again along with others.

Someone who is uncomfortable with their own image, and doesn’t see themself as good enough because (maybe implied gender dysphoria?) and is criticized by others for how they express themself.

Someone who feels as if her art is never good enough, talentless, and feels that she needs likes on her social media to be validated.

Someone who is controlled by people around her, putting a fake image in front of her parents and many others, instead she does not know what she really wants, lost all value of life and even implied that she is suicidal.

Yes, these characters aren’t the healthiest but they are a REALISTIC PORTRAYTION of artists who are suffering.

Ena is not “annoying” for seeking validation when she was never loved.

Mafuyu isn’t “toxic” for wanting to disappear because she lost all value of life.

I hear so many people complain about Mafuyu and Ena the most because of their illnesses. I even hear shit about Mafuyu being “insensitive” and “not showing gratitude towards 25ji”. She is literally. Suffering.

For years she has been suffering since she was a kid. Yes, she needs help, desperate help because it was shown in the story that she was in the sekai for a week. Also not to mention the game just released in October, there is still room for development. The point of the sekai is to help others achieve what they really want.

Now with Ena,

She has a complex relationship with her dad, who is an artist (if i can recall) that she wants to surpass. She doesn’t have the most perfect relationship with her younger brother and her mom is nowhere to be found. She feels desperate to have attention on her because she was never given attention, or love.

She feels as if her art is never good enough because she barely gets recognized for her talent. Now here’s the thing; most people see her as an attention-seeker, but that’s not the case. If you were never paid attention to online AND in real life, of course you would want attention and a reminder that you are important. That’s what Ena is doing. She’s not seeking attention just for the fun of it, she wants to be noticed for her talents and recognized.

I haven’t seen much hate about Kanade, and with Mizuki I only hear about their annoying gender debate, which isn’t relevant to the idea of mental illnesses but i still find it annoying

I believe most of the people who hate 25ji or any of the characters haven’t read the story yet, which is understandable because the game is in Japanese only! But there are already story translations on Youtube, and I recommend reading about it because it’s a good introduction to the unit and the characters. I don’t think its entirely bad to hate someone from 25ji, if you don’t like them that’s fine, just please don’t use their problems against them. The idea of Mafuyu wanting to cut off from the rest of the world is unhealthy, yes, but please don’t hate her/demonize her because of it.

If you made it here congrats! I didn’t expect to write an essay on 25ji Night Code... uh oh

The only inspiration I have for writing this is because of some “hot takes” I’ve seen from the instagram side of the sekai fandom and... it’s really just people misunderstanding 25ji and hating Ena and Mafuyu. If I get anything wrong I’m sorry, I’m not really the best at English or explaining stuffs into detail and my memory is kinda bad, but I really needed to get this off my chest.

Have a Mafuyu I drew a while back as a reward for reaching this far 🖤

[bloodyshadow1]

just out of curiosity (this isn’t meant to be a rude or sarcastic question), what was it that bothered you most about the kingsley thing?

for context, I haven’t actually seen the ending yet, i’ve only heard vague spoilers about what happened, but I am curious to hear your thoughts on it (i don’t mind hearing more spoilers abt the ending!)

sorry it's taken me so long to answer, I've been trying to word things right because I've been told I sound abrasive over text and I want to be clear that it isn't directed at you anon, it's just how I am as a person. Discourse under the cut

There are many things I dislike about the Kingsley thing, I'm not going to rant here (even though I did looking back and I apologize), but I'll give you some that I think are what bugs me the most. The first being that nothing that happened with Kingsley couldn't happen with Molly, after the initial waking up scene. We only had 26 episodes with Molly, we didn't know him that well and he's been dead for almost a year, anything except the not remembering anything, from walking away from a fight that he is clearly underleveled for, to going to be on a boat as a pirate could have all been Molly. It would have achieved the same thing, except he would have had the bonds with the Nein that started to grow as Molly, seeing them as they were at level 5 to now saving Exandria, but that didn't happen. I never really understood the Yasha Molly bond, since Yasha was gone for most episodes that Molly was around for and she was very quiet during those episodes, they never got a chance to really talk about anything deeper so it feels like an informed relationship, but Yasha the character cared for Molly yet because he's Kingsley, they barely have any interaction again and it feels empty and hollow. He barely interacted with any of the Nein, and certainly not on any deep level. He didn't even bother to ask their names, and only seemed like a kid dashing to do the next thing he could think of, only being able to do so because he is around a bunch of rich and powerful strangers that are treating him well without any actual care or curiosity about them. We got a shallow shadow of Molly and Lucien in Kingsley who doesn't add anything to the story.

There's also the fact that spells that bring back the dead don't work like that. There needs to be a target and a willing soul, that's what Matt's revival rituals are for, to coax the soul back to the body. I'm all for bending the rules of dnd for cool stuff, but it is part of extra rules in critical role that needs bending and it makes Lucien's argument of Molly never existing as anything but a shadow fragment of himself have a lot more weight if he didn't get brought back through magic and a literal goddess stepping in. Also greater restoration shouldn't have done anything but bring something back, it restores, it's in the name, it shouldn't have created a new personality and it definitely shouldn't have destroyed molly's old one if that's what happened.

Additionally, if this happened in an episode that wasn't the finale of the campaign, then I would feel differently. But it was, there isn't any more story, he's there for a bit part of the finale and nothing more. It's like if Liam came in with a half-elf rogue at the end of campaign 1 I would be pissed off at that character too. The story of the Mighty Nein is over, yeah there will probably be oneshots, or specials maybe, but it's over over, no more episodes every, the fellowship is broken, and they are living their own lives not as their adventuring party. I nothing Kingsley because there is nothing to care about, if he wasn't wearing the Molly/Lucien body he would be a random NPC, but because he is, he is just there with nothing really to get attached too. I know some people like him, I honestly can't understand why people do. He's Molly without any of the time or bonds that made Molly interesting, he's just a boring version of Molly and there's no time to get attached or understand anything more than. There's a reason why in almost every form of media, they refrain from introducing a new character in the last episode or chapter, because they come off flatter than the other characters the audience has followed, and for the most part they're right. Maybe they'll do a oneshot that focus' on him but I don't know why I should care.

The biggest thing though, is that it feels like defeat was snatched out of the jaws of victory. The whole final arc, the Nein has gotten nothing, no real treasure or magic items, not even renown and respect like Vox Machina did in defeating Vecna and saving Vasselheim, it seemed like actually getting Molly back was the one thing they wanted..., and then they didn't. He's a stranger wearing their fallen friend's body, who doesn't even seem to care about what they struggled for, that gods had to beat luck to bring him back and they're nothing to him. They got more from curbstomping Trent and bringing him to justice than the whole rest of the final arc and Kingsley is just another reminder.

Sorry for this rant, you did ask, but I just needed to get this out. I wasn't actually that attached to Molly, he was a fine character but I think the fandom got way too attached to him and instead of actually caring about his canon self, they pushed their head canons on him and that has it's own problems for me. But Kingsley just coming in literally right before the series ended just felt like a kick to the groin. Other people feel differently, I'm definitely not someone who says the cast is playing wrong, it's just something I hated about the finale of the story I loved and followed for so long.

[feralcherry]

Naruto takes that might enrage you (girl addition)

Warning, some of these takes might enrage you- that’s fine.

Fillers don’t count as canon, don’t even bring them up if you talk about this post lol. Also it’s been a while since I’ve seen the whole series, so some of these might be disproven as I continue with my rewatch. The excuse that Shounen is for boys is also very weak and holds no weight, as tons of girls (and nonbinary folk) relate to the characters in this show, so that doesn’t excuse Kishimoto for his weak writing of women.

To preface, I love this show. Love it to pieces. It was part of my childhood and holds a very special place in my heart. But there are some things I personally don’t like or wish could have been done better. I love every character and will go blue in the face talking about how much I still love this show. That doesn’t free it from my criticism. I’m also only listing what I don’t like and what I would change, though I’d be more than happy making a post about what I loved.

Let’s start off with my girl Sakura Haruno. She is easily the most hated girl in the series, and all because of how ‘weak’ or ‘annoying’ she is. As if that’s not the fault of Kishimoto himself lol. She was shoved off to the side continuously and never given cool storylines, unlike the other members of her team.

What I took issue with about Sakura:

-What were this girls dreams?? The whole reason she became a ninja was never really talked about nor were they really developed as time went on. She was all about Sasuke, which would be fine if she grew out of it. But no. 

-Her crush on Sasuke was super stale. He was handsome and powerful, but what else was there to him? He was a jerk to her most of the time (there are some instances he’s somewhat kind to her, but if we go off canon, it’s not enough to make her deep love make sense). I think it would have been so much more interesting to see her grow out of her infatuation for him. If they had to have ended up together, watching them relearn each other and fall in love would have made them more compelling. She stayed loving a boy who thought very little of her. 

-She’s pitted against her best friend and doesn’t develop much of a relationship with other girls her age. It’s kind of sad, and I think they should have fought over something other than a boy. 

-We are told repeatedly that she’s super powerful by other characters, but she’s never given time to truly shine. She got like a single battle with Sasori and she deserved more cool moments like that!

-She was a healer, which makes perfect sense. But why is it mostly girls who are the healers? It’s a bit weird, when there’s also Neji with his perfect chakra control. She only has her healing abilities and her super strength; but even then someone like Kabuto has more offensive healing based techniques than her. Like his chakra scalpel. 

What I would fix:

-New dreams. Show her find a dream outside of her team and grow into it. Also give her more of a backstory. Sai has more of a backstory than she does and he’s way newer than she is.

-I would let her fuck up one of the Peins instead of Konohomaru- she’s a main character and passed over for that little brat?? She should have gotten to do more than scream out for Naruto and heal people :/ 

-She her intellect a bit more. She’s so smart, and yet we don’t really see it.

-She’s perfect for genjutsu, Kakashi himself said so. So why not give that to her? Or play more with ninjutsu. She has earth and water on her chart, so why not give her those abilities? Maybe even wood jutsu to even her out with her super OP teammates. Idk how, it could have happened, this is a show full of demons and god like abilities, it could have happened someway.

-She should have grown out of Sasuke and not married a man who doesn’t really appreciate her and isn’t there for her at all.

-I would totally have expanded on Inner Sakura more. Imagine if it made her mind impenetrable? Could have woven that in with her skills for genjutsu and made her unaffected by other’s illusions.

Next, let’s go with a more beloved character of the fandom. Hinata. Now personally I don’t care much for her- she could have been so cool but just like Sakura, they kind of messed her up.

What I didn’t like about Hinata:

-Her entire existence is revolves around Naruto. Naruto this, Naruto that- and yet she simply sat back and watched as his life was shit and did nothing despite her ‘love’ for him. And then fillers/movies are added to show that oh wait! she’s been there this entire time!! no lol. Build her up from the start as his love interest at the very least.

-She stayed super meek the entire time. Shy girls are okay, but I wanted to see her grow into herself more and not need as much reassurance. She’s a ninja and should stand on her own two feet more.

-She’s less skilled then Neji and I would have loved to see her outmatch him at some point, even once. Or gain abilities outside of her clan, or do something that made a name for herself outside of being the heiress of the Hyuga.

-She never fixed her clan which was one of her few spoken goals. That was a huge bummer.

-I think it would have been cool to see her mess up Pein a little more. She only stepped in because it was Naruto, which reinforces that she’s only about him. But at least let her land a hit if she’s as powerful as people say she is. 

-She makes the most sense to be a housewife or a healer with the way her attitude is but in Boruto, she’s kind of rewritten to be a ‘scary’ mother which just doesn’t fit her. Plus, she tells Boruto to go and take care of his dad?? Bro, that’s your child and your husband is the hokage. 

What I’d fix:

-Prove her dad wrong and show him that her compassion isn’t a weakness but a strength. 

-Fix the Hyuga clan bs.

-More character growth and showing more of her life away from Naruto. Her romance with him could also have been better. I hated her always watching him but never standing up for him, it kills me.

-Neij dying for her proved their clans hierarchy bs to be right and it just doesn’t make sense for him to die for her. It showed that he was right to feel caged and that he simply existed for the benefit of the Main family.

Now with the others, there’s much less I have to say about them because they aren’t main characters or the love interests.

Ino-

-Jealous of Sakura, no dreams of her own, stupidly loves Sasuke and for what? WHAT’S SO COOL ABOUT HIM?

-I like her growth for the most part, it was cool watching her fight in the War Arc with her team. 

-Why is she the medical ninja? I never got that.

-She got with Sai but they didn’t really show their development and how they fell in love with each other. It’s like she only likes him because he looks like Sasuke and called her pretty once.

Tenten-

-Should have gotten to train with Tsunade at some point, since she was the one who originally idolized her. 

-We know nothing about this girl at all. She doesn’t even have a last name.

-Her weapon usage was meant to be so cool and yet she missed so often- there’s a disconnect there. Her abilities could have been built up more. Imagine if no matter what she never ever missed. That would have been cool.

-Her weapon shop isn’t doing well. Just because it’s an era of peace doesn’t mean the need for weapons is totally over, not if there are still active ninja??

Karin-

-I actually like her, she’s kind of funny and I like that she’s mean even if she can get annoying.

-Again, another healer, though she’s also sensory which is more interesting. I’d like to see her with some jutsus though. That would have been neat.

-Her love for Sasuke makes sense since he saved her and smiled at her, making her think of him as her hero. And she’s the only one he apologizes to without Naruto strong arming him into it.

Temari-

-She’s pretty solid in my opinion. Though I would have loved to see her more without her brothers.

Konan-

-Her goals in life were to support Yahiko and Nagito’s dreams. It would irritate me so much if other girls in the series were more well rounded and din’t also have some sort of dream involving a boy.

-She was underused. I would have loved to see her fight more.

Tsunade-

-Only becomes hokage to support others dreams...All of them men. And then later passes the title onto Kakashi who doesn’t even want to be Hokage either. 

-No other justus used, she’s on par with Jiraya and Orochimaru and yet she’s only super strong and the best medic. She should theoretically be more well rounded than that, right? She also should be shown fighting more even if she’s a medic, she’s also s legendary sannin 

-Had to be saved by 12 year old Naruto. I know it’s a show about him, but she’s meant to be a literal badass but needs a kid to save her.

Kushina-

-Wanted to become the first woman hokage and then didn’t. Her husband did. and then she became a housewife?? What?? She should have become the first woman hokage with a badass husband or had another prominent role in the village like as a council member or something.

Kurenai-

-Always lost a fight? She’s some genjutsu using badass but always lost fights.

-No real personality, she’s just chilling there. Sexy as hell though. Has a kid and that’s about it.

-What I will give her is that I’m so glad she was allowed to age. So many anime mothers always look the same as their teenage self and she looks like she can be anybody's mama.

Over all, the girls could have been handled much better. I wouldn’t find issues with any of them being housewives or all about boys if that weren’t what seems to be the standard in the anime. I just wanted more of a variety and better character development, especially for Sakura and Hinata who are the mains 😩

Now to what might REALLY piss people off- ships! I’m not trying to start some war here, this is just my opinion and you can take it or leave it.

Sakura- Naruto, since they had the most development and showed more than two seconds of caring for each other. Even Sai in Shippuden has more of a connection to Sakura than Sasuke did.

Ino-Shikamaru, if she had to end up with a guy it makes sense it’d be him since they spend more time together than her and Sai did. (inosaku for the win tho)

Hinata-Shino or Kiba, again, because they spent more time with her. Naruto and her felt very rushed and I don’t quite understand the appeal.

The one that made the most sense and became canon was Shikatem, though their son’s design was lazy :D 

If I do a second part, it’ll be about the boys and the ships with them that made sense to me. For now, this is all I have. If you’ve made it this far, thank you lol

byeee

[phenomenalcosmicpowers]

Post-Trailer Generation 5 Thoughts

So, a trailer for the beginning of G5 has now been released. And as promised, I am having a supplementary post to my preliminary thoughts and concerns heading into G5. Though I do first want to answer something I’m sure some might be curious about and that’s if G5 will have any bearing on I Dream of Twilight Sparkle. Given the thing about it being supposedly being the same Equestria at least according to mentions of the Mane 6 as the ancient times and by execs.

G5’S EFFECT ON I DREAM OF TWILIGHT SPARKLE

I will go ahead and say that no, other then if there’s maybe a part of the movie and/or upcoming series I want to make some sort of reference to for any reason that G5 will not happen in the IDOTS universe. The thing about the premise of G5 contradicts a huge thing that’s part of Secrets of the Dragon’s Tear in that Life itself is Magic. With presumably years and years of no magic, G5’s world wouldn’t exist. It’d be the lifeless wasteland that was seen in the Season 5 finale. I will stay firmly on G4 characters as I still have plenty I want to do with them. I’ve once thought about ending I Dream of Twilight Sparkle on the 10th anniversary of the blog next year. But that might not be enough time to fully explore everything I want to do post-Secrets of the Dragon’s Tear. So rest assured I have lots of plans still without having to dive into G5 material.

Another huge difference in IDOTS case that I will point out is that thousands of years by now as I imagine is implied by G4 being Ancient Equestria in G5. Is that Twilight (and Spike too, who will probably be full size at that point) will still be around. And even the others of the Mane 6 and other characters of the G4 generation will likely be able to guide the living as summonable spirits. I doubt under that context that the world of Equestria deteriorates to G5’s situation with this all in mind.

(More after the break)

REITERATING THE CONCERNS ABOUT THE G4-G5 CONNECTION

But now to actually get the trailer itself, it generally shows what we know already but this is the first time we see a little bit in how they’re executing it in motion and acting. They are going to continue mentioning that G4 is the ancient times of this world with the only reason Pony relations that seems to have deteriorated is the long passage of time. Which seems like a terrible interpretation of time. Division still happens in our world especially in the politics side of things but thousands of years ago (or even just a few hundred years ago) it was far worse then it is now with authoritarian empires, monarchies, and enslavement of people everywhere. There’s not a period of history from thousands of years ago that most of us look to have again like Sunny will for Twilight’s reign.

If we are to take it at face value that G5 happened after G4, the peaceful world we saw in The Last Problem where not just all 3 pony types but even non-pony species popullate many areas of Equestria and live in harmony. Even if perhaps you’re not a fan of one or both of the final two seasons of the show, The Last Problem showed that Twilight’s friendship school accomplished it’s goal in helping Equestria reach out to other places in the world. It’s hard to see from that point how things can deteriorate where things seem to be far worse then Celestia’s sole rule of 1,000 years. Or to go even further, it seems to have gotten just as bad if not worse then the Hearth’s Warming story of the founding of Equestria. It’s arguably worse then even the Hearth’s Warming story since even if it was obvious the three types of ponies hated each other, they tolerated each other enough to bargain the necessities at that point. The earth ponies would make the food if the Unicorns move the sun and moon and the Pegasi help with the weather. But as seen in the trailer even one sighting of a unicorn in an Earth pony town puts the whole place in a panic.

Speaking of the Hearth’s Warming story they’re going to have explain why the Windigoes aren’t currently ravaging the planet in Ice and Snow like in the story if we’re to truly believe this is the G4 world we know. Somehow I feel they’re not going to for that deep cut in terms of the lore of G4. I think any connection to G4 is going to be treated more as an afterthought. References to Twilight and her friends, the toys in Sunny’s house, and murals to the past the only huge indications that G4 was the ancient past and never explaining how things got where they are now. I believe this is an attempt of Hasbro to bake it’s cake and eat it too. They want to try to retain G4’s popularity heading into G5 so they try to say G5 is the same exact world even when so much of the evidence we’ve seen so far is too different to be world we knew. (I know there’s a map that shows the Pegasi have what might have once been Canterlot. But there still needs to be more) I feel like most fans going into this should go into this thinking this is a totally new world despite the references to G4. Or even perhaps the ancient G4 isn’t the same G4 we saw in the show. Maybe the Friendship school never happened in this timeline for example. An alternate universe G4 where they never developed the school might make this at least somewhat more palatable. Though even then there’d still be questions.

Another note in the story is as a sort of flipped from G4. Where Canterlot had Unicorns seem to make up most of the rich upper-class ponies. The pegasi seem to be the upper-class and/or royals this time while the Unicorns are actually the poorest of the three and Earth Ponies are middle-class. I slightly joked after hearing that maybe this is a universe where Cozy Glow actually got what she wanted given she was a Pegasus heh. Not that makes any sense either, as there’s probably no honoring of the Mane 6 if they got defeated by a Pegasus filly.

BOOK LEAK

On the same day of the trailer we also got something of a leak of book that comes out next week that recaps the movie in a children’s book style (Don’t worry I won’t spoil anything from it, but yes I did see the scans). Now naturally not all details of an entire movie is probably going to get in a picture book with small excerpts of text on a 32 page book. But it does generally give an outline of how the movie goes. The scans give enough of an outline of how the movie will go. I just have too much concern about G5 to resist knowing how the movie will go to wait until the movie releases. I still intend to see the movie itself but it’ll sort of give me an idea of what we’re in for. For a spoiler-free review of what I know, I think under it’s own merits if we ignore the G4 elephant in the room it’ll probably be a decent way to start things.

FANDOM REACTION

I think if the context was G5 was it’s own separate universe with no connection to G4 it could potentially have some standing on it’s own and will probably have young kids enjoy the movie that see G5 before they see Friendship is Magic. For older fans of G4 though, heading into this generation there’s going to be a lot of things preoccupying the mind before we even start watching the movie. Having G4 as the ancient past has something of a pro of at least getting some fans who liked FiM to at least give this a chance, but at the cost of leaving certain expectations and putting some of the creative freedom in a bind because to tell us this is the same world means you will have fans pointing out contradictions where as there would be no concern if this world was allowed to be it’s own thing The writers and staff of G5 are going to have fans that criticize them for any choice they make that doesn’t fit with G4 in some way. I’m not going to be one of them of course, as that’s annoying behavior even if I agree with the fan who’s criticizing them. And fans have plenty to already raise an eyebrow at, such as normal animals oddly having wings and/or horns when normal animals tended to be just normal animals in G4 (Albeit alot more sentient then real life animals).

LACK OF NON-PONIES?

There also doesn’t seem to be any sign of the other species that became more prominent in late G4. There’s not even a Spike from what we can see thus far. Unless maybe there’s a 6th main character that gets introduced in the beginning of the series that has a little dragon companion this would be the first time since maybe My Little Pony Tales that there was no Spike. I imagine we will get the return of some non-pony species.but it’s still going to be an elephant in the room because the end of G4 showed that basically all other species became allies to the ponies. Did relations to the non-ponies also deteriorate terribly? And there’s also the possibility that many of the Dragons have long enough lives that they remember Twilight’s reign. Maybe even a possibility of full-grown Spike making an appearance in the series. But then there’s still griffins, hippogriffs/seaponies, yaks, kirins, changelings, and more. You keep the world of G4 you have to keep in mind all the species that played a role at some point. If you ignore them for too long it’s another point to those who might feel that this isn’t truly G4’s world.

ALICORNS

I won’t say much on subject of Alicorns since I already mentioned that in the preliminary thoughts, though I will reiterate things like even if say we overestimated the immortality of Alicorns they may still need to point out that Twilight, Celestia, Luna, Cadence, and probably Flurry Heart too are all gone. There doesn’t seem to be any signs of Alicorns at all. To be honest it might be that the only real Alicorn reference is the possibility during the scene where Izzy disguises everyone as unicorns. Someone manages to see either Zipp’s or Pipp’s wings and thus they get a lot of unwanted attention. (And in contrast probably one of the non-Izzy main characters horn disguise falling off)

CONFLICT AND HAPPY ENDING OVERRIDES

I get that the main response to concerns of G4 fans is there has to be some sort of conflict for this series to be interesting as otherwise you go back to the too saccharine days of G3 where the conflicts leave almost no danger to the world at large. But we can still point out that if this was presented as it’s own world separate from G4 this would be ok. But not the same world where Sunny’s goal had been more then already achieved. It doesn’t lay the blame at the Mane 6 for failing at the very least but it certainly looks down at all their descendants generations later of being unable to withhold the Mane 6’s lessons and keep the peace. They had the solutions for divisions mostly solved, yet it’s somehow squandered. It won’t be easy to swallow for anyone who loved the conclusive happy ending FiM got. And even for fans who weren’t as into the ending as others they’re only being vindictive if they say it makes their criticism of the ending valid.

The point is the series ended as happily as it could of gotten, and you will bug fans no matter what you do if you attempt a happy ending override. Just look at how for example the Last Jedi bothered some Star Wars fans with Luke’s characterization after the joyful end to the original trilogy.

HARD ACT TO FOLLOW & DIVISIVE FANDOM MOMENTS

Now, even if G5 had none of the pre-conditioned concerns it would have a lot to live up to. G4 is the absolute highest peak MLP has ever gotten to. Hasbro’s going to try to repeat the same success but it’s a lot more likely G4 remains a lightning in a bottle that can’t be repeated. And any attempt to recapture that lightning such as applying G4 as the ancient past is looking to backfire. It’s very likely that even if G5 is generally a success, Hasbro will not reap the same benefits that it got from G4. The cost of a big success is the pursuit of attempting to repeat that success but ultimately not working out quite the same way. I don’t wish any ill will of Generation 5, I want it to have an audience and the staff to enjoy themselves working on the show. I don’t think it will quite capture the same attention I gave to G4 but that’s ok. This is how Hasbro’s operated for decades, as I’m sure Transformers fans have gone through the same feeling.

There are shows that have maintained fandoms for years despite the show having ended more then 10 years ago. I don’t think Friendship is Magic is going to be forgotten anytime soon. There are sure to be clashes about G5 in the coming years as it’s impossible to control an entire fandom that will have it’s vocal parts at eachother’s throats. But I don’t plan on looking down on anyone who ends up enjoying G5, I hope in some way there are those who may enjoy G5 as much as we did G4. And also for said G5 fans to respect those who continue to do mainly G4 content. I plan to give G5 a chance to grow on me, I just know the G4 is the past concept is going to somewhat bother me in a similar way to how for a long while Starlight’s lack of a full-fledged backstory prevented me from looking at her character with nothing but lukewarm feelings (Until I expanded on her myself in a story after the show’s ending). But just like with Starlight I don’t plan to rain on the parade of those who did end up liking Starlight. Especially considering I’m probably among the fans that were on the other side of those arguments as someone who liked the idea of Alicorn Twilight despite how divisive it was. I’ve been somewhat on both sides of different controversies in G4’s time itself. As G4 itself had it’s own divisive parts in it’s own history. Arguably, G5 being the distant future makes it just another part of those fandom controversies.

Though even with everything that happened a positive side of all of those is there were many fans invested one way or another to get heated about the show. Not saying it’s a good thing to have fans at each other’s throats but it’s part of G4’s legacy that people cared when something disappointed them. I think while there were certainly a good number of fans that left the fandom over certain stuff especially in regards to Season 3 and the first Equestria Girls. Those who stayed generally still had good things to look forward to. I myself kind of feel like Starlight’s reformation was the closest to a jump the shark moment where Season 6 failed to capitalize on nearly all it’s opportunity of what Season 5 laid up for the show’s future. But there were still good episodes in Season 6, Season 7 had some pretty great episodes, Season 8 is a bit of a mixed bag but even that had it’s fun parts, and I’m on the side that I’m happy with how the final episodes of Season 9 finished off the show. I don’t think Starlight’s reformation was a point where the show never reached another high point and I’m happy it was successful enough to get a conclusive ending rather then either getting canceled after a finale that didn’t leave things off with a proper goodbye or ending too early. As if the show had not been as popular as it did, Magical Mystery Cure would of been the series finale. I’m actually one of those who loved MMC, but for the show not to get things like the CMC’s cutie marks and just leave things that Twilight is a princess and that’s it certainly would of been way too soon of an ending.

CONCLUSION

Obviously, the staff seemed to plan for more then 9 seasons as no doubt they probably had more plans for the Student 6 and/or Cozy Glow had they gotten the green light for Season 10 or more. But for what it’s worth, it still got an conclusion that not all cartoons like this get. For all it’s ups and downs, MLP retained my interest for the entire run that I started watching and I still intend to do fan content about it’s characters a few years after it ended, so G4 MLP continues to be retained in a special place in my heart. Perhaps that’s a big reason I have the concerns about G5 that I do that I’m attached to that universe and for it to say things go downhill even if it’s not really the fault of the Mane 6 or anything makes it hard to accept very easily. I do think my concerns about the G4-G5 connection have merit either way, but I will repeat that I don’t wish any ill will on G5. Whether fair or not, G5 has a lot to live up to after the success of G4 and the consequences will be there for fan expectations. I hope it finds a decent enough audience regardless, and I hope that if I try to ignore the baggage of the implications of an Ancient G4 Equestria being part of this that maybe there’s something there for me too. I never thought I’d be invested so much in a cartoon about magical talking horses to this point a long time ago, but gosh darn it G4 managed to do so. And the staff behind G5 will have a lot on their shoulders to try to maintain that interest. Even if that task is impossible, I hope they try their hardest. Even if I’m not as invested into this generation, I want to be able to respect a good try.

[jonthethinker]

I’m always delighted to read meta people write about moral complexity concerning the characters presented to us in Critical Role. It’s due in no small part to how beautifully and astutely written these pieces are, and with how much care and tenderness people treat the subjects of their analysis.

But it’s also interesting in another way, because it shows me how differently I view the fundamentals of morality from the characters, the cast, and majority of the fandom itself.

And since I’m feeling very self-indulgent today, I’ve decided to write about how and why under the cut.

To begin our discussion, let’s use a rather popular subject on the topic of moral ambiguity: Essek Thelyss. He’s a fascinating character for many reasons, but our interest is in his choices and the consequences there in.

It’s discovered by the Nein that Essek is responsible for the theft of the Luxon Beacons and their acquisition by the Cerberus Assembly, which is believed to be the main crux of the war between the Dynasty and the Empire. He admits to them he did this because he felt his people were blinded by a faith that prevented them truly understanding what the Beacons were and how they worked, and so an alliance was formed with the Assembly in order to finally gain that understanding.

The only thing that really made him doubt this decision was his budding friendship with the Mighty Nein, not the war he helped start or the people harmed in the process, but that the people he had grown to care for had been caught up in his machinations to acquire knowledge; again, it’s not the moral or social implications of his actions that bother him, it’s strictly the personal ones.

And this is where the distinctions between my moral understanding and that of  others begins to display itself. Others see this as a moral development on Essek’s part, and a sign that he is growing in a more positive direction. I somewhat disagree. I see it as a sign that he can grow, but while the soil has become fertile ground, no buds have broke the surface yet.

Goodness, according to my own moral compass, comes from two basic notions; compassion and humility. Compassion to care for those you gain nothing from caring for, and humility to place yourself less and less at the center of importance in the grand scheme of things. This doesn’t mean devoting yourself so much to others that you don’t take care of yourself, but that you are okay with being intermittently uncomfortable and taking risks if it means others are taken care of. And humility doesn’t mean you think yourself unimportant, but that you are a part of something larger and grander that you are on your own.

Essek cares about the Mighty Nein. That shows that he can care about people outside of himself, but not very far outside of himself. They are his friends, and friends and family are, to our minds at least, extensions of ourselves; they rest against the bubble of self, and are often a huge part of how we even define and understand ourselves as individuals in the first place. Very selfish people can be very protective of the friends they have, because to a selfish person, there is very little difference between person and property; you are what you own, and your friends belong to you. Essek is, of his own admission, a very selfish person. So caring about his friends isn’t really some moral stride in the right direction, but more of an indication that he can care about others, but only in so far as they are of value to him directly.

But why is Essek the way he is? Many in the fandom say it’s because of his status as a prodigy, and the pressure that has placed on him over the course of his entire life. The expectations placed upon him are enormous, and he simply can not fail to meet them.

But that’s not really the full story. Because what most people seem to fail to include in their calculations is Essek’s class position; He is nobility, and unconsecuted nobility at that, and we’ll get to why that matters shortly.

Essek has been sheltered and protected from every hardship the average person of Xhorhas experiences. There has never been a single moment in Essek’s life where his material well-being has been in question. Not one time. While the pressures to succeed have been great, he’s also been given nearly every single tool he’s needed to do so. No doubt he received the sort of high quality education most folks couldn’t begin to comprehend, all while having the backing of his Den and the Dynasty at large to guarantee any actual failure has no real bite. When our goblin friend Zorth of Asarius fails at his job, a moorbounder snacks on one of his limbs. When Essek fails, maybe it causes some frustration and some momentary tension for his Den, but his relative social position and quality of life stays the same.

Seeing as he is unconsecuted, he’s never even had to start his life as someone with less than he has now. Skysibil Abrianna Mirimm started her current life as a goblin, and according to the Explorers Guide to Wildemount, has lead to many a whispered jest or cruel remark among the other members of the court, and because she’s had this experience, she’s grown a greater appreciation for the “beastfolk” as a broader sect of their society. Essek has had no such experience to open his eyes to the broader experiences of the public. He’s been insulated from the core features of many people’s daily realities in a way that virtually guarantees he feel nothing but disinterest at best and utter disgust at worst in regards to the trials of others.

This is not to take away from his agency, and to say it’s not his fault. His brother Verin by all indications experienced the same sort of life he did, but is an acclaimed leader and has very much humbled himself to a cause greater than his own ambitions, that being justice and honor for his people. So it would seem it is both his circumstances and his reaction to these circumstances that have affected who he has become, and what tools he has at his disposal to change that.

And to continue this thread for a moment, it would behoove me not to mention an incredible important aspect of Essek’s class position, and that is the power that comes with that. Anyone in Xhorhas could have had the same notions about the Luxon as he does. Anyone of them could have had the same grand sense of self-importance. For instance, Vendalla the housekeeper could secretly believe all the same things about how the Luxon religion is blinding the masses and holding back the Dynasty from realizing its true potential. The difference is she, unlike Essek, isn’t one of the handful of people that can act on that belief.

I feel this is where a rather stark divergence forms between my own sense of morality and that of others, and it’s my belief that systems and power structures are far more important in understanding the moral implications of a thing, and not individual belief, intent, or inclination.

To better explain where I’m headed, let’s use an analogy of sorts. When you think of yourself, if you’re like most people I know, “you” as an entity are independent from your body. You might think of yourself as a soul or maybe “you” are your brain or a consciousness piloting your body, but your body is ultimately seen as something “you” control.

But for me this isn’t the case at all. In fact, I don’t only believe you are also your body, I believe that yourself actually extends beyond you into the environment around you. You are not you without the many sensations and feed-backs, and sometimes lack there of, that your body produces, in response to the material reality around you. You would not be you with your brain in the body of nineteenth century Chinese peasant farmer or the body of a crusading knight in the twelfth century. You are defined by the context in which you exist.

And this extends further. I don’t believe people are independent ideological actors acting solely on their beliefs and feelings about the world. We are not independent of the context in which we exist. For the most part, your context does a lot more to shape your ideology than your ideology will ever shape your context. It’s quite the herculean task to think your way out of poverty. And it’s certainly a difficult proposition for a rich person to develop an ideology that doesn’t support them continuing to hold onto their wealth. These things can happen, for sure, but because of the broader systems and incentives at play, to expect people to just choose to swim up stream without also creating new systems and incentives to encourage that is bananas to me.

This is not to imply there is no such thing as agency, but your material conditions and social position are going to heavily influence the degree to which you can make decisions. The higher your class, the more choices you can make. The more hegemonic your ethnic group or race or gender or sexual orientation, the more options you will have, but also the weaker your incentives are to try and change that. That’s why social movements are generally comprised of the sufferers and not the sympathizers. The greatest allies don’t arise just because they believe something is right or wrong, but because they have humbled themselves before the size of the cause and have faith that their effort will support something much bigger and more important than their comfort and position.

These people are exceptionally rare for a reason; because it’s hard to do that. This isn’t a moral judgement on the people who don’t do that, quite the opposite; they are fish swimming down stream with the current instead of against it. If you want people to swim the other way, you don’t scold them into trying to swim harder; you make it easier. You change the current. And this is a task that you can’t do alone. You have to do it in a coordinated way, in disciplined unison with others. That’s why every major change the world has ever seen has largely been the result of pressure from movements not individual actors, and why the most successful movements are composed of the broadest base of sufferers, generally in the form of a broad working class struggle.

People in this fandom and many other fandoms try to be good. They try to believe the right things, and like the right things, and say the right things. But their power comes not from their individual beliefs, but through their combined action with others, joining together to change the current, and their faith that even though they may not get to personally feel the current shift, they were an integral part of that process. And it pains my heart that most of them can’t see that.

You see this in the Mighty Nein. They all struggle so much with their own sense of self-worth in comparison to their friends. They’re all worried they’re only worth as much as their latest contributions. The problem is that they define themselves as something separate from the Nein. Could someone who they see as contributing more than they have, have done so without the backbone of support they receive from all the others? No. None of them would have gotten far without the broader system of support they have developed for each other. They have shifted the current, changed the incentives. No person is exists in a vacuum. Our context shapes our possibilities. Want to change the available options? Change the context. And you can’t do it alone.

So if Essek is to truly get better, he needs more than just the Nein’s friendship. He needs the system they’ve developed. And that system is going to have to work hard against the many currents that flow through Essek’s life. They will have to change his incentives.

But the question is, do they want to? Most of the Nein weren’t mad about the war. If they were mad, it was because Essek lied to them personally. Only Beau seemed particularly interested in the consequences on the broader world, and her response was to try to scold that fish up stream. And it didn’t work. So really, it will be a question of if the Mighty Nein want to even try to push Essek onto a more positive, morally rewarding path, and what incentives they have to do so.

I really hope the small handful of people who read this can take something from all of this. I’m not alone in this outlook, as it has been something that has been contributed to by sufferers and sympathizers alike across history. If even one person walks away from reading this thinking about systems of power more than individual choices and beliefs, I’ll rest easy. Thanks for reading, regardless.

[jedi-order-apologist]

I don't know if you was asked this before, but what you think is the cause of jedi hate being so popular in fandom? I personally think is a mixture of a distate of organizated religion and genuine belief of sidious's lies.

I do have a few ideas as to why the fandom is particularly and uniquely uncharitable towards the Jedi Order.

The biggest reason, I think, is the tendency for people to assume the worst of characters they can’t relate to. I’ve seen this in other fandoms with reserved characters (and to some degree in real life, too), and with the Jedi we have an entire culture that’s reserved and values this personality. It’s a combination of culture clash, and of most of the audience just not being able to relate to or connect to these characters at all - they find them cold and aloof and weird and unfeeling and repressed. As someone who’s also been called a few of those things when I don’t intend to come across that way, I can see why these terms might get applied to the Jedi even though I don’t see them like that, and I don’t think they were intended to be seen like that (since Lucas also comes across on the reserved side tbh).

Falling for Palpatine’s manipulations is absolutely a big part of it as well. Many Jedi-critical arguments are paraphrased from Palpatine’s talking points on-screen and in expanded material, if it’s not almost word-for-word. It’s a great testament to his charisma and effectiveness as a villain, but unfortunately the fact that he’s not exactly a reliable source gets lost in the fandom repetition as context is stripped out. It’s easy for the fandom to echo things like “the Jedi don’t appreciate Anakin” when they leave out that Palpatine’s statements like this were a deliberate part of an abuse tactic to isolate Anakin and undermine his support structure, that he was deliberately stirring up tensions between Anakin and the Council by putting him front-and-center in his power play over them.

I agree that anti-religious sentiment is a part of it as well, and to some degree it’s an extension of my first point about people assuming the worst of people they can’t relate to. We’re used to seeing organized religion as the bad guy these days, and there’s a tendency for people to want to shape their interpretation into that mold. People have been making good points on my earlier post - a lot of it is coming from a Western Christianity-dominant bias, with people incorrectly assuming all religions work like their own experiences with it (there’s also, I think, a misconception that the Jedi were based on any one particular religion, when in fact they’re an amalgamation and should be looked at for what they are, not how accurately they reflect particular real-world religions) I’ve wondered before if regional fandoms outside of the West are far more Jedi positive, if anti-Jedi sentiment even exists there.

Contrarianism plays a role, too. I’ve never been in a fandom where there wasn’t a group of fans seemingly hellbent on proving that the heroes were just as bad, if not worse than the villains, twisting whatever context they need to to make that work. They want the heroes to be the bad guys. There’s a misconception that “greyer is automatically deeper” where people find any reason to tear down the good guys and justify the bad guys because that's the "smart" reading, missing that a uniform grey isn't actually more nuanced just because it's not black or white, especially when it's slapped on with no regard for the actual context. Sometimes you can look at the black and white and see the nuance and variation and shades, and still come away with black and white on the whole.

Those, in my opinion, are the most fundamental reasons people are so uncharitable towards the Jedi - it then gets exacerbated through a feedback loop of these uncharitable assumptions feeding into some of the expanded material which then feed into other expanded material and those all then fueling anti-Jedi sentiment further by giving something for those people to point to to say “see? Look how flawed and bad and wrong the Jedi were, here’s proof!” even if it was an invention of the expanded material, working backward from an already-made conclusion that was informed by things not necessarily reflected or intended by the source films. (Which is not to say, of course, that the expanded material is bad - I enjoy some of it myself and those stories obviously have value to people and I wouldn’t want to take away from that. People can have their uncharitable interpretations if they like - I just wish that wasn’t seen as the default or intended reading by the fandom).

[piccolina-mina]

I have very mixed feelings about the sudden policing of shows and movies for casting “teen” romantic leads whose actors have an age difference. Whether you like it or not, this is how Hollywood works.

Yes, adults are usually cast to play teens to get around working hours, child labor laws and schooling. Yeah, there is something to say about the disproportionate casting of mostly older guys as teens when casting actual teens as female leads.

And yeah, in the past 40 years of film and television some of it has been downright disturbing, but there’s the almost irksome tone policing that’s happening now where we’re hyper-critical of works where romantic leads have real life age differences between actors, even when the actors are both legal, and even when the characters they’re playing don’t have an age gap. 

And people being told they can’t promote or enjoy a work’s in canon love story because of the age difference between the actors portraying the characters. And even comparing or accusing shows who happen to have this type of casting and who have a love story as essentially peddling kiddie/philia, and I just cannot … I can’t. Sorry. No.

Things aren’t taken into consideration such as typically an entire story may be written before casting even happens. Sometimes casting the right person for the role will include someone who isn’t the same age as the character. This is how the acting field functions, and within reason, this is something that all actors, including the young ones and their parents are aware of etc.

I do find it interesting and have noticed an unfortunate pattern that folks are particularly critical of this when it comes to young actors of color as romantic leads, and it doesn’t sit well. Because while the concerns are valid and shouldn’t be discounted, only being this consistently vocal about it to the point of policing fandom and chastising and discouraging fans from daring to enjoy a ship between the CHARACTERS … there’s a lot to unpack there too.

I’ve seen this recently with Never Have I Ever. Maitreyi Ramakrishen is 18, and Darren Barnet is 29. Yeah, no lie, it is hella weird even within the context of the show because of Devi actively seeking out a physical relationship and also Darren LOOKS like a 30 year old man.

I saw it with The Sun is Also a Star with Yara Shahidi and Charles Melton who are like a decade apart in age. But was something I didn’t notice while watching at least.

But I’m also seeing this with Julie and the Phantoms. The show could not get more wholesome and chaste. The romance between Julie and Luke is innocent pining, but folks are still super worked up about Madison being 16 and Charles being 21, and you would think the characters got it on with no clothes in the backseat of a Volvo or something. And I’m just trying to understand what the guidelines are now.

Because there are DEFINITELY some fkd up and problematic age gaps. Brooke Shields’ mother basically p*mped her daughter out doing films like Pretty Baby. It’s grotesque and should be criminal. She was 14 doing s*x scenes. Simonetta Stefanell was 16 doing them and playing Al Pacino’s wife in The Godfather. Kristen Stewart, Drew Barrymore, Jennifer Lawrence, Dakota Fanning (ironically with Stewart) and more have definitely been in some questionable roles doing questionable things with questionable age differences.

But then, specifically teen stuff we’ve collectively enjoyed is open to critique, no doubt, but it’s also not dissected the same way or has the same expectations? And I don’t know.

No one batted an eye over 19 year old Tyler Posey paired with 26 year old Crystal Reed, and it definitely didn’t discourage anyone from enjoying their ship…

Trina Mcgee was 28 when she started playing Angela Moore on Boy Meets World and was even expecting at some point, and Rider was 17, but we weren’t discouraged from enjoying Shawngela (because of that anyway 😒).

Mila Kunis was 15 on That 70s Show with a 20 year old Ashton Kutcher.

Selena Gomez was 16 and Drew Seeley was 26 in Another Cinderella Story.

Andrea in the original BH90210 was in her 30s.

Taylor Momsen was 13 on Gossip Girl (still weird AF casting choice honestly) With 19 and 22 year olds over time.

Claire Danes was 14 to Leonardo Dicaprio’s 22 in Romeo and Juliet. And to 21 year old Jared Leto (which eww) in My So Called Life.

Lyndsy Fonseca was 14 with a 25 year old costar playing teen love interest on Y&R

Peyton Kennedy was like 15 with Sydney Sweeney being 22 years old in Everything S*cks.

Mischa Barton was 17 The O. C. with 24 year old Ben Mckenzie.

And Sasha Pieterse was 14 made out with 23 year old Shay Mitchell in PLL.

Cobra Kai, which is two seasons in now, has a love triangle between Sam, Mary Mouser who is 24, Diego, Xolo who is 19, and Tanner Buchanan who is 21.

I’m not arguing that people shouldn’t feel some kind of way about some casting choices or aren’t entitled to feel a certain way about this. I’m not even arguing that Hollywood doesn’t have an issue here because they clearly do as evidenced by examples above.

But I’m just genuinely trying to understand where we’re expected to be as consumers and fans of fictional works, characters, and relationships (again, within reason) if we’re not allowed (by public opinion and fandom space) to enjoy the fictional stories and relationships, romantic or otherwise because of casting choices…

Because I’ll admit, Devi and Paxton on Never Have I Ever was distracting as hell because Darren has like crow’s feet and everything and doesn’t pass as a teenager even by the absurd tv standards, so I couldn’t get into the pairing.

But I’ve been a diehard Shawngela fan for years, and that age gap between the actors didn’t deter me back then and it still doesn’t now.

And imagine my surprise when I bingewatched one of the most wholesome shows of this godforsaken year only to discover it’s now wrong to enjoy two adorable teens singing to each other lovingly and hugging because apparently there’s a five year age gap between the actors playing them and therefore it’s problematic to like the fictional pairing.

Like, I guess this is controversial, but Tumblr, I’m tired.