#this goes for queer ships too

[atlasshrugd]

no but the thing is, when the hero falls in love with the villain she is falling in love with the darkest parts of herself. she is owning her shadow and the owning makes her stronger. it is not about whether a ship is toxic or romanticising abuse because it’s not about two individuals. the struggle is not one between two people, just like the love is not between two people. when the hero falls in love with the villain she is loving herself. when she loves herself she is stronger, better, able to transform darkness instead of running from it. at the moment of loving, a person changes. the loved changes. and the love of the villain changes the hero. it’s all about this, don’t you see?

[queeringclassiclit]

Victor Frankenstein & Henry Clerval

from Frankenstein by Mary Shelley

[3gremlins]

me: i care less about dragon age now, it's been almost decade, i am tired.

*a few crumbs of dragon age news*

THE BEACONS ARE LIT! GONDOR THEDAS CALLS FOR AID DISCOURSE!

[thereareeyesinsidethetrees]

stan: how can you be polyamorous and aroace, or…whatever mabel called it?

ford: in my case, i have my family and i have my platonic polycule. i would prefer to never have to interact with anyone outside these two groups

stan: what about soos and wendy? they’re not in either of those groups

ford: first of all, i am soos’ uncle, second of all, are you saying you don’t believe i would both die and kill for wendy?

stan: you’ve got a weird way of defining family, six

ford: it’s my favorite way

[sysig]

Went absolutely feral on WOY again recently (Patreon)

[buckymilf]

.

[theophagie-remade]

Not sure whether this can be considered a hot take or whatever but something that I really dislike is that there really doesn't seem to be a distinction between fanbase and fandom in many people's minds anymore, which is really grating because you'll see comments from self proclaimed fandom members like "I like [thing] but I'm not one of those crazies who care about ships lol, weirdos 🤪". Because shipping is one of the core elements of fandom, so if you really can't stand it that much maybe the problem lays within the fact that you entered a community that does not fit you

(Which isn't to say that you have to ship something, anything, to be a fandom member, but accepting the existence of shipping as a common practice should be the minimum lol)

[laverrez]

Get a fucking life, you queerphobic asshat.

I'm very queerphobic. I'm the most queerphobic person around. Every character I've ever had is ridiculously queer and I hate all of them. I hate my genderqueer, grayromantic, homosexual self. I hate all my queer friends (because none of them at all are cishet). I hate everything queer. I even hate rainbows, because they remind me of queer.

It's so funny that you guys see me critique a queer relationship/character and say shit like this without even looking at my content or my page, generally, but *you* specifically had to, to make an ask, and you glazed right over the "they/them" pronouns in my about. I guess it isn't queer enough of me to be openly, happily nonbinary.

What would you say if you knew I shipped Winter and Glynda? What would you say if you knew I shipped *Ruby* and Glynda? Weiss and Glynda? Willow and Glynda? More female characters with Glynda than I can count, and only one single male character? It doesn't matter if my top Blake ship is Monochrome, though, because it isn't Bees, and therefore is incredibly queerphobic.

I'll get a life when you move out of your mom's basement, babe. Have a nice day.

[murcielagatito]

barbara and gerald are so queerplatonic like just look at them they love eachother so much and have kids together and live together and eat cute lil lunches together that is a gay husband and his lesbian wife and they love eachother so much. like ugh <3

[evansboyfriend]

few months ago i met a woman on hinge who's writing an og m/m romance comic and when we got to talking about it and we both pointed out the abundance of women creating m/m content, whether fanworks or original things, and talked about the why behind it all, and she said something about the ease that comes from the detachment of it all, speaking as two queer women, when you're working with two male characters that don't force you to confront your own sexuality, your own history, your own gender identity, and i said you know what, i get it. it just made sense, she didn't have to spell it out for me. in that moment i felt seen.

a relationship that only features men can very much be a safe space for women, especially queer women (i'm not gonna talk about it from straight women's pov, because i don't get it, i'll never get it, i'm not straight) who want to read and write queer stories, and more specifically, watch queer stories without having to be subjected to viewing an f/f couple through the fetishising, dehumanising male gaze - and there's so much to be said about existing as a queer woman in a mens' world, and i dare anyone to try to deny that we're still very much living in a mens' world.

i will always defend this space - established by women, mind you, decades ago - and our right to create and enjoy fanworks and exist peacefully, away from the clutches of capitalism, away from made-for-profit, sanitised, family-friendly canon queer ships, where we can take whatever we like from canon and disregard the rest because that's what fandom is, that's what it was built around, where we can find queercoded characters/relationships and analyze the subtext to hell, where we can use characters and ships to uncover and unpack our own issues from a third-person pov because that's what feels safest.

but there needs to be a line that you cannot cross, even as a queer woman, and that line can't ever be defined by us. it's all the things queer men are talking about right now, very clearly expressing their discomfort, very plainly saying that this space - that's centred around a canon, established m/m couple - has become not only unsafe but filled with hatred and vitriol and very real homophobia. it doesn't matter if it's "just a fictional character/couple" - this incident has unveiled a lot of tumblr-girls' homophobia specifically targeted towards mlm, because we've grown a little too fucking comfortable with this 'women-only' space i think.

and i'm so glad to see people pointing out the 'self-insert' trend for the problem it is, when it crosses these boundaries. i'll never make someone feel badly for engaging in self-insert, as long as you call it what it is, because you're using one half of an m/m relationship for it, when instead you could be writing character/reader or character/ofc or character/self fic, because that's what we used to do. that's the first thing i did when i discovered fanfiction, some 15+ years ago. so this behaviour is just... baffling to me. and if you insist on using an m/m ship for it, check yourself and realise it needs to stay in your transformative works, and you need to be ready to re-think and amend your behaviour when it crosses that line.

we are not queer men. we will never know what it is to exist in this world as a queer man, in the same way that queer men won't understand the specific things we as queer women struggle with. and that's okay! we don't have to understand everything down to the finest detail to be open and empathetic and kind to each other. we're in the same fucking community. do better.

+ special mention to this excerpt shared by @canichangemyblogname

from this post

i didn't wanna derail so i made my own post.

[professorcalculusstanaccount]

An AU where Tintin is a crime lord, inspired by @jerseyhobby 's post here!

Detective Rastapopoulus is one of the most brilliant minds in his department. His talent has been long overlooked due to his status as an immigrant, but when a new teenage menace starts to stir up the streets, Rastapopoulus's knack for digging into the murky depths of the criminal underworld is called upon.

His target is only known by his alias, Tintin. At just seventeen he already has a few bank heists, smuggling operations and a chain of illegal clubs under his belt. He operates like a phantom, making himself hardly known. Those who have had business with him never recall him raising his voice, as he simply does not need to. Manners go a long way, and manners are an effective mask for the brutality required to maintain such an operation.

Few are confirmed to know him personally. He has his beloved dog, Snowy, who has a taste for expensive jewelry, and his right hand man, a pickpocket-turned jewel thief he met in Shanghai. Together they are unstoppable, nothing is outside their reach - and when the Karaboudjan, a large shipping vessel goes missing, along with its crew and captain, Rastapopoulus just knows they are involved. If only he can keep his temper and ego in check, he might just be able to finally put an end to Tintin's reign of chaos, and perhaps earn the recognition he so desperately craves.

I think an AU where Tintin uses his abilities for crime would be an interesting way to see how he's impacted people he's met, so for this take I have only inverted Tintin and Rastapopoulos - Haddock is still an honest man, but his vulnerability leaves him open to being manipulated. He becomes Tintin's equivalent to Allan Thompson, only this time motivated by fear for his life rather than money. Alcohol, threats and his rock-bottom self esteem keep him in line.

Calculus is scammed by Tintin for his inventions, leaving him feeling deeply betrayed as he is someone with strong morals. He vows revenge, his tunnel vision leading him down incredibly destructive paths. He was initially targeted by Tintin because he just seemed naive and easy to exploit, but Tintin severly underestimates him, despite Chang's warnings. Not only does Tintin have the law on his tail, but a mad scientist with nothing left to lose, who has access to devastating explosives.

Chang simply wants somewhere he belongs. Canonically he's stolen from cops before, so there's no doubt that if Tintin dragged him into crime he would follow along - but he may start to doubt if their bond is built more on what he can do for him rather than his value as a person.

Rastapopoulos this time gets to use his cunning to catch a slippery crime lord, but he still has the same shortcomings as his canon counterpart. He sorely craves attention and praise. He has a terrible short temper. He craves power and influence. He starts to use increasingly questionable methods for his investigation, as his higher ups breathe down his neck for being incapable of catching a couple of queer teenage hoodlums.

Tintin himself isn't motivated by money or power, he's looking for thrills and control over his life. Canonically he's rather emotionally shut off, and he's no different here. He doesn't let himself get too attached to anyone else. Unlike canon Rastapopoulos, I can imagine a crime lord Tintin pouring money and resources into communities in need, and opening up spaces for marginalised groups like bars for queer people. He still wants to do good deep down, but just doesn't quite believe he is a good person.

[bleedingoptimism]

part one -> 📱💞🚙

The first video goes viral. They get a lot of new traffic on their page, and half of it gets curious about their music, and half of the curious ones even become fans. So the series is already a success with only one video out. 

In the second video, Eddie, still blushing but smiling cheekily introduces Steve, who is all smiles and sunshine wrapped up in muscle and tan skin and people eat it up.

Then the actual process begins, and it's genuinely informative and quite good, Steve really knows what he's doing and he seems to have a passion for it that makes his eyes shine whenever he's explaining to Eddie what they are doing and what for.

It’s also fairly comedic, the series. Eddie keeps tripping all over his own feet making funny remarks to make Steve laugh. They both work on the van, because Eddie wants to get his hands dirty too, so Steve stays close behind, whispering instructions and murmuring praises while he works that have Eddie sweating and blushing from things that are completely unrelated to the manual labor and looking at the camera like he’s in the office.

It becomes kind of a thing because Eddie knows Steve doesn't watch the videos and everyone already knows from the first video that Eddie has a little crush on him. So he thinks it is just innocent fun that when Steve is working and Eddie has the phone in his hands instead of the tripod, he sometimes zooms on his back, his arms, the sweat on his neck, and then back to his face, sighing and shaking his head slowly.

TikTokers even start shipping them, saying Eddie has very clear cat energy and Steve is the most golden retriever boyfriend-coded man on the planet.

But something shifts as the videos go on, Eddie’s quips are less jokey and more just pure admiration for Steve’s work. When they film a time-lapse the audience can see them working together, bumping shoulders, Steve looking at Eddie and looking away when Eddie looks at him. And when Eddie is filming there are no more jokes about him pining on camera. It is just scenes of Steve laughing, or just smiling, working while he whistles. Zooms of his eyes, his nose, the highlights on his hair, the way the moles on his cheek move when he smiles crookedly at something dumb Eddie says.

The whole series becomes a documentary about how Eddie fell in love with Steve and then… it's complete. It's done. The van is finished. Eddie films one last video thanking Steve for everything, and making one last flirty joke about taking him for a ride. Steve laughs and runs a hand through his hair, telling Eddie he’s welcome. And that is it. The series is done. 

It drives everyone insane because they love it of course, but also. Because it seems… unfinished. It's kind of a mess, Corroded fans are fighting the shippers and the shippers are accusing Eddie of queer bating, which he thinks it's fuckin hilarious and sad because it's his literal life they are talking about. 

But the truth is, there’s nothing more to tell. They had a real conversation after Eddie stopped filming, a proper thanks and hug goodbye. And then Steve just left. He never made a move. And Eddie tried, he really tried. He insinuated, flirted, complimented. But Steve was either not interested or completely clueless (probably because of how uninterested he was).

And now Eddie has a beautiful van, completely equipped for two people to travel in style. And no one to share it with. So he stays at home, wrapped up in a blanket and watching the comments on his tiktoks, laughing and then crying with the way people describe how palpable their chemistry is. And he misses Steve. He keens, he pins, he craves.

part three ->📱💞🚙

☕🥐💕 coffee? by the side of the road?

[clownowo]

I love inventing terrible in universe fandom drama.

Gavintwt fell into a couple months of terrible discourse about Klavier’s sexuality. people argue about whether he's gay or just queerbaiting and then people argue about how this is invasive actually and real people can't queerbait and Klavier is just openly queer the whole time with a song literally titled "my boyfriend is the prosecution's witness". blissfully unaware.

There's a trend of Gavinner stans committing crimes or messing with crime scenes just to be prosecuted/called as a witness by Klavier. he has to put out a formal statement imploring his fans to pursue other methods of getting his attention:

just. please. stop. please.

A few years after the disbarment someone digs up an old viral post that's like

📖 tilthat February 15, 2018 TIL that during a case in 2016, a defense attorney cross-examined a parrot during the final day of court. The defense won the case. 🐢 tortise-law February 15, 2018 Sit your ass the hell down this motherfucker's name is fucking Phoenix Wright and you don't understand how fucking batshit that case is. He was defending prosecutor Miles Edgeworth, who he had previously DESTROYED THE PERFECT RECORD OF. And it STARTS with Wright proving a witness didn't actually see the murder because they were searching for the goddamned Loch Ness Monster. And not only that, the case ends with him ACCUSING THE OTHER PROSECUTOR, MANFRED VON KARMA, OF ORCHESTRATING THE WHOLE MURDER AND KILLING EDGEWORTH'S FATHER. AND HE WAS RIGHT???? LIKE???? 🎩 gay-ramarye February 16, 2018 holy shit reading this guy's wiki page is a fucking trip. not only does he have a perfect win record, that defendant immediately followed this up with FAKING HIS OWN DEATH??? spacejamminninja-deactivated2018 February 16, 2018 How is this not a tv show already. What the hell do you mean he faked his death 🪶 is-the-hawk-video-cute February 17, 2018 tbh if my defense attorney cross examined a parrot and accused the opposing counsel i'd fake my death too 🌸 pinkprincess February 18, 2018 japanifornia cases are just Like That i have never heard of a normal one.

and gavinblr suddenly realizes that that was the dude Klavier got DISBARRED a couple years ago. viral sensation parrot cross-examiner Phoenix Wright. the fandom goes crazy for a few days but then Klavier does a new photoshoot and they all move on.

A post joking about shipping Klavier’s brother with the guy Klavier got disbarred becomes a huge meme in gavinblr and a subsection begins writing ironic Krisnix RPF that progressively becomes genuine and then turnabout trump happens and the fandom explodes again. Half the Krisnix shippers jump ship to Klapollo because they felt weird about shipping a murderer (and did you SEE the Kitaki case? Klavier was sooo flirting with the defense <3). The other half doubled down and reveled in the angst potential. Part of the Klapollo shippers started truthing. They study court transcripts to prove that Klavier and Apollo are in love if not already dating. Unfortunately they’re right.

[invested-in-your-future]

"but it's realistic that they would breakup"

Not the point.

"But they had a lot of trauma the re-"

Also not the point.

"But at least she's a-"

Absolutely not the point.

Y'all trying to justify a narrative choice from within the narrative constraints.

That's a mistake.

Just like how many people never understood why so many would pick Bae ending, so many people just don't seem to get what the pairing meant overall.

Y'all realise what this pairing meant to people when it came out?

Despite the issues with the ending, the adoration and love the pairing has to this day has been earned by the game - it's inseparable from the franchise and it's reception.

It wasn't just another pairing. It wasn't just something that existed as bait or something within fanon or something developers never committed to.

Through the years plenty of ships get baited disingenuously while throwing the audience nothing but breadcrumbs - for example the disaster of Sherlock fandom, the mess with Supernatural, Teen Wolf, Voltron and so on. Or the way Blake/Yang in RWBY were the most blatant baiting that got no on-screen development(despite all the setup that show ignored for years) till the moment the show literally was getting axed and they wanted to milk LGBTQ+ community for money one last chance, skipping all the development to characterization characters deserve and attempting to bribe LGBTQ+ community with breadcrumbs at the last possible second.

And some shows would stumble into something important but fail to realise it and thus end up squashing it - ask Buffy fans about Tara and Willow or The 100 fans about clexa.

There were LGBTQ+ pairings in video games too but rarely they would be so front and center and very often would be playersexual.

This wasn't what Life is Strange ended up being.

Life Is Strange, at the very core is about queer experience - about fitting in, about making connections in the world that rejects you, about finding beauty in the life that hates and hurts you - Max and Chloe's relationship is the key to the entire game.

For some that meant letting go but for others? It gave the chance to fight a trope no matter what and to get an ending, albeit flawed, where a WLW pairing they liked can be happy and face the future together.

People lived through those two characters and their experiences finding something genuine to relate to.

Max and Chloe were that generation's Korra/Asami, Willow/Tara, etc.

Even DONTNOD recognised that in the end and treated it with respect.

Double Exposure might not pull a BYG outright but it sure does everything to kill the happy memories a fandom made about the pairing - to go back through every single ray of sunshine one ending got and subvert it, taint it, reject it.

Picking the Bae choice when playing Double Exposure is the Narrative constantly telling you how wrong you were to expect happiness when you picked the ending where the pairing is intact and how acshually it isn't intact!

It doesn't kill the characters but it sure goes an extra mile to kill what those characters MEAN to the audience.

Realism, plausibility and so on come after - it's what a writer does when they decide on a path. A writer doesn't just do something because it makes sense and is out of their control - they decide to do it and then make it make sense. Whether they succeed or not depends on how good a writer is.

Double Exposure isn't the story about a breakup. It isn't the story about two women dealing with their trauma.

Double Exposure treats an iconic pairing people cared about as a backstory element - nothing more.

Deck Nine expects the audience to accept what happened and move on to shiny new cast and possible new LIs.

The writers of Double Exposure are telling you - "look, this doesn't matter. Now here's a new mystery you can solve and new cast and look Max is back and you liked using her powers right? Use powers to do stuff."

To this developer team the core element of what made the franchise so important to its audience is nothing more than a leftover plot thread to "write around".

Because to these writers queer experience apparently starts and stops with searching for a relationship - someone being in a relationship that's not part of the story or someone being comfortable NOT being in a relationship at all just don't exist.

What Deck Nine writers seem to be doing is treating it as disposable or interchangeable/replaceable, while also inadvertently tainting whatever comes after with fandom rage.

The worst thing that can happen to a new character is being "the next love interest" - because people channel their frustrations towards the character (or in some worst cases, please don't do this, the actor).

Where there was an iconic part of the franchise Double Exposure, intentionally or not, sets up a toxic battle ground.

That's the point - treating LGBTQ+ audience as sales numbers, manipulating us, treating something that has been a formative experience to so many lives as disposable, or worse yet - malleable.

(And yes there's also a wider issue with Deck Nine and the working conditions there, misogyny, the nazi imagery and the rest but I don't think this is that disconnected from that? How they treat their audience and subject matter is a reflection of culture inside.)

[blossomthepinkbunny]

Vivzepops fetishization of queer men and the lack of Sapphic content in HH and HB

I found it a bit dissapointing that Charlie and Vaggie had very little interactions that could be read as romantic or sexual, especially since they are the supposedly the main couple of Hazbin Hotel and have been together the longest out of most of the couples in HH and HB.

Of course having more casual representation is also fine but the most memorable thing about their relationship was the quickly resolved argument they had when Charlie found out about Vaggies past. I've seen different opinions about how they were handled as a pair.

I understand when someone says that they enjoyed a more relaxed couple with subtle, realistic interactions, interactions that are often overlooked just because both characters are female.

But I can also agree, that they were really not a stand-out couple (wich is weird since Charlie is the main Character) and that it was a bit dissapointing to not see a lot of content for them.

Now the main issue I found with this is that in Vivzepops stories there is a definitive lack of sapphic content. It sometimes seems like women are sexless unless they are with a man. But two men can be sexual and openly affectionate (romantically too). At first I didn't really understand why I felt weird about Chaggie as a couple, so I looked at all the implied/canon ships in Helluva and Hazbin (including past relationships).

Implied/canon couples between a man and a woman:

-Millie and Moxxie

-Blitzø and Verosika

-Stolas and Stella

-Millie and Chaz

-Beelzebub and Vortex

-Sir Pentious and Cherry Bomb

-Adam and Lute

-Lucifer and Lilith

Implied/canon couples between two men:

-Stolas and Blitzø

-Asmodeus and Fizzarolli

-Moxxie and Chaz

-Angel Dust and Husk

-Vox and Valentino

Implied/canon couples between two women:

-Charlie and Vaggie

Now please tell me if I missed any, but these were the ones I could think of.

Honorable mentions include Loona & Vortex, Blitzø & Striker, Blitzø & Chaz and Blitzø & Fizzarolli. But I didn't put these on there because they're either one-sided or don't have enough romantic content.

Now it's very easy to see the difference between representation for queer men in comparison to queer women in these shows. The only relevant (im not counting Background characters) Sapphic relationship there is, is Chaggie. And it's completely underrepresented when compared to the content the man x woman or man x man ships get (not to mention the total absence of gender-queer characters).

One of Millie's and Moxxie's jokes is that they're so in love, that they're almost always cuddling, holding hands, talking sweet or just straight up making out with eachother (I'll talk about Millie a bit later). Sir Pentious had multiple scenes dedicated to him trying to confess to Cherry Bomb or just crushing on her in general.

Stolas' and Blitzø's relationship has become one of the main topics of Helluva Boss and they get a Backstory and explicit aswell as dramatic scenes for them as a couple. The same goes for Asmodeus and Fizzarolli (except that their love isn't as important). Angel Dust and Husk get a song and part of an episode for their relationship to develop.

Here i'd also have to mention that by the list I made Vivzepop's fetish for queer men is very prevalent. Most of the couples between men and women are either past relationships or they get very little attention to them. The only ships that often get special focus, development or explicitly romantic/sexual focus are ships with two men (no matter if their dynamics are even good, healthy etc.).

Now for Millie there are different ways you could talk about her situation with relationships. In general I think that everyone can agree that Millie lacks Character and is a good representation for the neglect of the female characters. Most of her moments revolve around Moxxie in a way and she hasn't had precise characterization so far.

Millie's relationship with Moxxie is sweet and simple and is generally one of the better things about Helluva Boss (if you ignore Millies lack of personality wich really pulls the couple down for me). Now the Episode "Exes and Oohs" shows the mutual Ex of Millie and Moxxie. Chaz dated both of them and as we see in the episode affected both of them very negatively. At the start we literally see Millie freak out and destroy a bunch of stuff, just because she saw Chaz on the street.

Yet Millie's relationship with him is never explored further. All we know is that she dislikes him and that he's a giant asshole. Whereas Moxxie get's a whole Backstory and episode plot about him and Chaz. No focus is given to Millie at all even though Chaz is the ex of BOTH of them.

Another thing that I wanna point out is Millie's possible Bisexuality. Now im not so sure for this point because I couldn't find genuine confirmation on wether Millie is actually confirmed to be Bisexual or if it's just a headcannon. So take this with a grain of salt BUT if Millie is Bisexual then she perfectly shows how little Vivzepop cares about Sapphic representation. What does Moxxie get to confirm him as Bisexual? An ex of the same gender (also multiple explicit flashbacks with him), a whole discussion about his queer identity and a scene where he literally says that he's Bisexual. Moxxie is pretty good Bisexual representation in that regard.

What does Millie get? Nothing. Again I don't know if she's genuinely also Bisexual or if it's ever been confirmed but it'd also be pretty weird if Vivzepop apparently cares so much about queer representation and then doesn't confirm any female characters as actually queer.

I think a lot of people have talked about her blatant fetishization of queer men and I think that that's also mainly why I feel weird by the lack of attention on Vaggie and Charlie as a couple.

I sorta wish I could enjoy a more toned-down and realistic couple in these shows, but when I see that a ship like Vox and Alastor (wich isn't canon nor would it even happen since Alastor is Aroace) is talked about more than the actual main character's relationship I just don't like it.

There's so much more you could say about poor queer representation by Vivzepop (like the fact that she's fine with people ignoring Alastors Aroace identity, and the stereotypes etc) I mainly wanted to talk about the neglect of her female cast in terms of sexuality.

[theeggoman]

They are cute together, deal with it. [Rant below]

Drawing black gay teenagers should not be as controversial as the internet has made it into this past week. I am disappointed and frankly grossed out by the harassment gay and black artists are receiving over a cute ship from a cartoon. This is getting absolutely RIDICULOUS. Hobie Brown is a teenager. He was introduced in the Teen Squad with Pav, Miles, and Gwen, who are all confirmed teens. He's inferred to be in a romantic relationship with Gwen, who is confirmed older than Miles but STILL A TEENAGER. Yes he has his own apartment but that may be due to his backstory of losing his parents. Yes he goes to the pub but drinking laws are different in England and he uses his Spider identity to avoid getting carded in the comics. PunkFlower as a ship existed in the comics years before this movie came out. Why is no one showing the same criticism and concern about GWEN and GWEN'S maturity and GWEN'S age as they are Hobie???? Why would the film infer a romantic relationship between Gwen and Hobie if Hobie was an adult??? Everyone needs to examine why they are so adamant that a dark skin black boy with natural hair and African features is "too old" and "too mature" for Miles. You need to examine why you're so against seeing a queer black relationship WHICH IS NOT EVEN CANNON. There are three directors of this film and each of them has stated a different age for Hobie and each of them has said his age is up to our own interpretation. Why are you interpreting him as a grown adult but Gwen Stacy as a child? This whole bullshit thing screams anti-black and anti-gay. I'm a hardcore MilesGwen shipper, but I will continue drawing these two being silly teens going on dates and holding hands because young black gay kids deserve to see themselves represented even if it's only in fannon. They deserve a story that is cute and wholesome and racists on the internet will not ruin it for them. PunkFlower forever.