#star trek and rhetoric

[trek-tracks]

As an English professor who teaches writing and rhetoric, I actually use Kirk, Spock, and McCoy all the time when I'm teaching my students about the balance between Ethos (credibility and authority), Logos (logic and reason), and Pathos (emotion and idealism).

If there's an imbalance or over-reliance on any of them (say, if Kirk uses only his authority as captain as the reason for a decision, if Spock focuses too rigidly on a logical outcome without considering reality, or if McCoy protests too emotionally without examining the bigger picture), the story tends to comment on the resulting errors in judgment and negative consequences.

That's why they're so perfectly positioned to comment on philosophical issues; the ideal is a balance between all three. While it doesn't always lead to a perfect solution (because usually there isn't one), their harmony often gives us one of the better choices. That's also why, in my opinion, the series doesn't work as a balance between Kirk and Spock alone, requiring Kirk, Spock, AND McCoy to reach its full potential.

Basically, if you take my class, you *will* get a Star Trek reference at some point. Whether my students consider that a good thing or not is really up to them. :)

Them: Describe Star Trek: The Original Series in three images.

Me:

[not-equippedforthis]

love how when you're getting into/observing a fandom you barely know you can judge which episodes are The Most because every other fanfic is about them. what happens in Our Man Bashir guys. whats Doctor Bashir I Presume guys. whats Internment Camp 371. guys.

[stonedtrek]

so Riker definitely played in a ska band at the academy right

[punkbxt]

like it or not villains or not the borg WAS sevens family. the borg was ssevens home. seven loved being part of the borg and while seven has immense guilt over what it had to do as a borg, seven learns and grows from that

but the borg were important to seven and the borg made seven feel safe. seven was efficient and capable and a lil bit nonstandard and the borg queen saw potential and power in seven. the borg were THE most important thing in sevens life and it can never be stripped away because the scars go to the bone

the borg is a physical representation of how sometimes things change you and you can NEVER go back to who you used to be because thats not who you are anymore. i can imagine it was extremely painful for seven to have been stripped so heavily of borg components not only in a physical way but an emotional one as well

[nie-narzekam]

Hark who’s talking 😂

(It feels weird being the voice of reason, doesn’t it?)

[bigassbowlingballhead]

Why is book’s ship… so… phallic

[tocourtdisaster]

I’ve watched a lot of Star Trek this year (all of SNW, LD, DS9, and I’m almost done with Enterprise) and I have to get this off my chest.

It annoys the shit out of me when they only give two dimensional coordinates when they’re in a space ship. There are three dimensions in space! Why do they only give X and Y coordinates? Where do they want to be on the Z?

Space is not a flat plane!

[woman-of-many-fandoms]

Wait, we didn't see Spock smiling like that last episode. What happened last episode that would make him start smiling like that??

[pom-seedss]

I chose to be fat. I chose to take medication that had a primary side effect of gaining weight. I chose that over not having medication. When I was starting to gain weight, I had several doctors warn me off of the medication because I was gaining weight. I chose to continue to take the medication.

I wasn't doing it explicitly to be fat, but I chose to become fat none the less. I chose to continue to become fatter as I was being told off for it. It was a choice.

Acting like nobody would ever choose to be fat, makes it seem like a terrible fate worse than any other.

My doctors noticed I was gaining weight and tried to persuade me to go off of the medication that was otherwise saving my life. I had to tell them point blank that I would rather be fat than dead before they would stop hounding me about it.

And frankly, it shouldn't have gotten to that point. My increased weight wasn't affecting my health, I had many lab tests to prove it. But despite this, it was considered a problem because being fat isn't ever something people would choose.

Being fat is fine. Being fat is good. Being fat isn't just some conscripted shameful fate you cannot ever change so you might as well work to accept it. It is glorious and beautiful and amazing.

While I think it is useful for some people to be reminded that bodies are complex and our body shape is often not within our control.... using that to shrug and say "no one would be fat on purpose otherwise" still makes being fat a bad thing. It still paints our natural human variation as an abomination no one desires.

Even if bodies were 100% malleable, we could change them on a whim and we could reshape ourselves however we want: some people would still be fat. Some people would choose to become fat. Some people would actively work towards that state of being because they like it!

it literally HAS to be okay to choose to be fat in order for fat liberation to mean anything at all tbh

[mickstart]

It's SO wild that ds9 was maybe the first star trek media to sit down and say "you know we should really examine the way imperialism and specifically American 'manifest destiny' imperialism is baked into modern American sci-fi to the point we don't even question its presence there even when we're critiquing imperialism itself" and then the new trek that everyone called Woke And Progressive was like "actually imperialism is good BC The Federation is the ONLY way to save the galaxy from primitive savagery." Like episode one of ds9 has a character respond to the traditional sci-fi 'bold new frontier' rhetoric with "this 'wilderness' is my home" and then new trek decided to market one of its shows by putting a white man in a cowboy hat on a horse. Like. Get help.

[myfandomrealitea]

okay, so- this is coming from someone who really hasn't engaged in fandom discourse, especially regarding shipping and such. I dearly hope this doesn't come across as bait or troll, I'm genuinely curious and want to learn. apologies for the possibly-dumb question, but I really just need to ask-

what is proshipping? and what are 'antis'?

you know how it is, when you ask around you always get a biased answer one way or another. "proshippers are pedos" "proshippers all condone incest" "proship Bad and if you interact You Are Bad" (i think these are 'anti' points of view? am i using that term right? that's the rhetoric ive mainly heard). but despite all of that, i don't know if ive ever actually gotten a straight answer as to just.. what it factually is. because it doesn't feel like the sort of thing that you can boil down to insults or accusations or whatnot. it's all just very confusing to me, especially because i come from a place that essentially just told me to avoid like the plague and never look back. sorry, this became a bit of a ramble, lol. thank you so much in advance, i hope i'm not being a bother or insulting with this ^^;

The modern term; 'proship' (s.a; 'proshipping' and 'profiction') is an evolution of an earlier fandom acronym known as: 'SALS.'

Ship And Let Ship

SALS was one of the earliest fandom adoptions and interpretations of the concept of not bullying others for what they shipped or their fandom interests, and not trying to control or dictate what was "allowed" to be shipped or enjoyed. The most notable origin of SALS was during the early years of accessible fandom via Star Trek, and the present homophobia and misogyny in a largely male-dominated community.

As woman became more involved in fandom spaces, the presence of 'other' ships and pairings began to increase. M/M, F/F that wasn't purely for sexual gratification, and M/O and F/O (where 'O' is Other) pairings were popular amongst women, much as they still are today.

Not only did the presence of women in a "male space" receive a not insignificantly negative reaction, so too did them filling the fandom space with their shipping content. Now; sexism and misogyny and homophobia were not entirely to blame. Again as is still very much present today, people simply Did Not Like Certain Ships or Characters. And as they still do today, they'd spread hate about them and to the people who did enjoy them.

Thus: the birth of SALS.

(In other words: I like what I like and it has fuck all to do with you. Shut up and move on.)

Back then, SALS was mostly contained to just that. Ships and characters. Since back in that era 'taboo topics' and 'sexual content' were still pretty covert, people weren't exactly arguing the merits of incest in public forums and at conventions.

However, as all things do, the internet evolved. Society evolved. Media evolved. And so too did 'SALS' evolve in keeping with the new culture and subjects present in fandom spaces.

Suddenly it wasn't just ships and characters to be advocated for. It was themes. Subjects. Kinks. Plots. The more things people found to enjoy, so too did the more things people found to hate.

'Proship' is actually grammatically pro-ship. As in; in support of shipping. This is why I always state that the modern conceptions of proshipping would more accurately be coined profiction. It is no longer just about ships, but fiction as a whole.

However; the core value and sole inherent point of being proship, SALS, profiction and so forth remains exactly the same:

[I/We] believe you have no right to harm others over the [ship/content] they create or consume and [I/we] do not have the right to dictate what is or is not allowed in fandom spaces.

That's it. Don't harass people for what they enjoy fictionally. Don't try to force them into not enjoying or being able to enjoy it.

Of course, the modern adaption varies wildly in terms of 'additional values' thanks to the evolution of the term and what it can encompass. However, there is certainly no obligation to:

Create or consume content you are uncomfortable with.

Create or consume content regarded as 'taboo' or 'triggering.' Such as incest.

Be involved with any aforementioned content beyond turning a blind eye if its not your thing.

Inherently, anyone who says they're 'neutral' on the matter but firmly believes in minding their own business is just a proshipper refusing to use the label if you're taking the term solely at its core value.

In terms of 'antis' they're just the antithesis of the above. Antis are people who generally believe that fiction is irrevocably tied in with who you are, what you believe/condone, and that real-life limitations and values should also apply to fiction.

Although, its is heavy debated and it wildly varies per individual to the degree this is taken.

(E.g: some 'antis' believe you should only write rape fic if you are a victim using it as catharsis or education. Other 'antis' believe there's absolutely no excuse or reason to write rape fic at all.)

Antis typically believe that enjoyment or being invested in content which is regarded as harmful or illegal in real life is morally unsound and reflects that you're a bad or morally unsound person.

Although I disagree, I can honestly say in some aspects I do understand this reasoning. I don't agree, but I do understand why people may come to that conclusion.

As with proshippers, antis vary from people who simply ignore and block content they don't agree with to radicals.

'Anti' is again a prefix. Although modern adoption of the term uses it as a singular signifier, it would grammatically be anti-[fandom], anti-[character], ect. As was commonly used in the past.

The rhetoric that all proshippers are pedophiles or support incest is common-spread and effective 'anti' propaganda. Similar to how so many people believe 'proship' inherently signifies that you must create and/or consume taboo or darker content.

It doesn't.

¹ Proship may also be accurately termed as simply: 'anti-harassment.' ² Its important to note the 'definition' of these terms may vary wildly depending on the individual. However, detailed above is the most historical use and evolution of the terms and their definitions.

[fizzie]

thinking about this scene from star trek beyond where spock saves kirk's life and he asks (rhetorically) "what would i do without you spock"

to which spock responds with: "I...."

and trails off

what the fuck had this bitch, who never shuts up, speechless

BROTHER IN SURAK WHAT WERE YOU GOING TO SAY???

[spn-fanfic-reblog-writes]

Useful reference

Can’t explain it but they’re really cunty in this photo

[tuttle-did-it]

I'm always angry that Janeway wasn't allowed to have a romantic relationship with a woman, but now that I've found out that Kate Mulgrew specifically asked for a same-sex relationship and they refused, I'm extra mad.

Who is responsible? We need to talk.

Quote was from article above.

In case people haven’t looked at the tags, this is a rhetorical question. We all know who is responsible.

EDIT- want to know more about Queering Janeway? I wrote a post about That White Suit in The Killing Game here- https://www.tumblr.com/radarsteddy/715172803725393920/dance-magic-dance-the-white-suit-tho-great?source=share

[rei-ismyname]

X-MEN #7 From The Ashes

Possibly the biggest downside to the circular, repetitive nature of X-Men comics is that real life is awful enough. Jettisoning the hope of the Krakoan age for the misery porn of From The Ashes feels kinda callous and depressing in a world where there are multiple ongoing genocides and the USA just said yes to fascism again. Nevertheless, join me in some light escapism - a little Magneto goes a long way. Spoilers for X-Men #7.

I've also been spelling Jed Mackay's name wrong. Sorry

Running throughout this issue is Magneto's flashback to The Iron Night. The 'this is Logan behaviour' exchange from the previews has been all over my dash and it's great to get more of this dynamic. It's fantastic to see someone in universe say it out loud - Logan is a whiny little bitch, often a hypocrite, and can be blind to his immortality privilege. Scott knows that better than anyone - his wife's boyfriend throws a tanty like no other. They love him, but it's another reason why he's not the best Wolverine. I hope 'Logan behaviour' sticks around in the fandom.

This is Logan behaviour, Idie

I appreciate the informal nature of the Piper discussion. For one, you don't want to scare the kid or make her feel unwelcome. Idie said that she 'couldn't wait for you (Cyclops) and Magneto' re: Idie - having Psylocke be the one to spell it out for her is effective. The X-Men IS a team and the stakes are incredibly high. Besides, as Beast said in my first screenshot they have a Cerebro. This test could have been done from afar without the risk, and it's implied that it was.

I'm enjoying seeing Idie behaving compassionately, but it looks like she's got some serious anger and mistrust of authority (both justified) from Krakoa. It's great she's getting this kind of character focus and I hope it's followed up on. So many threads and beats have been setup that are likely to be disrupted by the Raid on Graymalkin event kicking off next week, but I'll reserve my judgement on that for when this first arc is concluded.

This is Logan behaviour, wild sentinel.

Gotta love Max and Scott's friendship being shown as they drink crappy beers and bask in Magneto rhetoric. I don't want to question the expert, but is this sentinel Wild or wild? It's clearly not an ORCHIS Iron Man model, but Wild Sentinel has a very specific meaning.

Okay, clearly Wild. It's not attacking either of them, though. Kind of Cyclops to spell out the Star Trek Borg adaptive schtick they've got going on. This is the action scene of the issue, the mandated violence.

'Why is that leopard eating our faces?'

I don't mean that entirely pejoratively either. I'm just as susceptible to the Magneto and Cyclops power fantasy as the next person, though it's a bit of a dirty trick to wait until issue 7 to show it.

This is NOT Logan behaviour, Magneto.

Sigh. I love your sense of drama Magneto. Play to the crowd, old man. I hope your monologue doesn't become ironic. Oh wait, we already know it has. This could have been a clever moment.

Uh oh, looks like his knees are weak and arms are heavy. Vomit on his sweater already...

So we see the moment Mags' powers start to shit the bed, right after a Wild Sentinel attack. I'd be suspecting Cassandra Nova's involvement just off these two data points tbh. Which idiot resurrected her anyway?

Oh, fuck off. Logan behaviour, Mackay.

R-LDS sounds like horse shit to me. Scott says 'we don't know that for sure' so how does this speculative condition have an acronym already? Mags is speaking as if it's a fact, but he doesn't even have the same body The Five resurrected. Maybe he has Umari-Key-Waiting Room-Brashear Portal Syndrome. Obviously he's scared but this feels like an idiot ball moment, and a cynical jab at Krakoa. The Five was something they got right, even with Sinister in the mix. The implications would be insane. 16 million Genoshans were resurrected, 250k Krakoans (give or take), a whole bunch of vulnerable human children via The Phoenix Foundation, Captain America, and 1000 fucking years of Sinisterized clones etc that had nothing of the sort.

No, there's way too many data points that apply to Magneto alone to make seriously considering The Five's resurrections as the source of patient zero's malady. It would be scientifically irresponsible to get to the point of naming it and then an acronym for that. Mags is good enough at science to know this, and Beast is too. I'm no scientist, but it manifested during a fight with a Wild Sentinel. I assume they have better resources than the Marvel wiki I'm using, but that robot/Cassandra Nova is my prime suspect - the lady they know for certain to be involved in ongoing genetic fuckery - activating X-Genes. Though not Piper Cobb...

Or yes Piper Cobb? Smash cut cliffhangers aside, this would be a great time to retcon Homo Sapiens Superior right the fuck out of existence. It's never made sense, and not just the 'Superior' part. Again, I'm not a scientist but I'm certain that's not how phylogeny works. They're mutated humans, but I don't live in 616 which canonically operates on impossible physics, so idk. My fingers are crossed but my expectations are nil.

That is Logan behaviour, masked kidnapper

Okay, we'd known from solicits that Beast would be getting beat down in captivity at Graymalkin. I had speculated he'd give himself up to get inside, but the ol' bag over the head works too. I dig his outfit.

X-Men #7 is worth reading IMO, and it's one of the better ones based off Magneto content alone. Last issue I wrote that the formula was becoming easier to spot, and I stand by that. A handful of character moments, some new information about one of the ongoing mysteries but it piles more questions on top of half answers and speculation. For example, we get to see Scott and Max fight a sentinel and be friends. There's new information there but a LOT more questions. The characters are at the point of absurd speculation which raises tension but doesn't make them look very competent. To kick off the event 'Raid on Graymalkin' they went with a final page bag over the head instead of any choice and comic book events notoriously derail everything so friends can argue and punch each other.

All that said, it's only *just* acceptable in my opinion - and that's the best I can say for the rest of the line too. We know that there's been ongoing issues with writers simply not knowing major Krakoan plot points, though they probably have the excuse that they were writing before FOTHOX/ROTPOX ended. Surely there's someone in charge of overseeing all this, like Hickman was as Head of X. *Looks at the credits* Tom Brevoort - Conductor of X... That's a fancy way to say 'line editor/hatchet man.' I'll stop there and save it for the From The Ashes piece I'm doing, but spoilers: I'm not impressed with how this guy keeps failing upwards.

What did you think? Thanks for reading.

[tossawary]

Tried watching some of "Star Trek: Enterprise" during work (that's the pre-Kirk one). The emphasis on the fact that Humans and Vulcans have been acquainted for, what, 100 years or so...? Like, okay, this show is going to be about various Human and Vulcan characters learning to get along over the course of the show, I presume, so the show wants them to have a very rocky start. I get that. "Star Trek" is constructed by writers to be a vehicle for heavy-handed "why can't we all just get along" messages and always has been, and that it why it is (and I mean this both positively and negatively) Like That.

But the fact that Vulcans and Humans are apparently so poorly acquainted (and yes, obviously, this is happening in the context of potential conflict with the Klingons and Humans launching out into the rest of space, so tempers are running high) even after all this time is... somewhat amusingly nonsensical from an in-universe, more realistic perspective. It's funny.

Firstly, you'd think that a supposedly logic-based culture that prioritizes cooperation for the purpose of communal betterment (the Vulcans) would have worked out by now that Humans are not going to suddenly all take to the teachings of Surak, and so would have efficiently adjusted their rhetoric to more effectively appeal to Human perspectives. Experienced Vulcans would adapt to structure their explanations and arguments slightly differently, surely?

Like, wow, there's not a single Vulcan ambassador who has studied styles of Human argument and personally found it logical to "speak their language" a little more rather than make huffy appeals to Vulcan authority? Any Vulcan anthropologists or sociologists seeking to understand Human cultures? Realistically, there's no way that all Vulcans would agree 100% of the time on what is logical behavior and what isn't. Some Vulcans might decide that smiling puts Human colleagues at ease and do so (even if they shouldn't HAVE to, Humans shouldn't expect Vulcans to perform emotions for them), because it makes cooperation easier, which is logical.

But that's just not what the writers want here. Which is fine! They want their rocky start here. They're doing their usual "why can't we all just get along" arc, which is fine and great and I'm fond of it, even if I also personally find that "Star Trek" has been incredibly clumsy about their anti-racism stuff most of the time.

(So many shows typically have one Vulcan character regularly on the ship, rather than have, say, two Vulcans with different opinions on things in order to explore interesting discussions on cultural differences and the definitions of "logic". It makes the shows' depictions of Vulcan logic feel a little "tell, don't show" sometimes. I think it's a missed opportunity. Just as it's a missed opportunity not to put neurodivergent Human characters on a ship so aliens and androids don't have to be the stand-ins all the time.)

Anyway, secondly, you'd think that Humans would all know by now that Vulcans don't like handshakes? There's a scene where a Human tries to shake a Vulcan's hand and she ignores him, and I was like, "Okay, wow, INCREDIBLY rude to offer a Vulcan a handshake."

(Side note: I am aware that "Star Trek" repeatedly has Vulcans engage in handshakes with Humans, such as during first contact and when Spock is being introduced to Kirk in "Strange New Worlds", but it always reads to me as Vulcans choosing to go along with the gesture out of politeness. I still think it's a little rude for Humans to offer a handshake in the first place, if they can't accept a refusal with good grace. Plenty of real people across different cultures really don't like handshakes.)

And for an audience member unfamiliar with "Star Trek" and Vulcans, especially a USAmerican, the Vulcan silently refusing the handshake is going to come off as incredibly rude. I haven't watched further but I assume that this scene was intentionally written to demonstrate the issue of culture clash. Two people can deeply offend the other without fully meaning to do so. I'm guessing the Human didn't know just how rude he was being offering the handshake and that the show will elaborate on this.

But, realistically, I cannot fully suspend my disbelief that Humans and Vulcans have been acquainted for 100 years without it being common knowledge that Vulcans don't like handshakes. That would be absurd. Some Vulcan ambassador, familiarizing themselves with Human cultures, would have realized by now that it would not be offensive to inform Humans that, like many Human cultures, Vulcans do not like to make physical contact. And realistically, the Human liaisons, presumably trained diplomats who understand basic politeness and courtesy, would have been like, "We apologize for any previous offense. We didn't know. How do you prefer to be greeted? We will inform our people not to offer you handshakes again and to respectfully greet you in the manner of your preference."

I don't know if these Human characters know yet that Vulcans are touch-telepaths. The Vulcans would not have to share that information to make it politely clear that they don't like handshakes. If it IS known by Humans that Vulcans are touch-telepaths (it would be on their Future Wikipedia page), you'd think people prejudiced against Vulcans would be very aware of the telepatht and more inclined than most not to make physical contact.

Personally, realistically, I would think that any Human expected to make contact with Vulcans would have received a mandatory briefing on manners and basic cultural different. Any Human officer on a ship expected to go make contact with currently hostile KLINGONS and other known Non-Human cultures should be thoroughly educated in basic rules of interaction, for the safety of the ship if not basic civility. So, any Human officer offering a handshake to a Vulcan is either being intentionally disrespectful or is just incompetent (doesn't already know basic facts about the culture of Earth's first, longest, and closest ally) (didn't read the cultural briefing).

This happens in front of the Human captain too, so either the captain doesn't care to call out the offense and apologize (seems likely, he seems pretty hostile here so far) or didn't know it was offensive. Which is also just... stunningly unprofessional for someone who is supposed to be an ambassador for the entire planet of Earth.

And again, the episode is presumably intentionally constructed this way so that the characters can get to know each other later and learn to get along where the audience can observe them. Every single "Star Trek" show I've watched has had protagonist characters be prejudiced and even bigoted in clumsy ways that feel like they ought to be textbook cases of "What NOT To Do" in Starfleet Academy classes, so that the show can deliver basic messages about how prejudice is bad and we all have the potential for it and we can all get better. It is "Star Trek"'s whole thing. "Star Trek: Enterprise" isn't at all alone on this, because all of the shows have done this.

But my goodness is it amusing when a "Star Trek" episode presents a cultural clash problem that more realistically speaking probably would have been better settled about 100 years ago in-universe.