#fiction =/= reality

[myfandomrealitea]

okay, so- this is coming from someone who really hasn't engaged in fandom discourse, especially regarding shipping and such. I dearly hope this doesn't come across as bait or troll, I'm genuinely curious and want to learn. apologies for the possibly-dumb question, but I really just need to ask-

what is proshipping? and what are 'antis'?

you know how it is, when you ask around you always get a biased answer one way or another. "proshippers are pedos" "proshippers all condone incest" "proship Bad and if you interact You Are Bad" (i think these are 'anti' points of view? am i using that term right? that's the rhetoric ive mainly heard). but despite all of that, i don't know if ive ever actually gotten a straight answer as to just.. what it factually is. because it doesn't feel like the sort of thing that you can boil down to insults or accusations or whatnot. it's all just very confusing to me, especially because i come from a place that essentially just told me to avoid like the plague and never look back. sorry, this became a bit of a ramble, lol. thank you so much in advance, i hope i'm not being a bother or insulting with this ^^;

The modern term; 'proship' (s.a; 'proshipping' and 'profiction') is an evolution of an earlier fandom acronym known as: 'SALS.'

Ship And Let Ship

SALS was one of the earliest fandom adoptions and interpretations of the concept of not bullying others for what they shipped or their fandom interests, and not trying to control or dictate what was "allowed" to be shipped or enjoyed. The most notable origin of SALS was during the early years of accessible fandom via Star Trek, and the present homophobia and misogyny in a largely male-dominated community.

As woman became more involved in fandom spaces, the presence of 'other' ships and pairings began to increase. M/M, F/F that wasn't purely for sexual gratification, and M/O and F/O (where 'O' is Other) pairings were popular amongst women, much as they still are today.

Not only did the presence of women in a "male space" receive a not insignificantly negative reaction, so too did them filling the fandom space with their shipping content. Now; sexism and misogyny and homophobia were not entirely to blame. Again as is still very much present today, people simply Did Not Like Certain Ships or Characters. And as they still do today, they'd spread hate about them and to the people who did enjoy them.

Thus: the birth of SALS.

(In other words: I like what I like and it has fuck all to do with you. Shut up and move on.)

Back then, SALS was mostly contained to just that. Ships and characters. Since back in that era 'taboo topics' and 'sexual content' were still pretty covert, people weren't exactly arguing the merits of incest in public forums and at conventions.

However, as all things do, the internet evolved. Society evolved. Media evolved. And so too did 'SALS' evolve in keeping with the new culture and subjects present in fandom spaces.

Suddenly it wasn't just ships and characters to be advocated for. It was themes. Subjects. Kinks. Plots. The more things people found to enjoy, so too did the more things people found to hate.

'Proship' is actually grammatically pro-ship. As in; in support of shipping. This is why I always state that the modern conceptions of proshipping would more accurately be coined profiction. It is no longer just about ships, but fiction as a whole.

However; the core value and sole inherent point of being proship, SALS, profiction and so forth remains exactly the same:

[I/We] believe you have no right to harm others over the [ship/content] they create or consume and [I/we] do not have the right to dictate what is or is not allowed in fandom spaces.

That's it. Don't harass people for what they enjoy fictionally. Don't try to force them into not enjoying or being able to enjoy it.

Of course, the modern adaption varies wildly in terms of 'additional values' thanks to the evolution of the term and what it can encompass. However, there is certainly no obligation to:

Create or consume content you are uncomfortable with.

Create or consume content regarded as 'taboo' or 'triggering.' Such as incest.

Be involved with any aforementioned content beyond turning a blind eye if its not your thing.

Inherently, anyone who says they're 'neutral' on the matter but firmly believes in minding their own business is just a proshipper refusing to use the label if you're taking the term solely at its core value.

In terms of 'antis' they're just the antithesis of the above. Antis are people who generally believe that fiction is irrevocably tied in with who you are, what you believe/condone, and that real-life limitations and values should also apply to fiction.

Although, its is heavy debated and it wildly varies per individual to the degree this is taken.

(E.g: some 'antis' believe you should only write rape fic if you are a victim using it as catharsis or education. Other 'antis' believe there's absolutely no excuse or reason to write rape fic at all.)

Antis typically believe that enjoyment or being invested in content which is regarded as harmful or illegal in real life is morally unsound and reflects that you're a bad or morally unsound person.

Although I disagree, I can honestly say in some aspects I do understand this reasoning. I don't agree, but I do understand why people may come to that conclusion.

As with proshippers, antis vary from people who simply ignore and block content they don't agree with to radicals.

'Anti' is again a prefix. Although modern adoption of the term uses it as a singular signifier, it would grammatically be anti-[fandom], anti-[character], ect. As was commonly used in the past.

The rhetoric that all proshippers are pedophiles or support incest is common-spread and effective 'anti' propaganda. Similar to how so many people believe 'proship' inherently signifies that you must create and/or consume taboo or darker content.

It doesn't.

¹ Proship may also be accurately termed as simply: 'anti-harassment.' ² Its important to note the 'definition' of these terms may vary wildly depending on the individual. However, detailed above is the most historical use and evolution of the terms and their definitions.

[coockie8]

I mean a huge part of the problem is that antis just don't understand that different stories exist for different reasons, and not all stories are supposed to teach you a moral lesson, or any lesson, for that matter, right?

Like the entire plot of The Twilight Zone was basically "Wouldn't that be fucked up? I'm Rod Sterling." This show ran for 5 20-40 episode long seasons in the late 50's to early 60's.

Like yeah, some fiction exists to teach a lesson of some kind, or draw attention to real-world atrocities, or whatever, but not all fiction serves that purpose, nor is it supposed to!

And I know it's a fundamental lack of understanding, or wilful ignorance at the very least, because antis constantly bring up propaganda in this argument, as if propaganda isn't lies presented as fact.

Which is why it's dangerous; because it's not presented as fiction! If propaganda were presented as the lies it is, then it wouldn't fucking work, because the entire reason propaganda works the way it does is because you don't know it's fucking lies!

But if you're over the age of 10 and are watching something that is obviously just a fictional story for entertainment purposes, I would expect you to know better than to emulate everything you see in said story.

[eelfuneral]

People don’t *have* to like the Jedi, and people not being wild about a fictional group of space wizards is not the same as condoning genocide. Harassing people for talking about aspects of these very fictional people that they don’t like is not okay.

[shrimpmandan]

I honestly fucking hate when antis bring up that fiction DOES affect reality as a counterargument to proshippers bc the thing is they’re not even technically wrong. Fiction and reality are inherently intertwined on some level. For example, fiction often depicts the ideals and standards of the time, or the creator’s lived experience. Fiction can impact reality in the form of individual people, both positively and negatively. For example, a propaganda cartoon vs an educational cartoon. The thing is, antis refuse to acknowledge that the “fiction =/= reality” argument (in the context of proshippers using it) is a direct response to the incorrect assertion that fiction will make people act against their morals. This can be about anything from “incest/abuse/age gap relationships in fiction will normalize it irl”, “video games cause shootings”, “porn causes violence”, or any other amount of honestly baseless and reactionary assertions about the world.

I see propaganda brought up a lot, which is especially frustrating, because antis don’t understand how propaganda works. Propaganda is not something that you watch and suddenly, you’re racist. Funnily enough, propaganda on its own isn’t particularly persuasive or logical in how it’s presented-- it’s just manipulative. Propaganda specifically takes advantage of preconceived ideas, fears, and prejudices-- for example, anti-gay propaganda would play into the idea of gay men being predatory, deviant, and mentally disordered, because that was already the general consensus of the time. Propaganda, by nature, plays into existing emotions, or preys on the human fear of the unfamiliar. This is why the best combatant to propaganda is education.

You can apply this same thing to taboo fiction, violent video games, and violent porn. You could make the argument that these things could have negative influences on children, seeing as they’re much more impressionable and may have a harder time distinguishing between fiction and reality, but the bottom line is kids are not the target audience for any of these things. They are not supposed to be viewing NSFW writings, videos, or games. We already have things like ESRB ratings, “are you 18?” verification checks (as paper thin as they may be), and tagging systems in place for the express purpose of deterring kids (or parents of kids) from seeing something that aren’t meant for them. After a certain point, you really just have to place the responsibility on the parent for either not monitoring their children, or being careless about what kind of content they consume. Aka: NOT the fault of the adults who make or enjoy violent or explicit media.

Going back to propaganda for a minute, with taboo fiction in particular (incest, age gap, etc.), it’s already, y’know, taboo. Meaning people are actively discouraged from participating in, or even just talking about it, since things like incest and pedophilia are already largely considered immoral. Most Western citizens would agree that irl abusive relationships, rape, and the like, are all immoral. So why would reading about it suddenly make them go against the entire worldview and moral upbringing they had? That’d be utterly absurd! However, if someone who was already considering or apologetic towards something like pedophilia were to consume media depicting it positively, it might, and I repeat, MIGHT have a chance to influence them into actually committing an offense. And even then, any evidence of that is extremely flimsy.

There’s been a small handful of IRL cases around fiction and reality. One that comes to mind is the murder trial of Scott Dyleski, wherein the prosecutor asserted that the Invader Zim episode Dark Harvest inspired Dyleski to commit murder. However, this statement was hardly backed up with any kind of proof, and in my opinion, is a weak argument on the prosecution’s end. There just isn’t any psychological evidence that makes a strong connection between dark/violent/explicit media and moral degradation, and while there have been studies done surrounding things like “do video games cause violence?” and “is porn making young men misogynistic rapists?”, these studies either came back inconclusive or even outright stating that no, these things do not lead directly to IRL violence. Simply googling “do video games cause violence?” or “does porn cause violence?” will yield countless articles stating that there’s no strong link between the two things. And, at its core, this is what proshippers mean when they say that fiction =/= reality. To say that fiction is responsible for all of society’s ills, instead of the fact that fiction takes inspiration from the tragedies of the real world, is an absurd take.

Overall, I think I’m still happy with the “fiction =/= reality on a 1-to-1 level” wording that’s since replaced “fiction =/= reality”. It’s far less generalized and overall more difficult for antis to counter with actual evidence (which, let’s be honest, they barely use anyways), even though the only reason proshippers were using such a generalized statement to begin with was to counter another generalized statement: that taboo or violent fiction will always, or almost always, lead to irl crimes and normalization.

[urcharactersclasspect]

anyway enough of all that

media literacy is actually dead these days and no amount of "well no its not dead we can have different opinions" will stop u from being stupid if you straight up critique media on the basis everyones a piece of shit just for writing a villian who acts like a villian who you arent meant to like in the first place

[kissofthemuses]

{ How do I keep ending up on "you're not allowed to actually like this evil villain" tiktok? Like fuck off. Is this VILLAIN a gross manipulative piece of shit? Yes. But that's WHY. }

[myfandomrealitea]

I saw some stupid post about what media you consume and create so I made a rant and I thought it would be fun to share with someone:

For people who say that what you read/interact/make determines who you are and your values as a person I have this to say; do you know how many kids played with their toys in a gruesome manner? How many Barbies have had cheating, abuse, and divorce scandals that ended with someone dying? How many Minecraft sheep have suffered the piston end rod joke? How many mlp horror fanfics were ingested and enjoyed by younger fans?

Did you only play with your toys in a pure and golden way? Did you not try out some dark ideas for fun with the knowledge that this is all fake? Do you think the kids obsessed with fnaf and poppy playtime and the other dozen rip offs are pro child murdering?

They do it because it’s fun to play pretend, not because they want it all to actually happen. If children can realize that you can do things in fiction that you wouldn’t want to do in real life, why can’t adults?

This makes me think of the Reddit example in the comments of an AITA post where someone talked about how as a child they used to pretend they were an orphan and had to navigate life by themselves. When their Mom found out she went absolutely batshit, insisting it meant that they wanted her dead and were plotting to kill her.

People who think you can only consume specific media or in specific ways always make me laugh because you'll usually find out they love Disney movies or love songs about rape and gang violence or read the exact same literature only its okay because they do it "critically."

[malinaa]

if i think about the hunger games in peeta's perspective i WILL start sobbing

[big-moon-little-moon]

so called TPK enjoyers once they realize their graph paper wife is a part of the P that's supposed to get TK-ed

bonus:

[cacodaemonia]

I watched Grave of the Fireflies a little over 20 years ago, and I was deeply depressed for like a week. To this day, I cannot watch the film again. Does that mean it wasn't an incredible work of art or that stories about US attacks on Japanese cities during WWII shouldn't exist? Because the movie made me sad uwu?

That's how ridiculous people sound when they make the same arguments about depictions of kinks, sex, sexual relationships, sexual violence, and sexual abuse in fiction (because it's always the sex they're upset about—not murder or any other kind of violence).

I think some people forget that some literature and some media is meant to be deeply uncomfortable and unsettling. It's meant to make you have a very visceral reaction to it. If you genuinely can't handle these stories then you are under no obligation to consume them but acting as if they have no purpose or as if people don't have a right to tell these stories, stories that often relate to the darkest or most disturbing parts of life, then you should do some introspection.

[somewhereincairparavel]

everyone keeps talking about Jason vs Percy but why isn't ANYONE talking about how powerful they looked when they both used their powers TOGETHER at the same time, side by side, in Mark of Athena? Like Annabeth even got goosebumps watching them cook up such an intense storm from afar. Sparky and Seaweed brain, Power duo smh.

[woman-respecter]

men jerking off to videos simulating rape or at least violence featuring real women often facing actual pain and abuse is not the same as fanfic girlies reading about sasuke being exposed to sex pollen. be fucking serious.

also you basically never hear of someone injuring her partner during sex because she read destiel bdsm omegaverse, but men will demand their partners try extreme shit they saw in porn, sometimes with severe consequences.

[girllblogging777]

daily reminder that there’s a reality where your s/o shifts for you, reads fanfics about you and writes to you on character ai

[zu-is-here]

Selfish request of Dreammare pls ?

Pygmalion

idea by @clownyclowns

Dream & Nightmare by jokublog

+ the perfect finger sketch :'D

[melanthaeunomia]

Do y’all ever reread an old unpublished fanfic you wrote and then get invested on the storyline but get sad because you never wrote the next part of it, just me?

[the-bar-sinister]

Visualization for Self Shippers

Sit somewhere comfortably.

Close your eyes

Take five deep breaths– deep, slow breaths. 

When you inhale, let your breaths fill down to your stomach. 

Purse your lips and exhale slowly. Twice as long as you took to inhale.

As you move forward, continue to take long, slow breaths.

You are sitting on your F/O's lap.

It's not the back of your chair that you feel behind you. It's your F/O's chest supporting you.

How does their body feel against yours? Is it strong and firm? Slim and bony? Soft and plush?

Take a moment to enjoy the sensation of sitting with your back against your F/O, their body supporting yours.

Take another breath, and exhale it slowly.

Feel your F/O reach around your body to cradle you in their arms.

Feel the sensation of their arms enclosing you, holding you.

Feel the place on your body where your F/O gently rests their hands.

Consider your F/O's hands. What do they feel like against you? Are they big and powerful? Are they slim and delicate? Are they warm, or cool?

Let your F/O hold you for a long moment in their comforting presence.

Take another long breath and exhale slowly.

Let your F/O's hands move gently over your body. Feel the tingle of their fingers as they slide over you.

Feel your F/O's hand rest on your cheek and cup it gently.

Take another long breath and exhale it slowly.

Let your F/O lean over your shoulder, and kiss your neck, or your cheek or ear.

Feel the sensation of their lips against your flesh. How do they kiss you? Is it soft and fluttering? Is it firm and moist? Is it rough and hungry?

Let your F/O kiss you for a while as you rest your body against the support of their chest.

Linger awash in the comforting sensation of your F/O, breathing in and out.

Let your F/O squeeze you one more time, feeling the force of their body holding yours.

Then let them release you. Open your eyes, and stand up, feeling their support for you.