#potential Kandreil

[foxstens]

how is kandreil not real when neil couldn't leave until he knew kevin would be okay and kevin said 'you should be court' and kevin was the center of andrew's strange world and kevin said 'you're worth it' and andrew trusted neil with kevin because kevin was important to both of them and

[dysfunctionalcreature]

idk about yall but one of my most ever favorite aftg headcanons is that Andrew is really good with kids, and in the future when Aaron and Katelyn settle down and have kids, their kids will absolutely adore "Uncle Andrew", and he'll happily suffer through whatever sort of play the kids want to do with an as genuine and un-menacing smile on his face as he can manage, whenever he and Neil (and Kevin) come to visit

[midnight-stargirl]

i can never think of all for the game without thinking about how kandreil was supposed to be endgame. i love andreil i really do, but the wasted potential for kandreil drives me insane.

I MEAN SERIOUSLY SO MANY OF THEIR SCENES HINTED AT ROMANCE JUST FOR IT TO BE THROWN AWAY AT THE END

WHY NORA WHY

[kazbiter]

crazy that part of TSC mentions a potential throuple dynamic made up of two people in an extremely committed relationship and a third person that they are both equally obsessed with and it wasn't kandreil. i mean i didn't think it would be but still

[codename-adler]

kevin day is not “neil josten but taller” ok?

whether it’s kevneil, kandrew, kandreil. romantic or platonic. yes, these relationships affect him and how interacts, how he evolves. but he affects those he interacts with right back. like it should be. the adjustments should show. should matter. should be kind.

if neil and/or andrew–especially andrew–are mean, degrading, impatient, mocking, superior, frustrated towards kevin, simply because he is kevin, and kevin isn’t exactly that right back with them? the whole potential of a kevin-relationship was missed. pulverized.

kevin is not “neil josten but taller”–he’s kevin fucking day, queen of exy, son of exy, cult survivor, first and only ambidextrous striker, self-taught at that, and has led the palmetto state foxes to victory. he can be mean and ruthless and oblivious and hurtful and egotistical and a real fucking asshole. andrew’s that. neil is those things too. but they’re neil and andrew and kevin. their characters paint the colors with which their traits appear. they’re very evenly matched, that’s why they work so well together, but their differences make for a lot of it as well.

so unless it’s for the angst, the eventual happy ending, the character development, the relationship development, the healing, the therapy, the do-better… and *even* then…

don’t make neil belittle kevin. don’t make kevin the butt of andreil’s mean jokes. don’t make andrew compare kevin to neil. don’t make kevin palatable to andreil.

all three of them already fit together. nora’s shown us.

why would andrew despise kevin for not understanding the kind of communication he has with neil? and why would neil be the norm? before neil, there was kevin. and only kevin. he was the first for andrew. that can never be denied. and andrew would never forget. why would andrew build a relationship with a second neil? why would he isolate kevin with private, mean jokes with neil? why would neil make fun of kevin with exy? why would he get irritated with kevin for talking more than andrew? and why would all of that be for nothing, except establish a toxic base for the triad?

i don’t like it. it’s not two knives and a spoon. it’s three fucking knives. all equally sharp. all equally blunt. all equally handy. all equally hold-able.

three. fucking. knives.

thank you for coming to my KEVTalk.

[houseminyard]

let's talk about kandrew let's actually never shut up about kandrew because to me kandrew is like mutual hate but mutual obsession of potential. like andrew watches kevin openly want something so badly and is so passionate to the point that he learns how to play right-handed while andrew is trying to repress his want for the exact same thing, and kevin is the first person to look at him as more than just a weapon even though he still reaps the benefits of him being one. and andrew stands to assuage the only thing that stands between kevin and getting everything he wants. but all of it is only potential. them being near each other forces themselves to confront the fact that kevin is scared, the fact that andrew wants to be court, but neither of them will actually be able to do anything concrete about shit until they meet neil. so this is secretly a kandreil agenda but i just have a lot of kandrew feelings rn

[all-for-the-game-confessions]

I don't get Kandreil shipping. Yeah, I am aware it was a potential idea in some drafts, but personally I think it was a good call it didn't make the cut? Not in the way these relationships were shown anyway?

Cause Andreil of course make perfect sense, and one could even see where KevinxNeil would come from if she went with that, but KevinxAndrew is very superficial and forced beyond their odd understanding. Kevin is on the outside of what makes Andreil work and Andrew is on the outside of what could make Neil and Kevin work.

So yeah, of course, people can do whatever in fanon. But I don't get it, personally.

.

[rainbowd00dles]

I should be working on oc kiss week stuff, but all I want to draw is kandreil (I also would like kandreil fic recs if anyone has them, also for potential fic art feel free to suggest your own!!)

[jnmoreau]

You’ve made me seen the kerejean light (I’m super intrigued by kevjean already) and I’m really loving them but as a long-term kandreil and kandrew especially bitch (gender neutral) I go so feral every time there’s a hint. If you seriously go full Kevin Day in the middle five person polycule I will lose my mind in a positive way. When Neil was apparently holding Kevin’s hand and then called Jeremy pretty boy ‘in a bad way’ I was kicking my FEET. There’s so much potential for the other dynamics (Neil and Jean!!) if they all end up sort of dating, or even if they just start with both couples with Kevin. why so mad he talked to his boyfriends instead of you, boys. You would like to be trusted with all his secrets as well? Or you would like to be his boyfriends???

dear anon (gender neutral) let me tell you this (spoiler spoiler) i want and i /will/ make it a five person polycule, i just don't want it to feel forced??? if you know what i mean, so i want to wait and get them all to interact more with each other and!!! i'm a jeaneil truther first and human being second, i just don't know how to make them more active in social media bc in canon they wouldn't even know what twitter is so i'm trying to find a way to make them as less ooc as possible. AND i want to explore an andrew x jeremy friendship too so i'm looking into it as well (andrew only deserves nice things and jeremy is the nicest person out there)

[knickknacksandallthat]

if you don't mind me asking, what got you into kevin's character?

for me it was actually your fic, but since its so normalized in the fandom to dismiss his trauma and call him a coward and annoying for doing things that other characters are loved for, i didn't really care about him when i first read the books

now hes my favorite

Oh, anon, I love this!! What an honor, I’m so glad to have helped you join the Kev lovefest 😊 (Welcome to the dark side lol!) It makes me so happy that the A Fallen Star series has awakened this in you! 💖

And wow, what a good question. I don't mind at all! I actually had to think about this for a while to try and remember…how the heck did I get here???

So here is my ridiculously uncalled-for POV on Kevin’s character and slow descent into madness below:

(Disclaimer that these are just my thoughts and anyone in the aftg fandom can hc or think whatever they like about Mr. Day 😊)

Like you, anon, I was easily swayed by Neil’s perspective of Kev on first read. It makes sense and is a credit to Nora how we so fully buy into Neil’s opinion of Kevin that many of us just run with it. And to be fair to the fandom, it’s canon – Andrew, Neil, and all the Foxes tell us he’s a coward and annoying and so we assume it must be true.

So, I created many fics that played into this image and focused on andreil. (Because who isn’t enamored with andreil??? Legit, deranged obsession and couple goals lmao). Using that lens, it was easy to make Kevin the punching bag because he is the quintessential “straight man” in comedy (and yes, I do hear the irony in that) – the foil to other characters to make them seem better, braver, funnier, smarter, etc. It’s an age-old trick/trope in fiction that works very well. And it was an easier transition for Nora to make, I think, once she made the decision to remove Kevin from the main narrative of her story.

This character setup works well enough when you’re doing a fic from Neil or Andrew’s POV, providing an easy source of humor to fall back on. So, for me, I think my thinking shifted once I started working on Flavors of Fall and delved into Andrew and Kevin’s storyline there. That fic forced me to think from Kevin’s perspective, and I found at the time I had a shallow understanding of what made Kevin tick. It totally threw me once I really started considering sequels for that fic and the 12 Day Program for Courtship, both of which have Kevin cast as a main character. I had to dive deep into his makeup, seriously considering his motivations, his likes/dislikes, his personality traits, his relationships, and how he would react in any given situation.

Because I was interested in his character development, I started delving into fics like orionauriga’s just pretend , @likearecordbb's Long Walk in the Woods, @thetrojeans daylights, sunsets, and @dayurno's the age of no regret series. They are all brilliant, fascinating character studies of Kevin Day and his relationships that are extremely well done. There’s many more, of course, but I was searching for fics that specifically delved into Kevin’s thought process and choices and stayed there a while.

That’s what led me to feeling like I needed to tell his story with Dead of Night. Of course, it turned into a larger series with my flavoring of Kerejean added because I’ve never been a huge Kevin/Thea relationship fan. (But that's a discussion for another day which you can start here and here for that adventure.)

Now all that I’ve described above gives you the mechanics of the descent – the when, the where, the how. But it crucially misses the why. What is it about Kevin that got me in the end?

Ironically enough, it was his potential.

I think when Nora stripped away any kind of romantic narrative (RIP Kandreil OR Riko/Kevin/Jean) or a chance for a tragic storyline (Kevin dying in the end) it resulted in removing a lot of Kevin’s emotional vulnerability. We don’t get to hear what he’s feeling or thinking unless it’s related to Riko, the Moriyamas, or Exy. This means his storyline is consumed by the stereotypical sports underdog story, with us following his rise to champion (which is still a powerful enough narrative on its own that shines even in the midst of Neil’s crazy plotline. Switching that racquet to his left hand in the championship game? Iconic.) 

However, it leaves us very much with a shell of a person. Kevin’s character outside of Exy is reduced to a handful of facts – there’s a passing comment on his like of history, and the stark evidence of an alcohol addiction as a coping mechanism. We’re told he used to dance. That he learned French because Jean Moreau taught him. That he has no qualms about taking (mild?) drugs (cracker dust). Despite how much we’ve run with it as a fandom, the only allusion I’ve found in the books to him being strict with diet is this section from The King’s Men:

“No one needs to eat this before a game,” Kevin said. “Eat some granola or protein if you’re that hungry.” “Hello, there’s protein in the peanut butter,” Nicky said. “Let go of me before I tell Andrew you’re outlawing chocolate. I said let go. You’re not the boss of me. Ouch! Did you seriously just hit me?” … “Kevin, just let him go,” Neil said. “It’s not worth fighting over.” “When our defense is sluggish, we all suffer,” Kevin said.

From what I can find in the books, Kevin never once denies Andrew eating ice cream. (Which I’m 100% able to admit I might have missed something so feel free to quote me where that scene is because I was totally searching for it). In fact, every time they go to Sweetie’s, it’s implied Kevin orders ice cream with them. In the infamous kissing scene in The King’s Men, we actually have proof that Kevin got ice cream:

Kevin still hadn’t messaged Nicky by the time they reached the ice cream aisle, so Nicky gave in and called him. Neil half-expected Kevin to ignore Nicky’s call, but Kevin wasn’t so sour with them that he’d turn down a free snack…Nicky grabbed spoons from the kitchen and distributed pints to their hungry owners. Neil checked his expression when Nicky came back from dropping Kevin’s off….

Now I do think it’s in line with his character and his upbringing to have issues with food, so I’m all for buying into that specific hc. But we have very little evidence of it in the text.

His personality is reduced mainly to anger, arrogance, or cowardice (all traits that don’t make us sympathize with him). The only facts we have about his Tragic Past™️ are two things: his mother’s death, and his hand injury. Everything else we assume is based on Neil’s knowledge of the mafia, Wymack’s hearsay, Andrew’s deductions, and Kevin’s reactions to Riko and Tetsuji. We have literally no idea what happened to Kevin in the Nest. His trauma and his time spent there is a complete mystery. The closest we get is Riko’s comment to Neil in The Raven King:

“I am going to love hurting you,” Riko said, “like I loved hurting Kevin.”

This, I think, is one of the main reasons many of the fandom “dismisses” Kevin’s trauma in comparison to Neil’s because we can’t see it. We don’t know what happened and we don’t get to experience it, so this lack of explanation or motivation leaves us only with very cold personality traits. We’re unable to root for him as a character because we can’t sympathize. We can empathize because we know Very Bad Things™️ must have happened in the Nest, but we don’t see them happen the same way we do Neil or Andrew. Even Kevin’s hand injury is old and “healed” when we’re first introduced to the character.

The only true canon moment where Kevin appears “human” is in The Raven King with Kevin’s “then run” and “you should be court” conversation with Neil. His admittance that Neil’s life is more important than Exy is instantaneous – he doesn’t even pause to throw his Exy dreams down the drain if it means Neil can survive.  In a weirdly parallel way, we see Kevin’s thought process implicit in his conversation: “at least you’d have a chance.” It is strikingly similar to Neil’s internal conversation of: one of us should make it. (And there’s another whole separate discourse I could get into on how Kevin and Neil are two halves of the same coin, but we’ll save that for another day.) But even the revelation of Wymack as his father has more shock value than true emotional weight – we never see what that conversation looked like or how either party actually reacted. (In some ways, I feel like Dan being pissed at Kevin is given more “screentime” than Kevin’s response to telling his father and how Wymack reacted.)

So with Kevin’s emotions and past firmly locked down, we’re left to brush off Kevin’s reactions (or lack thereof) as part of his indifferent personality. It is what it says on the tin. (And that’s not to say Kevin is a perfect character by any means. He has flaws just like every other character.)

Now some people very accurately depict and buy into those limitations as simply being Kevin’s character/personality – I’ve read some awesome fics where Kevin is Ace/Aro and/or on the spectrum. These are completely valid, extremely well done, and I could totally see why others see and write him this way. Canon practically sets them up for it.

For me, though, it circles back to our skewed view of Kevin given to us by some deeply loved but also deeply flawed characters (cough, Andreil). Those same characters that we’re told time and again not to judge them by their cover but to try and understand how they’re affected by (and make choices because of) their trauma.

While Andrew and Neil end up giving each other this grace through a hard-fought battle of truths and exchanges, they do not extend this same courtesy to Kevin, and neither are we given the chance to do so. We literally can’t because, again, we don’t know what the full extent of Kevin’s trauma is.

Kevin doesn’t talk about his time in the Nest to any character, meaning we know nothing about it. Ergo we don’t know what choices Kevin makes because of it. In The Foxhole Court, Wymack specifically tells us Kevin was Riko’s pet. In fact, there is so much specific language that Kevin himself uses around the concept of ownership, and that Nora uses when referring to him that it jarringly sticks out in the text.  He has no sense of personal space or proper boundaries, viewing people only as assets to be used for the good of the team, which at the very least is a sign of mental abuse. But the fact remains that we just don’t know. We don’t know how far this mental abuse was taken, how often or severely he was injured, if he injured or was forced to injure others – we don’t know.

But it’s obvious whatever happened to him started as a child and built from there. Which means he has years of abuse and power dynamics embedded into him. He has every right to be afraid. In fact, we are demonstrably told and shown often in canon that Kevin is afraid…but fear does not equate to cowardice. In fact, we know that bravery often means being scared and doing something anyway. And in many cases, that’s just what Kevin did (with a crutch named Andrew). But even before he entered his deal with Andrew, it's important to remember that even though he was brainwashed and beaten from a young age to understand that he would die if he betrayed the Moriyama family in some way, he left them.

This is always so significant to me because so many abuse victims stay in their situation thinking/hoping/praying it will get better – either because of an idea that their abuser will change (“they’re just having a hard time at work rn”) or that the victim will fix whatever flaw the abuser finds lacking. Or alternatively, they recognize the situation is bad, but they can’t leave because they feel like they have nowhere to go, no one who will help them, trapped by their lack of skills/contacts/money. In Kevin’s case, both situations rang true. And yet he left. He left, and in only a year and a half’s time he recovered from his injury and led his team to the championship.

But he is only at the start of his recovery. I think he’ll need years of therapy to recover from all that happened in the Nest. I think many of his emotional and social shortcomings are a direct consequence of that timeframe and he did not have the freedom to address them until the threat of the Moriyamas was removed. I do not think they are permanent parts of his personality – I think in time, he will be allowed to grow and recover and contribute much more to his relationships than he’s capable of doing at the end of The King’s Men.

Though the series finished, I think Kevin’s story is just beginning.

That’s why I think he’s fascinating to explore as a character. That’s why I love writing him right now because in many ways, his possibilities are endless. There’s so many opportunities to explore different facets of his story that we never get a chance to in canon. Kevin’s character and narrative is a tantalizing tease which many of us have fell hook, line, and sinker for. (Including yours truly.) We want to rabidly sink our teeth into it and shake it, like a dog with a bone.

So we do. 😉

Phew. Okay, that’s enough. None of what I’ve written above is new I’m sure to those of the fandom who have been here since the beginning or have become diehard Kevin fans. But thank you for letting me ramble in this ask, anon. Writing about Kevin has been a very fun and therapeutic adventure for me. So I’m so glad that there are others out there who are enjoying it too 😊

[foxstens]

this is just me but i think andrew and neil miss kevin like a limb after he graduates

[kevindavidday]

the yoohankim potential that kandreil has. i will elaborate eventually

[thespineoftherighteous]

what’s your ranking of Kevin Day ships?

gorgeous gorgeous question.

if you want to give me specific ones I can definitely do that but I'll just go with the more common ones for now. (also sorry if this is a test and I'm supposed to say like. Kevin and Himself. but if it is, I'm going to fail)

Kevin/Allison. first and foremost. girl you'd think that this would be ironically but no. they're hot, they're fiesty, they'd definitely be some degree of toxic, at least at first. they serve and slay etc. no matter how you go about it, their get-together will always eat because how do you put two people like *that* in any kind of relationship without it being delicious. I was on a bit of a kevallison kick some time ago I need to start thinking about them more (the way I said "common" and started off with one of the least popular ones)

if we're strictly talking romantic ships then kandreil goes here (classic) but if including non romantic ships then Kevin/Andrew because what even the HELL is that they're so good they're so good

I've never really indulged much into Kevin/Jeremy stuff but Kevin having a crush on Jeremy is scrumptious to me. just the way he canonically is with Jeremy is wonderful

another non romantic pairing (definitely derailing here) but Matt/Kevin. I think they have a fun canon relationship and great potential for even more. bonus points for Kevin having a small crush on matt

I'm not super serious about Kevin/Aaron but I've indulged and I've had some fun times with them like it's so random it doesn't make much sense but that's so great.

I'm not really thinking of any others, besides Jean/Kevin which for some reason? doesn't really compel me?

[ninyard]

random ask i send everyone cause i like to know: favorite non canon aftg ship if you have one? if you don't non canon ships favorite canon aftg pairing (no andreil allowed though, pick a different one)

My basic and easy answer is kandreil

My less popular one is MAYBE Kevin x Allison (kevison? kevallison?) the potential there for me is *chefs kiss*

I fuck with kevjean, kandrew/kevneil seperately and jenee is also v special to me. jerejean is a given at this stage tbh.

I think all this really says about me is that Kevin Day works in almost every possible pairing because he is pretty and bisexual and has more bitches than anyone else. Any pairing involving Kevin is 100000000x hotter just because he’s there.

[codename-adler]

Can I ask for some PiP information on Eva Josten and/or Matt Dan and Her?

so sorry anon for the delay!!! but be proud of me bc i wanted to crack down on Baby Girl, Good Luck and instead chose to focus on you!!!

>>> Dan, Matt & Her under the cut

Adler's WiPs ~ Project: Eva Josten

There was an idea… to bring in a remarkable spy-assassin… to see if she could become something more… so when they needed her… she could kill the one person they never could… The Butcher’s son, Nathaniel Abram Wesninski.

Enter the Butcher’s daughter: Aleksandra Eva Wesninski. 

Lost to Mary, not even remembered by her own brother, the little Wesninski is on a mission, one she was raised for, one she did not choose, but one she damn sure is embracing now that goddamn Nathaniel has ruined everything. His death would be sweet, sweet ambrosia to her. If she had to dispose of all the other puny sports junkies along the way, she would. Where her own father had failed, where Lola Malcom, Riko and Ichirou Moriyama, and Stuart Hatford had fallen short, she would rise up to the occasion and annihilate the stupid bastard. She would die, not trying, but succeeding. Such was her purpose.

xxx

Adler's WiPs ~ Project: Dan, Matt & Her

Dan x Matt x FOC ot3 AU

New Fox recruit (20F) has had a baby recently whose father she claims was another student in her year (lie);

She kept playing Exy until (X) months and with prowess at that;

Kevin is wildly against picking her (somehow she reminds him of his mother) and thinks a team like the Foxes isn't for babies (like every other team) and that a mother like her isn't for the Foxes;

Dan isn't bothered by the recruit's background and baggage but she does wonder why Wymack pushes so much for her;

Abby convinces Kevin and Dan;

The recruit will live at Abby's with her baby as long as it's viable;

Abby will help take care of the baby; she is quite excited despite the circumstances because she has a really, really good feeling about the recruit and the potential she has to bring the team and Wymack closer together;

Dan isn't very comfortable with the baby and the recruit when they arrive, because they remind her too much of her own background and the adult position she has been forced into at a very young age;

The recruit looks up to Dan so much, though, she can't quite avoid all contact

Andrew very much steers clear of the recruit and her baby despite finding them interesting somehow, and them drawing him in for reasons he can't explain (yet);

Neil is traumatized just at the perspective of having to captain the recruit and being in the same room as a live baby; it's almost enough to make him run away again (almost);

Kevin is very stupid about the whole thing, but the least afraid of the Kandreil triad, and his stupidity ends up being endearing (with the baby, not with the recruit);

Renee & Nicky are the most excited of the Foxes, and also the most apt to babysit;

Aaron really doesn't give a flying fuck about the baby, which is why the baby likes him so much; Katelyn, reasonably, really doubts the safety of having a pregnant-until-recently recruit on the Foxes' roster, and of having the Foxes trusted with a baby, which is why she's relieved when Aaron's got baby-duty, but also pissed he has to have another weight added onto his shoulders; she watches the situation from afar but very much disapproves; she bonds a little with the recruit, tries to help her at times, but sets clear boundaries about 'no babies';

Allison buys a shit ton of baby clothes so as to avoid baby-duty, which she couldn't care less about, as does she for the recruit herself;

And Matt... Matt doesn't really concern himself with the baby nor the recruit until /incident/, because despite each Fox having an opinion, it is mostly Abby (and Wymack) taking care of things when the recruit absolutely can't (and she's doing the absolute most);

Matt tries to support Dan as best as he can, which means a lot, lot, lot of talking about the recruit, which means Matt knows exactly when things start to get personal for Dan, knows the exact moment when Dan falls;

Which means he doesn't even notice himself falling for the recruit as well;

Dan falls first and Matt falls harder.

Basically I wanted the Foxes to have a baby but didn't want to do that to any of them, so I created my own OC and then rocked her shit in a very bad way. As you can see, I have not much (if anything at all) figured out. Title is temporary, just a file name. The OC isn't fleshed out (i know how she gets there, idk wtf she does after that) nor baptized, her baby isn't named or gendered either, I don't know what major incident pushes Dan and Matt to really care, I don't know how Serena Williams or Alyson Felix did to compete while pregnant/recently pregnant but I'm looking into it, and...yeah. I also wanted to explore Matt and Dan's characters, and relationship, because I feel they are wildly underrated and swept aside in fics as just the lovey-dovey couple, and I thought, 'Wouldn't it be wild if the most established couple of the Foxes suddenly got with a 3rd partner?' and thus this idea was born (like someone else's baby I know...) Enjoy this shit show!

[queer-lovebot]

oh now i need a fic of kevin suffering from his cramps

That’s bc you love sunlight and joy and all things good in the world.

The fun thing about Kevin and his cramps is that it can go in any direction. Like really. Let’s step away from the obvious Kandreil KevJean of it all. Let’s get into the niche. KevThea. KevMattDan. KevNicky. KevAaron. KevAllison. Kev and his father even. Whichever poor soul that’s stuck with Kevin will each have such different but character-building experiences with him. One of the many “Kevin Day is human” moments, and his him curled up on the ground and begging for his cravings and even asking for a little bit of cuddling…tummy rubs…braiding his hair back for him as a kindness….turning off the lights and having him slam down pills then pass out

OR it can be super silly and it’s just a compilation of “Kevin Day Hysterical Moments” which include potential red cards, him snapping at people, Kevin glowering. You know the works