#or abuse apologia

[spite-and-waffles]

TIL that if I hate Bruce Wayne and want him to see consequences for his emotional and physical child abuse (I don't mean them being sidekicks that is a genre convention) I shouldn't be in this fandom. Which means, according to this person, the Batfandom is only for Bruce stans who can overlook child abuse. Kinda telling on yourself there mate.

[bigskydreaming]

Imagine if you were a gay or bi man who tried a certain firefighter show because of all the attention it was getting for one of its mains having a later in life bi awakening.....and between seasons you ventured into its fandom in search of material to tide you over til the next one. And you're greeted by a deluge of posts and fics that are just cheerfully homophobic towards one half of the newly out bi character's canon relationship on the basis of 'well he's not the RIGHT gay guy' and pushing the idea that actually its fine to cheat on him because Reasons and he's sexually predacious based on......behind the scenes implications people have divined like they're reading fucking tea leaves.

But don't get it twisted....this fandom, like all fandoms, really cares about representation!

Sorry not sorry, but we really need to kill this idea that fandoms are welcoming and inviting and inherently progressive when they're frequently insular and reductive as fuck. Every single fandom I've been in has had major trends of people doubling down on their own headcanons and fanon interpretations of the characters and willfully enacting trends aimed at running off people who like the 'wrong' characters (usually characters marginalized along one or multiple axes), like the characters in the 'wrong ways' or other bullshit.

Scott is a Bad Friend fics overtaking Teen Wolf fandom was not incidental, it was a FEATURE of the fandom, because the vast majority of that fandom did not want to share its space with anyone who had the nerve to like its main character. Survivors complaining about or criticizing the prevalance of rape fics in a certain fandom has in my experience always led to a reactionary UPTICK in those fics, with gems like 'this character can, will, must be raped' in the tags making it crystal clear that some of these fics exist because how fucking DARE anyone try and push forth a narrative not agreed upon by Fandom Main.

I could cite examples for so many other fandoms, with the commonalities always being that vast majorities in these fandoms are explicitly reacting defensively to being asked to be more mindful of fandom trends revolving around or exacerbating racism, homophobia, transphobia, rape or abuse apologia, ableism, etc....

With the most prolific fucking rallying cry across countless fandoms being "No the fuck we will NOT be doing that," because lolololol.....

Fandom is an inherently progressive space, didn't you hear?

[bonefall]

I haven't read Breezepelt character arc fully, but what in the banana world is the logic of "you're an evil adult, therefore you deserve all the abuse you received as a child"... What??? How do people get those ideas to begin with? Jesus

Most of the time in situations like this, the person just starts with wanting to defend a character they like. 90% of the time this is the abusive man of the week, because due to the nature of WC they liked them as an apprentice and don't like the idea that they're A Bad Guy now. SO they work backwards so their favorite boy is reasonable.

I will say it bluntly; I think the impulse is cowardly and I don't respect it.

Do you relate to a character with flaws that causes them to hurt people? Boohoo. There's no law that says you're only allowed to like perfectly moral characters. Drop the black and white thinking and realize that all people, even people you like or have positive or admirable traits, have the capacity to hurt others.

This is how we get the greatest hits like "Maybe Ashfur trying to murder his ex's kids is her fault actually" and "Perhaps Crowfeather was only an abusive father because the child had bad vibes." You look like a darn fool.

That said, I think the saddest stan behavior I see is when the stan in question was abused themselves, and hasn't unpacked it. It's unfortunately very common.

"Your father getting annoyed that you have inconvenient needs like thirst and hunger is what all dads do!"

"They didn't mean it, so the child is obliged to feel less bad about mistreatment."

"It's not abuse if they only hit you once/on the correct body part/soft enough to not leave a bruise"

"It's normal to feel constant guilt and dread around your parents."

"Abuse is discipline; bad kids deserve to get hit." (Always with the quiet implication; "I know this because I was a bad kid, I made them hurt me.")

It's good to keep in mind this fandom skews young. A lot of them are still repeating the excuses their friends and families made, and that last one is remarkably similar to the Crowfeather claim we're talking about. Child abuse is common, but most people don't want to think badly of their parents.

"A child abuser is an uncaring monster, but my parents are good people who just made some mistakes" -girlie who has not confronted the innate human capacity for harm :X

Sometimes we visit banana world. Other times, we live in banana world.

[uncanny-tranny]

The idea that children are inherently duplicitous, manipulative liars is genuinely doing harm to children and further obfuscates when genuine harm/abuse is occurring because, "what can the adults do, children are demons!"

The idea that children have divine knowledge that transcends adults' own knowledge and they use that knowledge for personal gain is, simply-put, abuse apologism. You are aiding and abetting abusive behaviour from adults, parents/guardians, medical professionals, whomever it might be.

[warrior-cats-rewritten]

Excuse my language.

What is this fucking horseshit?

Tell me you can't take fan criticism without telling me you can't take fan criticism.

"He only wanted to make sure the cat he loved was safe" is that why he's still an arrogant dickhead in TBC?

"Some say His reckless behavior is why Skuclan had to leave the forest for so many generations" we already established that it was human greed and if things are "much simpler" in starclan why would rumors like this float around?

"Even if he had done terrible things" like some of the most horrific acts in the series? "Plenty of cats have done much worse and their Clans have thrived"

Like who? Brokenstar? Who starved his own clan half to death and tried to map-wipe another? Tigerstar? Who almost destroyed all 4 in 1 go? I wouldn't call that thriving, that's bouncing back, but, sure, Firestar's author-possesed corpse. You'd totally say that.

"Starclan doesn't punish living cats."

OH DID THEY STOP DOING THAT?

[homielander]

You called me "Squirt," silly. Remember why? [No.] Oh, Marty— okay. But you do remember, though, that I used to be left in there for hours, days on end. Completely alone, right? Only — I was never really alone, was I? Big Brother was always watching. You were always watching, weren't you, Marty? Huh? But... growing boys have certain... needs, shall we say.

THE BOYS 4.04 | Wisdom of the Ages

[familyagrestefanblog]

I find it... kinda irritating how saying that Hero Gabriel is still a failure of a father even if he's not a bad person is apparently somewhat of a hot take.

It is irrelevant at what extreme end of the moral spectrum Gabriel is - sadistic villain or heroic saint - fact still remains that you wouldn't notice either with Monarque or Hesperia that they are fathers at all, while simultaneously both Adriens are clearly depicted as teenagers who basically have to re-settle themselves into their lives after they were emotionally orphaned in every sense that matters.

It is irrelevant that Alt Gabriel is a hero, not a bad person or that he wasn't outright abusive like our Gabriel, nothing will change the fact that Griffe Noire Adrien's path to healing goes the same route as our Adrien's.

And that is AWAY from his father, not WITH him.

Griffe Noire at the end was roughly were our Adrien started off at the beginning of the show, just this time with a better path ahead Ladynoir wise since they know their identities.

He changed for the better when our Adrien gave him the self-acceptance, understanding and sympathy he didn't receive from Alt Gabriel or anyone else for the matter.

Helped him overcome the grief of loosing their mother and accepting that the self-harming behavior he's acting on (or both of them) is not something she would want for them.

There are 2 reasons why Alt Adrien couldn't get over his mother's death, and that's 1) because unlike our Adrien, Alt Adrien didn't try finding new happiness in friendship, and 2) because he too couldn't count on his remaining parent (Gabriel) which made him feel his mother's loss even worse.

Alt Gabriel could be the greatest hero of all time and he still would be a fucked up father because he was so busy being a saint that he apparently barely was a father. When alt Gabe cries in the sewer one would think he'd bring up his child as one of his main motivations, but no, he doesn't.

Because Hesperia is just as little characterized as a FATHER as Monarque.

That aspect of Gabriel didn't change.

Hesperia didn't even fucking know that his son is Griffe Noire either, how attentive to you think this man IS??

Alt Adrien goes on the same path as our Adrien and that's away from being emotionally dependent on his father - the way a 14 year old should normally ALLOWED TO BE bc thats NATURAL and how it's supposed to be - to make friends, but most importantly he sure as hell went on being emotionally dependend on HIS Maribug the way our Adrien was/is

Especially the last picture is extremely telling (and one would think our Marinette would finally start paying attention bc Griffe Noire's change right in front of her eyes is literally all she would need to help her fully understand HER Chat Noir's behavior and how that came to be. But apparently we can't ever have Marinette pick up on the most obvious stuff about Chat Noir's problems).

Unlike Toxinelle who is waving goodbye while holding Griffe's hand, HE is not acknowledging our dimension anymore even when he's the last one to enter the portal by a good bit, bc he's so fixated on his Maribug as his whole world bc just like our Adrien he's literally emotionally an orphan and needs an anchor like everyone else.

Good chance that Toxinelle thinks they're just normally holding hands and she's merely going in first, but no, he is letting her lead him out. He doesn't care whats behind or ahead of him, he's just seeing her.

Alt Gabriel is an awful father and you can tell because Alt Adrien literally has to re-settle in life similar to an orphan while his father is still alive and living in the same damn house!

THAT'S what decides if Alt Gabriel is an awful father, NOT him running around as a charming hero. The quality of parenthood is NOT measured by how "good of a person" the parent is, it's measured by the child's fucking well-being

And I don't know if you noticed it by now, but this is the same logic as our Gabriel being hailed a hero after his death. The special already elaborates on this new angle of Gabriel suddenly being a "hero" while he very clearly was a monstrous failure of a father (and person).

So what side are YOU gonna be on here?

Are you going to victim blame Adrien by just declaring Gabriel Agreste a great, blameless and loving father now because that's what you're being told at face-value while the narrative conveniently plays the case in Gabriel's favors by removing all of them from the dimension they are actually from so his faults are being mostly covered up, and Adrien's looks worse without its proper context of their home-dimension and father-son dynamic

Or are you going to fucking LOOK at the child this amazing hero is emotionally abandoning on a daily in way too many ways and ask yourself if that's the result of a competent and attentive parent?

[zootzbootz]

oh boy... I have a LOT to say today. so. buckle up.

telling systems that locking away dangerous/abusive/problematic alters under any circumstances is "bad and wrong" is... quite honestly abuser apologia and puts the well-being over a single headmate- the ABUSIVE one mind you- over their actual victims. over the rest of the system.

now I don't advocate for this extreme case scenario in every situation. locking away a headmate should only ever be used in the most dire and last resort situation. if the alter in question is shown to have no desire the change and all their presence causes is legitimate harm to the rest of the system (or even people outside of it) locking them up shouldn't be off the table.

"but but but - locking them away is cruel and unnecessary!!11! 1! 1! 1!! 🥺🥺" you know what else is cruel and unnecessary?? forcing an abusers victims to be around said abuser nearly 24 fucking 7. and within a system- locking that abuser away may be their only option. they can't always "hash things out" because, and some of y'all really need to get this through y'alls heads- not every abusive alter is like that because they're "hurting and misunderstood" some are just LEGITIMATELY BAD PEOPLE.

while on that note, actually. I honestly HATE the narrative that all abusive/problematic/harmful alters in systems are just "misunderstood and hurting 🥺🥺"

like- yes, absolutely, that is the case at times.

But it isn't like that in every single scenario.

people need to realize that bad people exist as in. legitimately bad people. people who know their behaviour is wrong and do not care and continue to act like that anyway and no amount of "talking it out" is going to make them change their minds.

and people like this aren't limited to singlets either.

like bro consequences have actions.

in the OW- if someone does something horribly fucked up. you know what happens to them? they get locked away in PRISON. (which yes the system as it's issues. that isn't really the point tho. the point is if you are a danger to other people. you're obviously going to be removed from being able to interact with other people in mass.)

I don't think seperating a genuinely dangerous and problematic alter is all that different. it's protecting the rest of the system from somebody who WOULD unequivocally harm them had they been allowed to roam free otherwise.

[finalgirlsamwinchester]

Elizabeth Jean Hornbeck, Who's Afraid of the Big Bad Wolf?: Domestic Violence in The Shining

[cringefaecompilation]

actually yeah it does bug me (well, more confuse me tbh) that there wasn't a lot of aftermath to trapping delilah, as narratively deserved as being forgotten and discarded as she did, but the one silver lining to all of that is that nobody is making shitty meta posts insisting laudna is "the real abuser" for using her as an infernal engine

[hussyknee]

[bonefall]

God I am so tired of Bramble fans who refuse to use critical thinking and believe that brambleclaw and squilf are equally bad. Many also hate on moonkitti's video which they most likely haven't even watched or misconstrued points in it. You can like a character without defending all their actions please I'm begging you

And people will sometimes jump to their defense, saying that people just dogpiled them for liking a character the fandom doesn't like, and while that can happen, sometimes people are actually dogpiling them for ignoring abuse and insulting creators with different opinions

(Some discourse happened on Twitter recently about this but it's something I've seen happen before, I'm not specifically talking about anyone)

I'm going to be honest and drop my feelings.

Never have I ever actually SEEN a Bramblefan "get dogpiled" for liking Bramble.

I come out here on my massive soapbox every couple of weeks and drop whole essays on this guy, I chat casually about how important he is to me as a character, both as someone who was abused in a way similar to Squirrelflight AND as someone who can relate to Bramblestar's situation, and before BB got so large and my attention was easier to divide I even ran an AU called Sweet Nothings which had a "big brother" Bramble take in it.

There is no shortage of Bramblestar-related posts around here, yet, I have never, NEVER gotten shit for when I talk positively about Bramble.

In fact, he's commonly cited as one of the favorite cats to see on this blog from my audience. I get praise for addressing him with nuance, explaining how his actions are abuse while also keeping him human, talking about how his life is a painful cycle of self-doubt that makes him double down on his worst decisions. Every time I post about him, I get an influx of comments centered around how my takes on him are appreciated.

What I DO see is people who make art where they try to bothsides him and Squirrelflight, or say something completely false about his behavior, or straightup post DARVO tactics to defend their fav's honor. When someone makes a comment that goes "uhmm? Bit strange innit?" they call it "harassment." Or when people block them, they call that "receiving hate."

OR when someone makes a vaguepost like "Heyyy, DARVO is an abuse denial tactic where the abuser or their apologists Deny the abuse took place, Attack the accuser, and then Reverse Victim and Offender to claim they were actually the person harmed. Bramblestans are playing this out, step for step, and that's bad!" they call THAT dogpiling.

Meanwhile Moonkitti got death threats and was actually harassed for posting Bramblestar Is Worse. To the point where she is hesitant to ever make another video on the topic.

So y'know what? Hot take? The stans don't actually like Bramblestar. They like the vague idea of a sadboy character who broke free from his dad's legacy so they slurp up the framing of the notorious abuse apologist writers, and they get mad when people who have critically engaged with the books don't see what they desperately crave.

How can you really LIKE a character if you can't engage with their actions? If you need to surround yourself in an unpoppable bubble and can't accept anything he's done in the 20+ years he's been active? How can you truly love a man without all his mistakes?

It's sooo hard to be me, Tumblr User Bonefall, the ONLY one who likes Bramblestar correctly. It's rough out here.

[barbiegirldream]

im actually without words, this level of victim blaming i'd only see it towards woman by alt-right fuckers but now i've been seeing it from "leftis" and it's just so dissapointing. Those leftis didn't learn nothing about the most famous lowcows cases like and how the alt-right are using them and enjoying what they're doing. They want dream gone so are using "progesist" people and ways of talking to get more reclutes to harass him

it's genuinely so scary imagine if you're a victim right. and you see everyone saying if he's younger than you it doesn't count. if he calls you slurs he was just drunk. if he hits you he was just drunk. and he said he was sorry get over it. if he hates jews he was drunk. it's not his job to manage himself because 20 year olds are little boys. if you don't have evidence you're lying. if you do you're just trying to blackmail him or to ruin his career! if you tell everyone you're trying to seem like a good person for exposing him but you're not a hero bitch. if you wait two months that's too long get over it.

[angorwhosebabyisthis]

every now and then i remember the time a few years ago, when sdmi fandom first had its revival thanks to netflix, when a wildly popular sdmi blog run by an anti said the words 'perfectly good Black woman' in reference to why you should ship [man you could easily read as white, whose arc she was fridged for] with her instead of [hatesink character whose race is ambiguous due to being a furry, but has a BLISTERINGLY antiblack narrative under a thin layer of fantasy racism, with a fun side of homophobia and holocaust denial the latter of which is directly invoked in the post], which got hundreds of notes, and i grimace my face through the back of my head all over again lmao

[bonebabbles]

slash did disrespect the dead but at least he's not leaving the bodies out to rot like a spectacle for all to see. HORRENDOUSLY low bar, i know, but ... eugh

Like... he left Misty's corpse out there for at least a day, maybe longer. Wind Runner and Gorse HAPPENED to find it, and that lead to the Bumble death scene. Clear Sky disrespecting the dead was a relevant plot point.

But the team doesn't remember their own books so they've just totally forgotten that!

[hurremsultanns]

So sick of seeing Magnificent Century 'hot takes' that are just blaming Hürrem for the abuse that she suffered