#not to say any of those things are inherently... bad?

[magicisrealandsoismyally]

Have you ever met a trans woman? In real life? Because it feels like you view us the exact same as you view cis men. And I don't blame you for being afraid, you're operating off a lack of information. I'm not saying you're automatically wrong, but I definitely feel like your opinions would be different if you actually knew and made efforts to understand and hear more trans voices.

You have a lot of focus on AMAB and AFAB, but sex isn't a set in stone reality. Plenty of AMABs don't have penises, and plenty of AFABS do. Bottom surgery fully exists, and your argument doesn't consider people who have genuinely, medically modified their sex. Are we going to segregate based on assigned sex at birth? Because that would be transphobia, inherently equating people's sex at birth to what gendered spaces they're allowed within. Are we going to segregate based on current sex? Because now we're checking people's genitals and locking community behind the ability to afford sex reassignment surgeries. At the end of the day, the idea of segregation is flawed and fascist. The patriarchy and elite defines and separates us based on sex as a way to have us at each others throats instead of the real issues.

"any more than 0 women is unacceptable as a sacrifice to validate AMAB identity/feelings"

I need you to understand that this is a transphobic statement. I'm not saying you're a bad person or anything. Internalized transphobia is something everyone has, even me. It's our duty as people fighting for a better world to realize that kinda thing. It feels like your idea of being a trans ally is allowing trans men into feminist spaces, but as long as you exclude all trans women, you're still being a transphobe. Being a trans ally isn't just about being nice to trans people or letting some of them into your spaces, it's about accepting their gender identity. You're not a trans ally by treating trans men like cis women and trans women like cis men. You're still assigning social gender to sex at birth. I'm not telling you this to say you're bad, I'm saying this to help you realize that your argument is transphobic.

If we define our society through our fear of other groups based entirely off things that people do not choose, sex, gender, race, cultural group, etc., you are just reinventing fascism. You cannot be free if you still choose to wear the chains. You are not going to become free with the tools of your oppressor. The more you define the world with biological sex, the more the patriarchy wins. Because they also assign traits to people based on biological sex. That's how we ended up like this. Real change comes from destroying their tools, not taking them for ourselves.

Racism, ableism, and sexism are all older than capitalism yes, but they're all products of fear and hatred encouraged by elites to keep people in line, to stop people from uniting against them. Capitalism is another in a long line of power structures using hatred as a tool to stop us from actually uniting against those with power. Trans women are not your enemy. Segregating yourself from us is not going to help you overcome these power structures.

I mean this in the kindest way I can, you are letting fear define your politics. Just like every fascist's supporters have. You are letting fear of a group you do not understand or interact with, define how you treat them. Please, talk to some transfems, it will do you some good. You have an idea of us in your mind that doesn't reflect who we are in the slightest. We are not men. We never have been.

I'm not against creating specific safe spaces if that's necessary, but your entire argument is laced with subtle transmisogyny, and it tells me you're not coming at this from a healthy mindset. Have a great day, and I really hope you can see what I'm seeing upon reflection.

"OP is a terf" is a thought-terminating cliche meant to keep you from questioning the status quo and keep you afraid of being labeled a heretic should you come to your own conclusions about anything.

[bigskydreaming]

Imagine if you were a gay or bi man who tried a certain firefighter show because of all the attention it was getting for one of its mains having a later in life bi awakening.....and between seasons you ventured into its fandom in search of material to tide you over til the next one. And you're greeted by a deluge of posts and fics that are just cheerfully homophobic towards one half of the newly out bi character's canon relationship on the basis of 'well he's not the RIGHT gay guy' and pushing the idea that actually its fine to cheat on him because Reasons and he's sexually predacious based on......behind the scenes implications people have divined like they're reading fucking tea leaves.

But don't get it twisted....this fandom, like all fandoms, really cares about representation!

Sorry not sorry, but we really need to kill this idea that fandoms are welcoming and inviting and inherently progressive when they're frequently insular and reductive as fuck. Every single fandom I've been in has had major trends of people doubling down on their own headcanons and fanon interpretations of the characters and willfully enacting trends aimed at running off people who like the 'wrong' characters (usually characters marginalized along one or multiple axes), like the characters in the 'wrong ways' or other bullshit.

Scott is a Bad Friend fics overtaking Teen Wolf fandom was not incidental, it was a FEATURE of the fandom, because the vast majority of that fandom did not want to share its space with anyone who had the nerve to like its main character. Survivors complaining about or criticizing the prevalance of rape fics in a certain fandom has in my experience always led to a reactionary UPTICK in those fics, with gems like 'this character can, will, must be raped' in the tags making it crystal clear that some of these fics exist because how fucking DARE anyone try and push forth a narrative not agreed upon by Fandom Main.

I could cite examples for so many other fandoms, with the commonalities always being that vast majorities in these fandoms are explicitly reacting defensively to being asked to be more mindful of fandom trends revolving around or exacerbating racism, homophobia, transphobia, rape or abuse apologia, ableism, etc....

With the most prolific fucking rallying cry across countless fandoms being "No the fuck we will NOT be doing that," because lolololol.....

Fandom is an inherently progressive space, didn't you hear?

[storywestistrash]

i am actually so tired of the way westerners treat eastern europeans

[sunbunnyyy]

i know i just got here, but seeing all of the laughably bad takes from both sides of the spectrum is convincing me that no, i don’t actually need to be on social media again.

[dykeogenes]

Hmm I believe I remember learning a few years ago that when one is asked to acknowledge that they’re impacted subconsciously by systemic racism/sexism/homophobia etc, or is told that they’re behaving in a way that’s bigoted/harmful, “no I’m not” is the wrong answer. So I think some of you should get less excited about saying that when Jewish people tell you you’re being antisemitic.

[tricksterlatte]

The Online Fandom 7 Deadly Sins

sloth: complaining about how no one writes the tropes or pairings you like and bashing what's already out there, while refusing to create anything you desire yourself

greed: zine and other finance-related scandals with zero remorse for those negatively affected

gluttony: spending rent money on merch, experiencing buyer's remorse, then repeating the same process next month

wrath: anon hate over literally everything under the sun, even harassing official writers and threatening them if they don't make your ship canon

pride: devaluing other's characterizations and ships to praise yours as better, whether through a canon perspective or a moral perspective, when neither matter in the long run when it comes to your own enjoyment

envy: trash talking others' fandom creations or saying you won't bother creating anything because it'll never be as good as them

lust: fighting over who tops or bottoms because of your personal preferences when one, both, or neither could happen, especially when most of these characters never even kiss canonically nor have most people fighting done any of these things irl themselves

[bogkeep]

i think. that if My Trauma™ has taught me anything, is that a lot of the time, what makes something Malicious Manipulation is the context.

like, of course we want to be able to tell when someone is trying to decieve us, and there are plenty of phrases to raise red flags and linguistic tricks designed to rope us along, to be sure... but someone saying the truth in a kind way and someone lying with ill intent can say the exact same thing. the difference is that one does not match up with reality. and yeah, that's scary! that's the whole thing about trust!! every time i see an analysis of someone's behaviour on social media with a framing of that person being SUSPICIOUS and MANIPULATIVE, it honestly really fucks with my head because ANYTHING can be posited as Suspicious and Manipulative. blocked people? didn't reply to every message from strangers? didn't publicly adress a topic or a controversy? took a break from the internet? said literally anything at all??? sounds like normal and healthy social media behaviour to ME, but what do i know! anyone who has the misfortune of finding themself the target of a smear campaign will quickly find that there's Nothing you can say or do that doesn't look Suspicious. if even a genuine effort to rectify a mistake or explain what happened can be seen as MANIPULATING THE MASSES, what chance do you have if you react in a normal, human way to being bullied? or, on the flip side, if you hold on to bad faith and read it in everything, if even generic niceness creeps you out, if there is no way for anyone to prove their innocence or humanity to you - that doesn't seem like a pleasant way to live, either. nor is constantly worrying if anything you say will come off as Malicious or Manipulative.

like, yeah. there's shitty people out there. i don't have any good advice on avoiding them. i trust easy, i often forget people can Just Go On The Internet And Tell Lies - yes i am quite autistic thank you - and my main two defenses are "i don't like the thing you're saying, either because the contents are bad or because the contents don't make any sense" and "the things you're saying and the things you're doing don't match up". those only really work if i trust myself enough, and sometimes that's hard, too.

anyway those are another two cents nobody asked for but you're getting anyway

[musical-chick-13]

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[unproduciblesmackdown]

also a special shoutout for real like wendy epic ableism moments when she stops talking directly to winston and expresses this is b/c he communicates too incorrectly (here too literally or whatever, once again whether he misinterpreted her or she misinterpreted him, it's put on him) and thus he doesn't deserve that

[mars-ipan]

you guys ever think about the milgram shock experiments? i think about the milgram shock experiments a lot. they feel kinda relevant right now for some reason. hm

[bigskydreaming]

The thing that kills me about the Star Wars prequel trilogy and why I will die on my hill that my problem is not that Star Wars is a tragedy, its that its a badly written tragedy, is that Anakin Skywalker was at his closest to being a good Jedi when he was ten years old.

[rocaillefox]

if you are writing fanfic about a story that has Themes and you say something in the exposition thats Directly Against These Themes, well. depending on what youre saying i may keep reading BUT the point is you are on some Thin Ice. (about if i will keep reading)

[seraphasia]

the problem with self-diagnosis that most concerns me is the risk of people, teenagers especially, pathologizing normative behavior

[arolesbianism]

If I ever do get properly into dst character modding I like have to make an oni character mod at some point, but the issue is Id want it to be an Olivia mod so bad but also Nails is as far as I'm aware the only legal character name wise and as such it feels like it has to be them, y'know for the bit. But also I have already written too much Olivia dst dialogue and I need an excuse to use it damnit

[marsupials-of-mars]

It's funny how often Bill is described as a master manipulator, he's so smart that he knows what everyone is thinking and how to push their buttons.

Because he is SO BAD at manipulation!

The only reason he ever gets what he wants is because he can literally read and control minds. And historically, he is pretty shit at using what he learns in a productive way.

Every time he has a human partner, it's because they are obviously desperate for something he can provide. All he does is use the fact that he's a seemingly omniscient otherworldly being to gain ethos, and then tell them he can get them the thing they want.

These are not complicated concepts. Anyone with those inherent advantages could do that. And, historically, when the actual negotiations are up to him and he hasn't backed someone into a corner, he pretty immediately fumbles the bag.

Think of when he possessed that priest: he pitched his plans outright with zero tact and everyone in the room immediately refused and dedicated themselves to making sure he never got his way.

The pharoh DISPISED him, found him annoying and tried to banish him. The shaman caught wise pretty quick. Xgqrthx never even planned on helping him at any point. Every plan failed because of Bills own ineptitude, when all the cards were stacked in his favor!

The way he talked to Ford was disturbing and direct and entirely Bill-like. Ford was just a sponge for any flattery and happened to be into the way Bill spoke and left him rats and suggested murder because he is also abnormal.

Bill is bad at making friends, which is why he has just a few henchmaniacs he's gathered over billions of years.

People DO NOT LIKE HIM.

And he's in denial about that to an extent. He always thinks they'll be on his side once he reveals his true intentions. He always thinks they'll go for the promise of infinite power and destruction because who wouldn't?

Basically, for an immortal god who's had an unfathomably long time to practice social skills and can LITERALLY ENTER MINDS TO KNOW EXACTLY WHAT TO SAY... he's really, really bad at manipulation. And really, any sort of person to person connection.

[tofixtheshadows]

You guys really need to stop and consider the ways you're talking about Kabru I am dead fucking serious. Like I know that flattening characters is just what fandom does to a certain extent, but Kabru's actual personality is getting lost to the fandom hivemind insisting that he's aggressive/cruel/sociopathic/hateful, and these are particularly concerning takes to see leveled at the only brown character in the main cast day after day. "My poor sweet golden child Laios needs to be protected from this scary brown man" is not a good look! Like, it's very telling that the bulk of the hate and bad faith readings are reserved for Toshiro and Kabru. Everyone else's flaws get to be discussed and validated and forgiven (or erased), meanwhile people are straight making up things to be mad about with Toshiro and Kabru but patting themselves on the back for being smart.

The worst part is how undeserved it all is. I'm trying to lay off anime-onlys because we're still kind of in the red herring stage of getting to know Kabru, but I would still like to gently suggest that even if you think Kabru is up to something, you don't gave to get in the tags of every fan creator's post and bring up how you hate him or You Can Tell he's totally evil. Sometimes I think Kabru's blue eyes give people license to say things about his appearance that they know would sound completely racist otherwise, but referring to his blue eyes acts as a get-out-of-racism free card. The jokes about the dog with brown contacts are getting old, by the way.

For people who have read the manga, it's disappointing. Kabru is one of the most complex and important characters in the story, and if you base your interpretation of him and all your fandom interactions on shallow first impressions you are completely missing out.

I know part of this is because Dungeon Meshi is a comedy, but the story also wants to be taken seriously. For example, it's admittedly really funny when Chilchuck calls Laios "sick in the head", but that doesn't change the fact that the way Chilchuck casually belittles Laios caused him to hide the fact that he was "hallucinating" from his friends for weeks. Those feelings matter.

Like, this

is funny.

But this?

Is not. This is just a very clear example of a brown boy with PTSD. As someone else with PTSD, just looking at this fucking sucks, man.

The only reason why Kabru thinks about killing Laios is because he is in the middle of a flashback. He's struggling through a panic attack. If he truly wanted to kill Laios because he's violent or because he finds Laios inherently annoying, he wouldn't otherwise talk with Laios normally. Notice how he doesn't act this way at any other point in the story- it's just because he's triggered by monsters. Even when he's thinking about his plans to "deal with" Laios later, he's reluctant to actually kill him and only considers it to prevent another tragedy. Despite his deadly skills, Kabru relies far more on "soft" power- insight, persuasion, diplomacy. He's a rare example of a character who absolutely is, or at least can be, manipulative, but seems to use his abilities for good. He's not a pathological liar, he isn't looking down on everyone behind a smile. He's someone who is extremely emotionally intelligent, and he's willing to put aside all his own basic wants and needs to stop the cycle of dungeons devouring humans.

I'm going to cut a potential thesis on his character short and just give some examples of things that fandom should consider about his personality more:

Racism in fandom isn't just about whitewashing in fan art, or using racial slurs. The insidiousness of bad faith readings, reductions to racist tropes, lack of fan content for characters of color, and dismissal of a character's complexity are far more common. You can believe yourself to be completely neutral or even positive about a character and still churn out low-grade bile about them into fandom's collective unconscious. Fandom reflects real life.

And I have been around fandom long enough to see how these behaviors (mostly from my fellow white fans) affect fans of color, how it makes a fandom feel hostile and unwelcome to them. It's fun to make jokes and memes, I'm absolutely not saying that everything needs to be a deeply nuanced take, but we need to be careful that it doesn't veer into toxicity. Please think about how our contributions to fandom come across, and what sort of vibes they cultivate in this communal space.