#mansplaining loki

[lokisgoodgirl]

the rolled up sleeves will never not have an effect on me

thank u for coming to my Ted talk

A gift of the sl-slutty...*wipes brow* slutty forearms?

I'm feeling more myself this morning than I have all week so lemme tell u a tale that no one asked for.

On Friday, my brother in law was staying with us overnight (he showed up at 8am but that's another trauma, still...fucking rude.) - so he and my husband went out in the evening and I did what I am known to do...put on the Loki series and wrote some filth.

They came back about 10pm, and I was getting towards the end of episode three. NOW, connoisseurs will know that episode three features some classic erotic rolling up the sleeves action. As I was trying to concentrate on Mr L tucking up those cuffs, brother in law says "oh, is this the Loki series?" I say... "It is, yes." He goes, "oh... I remember really liking this."

Now...this well meaning fool begins to mansplain Loki to me. 🤣🤣His place in the MCU, his (wrong) backstory. And I'm still pissed of that he had the audacity to spend all day at my house unannounced but I'm trying to be nice so I nod and smile while I can feel my husband lose the will to live with 2nd hand embarrassment for him beside me.

The words, "Did you know Loki's the villain in the first Avengers film" passed his lips- and I was like oh, tell me more BIL. Was that Age of Ultron??

When he finally, mercifully stops, I say "yah, I'm quite familiar with Loki actually" - cue Pikachu face from BIL. "Oh" he says, "have you seen the series before?"

"I have." I say, and husband clears his throat.

"C knows more about Loki than both of us, trust me." he says.

Cue this exact vibe.

Anyway. That awkward silence was followed by THIS SCENE AND THE THREE OF US JUST STARED AT THE TV and i had a little giggle to myself.

In conclusion, thank you for the reminder that Loki's rolled up sleeves are devastating and for making me laugh remembering this tale. Also this pic 👇 is new to me and is genuinely one of the best things I've ever seen 😂😂 his sketches are on par with mine!

For the forearms and to a lesser extent the story : @holdmytesseract @fictive-sl0th @simplyholl @mochie85 @gigglingtigger @ladyofthestayingpower @ijuststareatstuffhereok89 @wheredafandomat @mischief2sarawr @muddyorbsblr @littlespaceyelf @lunarnights95 @cheekyscamp @loopsisloops @lovelysizzlingbluebird

[galaxythreads]

I think that even if Mobius had flat out punched Loki on screen seemingly without reason, Lokius fans would still somehow find a way to frame that with love.

[nostalgia-tblr]

did i mention here the SHOCK REALISATION that sylki fic is often about Loki emotionally supporting Sylvie and lokius fic is often about Mobius supporting Loki, so if you combine those it seems fandom has an overall heirarchy of How Fucked Up Everyone Is and it goes:

Mobius >> Loki >> Sylvie

There are a few conclusions we could draw from this, mine is that I feel so very sorry for the hypothetical character that fandom would consider fucked up enough to need to be emotionally supported by Sylvie D: THAT POOR BLORBO D: D:

[7soulstars]

My Incorrect Universe #97

*At Avengers HQ*

Loki: I don’t think we can mansplain, manipulate, or malewife our way out of it this time.

Bucky, cracking his knuckles: manslaughter it is.

Me, spritzing them with a water spray bottle: hey! no! bad!

*meanwhile in Mirkwood*

Me: I can't believe you tried to assassinate Thorin!

Thranduil: Well, 'assassinate' implies it was politically motivated. I tried killing him because he is a dick, so technically I tried to murder him

Me: ohhhh

Elrond, his blood pressure rising: THAT DOES NOT MAKE IT ANY BETTER-

*me whenever Loki and Bucky misbehave*:

[northrnfool]

You know, toxic masculinity actually takes many different forms:

It can also be thinking that your own stories, the ones that focus on straight white males, are the ones that are underrepresented in media even though they are absolutely not. It’s the perpetuation of the illusion of marginalization.

It’s also patronizing fans (a lot of whom are women and LGBTQ+) who see very clear things in your story telling and treating those fans like they’re less intelligent than you because they are able to read the subtext that’s put onscreen. It reminds me of Dan and David with Game of Thrones and how they would make little post episode videos mansplaining each episode to us even though they were clearly the ones to didn’t have a grasp of the material they were working with.

It’s also not knowing when your opinion isn’t necessary. This show has already been criticized for doing the bare minimum to provide representation, for having Loki say he bi and acting like they did something revolutionary, and following it up with absolutely nothing. But then proceeding to put something onscreen that gave fans hope - like maybe they were actually going to show people in the LGBTQ+ community that their stories matter - only to follow it up with, “oh no, silly fans, it’s cute you think these two men are in love, but male friendships are more important”. Like, goddamn… as @wowwwmobius said, the cognitive dissonance is astonishing.

I’m just flabbergasted.

[bugwolfsstuff]

Loki in my ToL AU summed up:

Loki: i don't think I can manwhore, mansplain, manslaughter my way out of this

*grins* Manipulate it is

[bellaaldamas]

"Progressive" culture, you are here:

Angrboda getting to avoid being faced with her greatest fear and insecurity of being forgotten by Loki/Atreus and, instead, having a positive and loving relationship with him and a support system she never had but has now found in the form of Atreus and his family and friends is "not feminist". It is a "cliche" and - of course - "for housewives and teenage girls". SMS is not here to please those lowly nonintellectual types who want "cheesy stories".

So:

Angrboda actually facing and living out her greatest fear of being a "forgotten chapter" in Atreus/Loki's story (the fear even her grandmother preyed upon when trying to hit Angrboda where it hurt the most - and Gryla knew it was not being a part of Loki/Atreus's life specifically that would cause Angrboda the greatest pain, despite all the other pain she'd already gone through) but suddenly coming to be "okay with it" because she is meant to fulfill a Greater Purpose TM is a "progressive" and "profound" scenario. It is totally not misogynistic to imply a woman does not really know what she wants, does not understand her own mind and is merely projecting her "desperation" for love and understanding onto a man. She is merely assuming she loves him and wants a future with him when she actually wants/needs something else entirely. And the society/narrative will be there to explain (read: mansplain) to her what she really needs.

Then said narrative would conveniently get away with this misogyny by ensuring a female character who "knew nothing about what she really wanted" is respected and cherished by everyone other than the person she cares about the most. This is the "progressive" writing.

Woman's concerns do not have any value and are merely "irrational fears" even if she has a perfectly good reason to have those fears because she's spent years being lonely, vulnerable and having no support system. A woman should be "strong and independent and need NO man" whilst a man gets to grow up, grow old and still have positive experiences, including positive romantic relationships with multiple women. It does not make a man shallow and hormonal and desperate and "not knowing what he wants" at all.

On a serious note, the above is the one scenario that would turn me away from the GowR series. Almost anything and everything else I can potentially handle.

[amarriageoftrueminds]

(1.) Still absolutely wild to me that Tony mansplained collateral damage to a room full of people that included Wanda, whose twin brother was killed by his robots and whose parents were killed in front of her by his missile (same year he was a few hundred miles away in Bern).

And she has still yet to get an apology from him.

Because the only thing Tony has ever listened to is the sound of his own voice.

We had Anton Vanko want to kill Tony to avenge what Howard did to his father (Villain Behaviour), but where is the movie where the grown kids from the Middle East come to kill Tony for him Jericho-nuking their entire villages?

(My god, imagine the numbers! They could form a Club!)

(2.) Tony's betrayal of Clint's innocent family proves why Clint was right not to trust him with this information.

(3.) Tony had the idea for Ultron, had the name picked out already, and was working on it before he went to the Hydra base (where Wanda was) and got the mind stone.

He had already mentioned it to Bruce (because Bruce was able to trot out the name unprompted).

It was entirely Tony's idea, and Bruce had to be emotionally blackmailed into helping with it, because Tony couldn't finish it on his own -- which was the only reason he brought Bruce in on it.

As a sentient being, Ultron's actions are his own fault, but Tony nevertheless had the same idea as Hydra -- Insight 2.0 -- and abused his position to continue to carry it out even though he knew Hydra thought it was a good idea. (And while not under any kind of mind-control; since, as he said himself, 'I wasn't tricked, I was shown.' Wanda didn't make him do anything.)

And he knew it was wrong (otherwise he wouldn't have bothered to keep it a secret; he'd be bragging about it) ...but did it anyway.

And Tony was the one arguing they should blow up the whole city full of people to 'solve the problem', which Steve had to spoonfeed to this idiot that that was wrong.

(4.) Tony wasn't almost beaten to death (pls cut the histrionics, you're embarrassing yourself). He was wearing a full suit of Titanium armour. (Y'know, the Iron Man suit? Thing he's kind of known for? Ring any bells?)

And only stopped homicidally attacking because the suit's power source was disabled in self-defense by his victims, one of whom he literally dismembered.

(5.) Ah yes, Tony's parents he's never mentioned giving a shit about before, Howard the Milkshake Duck who never told him he loved him, and- uh... Martha??

Also: Bucky wasn't brainwashed, he was mind-controlled. Quite literally non compos mentis.

(Notice how the Wanda mind-control Tony stans imagine happened to Tony is seen as an excuse for him voluntarily making Ultron, even before that, but Bucky's actually-legitimately-did-happen mind-control by Hydra isn't enough? )

And Tony didn't initially attack Bucky, he attacked Steve. He cared more about Steve not telling him something than about the actual killing of his parents, and everything that came after was a tantrum to punish Steve for not kissing his shortass or whatever.

Murdering Bucky over the Starks (whose deaths were karmic anyway, since Howard knew about Bucky, was running SHIELDra for decades, etc.) is like someone murdering Clint to punish Natasha for not telling them that Loki made Clint kill a loved one. 🤪

Villain behaviour, even within this movie (as Zemo is basically just European Tony).

And why is word of this blorbo considered gospel, but the fact that he admitted to knowing Bucky was innocent and didn't care, not? Selective hearing?

(6.) Ah yes 'infantalizing' [misspelled]

The favourite word of those main-character-syndrome ass people who see a mild neutral view of a character other than their blorbo as an insult to blorbo, somehow?

The thing I can't get over about Wanda and Pietro is how irrelevant Hydra is to them.

Unlike Tony, they never espouse Hydra views or rhetoric (they're literally just there for a chance to kill Tony), and the very first time they're let out of their cages they ditch Hydra immediately, and work with Ultron.

Why let them out of the cages in the first place?

It would've been more dramatically satisfying and coherent to have the Avengers find them still in their cells, try to release them as hostages / victims (which they are), and then the Maximoffs attack their rescuers (because they're trying to get at Tony).

Ultron is Hydra-adjacent because Hydra had the same idea to create him as Tony, (and the mechanical bodies Ultron possesses are the drones from the Hydra base, which Hydra built in preparation for this). But the mind-stone had exhibited malignant behaviour already in Avengers 1 (remember when Bruce picked up the scepter?) So who knows how much is down to Hydra influence rather than the stone's natural evil mojo and/or Tony's shitty personality rubbing off?

Being a robot, Ultron is able to lie to Wanda, and does so in order to get the twins on side... so that shows that the twins' values are incompatible with Hydra-adjacent goals, and that Ultron could clock that immediately.

Also: putting aside the revenge quest was a sign of Wanda and Pietro doing a hero-turn away from villainy.

Because a parents-deaths-revenge quest is *repeat after me*

📣 VILLAIN. 📣 BEHAVIOUR. 📣

(7.) As Thor said it in Ragnarok 'he's a friend from work!' And that's about two guys who actually get along!

Tony is not Steve's friend; he's just That Annoying Guy at the Office.

Worse, he's that annoying little oik whose daddy founded the company and who now whines about having to pay for everything... when this is literally a non-profit and none of them are drawing a salary, even though Whiner is a billionaire.

He's the nepobaby up to his eyeballs in blood, but throwing a vicious tantrum because the Most-Respected Unpaid Intern doesn't trust him, for some reason. 🤷‍♀️

i,,,,,,,,,, do not even feel like talking about all the ultron and anti team cap stuff. if any of y’all want to, please feel free

but i do want to talk about clint barton:

STOP MAKING CLINT INTO THIS ASSHOLE WHO LEAVES HIS FAMILY BEHIND AT A DROP OF A HAT AND THEN END UP BLAMING TONY FOR HIS STUPIDITY

i don’t like mcu clint barton, but this is wrong. clint is a hero, which means that he’s gonna fight for what he believes in. he believed the accords were wrong (they were, but that’s not what this is about), so he fought against them. that doesn’t make him an asshole and nor does that make him stupid

but you know what? he did blame stark and he was fully within his rights to blame him. stark revealed that clint had a family to ross, a powerful government agent who has been given free reign to anything regarding enhanced individuals and vigilantes

[incorrectmarvels]

Sylvie: Gaslight, gatekeep, girlboss

Loki: Mansplain, manifest, manipulate

[goodnightt-moonn]

gaslight

gatekeep

girlboss

mansplain

manipulate

malewife

[worstloki]

Is it possible that Sylvie faked the kiss only to distract Loki, get him outta her way and kill the crazy dude writing scripts for timeline

Don't get me wrong, I only stan aroace Loki and I can't help but see this as a proof of his character development and self love, so if they'd become a cannonical couple... Let's just say I won't be happy.

:)

Sylvie kissed Loki to steal the Tempad like the girlboss she is and killed the only witness and has now gaslit the timeline into undoing it before deciding to slip the bracelet on and gatekeep the place herself

[mxlcncholy]

As a Lokius shipper, I’m gonna put in my two cents here (I mean no aggression and i don’t want to start an argument. I just want to clear things up).

It’s a common misconception that people think Lokius shippers hate on Sylki because of how it contradicts Lokius. “If Sylki is canon Lokius will never happen, and that’s why we are against the ship!” I’ve seen multiple people on this site make this assumption, but I speak for myself and most probably most of the fandom when I say that this is NOT the case why we don’t really like Sylki.

Personally, I’ve had my fair share of really queerbaity, largely hinted but never canon ‘queer ships’ from different forms of media. And when connecting with other Lokius fans through the internet, I found that a lot of them share common interests with me on those ships as well. I think most of the Lokius fans who share other common interests/ships with me can agree that we are very used to ships not being canon and are completely fine with it. What’s the joy in having a happy, everything-is-fine-and-they-are-canonically-together ship? Isn’t that what fanfics are for?

No, the main reason why most of us Lokius shippers can’t deal with the Sylki ship is due to its really weird message/vibe that it’s emanating. Now I’ve been a crew mate on the Lokius ship ever since the dawn of its existence (the first trailers that came out in Dec 2020 and early 2021, as you will), and I’ve witnessed the entire development of the fandom during Season 1. In the first two episodes, everyone was really excited to see how Loki and Mobius’ relationship would actually turn out, but more importantly, who the mysterious hooded person the trailers showed us was (spoiler alert: it was Sylvie). So Sylvie appeared at the end of Season 1 Episode 2, and everyone went crazy with her mystifying appearance. Introduced at the end of Episode 1 as a ‘Loki variant’, who actually IS she? What is her relationship to VariantL1130!Loki (or in simpler words, our Loki)? What is her deal? How did she get here?

In Season 1 Episode 3, a connection was made between Loki and Sylvie as both of them shared more about their story. But the ‘connection’, as it seems, stems from their common background and origin. The show has established that Sylvie was also ‘a Loki variant’ which, is unnervingly vague. Does that mean she shares the same parentage as L1130 Loki? And again, what is her connection to L1130 Loki?? At the end of the episode, most of us (these statistics all come from experience and online interaction since I was deep in the fandom and gained a lot of Lokius shippers’ feedback when Season 1 was airing in 2021) deemed their dynamic to be very ‘sibling rivalry’ for one reason or the other, 1) because it was the vibe they gave off (I can back this up since I have a sibling), 2) because they have been established as the same person. So that was the direction we thought the show was heading in when Season 1 Episode 3 was airing.

But then. Season 1 Episode 4. They deemed it a romantic connection. Again a million questions surfaced. Aren’t they the same person? Didn’t they JUST give off a sibling dynamic in Episode 3? What the fuck is going on?

Of course, a lot of the ‘Lokius for-lifers’ that have been here since the beginning were confused. Other watchers began to jump onto the Sylki ship, since admittedly, they also have a kind of very… unique chemistry established in the show (and is pretty much canon). This episode was where the Lokius-Sylki ‘rivalry’ originated.

Now I don’t know to what extent you know about this ‘history lesson’ that I’m just mansplaining to you right now, but in the Lokius fandom, it was a really common view that Sylki was just. Weird. Sylvie was introduced as a ‘Loki’ in EPISODE 1. That’s why people did not care for the relationship that Marvel offered us between Loki and Sylvie. Aren’t they the same person? This timeline stuff they’ve put out in the later episodes (4-6) were confusing and the information was densely organised but there were absolutely no clear answers as to if Loki and Sylvie were ACTUALLY the same person or not. But judging on how people interpreted the information about pruned timelines and stuff, there were two verdicts: 1. Loki and Sylvie were the same person (due to how they come from the same MAIN timeline before being apprehended by the TVA, you know, since the TVA firmly believes in pruning any other timeline that deviated from the main one, which was ) or 2. They are not the same person (supported with different pieces of evidence such as ‘multiverse theory’ or ‘Loki is just a title like Spider-Man or Batman’, some of them contradictory to each other, some of them making sense). Some Sylki shippers enjoyed the ship under the circumstance that they are not related at all (which, fair), and I’ve seen some Sylki shippers admit to the incest/sibling factor being the main reason why they enjoy the ship. A bit weird.

As someone who does not support incest (with a very clear reason why), Sylki is a ship that enters a lot of grey area. They do have chemistry, yes, but judging the circumstances, is the chemistry even… ethical? The answers are very vague and very hard to come by.

I don’t speak for the entire Lokius fandom when I say that we don’t give a hoot in hell as to which ship becomes canon. In fact, Lokius-Sylki multishippers such as yourself is proof to how Lokius shippers don’t care about another ship existing at the same time as Lokius. Most of us aren’t THAT immature to shit on other ships because of that contradiction. The reason why we dislike Sylki is due to how it might insinuate incest (or just literal self-cest, it isn’t a word and it isn’t a scientifically possible thing but from the self pollination of flowers, I think we can all hypothesise what happens when the unlikely event of someone getting with another version of themselves happens). If the show writers had CLARIFIED in WHAT way Sylvie is a Loki (and clarified that they AREN’T RELATED IN ANY WAY), Lokius shippers would’ve just stopped attacking the Sylki ship (because if it wasn’t for the potential incest, it would be a valid and healthy ship and no one would have a problem with it).

One last thing, before you accuse me of bias, I would like to say that I have friends that are also Marvel fans that do not ship Lokius or Sylki and are still icked by the Sylki ship due to its potentially incestuous relationship. I’ve seen a lot of comments online that think the same. Similarly, I’ve also seen a lot of comments online that just do not give a shit about either ship and accepts whatever canon relationship Marvel throws at them. It’s a big fanbase. No matter which side you’re on, you will always find someone who shares the same view.

TL:DR: Lokius shippers do not hate the Sylki ship because of how it contradicts Lokius, but they hate the ship because of its potential incest connotations. It’s really not anyone’s fault and I don’t blame Sylki shippers for spotting the chemistry and shipping them under the circumstances of them not being related. The way this ‘shipper war’ can be solved is in the (quite unlikely) scenario that the show writers clarified that they were not the same person, which, would be the best outcome for literally ALL of us Loki TV show enjoyers. Thank you for reading.

I really hate the fighting between Lokius and Sylki shippers.

Unpopular Opinion: I’m on both teams. I ship both of these pairings. Hell I even like Sylvie x B-15. Give me two characters and I’ll find a way to ship them - okay, maybe not all but you get what I’m saying.

My point is, why can’t people just be allowed to enjoy what they enjoy?

I understand the importance of queer characters & pairings, and Loki himself is canonically queer, but that shouldn’t mean we fight each other about what ship is more cannon, or what ship is better or whatever else there is to possibly argue about. I think we can agree marvel isn’t the best (like most shows and money making corporations) at portraying queer characters and relationships.

But just because someone ships Sylvie and Loki, doesn’t mean it’s a personal attack on the ship of Loki and Mobius.

I think both ships are beautiful in their own way.

Mobius was Loki’s first proper friend. He showed Loki it was okay to let down your defences, he was with him till the end (a few wobbles but that’s friendship), and above all he cares for Loki. He risked his skin (literally) to save him and anchor him to the timeline. His first thought was ‘okay let’s sort you out before anything else’ with his time slipping, and helped calm him down from his panicked state, wanting to ensure he was okay. He loves Loki (take that as you will).

Sylvie was the first person Loki was able to relate to personally, knowing how she felt, seeing what it did to her. He began to understand himself because of her. He realised there was more to life than power and a throne, that he was capable of caring for another selflessly. She made him feel how he most likely made Thor feel many times. Betrayed. And it was an important step that Loki needed to take, but he still chose to try and find her because he knows she needs him. She is a complex character, like Loki. He loves Sylvie (take that as you will).

Very different ships. Very different dynamics. Very different people.

Besides, it’s Loki. He probably fancies them both.

(also I’m not that active in either communities because of the drama, but I observe and quietly ship to myself. both ships.)

[gcthamgays]

Gaslight:

Gatekeep:

Girlboss:

Manipulate:

Mansplain:

Malewife:

[youaremysunshine-court]

This fucking bitch just tried to tell me that the "fluid" on Lokis sheet referred to him in other universes, I told him that Loki is canonically genderfluid in the comics, and he left me on read because haha I guess he googled it. Bitch.

[cricket-moth]

I JUST SAW SOMEONE SAY THE M. IN MOBIUS M. MOBIUS’S NAME STANDS FOR MALEEWIFEEE IM CRYYYING

[benevolentgodloki]

There were more important things than mansplaining the Chitauri to her at this moment. She must have been young at the time of the attack, which was boggling to think of when for him the events had been only a matter of weeks ago.

Loki stayed still. She was alone and they both knew it. He could snatch an arrow with ease if it came to it. He could do worse than she was probably even aware. What he wanted, however, was to appear calm and to encourage that in his hunter.

"What I did before, who I was before, cannot be taken back. Whether you believe me or not, I came back to help. I came here last as a conqueror and a monster. That is not who I want to be."

“They flew their speeders into buildings and made them explode! I’d call that pretty suicidal.” The grip around her bow tightened so hard that her knuckles turned white, familiar material digging into her hand. She rotated the button and in response her quiver picked one of her trick arrows heads, mounting it onto a shaft.

She’d only seen Loki on pictures, videos, footage from the day her father had passed away. His picture was burned into her mind. Seeing him back in New York, so many years later had felt like a smack in the face, old, long burried emotions digging themselves back onto the surface. Kate wasn’t a Widow or a legendary assassin, so hiding was harder. There was no doubt in her mind she had to follow him, but now... Kate was scared.

“Nevermind that! What are you doing back in New York. More distruction to cause? More people to hurt?”