#helena meta

[trackingthehuntress]

I don’t think I could ever really pick a favorite thing about Helena, but something I think I’ve loved since the beginning of my love for her, - starting with cry for blood and going on to reading her other stuff - something I love is that she’s not really ever a character who gets fixed. Basically all of her connections in the heroism community (except for like. Dinah and Renee) have at one point or another viewed her as a problem, as someone who needs their solution, as someone who needs to be managed or manipulated. So many other characters look at her and see something that needs to be controlled, and at times the individual comics’ narratives agree with this and uphold it. But when you look at the whole of her character history, you see someone who never has the exact answer, who is never sure if she is actually a hero or still that scared little girl whose family was murdered. She’s always throwing away her costume only to pick it up again a few days later. She isn’t static, but her problems run deeper than ones that can be given a simple fix.

where was I? Oh right - she’s not a character who gets fixed. Because every person who thinks they can fix her, or control her, or agrees with people who try, or anything like that? It fails, in any way that matters. Think about max lord, think about batman, think about nightwing, think about oracle. Even if their plans succeeded in the short term, did they have any lasting effect on her or who she is? No - they all ended badly for someone, and only someone who recognized the harm of treating someone like this and apologized was able to get anywhere close to a healthy, meaningful relationship with Helena (that would be Barbara, by the way). So the thing that i love is that even when the people around her are all trying to shove her into a box and then fix the person they’ve imagined her to be, she is allowed to exist as this multifaceted person who has failures and flaws and struggles yes, but ones outside of the two dimensional person the people around her see her as.

[helena-and-helena-meta]

Welcome, welcome!

I'm Helena, Decay, or Phantomato which ever one ya'll prefer to call me! Sometimes I write and ramble, and my blog is based around the characters Helena and Helena META! Though my current obsession is all versions of ANY Yautjas from Predator/AvP(Especially Wolf) except AP, batfamily, Justice League, and Lapis Lazuli from Houseki no Kuni. LGBTQ blinkies by Shortcakeem0ji :3

The things I write can be taken as platonic or romantic unless explicitly stated that they're platonic! I won't write smut though.

So I thought I'd put this here, but here is my Twst acc!

Also, here is my Azur Lane account the server I'm in is Amagi

Here is my Fate/Grand Order friend code!

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Helena's interests

I like games such as Azur Lane(obv), Destiny and Destiny 2, YuGiOh duel links, Minecraft, Terraria, Stardew Valley, Fate/Grand Order, and Twisted Wonderland

My current anime list consists of That Time I Got Reincarnated As A Slime, Slime Diaries, Land of the Lustrous, YuGiOh, Azur Lane: Slow Ahead!, Umamusume: Pretty Derby, Takt Op. Destiny, Wonder Egg Priority, The Fate series, and Bofuri

My favorite shows are Helluva Boss, Hazbin Hotel, Steven Universe, FBI, SWAT, 911, 911: Lone Star, Kitchen Nightmares, Master Chef, and the first few seasons of Red vs Blue

My favorite movies are Twister, Patriots Day, both TMNT bayverse movies, Dunkirk, Unstoppable, and many more, can't name them all :3

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Helena's writing. Most of my stuff will now also be posted to my Ao3, DecayingHelena, though it's mainly just going to be the James Ironwood stuff

For That He Is Thankful (Rewritten)

Do you fear me? (Rewritten)

Memories of Tempesta(AL x TWST)

Floral Fever(OM)

Floral Fever 2(OM)

Ice cream (Rewritten)

"They called me what?"

"I love you."

Kiss(James Ironwood x reader)(Rewritten)

"Shall we dance?"(Ironwitch)(Rewritten)

A strange craft(RWBY AU)

New hopes(RWBY AU)

James Ironwood headcanons

Unwind with me(RWBY au) (James Ironwood x reader)

James Ironwood headcanons 2

Love and Bad Luck(Ironqrow)

The world of yesterday(Ironwitch)

New Light(RWBY au)

James Ironwood headcanons 3

Valentine's Day(James Ironwood x reader)

The one thing he wished for(James Ironwood x reader)

Ironwitch headcanons

Ironwitch headcanons part 2

Project Personality: Penny Polendina post

Ironwitch headcanons part 3

"Pillows don't talk."(Leona Kingscholar x reader)

Fry Thief

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Helena's rambling

Yuu protecting Malleus(What made me write For That He Is Thankful.)

Aggressive love towards Malleus

Helena's thoughts on Self aware TWST

Helena's thoughts on Self aware TWST 2

Rollo, the twink baguette

Chaotic Yugi Mutou

Helena watches Land of the Lustrous

Silly little twst idea

Silly little twst idea pt2

Silly space idea :3

Aggressive love towards James Ironwood

James Ironwood with a new outfit

Recoil

Helena's obsession with Ironwood

Helena's idea on HnK! James Ironwood

Helena's RWBY tier list

James Ironwood but with Destiny 2 weapons

Helena's back problems

Helena's Hunter

Helena's favorite James Ironwood moments

Helena making fun of their favorite boi

Helena speaks in memes

No sleep Tumblr

Multiships my beloved

Helena's RWDE rant

Helena's nicknames

Helena finding a new obsession

"You brought this upon me."

Cú Chulainns as out of context Discord convos

Cú Chulainns as out of context Discord convos

Cú: Either always kissing death or always going overkill

Nero has no chill

Helena's screentime

Helena condones murder

Clowning on both Europe and America

Helena gets reminded of Malleus

Outta context Discord continues

Outta context Discord: Crime edition

Weather sickness

Outta context Discord: Darkside of the internet

Outta context Discord: We're fucking dumb

Pissing off my bestie on Discord

Helena's thoughts on a Ironwood scene

Helena

Out of context Discord: AvP edition

Out of context Discord: AvP edition part 2

Helena's thoughts on Arthur Curry

Fried Fish

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My rants are tagged under "Helena Rants", it's mainly some personal issues so if you don't wanna see that then feel free to block that tag

[royalfortunesmate]

Cute onsen theme, might keep this one <3

[fantastic-nonsense]

oh my god all this time I believed that what fanon!Jason stans really wanted to read was Helena Bertinelli's books (because of all the relationships and interpersonal dynamics they keep stealing from her to project onto Jason) but what they actually should be reading are Catwoman books

Selina's the one who killed Black Mask and dismantled his operation after War Games. She's the one explicitly protecting the East End (aka Crime Alley) and going out of her way to protect the women and children of Gotham's underworld. She was the one doing mafia kingpin shit in the New 52 while Jason was off messing around in space with Dick's friends. She was the one protecting the Alleytown kids and trying to root out crime by "taking control" of it.

like Selina literally took over a crime family and united the criminal underworld in the New 52 while Jason was off fighting the All-Caste and Crux with Roy and Kory, I can't believe I didn't make the connection sooner

[soleminisanction]

Once again got a bee in my bonnet to spend a night doing obscure fandom research to make a point, so. For all those people who keep making the annoying, "Tim keeps '''stealing'' other peoples' names" comments -- have a table.

EDIT: Updated version with some mistakes corrected.

Everyone with a check mark has used that codename at some point in DC's 80+ year continuity -- Elseworlds and alternate dimensions/timelines count, adaptations (movies, video games, cartoons, etc.) don't unless they've got comic book tie-ins, and neither do in-universe dream sequences/illusions/fantasies/other narrative elements that are objectively "not real" within the boundaries of the fiction.

A purple marker indicates an element that only applies in Elseworlds or alternate timelines. Yellow is for the originator of the legacy title. Star symbol is for borderline cases/extenuating circumstances/it's open to interpretation (with some further elaboration below).

The "other" column is just there to account for people who've held lesser or non-legacy titles, like Renegade, Wingman, Arkham Knight, Drake, Redbird, Talon, Deadman, Black Bat, Orphan and Catwoman.

Point being: the people who have actually gone through the most legacy titles in this family are Dick, Babs and Jason, tied with 5 each (again, not counting "other;" if we counted those separately Dick would've had by far the most). Tim is tied with Steph AND Helena Wayne, so unless you're whining about them "stealing other peoples' names" you're just wrong, and they're all only one higher than Damian, Carrie and Bruce.

This is a legacy family that passes their codenames up and down the inheritance line. It's what they do. It's not a legitimate criticism to level at one character and not the others. Please get over it.

---

Further elaboration on some of the lesser known/niche cases:

- Bruce uses the Robin ID in Superman & Batman: Generations, as well as the pre-Crisis Detective Comics #226 story.

- In the second half of Thrillkiller ‘62, Babs cuts her hair and dons the Robin costume worn by her deceased partner Dick to get revenge on his killer; however the only name ever used for her in the series is Batgirl

- Cassandra was a member of the Robins orphan gang from Dark Knights of Steel.

- Duke was a member of the We Are Robins gang, as well as the aforementioned DKS orphan gang, and has appeared as Robin in a couple of Elseworlds, including I believe a White Knight spin-off.

- Cass was Batwoman in one of the versions of the Titans Tomorrow, as was Bette Kane, depending on changes to the timeline.

- Babs is Batwoman in the Batman ‘66 comics and in the 1980 story “The Secret Origin of Bruce (Superman) Wayne”

- Earth-3 Steph is Batwoman in Young Justice 2019.

- Helena Wayne is Batwoman in the possible future story Last Rites

- Tim is a member of the Batgirls vigilante/little league baseball team in the DC Bombshells universe, as is Cullen Row. Some call them the “Batboys” instead. I call those people cowards.

- Helena Bertinelli wore the costume that would later become Cass’s signature Batgirl look during No Man’s Land. However, she was more often referred to as “The Bat” and her Batgirl status is up to individual interpretation.

- Dick didn’t originate the Nightwing name, it started with Clark in the Silver Age.

- Steph has never been Nightwing. The panel where she appears in the costume is a Black Mercy illusion that happens only in her own mind. It’s a dream sequence.

- Barbara was Nightwing in the Smallville Season 11 comics.

- Terry was briefly Nightwing in volume 4 of Batman Beyond.

- Damian briefly became Nightwing after accidentally killing Dick in the Injustice series.

- Dick is Oracle in the “Eight Wonders of the World” version of Earth 2 (aka the Black Superman dimension)

[casscainmainly]

I know people love saying 'Bruce is a girldad' and I totally get it, we want to show how much he loves Cass and that she's his daughter. But Bruce's initial love for Cass was largely predicated on how not girly she was. He openly dislikes her girlhood throughout Batgirl 2000 (including but not limited to: dismissing her civilian identity, berating her for any romantic attempts, weakening her friendship with Stephanie, undermining her relationship to Babs, etc. etc.). Cass' femininity interferes with his ability to project onto her, so a lot of the time he just dismisses it. Is it really a coincidence that Bruce's only adopted daughter is one who wasn't raised as a girl?

[finalgirlsamwinchester]

sam. sam. sammy. started out as a darling 00s emo boy. pretty lad who could've doubled as a frontman in a warped tour band. spiritual baby of my chemical romance's three cheers for sweet revenge. embodiment of his cultural moment and so perceived as too whiny by the narrative and the audience and hated for it. grew up to become a beautiful exhausted woman protagonist for an A24 psychological horror-thriller film. losing her mind. going through exquisite torment. holding it together by a thread, haunted by horrors you would be able to comprehend if the show was still a horror. or at least a drama. too bad she is now stuck in a superhero sitcom where the moment you express a slightly real complex emotion. the audience will start pelting you with tomatoes. for having hysteria.

[eddiespornstache]

the most important thing to me is that this isn’t what’s best for chris. if helena and ramon’s motivations were entirely unselfish, they would’ve said, okay, he can come stay with us for a couple weeks, get the space that he’s asking for, and then we’ll regroup as a family. but instead they moved him to texas indefinitely, and he’s basically been allowed to stew on the situation for months on end.

and they do it out of love in their minds, but it’s a love that’s founded on the same misunderstandings of eddie that they’ve held against him his entire life, and it’s a love that right now is using chris more than it’s protecting him. and that’s not good or healthy for him. in fact, it’s reinforcing for him the exact same flawed line of thinking that plagued both of his parents: that avoidance and running away are appropriate ways of dealing with your problems.

it’s molding him into the kind of man eddie expressly never wanted him to become—someone who, just like eddie and ramon and helena and shannon all at various points in their lives have, isn’t honest with themselves about what they’re feeling and why.

eddie loves his son, would never intentionally hurt him, feels horrible that he did anyway, and is doing everything he can to reach out and start rebuilding their connection while still trying to respect chris’s boundaries and desires, and chris deserves better than an environment that is, intentionally or not, consciously or not, encouraging him to continue to mire in the teenage petulance that, while eminently justifiable, isn’t going to serve him long term

[necrotic-nephilim]

@sasheneskywalker i love when you enable me to ramble about things because oh my god do i have thoughts.

so recently, i made a post discussing the phenomena of DC x DP and DC x MLB crossovers and why they exist and part of that post was discussing how largely speaking, at least half, if not more of the Batfamily fandom doesn't read the comics. if they interact with canon DC material, it's adaptations that are their own sequestered universes and oftentimes not remotely comic accurate or seeking to be. the most obvious example is the Young Justice cartoon. i'm adding a cut to this post because it just got so long i'm so sorry.

a lot of times, when people are discussing the "why" of this oversaturation of fanon-only fandom, they blame Wayne Family Adventures. and i think, to a point, i agree WFA is responsible for a boom in this fandom. but as someone who's been in the fandom long before we had WFA, to me it's the other way around. WFA was DC's way of meeting the demand for this easy-to-get-into, easy-to-consume content about the Batfamily that predicates itself on the comics just enough to be vaguely the same characters, but has a more sitcom, slice-of-life sort of vibe so DC could profit off of this section of the fanbase that otherwise wasn't consuming its primary material. and well, it's definitely worked. not only that, but i have a weird theory that the decline in the MCU also led to the rise in the Batfamily fandom. when you consider the fan content that made the MCU popular within fandom, it's that 2012 "they all live in Avengers Tower and Thor is eating poptarts and Clint is in the vents and there are movie nights every Friday" sort of vibe. those were the fics that were a hallmark of the fandom. and as the MCU has strayed from well... quality content in general, but specifically well-thought-out crossover content where characters can have their own arcs but also exist in a wider story where they clearly care about each other, that fandom was sort of homeless. so where do you go, if you like a superhero found family where you can have villains for angst but also stick them all in one big family-like home for silly crack and have a plethora of options for gay ships? well. you go to the Batfamily. if you write a crack/fluff Batfamily genfic with silly vibes and low stakes instead of say, a fic about a very specific comic issue even if it's a popular comic, you're *going* to get more traction for the former. because the fanbase largely just isn't reading the comics.

and i feel... complicated about this. because on one hand, Don't Like Don't Read has been a tenet of my fandom experience. i'm very pro-fandom and that includes fandom content i don't like. and to an extent, i do think this sort of should apply to Batfamily fanon. i enjoy having my moments with other comic purists, giggling over exceptionally painful OOC headcanons or even facepalming in pain over some content but it is on me to not interact with that content. you don't make fandom a better place by being hostile to fans who engage with canon in ways you don't approve of. and frankly? we as comic readers are not going to get non-comic fans to read the comics by being asshats to them. no one is going to want to pick up any comic if we get a superiority complex about it. and also, i feel like we're all lying to ourselves a little bit insisting comics are so, so easy to get into. they're not. we can just all agree, they're really not. i've been single-handedly helping my sister get into comics, specifically Wonder Woman and no matter how simple i make it, i watch her get frustrated trying to understand what pre-Crisis and post-Crisis and New-52 and Flashpoint and all these things mean and what a retcon vs a reboot is and what a Crisis Event is and what the hell Diana's current backstory even *is*. sure, you can give someone a beginner list of comics to start with and slowly dip their toes in the water but sooner or later, *something* is going to confuse them. comics as a medium straight up aren't going to be everyone's cup of tea. and if someone *just* wants to read silly fluffy fanfiction about the Batfamily, i can't entirely begrudge them for not wanting to take the hours and hours out of their day to understand this medium. it's not an accessible medium to get into. "read this and this, but this run is out of print and this run wasn't collected in trades at all but also make sure you read that event in order and this is a good comic but the backstory in it is retconned and you *have* to read this it's so important but it's also really bad because the author kind of sucks" sounds. ridiculous for someone who like. just wants to read some stuff about Nightwing. sometimes, we all make reading comics sort of sound like a chore, not a hobby.

so my point is, i do extend some grace to Batfamily fanon for existing. i think my biggest gripe is, as i said in my other post, misuse of tags (if you're not creating content about comics, maybe you don't need the comics fandom tag on Ao3, just the all media types umbrella tag) and my far bigger gripe: when panels are taken out of context to support fanon only headcanons. if i could impart *anything* onto the Batfamily fandom as a comic fan it'd be this: if you haven't *read* the comic, don't spread the panel. if you don't even know what comic it's *from*, don't spread the panel. it's fine to use comic panels to discuss your headcanons, but so often i see someone spreading a comic panel from a comic they haven't read, and when asked where it's from, they can't source it. a silly example that comes to mind is a post going around, taking a panel where Dick, in his internal monologue goes "here comes the sun. do do do do." and the post is claiming it's from him getting buried alive. when that panel comes from Nightwing (1996) #140, and he gets buried alive in Nightwing (1996) #127, two completely different moments frankensteined together. if you're going to not read the comics, that's completely fine, but unless you're sure of the source and the context, panels shouldn't be spread around. i'm sick of this specifically happening to Red Robin (2009), with ppl claiming Tim has totally killed people because he blew up some of Ra's' bases, when those panels within context, make it clear he gave everyone time to escape. and in a later arc in that very comic, Tim grapples with the idea of murdering Captain Boomerang, and *specifically chooses not to*, because he doesn't agree with murder, even against the person who has hurt him the most. if you'd like to write fanfiction where Tim is pro-murder and has done some sketch things, i'm totally on board and would probably like to read it. but there's no need to pretend it's canon from a few panels you saw out of context.

beyond that, i think it's not *entirely* correct to say that fanon is harmless. whenever i see very WFA-positive posts, they often default to the argument that WFA is fun and silly, and comic fans are killjoys for not liking it. which. i think is complicated because the issue is, WFA and fanon don't exist in a vacuum. if you like WFA power to you, i don't think it's the worst thing ever, but i do think it's degrading to these characters because honestly? they feel incompetent in the webtoon. it's one thing if WFA was solely a slice-of-life sort of deal, just having silly episodes where Bruce is taking on a PTA mom or they're all fighting for the last cookie. but when WFA attempts to take on more serious plots with these characters, it *fundamentally* falls flat in understanding them. i get it, Bruce comforting Jason having a panic attack because a noise reminded him of the crowbar felt cute in a microcosm, but i'm so serious when i say that storyline destroyed how like. half of this fandom understands Jason Todd's relationship to his trauma. it doesn't understand how he reacts when he's triggered, what coping mechanisms he seeks out, and how he would handle Bruce comforting him. even if i can believe for a brief moment Jason *would* be triggered by something like that, him running and trying to hide and then getting a hug from Bruce to make it okay is just. painful. WFA needs everything to be wrapped up in a nice, neat little bow. so even when it starts to tackle interesting concepts, it makes them fall flat with its need to be soft, low stakes, hurt/comfort. there was a two-parter episode that dealt with the complicated mutual hatred/jealousy between Tim and Damian that *almost* really interested me because for once, it felt like the webtoon wanted to explore canon messy dynamics. but of course, it had to be fixed with one conversation and a hug. you don't mend the *years* of issues these characters have like that. WFA isn't in character because these characters are hyperbole cartoonified versions of themselves to fit within the medium and be a cute happy family.

because that right there, is the crux of it. the Batfamily fanon seeks to simplify the Batfamily and force them into a nuclear family. there are so many fantastic posts on here discussing how the nuclear family-ification of the Batfam is eroding decades worth of complex histories so i won't go too far into that. but what i will say is that there's this need, in the Batfamily fandom, for the Batfamily to exist as a unit. they are a *family*. (honestly i think calling it the Batfamily is a misnomer and has been for years but we're in too deep now.) they exist to each other first, and any teams or friends they have come secondary to this family unit. you can *specifically* see this demonstrated in what headcanons are becoming popular these days. i have an entire lengthy meta in my drafts about how i *loathe* the "the Batfamily meets the Justice League" genre of fanfic because it makes no *sense*. in order to have this genre of fic exist, you must operate under the assumption that no one in the League, or adjacent to the League, knows the Batfamily exists and are thus utterly shocked to discover Batman has kids. and to make *that* work, you have to strip *every single Batfamily member* of such important dynamics and friendships so you can lock them all in Gotham for their whole lives. Dick can't have the Titans, Tim can't have Young Justice, Duke & Cass can't have the Outsiders, Jason can't have the Outlaws, Damian can't have the Supersons, Babs can't have the Birds of Prey, and so on. because if they had these relationships, they would be known to the League. the Batfamily fandom doesn't care about this, it's just "silly fanfiction", it's not trying to be serious. but how can you say you like Dick Grayson as a character if you don't understand the Titans *are* his family? at some points of his life, moreso than the Batfamily even is. it is constantly repeated to us in most comics with Dick how much the Titans mean to him. he *needs* them to be who he is. the same extends to every other Batfamily member, most of which have been full League members at this point. but in fanon, that doesn't matter. the Batfamily are a sequestered unit first, and all of those side relationships are secondary and easy to toss away, if it makes your fanfic work better.

and because they have to be a unit first, you have these forced relationships that dump years of actual canon material for the sake of making them get along. the Batfamily fandom has its favorites and well. it's no secret it's usually the boys. Jason and Tim by *far* stand out as fandom faves so, their dynamic is a heavily explored one. it does matter that in canon they don't tend to get along and especially don't see each other as family. what matters is that you can push dynamics onto them. and so fanon gets all twisted up about which Robin Tim actually idolized as a kid (Dick) and what member of the Batfamily is pro-murder but still an older sibling figure to him and looks out for him (Helena, or if you want the dynamic of once tried to harm Tim but they've reconciled, Jean-Paul) in favor of who's the most popular. Dick, Jason, Tim, and Damian are always going to be the standouts for popularity, but it's specifically Jason and Tim who are getting fanonized the most. and that's because really, we don't have much canon content of Tim that *isn't* the comics. for Dick you've got Young Justice (tv), for Damian you've got the DCAMU, for Jason you've sort of got the Under The Red Hood movie, but Tim sort of lingers in this limbo. (yes, he's in Young Justce (tv) and Titans (live action) but in neither is he the main character nor given much depth) so, he gets a *lot* projected onto him and has become fanonized. and even with Jason's animated movies, you don't see him interact with Tim, so people build it from the ground up how they want to see it, disregarding of canon comics. i think it's what makes him so popular in the first place- he's malleable into whatever you want or need him to be.

and of course, the fanon ignores other characters in the Batfamily it doesn't know about. i feel like you could create a tier list of Batfamily characters by their popularity, going from the fandom main characters: Tim, Jason, Bruce, Alfred, Dick, Damian. to the underrated: Steph, Duke, Babs, Cass. to the forgotten about unless they're convenient for a story: Kate, the Foxes, Helena Wayne, Carrie, Selina, Harper Row, Maps, Minhkhoa Khan. to the absolutely unknown: Helena Bertinelli, Jean-Paul Valley, Onyx Adams, the Clovers, Julia Pennyworth. it's not lost on me that the ignored characters tend to be women and people of color. which is both a canon and fanon problem, DC will continue adding interesting characters to the Batfamily, play with them for a few years, then drop them to default to the "Batboys" again. and it's a vicious cycle of the fandom only caring about the "Batboys", and thus people entering the fandom via fanon osmosis won't have content about the other characters, therefore, they won't be interested in those characters enough to create it, and it's just this ouroboros consuming itself, no matter how much canon content we have of these other characters. and it's ridiculous just how large the Batfamily is becoming because of this, which is why i'm a pre-Flashpoint fan, because then the Batfamily was contained enough to actually feel like a family with every character having nuances relationships with each other, but i digress because those thoughts could be their own post.

and the thing about fanon is it doesn't exist in a vacuum. DC has started turning the comics to accommodate for what fans are asking for, because fans will beg and beg for content they're not going to consume. Tim Drake: Robin had Tim as a coffee drinker because that's the fanon accepted headcanon. and the resolution of the recent Gotham War arc was for Bruce to buy this new manor for everyone to move in and call him. nevermind that most of these characters have their own homes and have zero reason to be moving in with Bruce. Tim had his marina in Tim Drake: Robin, Dick has Bludhaven, Cass and Steph have their little side of town in Batgirls (2022), and so on. these characters are being forced together as a unit, as one big happy family living together, to appease what non-comic fans want and it's damaging comic relationships. Robin: Knight Terrors saw Jason and Tim team up and working together, which i've seen varying opinions on but i personally despised. their interactions made zero sense for any of their canon history, but it appeases them being this close sibling relationship that fanon acts like they are. also the fears they faced in their respective knight terrors didn't make sense for either character and *only* worked as a moment of bringing them together so they could reassure each other and have this weird dreamscape bonding moment. the canon is bending itself to the will of fanon rather than building on the pre-existing complex relationships. Tim barely even gets along with his most important team in Dark Crisis: Young Justice because it seems the only important relationships the Batfamily can have is with each other. and when we do see them outside of the Batfamily, it only seems to be to relive the glory days like with World's Finest: Teen Titans, instead of developing them as they currently exist. this isn't recent in the comics, it feels like you can trace it back to the New-52, but it does feel a *lot* worse over the recent years. WFA is fine when it exists in its own bubble, but the simple truth is, DC content never exists on its own. the adaptations will reflect back onto the comics. (the damage the Young Justice cartoon has done to some characters should honestly be studied) and so it does frustrate me a bit when fanon-only or adaptation-only fans act like we're being nothing but killjoys for being frustrated with this. since they don't read the comics, they don't see how the comics are suffering as a result of this.

people argue about what's out of character for the comics they don't even read. i'm sorry, but "bad dad Bruce" is consistently canon. that man is just kind of shitty. when you take someone who has the drive he has, who has this need for the Mission first, who needs a teenager in spandex next to him to keep him off the ledge, that guy is sort of going to be a shitty father figure. he just is. not on purpose or with malice, but when you compare him to any other dad in a big DC family, he sure takes the cake. it's why characters like Oliver Queen tend to *really* fucking hate Bruce for how he treats his kids. Bruce loves fiercely, but he doesn't do well with putting that love first. and his love is a controlling one, he is very particular about controlling how others in the Batfamily are "allowed" to operate. it's what drives the wedge between him and Dick, it's why Steph is never a true daughter to him. (besides the reason of her needing to be a love interest to Tim first, anyway-) i've never understood the massive outcry of people reacting to Bruce kinda being shitty in comics they're not reading. there are some moments that get ridiculously OOC with how cartoonishly evil he is (the whole Gotham War arc and that... complicated mess with Jason) but largely if you want sitcom loving nuclear father Bruce, you have to accept that is a fanon thing, not a canon one. the Batfamily being a nuclear family in *general* is fanon. most of the "Batkids" don't actually see Bruce in a particularly fatherly light and begging for moments where he calls them his kids or they call him dad outside of incredibly specific circumstances is just OOC.

it's getting harder and harder to exist peacefully in this fandom it feels like, if you don't comply to the standard fanon has set. i'm happy people are having fun with their blorbos, even if in ways i dislike, but that "harmless fandom fun" does ripple it's way back to canon, eventually. so i end up pretty tangled with my feelings because are fans at fault for DC making these poor decisions? probably not, but it certainly feels like an unfortunate cause-and-effect situation whether at the end of the day, nobody is happy. and of course, i know some fanon-only fans are striving to be more canon accurate and care about canon dynamics more than others, but for them it's always going to be an uphill battle with the above-mentioned out-of-context panels thrown around and ever-pervasive fanon overtaking anything that's truly seeking to be canon compliant. so really, it sometimes feels like we're all losing.

[mewtwoandme]

Siv's gonna become the world's most overprotective mama until Blu can defend himself, ain't she? Also, poor Louie, I'm guessing the Lycanroc will be Siv's first target?

Yeah Siv's not gonna let anyone near Blu for the first week or two before she starts to mellow out.

The lycanroc's definitely in the line of fire right now

[alkaysani]

in the height of everything brewing, with buck in the same room as his parents and christopher, eddie gets a moment where everything is too much

and when one of them asks if he knows what he's doing. if he really thinks that buck, this man, can fill the void that christopher's mother left behind, what if eddie turns and shouts: "would that be so bad? he's already been doing that!"

then he goes quiet, and his eyes are on the floor, and he has no idea that buck is staring at him with these wide eyes, and he goes, a little bit more quietly this time: "he's the best thing that happened to me christopher"

and in an even much quieter voice, barely a whisper, he adds: "to me"

with so much heartbreak that everyone can feel it in the silence

and that moment is the first time that everyone in that room is on the same page. about the will, shannon, christopher, buck, and eddie

[cinematics123]

So… I hate to do this. But remember when Eddie lost Buck? Sure, he couldn’t even look at Buck when he was in the hospital. But I mean when he lost Buck.

In the lawsuit.

Eddie couldn’t talk to Buck and he went off and ended up in an underground fight club and almost killed a guy and had to call 911 on the club so that an ambulance could pick up the guy he almost killed.

That was just… not being able to talk to his Buck.

This is Chris. This is Eddie’s soul. His reason for living. This is what kept Eddie holding on.

Are you worried about Eddie? Buck is. Even Eddie is. You should be.

Shannon left Eddie, and he hasn’t gotten over it. Chris just left Eddie. Like Shannon did. No note. No talking it over. Just an, I’m leaving. And Eddie’s parents, who tried to force Eddie to give Chris to them, are the ones who took him.

I’m worried about Eddie.

[canonicallyobserving911]

Helena Diaz is a huge problem but Eddie has a blind spot for his mother and if the show isn't going to deal with it, she'll get away with all the crappy things she's said to him.

(Clearing drafts before season 8.)

Recently, while I was writing fanfics that are primarily focused on my favorite character, Eddie Diaz, I realized something about the Diaz parents' quick trip to L.A. in 7x10 and it was quite shocking. When the finale aired, I thought it was interesting they hadn't been shown in CANON since season 5 and prior to that they were only in Eddie's flashbacks in 3x15; therefore their actions in 7x10 were suspect. IMO, the only reason they showed up when Chris called in 7x10 was because Helena's been trying to get Eddie to move back to El Paso since 2x18 and before he relocated to L.A., she tried to convince him to leave Chris with her and Ramon.

Before I get started, I need to indicate that Ramon and Eddie reconciled in 5x17, therefore the majority of this post is about Helena's motivations along with the way she's always tried to control the situation. She never wanted Eddie to leave El Paso and now that she has Chris and they're raising him, I think her plan is still to get Eddie to do what she wants him to do. I don't like her because she's manipulative and controlling and I saw that smug look on her face when they were leaving. She never listens to Eddie and she's always trying to get her way. Furthermore, she's said a lot of mean and hateful things to him like "Don't drag him down with you, Eddie." What type of mother would say something like that to her child?

Prior to 7x10, it was extremely strange that Helena and Ramon didn't ever visit L.A. when they had the chance or when they should have. Eddie got shot in 4x13 and in 4x14 he had a welcome home party but they weren't there. Sure, it was during the pandemic and the actor and actress may not have been able to travel to be on set but they DIDN'T EVEN CALL. Carla did a FaceTime call with Eddie and Chris earlier in season 4, so what's the deal?

Also, in 5x17, Eddie told both of his parents "Planes fly in both directions" but they still didn't show up and he said that after his mental breakdown. They didn't know about it but in 6x15 Helena guilt tripped Eddie into traveling to El Paso for the weekend even though they were busy with Chris' extracurricular activities. Ramon's retired and Helena doesn't work so what the actual "F" is going on?

It seems like the only reason why they appeared in season 7 was so Helena could finally get what she wanted and that was to pick up Chris. She may have thought if she said Chris was going to live with them indefinitely, Eddie would move back to Texas but that's not happening.

The reason I'm not including Ramon in most of this is because as usual, he got his information about Eddie second hand from Helena the same way he used to while Eddie was growing up. Reminder, Ramon was on the road for work and any information he got about their children was told to him by Helena.

I did a post on the Diaz Dynamics (linked here) back in 2022 and based on the way everyone was standing in the backyard, it looks like Helena doesn't really get along with Ramon's side of the family.

I really don't understand why Eddie hasn't figured out his mom is the problem. She got an UNDESERVED REDEMPTION (related post) just like the raggedy Buckley parents and Sang Han. Can the writers PLEASE address these shitty parents and stop trying to retcon and redeem them? It would be different if they got a redemption arc like Toni and Hen, Athena and Beatrice and Eddie and Ramon but they didn't so this is getting ridiculous.

It's perfectly normal to show that all parents aren't good and even though it's their adult children's decision to forgive them, all of them don't deserve to be redeemed.

[bam-bi-buck]

Buck & Chris’s relationship + abandonment issues - long post

Do y’all think part of the reason Christopher went with his Grandparents is because he felt safe enough about Buck’s love and commitment to him that he knew Buck wouldn’t be mad at him when he came back?

Before I continue with that train of thought, this thought process is shaped by theories I’ve seen about why Chris called his Grandparents instead of Buck when Chris has gone to Buck for support with his anger/fear due to Eddie’s whole thing twice before (4x08 & 5x13) but he didn’t this time? Why? maybe because viewing him as a parental figure in this case impacts how he views Buck likelyhood to be completely on his side as his grandparents (especially Helena) are instead of being on both of their side - which he was

Chris was really angry and hurt, he didn’t want Buck to try to fix this, to try to keep them together, he wanted Buck to be angry at Eddie with him, but that’s not who Buck is and both Chris and Eddie know that

That’s why Eddie called him and Chris didn’t

Now back to Chris, his abandonment issues, and his relationship with Buck and how we can interpret it based off 7x10

Chris has severe abandonment issues, which is not surprising at all based on what he’s been through - Eddie being in active duty throughout his early childhood, then working himself to the bone with three jobs, Shannon leaving to California and then dying

Then he had feelings of abandonment during the pandemic, he lost contact with both Ana & Marisol after their relationships with Eddie ended, his bisabuela moved back to Texas, and we didn’t heard about Carla at all season 7 (I’m like 98% sure - please correct me if I’m wrong)

In season 7 he even said he feels like girls leave when Buck had that dating talk with him

(Even Buck technically left him for a bit, during the lawsuit era but I’m unsure is he views it that way or not though we do know that Chris missed him during that time - Grocery Store Divorce and all)

However, Buck has since made a promise to him and their relationship has evolved a lot since then

We know that Chris goes to Buck when he’s mad at Eddie (4x08) and there’s lot of evidence that indicates he views Buck as a parental figure (he talks to Buck in a similar fashion as he does Eddie, he seeks out Buck for support, the way he spoke to Buck while he was in a coma, just to name a few)

Plus there’s a reason Eddie chose Buck as Chris’s legal guardian and why the writers chose to include that plot

Because of Buck & Chris’s bond

And he lost his mom, he’s almost lost his dad several times, he’s gotten attached to two different women Eddie was seeing and has now lost them

When Chris ubered to Buck’s place and said that everyone leaves, Buck promised he wouldn’t leave Chris

And then when he talked to Chris before he left with his grandparents, Buck did flounder a bit (as would I in that situation, not judging here) but he does make a comment about understanding Chris wanting to go which would probably reassure Chris that Buck isn’t and won’t be mad at him

I think Chris would have had a harder time leaving if he was scared of Buck not being there when he got back

We all have our assumptions (mostly negative from what I’m seeing but I’m not judging I do too) but we don’t actually know what Helena’s saying to Chris, if she’s talking down Eddie’s love for him or not

But while it’s possible she is, Eddie told Chris himself that he can come home at any point he wants

We can also assume that part of why Chris left is because he’s mad + hurt and lashing out wanting Eddie to feel the same as him / doesn’t trust Eddie right now and is waiting for Eddie to do something to prove himself before he’ll be ready go home

I do believe that Chris knows that he can go home to Eddie (no matter what Helena may or may not be saying) and thus him leaving isn’t triggering his abandonment issues and that he’s just waiting for, as I theorized above, for Eddie to prove he won’t be hurt again if he does

and thus his abandonment issues won’t be triggered regarding Eddie (this time) unless he’s convinced he can’t go home, something happens with Eddie, or Eddie fails to prove himself to Chris

OR his abandonment issues were already triggered and he felt like he was losing Eddie (again) to Kim and her madness and he left as a means to protect himself from that, and is, again waiting for proof that he’s safe to come home from the aftermath of all that

All that to say I don’t think his abandonment issues would stop him from leaving Eddie with his grandparents in this particular instance

Ethier way though… because Chris has had a lot of experience of not having both his parents, losing parents, dealing with the fear of losing parents, and losing positive authority figures, it had to be really tough to leave Eddie himself, no matter how angry and hurt he is

And if I’m right and he does view Buck as a parental figure as well then we might assume he’d also fear losing Buck as well by leaving to Texas

I think his abandonment issues would have been triggered regarding Buck while living in Texas, especially since he’s probably always worried about losing Eddie to a certain extent (army, overworking himself in Texas, work as a firefighter, etc) he lost his mother twice, lost both Ana and Marisol who may not have been parental figures but were positive authority figures in his lives, except Buck promised Chris he wouldn’t leave him

And so I think independently of his feelings regarding abandonment and Eddie, Chris still feels secure in his relationship with Buck to not fear losing him during his time away

Just a theory and I could totally be off but it’ll be really interesting to see how they address everything when Buck and Chris reunite (if they do)

[crim-bat]

Well I regret sending that anon now because I inspired a rude person to send one as well, sorry. I still disagree with the framing. The body of your post is dissonant with that “I’m a long time fan of Jason” intro. I see people saying damian shouldn’t exist because he and Tim are hitting elbows both being robin and Tim existed first, and the only rebuttal needed is “I think Damian is an interesting character and I like reading about him” and I say that because like him. (And that very wrong damian criticism is pushback against people saying Tim shouldn’t exist because he doesn’t have a place to be right now.) You not having a similar feeling about Jason just… seems like you don’t like him? Calling it cannibalism instead of just the characters being around for decades and the same ground being trodden, when there are other characters that do this as well, notably even ones you bring up as counterexamples. I’m not going to say anything else because I think I laid it all on your doorstep already, sorry again and have a good night

Hold up a moment. You dont get to call me rude after firing off first and walk away. Many people do think Tim shouldn't be robin anymore and actively complain that he's still not moving from a junior role to a graduated title. Red robin wasn't perfect but it certainly wasn't worse than him going back to robin.

I'd challenge you, dear anon, to ask yourself a question.

1. Has Jason ever had a good all caste story?

2. Has he ever had an actually good story when he went postal as an anti hero? Under the hood doesn't count as he was purely the antagonist then.

3. How about a good story where he worked with his brothers and him constantly having a chip on his shoulder was endearing like Damian?

4. How about a run where he was batman for a bit and then the real deal showed up to beat the snot out of him?

I'm not saying there shouldn't be any bleed into what other characters do but there's nothing creative with what they've done with Jason because it all relies on him fundamentally never having a defined niche, outside of crime boss, to call his own.

And because Jason is placed where other characters that are more established and would otherwise be a better match for a story and because Jason has fundamentally nothing going on that wasn't cribbed from someone else, including the first iteration of the outlaws which was just a worse version of the outsiders which were also dicks friends (that's a 5th and 6th thing he took from another character, dear anon), he lacks the foundation to tell his own stories properly.

Dear anon, Jason, as he is treated right now, is a middle child copy cat who deserves better than both the writers who created that situation and the fans who enable it. Including you, dear anon

[stagefoureddiediaz]

The Chris and water theming is still making itself known.

It’s making me wonder if that pool is gonna get built and Chris is gonna get into danger in it because Helena isn’t paying attention etc!