#episode 808

[hauntingblue]

One of luffy's main traits being that he likes to eat and then making a story in a food themed island about his friend who makes him food is so fucked up

[revlischarm]

WHAT THE FUCK, SANJI

[aki-bara]

After Luffy says he can't become the Pirate King w/o Sanji. :,)

[pussyfootmaneuver]

just watched the worst episode of one piece ive ever seen. yes it takes place in the arc where "sanji gets good"

[rzdhc]

I genuinely hope oda doesn't pull a Kishimoto and have Luffy end up in a relationship with any of his crew

it'd be a helluva lot more impactful if he doesn't

Luffy's willing to go the extra miles, hell, he'd move the planets for any of his crew, and I love Oda for showing the power of friendship

if he ends up in a relationship with them, I'd be so disappointed

[bucksboobs]

With two episodes left until the winter break what I want for Buck (but not at all what I expect anymore) is for his plot in 807 to be him playing the field for a rebound, enjoying it for a time but having a heart-to-heart with Bobby that casual sex isn’t what he wants anymore (callback to Buck 1.0 without just rehashing it) and going on a real date with someone instead. In 808 he’s still trying it with this person but there’s no spark at all, and he talks to Eddie about if he’s going to see them again, he answers no, he doesn’t think so. Near the end of the episode, he shows up at an unfamiliar door. “Can I come in?” “Of course.” “Look… Tommy.” “…… Buck.” (Buck looks visibly hurt to be called this) “I got out there. I slept with other men, women, a bunch of people and… it wasn’t the same. I can’t be with any of them. Not because I’m unsure or because it’s all new but-but because it’s you. I love you, and you may be my first. But I want you to be my last. And I promise not to break your heart.” “Evan…” then they kiss and everything’s all better happily ever after.

[lc-holy]

Conférence Masterclass 808 (Translation)

I've taken the liberty of translating the conference that took place last year with the writing director of Miraculous (Sébastien Thibaudeau). It was only made public when someone posted a video of the conference a short while ago.

In this conference, Sébastien Thibaudeau will talk about the creation of Miraculous and his work on the series. He is joined by Chloé Paye, a new scriptwriter working on Miraculous season 6.

Sébastien talks a lot and repeats himself a bit, so the summary can be a bit confusing.

I strongly advise you to go and listen to the video if you understand French. There are a lot of details I'm going to leave out, and Sébastien is very funny.

Photo belongs to mlbfanfr on twitter.

Please be respectful in comments or tags. If you want to debate on things related to this conference, please make your own post. I apologize if there are any mistakes, I'm French and I'm not fluent in English.

-12 years ago, Sébastien arrived at Zagtoon, a studio that was just starting out and had yet to produce and broadcast any series. The producer (Jérémy Zag) and Sébastien hit it off and decided to start working together. Zag decides to give Sébastien total freedom over his projects. Sébastien then decides to put the spotlight on scriptwriters, because in this profession they are unfortunately poorly paid and never stay on the same projects.

So they produced a cartoon called Kobushi. A little-known series that did rather well, even if it didn't stay on the "Gulli" channel for long. The scriptwriters and producer were happy with the end result, as it was produced in a very short time.

Jeremy Zag then proposed another project, which he thought was quite good, but which he was unable to sell to broadcasters. At the time, the project was called "Ladybug". No one was interested, as the project was aimed more at an adult audience than a children's audience. Sébastien had to make sure that the project could be broadcast on Disney and TF1.

There was only a "trailer" also called "Ladybug" (but you'll find the video under the title Ladybug PV) animated by Toei animation. At the time, Sébastien had not yet been hired by Zagtoon. It was Jérémy Zag who convinced Toei animation to work with them (no mean feat, since Toei animation doesn't work with anyone).

So Sébastien started working with Thomas Astruc (the man who wrote and created the "Ladybug" project). At first, he didn't want to work on this project because he found it complicated. Thomas wanted to make a series for adults, but at the time, it was very complicated to make a cartoon for adults. What's more, they didn't have enough money to take on such a project. Sébastien finally agreed, but there were some changes to be made, which Thomas accepted.

-What Sébastien appreciated most in this project was the romantic comedy, the love square between the two main characters.

To meet the requirements of the cartoon industry, "Ladybug" had to be set in a neutral universe, in other words, in an imaginary country or the USA, but Zag, who loves Paris, declared that the cartoon had to be set in Paris.

In the end, Thomas Astruc's entire project was discarded, leaving only the love story between the two heroes and the city of Paris, where the story was to take place.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------

-Sébastien explains how he writes Marinette's first dialogues: He says he talks a lot in real life, so he writes Marinette like him. She says out loud whatever she's thinking.

For Chat noir, he makes him tell his father's jokes. Something TF1 doesn't accept. The TV channel went so far as to refuse to validate the Bible (a collection of information on the series and episodes) until it had removed the sentence: “Chat noir makes jokes”. Sebastien has therefore removed the sentence, but will continue to make Chat noir tell jokes.

-The writing director's job is to get the producer, creator and broadcaster to agree. The series broadcast on TF1 and Disney are very different. TF1 wants series whose story can be told in a single episode, unlike Disney, which wants series whose story spans several episodes.

Sébastien and TF1 agree that Miraculous will be a series with one story per episode, a "Formula Show".

He cites the example of Dora the Explorer episodes, where every episode is the same: Dora goes on an adventure from point A to point B, she has to find 3 clues, then she meets Swiper, she sings a song to make Swiper go away, she uses the talking map to get from one place to another, then Dora manages to get to point B and the episode ends.

This episode format is used for children, to give them a reassuring framework, as they build themselves up through repetition. That's why series like Dora work so well with young children.

So Sebastien sold the Miraculous series to broadcasters as a formula show. A person gets angry, is akumatized, then marinette transforms into Ladybug then frees the person from the akumatization and… The End.

It's also for this reason that Marinette tries to confess her love for Adrien in every episode, but is unable to do so.

But he tried to go against what he had planned with TF1, by slipping little extra stories into certain episodes. Audiences were receptive to these slightly hidden stories. The TV channel even asked Sébastien if there really were hidden things in the series, but he denied everything. Thanks to the positive reception from the public, TF1 agreed to develop the characters of Marinette and Adrien and flesh out the universe a little more.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------

-Once the bible is written, they have to write a script. But first Sébastien, as writing director, needs to know the mood of the series, and to do this he calls on Thomas Astruc, the series creator. Thomas is a great fan of classical painting. A single painting can tell a complex scene with lots of detail. He wants the episodes of miraculous to be like these paintings, there will be very few shots, but in a single shot a lot will happen.

-Sébastien explains that one of the things Thomas wanted to convey in the series was emotion. They didn't want to do what a lot of children's cartoons do, which is to beat the bad guys and win at the end of the episode. They wanted to tell kids that it's normal to have negative emotions. We can also become better people, learn from our mistakes and so on. It also reassures TV channels by setting up scenes that are repeated in every episode: people get angry, people akumatize then people deakumatize, end of episode...

Once the TV channels had been reassured, they set about writing a script.

-Sébastien asks Thomas to write the ending, as they're not sure the series will work. They also wondered what the aim of the series was, and what they wanted to say to the children. The two of them sat down in an office and wrote the ending, which turned out to be just the end of an arc. He even adds that now that they've written a lot more, it's important for them to write in advance so that everything is clear to them.

-The first season was written by 19 authors, from home. He found it interesting that the series was written by several different authors, even if some of them didn't quite understand the premise of the series. One episode that Sébastien particularly appreciated was written by two “autrices” (I think it's weird to say “two female authors”, so I'll use the French word): the refletkta episode, with the story of Juleka who couldn't get into the photos. (Note that all the episodes were proofread by Sébastien and Thomas).

After that, they kept a few people on to work together on the scripts for subsequent seasons.

Sébastien explains that he keeps a close eye on the production of the episodes, to make sure that everything that goes into the picture is as faithful as possible to what they've written in the script.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------

-The kwamis exist thanks to Toei, who wanted funny little animals to sell plush toys. So the scriptwriters had to find a way to integrate kwamis into the story.

-(Again, Sébastien advises people to check out the Kobushi series if they can still watch it somewhere, or ask the leaker who leaked the whole of season 5 to give them the episodes (that's a joke, of course)).

-Sébastien talks about the Ikari gozen episode, which could have been a total failure because the storyboarder didn't fully understand the scenario. Sébastien asks Zag to redo the storyboard, which will add 10 weeks to the episode's deadline. The storyboarder admits that he's always done storyboards mechanically, without worrying whether the episode is good or not, whether the jokes are funny or not. Eventually, the episode was redone by the same storyboarder, resulting in the episode we all know today.

- They still have a lot to tell with Miraculous, to the point where they're wondering if they'll have enough seasons to tell everything they want to tell. Sebastien says there will be a season 6 and 7, and probably a season 8 and 9.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------

- Chloé Paye met Sébastien when she was looking for an internship. She had never worked in animation, and knew nothing about Miraculous. She tells us how the scriptwriting team works. Each time, all the scriptwriters in the room have to be convinced of the script. They can sometimes spend hours on details to get everyone to agree.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------

- The driving force behind the series is that there must always be a secret between Marinette and Adrien. The lovesquare can never be broken, otherwise there's no series. Sébastien knows that some people are worried about this. Will they continue the lovesquare for another 4 seasons or more? How will they evolve? Sébastien says not to worry, they know where they want to go.

-It takes them 14 to 16 months to produce an episode, but it's often much longer due to unforeseen circumstances. And they don't work on one episode at a time, but on several at the same time. One episode takes a long time because of the 3D animation.

One of the things that's complicated with Miraculous 3d animation is that they can only display 3 characters at a time on screen, whereas the series requires them to display many more characters. It's also very difficult to correct animation errors, as this takes a lot of time.

-The TV networks were very surprised by the success of miraculous. They didn't think adults and children alike would watch the series. The TV channels were a little confused because they usually make series for a specific age group, but since miraculous had people of all ages watching, they weren't sure what to do.

- Sébastien says he's very happy that miraculous inspires a lot of people to create things, like writing fanfiction, however he's not interested in it because he doesn't want to be influenced by certain fans who would love to see certain things in the series.

- Writing direction also means paying attention to how the characters speak. They all have their own way of speaking. For example, Adrien will never say "j’te parle", but rather "Je te parle".

- During the writing process, the writers sometimes act out scenes to make the dialogue more natural. This is what happened with the episode "Gang of secrets". They felt that, with the success of the show and the pressure it was generating, they needed to write something to relieve their stress. So they wrote about Marinette and the enormous pressure she was under to keep all her secrets. The final scene, in which Marinette tells Alya that she's Ladybug, came naturally when they performed it together.

[lover-of-mine]

Hi, welcome to Buck just had his oh moment and the color theory of it all.

Usual shoutout to @stagefoureddiediaz because being mind meld with her is what's getting me here lol

First, I'm gonna break my own rule and give too much power to the showrunners, I know I keep saying not to, but hear me out. Buck, Bothered and Bewildered is on Buck's pov, right? That was made clear by the episode and then confirmed in interviews that that was the vision, and well, Tim also said that that scene was from Buck's pov, it's all about Buck's reaction and how he will go crazy about this because he's abandonment issues personified, that is also confirmed with the way we don't see what Eddie is doing until he tells Buck, we are learning things at the same time as Buck is.

Okay, well, why am I going back to 704? Well, Buck's fear of losing Eddie (I don't care what Buck says, he wanted Eddie's attention) made him go completely batshit crazy last time. But it also triggered something really important: Buck's bisexuality. And they just repeated that trigger, but this time with Buck choosing to walk in.

They repeated the bt first kiss structure but with Buck making the choices that create that change. The bt kiss, Buck is working on some bills, Tommy shows up, Buck is spiraling because of Eddie, Tommy kisses him, Buck has the bisexual realization. The 808 scene, Eddie is working on the houses, Buck shows up, he's spiraling about Tommy, Eddie reveals something, and Buck is snapped into the realization. Important thing to notice is that Buck still doesn't fully understand the depth of what his relationship with Tommy showed him about himself, so Buck still might not understand the impact of what his abandonment issues just told him while he was sitting on Eddie's couch. And it's all on Buck's pov.

But Anna, you said color theory.

I'm getting there. Because, well, the bt kiss is blue and red.

Same as 808. So we are evoking the same feeling, especially because of Buck's short sleeves and the buttons (and not a white shirt under this like he had all season lol)

And thinking about the blue and yellow coding Buck's bi arc, he worked his way to lighter blues. He starts with the navy blue colors until that lighter teal tone from the coming out scene.

It's also interesting that in the scenes that are about Eddie in a sense, when he's talking to Maddie and he got it right about it being about Eddie, and the coming out scene being about their friendship, are lighter colors along with Buck matching his background. We don't have the yellow elements but we have that cohesion on the frame composition. (I guess the 606 hoodie also counts since blue and green theory but I don't want to make another image now).

If you're new here, the theory is that Buck worked his way to his blue from darker colors, his blue being the color he is wearing during the coming out scene (and Eddie will find his yellow, but we are not talking about Eddie).

We are back in the darker blue but the composition of the scene is lighter. Buck is literally in front of the light as he is talking to Eddie in the kitchen, and it's the middle of the day.

He matches the background, the couch, the Texas frame, the lighting is also a lot colder than it usually is in Eddie's house. And it's also very important that he is on the couch, because yay couch theory.

But Anna how does any of this prove anything?

Well, Buck is working his way back to his blue while in the darker colors, because while he got the bisexuality part right, Tommy wasn't the right person, and he's finally back in the light, we don't have the dimmed light and the obstruction of his face created by the shadow, dare I saw Buck is finally starting to see things clearer.

But why am I so sure? The shirt he was wearing today?

Same color but in a darker shade than his blue.

Buck is back on the discovery feeling that comes with the darker blue but this time he's in the correct hue, he just needs to get to the right shade, and he just figured something out.

Abandonment issues personified just had his oh moment about Eddie at the thought of losing him permanently, sitting on Eddie's couch while wearing his blue.

Other things to notice, Buck knocked but walked in before Eddie could get to the door, he used his key and the knocking was just to let Eddie know he was there, Buck is the one who suggests moving to the couch and the couch ties it back to the couch theory and the 601 dinner, dare I say that even Buck offering to bake for Eddie and the cooking aspect of it all, and the idea that the couch is home and home is a person and for Buck that's Eddie.

Something else is the way that we finally see someone eating whatever it is Buck is stress baking. Madney don't eat at the loft and the chief interrupts them at the firehouse. Eddie on the other hand is DIGGING into those. And food in 911, in media in general, is about connection, and is very pointedly about love here, and the whole stress baking is great because the kitchen is Buck's safe space, he cooks for people he loves, we see that from when Maddie comes back, to the pointed way he gets take out for his parents in 610, to the lasagna, making chilly with Bobby, cooking for the house on 709 and getting Bobby's approval. And the fact that we are getting Eddie eating what Buck's nervous state is creating while allowing Buck to just go through his kitchen to make more because he is not about to not accept every part of Buck Buck offers him is important.

The fact that Eddie isn't objecting to Buck rummaging around his kitchen is also important in the way the show uses Eddie's house in a meta way, kinda like the way the show uses the loft to match Buck's spirits in a sense, how the kitchen is his heart and for family, how the living room ends up being for guests and it's made pointed about the couch his mother bought "for his guests", Eddie's kitchen and the whole way it's the space Eddie allows himself to be vulnerable but there's the thing of honesty, the core of who Eddie is is tied to the kitchen, and the fact that he's just letting Buck move around like it's his kitchen ads a lot. Buck is the only person who walked into the house through the back door, Buck has a key, Buck has been in every room (except the bathroom but I think they are saving that for buddie canon), that's home for him too and Eddie never thinks to question and Buck never thinks to doubt it ("this is Eddie's house, I'm not really a guest").

Anyway, Buck oh moment real. Buddie 8b real. Color theory got me so high I'm wondering this is what doing hard drugs feels like. I think this is all I have to say. I might come back, who knows? I don't.

If you read this I love you.

taglist (interact with this post if you wanna get tagged)

@sparkedblaze @caw-salem @dreamofsomepiphany @100ceruleaneyes @linus-lucy @chaosqueery @gina-spike @chimchiminie98 @elvensorceress @singitforthegirls @dangerpronebuddie @182daysof @steadfastsaturnsrings @sparklespiff @inell @miles--to--go @jesuisici33 @wolfdeans @lunarsolar1 @joshwritesfics @glasscities @kejfeblintz @stagefoureddiediaz @mosaicstardust @eddiedisasterdiaz @hermioneindisguise @queerprincesseddiediaz @lookforanewangle @becausebuckley @lemotmo @thenainitaldisaster @epiaphany @trudayss @shelfthe-reader @alliaskisthepossibilityoflove @buckgettingstruck @scoupsahoy @the-whispers-of-death @iced-coffee-jesus @izzysbeans @starkytower @thegeekcompanion @sunflower-eddiediaz @bucks-daddy-issues

@dingdongfries @angelcamael

[azaharinflames]

Well, hello my fellow and beloved BuckTommies. I come here with a new theory - not quite or what will happen, but on what did.

Let me put my tin hat firmly on my head for a second, alright? Because we have been talking about all kinds of possibilities, and have theorized about BTS, and even budget cuts, but.

We are all missing one thing.

What happened during the summer that has repercussions in the series right now? Or that will have in the immediate future, but we’re only seeing the start of...?

An ‘I Know What You Did Last Summer’ reboot was officially announced.

It is set to be filmed in Australia come the New Year. And JLH, famously having been in the first one, is going to Australia to film for this one as well. 

This means that, just like they did in Season 5, they will have to take JLH’s absence and other compromises into consideration. In Season 5 she was on maternity leave, this time around she has a movie to shoot. And it just hit me that it might be the reason why things got moved around, and why perhaps they did what they did with BuckTommy.

(Disclaimer: I am not putting this on JLH, and I don’t want anyone to do it either. If this is something that clashed with the initial plan, what the writers and Tim came up with it’s on them, never Jennifer)

We know Tim is not someone who writes his stuff in advance. He’s flying by the seat of his pants; he writes as he goes, and this is something he has said before. So now he has to write and plan in advance because Jennifer will be somewhat absent. The direct result of this is, in my opinion, Madney.

The storyline of them having a second child at home, having her go back to her family, having Jee notice her absence, and then starting to debate on whether to have a second kid… had the potential to be more than one episode. Or, at the very least, to end the episode with them deciding that, yeah, they want to try, they want to expand their family. Maddie’s mentality on PPD could’ve been an episode in itself (Lord knows we don’t get enough Maddie episodes, especially lately), instead of a throwaway line on how she doesn’t want PPD to define her. I do think it’s amazing she’s at that point in her life and on her journey, but I can’t help but think this could’ve also been a really nice episode arc to have. Chimney’s doubts were also gone pretty quickly, with not even needing to talk to anyone about it. All in all - the storyline felt rushed and a bit anticlimactic. And at this point, I can only imagine they will somehow try to create some drama surrounding the pregnancy in 808 (807 perhaps, but it feels like it’s busy enough) so that Jennifer’s absence is justified. We don’t know if, just like in Season 5, Kenny will also be absent (Chim going with Maddie wherever she goes, I don’t know). People weren’t happy with him having to be off the show in Season 5, so I hope he stays, but we don’t know just yet. 

A side result of this could’ve also been BuckTommy. If there is something I’ve gathered from Oliver and Lou’s interviews is that both were a bit surprised it happened this soon. Now, we don’t know if this means they were breaking up for good later on in the season, if this was supposed to be a longer arc, or if they knew there were talks of break-up-make-up, once they were more established. As it is, this happened now.

And in my mind there are two possible theories. Let me present first why I have them:

-They need some substantial drama to go on for 8b. Bathena went through it in S7 and now are rebuilding their life, so it would be a bit of an overkill to have them go through it in S8 as well. Eddie is going through his own stuff and is going on a journey of discovering and enjoying himself (that, personally, I hope deals with actually dealing with it and having deep conversations with Chris). Hen and Karen have just gone over the drama of the adoption and, to be honest, they need a breather. Give them SLs that don’t involve them somewhat losing their kids (be it adoption, or an accident). 

-So… that leaves Buck. Buck, whom we all joked was the only one doing fine in Season 7. Whom we all said was going to go through it in Season 8 to compensate for his happiness in 7. Well. The joke’s on us. He’s had such a drama-free period of his life (yes, affected by what was happening around him, but not directly involved in it) that I think we forgot they enjoy making him suffer. We barely saw a thing with Gerard, and nothing to last the whole season, so… now this. 

So. From this, I see two options:

-They always knew they wanted to have BT have issues, that they didn’t want them to be easy or smooth-sailing, because has a couple in this show been that? No, right? So why would they? So they wanted a break-up arc, potentially ending in making up. Perhaps things moved around a little bit, we don’t know. But maybe they want 8b to deal with Buck trying to see what Tommy meant, yet realizing he still wants Tommy, thus starting the make-up arc. Meaning, they decided to have BT bear the weight of the heavy drama of this second half. People are already invested, clearly, and with JLH gone for a bit, they need people interested in what will happen next.

-Sort of the same, but different results - they just want Buck dating around and having drama with that. Admittedly weaker than the other option, but it is one I don’t necessarily eliminate just yet. Mostly because I’ve learned to be skeptical of 911’s intentions. 

Previous to 806, I fully expected 8b to have more Buck/BT, Madney stories as A plot, as they haven’t had one in 8A. But now that I think about it all, I can’t help but wonder if those last minutes decisions were to accomodate what will happen, just like it happened in Season 5 (which, I will remind you, dealt with her absence by having a lot more of Taylor than we were expecting. Her appearances went down quite a bit once JLH and Kenny were back, and shortly after, she was gone).

Again, I am aware I might be delulu right now. But for the first time in days, something has fully made sense to me. In conclusion:

[so-that-was-okay]

So, 807 and the future of Bucktommy.

This is an open door. And I even want to think Tim & Co always had a plan. The breakup was planned but not final. Buck is pining, he's not depressed to the point of being broken but he is heartbroken. Tommy's constantly on his mind and he'd have called him if Hen and Eddie didn't stop him (which is also part of the classic romance storyline).

What really hijacked this story is those damn interviews presented as exit interviews. They were made to make us believe Lou was definitely done with 911, meaning Tommy was completely written off the show. Without them, no one would have known Lou was off the show for the rest of the half season. We'd have waited for Tommy to appear, and we'd have seen Lou reappear on SWAT, thinking he's doing both. Buddie journos disrupted the show's narrative.

Now that that's passed, what is the show telling us? It's telling us Buck is not over Tommy. It's telling us he's not ready to date someone else right now. He's lonely and he wants Tommy back. It won't happen in 808, I'm not even sure they'll mention Tommy again in next episode because that's the thing: in a classic romance storyline, Buck will now enter the "look at me, I can live without him" phase. He'll try to move on. I can see him go on a couple of dates (maybe during the hiatus or even in 808) with nice people but his heart is nowhere near ready for that even if the distraction is welcome.

Which leads us to 8b and the next phase of the romance storyline. Something should happen that makes them cross path again. On a call? Maybe at first. If they really write that as a typical romcom, then it's all awkwardness, nervous smiles and an irremediable attraction. They never parted by a lack of love or attraction. Tommy left because he already loved Buck too much too soon. But it's also 911. If they see each other once on a call, next time should be a lot more dramatic (chopper crash my beloved), which would lead to their eventual reunion.

It's a stretch but this is what could, and maybe should, happen. 8b is made for their reunion. If we completely forget the interviews, everything is perfectly rolling. It's sad for us, and heartbreaking, but that's the point. That's how romance is done. Hell, they could even cross path while they're both on a date with someone else and things would be so weird (and Buck would be jealous without admitting it of course).

Now, that could also be the delusion talking but we deserve to imagine a reconciliation storyline. We're almost owed it. We're tired of the doomed queers, the lonely, the loveless, the forever single best friend clown of the group. They're already trapping HenRen in a mother storyline with no character development left (I miss Hen and her personal ambition), at least let us have bi Buck living the love he deserves with someone who actually cares about him.

We need to continue being (respectfully) loud about them. The GA joined us, we're not being delusional on that point. If the GA is also disappointed then it means something. It's a lot bigger than just a shipper tantrum. Buck and Tommy are meaningful as a couple for a lot of people.

[buddiebeginz]

For everyone hoping and or expecting there to be something huge in the mid season finale on Thursday and who will feel let down and upset if there's not I wanted to point out some things.

First of all Tim just came back in s7 and it was a shortened season. I know we all had issues with how that season was handled but I also think Tim had a lot to figure out for having just come back to show. He was bringing 911 to a new network had only 10 eps to tell the entire seasons stories in. It was also a rather important season considering it was where they finally had Buck come out and where the pieces were finally being put into motion for Buddie to happen eventually (like in episode 704).

But I also think a lot of stuff Tim wanted to do in s7 he didn't get to and instead carried it over to s8 where he felt he had more time. The majority of 8a was spent closing out storylines that started in s7. What people have to realize is that a lot of this likely would have been the second half of season 7 had that been a full season. Now going into 8b I expect to see more focus put on Eddie's coming out and more movement towards Buddie happening.

None of this means that the mid season finale will necessarily be a huge ep or have a nde or have Eddie come out or Buddie kiss or anything like that. This ep may be pretty similar to the one we saw last week especially because like some have pointed out Tim and the others may have been expecting 809 to be the mid season finale not 808. And besides that 911's mid season finales have rarely been these huge events. Those were usually saved for other eps.

---------------------------------

S1 -

shortened season - no mid season finale

no real NDE's although you could say the plane disaster was one for Bobby

S2 -

210 - mid season finale - It's revealed that Chim's friend is Doug

*2b*

211/212/213 - Chim begins/ Doug attacks Chim and takes Maddie

217 - Shannon dies car accident

218 - Buck NDE truck bombing

S3 -

302/303 - Buck and Chris NDE tsunami

308 - Hen NDE car accident (a few eps before mid season finale)

Bobby radiation exposure 309 (one ep before mid season finale)

310 - mid season ep - Michael cancer diagnosis

*3b*

314 - dispatch center/Maddie held hostage

315 - Eddie NDE well

317 - Athena NDE r*pist

S4 -

shortened season because of Covid no mid season finale

405 - Buck NDE fire

409 - Albert NDE car accident

413/414 - Eddie NDE shooting

S5 -

506 - Buddie kidnapping

508 - Hospital (where David worked) fire

510 - mid season ep Eddie leaves the 118

*5b*

513 - Eddie breakdown

516 - dispatch fire

517 - Hen/Chim - NDE - jonah

S6 -

Mid season ep - Bobby's sponsor dying

*6b*

610/611 - Buck NDE lightning strike

618 - 118 NDE bridge collapse

S7 -

shortened season - no mid season finale

701-703 - Bathena NDE - cruise ship disaster

708-710 Bathena NDE - Cartel/Fire

S8 -

802/803 - Athena NDE plane emergency

805 - Denny NDE

---------------------------------

Looking at the way 911 has structured it's seasons in the past it's far more likely that if we're going to get a nde for Buddie or one of them we're going to get it later in the season and not at the mid season. We could get a more surprising moment like we've seen in the past like with Eddie leaving the 118 but like I said before I think it's highly probable that 808 wasn't meant to even be the season finale so a more shocking or surprising moments might not even be until 809 when the show comes back.

I just really think we all need to take a look how the show operates and prepare ourselves so we're not too let down. Also as much as I love coming up with theories and love listening to theories everyone else comes up with I feel like it's become a habit lately in our fandom for some people to get everyone excited and expecting certain things from the show. Then when the show doesn't deliver every single episode people are left feeling angry. This isn't just the fault of the people talking about their theories it's a fandom issue in general I think. I wish our fandom would just be more realistic going into each ep and not so quick to turn on the show if expectations aren't met immediately.

I 100% believe Eddie is going to come out and Buddie is happening. I've been watching the show for years and things have never been as close to Buddie canon as they are now but that doesn't mean it will happen instantly. Everything that's being shown and said (in interviews) is telling us that the show is playing the long game. We have to be patient and wait for them to get there, which I know can be really frustrating, trust me I've been waiting for Buddie's love story to be canon for what feels like forever. I think we will see more movement in Eddie and Buddie's story this season but maybe not this episode coming.

----

I also think it's important that we show our love for the show and the people who work on it more. I feel like a lot of the stuff I see out of our fandom lately is pretty negative. I'm not saying it's not warranted or that I don't do my own share too (I was talking just the other day on twitter about my issues with Athena's storylines) but I also can't help to think of how Oliver and Ryan and the others must feel. Imagine working really hard on something and then going online to see how the audience feels about it and the predominate reaction is about how awful the episode was. I definitely believe it's possible to love 911 (and any media really) and still be critical of it at times but I also think sometimes our fandom focuses too much on what we're not getting from the show and less on what we are.

We are incredibly lucky to have two amazing actors who put such love and care into playing Buck and Eddie and who have always been supportive of our ship. We're lucky that pretty much everyone involved with 911 (minus maybe KR) seems to be supportive of Buddie happening because trust me that's not common among a lot of other non canon queer ships. We're lucky that Buck has finally come out and that all signs are pointing towards Eddie coming out too. We're lucky that the show is even still on the air because it was seriously on the brink of being canceled before abc picked it up. If it had been not only would we have no chance of Buddie but Buck would never have come out and both men would have ended their run on the show with those lackluster partners. And speaking of lackluster partners we're lucky that Tim got rid of Tommy. I know he could have done it sooner but he also could have kept him around longer. I think some of you need to realize that making Buddie a reality is still a risk for the show and for abc. Having another main come out is still risky but they seem ready to take the risk.

Sorry this post got so long. I just had a lot of thoughts with the new ep coming and seeing everyone already prepared to be upset about it. Let's just go into this ep with limited expectations and be happy we get to go into a hiatus for the first time in a while without b/t being a thing. Thanks if you taken the time to read all of this. ❤️

[soothinglee]

| shitty 808s - kim jongseob x gn! reader - 1.2k wc✔︎

my notes⎯ sorry for not writing in a bit- I got hit by a scooter and lost hearing in my left eye. anyway- enjoy! (ilovejongseobsm). also the reader is younger than jongseob- so they're the maknae! warnings⎯ lowercase intended, cursing, not really proofread, I don't know jackshit about making music- I do make it just for fun but I don't know it on a professional level. songs⎯ "take you there x no bs" | dj short and "trillions" | alicia keys

“dude this sounds like shit.”

“it’s literally only 808s. it’s not going to sound good.”

“tell that to carti.”

jongseob groans and relaxes his body into the creaky studio chair. from where he's at; body slouches and neck bent, he feebly grabs for the mouse, each time he reaches he just barely misses it- giving a pitiful grunt every time.

you slap his hand away playfully, scooting your chair over in his place to play with the track. in the 30 minutes you've been in the studio you only managed the 808s. ass, in your opinion but something to start the song off as a base.

"what are you doing?" he mutters, looking towards the desktop screen. the black background of the software lights up every time you move around tracks. the purple and blue sections reflect off his glasses, "stop pressing stuff, you're gonna mess it up."

a scoff leaves your lips absentmindedly, choosing to replace the pre-made 808s with a original. you play it back for a spilt second- nodding to yourself feeling content in your work.

"you should be thankful I'm helping you," you start, adding a few high hats some measures into the song, "today is my off day and youngji just came out with a new episode."

he rolls his eyes and reaches over to grab his water bottle, he uncaps it and throws the lid on your lap. you make no effort to move it, "you would've had to come in eventually. jiung needed you today to record your verse."

you reach over to twitch your hand infront of his bottle, as if faking him out. he jerks his body away from you quickly, the water shakes in his hand- some even coming from the top and onto his sweater.

"bro." it comes out weak and quiet, a frown forming on his lips but you're quick to talk over him;

"for him, I wouldn't have complained. it's different when I have to do it because it's scheduled then come in to help someone work on his song." you spilt the back ground voices you added from files and slip in theo's guitar solo along with a 4 bar bass drum.

at this point you haven't listened to what has been added, jongseob still hogging the headphones. though you have enough confidence in yourself, and as one of the main producers, to know that the song will be somewhat decent- and way better than whatever he had before.

"what even is your inspo?"

"'bambi', baekhyun."

he makes a face, "sexy, no?"

you shrug, clicking around on the application to add some reverb, "piece will love it, fnc will tolerate it, intak will be happy. what more is there?"

he doesn't respond.

the difference between the software when jongseob had it compared to it in your hands is insane. infront of you the screen decorated with rainbows of colors, the static lines tracking the sound range from lengths and size. it's beautiful.

you feel a heavy weight on your left arm and look down to see jongseob leaning on you, he lets out a tired breath, and reaches up to fiddle with the loose string on your sleeve.

"are you almost done yet? you're hogging my equipment and I have other stuff I need to do."

"is all you do is complain?" you ask, titling the song with a random phrase and saving it, "because if that's the case I'll just get keeho."

his grip on your sleeve tightens as he tenses. for some reason jongseob is afraid of keeho- the latter always picking on him and fighting him. you would ask why and how it started but in all honesty, you couldn't really care.

"no no no, it's okay. you can keep working."

a proud smirk graces your lips as you reach over to slip the headphones off his head. he lets you, reaching forward to give you better access, smiling when he feels your hands pat down the mess they left.

you bend down slightly, apologizing when his head falls from your shoulder, and blindly reach for the tower to unplug the cord from its socket. "alright," you mess with the setting once more, turning the volume up enough so it can be heard. "you ready?"

jongseob yawns, "about time." you smack him upside the head.

the song is only about 3 minutes long, but in that three minutes it sounded wonderful. even though you were on playing around with it, something to keep jongseob satisfied until he could figure out what he really wanted to do with it, you think it could actually be the final product.

as the song plays you would take a look at his face to gauge his opinion. he seemed to like it; bobbing his head with the melody, a soft smile on his lips. it made you feel somewhat better about missing youngjis' show.

"okay, what do you think?" you ask as the beat fades out, you pause it so it doesn't play again and turn your body towards him, knees knocking each other.

he doesn't say anything for a minute, staring at the poster on the wall behind your head. his face is back to neutral. you think about snapping your fingers infront of his face to wake him up.

after a while he takes in a breath and says, “buns, actual buns.”

“you’re only saying that because it’s not jiung working on the song.”

he doesn't say anything but nods in agreement. there's a cheeky smirk on his face. "if that's the case, I'll just delete the song." you move the mouse to press erase before a hand catches you before you do.

"don't." he says, a mild glint in his eye as he pries your fingers from the mouse. he gently places your hand back in your lap while maintaining eye contact, moving the device to his side of the table.

"so it's not 'buns'?" you ask, the smirk back on your face.

he hesitates and then says, "no it's still ass, but why would I delete it just to start over, waste of time."

you laugh and go to answer but your phone vibrating catches you off guard. you use your face to open it to read the message;

멘토르 (mentor) come to floor 4 pls, we're ready for you :)

"uh oh," the chair beneath you slides backward as you stand up to collect your belonging. the bottle cap falls from your lap as you hand jongseob his headphones, "duty calls, i'll be gone for about an hour or two, if you need me, don't. I'll be busy."

he laughs, watching as you put on your shoes. you places a kiss on his head as you retreat for the door. you hear the clicking of a mouse and muffled music from behind you.

as soon as you reach for the door knob a voice calls out. "yeah?"

jongseob, hood pulled back so that you can see the bangs of his brown hair, his glasses that reflect the sparkle in his eyes, and the big smile on his face says, "I know I give you shit but thank you. you saved me a lot of trouble."

you smile back at your elder, a content look matching his own, "hey, anytime."

you close the door and head towards the elevator.

⎯if you want to be apart of my taglist let me know!

→ thank you for reading!

[stagefoureddiediaz]

Oh Oliver Oliver Oliver how I love thee!!

In flux you say

Dealing with changes you say

Velocity you say

A lot of possibility you say

So many most excellent things all in one answer!

Flux and change in the same sentence is so interesting and telling on several fronts (and not just Eddie’s moustache!). It’s very loudly saying bt bones sooner rather than later, but it’s also suggesting some things going down at the firehouse and maybe with Bobby (the working together during the plane emergency was very much giving me calm before a storm vibes) which I’m excited to see as I think it will be fabulous for Bucks development both personally and professionally. But it’s also giving me changes with Eddie vibes - and on a couple of fronts - the Christopher front, and the personal front.

The use of velocity is an interesting choice - when you think Bucks been stuck on that hamster wheel for so long and then got off one to land on another, the fact we’re now talking velocity is pretty interesting! It’s very much suggesting we’re going to get a huge amount of buck set up stuff in the next couple of episodes - on multiple fronts. So btw bones obviously, which I’m expecting to trigger some soul searching and figuring out - that his bisexual awakening has triggered buck knowing himself more than he ever has before but that Tommy has been holding him in stasis and as soon as he’s gone it will actually catapult him forward quite dramatically.

I mean velocity is giving me feelings for Eddie realisation vibes, but then, because I think in 806 Eddie is going to shave the stache off and then head off to Texas to try to fix things with Chris, things settling down for buck for a little bit makes a lot of sense to me. In combination with ‘a lot of possibility’ and the concept of ‘next step’ and Oliver being excited to see where ‘the story goes in the not to distant future’ it’s very much giving buck sort of pining era vibes. Eddie being physically gone (and working on his own stuff which I expect to take 2 episodes at most) giving buck some processing space would be great to watch - especially if we are shown them being in contact by phone and video chat etc. As the audience we’d get to see Buck actively knowingly in love whilst not being able to act on it - Oliver obviously wouldn’t know yet how that initial pining era is going to go from there because it would take us through to 808 - which is what they’re finishing up right now, so it’s all set up to be exciting because Eddie will then return and Chris will be back (he better or I will be protesting at the studio!) so focus will shift to that aspect for an episode or so, and we’ll have fully pining buck who’s also delighted Chris is back and that leads to a cliffhanger mid season on the will they won’t they front!

I can see it all so clearly and I’m very here for it please and thank you

[jimintomystery]

MST3K's most wanted

I've been organizing my Mystery Science Theater 3000 collection, so I've become preoccupied with the handful of episodes that are not easily available, and the reasons why. In case in anyone else is interested, I thought I'd share what I've learned.

For our purposes we'll be focusing on the ten seasons that aired on cable, from 1989 to 1999. With the post-2017 episodes, it's trivial to purchase them on home video or streaming. And the pre-cable stuff, from KTMA, is widely available as bootleg footage, which is probably about as good as you're ever going to get. But the episodes from the cable era have been notoriously difficult to re-release, and require special attention.

Of the 176 MST3K episodes that aired on cable, 166 have been released on home video, and 145 are available for streaming/download on the Gizmoplex. As someone who's been trying to collect the whole series since the 1990s, I think that's pretty impressive. But there are 40 episodes that have been particularly tricky. Let's take a look, won't you?

Currently available on the Gizmoplex, but never on home video (1):

913 - Quest of the Delta Knights

As I understand it, nobody was sure who owned the rights to this movie, or how to contact them, for years. The situation has only recently been cleared up, perhaps too late for a DVD release.

Currently available on the Gizmoplex, but out of print on home video (8):

203 - Jungle Goddess

317 - Viking Women and the Sea Serpent

319 - War of the Colossal Beast

510 - The Painted Hills

619 - Red Zone Cuba

806 - The Undead

808 - The She-Creature

912 - The Screaming Skull

It looks like all of these went out of print due to being on a set where a different episode's rights expired. Theoretically Shout Factory could re-release any of them in a "Lost and Found" set, but that may not be cost-effective as people move away from collecting physical media.

Currently available on home video and MST3K's official YouTube, but not on the Gizmoplex (1):

615 - Kitten with a Whip (Vol. 25 DVD, 2012)

Kitten is one of the Universal movies that could only be licensed for physical media. And yet, it's the only one I can find on the official YouTube channel. Beats me why that is.

Currently available on home video, but not on the Gizmoplex (16):

401 - Space Travelers (Vol. 32 DVD, 2015)

522 - Teen-Age Crime Wave (Vol. 33 DVD, 2015)

524 - 12 to the Moon (Vol. 35 DVD, 2016)

601 - Girls Town (Vol. 39 DVD, 2017)

605 - Colossus and the Headhunters (Vol. 38 DVD, 2017)

614 - San Francisco International (Vol. 32 DVD, 2015)

704 - The Incredible Melting Man (Vol. 36 DVD, 2016)

801 - Revenge of the Creature (Vol. 25 DVD, 2012)

802 - The Leech Woman (25th Anniversary Edition DVD, 2013)

803 - The Mole People (Vol. 26 DVD, 2013)

804 - The Deadly Mantis (Vol. 27 DVD, 2013)

805 - The Thing That Couldn't Die (Vol. 29 DVD, 2013)

814 - Riding With Death (Vol. 36 DVD, 2016)

815 - Agent for H.A.R.M (Vol. 33 DVD, 2015)

901 - The Projected Man (Vol. 30 DVD, 2014)

1013 - Diabolik (Vol. 39 DVD, 2017)

I was able to find the DVD sets listed above on Shout Factory's website. As far as I know, they'll remain in print for the foreseeable future, but there's no way to know how long that will last.

The general pattern with these episodes is that the movies are owned by major studios that would only license them for physical media. Columbia owns Teen-Age Crime Wave and 12 to the Moon. MGM owns Girls Town and The Incredible Melting Man. Paramount owns Diabolik. But the big player here is Universal, which controls the rights to Space Travelers, San Francisco International, Revenge of the Creature, Leech Woman, Mole People, Deadly Mantis, Thing That Couldn't Die, Riding With Death, Agent for H.A.R.M., and Projected Man.

The odd man out here is Colossus and the Headhunters; I can't find any info on who owns the rights to this film, which may be part of the problem.

The real hard cases, the stickiest of wickets, are below...

Released on home video, but now out of print (5):

212 - Godzilla vs. Megalon (Vol. 10 DVD, 2006)

309 - The Amazing Colossal Man (VHS, 1996)

910 - The Final Sacrifice (Vol. 17 DVD, 2010)

1001 - Soultaker (Vol. 14 DVD, 2009)

1012 - Squirm (Turkey Day Collection DVD, 2014)

Megalon and Colossal Man were both recalled when rights issues came up after they were released. Oops. These were produced by Rhino, back before Shout Factory took over.

The Final Sacrifice is particularly tough to find, even unofficially, because director Tjardus Greidanus is very aggressive about tracking down download links. I always figured someone was similarly possessive of Soultaker, since it's clearly a passion project, but that's purely my speculation.

The Turkey Day DVD set is still available on Amazon at a reasonable price, so Squirm is still relatively accessible for now.

Never released on home video or streaming (9):

201 - Rocketship X-M

213 - Godzilla vs. the Sea Monster

311 - It Conquered the World

416 - Fire Maidens of Outer Space

418 - Attack of the the Eye Creatures

807 - Terror from the Year 5000

809 - I was a Teenage Werewolf

905 - The Deadly Bees

906 - The Space Children

In 2017, Shout released its final (?) MST3K DVD collection, which included Satellite Dishes, a compilation of host segments from episodes that "may never get a legitimate release." This included the nine listed above, as well as The Amazing Colossal Man and Quest for the Delta Knights. Of course, Delta Knights eventually got a digital-only release, which is cause for a glimmer of hope. But the others are probably tougher nuts to crack.

Wade Williams owned the rights to Rocketship X-M and had a particular sentimental attachment to the film. His death in 2023 may make it easier to negotiate with his estate, but I wouldn't count on that being a swift process.

Godzilla vs. Megalon and Godzilla vs. The Sea Monster are part of a prestigious franchise, and it's remarkable MST3K got away with riffing on Godzilla movies in the first place. I get the impression that Japanese culture doesn't particularly appreciate the sort of mockery MST3K is known for, so the rights to these two movies may be a long, long shot. Then again I used to think there was no hope of for the Gamera episodes too.

Fire Maidens, Deadly Bees, and Space Children are owned by Olive Films, and currently licensed to Paramount. It's possible a deal can be made later on, but not until the current arrangement expires.

The major bugbear for MST3K fandom is Susan Hart, the widow of American International Pictures co-founder James Nicholson. One way or another the AIP catalog was split up and Hart laid claim to several of their films, including Amazing Colossal Man, It Conquered the World, Eye Creatures, Terror from the Year 5000, and Teenage Werewolf. Hart's price for licensing her movies is very high, and it seems Shout has given up negotiating with her. I suppose the situation could change when she passes away, but I'd feel rather silly hoping for an old woman to die just so I can pay 8 bucks to watch robots laugh at a werewolf movie.

In conclusion, I've already purchased all the movies available on the Gizmoplex (I got most of them in a Kickstarter reward package), and the 31 that aren't available there can be obtained by, ahem, other means. So it's a great time to be an MST3K fan, and I'm still amazed how easy it is to watch the show nowadays.

[loulovingho]

do you think this final episode before the hiatus will have tommy since we have written in

whoa... um, no. I'm not sure up to what episode they've filmed, but I'm sure they've already completed one or two into 8b by now. No backlash existed when they were filming 808, so I don't expect any indication that Tommy will return. IF they change their minds or do anything based off of backlash, I wouldn't expect to see any of it until late into the season, like near the finale. And that's a big, like big, big if!

I will always encourage people to continue writing in their love for Tommy, their dissatisfaction with the biphobic lines, the way Tim conducts himself in interviews and the blatant lies he tells, the way the writing is this season, or whatever may bother you about the show currently. But please don't do it with the expectation that you're going to get everything you want. Do it because it helps you feel better, and you deserve to be heard!

[mad-spoon]

Episode 808