#child orin

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BG3 Fic Feb Comic Edition, Day 23 :

A day in Durge's childhood : Meeting Orin the Red

The very moment she decided she would stab him in the back one day!

[quess-art]

I need D'Urge to be a companion 😭 Especially since he's canonical even when you create a custom Tav

(Some headcanons, some based on little snippets of dialogue from the game)

Edit: Baby Durge Tail Wag GIF

⇐ Previous | Memento of The Dark Urge | Next ⇒

[theannoyingurge]

I love how Gortash complains that Orin is insane and wants to kill everything in sight, yet seems to think The Dark Urge was different?

Supposing he isn't just saying this to manipulate you out of ripping his face off (a theory I enjoy quite a bit), he commends you for being calculated and controlled and knowing when to pick a fight. He says things like "Orin only cares for blood" and "I want to lead this city to glory, not scorch its earth" like he's selling you something.

Gort, do you even realize your former partner dreams of a blood red sky with not a single cockroach left alive to witness it? I feel like you don't.

From Orin's perspective, Durge was a mindless, bloodthirsty animal who literally wanted to kill everything indiscriminately. Sarevok also alludes to your "primal" urges.

So... what gives? Did Durge hide their true nature around Gortash because they wanted to impress him? Because it worked.

Was it all manipulation to gain his trust? Or were they so knotted in his chords that they forged a new self image, separate from Bhaal? Is that why they prayed for their father's forgiveness, promising that one day, they would finally stop resisting and win the game / end the world for Him?

Was that new, troublesome ego the one that they woke up with on the nautiloid after everything else had been lost?

Was the Dark Urge learning to resist Bhaal the result of a crush gone horribly right?

Poor Orin is just trying to live up to Durge's expectations and fill their shoes. But no matter how skillfully she kills, Gortash doesn't treat her with the same respect as her predecessor. Because he remembers a very different person than she does. One who changed for him.

It's no wonder she wants Gortash gone lol.

[calculatedklown]

It's completely baffling that Gortash is the only one of the chosen three with whom we don't get to have any dialogue regarding the information we uncover about him.??

Spoiler warning maybe lol

Like with Orin, we can mention her upbringing or the fact that she's a child of incest. Try to convince her that she's just been abused her whole life? Like obviously this changes nothing in the end. But it still matters that its mentioned.

Ketheric, we also can try and convince him to change his ways. Mention his wife, his religion, Isabelle. Literally mention everything we find out to try and convince him to turn a new leaf. Which also doesn't change any outcome. But I appreciate that its there.

But GORTASH??? We get absolutely NOTHING, it's absurd! It's baffling that we can't even touch on his backstory—like finding his parents,(possibly killing them depending on what you do) being sold to Raphael as a child, or the fact that he was scammed at one point. All the intriguing details we uncover about him lead to nowhere, and it's so annoying 😩

Like this isn't even just because I enjoy him as a character. It just seems like such a missed opportunity to find out more about him currently as a person!

The dialogue we encounter while trying to convince Ketheric and Orin reveals a profound insight into their true characters. Their reactions are telling and provide a unique perspective on who they are as individuals!

Ketheric fully recognizes the person he has become. He understands that he is a lost cause, fully acknowledging the wrongs he has committed and the irreparable damage he has caused. He accepts his fate without hesitation. Despite your words.

Orin lashes out in denial, and becomes completely manic (more so than her usual self). Completely baffled and distraught.

I want to know how Gortash would react if you brought up his parents or his childhood! It's a possibility he wouldn't be grateful if you slayed his parents; in fact, he would likely view any sympathy as a weakness and respond with anger or dismissiveness. Plus, we’ll never find out his true response to Durge after you say, “I always liked you.”

“Is that what you-”

I don't understand these missed opportunities with him?? Like I get keeping some ambiguity to an extent. Its why we will never get a clear answer into him and durges relationship…..BUT I WOULD LIKE A CRUMB OF HIM PLEASE!! I DONT EVEN NEED A KISSY SCENE! I JUST WANT ANY INSIGHT INTO HIS OWN OPINION ON HIS PAST IF ITS MENTIONED!

If you read all of this rambling…..please tell me what YOU think his possible response would be to any of these scenarios lmao please

[stainedglass-sketchbook]

CHILDREN OF BHAAL

I adore the vibe of redeemed durge your sister killed your mind and took your place - it was the greatest gift she ever gave you

[y-rhywbeth2]

An older topic expanded on a smidgeon: I feel like Orin and Durge are seeing Bhaal from opposite sides a bit, and somehow failing to realise that they're not getting the whole picture. That blind men and the elephant allegory.

Canonically Durge sees Bhaal's bloodlust - the god that is at all times consumed by rage and hunger for blood who marched an army of undead on an island nation and manifested purely for the joys of the feeling of delivering death directly with his own hands. 'Death is death, right?'

Orin correctly points out the doctrinal and ecclesial focus on philosophy and artistry, which Bhaal himself does care about. He sets up whole scenes out of a slasher movie, tormenting a bunch of Zhents and leaving horrific murders (executed smoothly, flawlessly and with little mess, considering), just to murder a horse because somebody joked that somebody might kill it. Said horse murder is also deliberately set up so that witnesses would look up and see his holy symbol painted on the ceiling in blood. He casually fought an entire squad of guards with a knife, and took the time to offer a sarcastic polite little bow of acknowledgment/greeting when recognised. He does enjoy showing off, and delights in mortals being terrified of him.

Durge isn't wrong, but Orin is right.

Bhaal, presumably, is letting them keep fighting over it because it makes them easier to manipulate and turn against each other, and it makes their fighting more fervent - particularly when it reaches terminal stage.

[maegalkarven]

As much as I love companions supporting and encouraging Durge to defy Bhaal by reminding them of other Bhaalspawns who did that, I don't think companions truly get (and Durge can't explain to them due to a hole in their head) what Durge is not just any Bhaalspawn.

They are The Bhaalspawn, the last of their kind, the ONLY one of their kind.

Unlike other Bhaalspawn, Durge doesn't have a mortal mother, they don't have any other blood in them to dilute Bhaal's.

Durge is made of nothing but Bhaal and this is why it's so hard for them to resist him.

[justsierrasart]

Baby Orin after getting an attempt on her life at age 6-7 by her own fucking mom!

Rant ahead.

I’m fully, entirely convinced, 99% of evil is not born, but made. Thus I fully believe both Orin and Helena were groomed and psychologically abused into being evil Bhaalspawn. Orin was just a baby that got attacked by her own mother and killer her in self defense, only to get praised for it. These are women raised in cults.

Is the Orin we meet pure unadulterated evil? Yes. Was she always evil? No.

[solar-eclippse]

We all love a conditioned whumpee, someone who was torn from normality and thrown into violence - but what someone who has known nothing else?

Whether they were born into their station, kidnapped as a child, or even if they've forgotten their previous life, this feeling of ownership is all they know.

Living weapons who don't know anything but their calling. Pets and servants who can't recall ever being treated as people. A conditioning that runs so deep that it's nothing you can undo, because nothing came before it. To try and heal them, you'd have to break them down to build them back up again.

[daemon-in-my-head]

I'll never be over Sally calling her own son a dreadful child or saying she should've ended him before he was even born. I don't give a single flying fuck about the crimes he's committed (at least in this context). Nobody should talk about their child like that. And you know this absolutely vile woman probably told him this and much worse shit straight to his face. She said all that shit to a small kid that was presumably still innocent at that point. Aka, she most likely told her child it would be better if he were dead. Aka, she told her kid to kill himself. A FUCKING CHILD. And thx to the Belladonna lying around in their kitchen, I'm still convinced she tried to kill Gortash once he came back.

'Sold him cuz they needed money' my ass. You made your own kid, the person you were supposed to protect, pay for your own fuck ups and debts and mistakes and send him straight to hell. LITERALLY. FOR SOMETHING HE HAD NO FAULT IN. AND THEN THIS THING HAD THE AUDACITY TO TRY ND KILL HIM.

The absolute hatred and disgust I have for this fictional woman. I despise Bhaals A+ parenting, but this woman is worse than the fucking lord of murder. Imagine being more loathsome than an evil deity whose whole bit is goddamm murder and death. I swear to fucking god-

[copypastus]

I like to think my Durge thought they got along perfectly well before the sudden but inevitable betrayal.

[alibonbonn]

Concepting some cool clothes for me and my frens' druid durges. I think druid durge is such a cool idea! Circle of spores or not. Iridis | Tarlukk | Gylla | Sparrow

[rattini]

The Dark Urge: Moth

[bloodurged]

the dark urge as orin's uncle. the dark urge who gifted her daggers and taught her to skin. praised her during the duel he insisted on, even in his weakened state; better to risk death than to let others fight her. if she is to die for this to end, then it will only be by the hands of family. not bhaal or sarevok but her real family, the person she is and could have been. the dark urge who treasures his red lady despite himself, always an arm's reach away: bhaal only allows love when it's a dagger. so she grows angry and jealous. love coming back to bite. the dark urge who is proud she managed to dethrone him, despite her failure to end his life.

[the-grand-gemini]

Big obsessed with all of the BG3 villains. The themes of the cycle of abuse/trauma in all of the main cast makes me feral over how the villains unfortunately do not/did not get the opportunity to be "saved" by Tav (if doing a good playthrough) and by experiencing the heros journey.

I could talk about Ketheric and Orin, but after reading @bearhugsandshrugs fic it got me deep diving into Gortash's character. It's amazing and everyone should read it especially if you're weak for Tav/Gortash like I am 👀💦

Trigger warning for abuse mentions below the cut.

Let me start with stating this is NOT an Enver Gortash apologist post, he's evil and he's done terrible things. This is just me yelling into the void about character foils.

Childhood abuse:

In game we really only get to know his history through background information that we can scrape together if you search through the city and the House of Hope.

We don't get any details on what exactly Enver went through as a child. We can assume neglect/possible violence from his parents given his mother's words and the fact they sold him. We get to know that he was beaten when living in the House of Hope, but not what other possible horrors he could have experienced there (not including just the trauma of witnessing the other debtors and Hope), what age he was, or for how long (if anyone knows more timeline wise I'd love to know) he lived there before he escaped. We don't know how he escaped either, if he had help or did so on his own.

I'm no child psychologist, but abuse has lasting effects as we can see through all of the main party. Victims of abuse tend to have difficulty moving past certain emotional stages in their life. Aka a person abused in their childhood may have issues maturing emotionally without therapy, etc (again I'm not a psychologist). There is a strong possibility that "Child" Enver is still probably holding the reins emotionally while adult Enver isn't even aware of how his past affects every action and reaction he has at all times.

I can't imagine how living with Raphael during ones formative years being healthy in anyway, but we can definitely see some of the learned behaviours he's picked up from the Cambion. A focus on possing/presentation, a suave persona, torturing/using people for his own gain, a general lack of empathy, deal making, similar attire with devil motifs...

Unhealthy coping mechanisms:

Speaking of attire, Enver's coat not allowing Fear to be cast on him speaks volumes to me. Imagine the absolute horror of moving from one situation of abuse to another much worse one in the hells as a child/teen and probably being in a state of fear/anxiety at all times. Enver wearing a coat that doesn't allow him to feel fear gives me three main thoughts:

1. He is doing everything in his power to avoid that specific emotion and therefore prevents himself from thinking about that period of his life. Meaning he is not confronting his trauma the same way the main party is forced to throughout the game.

2. Narratively does the coat prevent him from feeling any fear at all? Or do we just go with the game mechanic that ensures he cannot be made afraid by the fear spell? If it prevents him from feeling fear at all (which I think is narratively more interesting and you can take this headcanon out of my cold dead hands) how does this effect his every day decisions? Fear prevents risky decisions all the time, it's one of the emotions that actively keeps people alive. Psychopaths usually don't experience fear the same way an average person would. Given his many horrific actions (the Iron Throne being a key example) I wonder how much his forceful removal of fear has done to his perception of rational thought. If you aren't afraid of consequences what's to stop you from doing anything at all? Selling a loyal body guard to the hells, torturing an entire faction of people in order to manufacturer your own personal army, stealing from an immensely powerful devil aka mother fucking MEPHISTOPHELES??? He presents himself as calm and collected in conversation. He appears as if he's the most rational of all three villains when he's really just as awful when we look into what he's actually been up to vs seeing Orin and Ketheric kill people on screen.

3. Where did he get the coat? Did he make it himself or was it a boon from Bane? A promise to a devout worshiper that he would never be made to feel afraid or beneath anyone again?

Another abuser - Bane:

Speaking of Bane... Another user (please tag if anyone can find the original post!) mentioned a line Astarion says where he states that he prayed to all the gods, but none answered. OP wondered if Enver, trapped in the hells and desperate for salvation, called out the same way... only for Bane to be the only god to answer. I'd die to know specifically when he was introduced to Bane and made to be his chosen.

We know Bane is considered an evil god and we even find that if we kill Enver and then use speak with dead that Bane is torturing him in the afterlife for failing him.

Given this abusive relationship is Enver a foil for Gale, a man groomed from a young age by a goddess and left with the consequences when his actions did not meet her expectations?

Is he like Shadowheart, someone who was given no alternative and made to believe they willingly chose their god only to learn they were deceived and never had any other options?

Like Wyll he's cast out by his father (or in his case both parents).

Like Lae'zel he's worshipping a deity with false promises, how can he believe he'll rule the entire world like a god himself when Bane the god of TYRANNY would see no other at the top but himself (Was he secretly planning to use the crown like Gale to usurp Bane or just pandering to us)?

We know he and Karlach are absolutely foils for each other given that he is her abuser and like himself Karlach was forged by her times in the hells only to survive on her own merits.

Those are my thoughts! Would love to know anyone else's on the walking red flag that is Lord Enver Gortash.

If Enver lost his memories like the Dark Urge would he be given a chance to redeem himself through his actions? Could he with his knowledge of infernal engines fix Karlach's heart

Would Enver have ever become Lord Gortash if not for Bane...?

Anyways if anyone wants to yell at me about Enver, Orin, or Ketheric please feel free to do so! I love characters who fell through the cracks because they had no one there to help them only to crawl out themselves and burn the world.

[myheartismadeofstars]

Imagine if the Dark Urge had children.

In my head Durge (default) has two eggs that were being tended to in secret, to prevent people from destroying them. Bhaal should be pleased that his favourite child is going to be a father, right?

Then Orin got to him.

He forgot everything, including his unborn babies.

He changed too. Choosing to reject his father and resist the Urge.

Scelaritas Fel brings them up randomly when they reunite (because you KNOW he is ecstatic about Durge bringing little murder babies into the world. Since they are almost certainly Bhaalspawn, even if second generation) and that's how Durge finds out he's a father.

Scelaritas tells him he can destroy them if Master wants (Master does NOT want! He wants them safe, he just wants to know where they ARE!)

Anyway here's how fans who want to keep Scelaritas on a redeemed Durge path can still win: Durge tells Scelaritas that he'd need his assistance with his future Bhaalspawn children so he might as well stay with him.