#also also in our defense she's kinda hated

[kavennnn]

this is how naomi fans (me and the 1 [one] person in my askbox) can still win

[happy10thousandyears]

I keep getting afraid of being a predatory lesbian or being disrespectful towards trans women when I'm drawing my ocs because they have a messy dynamic ... but I do enjoy toxic GL dynamics because I like to project my own traits and traits I may despise or admire onto both persons involved...

[shigussy]

love interpreting my dreams using dreammoods.com

just used it to translate a dream i had when i was 16(its saved in my notes app) and according to the site, i was lacking in dr pepper and KISS(the band), that my grandpa cares for me, and that im overly defensive. this was the note.

[hoodreader]

Why does Chappell Roan get so much hate?

most of the hate she gets can be summarized with one word: misogyny. people hate when women are sure of themselves. but i’ll just be observing the ways this may present through her natal chart.

𓊆ྀི❤︎𓊇ྀི Tenth House in Cancer

this is going to be the house of notoriety/fame, because it’s the most public house in the chart, thus it represents our place in the public eye. it rules our relationship to the public as well.

in cancer, the native’s is known particularly for lunar themes (and contextualized to their own moon placement, as moon will be the lord of this house). chappell’s relationship to the public is one that is nurturing, empathetic… in some ways, a guardian. she may be known for her emotions (which she is) or intimate life (which she is, in a way). in my opinion, the tenth house also shows how we are publicly commodified. & i notice people try to commodify her emotions quite a bit.

her tenth house lord (moon) is in sagittarius and conjunct sagittarius pluto, in her third house - the house of communication and thought. and her moon is rejoiced in the third. thus, she will be known for her opinions.

let it be known… this is a very intelligent and well-spoken woman. like i really don’t give a fuck what nobody say, all of the clips i see of her speaking shows that she’s very thoughtful and intentional in how she speaks. and that is all the jupiter, pluto, & moon influence in this house. jupiter = wisdom, truth, justice. pluto = depth, taboo, complexity. moon = conviction, the mind, & the shadows.

however, because her tenth house lord is in the third conjunct pluto, her vocality is going to attract a polarizing response. this is usually because it almost ‘triggers’ the general public, especially triggering a deeply emotional response (10h in cancer, lord conj pluto). people kinda want to disagree just for the sake of without even genuinely engaging with her thought. sag pluto gen is a generation that’s already highly political (imo) but because that malefic informs her tenth house lord, she will almost be reprimanded for it.

it also causes an issue of parasociality. when u have ur tenth house in cancer, this causes people to already think they know u more than they do. however, the lord being conj pluto can show obsession, aggression, or possessiveness toward her from the public. like ‘helicoptering’ her. in the third house, it can show they wish to have dominion over her thought. but she is natively a very emotional speaker with a lot of convinction (3h sag moon). moon is a defensive planet so she’s going to always defend her standpoint / feelings, & this angers them more.

a woman with a tenth in cancer is going to have submissiveness projected onto them. people expect them to just lay down and take it. they expect conventional femininity & womanhood, but chappell’s femininity & womanhood as an openly lesbian woman deviates from the convention. her vocality deviates from the convention. etc. so the fact that her moon is in a self-assured & righteous sign and her moon wants to defend itself frustrates the people who hate her.

𓊆ྀི❤︎𓊇ྀི Fourth House Venus in Capricorn Opposite Tenth/MC in Cancer

as venus represents grace and charm or likability, her venus in capricorn and in the fourth doesn’t necessarily mean she is dislikable, and it doesn’t mean she doesn’t have those venutian qualities. but it means u have to know her or understand her more intimately for them to show. it’s saved for her intimate life.

in fact, venus is one of the quieter planets in her chart. in a sign of saturn, it shows reservedness. in the fourth house - the house of invisibility - it shows this romantic, feminine, graceful side of her isn’t as acknowledged. despite that literally being her chart ruler, since she’s a libra rising.

but again… her tenth house in cancer opposes her venus in capricorn. saturn already causes an effect where people interpret it as a lack of, so people think she outright lacks these qualities because they don’t perceive them.

her public image is at odds with her venutian expression to the public. which pisses them off because like i said before, that tenth house in cancer/first house in libra causes people to want to project submission onto her. but she’s not a submissive person.

the nature of libra/venus and capricorn/saturn is structure and balance. there’s a reason why saturn exalts in a venutian sign. she’s someone who deeply values peace, contrary to popular belief. her worldview/mindset/soul (first house) is literally in the sign of fairness & balance (libra). her chart ruler is in the sign of structure (capricorn).

but… the thing is that because her chart ruler is in a saturnian sign, she’s willing to more stubbornly assert herself. she’s comfortable making others uncomfortable for the overall goal or objective. and people hateee a woman with boundaries.

𓊆ྀི❤︎𓊇ྀི 1H/Ascendant in Libra Opposite Aries Saturn, 4H Venus in Capricorn (Chart Ruler) Square Aries Saturn (Venus Dispositor)

those with saturn harsh-aspecting the ascendant may struggle to be understood, accepted, or given grace by others. saturn rules isolation, so a lot of times, those with saturnian influence in the chart are isolated & unwelcomed.

this effect is also felt with the chart ruler is harsh-aspecting saturn, which it is in this case. and saturn is also the dispositor of venus. again, venus = grace/charm.

𓊆ྀི❤︎𓊇ྀི Misogyny

i did have a long ass drafted post about the astrology of misogyny, and maybe i’ll post it later. but for now, i can briefly speak on natal placements i think indicate a woman will experience a disproportionate amount of misogyny, relative to women with similar behaviors.

1H Libra Lilith - reference the myth of lilith

Moon conj Pluto/Venus square Saturn - the planets associated with womanhood are aspecting the malefics

Pisces Sun, Aqua Mercury, & Pisces Jupiter Conjunction - people hate women with big/strong personalities or women who are intelligent or provoke ur thoughts

Jovial Women (Sag Moon, Pisces Sun/Jupiter) - as i said above

𓊆ྀི❤︎𓊇ྀི Upcoming Solar Eclipse in Libra

the eclipse is on her ascendant (the house of health & the mindset) & opposing saturn (deterioration, exhaustion) so i’m not shocked she’s experiencing a menth health decline as a result of the dogpiling. the reaction she got for a very tame take about both kamala & donald being pieces of shit was ridiculous considering they’re both endorsing multiple genocides. i advise she stay private during this time anyways.

all the hate she getting lowkey making me wanna tap in, so y’all gon fuck around and make a fan out of me. but yeah.

hope this was interesting.

[gallavichsreddie1128]

Monster Part 3

Description: Part Three of the monster series

Here is the other parts: Monster Part Two

Word Count: 2,252k

Author’s note: I will not be updating this until season 5

Y/n sat on the side of the camera as John looked so depressed and annoyed to be on FireCracker’s show. Y/N hated that he was but knew that he kinda had too. Victoria was also there and that was the exciting thing. But by the look on John’s face, he didn’t care. Of course FireCracker would praise John. That made both Y/N and John roll their eyes but John had to hide it better. He put on the fake smile that he learned to do.

Y/N zoned out during the whole thing until Homelander said something. “Ally Victoria, really?” Homelander laughed. Y/N sat up in her seat now listening. “We’re all here to tell the truth so.. Tell the truth.” Victoria looked a little scared and cleared her throat “The truth is…” But Y/N was more interested in what John’s response would be. “I’ll do it.” He says. Y/N’s heart was pounding but for once she enjoyed the show. “Victoria here is a super hero.” “Thanks for the compliment.” She said but that wasn’t what he meant. “It’s all true.” FireCracker said and this is where Y/N would zone out but this was interesting.

Y/N covered her mouth as it was exposed that Victoria was a supe. Homelander got up and walked away as Victoria tried to get his attention. Y/N sat in shock but John pulled her up to follow him. “I worked my whole life to keep that secret.” She told him. “Well secrets rot your soul.” He said and Y/N wanted to laugh. But she could tell this was very serious. “Baby, can you gave us a second?” He asked her and though she wanted to hear she agreed and walked away so he couldn’t see her as she listened to them.

“Your girlfriend is working with Butcher. You don’t think she’ll tell them?” “Why do you think I sent her away?” He growled at her. He really didn’t trust her? Her heart hurt at that but she didn’t walk away until they were done talking. She ran away before he could find her and called MM.

She sat on the table watching Frenchie work on the virus. She knew that eventually she’d have to pick a side but she felt safe with both and she would always side with boys no matter how much she loved John. “If I had another choice I’d take it.” MM said to Hughie over the phone. Frenchie flipped him off making Y/N laugh. He smiled at her, “So how are you and the bad Supe?” He asked. Y/N wished that he didn’t ask that. She was trying to keep them separate.

“Frenchie, you don’t have to act like you want to know about that.” She tells him. “I know but I also know where your heart truly lies.” He said. Did she even know? Y/N felt her phone vibrating so she looked down and saw that John was calling. She answered, “Where are you?” He asked not even saying Hi. “I am relaxing, why?” She said which wasn’t entirely a lie. “I need you home.” He said and she sighed. “I will be later.” “You’re with him aren’t you?” He asked but it sounded almost like a growl. “No. I have no idea where Billy is.” That was the truth. He sighed through the phone. “Whatever you’re doing, come home after.” He says and hangs up.

“Frenchie you stay here. Kumiko and Y/N you’re with me.” She wasn’t paying attention until her name so she looked up at MM. “Me?” She asked and he nodded. She got up and followed him out the door. “What’s the plan?” She asked as the walked. “We fucked up our offensive. All we got is defense.” He tells her. “About Victoria?” She asked. “And the virus.” Hearing about it made her sick. Annie wasn’t herself and that Y/N could tell but she hadn’t been around much anymore.

“For all we know the shifter could be here.” Y/N looked around at everyone for a sign of a flaw but truth be told a shifter could act just like the person. “Does he know you’re down here?” MM asked her. “Hopefully not.” She said. “He doesn’t have tracking on you?” She shrugged, “He trusts me enough. Not enough to share information though.” She said. “Annie is the shifter.” Hughie said.

Y/N and MM looked at him. “Look forward. Like we aren’t talking.” He said and they did. “How do you know?” Y/N asked him. Annie came up to them and showed off the ring that Hughie gave her. Y/N’s jaw dropped but for a different reason than that. He proposed to the fake Annie? MM was trying so hard not to crack but Y/N couldn’t hide her shock. One second she is staring at the ring and the next she is unconscious on the ground.

When she woke she looked around and noticed that she was in Homelander’s bed. She sat up way too quick, “Too fast. You need to relax.” He said and sat on the bed. She looked at him in horror and confusion. Did he know where the president was hiding? How did he get her? “You weren’t answering your phone so I went to your house.” He brought her from there? “Why’d you remove me from my bed?” She asked. “I want you to move in with me.” He states, ignoring her question.

The shockness she felt got more intense after that. “Oh.” She said and looked away from him. “What do you mean “oh”?” He was kind of offended. She sighed, “I overheard you tell Victoria that you sent me away from that conversation because I’m working with Billy.” She says. “Oh.” He said. “I try to keep our relationship separate from work.” She says. “Yeah but you can’t.” He said. “What does that mean?” She asked. “You can’t because Butcher and I are mortal enemies and you’ll have to pick a side.” He said and he wasn’t wrong. But Y/N didn’t know what side. “Look I know this isn’t easy for you but unless you plan on giving me information on what they are planning, then you have no need to be with them.” He said.

But she doesn’t support him in his actions. She couldn’t say that out loud. “What are you going to do if I choose them?” She asked. “I will have to kill them all and maybe you.” He did not just say to her. She stood up, “John, are you fucking serious right now?” “You brought it up.” He was acting like it was no big deal. “I’m well aware that I will have to choose a side but it’s not now.” She said. “Billy wants me dead. I want Billy dead. There is no soon.” Billy wasn’t even talking to her right now. “Billy hates me now so I have no idea what he is doing.” She said.

“There ya go then. You don’t even have to choose.” She wanted to roll her eyes. “The others? Those are my friends.” “They wanna take me down also so that’s still his side.” “We wouldn’t even be having this conversation if you didn’t say that to Victoria.” “How do I know you won’t go back and say all the things you know to them?” He asked. “I’m not. Like I said before, I am keeping us separate from them.” “You can’t!” He stood up. Y/N rolled her eyes, “I have been!” He laughed. “You don’t think that you are uneasy around you and keep things from you because of that?” He asked.

“They think I’m using you.” She yelled. His eyes widened at that. “They wanna kill me Y/N. They are going to try every little thing they can too.” She knew that he was right but she didn’t wanna choose a side. She doesn’t want it to come down to that. “They have a right to John.” She whispered. “What did you say?” He growled. She looked at him with tears in her eyes, “They do have a right to kill you John. Not that I want that to happen but you have done terrible things John. And if you don’t see that then you need to open your eyes.” He looked down at her words.

She got up from her spot and went over to him. She wrapped her arms around him, “But I love you John. And if I can prevent them from killing you I will.” She whispered. He looked at her. His expression was unreadable, making her heart beat. “If you love me. You’ll leave them and be with me.” He tells her. “Okay.” She whispered. “Okay.” She leaned up and kissed him. She wasn’t sure what she was doing but she hoped everything worked out in the end. John wasn’t around, thankfully. So when her phone started ringing she was quick to answer it.

“Hughie” the phone said, so she answered. “Hey, can you meet up with us?” She knew that she should have said No but she didn’t want to. “Yeah.” She said and got ready. John was at the Vought tower and wasn’t due back for a while so she wasn’t rushing for that reason. She was rushing because she wasn’t sure what Hughie was calling her about. She looked in the mirror and sighed. John can’t know about this.

Seeing Victoria and her daughter was the last thing she expected as she walked in the room. Everyone gave her a look of hesitation on the situation besides Hughie. “What’s going on?” She asked Frenchie. “Victoria wants to get away from Homelander and she’s afraid her daughter’s life is at stake.” He said and Y/N nodded. Well she shouldn’t know that. Nor should she be here. Y/N sighed but her heart started pounding at the sound of “oi” from none other than Billy Butcher.

The guy who hates her guts. She hadn’t even thought about him not being there. She looked over at him and he looked good. He was no longer sick it seemed. He looked around and noticed her. The smirk almost dropped from his face. She stared at him, wondering what his next move was going to be. It was like the room went silent and the ringing in her ears started as Billy had tentacles and got a hold of Victoria. Everyone but her tried to stop him but it was no use. Even her daughter who Billy threw back.

Y/N watched in horror as he broke Victoria like a kitkat. Hughie and her had the same expression and she looked at Billy as he took the virus. “I should kill you too.” He said to her as he went to leave. “Oh by the way, you’re fucking welcome!” He said before leaving. Y/N looked at the rest of them in horror. His words didn’t affect her as much as she thought they would. He was a monster just like Homelander. Maybe he’s secretly been like that all along.

John was in his room at Vought Tower where Y/N finally found him. He looked happy. “I uh went back with the boys to get my things.” She said which wasn’t a lie. He turned to her, “So you’ve made your decision?” He asked and she nodded. “Yes.” She placed the box of her things down and went to sit right next to him. “Victoria is dead.” He told her and even though she was there the look of shock on her face saved her from telling him what she knew. “The President did it.” He said and she looked confused. “He confessed to it but you know I think? I think there’s more than just that.” He said and he wasn’t wrong. “More than what?” She asked. He chuckled, “She was killed by someone that wasn’t him.” He said and she was hoping that he wouldn’t start name dropping.

“You exposed her to the world. Did you not think of what would happen?” She asked. “It was all part of the plan.” He said. Before she could question it he pulled out a small velvet box. She covered her mouth as he turned towards her. “You were never part of my plan but that doesn’t have to be a bad thing.” He said as he lifted open the box to show a diamond ring. “Will you marry me?” He asked and she nodded without thinking.

He laughed a happy one for once and she hugged him. The tears that were streaming down her face weren’t just from this but from everything. She pulled away from the hug and kissed him before putting on the ring. “It’s beautiful.” She said and stared at it. “Beautiful things for a beautiful girl.” He said and she looked up at him. “I love you a lot John. Thank you!” She said and he nodded. “I love you more.” He said and picked her up. “Now I can fuck my fiance.” He said and she giggled. He carried her to the bedroom and dropped her on it.

Y/N woke up and saw that John was asleep next to her. She looked at his naked body and smiled at the memories of the previous night. She grabbed her phone to check the time but saw a message from Billy. Was he threatening her? She opened her phone to see the message and covered her mouth.

Is it a bad time to tell the woman that’s fucking my enemy that I’m in love with her?

[starbeltconstellation]

I don’t think they are bad and some survived order 66 Quinlan Vos was one of them. But I do believe they lost their way by the end of the clone wars because most lost their way or watered down their beliefs becoming to caught up in image and pandering to the senate (palps *cough*) even yoda said basically that a dark shroud surround them (Sith made) but they made themselves susceptible to it with arrogance, becoming inflexible, and a strange combo of attachment and detachment. Even mace windu was attached to the republic which is one of the reasons he was so defensive and disliked Anakin he saw him as a threat to his republic.

I’m not trying to hate on the Jedi just make sure that in discussing the Jedi we remember the good and bad. The Jedi did a lot of good, they made one of the longest major peace times the galaxy had ever seen, that’s 1000 years of peace time after ending the Sith war. And actually Luke skywalker, Ezra Bridger, Ahsoka (rebellion), and season 4 Kanan were prime examples of what the Jedi were originally. I just think when palpatine started pulling strings and corrupting everything to take power it made slow brewing Jedi problems 10x worse as some Jedi like Barriss Offee’s master mixed up avoiding negative attachment with being cold and callous because while a Jedi master should avoid “possessive” attachment especially in a way that would hold their student back they should have a good bond with them because emotional bonds are one of the pillars of trust.

-that’s my take, I’m not sure what you meant by no Jedi haters though. So if this crosses your line then I’m sorry I can see myself out cause I don’t want to start a conflict 😅

Hello, anon. 👋

Firstly, I just want to DEEPLY apologize for the long wait in my response. 😅🤦‍♀️ I try not to get behind on asks, but life has been crazy for me at the moment, and especially with longer asks like yours, I really want to take my time and give a good and in depth response.

Now, just right off the bat: I don’t mind discussing things. As long as it doesn’t get nasty and full of insults. So I’m not about to bite your head off.

In fact, I am going to take the time to use your ask to refute all of these critical/anti Jedi points, proving how most of it is Palpatine’s propaganda that the galactic citizens/SW fandom has grown to believe because it’s easier to have a big bad scapegoat (ie; the Jedi boogie man) than for galactic citizens to grapple with the fact that they themselves are also a part of the problem because THEY are the ones who vote in politicians in the Senate (who are a lot corrupt, except like a handful like Mon Mothma/Bail Organa/Riyo Chuchi/Padmé/etc. And even Padmé wasn’t a complete saint like a lot of fans think, since she purposely hid Anakin’s Tusken massacre just because she didn’t want to give up her new hot murder husband who was obsessively adoring over her/loved her), and THEY are the ones who also got the most complacent, are they not? After all… if the fandom blames the JEDI… why didn’t the CITIZENS clock anything wrong until suddenly an Empire was telling them to hand over all their freedoms or die?

It’s really easy to sit back and say what you would’ve done in the Jedi’s position, because the audience has more information than they do. What Dooku and Qui-Gon told them is the equivalent of being told they saw a unicorn (Sith) in the wild. It’s not that out there that there’d be some doubts from the Council, and people seem to forget that the Council STILL said they’d look into it. But they aren’t magic. They can’t just snap their fingers and see that Palpatine is the Sith Lord. Especially with the Darkness cloaking their Force senses. I think it’s kinda… gross? To blame them for something Palpatine was causing (the cloaking Darkness) that was literally part of the plan to genocide them. Just a thought, but maybe that should be Palpatine’s and Anakin’s fault, where it belongs? Lol. Sorry if I sound a little snippy, it’s just this is a tired and running around in circles argument (although I do think your ask is a genuine one, which is why I’m taking the time to answer it and perhaps if not change YOUR mind, then change someone else’s that might read this. I’m trying to reach more across the aisle here, because both sides I’ll admit have moments where they only want to be defensive and not explain their positions).

It’s funny how people always point out that the Jedi missed brewing corruption (they totally knew about it and tried to fight against it how they could. But just like in real life, I’m unsure what people expect from them. To strut into the Senate and threaten/murder the politicians into submission? Because ya know… that was kinda the red flag Anakin gave off with that “They should be made to!” line to Padmé. Just saying. 🤷‍♀️ Just like anyone, Jedi know the politicians of the Republic are slowly being corrupt (just like MOST politicians in real life, and you don't see everyone condemning all US citizens because we don't go clean them out like assassins or something), but there isn't anything they can do about that unless you expect them to go in and wave their lightsabers around to threaten the politicians into submission. As if Palpatine wouldn't immediately twist that into his favor to say they were "trying to take over the Republic". (And oh wait—he did that in the movies! Funny how that works, huh?)

What I think is interesting about you and about a lot of Jedi fans (including LH, who is the writer of The Acolyte) is that you THINK you’re being “fair” to the Jedi, but you’re kinda… not? 🤷‍♀️😅 And I’m not saying that as an insult. I’m saying it because it’s true.

Let me explain: There are rabid anti Jedi fans known as the infamous Karen Travis’s who is basically a rapid and foaming at the mouth Jedi anti who believes they “got what was coming to them.🤢🥶” LH on the other hand (at least in HER head), views herself as Jedi CRITICAL (which is something you clearly view yourself as as well. And there’s nothing wrong with being Jedi critical. The problem is that a lot of times this “criticism” becomes condescending, whether intentional or not, despite maybe the person’s best intentions). And while there is a little bit of a difference there, it’s not as stark a line as fans would try to convince us pro Jedi’s to believe.

As I mentioned to someone else in my other ask: there are plenty of fair criticisms about the Jedi that I can acknowledge: the Shimi thing, for one, which is I think just a bad symptom of GL’s writing being more “metaphorical” than literal. Shimi HAS to stay on Tatooine because Anakin eventually HAS to murder the Tuskens in cold blood so GL can tell the story he wants to tell of how Anakin can’t let go, and so the Jedi are never given the opportunity to do what I truly BELIEVE they would’ve done, which is go back and free her, at least for the peace of mind of one of their newest initiate. The plot literally physically bars them from doing so.

And even THIS is not without its flaws, because they would ONLY have wiggle room to free Shimi after the heat of TPM problems had died down where they had time to do so… while walking past/avoiding eye contact with all of Shimi’s slave neighbors, because as specified before—The Jedi have no jurisdiction in the Outer Rim, and you bet your ass if they freed all those slaves and started a war with the Hutts with their little 10,000 strong army, the Republic would take one look and go “Lol, good luck with that,” and not help them at all, which would be basically suicide for the Order to try and accomplish on abolishment of slavery on the Outer Rim all on their own in the TRILLIONS of people in the galaxy. They do not have the MAN POWER for that. Not without the Senate army/clones. So how can they be blamed for this? WHY are one of the “space minorities” of the galaxy being blamed for something that should be the POLITICIANS’S job? Can you not see the double standard here? Genuinely asking, anon, because it’s always baffled me.

People want the Jedi to do something about it? Get on the Senate’s ass about it then—the REAL people who are responsible for all of the shit going wrong in the Outer Rim while they line their pockets and kiss up to clueless galactic citizens for votes come election time. THEY are the ones that should be responsible for the problems of an ENTIRE galaxy—not a small little minority group (which I’ve already come to realize that the Jedi are. They are a culture/religion/family, and 10,000 is but a drop in the ocean of the galaxy. They are so small in the grand scheme of things that it’s SCARY when considering how easy it was for Palpatine to lead them to almost total annihilation) that try and try and TRY as hard as they can, which is apparently somehow NEVER enough, for the galactic citizens AND the SW fandom itself.

And why is that? Why is it so HARD for SW fandom to relate to them? Why does LH (who I’m sure in her head BELIEVES she’s as progressive as they come, just as I genuinely believe you had the best intentions when reaching across the aisle to send me this ask, but at the end of the day still comes across frankly exhausting and a little condescending when you pick out the “good Jedi blorbos” who are ones that deserve to live and don’t have to be dehumanized as “emotionless/cold/callous” like you just did with Luminara just because Luminara chose to grieve in a way you and Anakin and many other rabid Anakin fans/anti Jedi’s view as lesser than) view the Jedi as some type of “space cops” who are “oppressing 🙄” the Sith as a representation of her religious trauma that she is clearly projecting onto them as something completely separate than what the Jedi Culture actually is? Why does she view them as “emotionally repressed” and “almost catholic-like”, and views the fucking SITH (literal SPACE NAZIS 😭🤦‍♀️) as a representation for her persecution as a gay woman?

It’s because—just like MOST SW fans in the US—she cannot fathom a culture outside of the lens of western philosophy. In her mind, the Jedi aren’t a “real 🙄🤢” family. In HER mind, the Jedi aren’t necessarily evil, but she still believes those “poor little culty Jedi 😔💔🙄” didn’t see they were ‘sewing their own destruction’. (Which is blaming them. It’s BLAMING the victims of genocide, and it’s to this day the most disgusting thing I will always remember about the show’s “your actions will cause the destruction of every Jedi in the galaxy” quote that made Twitter go wild with genocide apologia galore).

I’m not gonna repeat everything in the post I made to the other anon (this ask response is long enough already), but I’ll link it here in case you want to read it, because I do have some examples screenshotted of certain SW fandom dehumanizing the Jedi and showing genocide apologia, which proves that pro Jedi’s critique/defensiveness for the Jedi Order and their culture isn’t an overreaction or without basis, because it proves that blaming the Jedi for their own genocide is the NORM, even if people won’t admit so outright (still can’t believe The Acolyte just outright SAID it. I’m not gonna rub fans’s of the show’s faces in it, but because of that line alone, I’m SO glad that show was cancelled. Anti Jedi propaganda is already bad enough).

Also, I’m sorry to tell you this, anon, but the Mace Windu thing is just straight up wrong. I have never understood this Mace thing with the fandom. People act like Mace was personally bullying Anakin every damn day. Mace didn’t even hate Anakin. Just because Mace was a little stern with Anakin and didn't worship the ground he walked on didn't mean he hated/disliked him/was jealous of him (a frankly childish notion, in my opinion). They both just had different views over how to be a Jedi and in battle strategies during the war. It was never personal with Mace. Anakin MADE it personal, because he always took not being told "yes" personally, like it was a slight against him. He didn’t see Anakin as a threat to the Republic until literally the last free day of democracy when he looked at him and saw a giant shatterpoint all around Anakin. I think that would give any Jedi pause. Lol.

Mace was a fine Jedi who treated Anakin just fine. Just because he didn’t worship the ground Anakin walked on or treated him like God’s gift doesn’t mean that Mace was a bad person or Anakin was a “poor little guy” getting bullied by him. The thing with Mace refusing Anakin a seat on the Council is overblown. Frankly: Anakin didn’t DESERVE a seat on the Council. He might’ve been a powerful Jedi, but he was still hot headed and reckless and still had a lot to learn. And his temper tantrum when he didn’t get his way did him no favors either (look, I LOVE Anakin, but I’m not gonna be delusional about his faults, okay? Most of his problems were caused because he built them up out of thin air. He built up this rivalry with Mace in his head, when Mace was busy with his own life. Mace was not “out to get Anakin” or something. That’s—as kindly as I can say—something children tell themselves when angry at parents who tell them “no”, which Mace did a lot with Anakin). And I’m not gonna lie, anon. People have always seemed extra hard on Mace specifically, and while it might not be all of it, I think there’s a part of racism mixed in there with a proud black Jedi that isn’t afraid to stand up to the white and emo and hot future serial killer in the making (my hot Anakin! 🥰🥰😂). I’m not saying YOU specifically are being racist, but I’m just pointing out something that I’ve always felt reeked around the fandom opinion of Mace (more from the SW YouTube dudebro side of the fandom, but still).

I’m not gonna go and explain a play by play of all my points, because I got in a argument/discussion with someone on YouTube the other day (even though I know it’s bad for my blood pressure 😬😤😂), and I feel like the points I made there are perfect as a main response for this ask, so I’m going to place the screenshots here. This whole online debate came about when I was watching a SW lore video on Leia visiting Anakin’s grave after the ROTJ celebration and telling him she doesn’t forgive him, and one of the commentators called her a “brat”, which pissed me off. Lol. But anyway, we’ve been going back and forth the past few days, and I’ve basically made a mini pro Jedi manifesto, so I think all of the screenshots will answer most of your questions and also refute them to show how they are inaccurate and more of a fandom opinion that’s only come about because fans like Anakin and want to twist themselves into knots to blame everyone for his problems but him.

Here are all of the online person’s screenshots: you’ll notice how eventually he tries to justify Anakin killing the younglings as a “mercy”. 🥶🥶🤢 Yikes.

-

Here are my responses:

Damn. Apparently there’s a screenshot limit. 😭 I’ll copy paste the rest:

Leia had every right to come and get closure if she needed to. Anakin personally tortured her himself after all. She has a personal stake in this through being tortured by their own FATHER that Luke doesn't have. Whether she wanted to go to make sure the person she viewed as a monster was dead, or to try and get some closure from what Luke had told her, it was within her rights to do so. She understood EVERYTHING perfectly. She knew who Anakin had been for years before the last five minutes of his death, and that was someone who'd terrorized the galaxy.

Lol, Anakin wasn't "fulfilling the will of The Force" as his reign on the Dark Side for 20 something years. He fulfilled the will of the Force when he finally got off his ass and killed Palpatine to end the last of the Sith. It's a copout to pretend any of his other actions were anything but his own choice, otherwise his 'redemption' means squat. She doesn't owe him anything just because he stopped the horror by killing Palpatine. It's the LEAST he could've done. You seem to believe that one action somehow should buy Anakin forgiveness in the eyes of all of his victims, and if they don't forgive him, then they're "brats" or something. Redemption doesn't work like that. You don't do the right thing because you'll get something out of it. You do it to be selfless and because it's simply the right thing to do. And I can tell you that Anakin would probably disagree with your opinion on Leia being a "brat" himself once he was back on the Light Side, because the whole point is that he'd be REPENTANT. Not being arrogant and expecting blind forgiveness for things that are quite frankly unforgivable.

Luke's forgiveness is a GIFT. It is NOT something that has to be the norm, and Leia is no less because she chooses not to forgive Anakin. She has every right to never view him as her father till her dying days.

Anakin had EVERYTHING to do with the explosion of Alderaan. This BS certain fans spout of "that was Tarkin" is nonsense. Anakin had agency. He could've tried to stop Tarkin or tried to leave the Empire way before that moment. Just because it was hard, he chose not to. EVERYONE on board the Death Star that weren't prisoners are responsible for the destruction of Alderaan. And yes, that includes Anakin. As I said before, Tarkin would only be given the highest sentence in court because he chose to order the planet destroyed. But Anakin would still be charged right along with him in a court of law. Just because Anakin had a traumatic life, doesn't excuse the things he's done. That's like saying a school shooter/serial killer has no agency over killing their victims just because they had a “hard life.” It’s a frankly illogical argument.

Anakin as 'Vader' could've choked Tarkin out right there. Who's gonna stop him? He's survived dozens of enemies in the comics. Him not having "authority" is a copout. Anakin was given plenty of authority in the Empire. He was just still Palpatine's lapdog at the end of the day. Hell—he could've grew a spine and left the Empire years BEFORE that moment. He does not get a free pass for "following orders".

Lol, Anakin does NOT have borderline personality disorder. That’s a fanon theory. That is NOT actually canon and George never said that. GL says Anakin fell because of his greed for power to never feel weak like he did as a child and because he was afraid to let go. The Jedi didn't fail him. He failed THEM. He's the one who fucking genocided them after all. Their entire culture is literally mental empathy because they're space wizards. There were times when Yoda and Obi-Wan all but BEG Anakin to open his mouth and say what's wrong, and he either refuses or is so vague that there's no way to glean what his main problem is (when Anakin talks to Yoda about Padmé and won't just ADMIT it's about Padmé). People can't help you if you don't meet them halfway. Anakin refused to do that. That's on him. Not on any of his victims. And even if he DID have borderline personality disorder (which is just a fanon theory), he'd STILL be responsible for his actions. It's amazing how much fans blame everyone else under the sun than the man who choked his wife. Lol.

I don't think Anakin is emotionless or incapable of care or goodness. That's the whole point of Luke, after all. I simply deny not giving him the agency to make his own decisions. He WAS a monster. What else do you call killing little kids who beg for your help? But the point of Luke is that Anakin ALWAYS had the opportunity to turn from his actions and be better. He just didn't find the spine until ROTJ. And that's great! He turned back to the light and his soul found salvation. But he is NOT redeemed in the eyes of anyone but Luke. It's laughable to think otherwise or that he wouldn't have been executed if he'd survived. And it's illogical to blame his victims and call them "brats" just because they won't forgive someone who was once basically space Hitler.

Despite what you may think, I love Anakin's character and the tragedy of him. I love that he found salvation in the end. But I DESPISE treating him like a child who didn't know what he was doing. He knew. He was selfish for twenty years. LUKE is who taught him how to be selfless. Everything else is on him. You can't call him the greatest 'redemption' of all time and then blame everyone else for his actions.

Because then what is there to redeem?

Nothing.

You can't have both. Pick one. 🤷‍♀️

What does it matter that Anakin as 'Vader' knew that Palpatine wouldn't praise Tarkin for such a cruel and useless thing in destroying a planet just to look a little tough? That doesn't mean shit. Just because Tarkin eventually gets what was coming to him, doesn't mean that Anakin couldn't have sped up Tarkin's demise right there. Good actions don't work like that: "Oh, it didn't really matter that he didn't try to save Alderaan! Because in the end Tarkin gets his karma!" (Anakin gets his karma too, by the way. You could argue from his burns or the fact that the only way he can 'redeem' himself is through dying by killing Palpatine).

I'm not sure what argument your making on if Anakin could've "talked" Tarkin into another way to get Leia to talk to betray the Rebels. I'm arguing that if he—or YOU—expected Leia's "forgiveness", then it implies there should've been some level where he could've done something different. I'm arguing he could've left the Empire years earlier if he'd grown a spine, or he could've Force choked Tarkin out right there and got him and Leia out of there somehow. Who's gonna stop him? No lowly soldier on board the Death Star could stand in his way. Palpatine would be miles away at that point.

He could've done something different. Fans just argue he was "helpless" in the sense that they don't want Anakin to be selfless to give anything up. The excuse that he was "stuck" and "had nothing left" is BS. Deep down, Anakin knows if he found Obi-Wan and repented that Obi-Wan would take him back. There's a whole arc about it in a comic when he's trying to bleed a Kyber Krystal. He just doesn't do it because he's too depressed and selfish to admit he screwed up his own life. He pretended for 20 years everyone betrayed him, when really it was the other way around, and that was too horrific to contemplate, so he pretended he was another person, when clearly he's still the same guy, only horrifically injured under the mask. He can only admit the truth after Luke offers him blind forgiveness.

It doesn't really matter that psychologists have "diagnosed" Anakin. He isn't a real person. He's a character that was written with a narrative purpose by GL. And GL was clear when he says the reasons Anakin does what he does is because he's greedy for power to not feel weak again and also because he's too afraid to let go. The writer of the character knows better actually. Isn't that what SW fans always say with GL?

Jedi are literally space Buddhists that GL describes as "empathetic space monks." Part of their culture is literally to be connected to all life around them. It's laughable to say they wouldn't understand a "simple person" in the galaxy. That's literally what they're taught to do in the Temple. Before the war, they were Advisors/ mediators.

Anakin had a fondness for Qui-Gon, but he did trust Obi-Wan. Maybe not enough to mention Padmé (he didn't trust ANYONE with that except apparently Rex, and l'm almost certain Rex found out on accident, because Anakin definitely doesn't care about Rex as much as he did Ahsoka), but he DID trust him. And he cared for Obi-Wan greatly. Just not more than his own wants and needs apparently. But that's true when it comes to Anakin choosing himself over all of his friends and family at the end of ROTS. The Jedi would've helped Anakin if he'd just ASKED without being so damn vague. Maybe they wouldn't have let him stay in the Order, but it's not like he'd be kicked out the door immediately. But Anakin wanted his cake and to eat it too, so he didn't tell him about his wife because he wanted to keep the power of being a Jedi. And guess what? The Jedi don't OWE one man the power to change their entire culture just for him.

There isn't anything wrong with having a set of rules for beliefs. Priests can't marry either. That doesn't make them “emotionless robots” that are “incapable of understanding human emotion” or understanding a struggling man's thoughts. As I said before, the Jedi cannot help Anakin if he doesn't ASK. You cannot condemn them in one breath for not helping him, while at the same time saying that it's fine Anakin didn't explain his problems with them, because they should've just been able to read his mind. It's hypocritical.

Obi-Wan had no other options but to follow Padmé to find Anakin. He NEEDED to find Anakin, because Anakin was fucking dangerous at that point in time, and had just helped genocide an entire culture. Not exactly father/husband material at that point. And even then, in the movies Obi-Wan doesn't reveal himself until it's clear Anakin isn't going to listen to Padmé. It's ludicrous to think if Padme kept arguing with Anakin that Anakin still wouldn't have strangled her in anger in that moment. Again, it appears somehow you're trying to put off this transgression he's committed on someone else again, and I cannot fathom why. It makes him far less interesting that way if he was just a "poor guy" who couldn't control himself.

What I find interesting is you can admit that Anakin doesn't have the information the audience does, which is why he thinks Palpatine is kind and is his friend, but you show no grace towards the Jedi, calling them "arrogant" for not realizing the Sith had slowly popped back up, as if they are somehow supposed to have the audience's information. The truth is that they don't.

Just like anyone, they know the politicians of the Republic are slowly being corrupt (just like MOST politicians in real life, and you don't see everyone condemning all US citizens because we don't go clean them out like assassins or something), but there isn't anything they can do about that unless you expect them to go in and wave their lightsabers around to threaten the politicians into submission. As if Palpatine wouldn't immediately twist that into his favor to say they were "trying to take over the Republic". (And oh wait—he did that in the movies! 🤷‍♀️ Funny how that works, huh?)

It doesn't matter if Anakin didn't "want" to kill kids/the Tuskens/betray Mace and his Jedi friends. What does that matter? What does it matter if he felt bad while doing it if he still DOES it? You wouldn't say a school shooter wasn't responsible for their actions just because they were sobbing the whole time they went around slaughtering everyone in the school. Anakin's responsible for his own actions, and just because he might feel "bad" doesn't let him off the hook. Even when he was masquerading as 'Vader.' Who cares if he was miserable 24/7? l’ll tell you his victims sure didn't when he decapitated them with his lightsaber or snapped their spines.

I'm not arguing about the people that forgave Anakin. I'm arguing over condemning people as "brats" that don't. (I personally think it's a copout to have Leia forgive him after reading some diary, so l'm glad at the least apparently new canon has her taking her entire life to get there). My point is there is nothing that makes Anakin's victims any less if they choose not to forgive him, because forgiveness is a GIFT. It isn't something you're owed. It's funny fans keep pretending he's owed that while condemning all of the Jedi as "arrogant", because I can't think of anything more arrogant than a man who was formerly one of the worst monsters in the galaxy thinking he's "owed" forgiveness. And just as I mentioned before, the Anakin after he came back to the Light wouldn't even agree with such a notion. He may ASK. But he wouldn't call Leia a "brat" for it. It's ridiculous to think that after the horror he'd personally committed to her.

I don't really care what your thoughts are on "Darth Mouse" as that's not what this conversation is about. GL describes Palpatine as the Devil, which is why Anakin can be turned back to the Light and Palpatine can't. But there is NO DOUBT that Anakin as 'Darth Vader' is seen as 'space Hitler' throughout internet culture (the Empire/the Sith is LITERALLY based off of Nazis). If you'd take a moment to google it you would see it's already a huge staple of internet culture. That doesn't make him emotionless or without goodness (he saved Luke, after all), but it IS still true. I don't see what's so hard about acknowledging his atrocities. He was a cruel and horrible monster for most of his life, and it only makes Luke's actions all the more miraculous when he somehow gets through to Anakin and makes him consider a heel face turn in the final hour.

Lol, honestly I also think you're a pretty strange person calling one of Anakin's torture victims a "brat" just because she didn't forgive him like dear saintly Luke. There is no shame in being kind like Luke (it helped him win after all), but there is NOTHING that makes Leia a bad person for not forgiving Anakin. I think you don't seem to contemplate just how BAD that is. Her FATHER tortured her for apparently HOURS. We have no idea just what he said and did to her during this time. He could've taunted her, for all we know. And I know, I know, you might say "He didn't know she was his daughter! 🤪🤪 " But that's not the POINT. The point is how he was cruel, and only seemed care when he realized she was his flesh and blood. Anakin's lucky Leia didn't spit on his grave. Because she WASN'T consumed by her anger to the point it was unhealthy. She just didn't forgive him and never viewed him as her father as long as she lived (because BAIL ORGANA was her father in all but blood). And that is within her rights. As I keep stating, Anakin is not OWED anything. His actions at the end of ROTJ are the LEAST he can do. He should be GRATEFUL to the opportunity Luke gave him and how Obi-Wan and Yoda were saintly enough to forgive him and help him become a Force ghost, because he quite frankly didn't deserve it. But salvation isn't always about what people deserve. Just like forgiveness, it's a gift. Anakin received a gift from Luke and Obi-Wan—but he is NOT owed it from Leia. And she isn't a "brat" for not giving it to him. It is important to stick to one's beliefs and principles. Leia stuck by hers. That takes courage and strength. She loved Luke but never agreed with him about Anakin.

And I also never called Anakin as 'Vader' a maniac. I called him basically a monster. Because he WAS. He helped kill thousands of people for Palpatine on the regular and continued to help genocide Jedi over the years, while ALSO still killing more kids over the years a handful of times too, even if he usually tried to avoid it (the Kenobi Show when he purposely snapped a kid's neck in front of his mother and dragged him through the street like garbage). Ironically, the more you learn and read about Anakin's atrocities, the more Luke's reaction becomes downright insane (while still saintly/miraculous), because NOBODY else (especially in real life!) would think someone like that had a heart deep down with a sliver of care left. That's what makes it miraculous Luke got through to him.

Lol, you cannot seriously be arguing that the maintenance workers on board the Death Star were "poor little guys." I don't know if you're aware of this, but even though there were probably volunteers, on the other hand, usually half the time in the military soldiers are ASSIGNED certain things like "mopping the floors" or "latrine duty" personally—so those people STILL were probably Empire officers. And even if they weren't, they still chose to be on the abomination known as the Death Star. Their sentence may be the lightest, but unless they were put there against their will they too would ALSO be charged. And also—with your argument—you're calling Luke's actions at the end of the Original Trilogy as a genocidal act or something, when really it was a necessary act to take out a planet destroying death machine. It's amazing how certain fans can try to twist things around to try and blame the heroes for something that is the villain's fault.

Here we go again with the excuses of "if only Mace wasn't mean to poor little Anakin" then Anakin wouldn't have had to murder everyone. Lol, is Anakin incapable of cognitive thinking? Because I promise you that if I was Ahsoka and heard that Anakin's reasoning for trying to kill me at one point in Rebels and betraying all of his friends is because a few people were "mean to him" I would just be pissed off at the gall of him to not take responsibility for his own actions. Even if a few people WERE mean to Anakin, that still doesn't give him the right to go on a murderous rampage. All his actions are still on him. That's like saying a school shooter is justified in his actions just because he was bullied. You calling Anakin a "Trojan horse" as if he planned any of that and wasn't just riding by the seat of his pants doesn't really make sense. Anakin didn't plan anything, and if you're arguing that BS theory that Anakin "balanced" the Force by genociding the Light Side to have it be even with the Dark Side (not true anyway since there were still more Light Siders than Dark Siders), then I am sad to say that you are objectively wrong. 🤷‍♀️

There is no way that "genocide is good, actually!" is the main theme GL had for a children's Trilogy. Anakin completed the prophecy when he finally got off his ass to kill Palpatine. He could've done that in Palpatine's office, or years down the line—either way, the outcome to complete the prophecy is the same: the eradication of the Sith. No more. No less.

Quite frankly, I think it's pretty gross to blame a culture for their own genocide, so the galactic community isn't doing itself any favors at that point anyway (including the SW community. It's always been a baffling fandom opinion to me). And despite what you and other fans may believe—the Jedi shouldn't have to CHANGE their entire culture/way of life for the sake of one man (Anakin) OR the galaxy's inhabitants who don't even TRY to understand them anyway (funny how Jedi are blamed for not understanding citizens, but what citizens try to understand them?).

They are not obligated to change their culture just for the right not to be murdered by a genocidal man on a temper tantrum.

Yeah, it's not surprising there were some among the population who "rejoiced" the fall of the Order. The war affected people's livelihoods and lives, and people get REAL greedy real fast when their day to day lives are affected by something. So yeah, it's no wonder they listened to Palpatine's propaganda to make the Jedi their scapegoat. Still pretty gross and disgusting, of course, but I can see how it came to be that way. Pretty ironic how people seemed to eventually miss the Jedi when they were gone, huh? It's not so fun dealing with an enemy (The Empire) when no space monk is standing protectively in front of you with a laser sword.

You DO know it's canon there were only 10,000 Jedi (not counting younglings and retired Masters) in a galaxy of TRILLIONS, right? It's illogical to expect them to be able to single handedly end slavery throughout the galaxy (especially in the Outer Rim where the Senate won't help them), or to expect them to be able to solve every damn problem in the universe like poverty (the lower levels of Coruscant). They helped people when they could. I don't know how, but you've seemed to have forgotten (just like most fans) that the Jedi ALWAYS tried to help. Even to the very end of their lives. It only makes it more gross to blame them for their own genocide. Lol, Luke barely knew shit about them except what he managed to scrounge up that hadn't been purged by the Empire (and a lot of that is from Legends authors, who didn't particularly like the Jedi anyway, so of course they'd write it like that and not as GL's vision of them being the heroes). The clones were treated terribly, and the Jedi did everything they could to make their lives easier (unless you'd prefer they sit on their asses out of the war to leave the clones under the command of people like Tarkin who didn't give a shit about them?), and it's illogical to blame them for the clones's plight. The SENATE are the corrupt ones and it's THEIR job to fix poverty and slavery and give the clones their rights. THEY are the actual villains of the prequels (besides the Sith), which is exactly what GL wanted to present to show the moral decay of democracy. And yet somehow people missed that and thought he was saying—"No, actually, it's the genocide victims who are wrong, guys!" when that couldn't be farther from accurate.

Dear LORD, here we go again with the excuses for Anakin's actions. Anakin "couldn't trust" Obi-Wan because of something kinda snippy/mean that Obi-Wan said when he was a TEENAGER?(The “pathetic life form/he’s dangerous line”, which he said when he was jealous/also—again—a teenager). Wow, way to hold a grudge. Lol. Doesn't that go against your whole argument about "forgiveness?" Didn't Obi-Wan's following actions towards Anakin then on in treating him like a brother show NOTHING about his care for him? Come on now. Let's be serious.

Why the hell WOULDN'T Obi-Wan go after Anakin? As stated beforehand, Anakin was DANGEROUS at that point, and needed to be put down. Anakin went against his fate to destroy the Sith, which put the prophecy on hold for a bit, so yeah, there was a "plan", which is why he lived, but that doesn't mean he wasn't dangerous and still didn't deserve to die at that point in time. He'd just killed kids like animals hours earlier. Again: not exactly husband/father material anymore.

Again, I feel like the implication here is that you're hinting that everyone misinterpreted the prophecy and that Anakin's fate was to bring "balance" by becoming a genocidal monster and "evening the score", and I am sad to say that you are objectively wrong. 🤷‍♀️ It's not accurate to state GL's original intent to a children's trilogy is that genocide to "even the score" was the correct answer. As stated again: Anakin completed the prophecy when he destroyed the Sith (ie; him and Palpatine). Full stop.

Hmmmm, you're doing a whole lot of speculation on how Leia "might" react if she was put in Anakin's situation, but not actually taking into account how everyone makes their own decisions and people can react differently to things at the end of the day. This just feels like another way you're trying to excuse Anakin's actions and condemn Leia for her bitterness towards Anakin just because: "Oh, if only that brat went what he went through! 🤪 " And such an argument—in the nicest way I can think possible—feels like the platitudes children tell themselves when angry at their parents. ALL of your and rabid Anakin fans's arguments are, because it all boils down to: "It wasn't HIS Fault! It was THIS person's! Because they were MEAN to him and he got BULLIED! And all his friends didn't understand him (even when it's obvious they reached out plenty of times and tried)!" It's just a very tired and frankly going in circles argument. You keep bringing up all these external factors as if the Jedi didn't try at all to offer Anakin coping mechanisms (Yoda literally offered them, and his advice—whether you or others want to admit it or not—makes sense. In war, you sometimes have to be prepared you might lose someone, and with the vague knowledge Anakin gave him, I'm pretty sure Yoda thought Anakin was talking about Obi-Wan. If Yoda knew it was about Padmé, no shit he'd probably have different advice). Anakin's life was not horrible at the Temple. He had a horrible childhood and that would fuck anyone's head up and leave a scar, but once at the Temple he was offered a whole range of different options to receive help. The only difference here is that you just don't AGREE with the Jedi's beliefs in how they go about helping people control their emotions so they don't lash out at people.

Maybe a few people (kids) at the Temple said a few things to Anakin that could be bullying (and I've only seen ONE comic related to that), but it's ridiculous to assume that the entire Jedi Order hated him. It's illogical to think that, and it's just like the childish notion fans have that Mace (who you call a "motherfucker" for... again, what? Treating Anakin like everyone else and not God's gift?) hated or was jealous of Anakin just because he didn't tell him "yes" all the time.

The point is, Anakin's life was fine at the Temple. Maybe he got a little isolated and lonely, but it's not like people didn't reach out. Anakin just had trouble reaching back. And all of those excuses don't let him off the hook for his genocidal actions, which you still seem to be twisting yourself into knots to try and do. THAT is childish. Not Leia judging Anakin for who he was when she had the misfortune of being tortured by him. You're plain lying to yourself if you think you wouldn't react just like Leia in real life. Most people are not gonna be wondering to themselves why the "poor little serial killer" did what he did to their family.

Just as stated before, Anakin honestly didn't deserve shit at the end of his life.

He'd betrayed everyone he'd ever known and thrown them all away (Rex, Ahsoka, Obi-Wan, Padmé, the Jedi/501st, R2, etc) like complete garbage. He helped genocide the Jedi—the very Order that took him in from slavery—and then spent those next 20 years hunting them down like animals, while also in his free time killing whoever Palpatine pointed him to like a lapdog just because he was depressed and pissed he'd screwed up his own life. He'd murdered thousands of kids at that point (literally monstrous and unforgivable for most people. Certainly me. Which only makes Luke's forgiveness more meaningful) and there is a comic where he hunted down a Jedi just for the sheer purpose of ripping his youngling out of the man's arms so he could let Palpatine turn the baby into an Inquisitor.

I am sure there are compilations on YouTube of all the people Anakin killed and the people he'd tortured or made jokes at while he smirked over their bodies. Come back and watch those and then tell me again he "deserved" to find peace. Lol, Anakin didn't deserve shit.

And I know that me saying that will probably make you think I hate his character. I don't. Anakin's character is very dear to me and I'm GLAD he found peace at the end of his life. I'm just under no delusions that he was "redeemed" in any sense of the word that wasn't in Luke's eyes alone or that Anakin actually "deserved" peace, when it should be completely obvious he deserved to be condemned to the farthest pits of Hell. As I keep repeating again and again: Anakin's 'redemption' and forgiveness are GIFTS. It's not something he is owed or something he even deserves. It's something he's given from the people around him who are quite frankly better people than he ever was in his entire life. Luke taught him how to be selfless at the end of his life. Because of his trauma as a slave, Anakin never wanted to do that beforehand from the fear of being weak again, no matter how many tried to help. But Luke did, and he succeeded with getting through to Anakin and making him finally get off his ass to make the right choice.

Again, The Force may have a "plan" but that doesn't mean people don't have free will. Otherwise, they'd all just be mindless puppets walking around spouting nonsense. That's just another copout to try and excuse Anakin's genocidal actions and say it wasn't his fault because it was his "fate". It wasn't. His fate was to destroy the Sith (and NOTHING else, despite what you apparently believe about a BS argument that I admit is common in fanon that Anakin "evening the playing field" was his destiny or something). He tripped and dragged his heels on that for twenty years before finally completing the prophecy in the final hour before his death. No more, no less.

It's childish to not take responsibility for your actions. It's why even though I love his character l'm not gonna treat Anakin like he was a "poor little guy" who didn't have a brain. He had options and a support system (Obi-Wan/Ahsoka/Padmé/Rex/R2/etc) he could've reached out to if he really wanted to. But he didn't because he just wanted to be told he was right. That's on him and no one else, as I keep saying over and over, despite how many excuses for him you try to bring up. I will repeat again: you give Anakin a lot of grace, but apparently none to Leia herself. Why is that? It feels pretty hypocritical. It also feels pretty hypocritical to judge and blame the Jedi in one breath saying they "lost their way (incorrect)", while in another breath embracing their very own beliefs on love and forgiveness. So, which is it? Do you think the Jedi had a wisdom and empathy for forgiveness, or do you think they "lost their way?" You can't have both and pick and choose based off how you want to excuse and justify Anakin's behavior.

Ahhhh, and THERE it is. See, I knew this gross argument (that I admit is a common fandom opinion) was hiding in there somewhere! I'm honestly not going to give this opinion much time, because at the end of the day you and everyone else who believe it are objectively wrong. 🤷‍♀️ You wanna know how I know that? Because it's genocide apologia. And at the end of the day, when you say the whole purpose GL made for Anakin's story and the theme of SW is that "genocide is good actually!", all I have to do to refute that is to remind you and others that this is a CHILDREN'S trilogy and from the words of GL himself; SW's main theme is about hope.

So because of that, this gross "theory" is shown for what it is: immoral, gross and just plain wrong genocide apologia. 🤷‍♀️ It's also just wrong in general, because Anakin killed all the Sith at the end of the Original Trilogy, and it's now canon more than two Light Siders were still alive at the time, so that would be "uneven scales" which goes against this immoral genocide apologia theory to begin with.

Ahhh, would you look at that! You've had the gall to bring up another gross argument similar to your earlier one (which is a common fandom one, I'll admit) that Anakin showed "mercy" to the younglings when killing them, when it's obvious that's incorrect and he didn't show them anything but cruelty. And now you're giving this type of similar gross argument that genocide survivors were "freed" from the "slavery" of their own culture! I gotta hand it to you, it's a common SW fan belief, but every time I hear it, I still get amazed at the gall of someone who truly believes this is accurate each and every time. Because it's obvious you don't agree with their culture (not saying I'd be a good Jedi either, but the point remains), which is why you think them being "freed" from their culture is better for them so the genocide survivors can make "real families" because you don't view the Jedi as family! Because you only believe in the basic family dynamic. So yeah, this opinion is also immoral and wrong obviously, because it tries to twist Anakin's and the Empire's genocidal actions as "benevolent" and "cleansing the Order for something new." Which is, again, genocide apologia, which proves you are wrong, because it's illogical that genocide apologia would be the theme of a children's trilogy about hope.

A lot of these things you bring up about Anakin and Palagueis are things l'm not even sure are actually canon anymore or if they're from Legends. Even if they are canon, these again are not excuses for his actions just because Anakin may have had a penchant for darkness. Even if he did, it's still his responsibility to learn how to control it and not hurt people. Many Jedi need to be guided on the right path to not follow evil, which is what the Jedi already did every day. With all of the thousands of Jedi trained and only a handful turning to the Dark Side, that seems like a pretty good record. The Jedi didn't "lose their way." This is a tired and BS argument that I admit Filoni has brewed the more GL gave him more leeway with SW, because Filoni doesn't view the Jedi as heroes in the right like GL did. There is nothing to show they lost their way just because they joined the war, because they literally were given that choice or sitting on their asses to watch the galaxy burn, and you bet your ass if they did that then Palpatine would spin it around to the public: "Look at how they sit in their ivory towers and watch you suffer under the Separatists's hands! 🤪🤪” So there is literally no way they can win here. If you're talking about how some of their methods got dirty (trying to mind trick the bounty hunter), firstly: they were literally trying to save their own children from being tortured/experimented on/enslaved, which I'm pretty sure gives them some slack (unless you're only willing to give that to Anakin?). Secondly, Anakin also got his hands dirty plenty of times in the war, and is conveniently not criticized by the fandom as much as the Jedi are. Ironic, huh?

Anakin could've told Obi-Wan anything and Obi-Wan would've helped him. Anakin knew that. Anakin just didn't want to risk losing his Jedi authority in the Order, because he didn't want to have to choose between a life with Padmé and being a powerful Jedi. If he cared about Padme completely selflessly, why didn't he just admit he was married and ask the Jedi to help Padmé and make sure she stayed alive through their Jedi healers? That was an option.

He literally risked Padme's life because he keeps sitting on the fence to try and have both. Because despite what you and some of his fans believe—Anakin isn't OWED both. He doesn't deserve everything in the world just because he is the oh so mighty "Chosen One/Hero With No Fear". A culture shouldn't have to change their entire way of life just for one man to continue being married and to have his cake and eat it too by staying in the Order. Even in real life, priests still aren't allowed to practice and be married. That doesn't mean they're being "repressed" or that they're under some type of horrible "slavery" to suppress their emotions. It's just the rules of that culture. If Anakin didn't like the rules of the Jedi, he should've just left after getting their help to keep Padmé and his kids safe. But he didn't because he wanted to keep both. That’s on him. Not his victims.

I mean, yeah, no duh the Jedi Order would’ve had some problems after killing Palpatine and having to prove they he was a Sith that acted on both sides of the war. Palpatine did that really well, but it’s a bit illogical to assume they wouldn’t eventually find evidence in his office somewhere or on his data files. He did the things he did by planning his schemes some type of way. And yeah, for some insane reason being a Sith Lord “wasn’t illegal”, but being controlling of both sides of the war IS, which they could’ve proved after a while. So, if you are trying to argue that Anakin’s actions were for the “better” because it would’ve been too “hard” for the Jedi otherwise—you are still objectively wrong this way. 🤷‍♀️ It’s also just another way to try and excuse Anakin by pretending his actions that day on the final day of freedom of democracy didn’t matter, when it’s obvious that they very clearly did. If Anakin hadn’t cut off Mace’s hand, the war would’ve been won. Therefore, everything that goes bad in the galaxy is legit Anakin’s fault. 🤷‍♀️ Of course Palpatine has the highest blame because he’s the mastermind, but betrayers/backstabbing is always a worse breed of crime, because it always comes from a friend, which is what Anakin was to the Jedi/Obi-Wan/Ahsoka/Rex/Padmé/501st. He legit ruins all of his friends’s lives with that one swing to cut off Mace’s hand. Trying to paint it as anything else is simply incorrect, and takes away from his ‘redemption’ at the end of the Original Trilogy by trying to pretend he’s a “poor little guy” who had no choice.

Anakin could’ve “defeated” Palpatine multiple ways. Just as I mentioned before, just because The Force had a “plan” doesn’t mean that everyone was puppets walking around on a string, because then free will wouldn’t exist. Anakin could’ve helped defeat Palpatine in his office that day in Revenge of The Sith by either taking the swing himself or either standing back and just letting Mace finish the job. He’s still The Chosen One that way, because his choice is still literally the defining action that saves democracy that way. He also could defeat him the way he does in the Original Trilogy, which is taking him by surprise to save Luke by throwing him down the reactor shaft to kill Palpatine. Either way gets the job done. He doesn’t need to physically fight Palpatine to get it done himself. He’s just the catalyst for what happens to the galaxy because of HIS choices alone, which proves how he has agency and understood why all his actions were wrong and just didn’t care. He didn’t need Luke for that in Palpatine’s office. All he had to do was grow a spine and let Mace take the final swing. He failed to do that and doomed the galaxy for twenty years because of it. 🤷‍♀️

Ahhh, there you go again with the gall to pretend that what Anakin did was “mercy” for the younglings just because the imperials would’ve done horrible things to them too! Gotta hand it to you, one has to have a lot of nerve to believe such an argument such as this (which I acknowledge is a common opinion among rabid Anakin fans), but it’s still gross and hilariously wrong every time I hear it repeated. So, just as I stated to you before: you and anyone else who has this opinion is WRONG, because obviously Anakin murdering little kids like animals is not a mercy. Anyone with any type of heart and soul should be able to realize that. What Anakin did is not and will never be a “mercy”. It was a cruel and dehumanizing act towards kids who were begging for his help. What would ACTUALLY have been mercy is what I stated before: Anakin snapping out of it to save the kids and lead them out of the Temple to save their lives. THAT is mercy. The only reason you continue to spout this BS argument that is common among rabid Anakin fans is to try and twist yourself into knots to deny Anakin agency and pretend he had “no choice” but to kill the kids for “mercy”, when it’s clear that this opinion of yours and anyone else who believes it is gross, immoral, and just plain wrong. 🤷‍♀️ It’s as simple as that.

Anakin WAS taught to understand, accept and manage his emotions correctly. That’s LITERALLY what “control” means: MANAGING your emotions so you don’t lash out at people in your anger, which is what the Jedi always warned their members against doing. The only difference here is that you just don’t agree with their beliefs, and are inadvertently portraying them as a culture who “suppresses” their emotions, when from the movies and TCW show it’s obvious that you and anyone who has this opinion is wrong. 🤷‍♀️ There are literally scenes that show it’s about being MINDFUL of your emotions so you don’t let them control you. Not to pretend they don’t exist. Anakin had all of these Jedi teachings available to him. The only difference is that he thought he was above the rules and that they didn’t apply to him. All of which eventually bit him in the ass, because he refused to listen to anyone and be told “no” without getting angry.

Qui-Gon was kind to Anakin, and Anakin had a fondness for him, but it is NOT canon that if Qui-Gon lived Anakin wouldn’t have fallen. That’s just a fanon theory that fans pretend is canon. You know how I know this? Because if you look it up, George Lucas straight up SAYS in interviews that Qui-Gon living wouldn’t have changed anything for Anakin not falling to the Dark Side. The “Duel of the Fates” is just what the song writer titled the song as a metaphor for the fight between light and darkness, but that doesn’t mean that because Qui-Gon died it was impossible for Anakin to grow a brain and a conscience and make choices of his own. GL literally knows better, because he’s the writer, which is what SW fans always say, right? Because anyone that believes that Qui-Gon dying “sealed Anakin’s fate” is simply using it as another copout/excuse for Anakin’s actions to pretend like all of his choices weren’t his own fault. Obi-Wan was a fine teacher for Anakin, and just because he wasn’t perfect didn’t mean he “failed” him. The truth is that Obi-Wan did everything he could, but Anakin refused to accept Obi-Wan’s help half the time. That’s on him and nobody else. He failed Obi-Wan. Not the other way around. Obi-Wan only thinks he “failed” Anakin out of misplaced guilt because he’s a better person than Anakin could ever hope to be who actually felt guilt for his actions, when Anakin in turn during that time at least felt nothing but entitlement and anger towards friends who wouldn’t join him on the Dark Side.

Dooku also doesn’t have any room to talk. He might’ve noticed corruption in the Senate, but the second Dooku joined the Sith and the Separatists and started helping enslave planets and killing people, he lost all credibility and became a big old hypocrite, just like Anakin became after ROTS.

So far, every single opinion you have given is just one excuse after another for Anakin’s actions to try and put the blame on someone else (usually the victims of his genocidal atrocities). And all of them are incorrect and immoral and wrong. 🤷‍♀️ Because half of it is genocide apologia or trying to twist Anakin’s actions from killing the younglings as “benevolent mercy”, when that is obviously WRONG and the biggest copout I have ever heard in my life. You also try to excuse Dooku’s actions, which is also wrong, because Dooku is a literal war criminal at the end of ROTS, so all of his opinions mean squat at that point, because he’d become the very thing he’d hated at that point, just like Anakin would eventually come to be from his own shitty choices. Therefore, every single thing you have brought up is not “facts.” It is simply an opinion that has become huge in fandom spaces because people like Anakin’s character and are biased against him and want to pretend he was a “poor little guy” who couldn’t make decisions, when it is clear there were a million other decisions he could’ve made.

I will then bring this around back to my original point: Leia Organa is not a “brat” for choosing not to forgive someone who was once one of the biggest monsters in the galaxy who TORTURED her (her own flesh and blood FATHER) just because Anakin might’ve had a hard childhood or a few people “being mean to him.” She doesn’t owe him anything, because specifically everything that had gone wrong in the galaxy up to that point was ANAKIN’S fault, and it is the LEAST he can do to kill Palpatine and fix it, so she doesn’t owe him anything for him killing the Emperor either. It’s great Luke found it in his heart to forgive Anakin, but it will NEVER be acceptable to call Leia a “bad person” for not forgiving Anakin, who is canonically the space Hitler (proven) of the Star Wars galaxy. She doesn’t owe him shit, and again: Anakin is lucky she didn’t spit on his grave.

Again: this doesn’t mean I hate Anakin’s character. But unlike you, when I like a character, I don’t need to excuse their every action to pretend they are “poor little guys.” Anakin was a horrible monster for most of his life, but I’m still GLAD he found salvation and peace in the afterlife. But he did NOT deserve it. He deserved to be condemned to the farthest pits of Hell, and I am under no delusions about that. He’s lucky the people around him (Luke, Yoda, Obi-Wan and Ahsoka) are far better people than he ever was while he was alive and were able to find it in their hearts to offer him forgiveness, because he never showed them that same kindness or grace, and obviously didn’t deserve their love or loyalty. It makes it all the more saintly that they gave it to him.

​You’re correct that I said earlier I didn’t want to continue this conversation because I feel like we’re going in circles. But if you’ll recall, I also stated if you kept messaging me then I would respond to the best of my abilities.

My final message to you on my points is the one I left before and also this following one, and then I will wish you farewell, considering we’re obviously never going to agree. Maybe someday someone will come across this thread and read my thoughts and see the logic in not believing genocide apologia is the theme of a CHILDREN’S series about hope. Either way, the conversation is basically finished. I’m not going to repeat everything I have said that discredits your points again, as nothing I’ve said has gotten through to you apparently. The reason in my last message I brought my point back around to Leia not being what you call a “brat” is because that was the original reason I replied to you to begin with. The other stuff in this final comment you send about Leia “owing” Anakin for her birth, which is why she “owes” him forgiveness is also wrong as well for all of the reasons I stated earlier. The parent argument is just another excuse because Anakin was a deadbeat dad. Lots of kids write off their terrible parents every day.

Every other thing you bring up about the Jedi and Mace and the Council has already been refuted by my points earlier to show them as incorrect, even if you don’t agree. The final thing is of course you repeating Anakin has no agency and shouldn’t be blamed because the Force had a “plan”, but again, I’ve already proven in my earlier messages that type of immoral and genocide apologia argument about it being his “destiny” to genocide the Light Side is wrong, because—again—Star Wars is a CHILDREN’S series at the end of the day, and it is completely illogical and absurd that “genocide is good, actually!” is the main theme of a CHILDREN’S trilogy about hope.

I will respond to you no further now. I am satisfied with the points I have made debunking your claims, and will definitely come back to this as a reference if I need to debate someone in the future. I will only leave you with a vague thanks that things managed to stay mostly civil besides us calling each other “strange”. But then again, I know we were both probably getting annoyed. Still, it’s a rare thing to have a mostly polite debate on the internet, so I’ll give credit where credit’s due. 👍 Goodbye, and hope your day is well.

-

As you can see, there’s a lot of genocide apologia in this guy’s arguments (literally disgusting), and there were times I got a little snippy (it gets frustrating defending genocide survivors over and over), but for the most part, I tried to be polite, because I wanted all my points to remain strong. If you are willing to listen to my perspective, I think you can admit some of his arguments echo your own, even if you’re obviously not as blunt and frankly gross about it as him.

Take the show The Acolyte, and how it’s supporters argue that it’s only “critiquing” the Jedi and showing them as “flawed”, which is what you wanted to get at when you sent this ask, no? To “make sure that in discussing the Jedi we remember the good and bad.” Well, my response is… why is that needed? You’ve seen all my points and examples about how being anti Jedi is the larger fandom opinion and how Order 66 is quietly thought to be partly “their fault”, which is literally one of the grossest opinions to have and I’ll never sugarcoat that. So, why is it NEEDED to point out their “flaws” with every post on how they didn’t deserve their genocide? Why does that matter? Why can’t it just be agreement: the Jedi didn’t deserve to be slaughtered like animals? Why is it “oh, but we must remember that they were flawedddd and complacenttttt. 😔💔 After all, if only they just hadn’t been mean to poor Anakinnnn. Then he wouldn’t have been ‘forced’ to help murder them all. 😔💔” Like… do you not HEAR how condescending that sounds? 😭🤷‍♀️🤦‍♀️

Why do the Jedi have to be the “perfect victims” for fans, otherwise they either “deserved what they got” or were “arrogant” and “brought it on themselves?” Why aren’t the MURDERERS/BETRAYERS blamed for the collapse of a galaxy (Anakin and Palpatine), when THEY were the ones responsible and who pulled the trigger? The point is that it’s frankly just weird how much certain fans bring up that “oh, don’t forget they were flawedddd! 🤪🤪🤪” on a post that is mourning the loss of their culture. I promise you that your “special little blorbos” Kanan and Ahsoka (the REAL her that hasn’t become Filoni’s mouthpiece) would probably not enjoy the way you describe them as “oh, but YOU’RE one of the good ones!” And I say that with all the politeness I can manage.

Funnily enough, the writer of The Acolyte, LH, kind of echoes your sentiments, which just aren’t as “benevolent” as you may genuinely believe. In her show, there’s no DEPTH or honestly real THEMES of SW put into the show. It’s all flipped around to the Dark Side being “liberating”, which is so far from true it’s literally laughable. 😭😒 And I’m getting ticked off that when genuine criticism from pro jedi fans come up, somebody just HAS to say—“This show is just portraying the Jedi as not perfect! 😌” 😬😤🫠 And I swear I’m gonna lose it one day, because it portrays the Jedi as more than imperfect. It portrays them as emotionally repressed, barely competent “space cops”. 🙄 (Fucking HATE that term antis use for them so much, because it’s what they argue about saying the Jedi ‘deserved’ their genocide because they’re an ‘institution’ and not a “real” family. 😬😬🤬🤬 Ohhhh, I’m gonna go off on someone one day. Lol.) And these are just my frustrations. It’s not personally directed at you at the moment, anon. It’s just me kind of venting all my thoughts on this post.

I even had a fairly decent comment on my tumblr post about my critique of The Acolyte from a fan trying to save it, and they basically said the same thing and that it’s from the Sith perspective so it’s skewed. But it’s not. 😭😭 Because the showrunner’s views literally mirror the villain’s and then they become her mouthpieces. The show is completely anti Jedi while trying to pretend in a condescending way that it’s only Jedi critical in a way like—“Ah, those poor little culty Jedi. 😔😔💔 Some had good hearts… but their culture doomed them to be wiped out… 😔💔” 😒🙄����🤬

I just… fucking HATE that show. 😭 SO much. And I know certain fans loved it, so I apologize if people enjoyed at least certain parts, but I’ve read a tumblr post that broke down the show really well and how hollow it is. The characters barely have time to interact and get to know one another before they’re all killed off (Yord and Jecki and Sol, who were fan favorites), until only Osha and Quimir remain—because at the end of the day, THAT’S what this whole stupid show was about. 😭🤦‍♀️ It was about a Reylo fanfic writer getting to play in her sandbox.

Anyway, my point is I don’t think you’re “anti Jedi”, anon. I think you’re “Jedi critical”, yes. But not in the benevolent way you believe. I think you are unknowingly being benevolently condescending in the way The Acolyte tries to be by saying, “Ooohhh, those poor, culty Jedi. 💔😔😔😔 If only they weren’t so emotionally repressed like robots (dehumanization)… maybe then they could’ve changed their culture so they didn’t have to be ‘cleansed’ for a ‘better galaxy’. 😔💔💔” It’s just… stuff like that. 😭🤷‍♀️🤦‍♀️ Which is… SO exhausting for us pro Jedi fans to hear over and over and over like it’s a valid take, when it’s just really not. But I wanted to explain my thoughts in a way I hope was mostly polite. I probably sound a little bit snippy, but it’s just because I’m frustrated at having to defend genocide victims again. That’s all.

I guess I would just… encourage you to rethink your thoughts? Because when you take into account what the Sith/Empire represent (Nazis) and then what the Jedi genocide is a metaphor of… your ‘argument’ looks less and less cute. 🤷‍♀️😭 I’m just saying. Some may not like me comparing it to real life, but there are plenty of Asian fans/aroace fans/Jewish fans that heavily relate to the Jedi for this very reason, and I refuse to allow their opinions to be silenced, because fiction is for everyone, and SW has ALWAYS been political, which means it’s literally MADE to be compared to real life.

Anyway, I hope this long meta post maybe changed some minds, if not your own. I’m gonna leave links to other big pro Jedi blogs that have better and more organized meta posts than me about this stuff, where they go in depth explaining how the Jedi are the good guys and how what happened in the Prequels was never about “the genocide victims are in the wrong, actually!” and was more about the SENATE becoming corrupt and rotting democracy from the inside out, which made it so easy for Palpatine to slither into power. 10,000 Jedi aren’t gonna easily change that. But the politicians CAN. They were just too selfish to do so. The Senate/Sith are the real villains of the Prequel trilogy. Not the Jedi (literal genocide victims). Anything less than viewing it like this is just… wrong. 😭🤷‍♀️

Here are the big Pro Jedi meta blogs I talked about:

-

Tags:

@ensomnia

@heartfairy

@fangirlteallie

@shoniwake

@lemons-to-limes

@lexskiss

@spidersaye

@selenaftmarvel

@silverwoodj

@ajtaals

[velvetvexations]

I unfollowed PT after she pulled the "you can't be afab and a transfem" thing a while ago, which was already really hurtful, and I kinda assumed the current backlash was just her saying some radfem talking points off the cuff, I figured it was an escalation but nothing too bad, but I found the posts and wow, this is like actually vile. Like I don't even have words for it vile. I really enjoyed her music and her posts helped me deal with a lot of my own issues for the short time I followed her, seeing her go so far down the transradfem pipeline that she's essentially saying (paraphrased) "transmascs have so few problems that it's our right as transfems to silence them whenever they try to speak, they do not even deserve to have a voice and pretending they do is in of itself transmisogynistic" is just. I don't know, it's just sad? I really did look up to her, seeing her hit that low of a point due to what I can only assume is years of harassment(which I mean, TERFs/radfems exploit past abuse to recruit so not surprised the suffering transfems have faced can be used the same way) hurts in a way I can't even describe.

I know we need to keep fighting to make it out of this, to actually move us towards trans unity and liberation(honestly seeing the ammount of random people jumping on the "let's harass a transfem for fun" train with PT makes the angry butch in me want to crack skulls in her defense even if she says disgusting things about people like me), but right now I hate this fucking discourse about as much as I hated ace/aro discourse even though the fight there was also worth it in the end. And I know shit's always been rough in queer spaces and the work will never truly be done, but seeing the trans community falling apart so badly that people straight up don't think some trans people deserve a voice at all is killing me.

We all deserve so much better than this. We really do.

We do, anon. I love you and I'm here for you. <3 <3 <3 <3 <3

[razorblade180]

Bed History

Firefly:Caelus, I have a very important question. Silver Wolf has told me some…interesting things. So I was wondering…

Caelus:How many people have taken me to bed?

Hologram appears

Silver Wolf:You knew what I meant by Smash. Don’t even pretend. You took me to bed. *disappears*

Caelus:So that’s one person right there. There’s March dragging me and Dan Heng into interesting situations.

Firefly:*red* You’ve slept with a boy?

Caelus:I will emphasize that was not on either of our plans that day. Only March’s. Other than that, there’s Sparkle you know about Stelle.

Firefly:I’m sorry, what was that?

Caelus:Huh?

Stelle:*opens door* Naaaaah I heard that shit. You slept with who!?

Caelus:…A Masked Fool.

Firefly:What!?

Stelle:When!?

Sparkle:How!?

Caelus:I-

They all turn their heads, including Sparkle. She then looks back at them as she chews on some popcorn.

Sparkle:You’re out of popcorn by the way.

Caelus:In my defense, this happened when you were dead and the first time I saw Robin was her body fading away. The vibes were at an all time low.

Sparkle:So your favorite trash compactor was mixing drinks and trying to dance sadness away. It kinda funny in a painful way. Like a comedian trying to save his performance.

Caelus:See? She’s just annoying and yaps. You ever just wanted to shut someone up who’s so smug?

Firefly:By sleeping with them!?

Stelle:I hate to say it….but if I had ran across Aventurine again back then and he called me Ms. Stelleron one more fucking time…

Firefly:Far be it from me to predict the actions of a Fool but how the heck do you even convince someone like her to entertain that idea?

xxxxx

Sparkle:Well well well look what the cat dragged in. A funny looking raccoon confused in the big city.

Caelus:You really think you’re above all. Just the ultimate risk taker with no care in the world.

Sparkle:Don’t know what you mean. Like any supporting character, I’m filling up space and watching the show. So what if the stage blows or the performance gets canceled. Another starts, so why be scared to step on any or play whatever?

Caelus:You really are crazy.

Sparkle:Perhaps~ like I said, anything can happen so anything goes. No need to get cold feet or stuck in the same scenes.

Caelus:Ever slept with a bomb?

Sparkle:….What?

xxxxxx

Firefly:You. Are. Insane.

Sparkle:It was a good question.

Stelle:Honestly i respect the hustle.

Sparkle:Maybe don’t die and make people sad. It was a one and done. Although…I’d give the performance four stars. It makes me wonder how well the leading actress performs.

Stelle:Keep dreaming.

Firefly:*pouts*

Caelus: *pinches cheeks* I’m sowy. Don’t be mad.

Firefly:I’m not mad. Also stop playing with my face!

Caelus:Not until you’re happy again. Although this side of you is cute.

Stelle:Very cute. *pokes face* Hehehe

Firefly:*blushing* (Why are they like this so often?)…..

Sparkle:Alls well that ends well.

Stelle:I can’t tell if you’re a matchmaker or a home wrecker.

Sparkle:Why not both? Don’t put me in box. Unless it’s with a certain fallen angel. Hehe, oh how I bet dear Chicken Wing Boy would cherish any familiar face these days. The Songbird might actually faint if her brother wanted some elation in his life. Only time will tell.

Firefly:I’m telling Robin you said that.

Sparkle:It’s hilarious you think I haven’t told her this myself. Her brother is hot and everyone knows it. He’s gotta put his sins somewhere and I know where.

CFS:You are an actual menace to society.

Sparkle:Said the Stellaron Hunter with her two stellarons. *vanishes*

Stelle:…So do you need my list of people?

Firefly:It’s two people and one is me. The other you just complimented his craziness.

Stelle:….I gotta step my game up.

Firefly:That’s not the message you should take from this!

Caelus:What’s your history.

Firefly:Just one. Could be two but maybe I should reevaluate.

Caelus:I respect that decision.

Firefly:…I mean you can sound a little disappointed; nothing is set in stone.

Stelle:Don’t fold so easily! You had me on the back foot blushing and kicking my feet. What’s so different here!?

Firefly:Silver Wolf gave me FOMO!

Caelus:Did she on purpose, or did you ask questions and never stopped?

Firefly:Not important.

Hologram appears

Firefly:I asked questions.

Caelus:Thanks for wingmaning.

Silver Wolf:Eh, I was bored and out of resin.

Stelle:(Step one; find a wingman…)

[probablyasocialecologist]

The far right aren’t the only ones showing up armed. Across the country, marginalized individuals are forming groups like the John Brown Gun Club and Socialist Rifle Association that claim to be devoted to the idea of community defense. Their rationale is informed by the massacres at Colorado’s Club Q and Florida’s Pulse nightclub, and tempered by a long cultural distrust of the police, who they say have repeatedly failed to protect them from — and in some cases even perpetuated — right-wing hate. 

Many sources interviewed for this story — particularly those who conceal their identities at protests — asked to use pseudonyms, in fear of being targeted or doxxed by the far right. Others were happy to share their names, judging that their public presence — or concealed-carry permits — shield them from harm. All of them, however, agree on one thing: The other side has guns and is willing to use them. The only answer is to be prepared to shoot back. 

[...]

“My community, the South Asian community, has been dealing with this shit for 30 years,” Azad says. “Every year, some dude throws a Molotov into a temple, or spray-paints swastikas on our houses.” 

Gato chimes in. “I don’t want to own guns and do this,” he says. “But I also don’t want someone coming after my wife because she’s a person of color.” 

But in Texas, Azad and Gato say, guns are a necessity — the right wing has them, the law allows them, and being armed is the only way to stay safe. 

“This is the Wild fuckin’ West, man,” Azad says. “We kinda do what we gotta do.”

[melmedarda]

I have śo many feelings about the Mel and Ambessa dynamic (mostly because their dynamic mirrors my own with my mom).

I don't doubt Ambessa loves either of her children. But at the same time, she is a soldier. And soldiers can't afford to show weakness, especially if they're leaders. In Noxus, emotion is vulnerability. And vulnerability leaves you open to attack. She's cold to Mel because she sees a younger, 'weaker' version of herself in Mel. Upon seeing that, she did what she does best when she can't handle the situation - dismiss her in favour of another and bury her feelings because they're a sign of weakness.

There's also the uncomfortable notion that she seems to prefer Kino to Mel (she was messy as hell for saying Kino was all the sweetness in her heart, but having nothing as complimentary to say for Mel) because she didn't seem to need to rely on emotions as much as she did with Mel. You kinda have to lower your defenses when dealing with kids, especially one as sensitive and empathetic as Mel. But Ambessa wouldn't or couldn't lower her guard, so she decided to try to harden Mel into her self image. When that didn't work, she sent her away.

But I maintain that Kino and her stepfather was able to step in and bolster her emotionally and affectionately where Ambessa couldn't or wasn't able to and that's why she's so attached to them both.The very mention of Kino's death was enough to stop Mel in her tracks. I don't doubt that Mel tried to reach out to Ambessa, but was rebuffed often enough that she just decided not to bother.

(Whoever wrote their dynamic either has a soldier for a parent or was raised by a black mother. There's something so pervasive about how harsh moms can be to their daughters. Something,something, mom's raise their daughters and love/coddle their sons.)

Great observations anon!

I've often heard that the traits parents most hate in their children are their own weaknesses manifested in them. Which pretty much explains Ambessa's dynamic with Mel. Ambessa was trying to fix all the things that she considered wrong with herself through Mel. But Mel, stubborn girl, only brings them out in her. That weakness, in Noxus were strength is venerated and weakness is stomped out.

The strong black woman stereotype has been particularly damaging for our community, and to see Ambessa struggle with it, and Mel as well (and eventually lose to it) truly was a journey. I do believe Mel was close with her father and Kino because they loved her in a way she understood. They cherished her thoughts and nurtured her ideas in a way that Ambessa did not.

One of my headcanons is that Mel would often write letters to her mother, to Kino, to Rictus, to anyone on the mainland, hoping for connection, but Ambessa made sure to cut her off from their family completely. Ambessa's letter in season 1 was the first correspondence Mel has had with her family in over a decade, and I think we can understand why she is on defense when her mother steps foot into Piltover.

Ambessa's parenting style worked for neither of her children, no matter how much she tried. And in the end, she lost them both to the very people she wanted to protect them against. She failed, both as a general and as a mother (she didn't manage to protect her children). The irony of it is painful but soooo compelling.

[glorious-spoon]

he speaks the languages of love [9-1-1 | Buck/Eddie | 1/1]

he speaks the languages of love

4k words | Explicit established relationship | phone sex

-

Eddie has been in Texas for nearly two weeks, and Buck has been extremely patient about it, in his opinion. True, it's possible that none of his coworkers would agree with that assessment, but in his defense, he's been existing in a state of sexual frustration not seen since Eddie shoved him against a wall and stuck his tongue down his throat after that close call with the cruise ship back in April.

"Good to know where I rate," Eddie says when Buck tells him this on their phone call the night before he's supposed to come home. He's just come off a twenty-four, so Chris is over at Pepa's and he's back at the loft. The lonely, empty loft.

"I mean it's not just that," Buck protests. "I do actually miss you."

Eddie snorts. "Is that why you bit Ravi's head off earlier today when he was talking about his date staying over?"

"You heard about that, huh?"

"No shit," Eddie says, laughing. "You didn't notice that we work with the biggest gossips on the West Coast?"

"Okay, well, first of all, I apologized for that—"

"Uh huh."

"And also, Hen blows things out of proportion."

"Oh, yeah, that sounds like Hen."

"Okay, fine," Buck admits. "I've been kind of a dick. She threatened to drown me in a washing machine earlier, and honestly, I probably deserved it."

"A washing machine?"

"This guy got stuck—it was a whole thing." He flops back on the bed, staring up at his empty ceiling in his empty loft. "Feels weird being at work without you there."

"I'll be back for our next shift."

"Yeah, I know," Buck sighs. "So, I mean. It's not just sexual frustration, for the record."

"Sure. I just think maybe it's a good thing Chris will be at school so he doesn't have to see you jump me the minute I get back."

"Well, when you put it like that," Buck admits. Eddie laughs, and he adds, "Okay, but you gotta understand, this is like—six months of finally actually getting to put my hands on you, and then I have to go cold turkey for two weeks? It's hard."

"In every sense of the word, I guess," Eddie says, because he's never met a dumb joke he didn't love. Buck groans, laughing.

"You're such an asshole."

"Uh huh. So you're saying you don't want to fuck me into the mattress when I get back?"

"Okay, I didn't say that."

"That's what I thought."

"I do want to, for the record. I've always wanted to. From, like, day one."

Eddie laughs warmly in his ear. "You're so full of it."

"Am not."

"You hated my guts the first day we met."

"Yeah," Buck admits. He yawns, then smears a hand over his mouth. It's late. They should probably both get some sleep. It's just that he really never wants to stop talking to Eddie, especially now that he's two thousand miles away instead of in Buck's bed, where he belongs. "I kinda did. You were infuriatingly perfect."

A snort. "Right."

"Still wanted to fuck you, though."

There's a couple of beats of silence. Then Eddie says, "Yeah?"

-

Continue reading on AO3

[marisol-000]

The Sandbox Scientists ch. 3

Sooooo I may have been off about how long this would take, in my defense this is only my second multi-chapter fic! My solution to this is to stop guessing when things will be done so you get ch. 4 when you get it <3

Something I realized when double checking the opening scene is that I accidentally made it very unclear which Henry is narrating XD, I’ve decided to leave it that way

Big chapter this time! I thought about splitting it up but that's lame so you get what you get <3 Happy Thanksgiving!

(a03)

Henry was over the moon.

The adults liked science!!!

The adults like science the way they liked science!!!!!

They weren't mad or grossed out at all! Like the other grown ups and kids were when he talked about it.

The “Lodgers” as they called themselves had shown him and the other him all sorts of cool stuff! Like a GIANT octopus, and a metal man with glowing eyes, the biggest telescope he’d ever seen in his life, and even mice that were invisible!

There were so many labs here that were used for all sorts of things he didn’t understand yet!

Mr. Sinnet even let them hold his flamethrower!!

Not even his mother liked when he showed her his ‘science projects’. But these guys! They let him put his hands in the dirt and pick up a plant that moved!

Other Henry touched some slime that didn’t stick if he was fast enough!

And one of the lodgers gave them candy!

Whatever this place was was the best place EVER! He hoped Momma would let them come back sometime.

Archer, their new friend, leaned next to them while they tried the big lollipops someone named Doodle gave them.

“So, what kinda science is you two’s favorite? Neuroscience? Engineering? Cryptobiology?”

No one ever asked Henry what kind of science he liked! He also didn’t know what those words meant but he couldn’t wait to find out!

“Potions! I like to make potions with stuff I find outside! Oh and monsters! When I grow up I’m gonna be a monster doctor so I can help monsters when they get sick!”

Other him jumped in at this. “Yeah! I’m gonna make potions that bring people back to life, like Frankenstein!”

Someone nearby gasped. A hushed mutter ran through the crowd at this. Lodgers who had started to drift away and chat with their neighbors were suddenly pulled back into the boys’ conversation.

Archer straightened, and had an odd spark in his eyes.

“Sooooo, you like Frankenstein then?”

They nodded, “Mm hm! He’s the coolest scientist ever! I wanna be just like him!”

The whispers grew louder, with people giggling and nudging each other.

“You don’t say? Then I bet it’d be <em>really</em> cool if I were to tell you about a certain someone who’s in town.” Archer mused.

Henry paused in trying to bite his lollipop, “Who?”

Surely they couldn’t mean…

“Oh no one special,” he said, someone snickered behind them, “It’s just that we just so <em>happen</em> to have a certain… mad scientist in our attic right now.”

The boys froze where they were. For a moment Archer got a little worried.

“FRANKENSTEIN?!?!?!??!?!??!”

Frankenstein was having a quiet day.

She’d had her fair share of that in life, living in the wilderness, distancing herself from society. Hell, even before everything she had isolated herself from the world, driven everyone away lest the small minds find out about her incredible experiments.

Which was fine, she didn't need anyone else. So what if the lodgers had barely stopped by to talk to her all day? It didn’t bother her at all! It wasn’t like she took the slightest indication that she was being ignored with anything less than the <em>utmost</em> grace and dignity.

She huffed into her book and pretended not to be eyeing the door instead of it’s pages. Glaring as though hating it personally. As if her lovelies were just on the other side waiting to see her and this stubborn door was the problem.

Creature, the stone wall, was as content as ever with the silence. Enjoying a book of his own in the corner, likely philosophy or something.

Although constant companions and wholly comfortable talking to each other, the two had worn out their conversation topics years ago. Either agreeing on certain things or tired of arguing in circles on others.

There were days when they'd debate for hours about something she was <em>clearly</em> right about and days where they pretended the other didn’t exist.

Lately he often mocked her about her ‘adoring fans’.

Judged her for how greedily she drank up the attention like a surgical sponge. Languishing in the first shreds of approval she’d had in decades.

Well, he hadn't actually said any of that, but he was thinking it! She knew he was!

She could just feel his disapproval in how easily she was letting herself get attached as if it were her own…

Bah! What does he know?

She hears them before she sees them, WAY before she sees them. The gaggle of lodgers charging up the steps with almost as much enthusiasm as they did on her first day awake.

The woman straightened immediately, practically tossing her book aside and giving her full attention to the door.

Finally, Frankenstein’s day was resuscitated as a crowd of almost every lodger in the building burst into her room. All chattering and shifting and even waving at her like her prison of a bed was a grand stage or operating theatre.

They kept a respectable distance considering how small the room was with so many people in it. And she preened under their attention, ignoring creatures sigh at his reading being interrupted.

“Frankenstein! Frankenstein!” everyone called out excitedly. Eagerly talking over each other.

Everyone was smiling and leaning around each other to get a better view of her. All their words blending together. 

A hearty laugh bubbled out of Frankenstein’s chest. They were so energetic and curious, smart and idealistic. They were perfect scientist material!

She wanted to put them all in her pocket and take them with her on her travels, tell them stories, show them the world.

Oh, how she resented that idiotic Doctor Jekyll for keeping them in a box. The way he had them eating out of his perfectly manicured hand, thanking him for their gilded cage.

Well it was about time they bit that hand!

Couldn't they see how the world was not in their books and manuscripts, it was out there!

Frankenstein held her gloved hands up to quiet the noise, taking a big breath for what was sure to be a rallying speech that would finally convince the so-called lodgers to fight for their freedom.

“Frankenstein! We have some special guests who want to meet you!”

She was cut off by a few of the lodgers. Fighting their way through the crowd, they were ushering someone to the front, entirely hidden behind the energetic scientists.

Frankenstein blinked in surprise as there, pushed out of the huddle as though in offering, were two…children.

She froze.

A cold wind rushed through her, instantly snuffing out the spark she’d held seconds ago. Cutting through her coat to her core.

The two boys in front of her were distinctive in appearance, it nagged at her, distantly. But all she could see was William.

“These are our newest recruits! Henderson and what was it? Benry? Yeah Benry.”

There was no way anyone named these unfortunate children that, unless London had gotten weird while she was gone, but the two seemed too entranced with her creature to correct them.

The boys weren't even looking at her like everyone else was, eyes instead on the homunculi like he was some celebrity they got backstage tickets to see.

“We found them snooping ‘round our labs!” “Cripes they were hard to catch.” “These two are gonna be fine scientists someday!”

The creature that had killed her youngest brother.

She understood why he did it.

She understood it was her fault.

It was her fault. For making a monster with such strength, just to see if she could. It was her fault for abandoning it, leading to the resentment and hatred for all like her. All Frankensteins.

It was her fault he was dead.

No! It was the price one paid for Science, she was wrong to have attachments then and she would not let herself get attached to these kids now. Not when it meant people got hurt. Not when - aannnnnnd Creature was letting them climb on him like monkey bars.

To her shock Creature was holding perfectly still, staring in utter befuddlement at the small things crawling on him like bugs.

As hesitant as he looked, he wasn’t stopping them. Merely watching.

It was… odd.

This had never happened to him before. Fully grown adults who were hardened from life and trained to deal with criminals turned tail at the mere sight of him, yet here were two children, gazing up at him with round eyes like he was Santa Claus.

“WOW, you’re Frankenstein's monster?!”

“Did you kill Frankenstein?”

“Are you gonna kill someone else?”

“How did Frankenstein make you?”

“Can we be friends?”

“Do you wanna play doctor with us? Mr.Tanis gave me a scalpel!”

One of the lodgers yelped, “What!? I most certainly did not!”

The way they were looking at him…

The lodgers looked at him the same way. At first he had taken it with suspicion, as he did all things. Assuming that their looks were of scientific curiosity, and that they were imagining all the ways they could dissect him. Take him apart and find out how he ticked, just like Moraue longed to.

But now, it was obvious, they were looking at him with childlike wonder.

Creature stared mutely as the lodgers wrestled the knife from the boy with brown hair, not quite understanding it yet.

The blond’s hair tickled as it brushed against his shoulder, though he did not react to it. The two children were being surprisingly careful where they placed their hands, taking care to not pull on any of his seams.

Creature watched as the little one slipped off, landing back first on his lap with an “oof”. The fall wasn't tall enough to knock the breath out of him though, so he seemed fine.

Creature lifted him up, holding the boy in one palm. He giggled in response.

One of the lodgers whose name he didn’t know called out to the boys.

“Hey! Didn’t you want ‘ta meet Frankenstein?”

The man was standing by the bed, gesturing to his creator with a smile.

The two boys gasped and scrambled to her.

The woman seemed almost startled to have her name called, snapping out of her trance.

Frankenstein shook the clashing thoughts out of her head. The two children at her bedside were staring at her, opening and closing their mouths like they couldn’t grasp what question to ask first.

She looked at the one with brown hair. She had snorted instinctively when he pulled an actual scalpel out of nowhere. A fine scientist indeed.

The blonde one had eyes like she’d never seen before. Perhaps he was some sort of creature? Or a descendant of one at least. No humans eyes produced light like that for no reason.

They looked at her like she hung the stars, like she held the secret to life itself. Which she did of course. 

No wonder these boys had snuck into the society just to see her! Why, who wouldn’t want to see the infamous Dr. Frankenstein!

And what's more, these precious children were untainted by Dr. Henry’s lies! The false ideas of what a mad scientist should be, reliant on his wealth and equipment.

Victoria had always seen herself as Job, a man who had everything taken from him, everything he loved and everyone who loved him, only to be rewarded for his faith.

She’d always seen the advancement of science as her reward for carrying out her experiments, a higher plane of understanding, the closest a human could come to godhood. But… hadn’t Job’s been everything he’d lost twofold?

Maybe, when she and Creature left London, they wouldn’t have to leave alone.

[I was struck by LIGHTNING when writing this sentence. All of the sudden a whole new plotline was open to me. One where Henry stays with the society and Edward is offered the chance to leave with Frankenstein to the _ forests.

It reminds me of gravity falls when the twins argue over Dipper taking Ford’s internship.]

Frankenstein puffed up her chest and launched into a story.

When Lanyon returned he waltzed through the kitchen door, swinging it open dramatically.

“Rachel, I'm back! I told the tailor Edward lost their bags on the trip here, so they need a new wardrobe.” he crowed, only to see an empty kitchen.

Hm, not in here. He wandered out again, peeking down random hallways.

He hadn't really told them that. As soon as he’d handed off the note and the words “childrens clothes” were out of his mouth Lady Beatrice and Lady Kimberleigh had practically mobbed him. Gushing and asking if he and Everly had finally had luck with a baby. He nearly had to beat the women off with a clothing hanger!

He shuddered at the thought of what rumors would come of this.

Regardless, the outfits were ordered and they could pick up a set in the morning.

“Rachel! Henry! Where in the blazes are you?”

“Robert!!”

He paused in the middle of the hall. That was Rachel. But he’d never heard her shout like that. She sounded almost scared, Rachel never sounded scared! Not even when Hyde disappeared after the fire.

He turned around and was surprised to see her running up to him with wide eyes, her hair a mess like she'd been running her hands through it. Her eyes red and puffy.

“Robert I’ve been looking everywhere and I <em>can’t</em> find them I can’t I've looked everywhere please tell me you know where they are.” she gasped, skidding to a stop.

His eyes widened, heartbeat picking up, “Know where- what?! Rachel you were the one who claimed <em>I</em> couldn't handle them, don’t tell me you’ve lost them already!”

The day manager tried to catch her breath, swiping a lock out of her eye.

“I was-! I took my eyes off them for just a minute! I left them to get changed while I made some sandwiches and I told- I told them to come to the kitchen after but they didn't and I went back for them but they- Robert they weren't there and I’ve <em>looked</em> everywhere oh what if they’ve left the building? Robert I <em>can’t</em> lose him again! I can’t!” she cried.

Lanyon had <em>never</em> seen her like this, she was always so sure and confident, it honestly made him nervous.

She reached out to him for a hug and he flinched back like her arms were livewires.

“Er, Well!! They can’t have gone too far! I’m sure they're just hiding or something. Kids do that, I think. Surely there's some nook or cranny you haven't checked yet!” He was stone stiff oh god where was Jekyll when you needed him, he can't comfort this poor girl!

Rachel just shook her head, curls flying, “No no I checked my room, Henry’s office, I checked all the labs and rooms and bathrooms I can’t think of anywhere else <em>to</em> look!”

“Well, they’ve gotta be here, can't the lodgers whip up some sort of, I don’t know, finding device?” He peered down the hall, hoping to flag down the nearest one and get them to deal with this. Unfortunately it seemed like he was on his own for this one.

“I don’t think that's how it works Lanyon, besides it’d take far too long, what if they're hurt?”

“Well they should at least <em>try</em>.” He huffed, “It wouldn't hurt to have more people looking either. Where are the lodgers anyway?” Now that he thought of it he hadn’t seen anyone besides Rachel since walking in.

Rachel sniffed, rubbing her face and breathing more evenly.

“Oh yeah, they were all running around earlier, some sort of emergency.

I think Griffin finally turned invisible and they lost him or something.”

She looked around, just noticing how empty the halls were.

“Uh, that was a while ago actually. They should have found him by now.”

Lanyon shifted uncomfortably. First Henry and Edward, now the whole society? Whatever was going on couldn’t be good.

In fact, it was almost suspicious how everyone had gone missing at the same time while he was gone…

“Wait. Oh god, What if the lodgers have them? The lodgers hate Henry! What if they took him away? What if they’re experimenting on him right now to find out why he’s small?!” Lanyon yelped.

Rachel frowned at him, “The lodgers do not hate Henry.”

“Oh yeah? What about the exhibition they’re all refusing to take part in? You’ve heard what they're saying about him, that he’s somehow corrupt and ‘rotten’ just because he hasn't gone off the deep end and killed anyone using science or something!”

“They're just going through a bit of a rebellious phase right now.” she defended, “And besides, even if they did, they love Hyde, they drink and play games all the time! They wouldn't hurt him.”

“That's worse!” Lanyon cried. He resisted the urge to run his hands through his styled hair, “Hyde’s planning on killing Jekyll for his will! What if the lodgers are in on it? What if they know he inherits the society? Now would be the perfect time to do it, they probably took him off to Queen Frankenstein while he’s small and defenseless!”

“Edward is <em>not</em> plotting to kill Jekyll!” Rachel shouted, “Would you give that a rest already! As for Franken..stein…”

The two looked at each other with wide eyes and bolted for the stairs.

“And that's when the beast pounced! I dropped my torch and rolled out of the way, I heard it crash into the brush behind me and took the chance to make a break for it. I ran all night, struggling to see my way in the dark and knowing it had no such human limitations. 

Miles away from civilization I knew my only chance was to somehow find Creature in the snowy woods before the beast found me.”

The lodgers gasped quietly and whispered to each other, sitting criss-crossed on the floor.

Both children were sat on Frankenstein’s lap, enraptured by her tale. They looked up at her with wide eyes, hanging on her every word.

“At one point I stumbled my way into a clearing, the…vollmond shining down on me. It was close behind, I could hear the thing snapping branches like twigs. I knew the only way was forward and started running. I could barely breathe, my legs felt like lead, with every step I took it only got closer, bounding after me on all six legs. It’s wide maw-”

The door slammed open with a bang. Everyone jumped, some people screaming in surprise.

Everyone whirled around.

At the door were two figures, hidden by the shaded doorframe.

Frankenstein huffed, more annoyed than anything. 

“Really doctor, this is the second time you've interrupted my tales for your insipid formula…Oh, the other one.”

The doctor coming toward her was not Jekyll, as she assumed, but Lanyon. The purple man was trudging through the crowd on the floor, stepping on hands and nearly tripping over people in his haste.

She crossed her arms, huffing, “Really, you and your-”

“GET AWAY FROM HIM!”

As soon as he was in range Robert snatched Henry off her lap. Earning a startled yelp from the boy.

Frankenstein jolted, confused. She hadn't seen this man much and while he was never the most agreeable person, she'd never seen him so furious.

She sputtered as he held the boy to his chest the way mothers did when she and Creature walked by. If she were in a better mood she’d get a kick out of the gentleman fearing her more than her creation.

“What in the world do you think you're doing? Grabbing this boy like you own him when I was <em>clearly</em>-!”

“What are you doing to him? Huh? Putting ideas in his head, trying to make him mad like you!” he accused, holding the boy tight while he squirmed uncomfortably.

“I bet you people are trying to brainwash him! Get him involved in unnatural things and mad scientist nonsense!”

Rachel, who was much shorter than the doctor and was caught behind the now-standing crowd of lodgers, tried to call out to him. “Er, Robert! I don’t think-” 

“Hey! What's your problem?” “We’re having storytime here!” “You're in the way!” “Leave him alone!” “Frankenstein ain’t done nothing wrong!”

Lanyon turned on the crowd with a snarl.

“Nothing wrong? Are you people crazy? She hit him!!”

Everyone gasped at the wild accusation. Of course they were on her side! Nevermind that Henry was just trying to help her when she hit him! Nevermind that she didn’t even have the grace to apologize!

One of the lodgers he did recognize, Helsby, immediately jumped to the quacks' defense.

“How <em>dare</em> you say that about Frankenstein! You rich pricks are all the same! Slandering good people's names when it suits you!”

“Frankenstein would never do that!”

“Yeah! We’ve been here the whole time and she never hurt him at all!”

Frankenstein herself looked unbelievably offended, her face a likely unhealthy shade of red for someone her age. “Dr. Robert I’m aware you disapprove of my presence here but I have NO intentions of hurting any child.” she spat coldly.

“Oh yeah? Even if that child is Jekyll?” He challenged.

“I- what on earth are you talking about you simpleton, that's not doctor Jekyll thats…”

Frankenstein looked at the boy squirming in his arms, <em>really</em> looked at him.

The smaller boy was still on the bed with her, pulling on the brunette in Robert’s arms. The brunette reached back, holding onto the other, looking at him with red eyes… he had a rather hooked nose…

The lodgers took up her rebuttal with vigor.

“What? Lanyon, did you hit your head man?”

“Yeah obviously that's Benry!”

Robert stared incredulously at the room full of scientists and doctors. Jaw hanging wide.

“<em>Are you telling me not a single one of you realized they're Jekyll and Hyde?!</em>”

Every person in the room stopped still.

“<em>WHAT???</em>”

“What did <em>Jekyll</em> do to get on Ito’s bad side?”

“Wait, you guys didn’t know that?”

“You did??? Why didn’t you say anything?!”

“I thought we all knew and just weren't talking about it!”

“WHY WOULD WE DO THAT?!”

“Oh, I thought they were Jekyll and Hyde's secret love children.”

“<em>What?!</em>”

“What, you think one of them's a girl? And besides, Hyde's only worked here the past two years, these guys are older than that!”

“So? Are you saying Hyde didn't exist before then or what? You think Hyde spontaneously came into existence two years ago? Huh?”

“Are YOU saying only girls can give birth? Some gals are guys!”

“Sure but Hyde??”

“He <em>is</em> rather short for a man his age.”

“Actually I was thinking Jekyll, he seems kinda feminine doesn't he?”

“Maybe Hyde knocked Jekyll up and recently found out about them! And he stayed to be a good father!”

“Pfft! Hyde? A good father? Now you're talking crazy.”

“I bet <em>that's</em> why Jekyll’s kept him around so long! He's the father of their children!”

Lanyon felt anger and disbelief rush through his whole body. He worked his mouth trying to say whatever was on his mind that wasn’t straight cussing.

“I - I - NEITHER OF THEM ARE WOMEN AND THESE AREN'T THEIR SECRET LOVE CHILDREN WOULD YOU LOT SHUT IT ALREADY”

Robert held a hand to his temples, his face screwed into a scowl.

“We suspect they were testing some sort of potion and something went wrong, turning them both into children.”

“Both of them drank it?” “What kind of potion?” “Wait but why don’t they remember us?” “Are they stuck like this?”

“Stuck like what?”

He stiffened. For a moment he’d entirely forgotten he was still holding Henry in his arms.

The boy was looking up at him, wide red eyes searching his face for something.

“Are-are we, we didn’t…?”

Suddenly Lanyon realized they had been hiding it. He and Rachel hadn’t mentioned who they were, why they knew them, or the real reason they couldn't go home. Hell they had even left the kitchen earlier to talk out of earshot.

They hadn’t meant to keep it from them. Honestly hiding it hadn't crossed their minds, but, neither did telling them. 

It felt wrong somehow. Like they weren't planning on having them around long enough to have the need to explain it to them. 

The boys hadn't asked why they knew them, too young to really distrust them. They just assumed all adults knew everything.

Before he had to answer and make everything worse, Rachel cut in. Now free of the jostling crowd and finally making it to Frankenstein’s bedside.

“Er, so, you remember when we found you, and we knew your names?” she asked.

The boys nod slowly, quietly looking at her.

“Well, nobody told us your names, we know them because, well I guess you told us.

We’re friends. We have been for a while, but, you two are supposed to be adults. Like us. Your names are Edward Hyde and Dr. Henry Jekyll. And you work here at the society, like we do.”

Henry tightened his hands on Robert's sleeve, face unreadable.

Edward gaped at the woman, still standing on the bed.

“But- but we’re not, we didn't drink any potions. We were at home!”

“I know, I know this doesn’t make any sense, I’m sorry for that. But, this isn’t so bad is it? We can take care of you! We’re gonna find a way to fix this. Right?”

She glanced at Robert, who was tight-lipped and looking at his friend with a distracted look in his eyes.

“Uh, right.”

“That-That’s ridiculous!!”

Right. Frankenstein was still there.

Robert slowly composed himself, the smugness he felt in realizing the woman had been speechless that whole time fueling his salty soul.

As mad as she had looked earlier, it was a cold sort of anger. This? This sputtering rage was fuming.

“This boy cannot be Dr. Henry! He is a scientist! That blasted doctor is nothing but a-a-a shameful fake and a stain on the name of science itself! Henry Jekyll is a disgrace of an alchemist and false idol of respectability and hollowness!

I detest that horrible man!” She gestured to the boy in Robert's arms, “How dare you make the wild claim that he is…that…”

Her eyes widened as she saw the expression on said boy's face.

Everyone in the room stared in horror as both kids BURST into tears.

“What is <em>wrong</em> with you??”

Rachel grabbed Henry from Robert. Who was holding the sobbing boy as far away from himself as he possibly could. Then snatched Edward up under her other arm. Storming from the room in a hurry.

She could hear Lanyon and Frankenstein start shouting behind her, quickly joined by everyone else. 

Rachel kicked the door shut behind them and sprinted all the way to Jekyll’s office.

When they got there she had to put the boys down to open the door. 

They had stopped crying by now but were eerily silent. Both looking down at their feet.

“Don’t listen to Frankenstein, both of you. That old hag's hated Dr. Jay since she got here for no reason at all! She isn’t even a real doctor!” she huffed.

Her voice hammered through the silence in a way that almost made her regret speaking at all. But the boys didn’t so much as flinch.

Creasing her eyebrows in worry, Rachel led them to the side room she knew Jekyll usually slept in instead of his own house. She's not sure exactly how old they are right now but they were definitely young enough to need a nap after all that.

As the boys walked past her she snatched Edward up into a hug and <em>squeezed</em>.

He startled, kicking his legs around. “Hey! Stop doing that!”

“Goodness sakes you two! Do you have any idea how worried I was when you ran off? I have half a mind to lecture you for leaving like that! But…”  now wasn’t a good time to scold them, “ I’ll let it slide if you chickadees lay down without a fuss.” she promised, nodding to the bedroom.

Henry looked around the room, there wasn’t much to see. More red curtains blocking out the light, a single bed pushed up against the wall, and a rather large wardrobe. Like the office, there were a lot of books, either on shelves or just the floor. There were many frames on the walls but it was too dark to make out many details.

They didn’t have shoes to remove so Rachel set Edward down on the bed, Henry hopping up next to him.

Sniffing, the two nuzzled into the pillows quietly as Rachel tucked the blankets in around them. 

Rachel is leaning against the doorway between Jekyll’s office and room when she hears the doorknob rattle.

She startles a bit, instinctively reaching for the kitchen knife in her pocket. <em>I swear to god if that wretch hobbled all the way here just to-</em>

The office door swings open to reveal Lanyon.

He blinks when he sees her, but doesn’t look too surprised. Mostly he just looks tired.

Behind him was Ito, who followed him into the room silently. She nodded at Rachel in acknowledgement, who nodded back.

Rachel peeked into the room, still asleep.

She pushed off the doorframe and with a final glance back, gently closed the door.

Lanyon sighed, stopping at Jekyll’s desk.“I talked to the lodgers, they're not to tell anyone outside of the society about this. Ms. Ito has volunteered to take a look at whatever potion they drank.”

Ito, who had been drawn by the shouting, had been given a rundown by the other lodgers. And, unamused at the grown adults all talking over each other, waited politely til Lanyon was done to offer her services.

“Dr.Jekyll taught me everything I know, if anyone can figure out what went wrong it would be me.” she stated.

“Alright, we think this is the potion they took.” Robert grabbed the glass container lying on the desk to hand to Ito, “It was the only one out of place when we came in, though neither of us actually saw them drink it.”

She nodded, taking the glass and holding it to the light.

There was very little liquid left. It looked to be a dull brown at first but when she tilted in one way and the other there was an oily red and green residue around the edges.

She sniffed at the potion, the smell alone almost made her gag. An unholy mix of so much salt she could smell it and residual fumes that made her head spin. Frankly she's surprised the two men managed to swallow this at all. Though with the things she’s seen Hyde eat maybe she shouldn’t be.

Ito sighed, “This just doesn’t make any sense, Dr. Jekyll would have measured out exact amounts, and certainly taken it one at a time if they were testing something new. Unless it had a delayed reaction.”

“What if it wasn’t something new?” Rachel suggested, “What if they did this a lot and were more casual with it?”

“Maybe, but what would they be so casual with? Do they take the same medication?”

“Mm, not that I know of. Maybe not medicine then? I know Edward drinks random potions sometimes for the hell of it.” she laughed quietly, “One time he vomited some sort of green goo in my sink and ran all the way to Jekyll's office.”

“Not to mention we practically have to force Henry to take medicine when he <em>is</em> sick.” Robert offered. The only thing he knew of Jekyll self-medicating with was wine, and it didn't typically de-age people by almost thirty years.

Ito poked around the desk in silence. She knew Dr. Jekyll was usually a dedicated note-taker, but again, if this was something he did often there would be no reason to.

Frustratingly, the habit of putting ingredients away after herself that the doctor tried so hard to drill into her was working against them now.

Usually it meant that volatile materials weren't lying around waiting to be knocked over and cause messes, or even small explosions. But in this case it meant she had no idea what ingredients were used in this experiment.

Dammit. She sighed and turned to Rachel and Lanyon.

“Alright, so basically I have no clue what this was originally supposed to do, much less how it went wrong, much less how to reverse it. 

I can take a closer look at this with some equipment but this isn’t a lot to work with.”

The two looked at her in shock, like she’d grown another head.

Robert bit his lip, tiredness quickly replaced with nervous energy.

“Can’t you just, give them a potion that makes them older?” he asked.

Ito made a face. “I…don’t think that would be a good idea. If we forced them to grow up they still wouldn't have any of their old memories, they'd just be adult-shaped children. And that's <em>if</em> something like that would work and not mix negatively with whatever they've taken. For all we know this could be a temporary side effect, and changing anything would mess everything up.”

“So they just, won’t remember us? Everything we’ve done together, everything we’ve talked about, all the time we spent together is just gone?” Rachel cried, “There's nothing we can do to get them back?”

Robert clenched his fists on the desk.

Ito sighed, “I know this isn’t what you want to hear but I think the best thing to do is just try to wait this out.”

She refused to say something so terrible out loud, but there might not be a solution to this.

Lanyon’s expression is blank with shock, then twists into anger.

“Well are we just supposed to wait forever?! Wait for them to grow up naturally? What about our friends? Our- our-!”

Ito clenched her jaw, “They’re my friends too.” she snapped.

“Look, there’s not much I can do with the information we have, Dr. Lanyon.

Even if I knew what went wrong and how to reverse this we'd need a ton of body parts. One of the most basic rules of alchemy is that mass can't be made or destroyed and I’m not even sure where it went when they shrank!” she said, throwing her hands up.

The neo alchemist took what remained of the potion and walked out of the room, leaving the two leaning over the desk in despair.

“I'll keep working on it but please, don’t get your hopes up.”

She closed the office door behind her to give them some privacy.

[pedge-page]

I saw gladiator 2 and have some words (spoilers below)

Alright so I primary saw this for Pedro and knew he would have a short ish role right before going in. Leading up to the premiere though, i did kinda expected more given he was credited second as if he was gonna be a lot more pivotal.

I've got gripes with other parts of the movie (like I don't understand why lucius had to be maximus son but whatever) but im going to focus more on Pedro:

First, I saw a lot of people say Lucilla didn't deserve his love and I ....20000% agree.

That being said, I was hoping to see a lot more of him get defensive over her. I wanted Acacius to live at least towards the end, and have him watch HER die. The payout of his revenge and total mayhem against macrinus would have been waaaaay better. I live for drama and plot, ans you can't have a character who preaches how much he loves his wife and puts her first and NOT give us the ultimate extent of that. Having him die first, while yes I see how it furthered the rebellion, just felt very... hollow. Like we were missing a LOT. She's also didn't react very much which really emphasized how much she didn't reciprocate his devotion. Shit would have been a lot better if they fleshed her love for HIM over her rekindled love for lucius.

(Also she was like "I found my son again!" No ma'am he was enslaved and coincidentally brought here. You didn't "find" him. You didnt even search. Like please tell me why her love of him was so important if we don't even see it... movies are SHOW don't TELL!)

There's also clearly so many behind the scenes photos that were part of cut scenes of him. Ans you could tell the movie was cut at strange parts.

For instance, the scene where macrinus visits lucilla in her home was definitely longer. And it was cut so awkwardly. They were mid convo and then it cuts to macrinus talking to someone else about her son. acacius definitely was supposed to be in that scene, which would have furthered a drama between the three. Would they have known he was on to them? And again, macrinus deals the final blow to her. So having a LOT more personal space between all 3, especially if there's implication that acacius always comes to her rescue but WOULDN'T if he were dead, etc.... there could have been so much more to further that interpersonal conflict.

I also swear there was a deleted scene of young lucilla and acacius. There's photos of pedge in different armor we never see, his hair/beard is all dark and youthful (no streaks of white) and it's the same time lucilla sends lucius away. Like what happened? Is that how they meet? Did acacius see a young lucius already? God i wanted so much more out of them. Soooo much of the secondary plot was around them and they cut almost all of it to build their relationship just to get to the plot.

Also fuck lucilla "go risk everything to save my son who definitely hates me while I never really tried to find him" and acacius is like "Yes I will risk our entire plan in the works for years to to get his ass on a whim. I dont even know what he looks like"

And back to his death: i think it would have been so much better if he didn't die (or at least, survived the arena). I know the praetorian guard wasn't loyal to him but it would have been VERY interesting to see them NOT open fire on him. And then the emperor's are livid at the sheer lack of loyalty in their own ranks, which would then make lucius AND acacius need to fight together to get everyone in.

And then of course acacius watches lucilla get killed which yes, there would have been such better payout for that to see him lose the one thing hes devoted himself to. Her attachment with acacius was a lot stronger that lucius so macrinus being hunted by acacius wouod have been a lot more satisfying death than lucius dealing the final blow. It also would have served a much better alignment of lucius no longer hating acacius for everything about Rome, and fleshing out their common goal now is to avenge her.

Lucius was like "I never saw the man" but really that change in his attitude was after 3 sentences from acacius??? No. You gotta built that out. Lucius can't just change his mind simply because "i love your mother" when at this point lucius still resents her!

(Also felt like the budget ran out towards the end. Two giant armies facing up but all we see is a young guy beat up a old guy in a creek. I get the "big battle" was the first scene but shit.... it was a way better scene. You can't de-climax the final scene when you spent all your money in the first 10 minutes. )

Again, even in the actual movie, her death was sooo.... short. She got shot in the chest, and was able to speak perfectly clearly for her final words, and then I swear we don't even wait to see her DIE before lucius is just running off. Like what? You can't frame her to be so pivotal in these relationships to the plot and just brush her death off.

Anyway.

I left and was like "when are we getting a pedro movie where he's fleshed out and wins and gets the girl" and let me tell you the last time we got a fulfilling pedge role was tlou s1 and the next time.... all my chips are riding on fantastic 4. Because the next piece of pedro is fucking TLOu2 which doesn't inspire any confidence at all. And then the Materialist where he's once again gonna be a devote excellent husband and the girl chooses the loser waiter. Like fuck. Give my man a win??

Idk if he's gonna live past mandalorian movie but I discredit it a LOT because I really want to see Pedro's face and acting in the flesh. I dont want him to just be a voice role. His physical PRESENCE brings all his work to such a different elevation. Its just disappointing to only use his voice.

I wanted to go home and watch a happy pedro movie but it's Sucks that he's not been able to utilize his talent for the first 40 years of his life, so we only have such short span of movies and shows he's in. And he fucking LOSES IN SO MANY. Like ok fink the fox is it??? Really??? (And javi but I've seen tuwomt so much now. It's the only thing he's not dying in)

My final thoughts are.... i wanted more pedro. Yes because I'm a slut for him but also because it genuinely felt like the movie needed more of him. They used pretty much all his scenes in the trailers and promotion, leaving nothing new for us in the actual movie. He was the most interesting character. He brought the most stakes. His strain between lucilla and her son was the ultimate climax for me in this movie and it just....fizzled. I expected lucius and acacius to have a lot more going on between them to get more emotions out of both characters. Like cmon. Acaius literally ordered his wife's death in front of him. That's some heavy duty conjecture. Make it fucking personal, ridley!!!

But then lucius was like "ah I guess he was aight. Seemed pretty important dude to everyone else"

Anyway. Yes. That's my spin. Disappoint.

[carpetbug]

La Llorona (3.2k)

read below or on ao3 • [tw: attempted drowning]

“It was true that he didn’t remember when he learned to swim, but he did remember his mother teaching him. That was a big part of why he was quickly getting tired of the topic matter at hand.”

“I don’t really remember when I learned how to swim,” Adrien shrugged, chin resting on his right hand as he passed the few remaining minutes of class conversing with his friends. Alya’s face turned down into a playful frown at his response, clearly unsatisfied with such a weak answer. Marinette watched the conversation in amusement while mindlessly chewing on a pencil—one already covered in teeth marks. They had all already told their own stories: Nino had been a natural swimmer, Marinette had to take a few years of swimming lessons, and Alya had told some kind of story about almost drowning at a water park with her older sister. Adrien hadn’t been able to follow that one very well.

“You can’t even remember bits and pieces?” she prompted. He felt like he was in some weird interview.

“Maybe you were just born knowing how to do everything, huh?” Nino teased from beside him before poking him with an elbow. He had started the conversation in the first place by mentioning how his little brother Chris had just started swimming lessons. Apparently, Chris was not enjoying them.

Adrien shrugged again, not entirely wanting to try and muster up bygone memories. “Oh, I don’t know, I must have learned at the hotel's pool with Chloe,” he awkwardly explained, trying to string together a story his friends would believe. When he really tried to remember, all he could see was fragmented pictures of his maman in her swimsuit, arms outstretched in a shallow pool that lapped around her waist. He could smell, slightly taste, the chlorine. It was true that he didn’t remember when he learned to swim, but he did remember his mother teaching him. That was a big part of why he was quickly getting tired of the topic matter at hand.

“Ugh, understood. If I had grown up being best friends with that girl I would also try to forget it,” Nino joked, making Alya and Marinette laugh. Adrien copied the sound—he had given up trying to justify Chloe’s place in his life, and even he wasn’t entirely sure she belonged there anymore—but the laugh he let out wasn’t nearly convincing enough.

Three pairs of eyes were immediately on him, stunning him into silence. It was like he had failed some invisible test.

The quiet held for a second too long before they started blurting apologies.

“Shit, dude, I’m sorry! I shouldn’t have said that, I know Chloe’s your friend and—”

“Yeah we didn’t mean to laugh, Adrien, we weren’t thinking.”

Marinette opened her mouth to begin her explanation when Adrien anxiously shut them down. “Guys, guys, it’s okay! I know you guys don’t like Chloe, but I also know you guys respect our friendship. It’s fine, really,” he assured them, squeezing Ninos shoulder comfortingly as he talked. “Anyways—,” he was desperate to get the attention off him “Why is Chris hating swim lessons?”

Nino laughed and began flapping his hands excitedly in the air, the previous tension quickly forgotten. “You’re never going to believe this, he’s scared of ‘La Llorona’.”

“‘The crying woman’? Isn’t she some kind of, like, Mexican folklore story to scare little kids?” Alya questioned, leaning towards her boyfriend enthusiastically.

“That’s exactly what I said! I was like ‘Chris, bro, we live in Paris. She’s all the way in Mexico, busy doing ghost things, no way she’s going to get you.’ But he’s convinced she’s out to find him! I don’t even know where he learned about it,” Nino recounted, laughing as he went. Maybe it was kinda childish to be scared of a ghost in a distant country; but in Chris’s defense, Adrien also felt uneasy about ghosts.

The idea of being haunted made his skin crawl.

“I’ve never heard of her. What’s the folklore?” he asked curiously, interest piqued.

“It’s actually kind of a gruesome story,” Marinette spoke up, but quickly looked like she regretted it as eyes turned to her. She looked down at her hands and fidgeted with the chewed pencil as she continued. “There’s a lot of different versions, but the most common one is a woman fell in love with a wealthy man, had his children, caught him cheating, and drowned their kids out of rage. Then she regretted it and drowned herself out of guilt, leaving her weeping ghost to haunt rivers and streams, crying out for her children. It’s usually used to keep kids away from bodies of water, especially at night. Supposedly if you hear her sobs, she’ll find you, then drown you when she realizes you aren’t her child.” Marinette shivered with the final sentence, clearly recalling something. She combed her fingers through a pigtail and let out a tense giggle. “My grandma goes on trips all over the world. She went to Mexico when I was in kindergarten, then decided to tell me that story when she got back. I was scared of the seine for months, so I can’t really blame Chris.”

“Your parents must have been mad.” Alya smirked.

“My mom definitely was! She was convinced I would never get over it, and I’d have a fear of water all my life. I forgot about it when summer came around and I got to go to the pool.” The girls were talking now, carried away with their own conversation.

Adrien didn’t mind. He was busy mulling over the new story.

“—rien? Adrien!” Nino shook him hard, eyeing him up and down like his friend had done something suspicious. It felt almost invasive, and made Adrien squirm in his seat. “Dude, you’re out of it. What are you thinking about?”

He stopped, and thought for a moment. Then the words got the better of him and before he could stop it the question spilled out. “Do you think she loved them?” Adrien asked, eyes locked with Nino’s.

“Who? The—La Llorona? I mean, I guess she loved her kids. All parents do, right?”

“No, I mean—I mean do you think she did it because she loved them?”

Adrien’s attention turned to the phone in his hand, a notification lighting up his lockscreen. It usually rotated through different pictures he had picked out, but right now it was settled on one of him and his mother. “Do you think she drowned them because she loved them, maybe just too much?”

Before Nino could respond, the bell rang out. Class was over, Adrien needed to go home, and Nino had to take Chris to his swim lesson.

✧⋄⋆⋅⋆⋄✧⋄⋆⋅⋆⋄✧⋄⋆⋅⋆⋄✧⋄⋆⋅⋆⋄✧⋄⋆⋅⋆⋄✧⋄⋆⋅⋆⋄✧⋄⋆⋅⋆⋄✧⋄⋆⋅⋆⋄✧

Maman looked so pretty in the pool. The way her hair shined in the sun, and the corners of her mouth wrinkled when she smiled. The clear, bright blue water that stopped at her knees. The thin silver band on her left ring finger reflected the sun brightly, as did the silver feather earrings dangling from her ears. She always wore jewelry. Her green eyes reminded him of the grass that grew beside water in the books she’d read him. It made him happy to have the same green eyes.

Adrien was four years old, right at the age where he was blathering out any words he could, and consciously exploring all the different sensations that came with being alive. But today he had a swimming lesson, which meant listening to his mother.

Emilie stood, merely a foot away on the second step, cooing and trying to coax her living ball of sunshine to dip a foot in the pool. “Adrien, darling, I promise the pool won’t hurt you,” she assured, leaning over and slipping a few fingers into his palm to grasp. He did so tightly, then slowly stepped down onto the first step into the pool. It was cool, almost ticklish, against his skin and thankfully only rose to his shins at this height.

“See!” she smiled, almost purring the words. She pulled her fingers from his grasp, lowered to the bottom step, and splashed the summer water towards her little student. He giggled and shielded his face, though the splash only reached his stomach. “Next step, now.”

Adrien’s laugh caught in his throat. The next step was deep, too deep, but… she was standing right there, lip-glossed smile beaming at him.

She wouldn’t make him go too deep. Maman was safe.

He stepped forward cautiously, missing the tight grip he had on her hand just before, and slowly found his footing. The water now pooled just above his hips, the sloshing waves from their movement gently pulling him this way and that. His arms hovered above the water's surface at his sides, refusing to fall victim to the pool just yet.

“You’re a natural, little minnow!” Emilie cheered, then sucked in her cheeks and pursed her lips to make a kissy face, trying to imitate a fish. Only she looked more like she had bitten into a much too sour lemon, which made Adrien laugh again, even harder this time. His arms dropped slightly and an elbow dipped into the water, making him squeal suddenly.

“It’s cold, Maman!” he whimpered, wanting to retreat back to the shaded table where their towels and pool supplies resided while they swam. Adrien’s gaze was locked over his shoulder on the dry, warm spot a few feet away when Emilie snapped her fingers to get his attention again.

It worked immediately.

“Darling, it’s the perfect temperature. Don’t let the water scare you,” she comforted him, reaching out again to offer a hand to hold. Adrien’s smaller hand took it urgently. “Last step.”

If the previous step had come anywhere close to scary, the last step was utterly daunting. Plunging one foot further into the depths of the water, the surface rose up to his chin. When he tried to lift his other foot it felt rooted to the concrete stair that held him above the water, and he couldn’t find the strength to rip off the bandaid. Thankfully, Emilie had strength to spare for her minnow, and using her free hand she hooked two fingers around his ankle, then sternly pulled it to the final step.

“Ah-ah-ah,” she cooed in her sing-songy voice, hands receding from the young boys’ space again before pushing at the bottom of his chin. His mouth opened to protest but she tilted his head back, letting his golden hair fall and soak up the chlorine-rich water..

Now the water lapped at the edges of his face as he stood, tiptoed, and tilted back. He looked up towards the sky, closing his eyes to block out the harsh sun, and urgently trying not to panic over the water sloshing in his ears. His arms floated in the water at his sides, and he was too aware of the open space where nothing could be grabbed onto. Adrien could hardly hear Emilie, if she was singing her praises at all, but if it was because of his submerged ears or his racing heart he couldn’t tell. After a few seconds—a few too many for small Adrien—she plucked him from the step and placed him on her hip, giving him a moment to rub the water from his hair and ears.

“Wonderful, mon bébé!” She was laughing as she whirled him through the pool, hands tucked under his armpits as they spun in excited circles. “Was that so bad?”

Adrien waited until they stilled to respond. “My ears went under the water,” he muttered, trying to balance in her grasp and holding onto her shoulders. “My eyes were closed, too. I was scared.”

Emilie pouted, maybe trying to give him a sympathetic frown, but it only made him feel smaller. It was the kind of look that a passersby gave a baby throwing a tantrum. “You’re okay,” she assured gently, holding him against her chest and lifting a hand from the water to push a wet strand of golden hair from his forehead. He leaned into the touch of her palm. “When you’re with Maman or Père, you’re always okay.” Their eyes locked and Emilie’s smile dropped. Her left thumb slowly grazed over her ring when she continued. “You know that, right, little minnow?”

The words spilled out before he even knew what he was going to say. “Yes, Maman.”

Yes, he was okay so long as Maman and Papa were there. Mother and Father would always keep him safe.

“Wonderful, darling. Now, let’s try doggy paddling.”

✧⋄⋆⋅⋆⋄✧⋄⋆⋅⋆⋄✧⋄⋆⋅⋆⋄✧⋄⋆⋅⋆⋄✧⋄⋆⋅⋆⋄✧⋄⋆⋅⋆⋄✧⋄⋆⋅⋆⋄✧⋄⋆⋅⋆⋄✧

It had been a grueling hour in the pool, consisting mainly of Adrien clinging either to his mother’s shoulders or the wall of the pool. The doggy paddling had been too scary, treading water was too exhausting, and floating on his back was too overwhelming.

Worst of all, Emilie was starting to get angry. She had even screamed at him when he tried clambering out of the pool.

Adrien hated making Maman angry. Her eyebrows would twitch when she furrowed them together, and she often brought a hand up to pinch the bridge of her nose in frustration. It made him feel stupid, and wrong, like he had broken some rule. Sometimes—though Adrien wouldn’t admit it for many years to come—it made him angry too. Angry enough to want to rip piano keys out of their places. Angry enough to want to destroy things with a single touch.

Angry enough to try and climb out of the pool during a swimming lesson. Which was, of course, unacceptable.

“Honestly, Adrien, you’re behaving like a brat! Are you stupid?” She snapped, top lip pulled back in a snarl, letting her canines shine in the sun. Adrien could feel them closing in on him. Even at her worst, he only wanted her to hold him close. It never really mattered if he was alive or dead when she did it—he just wished she wouldn’t yell.

“I’m scared, M-Maman!” He hiccuped, clinging desperately to the roughly textured wall. It stung the pruning skin of his fingers, threatening to cut his raw fingertips. Adrien didn't notice over his own sobs and wracked breathing.

“Stop crying already!” Emilie lunged forward to rip her son from the wall, ignoring his wails of refusal. He urgently grabbed for the wall as she carried him towards the middle of the water, muttering under her breath. The only things Adrien could pick up was ‘useless fucking kid’ and ‘made you to be better than this’.

The words didn’t fully register in his panic-stricken brain. The only thing he knew for certain was real in that moment was the steady stream of warm tears pouring from his eyes. Until Maman reached out, palm cupping his tear stained cheek, and gently wiped at the droplets clinging to his eyelashes. Adrien’s eyes opened and took her in, eyes half-lidded and eyebrows pressed together. She was as comforting as she was terrifying, which was an intense combination of emotions for four year old Adrien.

“Don’t make me repeat myself again. There’s nothing to be scared of,” she said intensely.

It made the tears stop and hiccups pause—it even took some of his breath away. Adrien’s mother was like a being of pure emotion, raw and untethered, changing at the snap of her fingers. Emilie could play people like a violin, and this was her philosophy when it came to maternal matters.

“Nothing to be scared of,” he whispered in repetition, eyes still glued to hers. His muscles relaxed, and he softened into his mothers hold. Truthfully, Adrien always thought it was much more comfortable once he stopped fighting.

Emilie smiled and nodded, then turned to look at the empty pool around them. Her hair was still radiant in the sun, but now the ends had gotten soggy and knotted as they dipped in and out of the water.

“M-Maman, can we stop now?” Adrien asked softly, unable to stop the trembling pout his lips formed. “Please?”

She blinked. Swallowed, then clicked her tongue against her teeth. It was a nauseating sound. “Only if you can swim, little minnow.” His body froze when her eyes targeted back onto him, his stomach turning when he saw her gaping smile. “Show me how you swim.”

In the blink of an eye, Adrien was forced under the surface, water overtaking his mouth and nose before he even thought to close or cover them. It stung, like a wasp had crawled through his throat and made a nest in his lungs, infesting him from the inside out. He gasped for air, desperate to cool the burning taking hold of his chest, but only inhaled water.

He was screaming, crying, violently thrashing in the water as he tried to breach the surface. The sounds only left his mouth in muted air bubbles, floating past his vision to the surface his body screamed for. But it was useless against the tightly gripped hand around his throat.

Maybe Maman just couldn’t hear him when he was so deep under the water. Maman wouldn’t mean to hurt him.

The water churned against his limbs, thwarting his efforts to kick and paddle back to air. He was quickly losing hope that there was any kind of escape. This is what baby birds who fall from their nest too early must feel like. Weak, defenseless, kicking and screaming and fighting to stay alive in a terrain that only wants them dead.

At least those birds can breathe.

Adrien stopped fighting when fatigue overtook him. His legs went limp and arms crossed his torso, enveloping himself in a tight hug under the water. There was some comfort to be found in that, even in the worst situations. He let the water envelop him, too tired to continue. His muscles eased, repeating the lesson he’d learned just before. Pain and terror are so much more comfortable once you stop trying to fight them.

His eyes closed. His body stopped screaming.

Then it was over.

Fresh air swarmed his lungs, bringing up the chlorinated water he’d swallowed. It tasted like stomach acid and summer.

“My poor little minnow,” Emilie murmured as she sat him on the wall of the pool. He coughed and gagged as she slowly rubbed his back, occasionally raising her hand to pet his soaked, ruffled hair. Her voice—usually spilling over with emotion—was monotone and brief, like she was stating a fact. There was no comfort in her words, only recognition that he was suffering. No apology, no explanation. No loving coos and empty promises of safety. Only a mother and her son.

“I-I couldn’t breathe, why Ma—” he sputtered, coughing and stumbling over the words.

She cut him short.“I already said, Adrien. No more squalling.”

He was quiet. His lungs still ached and his throat felt like it was burning, but his lips remained sealed. Any screams or cries were trapped out of his reach.

“You’re okay, aren’t you? No blood, no bruises. Good as new.” She beamed at him. “Nothing bad happened, darling. Let’s get you toweled off and head inside for lunch. You can learn to swim tomorrow.”

Emilie swam through the pool, leaving Adrien sitting on the edge. He watched her silently as she ascended the steps out of the water and made her way to him, then plucked him from the ground like a feather. He usually loved when Maman would carry him around on her hip. This time he felt like a prisoner of sorts, anchored to her side while his own emotions, thoughts, and wants were cast aside to cater to his warden.

“Yes, Maman.”

[skyeblue8]

𝓐ɳყσɳҽ Ɛɬടҽ Ƒιɳԃ ι𝜏 ｴɳ𝜏ҽɾҽട𝜏ιɳց... ♚

⋆⋆⃟⊱✪⃝⃞⃝⊰⋆⃟⋆ ⋆⋆⃟⊱✪⃝⃞⃝⊰ ⋆⃟⋆⋆⋆⃟⊱✪⃝⃞⃝⊰ ⋆⋆⃟⊱✪⃝⃞⃝⊰⋆⃟⋆

The one time a likely villainous and "ugly" character is brought up in Helluva Boss, he just so happens to be portrayed as "plus-sized". Both were words Viv used to describe this man, and honestly I find it hilarious. 😂 Not because bigger people can't also be villains, I mean just look at Eric Cartman, but rather that the one time she breaks from her usual standard of drawing skinny twinks, this is what she thinks an ugly person looks like. Someone who looks like Fizz but rich, bigger, and with more limbs. (P.S. No offense to Fizz lovers, but if anyone's ugly it's him, imo).

But like everyone has said, it's disappointing that this was the best she could do in terms of an intimating, evil figure (who's probably not going to be any of those things, knowing her.) I mean, we've seen true hideousness in her characters, just take Alastor:

Side note, in slight defense of Viv, regarding the fans who have complained about our complaining of Bee not being plus-sized, saying we would've called her fat phobic if she was, I honestly have to agree, as that's partially what's happening now with a few of us. Not all, just some. That being said, it just feeds in to my disappointment that she made both her and Asmodeus good people, as now the only villainous Sin who we're meant to hate is a bigger size, and kinda indirectly feels targeted.

⋆⋆⃟⊱✪⃝⃞⃝⊰⋆⃟⋆ ⋆⋆⃟⊱✪⃝⃞⃝⊰ ⋆⃟⋆⋆⋆⃟⊱✪⃝⃞⃝⊰ ⋆⋆⃟⊱✪⃝⃞⃝⊰⋆⃟⋆

[if-loki-was-a-fox]

I've seen a decent chunk of fics where Tim is Not Dead in s4, just for the sake of it, so I keep kinda pondering how that would've worked out, and how that would change depending on how exactly it happens

like if he just flat out survived, like Basira did, mostly unharmed, and was stuck waiting through the horrors for Jon to wake up for six months with everyone else, would he just keep on with hating Jon / hate him even more than before? could seeing Jon spend six months dead and then be shunned by everyone else somehow be enough to make him sympathetic to Jon again? would missing him be enough? or would he be even more upset and angry about the whole "you're not the same person, whatever you are you're not jon" thing that everyone else was so edgy about?

what if he also had his own coma, or other extended recovery period, or even had to become an Avatar himself to survive too? if he also had to trade his humanity for survival, would he stick by Jon through solidarity of that choice? could he even be the one to tell Jon about that choice, instead of Oliver Banks? or would he just be even madder seeing it as Jon put him in that situation where he had to make that choice? if he were just injured but didn't become an avatar, would that effect his attitude to Jon?

if Tim were around would Peter Lukas have considered him as a target, instead of Martin? if so, would he have chosen him? would Tim have prevented Martin from being taken in by Peter Lukas? would his anger have turned on Martin without Jon there to take it instead, and chased him to him sooner and harder?

if Tim were around for any part of Jon's Daisy Rescue Plan would he have encouraged or discouraged it? and why? what about the plan would bother him most? the risk to Jon's life, or just the risk that it wouldn't work? would he care if Jon went in without waiting for Basira to return? would he go in with Jon? would he help Martin pile tapes for Jon to find his way back?

how would he feel about Daisy's return? "we both almost died in the unknowing" solidarity, or "you're still a monster / you weren't here" anger, or "you're not a strong defense/weapon anymore" disappointment? would Daisy be able to bring Tim and Jon together if their relationship was still strained, being the between of "we suffered for six months after almost dying in the unknowing" and "we're both trying not be monsters while the rest of our companions shun us"? or if they were friends again would she be pushed to the side because Jon already had Tim, or even worse, put a wedge between them if Tim hated her for being a cruel and evil person before and Jon related to her through monster solidarity?

during the six month gap, would Tim and Basira bond over the loss of their closest companions (Sahsa and Daisy)? would Tim resent Basira for being disappointed by how Daisy had changed, even though it was at least still her, unlike Not!Sasha, "how dare you grieve someone who's still here"?

would Tim and Melanie get along? would they commiserate over their anger, or would they tear into each other over it? would they bond over "trapped in this horrid fucking place by Jon" solidarity?

I wish I were more of a Tim understander so I could ponder it more substantially