#Even when he knows it's wrong

[amethystina]

Hello ˚ʚ♡ɞ˚

I hope you’re doing better, both physically and mentally. I know you’ve been through a lot recently, and I truly hope you’re finding moments of peace and comfort in this difficult time.

I wanted to reach out because I usually connect with your thoughts on The Devil Judge, and I’m curious to see if we align on this perspective as well. I've noticed that many in the fandom view Yohan as being kinder and more selfless than he seems, believing he truly cares about people and their struggles. But from my perspective, it feels different. I think Yohan recognizes others' pains, but it doesn’t necessarily mean he empathizes deeply with them or feels much sympathy.

What do you think?

it’s always a pleasure to hear your thoughts.

May the rest of your day be filled with moments of calm and joy.

Hi there 💜

Unfortunately, I'm not doing the greatest but, well, that's sort of the norm right now? It could be worse, in all honesty. Me and my wife have some friends visiting from our university days, though, which is lovely! But that also means I'm going to be even more absent from here this coming week. Just a head's up.

Anyhow! Since I don't really read fics or metas for The Devil Judge I admit that I don't know what the consensus of the fandom is on any given subject. Except, perhaps, what I can glimpse in comments on my fics or in the asks I receive here on Tumblr. This means that whatever opinions I express are usually my own without influence from anyone else, which makes them very subjective, pretty limited, and, perhaps, not as well-rounded as if I had spent time discussing them with someone else. And I just want everyone to remember that whenever I answer one of these asks.

These are my opinions but I'm not going to claim that I'm right or that my thoughts are the only valid ones. They might, in fact, be spectacularly wrong since I never run them by anyone before I express them.

So, with that out of the way: Yo Han is not a kind man.

That's not to say that he's incapable of compassion or empathy, but his ability to relate to other people is, at the very least, severely stunted. I know that some think that he must have an antisocial personality disorder but, personally, I'm not comfortable diagnosing him with anything. I'm just not qualified to make that kind of assessment.

But what I can say is that he's definitely not a very considerate man.

But, as with all things Yo Han, the subject is a little more complex than that — and stems back to his childhood and past trauma.

To make a long story short, I think that Yo Han is emotionally mature and intelligent enough to recognise right from wrong. I also agree with you that he can see when people are in pain and, in some ways, probably relate to them. But what he actually does with that information depends entirely on who the person is and what scale we're talking about.

Because, as we see in the drama, Yo Han doesn't really care what happens to the people outside of his small, chosen circle. He was clearly shaken when Han So Yoon was kidnapped and K died, for example, but the unidentifiable mass of "the Korean people" doesn't interest him as much. Yo Han is incredibly loyal, yes, and capable of a fierce, all-consuming kind of love, but it's reserved for a selected few.

As for everyone else?

Not his problem.

And while that's pretty uncaring — ruthless, even — I think it's in part because of his childhood. He was so isolated that he can't really relate to people, only made worse by the fact that his mind probably doesn't work like most people's do. So even if he deeply loves someone, his empathy is still a bit patchy. He's used to pushing through pain and heartache and doesn't quite seem to understand that other people aren't — or at least not to the extent that he does it. Yo Han is a master at compartmentalising but doesn't understand that he's an outlier in that.

And so his ability to relate to people and understand their pain is severely limited. Because he's not working with the same variables as everyone else. Something that will barely faze him is enough to completely break someone else and despite being so clever, I don't think he understands that.

And it's even worse when you look at it on a wider scale. He's even less sympathetic when it's people he doesn't know personally and, quite frankly, I don't think he wants to care about nameless strangers. Yo Han protects and sympathises with the people closest to him — the ones he can see and touch and feel — but he doesn't waste emotional or mental bandwidth on everyone else. In some ways, he might not be capable of that. Because, again, the isolation he was put through as a child probably left quite a lot of scars and made him unable to connect with people in a healthy way.

He's not like Ga On, who genuinely cares about the fate of the common man and their country as a whole. I think that Yo Han sees the suffering and clearly doesn't mind doing a kind act here and there when he gets the opportunity — like donating the prison warden's money — but I still wouldn't call him a kind or a considerate man. He can be but also chooses not to be more often than not.

It doesn't come instinctively to him the way it does for Ga On.

Again, that's not to say that Yo Han doesn't know how to be kind — of course he does — but I don't think he views it the same way most people do. It's almost as if he thinks that kindness is a finite resource and therefore hesitates to waste it on people he doesn't care about on a personal level.

So no, I don't think he genuinely cares about other people's struggles and pain to the degree most people do. But it's not necessarily because he's evil or anything like that, but rather because he's so guarded. I've touched on it a couple of times in Who Holds the Devil, but I think that Yo Han is very cautious to reveal what he wants or admit when he cares about someone, simply because he's afraid of having it taken away or losing the person in question.

And if he were to care about every suffering citizen in South Korea the way Ga On does? I don't think Yo Han could handle that. I think he's shielding himself from that kind of commitment out of sheer self-preservation because every time he cares about someone, he leaves himself vulnerable for heartbreak. And he's not really equipped to deal with that heartbreak should it happen (again: emotionally stunted and childhood trauma)

In some ways, I think Yo Han is too scared to fully care about other people and, even when he does, he's always bracing himself for what he thinks is the inevitable pain of losing them.

But he does want to connect with people. Which means that he can probably learn to be more considerate of people he doesn't love on a personal level, but, again, I'm not sure if he wants to. At least not during the drama or even shortly after it. I think Yo Han is perfectly fine with being the way he is. He doesn't want to be a hero and has no interest in philanthropy — aside from how it might boost his reputation or, alternatively, punish those he thinks are behaving badly (like the prison warden).

But a couple of years down the line if he and Ga On are a couple? I think that Ga On could wear him down enough that Yo Han regularly donates to good causes and such. But Yo Han would do it more because he wants to indulge Ga On than out of any feeling of responsibility of his own. Because, when it comes down to it, I think Yo Han doesn't have any love and devotion to spare for the people outside his immediate circle. Taking care of them is difficult enough what with his upbringing and struggles to understand relationships.

Just like Yo Han says in the drama: I don't care if humanity falls as long as I have you two.

That's what he cares about most and even if he's capable of kindness and compassion, he saves it for the people he thinks matter. But even then I don't think he can empathise as deeply as most people would. Because he just doesn't understand that not everyone has his ability to compartmentalise and briskly deal with their emotions and trauma. I suspect that he thinks that Ga On is a bit too emotional a lot of the time. And even if Yo Han loves Ga On with every fibre of his being, he also thinks that Ga On's inability to control his emotions is both impractical and annoying — maybe even silly. Because Yo Han just doesn't get it.

He can't put himself in Ga On's shoes or understand that some people are just more emotional and need more frequent outlets for said emotions.

So yeah. I don't think that Yo Han is a particularly compassionate or considerate person, and he struggles to fully understand the people he loves, too. It's easier for him to be kind to them, at least, but he can't really empathise with them, either. But I would argue that it's not really his fault so much as a result of his childhood, all the trauma, and how he is a person. And it doesn't mean he's incapable of love or taking care of people — he's just very selective and, sometimes, he'll stumble because he doesn't understand what the fuck is going on x'D

In short: He's a disaster, your honour.

[hinamie]

big fan of panels where they look like they wld beat me up

[kenneth-black]

“he’s so insane for this” and it’s just a man looking at the love of his life 🤭

[turtletoria]

the krampus incident from the book of bill if it was out of character and stupid

[puppyeared]

can i offer you some furries in this trying time

@laikascomet

[inkydiamonds]

I HAVE REALIZED SOMETHING.

So. For people who are not Ethoslab watchers, in his most recent episode he showed off these beautiful statues Joel supposedly made of Etho in front of his house.

I figured Joel built them, and it seems Etho did too, because he sent Joel a message via mail about them.

This note... honestly surprised me a bit? I didn't think much of it at first, but the tone of it felt out of place. Obviously these two have this ongoing bit of being obsessed with each other, and they've done nothing recently but yes-and to the sun about it. This note seems to almost shut this bit down, saying "this bit hasn't gone too far yet, because I'm showing this on camera, but it's getting there." Which is a possible explanation for this note! But considering all they've done recently it feels very sudden.

And then. Joel claimed to not have built the statues. "Oh," I thought. "Joel is claiming not to have built the statues because he doesn't want to seem obsessed." Makes sense. Or maybe he *didn't* build the statues and someone is pranking them. That also makes sense.

But it was only when watching Joel talk about it on Impulse's stream, when I heard Joel say "honestly, I think Etho might have done it," that it clicked.

Oh.

This motherfucker.

He 100% did. That's why the message is so weird. Ethoslab built statues of himself outside Joel's base, messaged him via mail saying "that's kinda weird bro" and then DIDN'T EVER REVEAL THAT HE BUILT THEM. Oh my god THIS MAN...

From Etho's audience's perspective it just looks like Joel was continuing being obsessed with Etho, as usual, just another example in a long list. But *Joel* knows he didn't do that and *Etho* knows Joel will figure out who did. This mischievous motherfucker. Oh my godddd I hate them. Listening to him read back the note with that little smile in his voice. I am unwell. Why are they LIKE this

[inkskinned]

he says i hate everyone except you and that is addictive and that is kind of romantic and beautiful because you're young and you're kind of a sarcastic asshole too and you don't like bad boys, per say, but you don't really like good ones either. and you like that you were the exception, it felt like winning.

except life is not a romance book, and he was kind of being honest. he doesn't learn to be nice to your friends. he only tolerates your family. you have to beg him to come with you to birthday parties, he complains the whole time. you want to go on a date but - people are often there, wherever you're going. he's just so angry. about everything, is the thing. in the romance book, doesn't he eventually soften? can't you teach him, through your own sense of whimsy and comfort?

at first - you know introverts often need smaller friend groups, and honestly, you're fine staying at home too. you like the small, tidy life you occupy. you're not going to punish him for his personality type.

except: he really does hate everyone but you. which means he doesn't get along with his therapist. which means he has no one to talk to except for you. which means you take care of him constantly, since he otherwise has no one. which means you sometimes have to apologize for him. which means he keeps you home from seeing your friends because he hates them. you're the single exception.

about a decade from this experience, you'll type into google: how to know if a relationship is codependent.

he wraps an arm around you. i hate everyone except you. these days, you're learning what he's actually confessing is i have very little practice being kind.

[starry-bi-sky]

danyal al ghul memes because i don't think i've done those yet for this au.

(the jason one is in reference to the fanon headcanon/au that Jason and Damian potentially knew each other and interacted while jason was in the league. I've thought about it before in context of this au, but haven't thought about it enough to feel inspired or motivated to make a post exploring the idea)

(diablito means, as you can guess, 'little devil'. while i'm neutral to latino jason, i think the nickname is cute as fuck and was danny's main nickname from Jason. i don't wanna touch that timeline so im not gonna decide how old they were when Jason was there.)

Skulker: i am the ghost zone's greatest hunter! i capture and hunt creatures both rare and dangerous. Danyal: a poacher?? you're a poacher?? you poach animals??Skulker:...i sense i've made a mistake of some kind.

anyways that was the day that Skulker cemented himself as Danny's no.1 opp, and still remains there to this day even if he and Vlad are both viciously fighting for second. Out of everyone in the the AP rogues gallery, Skulker will be the first to be thrown under the bus in terms of 'o shit here comes phantom fucking RUN'.

[heich0e]

baby yuuji didn't start walking until well after he should have hit the developmental milestone because SOMEONE (uncle sukuna) always picked him up and carried him everywhere

[obsessedwithstarwars]

Question for the DP fandom:

Do you think Danny’s hair turns white when it falls out? It’s technically dead cells anyway but when it naturally falls off his head, do you think it turns white? Because I think it would be hilarious if his hairbrush just has white hair, no black strands whatsoever, and his significant other thought the worst until they know his secret.

[littlefankingdom]

It's funny how in fanfics, people write Clark giving parenting advices to Bruce, when in the comics (see: World's Finest: Batman and Superman) and other media (see: Young Justice), Bruce is the one giving parenting advices to Clark, and he is always very serious about it.

After all, Bruce has been a father figure and mentor for longer and more kids than Clark. Of course he doesn't need to call Clark for help to learn how to take care of his kids, Clark is the one calling Bruce for help when he has an issue and Ma Kent is busy.

[ciderjacks]

infantilization

[bunnieswithknives]

erm can we see more deer dale he's so silly

Deer Dale!!! Now with full antler face like I initially intended but could not figure out how to draw at the time

[arktic-rage]

honestly I absolutely love the Avvar in Jaws of Hakkon. How they worship the gods, how they view the world around them, how accepting they are and just how interesting they are too. I absolutely despise how the Inquisitor and Companions make commentary as if they're stupid or wrong in their beliefs, or that they're "just crazy people who worship spirits".

The dialogue you don't choose or even the ones you do are on the line of condescending, and it's frankly insulting, especially that all options on the dialogue wheel fall on that line.

the Avvar are so fucking cool, I hate we only get a DLC with them. (I also miss the Chasind - I wish they weren't forgotten or left in the dirt by BioWare :( )

[dykedvonte]

You ever just see a Mouthwashing take that makes you want to bang your head into a wall? I literally just saw someone claim Curly couldn't have been emotionally abused by Jimmy before the crash because he was in a higher position of power than Jimmy.

-Shrimp Anon

The mouthwashing fandom has shown me that people genuinely do believe that certain types of abuse are not as detrimental as other types especially when they deem those immune/resistant, ergo, believing one is objectively worse no matter how it affects the person nor the intersections of power, history and dynamics at play.

Get ready cause this is a yap session:

Cause like it's heavily implied that Curly and Jimmy's friendship was toxic and abusive, pointedly in the direction of how Jimmy uses Curly's belief/comfort in him. Curly wasn't forced to enable Jimmy but he was emotional and mentally on edge around him in almost every scene in some way. Mental and emotional abuse are not contingent on what positions you have at work. Yeah, he's Jimmy's boss but he was Jimmy's friend first and it's like getting into Psych discussion to talk about how social power tends to overshadow any perceived organizational power in the human mind. People are concerned about their jobs ofc but they tend to hang onto and put more value/investment into their personal relationships, hence why there tends to be laws and restrictions around mixing the two.

I always see the sentiments that "Curly is a grown ass man", "Curly is bigger than Jimmy", "Curly is Jimmy's boss", "He just needed a backbone" as criticisms of Curly and while I do agree that on the surface level all of these to be true and viable ways Curly could've taken more control of the situation, I often look at the parallels of Anya and Curly as victims of Jimmy pre/post crash.

The way Jimmy talks to Anya post crash is how he talked to Curly in the pre-crash segments. It's hard to pin-point mainly because we know he hates and wants nothing to do with Anya compared to his contrary but similarly handled obsessions with Curly. It's a weird sort of "honey-moon" effect of abuse Jimmy does in terms of emotional and mental victimization. He is always horrid to Anya, always talking down or questioning her abilities and thoughts in a situation, this of course includes the harassment and assault. However, he has a moment of attempted gentleness/conditioning when he question her about the mouthwash when she's contemplating drinking it at the table. The key difference is he has no personal investment in Jimmy outside wanting nothing to do with him, meaning there is no sort of romanticized version of him that he can condition her off of. He knows this, hence, why he always reverts to trying to make her to scared to oppose him.

This sort of give and take of "kindness" doesn't work on her because she knows he is just doing it to take more from her than whatever he could possibly give but it reflects even the "softer" scenes between him and Curly where he always rewords or rephrases Curly's sentiments and concerns to sound more shallow. He is feigning a deeper understanding by reworking Curly's emotions into something bad and needing to be hidden. Everything is laced with envy and resentment, an outburst just around the corner, I mean he even slams the table in the birthday party scene, a tactic in emotional manipulation to set the victim on edge and cloud their ability to respond. Even if Curly knows Jimmy won't get physical in that moment, the physical actions is intended to make him back down in the confrontation in case it does. This is something that is just not person specific. It ingrains itself into how you interact with the world and life and it shows in major and minor ways with Curly.

Post-crash, the abusive nature is more in tandem to the physical victimization Anya went through and the stripping of voice and autonomy we see take place. Like the parasite in HFIM, Jimmy speaks for Curly most of the time and puts words in his mouth, similarly to how he takes Anya's plans as his own. He very commonly, with the both of them mind you, supplements the worst aspects of himself into them; pettiness, selfishness, lack of understanding... And tries to cover himself with their best qualities; kindness, planning, initiative, etc...

These parallel are just to say that positional power has little to do with if a person can be abused and how it can even be flipped to further the abuse. There is no doubt that Curly could've picked up on Jimmy's envy of his position hence another reason he never confronted him as a Captain but as a friend as doing so would immediately put Jimmy in a space to be confrontational/combative.

I think the disdain some people have when they talk about the heavily implied if not implicitly stated emotional/mental abuse Curly experienced being Jimmy's friend is when treating it as an excuse to why he didn't do more. I can understand that completely because it is not an excuse to why he didn't do more but is a very real reason people in his position in these scenarios can experience whether in the context of a work or social environment. However, I also think the way people talk about it really does demonstrate a bigger problem when talking about abuse when somehow who is/was abused is either part of the issue or enabled it.

Harkening back to the sentiments about Curly's inaction regarding Jimmy, I think the exact phrases I used/have seen show how there is an inherent belief that it is easier to overpower the effects of emotional/mental abuse that go in tandem with the perception of Curly as someone who should be able to. There is not an age you suddenly stop being susceptible to abuse nor a set point or low where you realize how it has affected you. You don't suddenly know to stand up or put a face on to face your abuser nor admit that you inadvertently enabled them to subjugate someone else to the same treatment. Maybe it's my psych brain but their is this growing belief that direct action is somehow easy or always the best method with the game shows you instances where it is not always the case. In real life that rings true too. He should have done more, but it's not impossible to see why he struggled to find a way or didn't even if it makes us mad.

It's not easy to suddenly gain a "back-bone". You don't immediately want to resort to aggression, especially if it mirrors the type you were a victim to. You don't want to believe you allowed yourself to be treated this bad, let it get that bad or allowed something bad to happen to someone else. It is easy to be in denial, to retreat to your thoughts or make excuses to avoid the painful truth. It's frustrating but in a way we know is relatable. It why we both hate and love Curly for it. We know we'd be better, we think we'd be better, we like to think we wouldn't falter in the same ways but it's always easier to say that from the outside looking in. It's easy to see what he was doing wrong because we are seeing it, not him, but the game really does make you picture what you would do if this was your raw reality and it's why this debate about Curly seems so never ending/contradictory. We can all say what we'd do but bottom line is that's much different when you're in the moment with all the emotions and human feelings attached.

I personally think Mouthwashing tackles the themes of rape culture, enabling, toxic masculinity, types of abuse and patriarchy in ways that are meant to deconstruct the typical straightforward views we mostly have of these concepts and how little subtilities of them are just as, if not more, detrimental than the overt/obvious parts. The game deals with the idea of little details and bigger picture in a way to show that sometimes the bigger picture is not the issue but the little details that make it up. It's why I have a personal dislike of depictions of Jimmy as the typical horrible person who would of course do something like this because the game is about noticing the little warning signs, the foreshadowing and foresight.

It's why I dislike the typical discussion of "bro code" and "boys will be boys" for the game because the game makes a point to avoid the standard depictions of such. It is about the type of men who still enable despite not condoning, agreeing or even perpetuating harmful beliefs because they can't see the little details or the ways it seeps into their everyday. The severity is not obvious to them as it was not obvious to Curly, Swansea or even Daisuke the way it was to a woman like Anya. There are little details about Jimmy that should ring alarms but if you are too naive like Daisuke, too distant like Swansea or too conditioned like Curly, they are just off markers.

There is 100% more constructive/concise ways to say "Curly was a victim of Jimmy's abuse on an emotional and mental aspect that clouded his judgements and perceptions in the scenario" while also critiquing on the side of "Curly still had a responsibility to protect Anya as a crew mate and Captain that he failed to do due to biases and stigma's he failed to surpass" without the weird condemnation people give him about should've knowing better than to let himself be manipulated by a person he considered a close, if not family/best-friend and had his own reasons to trust initially. Also stop being weird about victims of abuse in general with this fandom, like sorry not everyone has a like social epiphany the moment someone's nasty to them. People are treating it like you immediately know when you are in a toxic relationship immediately or comprehend when a person is actively dangerous and either it's your fault for not knowing how to leave/cut them off or you deserve it. Like the hypocrisy of people believing how certain fans treat the story reflect their irl views but not their own is crazy.

End statement is: I honestly don't even know man, I've been writing this too long and just like no man on that ship was perfect or really helped Anya when it mattered and I feel like pitting them against each other in discussion on who did the least or most or how it was justified sucks cause in the end Anya always did the most and best thing for herself.

[lycandrophile]

i absolutely cannot believe people are trying to start discourse about whether nex benedict was actually nonbinary / whether it was okay for him to describe himself as nonbinary to some people if he didn’t actually identify that way as if he isn’t literally DEAD because he was KILLED. this is a MURDERED CHILD and these monsters are so busy getting mad at the possibility that he might have been a trans boy who described himself as nonbinary to his family because that was easier for them to take that they’re turning a CHILD who was MURDERED into fucking discourse. even when we die at the hands of cis people’s violence, our own community finds a way to make us the villains of the story.

and all of this bullshit on top of the ways that cis people are already trying to say our grief over his death is unjustified. all of this on top of people claiming he wasn’t murdered and speculating on other causes of death (i literally saw someone say he “clearly went home and took the coward’s way out” and i have never been more disgusted) or claiming that he started the fight as if any action on his part could’ve been enough to justify his death. i am haunted by the sound of his father screaming that his child was not filth because that is what people have been saying about this poor kid, that’s how cruelly his memory is being treated, and even the trans community can’t get it’s shit together enough to look past the stupid discourse and see the tragedy in front of us. did you all forget that it was supposed to be up to us to grieve him in the way he deserves when the rest of the world fails to care if people like him live or die? did you all forget that this child was our sibling, the future of our community, a life that we should have had the chance to know and treasure while he was still here but that we now have a responsibility to hold close to our hearts in his absence? nex’s life was precious and it was ended far too soon and if you truly believe that anything is more important than mourning his life and fighting for a world where no more trans people have to meet such an awful fate, you’re a traitor to this community and you do not deserve the place you occupy within it.

i’m so tired. i can’t even imagine how tired his family must be, to see the public treat the child they’re grieving so horribly, to see the world fail their baby again. leave him alone. he was already robbed of peace in life; the least you can do is let him finally have it in death.