#(​expect lots of lestat posting)

[radiantlestat]

hi guys!! while i’m not new to tumblr, i am relatively new to the iwtv fandom and i’m looking for some new mutuals and blogs to follow 🥹

pls interact with this post if you post about iwtv and are interested in becoming mutuals. i’d love to get to know everyone! ♡

[kuwdora]

all my netflix witcher peeps this week losing their minds with all the new photos and articles. love to see it.

[olderthannetfic]

I'm IWTV-wank-avoidance-asking Anon and it kinda missed me that it would be a wanky topic lol I was trying to see if the show is worth watching. A lot of my mutuals are posting IWTV gifs so I assume it's good, but I was curious if anyone who read the novel would think "Better read the novel". I don't realize an asking-for-rec ask would be wanky, but now that I think about who the writer is, it kinda makes sense. My bad lol

--

Ahahahaha.

Around here, I don't think anyone is precious enough about Anne Rice to start the genuine version of this wank, but Rice fandom can be... uh... very intense even on top of Rice herself having been the queen of drama.

You know about Red Beans Anne Rice, right?

Many years ago, Anne got all butthurt about a tacky-ass restaurant taking over an abandoned building that she'd had Lestat being emo in in one of the books. Instead of gothic atmosphere, it was now very PINK and LOUD. So she wasted money taking out ads in the local paper as Lestat trying to shame the restaurant owner... at which point a bunch of other restaurant owners also wasted money to respond in newspaper ads saying that they welcomed fellow businesspeople. It all ended in the restaurant's grand opening and people with plates of "Red beans Anne Rice" (i.e. red beans and rice).

--

Anyway, I read the first book back in the 90s when I was like 15. It's decent from what I remember. The thing that made it iconic when it came out in 1976 was that it was pretty heavily pushing the vampire=drug addict metaphor. This is everywhere in sexy goth sadboi vampire media now, but it wasn't as much of a thing at the time.

It was also very, very gay but in that way where (at least in the first book), nobody really says the word. That meant something in the 70s. Even by the 90s, it wasn't such a big deal, and it's a big nothingburger in the 2020s.

Book 1 is Rice dealing with the death of her child. It's all about suicidal feelings and Catholic weirdness. The main character is Louis, a.k.a. Rice's self-insert (which she confirmed herself).

Books 2 onward are about Lestat's dick.

He becomes a rockstar, vampire-bones the ur vampire, which causes him to mega level up, thus enabling him to thwart her plot to kill all men on earth aside form a few for breeding purposes, bodyswaps so he has a working penis again, fucks a nun, swaps back, gets Louis back by trying to commit suicide and accidentally getting a tan, etc... Much, much later books are about the other bonkers vampires, most of them more in the horny rockstar mold than the sad mommy of dead baby one.

In book 1, Louis is a depressed plantation owner who eats a bunch of his slaves among other fucked up shit. Claudia, their vampire daughter, is a small child who is upset about being stuck as a kid forever. One of the more disturbing parts is when Louis finds out she's fucking adult men. Lestat turns out to be a French nobleman with mommy issues despite Louis thinking he was only pretending to be upper class.

-- The TV series moved the entire plot much later in history, made Louis black, and gave him a spine. Some racists cried about this and some of tumblr cried about how it was offensive to take the plantation owner and make him black instead of doing that with the other one.

The show also made it more overt that Lestat is an abusive jackass boyfriend. This apparently came as a surprise to people with poor reading comprehension. Others have wanked about fans still liking Louis/Lestat instead of Louis/less terrible boyfriends. But... like... It's IWTV. What did they expect?

(So yes, some book fans will be immensely wanky about the show. Ignore them.)

Also, I hear they fuck on the show? Rice's vampires don't have working junk, which we know because Lestat stands in front of an entire wall of mirrors in the most bougie bathroom ever in Akasha's evil lair and discusses how his penis—I mean "The Organ"—no longer does anything.

Also, Armand in the books is the 14-year-old kept boy of a Renaissance painter with a harem of boys or something like that. (It's been a very long time since I read these.) Shit like this never makes it into the adaptations.

--

If you're curious about the history of vampire media or about a certain kind of Southern gothic shit, sure, read the books, particularly the first one with its radically different tone and much greater historical importance.

The old movie is a decent adaptation of book 1, though it makes it less gay (or at least removes Louis' weird boner for his dead brother) and messes with the ending in a way that would have made sequels veer off from the books. I haven't seen that other old movie with Aaliyah, but it looks like a campy time capsule of baaaad movies of that era.

Anyway, no, you don't need to read the book before watching the show. They changed a massive amount of stuff.

I'm in more of a Chinese media phase right now, but a bunch of friends have watched and said the show is genuinely good.

[eniokai]

I tried to explain to myself some of Marius's actions towards Armand, and I ended up with a lengthy post in which I want to express my perspective on the dynamics of Marius's relationships with Lestat and Armand. I want to emphasize that this is not how I personally view these characters, but rather how I see Marius's perspective on them.

It will be no secret that in Lestat's and Armand's lives, Marius occupies the role of a mentor, teacher, wise advisor, and serves as a father figure for both of them.

If we consider their relationships as familial, in this hierarchy, not by age but by position, Lestat would be the older child, upon whom Marius places his main expectations, ambitions, and hopes. Lestat is a reflection of Marius himself, the heir to his values and ideas. They are soulmates, sharing views on life and understanding each other well. This forms the foundation of their love and mutual respect. Respect is particularly important here because, despite the fact that Lestat creates just as many problems and chaos as Armand (honestly, even more) Marius sees him as an independent individual. He considers him an equal.

In contrast to Lestat, Armand is complicated and incomprehensible to Marius. He occupies the position of the stereotypical younger child, someone Marius expects nothing from and places no hopes on. He loves Armand simply for existing, even if that existence is not right beside him. However, Armand pays for the lack of burdensome expectations with the fact that he is not treated as an adult independent person. Marius does not believe that Armand is mature enough to live without the interventions of a true adult (Marius) in his life.

Does Marius consider Armand his equal? My honest answer to that is no. You have every right to disagree with this. Marius is convinced that he not only has the full right to make important decisions regarding Armand's life and to scold him like a child, but he believes that Armand needs this.

So how do Armand and Lestat differ in their positions? In absolutely every way. Lestat was initially a free person, he already had a formed personality and he already had a true maker. He found Marius on his own initiative and chose Marius as his authority.

Armand in turn belonged to Marius in the most direct and barbaric sense. Even if Marius did not consider him literal property, that was the factual status of Armand in palazzo. The difference in position and status is obvious.

Furthermore, what is most important is that Armand hardly remembered his life before the brothel. Armand was a blank slate. His new identity was built on mentorship and guidance from his master. Marius replaced parents, teachers, and other possible authority figures. This is more significant than Marius's involvement in the life of any other boy from the palazzo because they had a past, possibly families, and they knew their identities. In Amadeo's life, Marius is the foundation of his new personality.

And perhaps most obviously, but no less significantly, Armand is Marius's fledgling, his dark child.

I’ve seen a lot of angry discussions about why Marius believes he has the right to make decisions for Armand. I agree with this perspective, I think he genuinely believes he has rights over Armand due to all the aforementioned circumstances (not because of the fact that he bought him, but because of the immense influence he has had on his personality and his status as Armand's maker). I see an analogy here with parents who struggle to accept their children’s adulthood, they want to do what’s best, but it often backfires.

But at the same time, Marius is willing to take responsibility (finally 🤐). He takes Daniel under his wing not because he feels pity for some half-mad newly turned vampire, but because it’s a failure his own fledgling. Rights and responsibilities cannot exist without each other. Perhaps in this way, he is trying to atone for his actions (or lack thereof) towards Armand, maybe to redeem himself as master and maker. But I doubt Marius will ever be able to admit this, even to himself.

Armand finds it difficult to break the established opinion about him. Throughout the series of books, there has been a constant tension between them, which sometimes escalated into open conflict.

Armand would lose his temper when referred to as a child, he fought for the right to be considered an adult, as he had indeed gone through his own journey and made significant progress. Unfortunately for him, Marius is not a psychology guru. The differences in their views, life rules, and temperaments are perceived by Marius as misconceptions and immaturity, while Armand's adherence to religious beliefs is seen as a sign of suggestibility and an inability to make his own decisions. To be honest, I think there is some rational basis in this. The occasional emotional outbursts and impulsive actions, but most of all Armand's walked out into the sun, only reinforce Marius's opinion that Armand cannot handle his life on his own.

Let's wish Armand success in being perceived as an adult! 🌠

Origin: Cryptid Club

[murfpersonalblog]

IWTV S2 Musings - Tentative Timeline (Pt2: The Trial)

[The revised version is HERE]

I've been struggling with this for a while, cuz this ish just don't make sense, AMC. (I fully expect S3 to gotcha/retcon/fix stuff, esp. since who knows what Armand's tinkered around with in Louis' head.) I split this timeline in 2 parts: Pt1 has everything from 2x1 - 2x6ish (text & chart versions of timeline); and Pt2 covers as much as I can understand from the Trial's shenanigans. (I'm just one person tryna figure out wtf is going on, so if y'all have any insights, please share!)

I've been grappling with the sequence of events that led to the Trial since 2x6 aired, when Armand "could not prevent" his CHOICE to stand back and let Louis' family be abducted & tortured & killed.

Armand was actually in cahoots with Santiago the whole time (writing/directing/editing the Trial script); so was he also lying/making excuses about why THE most powerful vampire with the Mind Gift wasn't reading his own coven's thoughts?

So, since we know Armand put false memories into Lou's head about the Trial (which ofc makes Louis' account more difficult to parse), and we know Armand knew all about Lestat/Bruce since the very first day, I've just been wondering how early the Trial was planned out.

Cuz the BIG question everyone's circling around is WHEN Lestat arrived in Paris, and WHY he didn't warn Louis that the coven was planning something.

Theories range from:

Les willingly participated in the Trial, deliberately acting with ill intent cuz he was mad about Mardi Gras; "it's their turn to hurt." Lesdaughter Truthers are wrong, Les DGAF about Claudia.

Les was unable to warn Louis or stop the Trial cuz he was captured, injured & manipulated/mind-fogged (a la the book canon)

Sam Reid (deliberately?) hemmed & hawed about Lestat going into the rehearsal/Trial acting on raw impulse, with no plan whatsoever, other than getting Louis (specifically) out alive

NGL, I think ALL of the above are to some degree true! 😅

But I lean toward Theory #2 most of all, cuz that's how the book events transpired. But I'll be the first to admit that #2 is deeply flawed & hard AF to defend/prove, based on what little we actually saw in 2x6, 2x7, and esp. 2x8. Cuz it really does seem like Les LET an awful lot of bad ish happen that he too could've prevented.

So I wanna put 2x6 into context this time, to try and piece things together. Cuz the math REALLY ain't mathin, AMC.

What we have thus far:

According to Armand in 2x8, he started lying to Louis about the coven preparing the Trial the night Madeleine was Turned in 2x6.

November 1945

Armand knew the FIRST NIGHT Louis & Claudia arrived in Summer 1945 that they were lying about Lestat/"Bruce."

Spring 1946 - Spring 1947

The coven was suspicious the entire time--it's esp. obvs. as Santiago grills them about "Chicago":

Santiago vs Claudia (2x3) around Spring 1946, "Stick with it, Puce! You're almost there."

Santiago vs Louis (2x4) around Spring 1947, "New Orleans!" (It makes sense that it would take Santiago longer to confront Louis, as Armand kept complaining about Louis never being around the Theatre x x)

Late 1947 / Early 1948

post-September 1947, Santiago had already stolen Claudia's diaries & passed them around to the coven; and Celeste & Estelle had already interrogated Roget about Lestat.

Did Armand know Santiago was in Louis' apartment going through their things (while Claudia would either be out with Madeleine, or at the Theatre under curfew) --

--and did he know the coven was reading her Diaries right in front of him while Santiago & Celeste & Estelle were interrogating Roget about Lestat?

Esp. since all of this goes down in 2x6 BEFORE Armand had even met Madeleine & Louis/Claudia asked him to Turn her!

We know that by late 1947 / early 1948 (when Louis bought the Wols, then came home to find Claudeleine in his coffin, then took them to Armand to ask for the bite), Armand already knows that Lou & Claudia wanna do their own thing with Madz; committing the same "crime" that got Santiago's Maker killed--making a vamp without the Coven Master's permission--but ofc, Louis is NOT in Armand's coven.

Late 1948 - Early 1949

In the very next scene, we get Santiago & Sam in cahoots about Godot's projections/scripts. Patterns of behavior indicate that Armand LET this all happen, and only pretended that "the buffoon was in the audience."

In my Timeline Pt1, I surmised that the very latest Sam could've finished the Godot script was early 1949, cuz IRL Sam Beckett wrote the play b/t October 1948 - January 1949.

Spring - Summer 1949

So by Spring of 1949, Sam would be free to turn his attention to drafting a NEW script...for the Trial.

April 1949: Sam writes the Trial script.

(Is it JUST his half, or is Les already awake & in Paris & writing the other half with him? OR is Les awake & just in telepathic communication with the coven, and has no idea they're asking him questions to incriminate Claudia & Louis?)

2x5 & 2x6 also give us some very important contextual dates! Loumand references a bunch of events that happened around the same time, which can help approximate when Tuan's projections were being made.

LOUIS: The Berlin Blockade ended in May. The Geneva Convention was agreed in August. Some of the front pages from that year. But if you look in the filler, in the back pages. Strange crimes reported. ARMAND: A telescopic lens stolen from the Observatory at Meudon. A film company shooting the crime thriller 'Porte D'Orient' delayed when its inventory of color film stock is snatched. LOUIS: A gang of drunkards, hanging off of the side of the Eiffel Tower, all facing south by southwest, all muttering in unison--gone by the time police arrive by elevator. ARMAND: Crimes all left unsolved.

May 12, 1949: Berlin Blockade ends

June 21, 1949: Paris Observatory's missing lens reported stolen. (Because these are newspaper reports, we might also assume the actual time of the theft was the night before the article was published (June 20). But who knows.)

June 23, 1949: Oriental Port color film stock reported stolen; filming delayed. (Because these are newspaper reports, we might also assume the actual theft of the events was the night before the article was published (June 22). But who knows.)

The color film stock being stolen that delayed Oriental Port's filming is a VERY nice touch, cuz the movie was released in 1950, and was the first French film to use Agfa-Gevacolor film, which had only been available to the public since January 1949 (x x). So the film nerds at AMC really stay on top of their research! 👌

July 1949: Armand distracts Louis with library outings:

ARMAND: Ah, July, 1949. The reading room. LOUIS: Mmm. We broke into the same library every night that month, hypnotized security, as one does, flipped the lights, laid our backs on long tables and stared up at the ceiling. ' DANIEL: Hot. ARMAND: Iron pillars holding up terracotta domes, a light trick that made the ceiling appear higher than it was. LOUIS: And why not pass a month that way? An effortless, eternal life ahead of us. Funny thing, trying to remember what occupied one's time when one was ignorant of the plotting around him.DANIEL: Grab that. LOUIS: Santiago had broken into our apartme--I'm sorry. Grab what?

Louis implies that the "plotting around him" started in July 1949--or at least, that's when HE surmised (in Dubai, NOT Paris) that Armand had "started lying to me." Ofc, 2x8 would reveal that Armand was in cahoots with the coven since jump.

We can thus assume that this was when the bulk of the projector images based on Claudia's diaries were being drawn (whenever Armand wasn't distracting Louis with dates to the library). They already have the Agfa-Gevacolor film, and the Observatory's fancy projection lens, so that Tuan can animate whatever Sam had already written for the script. "But they had their Technicolor film. Tuan Pham's wizardry with it."

And ofc, they'd want to corroborate the diaries with Lestat's own testimony. (Esp. since it's clear from Claudia's diaries that Les ISN'T dead, just thrown in the dump--cuz Claudia KNOWS the only way to be sure you've killed a vamp is to burn them, and she's mad AF that they didn't do that to Les cuz Lou freaked TF out.)

Again: did they only call Lestat after they had Claudia's diaries (once they knew there was a chance he wasn't dead after all)? The dates seem to imply that this was the case--that Armand & Santiago & co. had suspected Lestat was alive ever since 1945, but it was only until 1949 that they bothered to contact him.

Fall 1949

September 5, 1949: report of Eiffel Tower climbed by "muttering drunkards." (Because these are newspaper reports, we might also assume the actual time of the events was the night before the article was published (Sept 4). But who knows.)

The September 5th date is the most telling: IF Armand is telling truth, this would be when the coven contacted Lestat, as seen in Tuan's projection during the Trial.

So, IF this is the truth & S3 doesn't retcon anything, the rehearsals with Lestat would've had to have started in September, after 3 months of Tuan's prep (the thefts started in June); and 5 months of Sam's writing & Armand's edits.

February 6, 1940 - September 5, 1949: Lestat's "state of repose" ends when the coven "wakes" him. (IF this is true, Roget was right that Les was just asleep, taking a long AF dirt nap. IF Les was awake before then, he was only motivated to come to Paris when the coven climbed the Eiffel Tower & told him the Trial was soon--likely still too emotionally damaged / psychologically injured to leave NOLA.)

Again, the big question is: what was Les up to while he was in Paris, b4 the Trial? Was he free to come & go as he pleased (in which case: why TF didn't he warn Lou?!); OR was he locked up (a la the books)?

post-September 5, 1949: Madeleine is Turned.

Right after the scene of Dubai!Loumand describing all the "strange crimes," we get the scene of Paris!Loumand in the park, discussing Madz, right b4 she's Turned that night (Lou's in the same clothes).

THIS is the night Armand claimed he started lying to Lou, ("They gave me a choice"). And again: we know even THAT was a lie too, cuz UNLESS Madz was turned the exact same night that Les arrived AND wrote his half of the script AND rehearsed it (meaning Les wasn't starved/tortured at all), then Armand had PLENTY of time BEFORE Madz Turned to work on the script & direct the rehearsals.

The same night of Madz's Turning, Armand moves into Louis' apartment (and Claudia's coffin 🤮), with his magnolia sprig. And speaking of plants....

September-October-ish, 1949: Claudeleine finds the X, planting flowers outside Saint Denis.

I assume "cold things" are the cold corpses Claudeleine is burying; that "become warm" metaphorically, when plants/flowers grow over their graves. I know nothing about autumn weather in France. Going by clothes, it looks like it's still nice & warm, cut comfy enough for light jackets. I also know nothing about flowers, or what seasons they grow in France. But apparently Claudeleine's Fall flowers are fine:

Lavender: usually stops flowering in late August or mid-September; definitely by mid-October.

Sweet Iris: has high cold resistance, and goes dormant from November - March-ish.

Peony: apparently there are regular peonies & tree peonies, and they both like colder weather--the regular ones go dormant around November. Plenty seem to be ok in Fall, up to October-ish, that you can get at nurseries. And they really like bone meal as fertilizer, omg. XD

(My headcanon wants to assume that Claudia only agreed to visit Louis in Paris either cuz it was gonna be her birthday (9/21), OR his birthday (10/4). 💔 Cuz misogynoir, I'd bet Monopoly money it was Claudia's; DOOMED by the narrative! 😭)

Late 1949 (September/October): The Trial.

(Guys. D'you reckon those nasty theatre kids held the Trial on frikkin Halloween? 🤣)

Late 1949 (November-ish): Louis is kept buried alive in the wet room for at least 1 month after the Trial, before Armand finally pulls him out the coffin.

The latest the Trial could've taken place is October, in order for OVER a month to have passed and the fire still happens in 1949.

VERY Late 1949 (November/December): Louis slaughters the coven, the "Great Fire of 1949" send the Theatre des Vampires up in flames. 🔥

(The Talamasca folder in 2x3 calls it the "Great Fire;" which makes me giddy, cuz we also have the "Great Burnings" in the books, related to Akasha. I love how Akasha & Louis are paralleled, just slaughtering vamps with the Fire Gift, bless.)

1950

May 24 - June 4, 1950: The French Championship of 1950 takes place at Roland-Garros. Spoiler: the Australians lost that year. 😂

[nalyra-dreaming]

'it always is and always was about the shipping'…i'm more & more thinking this is true! imho certain fans only started hating on the show & getting outraged about s3 being tvl (which rolin told us about from day one!!) when things didn't go their way wrt loumand. it's like they finally realized they bet on the wrong horse so they want the show to fail now.

imho s2 ended on a v hopeful note for louis. if anyone was really that worried for his future relevance you'd think the show re-affirming that loustat are soulmates & their relationship is the core of the show would be a good thing, not bad?? it means that even if lestat's the main focus for now, louis will still be central. louis & lestat are co-leads. one or the other may get more screentime in a given season/arc depending on where the story's at rn, but it all comes back to them. so either these fans are just clutching at straws for things to gripe about, or they were in denial about what a tvl season would mean? like did they think the writers were gonna frame lestat as the villain during his own season or that loumand would team up to 'defeat' him lmao? i don't wanna sound harsh but i really don't get what they even expected?

It's always been and always will be about the shipping. There's some great posts by @cbrownjc about that, too.

And yeah well, you wouldn't believe some of the asks I got back then, where people expected Louis to do a Blade and go after Lestat and "his gang" in the upcoming seasons.... (for example).

There were a LOT of people after s1 who expected this to be about the "good vampire" who goes after the bad ones, and "since the show was totally different to the books"... that the show would not be doing the books.

And now, that that is rather clearly not the case... a lot of people are not getting the show they made up in their heads. And that frustrates them.

I get that frustration, to an extent :) But everyone on and surrounding the show talked about doing the books and which books, too, from the beginning.

Like, Rolin Jones is on record with this:

(That particular image also always comes to mind when people wonder how the show can be called IWTV and go to other books now...)

The ones whining about it all now simply did not want to listen.

[adamnablelittledevil]

Reacting to The Vampire Lestat - Part III (with a bit of spoilers)

I like Gabrielle.

I'm not sure I love her, but I really like her.

I feel wrong using feminine pronouns with her, though. I feel like Gabrielle is whispering in my ear that is they/them. Like, I've never had a headcanon so strong before? I don't know about labels, but for me those are the pronouns Gabrielle would use. It's just so clear to me.

I won't use them because the book doesn't do it, the fandom doesn't do it, which I'm not criticizing because it isn't exactly 'official', so it wouldn't be real canon to... But I feel like if the books were released today, it would be. And I hope the show changes that and we can gradually adjust too.

I hope that when they write season 3, they show signs of her gender dysphoria even before she says something explicit like the "you're the man in me" conversation. I want lines that imply that, I want a look in her eyes and expressions on her face whenever she gets gender envious of guys or has to do something "feminine". The book doesn't do a lot of that because Lestat is the narrator and he is away from her, so we barely see her before the transformation/'transition' but the show has the opportunity to explore more of it and I hope they use it.

Gabrielle was born to be a vampire. I think she would nail it even without Lestat's counseling. It's just second nature for her. You go, bruh!

Gabrielle actually seems to be more fun and even affectionate than I expected? I was worried that she'd might be too confident, powerful, badass, empowered etc that she would feel cold and emotionless, because that's usually what happens with characters like these and I hate that... But so far it hasn't been the case.

She really blossomed with vampirism. Feels like she is finally getting the opportunity to have the life she was meant to live.

The only downside is the hair. That moment with the hair was so visceral. I feel bad for her. Imagine being stuck with a hair you hate and gives you body dysphoria forever. I hope the show lets her hair be short. Like, maybe her illness affected her hair or something. Or at least give her hairstyles that make it look shorter than it really is. Or make her cut it every day. I don't care. Let the dude have short hair! Period.

Lestat's reaction to all this is like... Mixed feelings. He doesn't love it. Which, I get it, all his life he knew her as a "woman". It can be weird adjusting to that, it may feel like you're losing someone. But there are these gentle moments when he separates accessories (if I remember it correctly, rings) that are masculine for her because he figures she would prefer them and when he says he'll cut her hair every night if she wants to, so it's more of unlearning and grieving what/who he thought was 'real' and adapting to a new reality. It's not an "okay, let's go!" reaction as if nothing happened, specially for the time being (1700s), it's complicated, but he seems to be open. I can't speak for everyone who is trans and/or under the non-binary umbrella, but it was human to me and I have no problems with it.

Alright, so whether it was incestuous before or not, now it clearly is. I do hope it started now and not when they were human, though.

She was my mother, my fledgling, my child (sort of), my roommate, basically the only friend I had and my lover. I mean, not exactly, but I thought the joke was funny.

I feel like if I talk about the incest, it has to be on another post because it would probably take too long. There are way too many things to talk about and I'm still approaching the middle of the book.

Let's just say it sort of makes works with how the book, the characters, this species and universe are written. I can sort of get it, at least for now. Is it necessary? No. Would the show suffer if they don't do the incest? Not all. Is it random, irrelevant, only for shock value and because "let's get nasty freaky and controversial these are vampires and this is gothic horror grow up cupcakes deal with it hahaha"? Also no! It has some kind of logic. But I feel like Lestat and Gabrielle are already layered enough with their parent/child/maker/fledgling/sort of envious of each other (including the fact they're both gender nonconforming to some extent) dynamic on its own, that there's plenty to cover here without incest. Still, if the show goes there (and I'm afraid they will), I also expect it to make sense and not be just for the sake of being seual, weird and controversial. I believe Rolin is too good to write something that mediocre and poor. So, I can live without it, but I'm also trusting the show to do whatever their thing is. Let's see, I guess.

Also, at least at the moment, it's not as big as people make it out to be. Again, to talk about this properly I'd need another post, but it's not like they sleep together, they're head over heels in love with each other or anything. Like I said, there's some logic that is kind of complicated to explain here, but it's not that radical and it's not that often. Sometimes I even genuinely and wholeheartedly forget about it. Fortunately, there are way too many other (and more) interesting things going on to focus on.

Gabrielle learning about her powers is really fun too, maybe even more fun than Lestat since she's such a natural at this whole thing.

And their maker/fledgling dynamic is entertaining as well.

She's like, climbing walls, jumping from roofs etc like a cat, just having the time of her life and while Lestat gets pretty adventurous and experimental with his powers too, it's not as much? Gabrielle takes it to the next level (good for her).

Like, sometimes he has to stop Gabrielle like a father with his kid, like "CAN WE PLEASE JUST GO HOME WE CAN DO MORE TOMORROW" and it's simply hilarious.

Stop it, Lestat, let Gabrielle HAVE FUN!

Gabrielle just gives major Cat Woman vibes. Now I need Cat Woman-esque scenes on the show with her climbing and jumping between buildings etc. WE HAVE SO MUCH POTENTIAL AND THE VISION IS CO CLEAR. Do it, Rolin!

It's cool that Lestat finally has some real company and someone with whom he can be open about being a vampire.

Loneliness is the biggest thing for him on the show and I have a feeling it's the same thing on the books. And it's even worse here, because there are moments where he is completely alone and in so much pain (and we haven't seen that on the show yet). Having Gabrielle around made things better for him and he hasn't cried in a little while (and he was crying A LOT on those first two chapters, for very understandable reasons), so this was a nice turn for him and the story.

I also think he enjoys being her mentor, like it gives him a sense of purpose and pride. Reminds me of how he talked about the way he felt at the monastery. And it's sweet to see him teaching Gabrielle stuff.

And sometimes he feels like an old and tired single dad and it's just funny. Like, Gabrielle is ready to create the vampire Olympics and win gold for every single sport and he just wants to sleep. Lestat is too much and loves playing around, but Gabrielle is too much even for HIM. Imagine having more energy than the actual ADHD child. What a legend. They're hilarious. A lot of room to play with humor with these two and I hope they use it.

P.S. Nothing is permanent, opinions might change and this is based on Lestat’s narration, which can be unreliable. I’m reading the books so I can find out more about the characters, what potential events might happen in the show, what I can expect etc. This is my favorite show in the universe, so I want to be as informed as possible. I have no idea if I’ll become a legit fan of the books or not, but so far I’m enjoying it. I’m posting these comments only for fun.

[confirmeddead]

My thoughts on the SDCC season 3 Vampire Lestat teaser 🩸

Really excited about the format! I knew they’d switch it up from what we saw in Dubai and this is literally what I was hoping it would be. I think I mentioned it in my season 3 greenlit post that I wanted it to be Daniel interviewing him in various cities as he toured. Lestat is too unpredictable to want to sit and recount his story in such a stale way ala Louis in Dubai.

I *think* this is just a teaser that gives the vibes on what we can expect, I don’t think these are actual clips from the season. This had to have been filmed recently given Sam’s fresh balayage 😂 (I KNEW he’d done it for a reason…) and I DO think filming will begin this year and go into next year.

Daniel being part of the interview was, of course, expected. He was so excited to write a sequel, release vamp sex toys, etc. Of course he said yes to Lestat (I think Lestat went to him because TVL was Lestat wanting to tell his story- so this is all agreed to and on his terms).

The dynamic between Daniel and Lestat will be so fun. Sam said somewhere that of course they’d fight but they’d also get along. Daniel is a wise-cracking, experienced person. He’s been through a lot and I’m sure Lestat will like going back and forth with him.

So no cast reveals! I can’t think when they’ll reveal the big three (Gabrielle, Marius, and Akasha) but I’m hoping it’s not just a press release. These are MAJOR vampire chronicles characters, I need them to be revealed in front of fans! New York Comic Con is in October 2024. While I’d like for them to be filming by then, maybe this could happen right before filming begins? Idk

I won’t pretend to have any idea what they’ll do with Louis 😭 it won’t be anything from the books, of course, because he was barely in TVL.

With how much a fanboy Rolin is for TVL (like, totally valid), I don’t expect a lot of present-day Armand. Of course we will see him in the 18th century! Okay idk why I made this into a theory post but I’ll cut it out.

This teaser was really, really good. TVL was when I started loving Lestat as a character and everything about him (his past, his family) made him make a lot of sense to me. He’s so chaotic and Sam is gonna kill it. If this becomes a Vampire Lestat stan account, don’t say I didn’t warn you (but Armand/Assad will always be my #1 🩷)

[romanticizingmurder]

I think the idea of Lestat as Marius's favorite is kind of overblown? Marius certainly loves Lestat, and I think Armand believes or at least worries about Marius favoring him:

So it's not like I don't get where this comes from.

But I'd argue he treats Lestat nearly identically (in terms of big events, he's obviously not out here macking on him).

He hears Armand crying and seeks him out and brings him home.

He sees and hears Lestat seeking him out and finds him and brings him home.

And I see a lot of people follow Armand's logic and then go "but he doesn't rescue Armand from the cult but he forgives Lestat talking about The Parents". The thing is. I don't think this is good comparison to Armand and the cult. For whatever reason, I can come up with a few ideas, I don't think Marius was truly that upset nor really expected Lestat to keep the secret. He doesn't have the visceral reaction to it that he does to Armand accepting the cult (not blaming Armand here, not saying blaming Armand is good).

But we do actually see Marius react to Lestat doing something unexcuably stupid. And what happens? When Lestat fully betrays all advice given to him by everyone and lets his body be taken over? Not only does Marius refuse to help him, he even makes sure Lestat sees him refusing to help - at least when he went to watch Armand with the cult, he didn't reveal himself and make the rejection clear:

Marius has, and you can come up with any number of reasons as to why this is and it's not the point of this post, a habit of essentially ghosting people when he reaches a certain level of emotion. He leaves Pandora, he doesn't try to unbrainwash Armand, and he refuses to directly help Lestat.

It's also worth noting that in both Armand and Lestat's case, he doesn't help them but he also doesn't particularly hinder them. By the time he's recovered enough to check on Armand and find him killing innocents, Marius doesn't actually try to interfere despite his horror at it - nor does he try to destroy Lestat's body before Lestat has a chance to recover it.

I think the idea that Marius treats Lestat measurably better than Armand largely just focuses on his and Lestat's relationship in its very early stages, when the wider picture shows Marius still in his same patterns with Lestat as he was with Armand and Pandora. Which is to say: I don't think Lestat is Marius's golden boy or his favorite, I don't think he treats Armand worse than Lestat.

(I might even go so far as to say I suspect if you actually compared Awful Things done by them, Marius is willing to completely ignore and forgive significantly more of Armand's past post-reunion than he is of anyone else, at least as seen in how he treats them)

[manynarrators]

Y’alllllll, I miiiiight be coming out of QotD with a new ship. And godamnit, I go from my Lestat/Armand ship (comparative rare pair with little content) to drumroll please, sprinkle in a bit of rising tension!

Something even rarer and virtually non-existent! Khayman/Armand. I want to read fic for them. There is no fic. I have thoughts about it, I think it could be So Good.

If I want fic for them I’m going to have to write it myself, aren’t I?

It sounds like such a crack pairing but I have logic!

The first is that Khayman is immediate taken in by Armand. But not just because he’s pretty, which is a part of it. But also the amount of power Armand has, notable for someone young(er). There’s respect! I’m here for someone ending up with Armand who isn’t scared of him, but is still aware he’s not weak.

And then throughout the whole middle portion of the book from Khayman’s perspective, he’s constantly looking for Armand! He keeps thinking things along the line of “I have to go to Armand, I want to try and protect him” which considering Akasha is quite literally going around murdering a ton of vampires at that moment, isn’t exactly patronizing! Still sweet though.

Armand is a bit cold towards him, but also he’s having A Day, and I think he’s not at his best for some logical reasons!

Now I to what is infinitely more like… personal reasons. The one that made me write the post: I think it would make Marius so upset, for a couple of reasons. The first is just that Khayman is incredibly old, and incredibly powerful. Six thousand years, compared to two. Not only is his beloved fledgling moving on with someone else, but someone even more of an ancient than him!

The second is that Armand is consistently made a spectacle because of his beauty. And Khayman is… unsettling. He’s got some aspects of beauty to him, according to Marius, but, on the whole, so old and inhuman it’s cycled around to terrifying. And I love the idea of Armand saying “no, I like him”.

The last one that I can think of for the moment is the fact that Armand and Khayman are both odd. Odd in a distinctly vampire way. Like half of what Armand says in TVL and IWTV is telepathically, he doesn’t move in the way of a human, he is, of the core cast of vampires, probably the least human acting one. Khayman hits a lot of the same vibes. They also both have a fascination with the modern world and learning about that. Give me these two old vampires learning about the world, but also without judgement that comes from being unsettling, or expecting to blend in more.

Like I’m all for Armand learning to be human, but also I am SO HERE for my vampires being well, vampires, with the goose-bump raising, cat-scaring unsettling nature that comes with. I think it’s got some of the appeal of show Devils Minions, just in a way I think has intriguing potential I want to poke around in.

This has been my TED Talk!

[waterghoulcalamity]

all this discourse on twt about who gets to sit on whose lap seems so strange, forced and honestly dumb to me because—for context: someone posted the picture below with the caption being something like "some pls draw loustat like this.

all fun and games until they start posting the fanart and most of them it's lestat sitting on louis's lap which i, admittedly, figured that people wouldn't be happy with because i've always had the impression that this fandom (at least the twt side) views lestat through a more masculine lenses and you can see this in a lot of loustat fanfiction that he takes the role of the "man" in the relationship, with louis being the wife, and don't much like it when lestat takes more feminine/soft role in the relationship. me however, i was happy that people were starting to be more open to shed the heteronormative glasses and the roles and whathot, and have fun with cute fanart but yeah, no.

to my surprise (or maybe not) the discourse was how "some people" (derogatory) expect louis to take the role of the man because he's a black man (what) and lestat the woman because he's white (again, what) and the entire time i'm sitting there confused because this never crossed my mind and, from my perspective, this wasn't even something that was happening in real life?? I don't know, i tend to not involve myself with discourse because i find it exhausting, but i guess this one caught my attention due to how out of nowhere it seemed.

admittedly, i don't think i'm the right person to talk about race. while i'm not white, i'm also not american, and in my country race is not the first thing that pops to mind when we think of the source of issues, but I understand that it is different in america, so perhaps they're right and i'm the one who's being disrespectful and underreacting? who knows.

well, i've rambled plenty, sorry again. i guess that, ultimately, i'd just like it if people stopped making discourse out of everything and started focusing on having fun and enjoying the show that they like a little more, not everything has to be about a group being wrong and another being right. sometimes it's okay to enjoy a joke.

[storyteller-aprendiz]

So maybe I am wrong but I don't think you can gendered Louis & Armand, the way you do Loustat.

Because neither Louis nor Armand are really the "housewife" in the situation. In Dubai and SF is Louis' initiative and therefore his business but Armand does have an equal role on it, tho Louis is the more capitalist/investment savy, Armand is like the one to schedule talks with buyers, help fix the houses etc. It is not Armand's home, like Louis moving into Lestat's, is THEIR home, both in Dubai and SF.

And like even if the bullshit with the books (which tf) and the tree are definitely Armand, the art, the furniture even the gray are Louis' (cause he's grieving). Like for me the Dubai penthouse is like a reflection of Louis' self/soul "You are in my coffin" as much as a manifestation of Armand controlling tendencies.

I saw a post about exactly this, like how Armand & Louis relationship is a Depiction of how even in the queerest of models and types of relationships abuse can still take part if people are not willing to question the systems, dynamics or just plane different levels of power their members have.

And then we have the D/S dynamic. Kink and BDSM are already shamed upon in our heteronormative society, because they play with the power dynamics that already exist in the relationship, and they create a separte extructure through safe-words and after care and good old communication in which both member can consent to those dynamics, be safe and most important GET PLEASURE from them.

And like, Armand as the powerfull abusive partner Technically, considering our heteropatriarchal lense should be dominant, but he gladly relinquished it to Louis. Which is a role we don't expect from the patriarch of the house.

Plus all of Louis' boys, means he has a sexual freedom that is not allowed to the "housewife". Though, of course that extend of freedom is still determine/manage by Armand, but not in the sense of Louis is sexually his, ergo he can't be with x. But rather Louis might get Hurt, so I need to control him, for his sake.

Which is why Armands abuse looks more to me like care-taker abuse than like the heteropatriarcal shit Lestat does.

Which I think, is also because Armand being a racialized man with a learned helplessness ingrained to him, really can't like inhabit the same role Lestat does in a home. He will always be a step down, cause masculinity and male privilege gets further away (or like changes? I think that's a better way to put it) the more marginalization you inhabit. Which also makes a lot of men of color double down in what little power it does grant's them (sometimes going to bigger like displays of power than the subtler types of white men), which you could argue Armand also goes for/participates in with the staging of the trial.

I hope anything I wrote here makes sense. But yeah, I think that the patriarchal husband/edwardian wife comparison even if it works as a lense to analyze Loustat, it falls apart for Louis & Armand.

[ileftmysoulinnorway]

We all had a tough end of the week, so I thought I would put together something about my IWTV set lurking experience in Prague, hopefully to cheer someone up and show you that the people working on our little show are incredible, everything is well thought out, and we have a lot to look forward to.

Locations

I am confident that Prague will be a good substitute for Paris. I love this post comparing Prague's Théâtre des Vampires location with a real Le Grand Guignol in Paris. But similar care is given to other locations as well.

I like to joke that I enjoyed a month-long tour of Prague's most famous landmarks, only to have the actual filming take place in nondescript alleyways right next to them. But it makes perfect sense. They want to capture the nicer and older parts of the city that suit them, but not anything that would tell you it's Prague.

Production design, costumes

I saw them build everything from scratch on several sets. And I'm in awe. From putting up posters that will probably only appear in the background of a single shot, to street names that fit the exact topography of Paris and make sense in the context of the scenes that take place on them, to storefronts that they really didn't have to pay that much attention to, or a menu at Le Dakar Café that you could only read up close, but someone took the trouble to make it anyway?

And maybe this attention to detail is normal, I don't know, but I still think Mara and her team deserve all the praise they get.

S1 showed us how much attention is paid to the costumes. I can assure you that has not changed. All the hats, coats, capes and dresses. I can't tell you how many times I've been pleasantly surprised. By the choice of colors for Lestat. By how beautifully all of Armand's black clothes come to life with little details.

People

There are so many people (and I mean SO many) working on the show and they all know exactly what is expected of them, everything runs like a well-oiled machine. I haven't seen any problems, any conflicts, any excesses.

I'm not under any illusion that everything was trouble-free, but really the only complaints I heard were about the horrendously hellish schedule (I guess that's normal) and then the occasional person wishing they had finished earlier (they never finished earlier).

They are all heroes to me.

Directors

Levan is the only one I saw. He seems so focused and professional. His "rolling...and action" is unforgettable.

Actors

After six locations and about fifteen scenes (and countless rehearsals and takes), I think I managed to get at least some idea of them, and yes, they really seem to be such nice people.

- Jacob, I don't envy him at all the emotional strain of playing Louis, but at the same time I love his portrait of Louis so much.

- Sam's transformation into Lestat is something to behold.

- Assad was the only one present on every set. I don't think we've fully realized how big a role he's going to have (at least in S2).

- Delainey, Ben, Roxane and everyone else 💜

Scenes

They were far from finished when the strike started, but at least (in my opinion) they got to the last block of episodes. 

I'm not going to pretend to have a concrete idea of what to expect from S2 based on what little I saw. But I do have a few guesses, and I'm insanely excited and thrilled. And, in the case of the 1700s flashbacks, totally confused. I can't believe they're going to do so many unexpected things, or other things so soon.

I truly believe that S2 will not disappoint any of us. We just have to wait a little longer. But if this strike means that everyone gets a better deal and the studios are forced to change their ways, it will be worth the wait.

[massiveharmonytiger]

No, iwtv fandom. I won't be tagging my opinions about Marius as "Marius hate," to "avoid stressing people out."

Why? Because this fandom is not made up of people that are just "Marius lovers" and "Marius haters." Lots of people have mixed feelings about him and I take that into consideration when I post about him. Even as a so-called "Marius hater", whatever the hell that means. I mean, some people just straight up peg you as an anti or a self-righteous prude if you have one ounce of distaste for Marius, which hardly seems fair because a) Not once did I call for shaming, censorship or say that Marius shouldn't exist b) Have you SEEN my ao3 history.

I happen to think that Marius is a really important and complex character and I can't wait to see them portray that in the show. I just think so many Marius stans are so in denial about who Marius is or driven by repressed guilt because they know who he is and can't handle liking him despite that because they think it makes them a bad person (it doesn't). Ergo, they have to see him as this perfect father lover archetypal figure, which is depressing because we're all out here dragging every other vampire on the show, but please no dissing Daddy Marius. More so because of the associations tied to his blondness and whiteness and Roman-ness - god, I can't wait for the show's portrayal - I'm foaming at the mouth here. Ergo, they can't handle any negativity about him. I mean, we saw the same thing when Lestat slam dunked Louis through the clouds. Everyone on this website who couldn't handle the mark on Lestat's perfect white ass had a complete meltdown. There isn't half as much drama when Louis, Claudia or Armand get criticized for their shit behaviour.

I try to make my posts fair and balanced but I think a lot of the more hardcore stans that couldn't even handle that much. You know, because they weren't posts about the sun shining out of Marius' pretty golden ass. So many wouldn't be seeing my posts all that much anyways on account of them having blocked me after engaging with my posts or vice versa.

I just feel that my posts should be accessible to everybody and then they can decide how they feel about it. Whether they want to reblog it or hard block me. And that's not going to happen if my posts are excluded from a whole portion of the fandom that's simply trying to avoid drama and vitriol by blocking a hate tag. Furthermore, why should my discussions on slavery, pedophilia, racism, abuse, genuine themes in all iterations of Marius' story be classed as "hate" because some people are uncomfortable acknowledging that they are in fact, genuine themes in the media.

Hearing other people out is healthy. Creating boundaries and deciding to remove people from your curated tumblr space is healthy. What's not healthy, however, is splitting the fandom down the middle into this "Marius loving/Marius hating" binary and expecting people to cultivate an echo chamber where everybody shares your opinion and you won't have to learn how to deal with people that might disagree with what you think. TVC has never been the type of media for making people comfortable and I think it's weird that people would want to interact with this specific media in all its rapey, murdery, slavey, racist, colonialist glory and then be all surprised and butthurt when people engage with those themes like its a personal affront to them when nobody is actually personally attacking them. To the point that they don't even want to acknowledge the existence of the part of the fandom that engages with those themes. And you call that etiquette?

Although etiquette was pretty much associated with societies that would host lavish, "polite" parties on the one hand and colonize, enslave and discriminate on the other, so why wouldn't online etiquette follow the trend? Let's just say nothing negative about any complex or problematic characters, themes and issues and then we can all have a good time and pretend that everything is perfect.

[murfpersonalblog]

IWTV Musings - LDPDL & Nosferatu 2024 (Pt9: Subverting Gothic Gender in Femme-Coded Gay Black Men)

Since S1 aired, a large portion of AMC's Interview with the Vampire 2022 fandom has resisted the notion of Louis de Pointe du Lac, a Black gay male vampire living during Jim Crow, as a female-coded character. Viewers (esp. cis straight white women--the antithesis of the gay Black man) have expressed how they either cannot or will not see Black!LDPDL aligning with feminine tropes, archetypes, aesthetics, sentiments, roles, norms, or social positions. Many cis straight white fans have made in depth analyses of IWTV's Gothic/Horror genre(s), and Gothic hero/heroine tropes through white male/female lenses, but I've yet to see any substantial analysis (or even acknowledgement) from this contingency about Black Horror, let alone the intersection of Black LGBT+ Horror and Gothic Horror. Meanwhile, their main defense/offense against Black & Bipoc fans has consistently been to either throw TERF accusations & media literacy snobbery at anyone who criticizes or counters their white-centric gender analyses of Black!LDPDL's place in Gothic Horror (others' experiences: x x x | my own experiences: x x x). And interestingly, a lot of IWTV Gothic aficionados have avoided engaging with the most recent iteration of the vampire in Gothic Horror that loosely inspired Anne Rice's Vampire Chronicles series: Dracula, a la Nosferatu 2024.

So this post is largely in reponse to several of @pynkhues' anti-GothicHeroine!Lou etc analyses of Gothic characters, but I'm still sticking to the Louis/Ellen theme when relevant, just walk with me.

Louis as the Byronic Hero? 🤔

First let's look at @pynkhues' analysis of Gothic characters here:

YES, Louis is a Byronic hero. However, AR's own Alphabettery acknowledges that all Byronic heroes are NOT created equally.

Lestat is "THE embodiment a Byronic hero," while Louis SUBVERTS the archetype by regretting/rejecting his bad tendencies, rather than EMBRACING them, unlike Byron/Lestat/Lord Ruthven/etc.

Cuz going by the definition Pynkhues provided, when you actually break their characteristics down, you can easily see which one fits more than the other.

Louis has far LESS in common with the Byronic hero than Lestat. Lou's similarities to Byronic heroes are largely skin-deep (LOL). He's a tortured emo pretty boy, sure, but the points where he differs are what BREAKS the Byronic mold, not AFFIRMS it:

3) Louis does NOT rebel against "all fundamental values and moral codes of the society"--the whole point is that he CONFORMS to societal expectations, to the detriment of his own happiness!

5) often shows a GREAT DEAL of disrespect for ANY figure of authority. | 8a) arrogant

I've addressed this b4, cuz LouisAntis keep pointing to the RACIST Alderman Fenwick calling Lou arrogant, and Lou sassing him saying "MAYBE I am arrogant!" as CONFIRMATION BIAS for all the things these horrible white men said about that uppity Black N****r who dared to rise above his "PLACE in the world...flying too close to the sun." And we see the exact same nasty sentiments with Santiago & Lestat & Sam's script in 2x7 (written by three more white men to insult & vilify Louis). Cuz yes, Louis IS prideful/haughty, esp. in the context of the classic tragic hero where pride comes b4 a fall. But it is in direct response to his attempts to break FREE of the societal constrictions tryna keep him DOWN. The white racists in NOLA are busy tryna steal his property right under him with the Ordinances segregating Storyville; and the coven's busy tryna convert him into their satanic death cult where he'll never be allowed to have his own autonomy/independence again; a SLAVE; "you'll be our little birdie for the next 50 years~!" The point is that GAY Black men & women in general were both at very the bottom of the social pyramid (maligned in a patriarchal society that equated femininity with everything negative & weak & exploitable). LDPDL & Ellen Hutter resist the UNFAIR TREATMENT they received. That resistance is treated as disrespect to KEEP them in "their place;" abused & dehumanized.

Louis shows TOO MUCH respect to awful racist homophobes, from his hateful AF mother, who he deferred to until her dying effing day; to his racist white bosses Tom Anderson & Alderman Fenwick & Fenwick's lawyer; to the white cops who busted in his house threatening to put him in JAIL for being gay. Louis' monologue in 1x2 about "No, Sir; Yes, Sir" flew CLEAR over y'all heads; y'all have the nerve to take Louis STANDING UP FOR HIMSELF against insults & blatant racism as a sign of "disrespect," and then wonder why Black fans call y'all out as racists, I swear. 😂

6a) Neither Louis not Lestat stand against the dehumanized system of labor, as they both indulge in the benefits of human exploitation, from slavery to prostitution.

6b) WHERE does THE Catholic Guilt LDPDL stand against traditionally repressive religious??? 🤨 Jacob's most iconic scene is of Louis crying out to God in a confession booth! 🤣 Yes, in WWII he started losing his religion, scared that God didn't exist cuz of everything he saw during the war, but Armand pointed out that Lou was STILL holding onto Christian notions of good & evil. Yes, in Dubai he says he doesn't read the Bible much anymore because of it, but he STILL wondered if his mom was right that his nature was that of the Devil, and he tried to prove everyone wrong by not killing since 2000.

6c) WHERE does Domestic Thy Name Is LDPDL stand against social & familial institutions & traditional family values? 🤨 Lestat & Armand didn't even WANT any kids--Louis was the one constantly pushing to start a family with them; only for Lestat to tell him to his face that "I am your family, Louis;" eff them kids, eff Benni, we don't need sons or daughters to be a family so long as we have each other!

8d) WHERE is Louis "unrepentant for his faults"? 🤨 All he does is blame himself for ish that ain't even his fault! All he does is repent--he's eating human food every week that tastes like PASTE! CHALK! SOAP! as a form of self-mortification, to remind himself that he IS human, that he doesn't WANT to be a damned & undead killer.

Louis =/= Gothic Heroine? 🤔

From CLAUDIA'S POV, yes 100%, Loustat are BOTH the patriarchs from hell, her "taught to kill by her demon fathers," etc. She indeed follows the typical Gothic Heroine arc (putting aside her being a child, ofc), esp. since yes, Louis doesn't really rescue himself from his bad situations--Claudia is "my light, my salvation" who saves him in S1, and Daniel saves him in S2. But AMC!Louis has far more agency than book!Louis, in that he IS aware of the Murder Plot, and actively (albeit reluctantly) takes part in it; unlike book!Louis, totally blindsided by Claudia. He never wanted to leave Lestat--who represented FREEDOM & PASSION for him; "I was seen!" And just like Ellen/Mina, in the end Louis musters the willpower to slit Lestat's throat & "kill" his soulmate--not for his own sake, but for the sake of HIS DAUGHTER. He sacrifices his happiness for her, but still chooses Death, when he refuses to burn Lestat. He WANTS to hold hands with death, BUT ALSO sees purpose/worth in how he can weaponize his bond to Lestat to distract Les long enough to axe him.

The biggest difference with Louis & Mina/Ellen isn't GENDER, it's SPECIES--the other protags DIE, while he lives on as a vampire. (Ofc there's some iterations of Mina Harker AND Jonathan Harker/Thomas Hutter where they're permanently turned into vamps, too.)

Louis 100% wanted to leave Armand--how on earth was Louis able to leave "easily and definitively"?! 🤨 He tried to KILL HIMSELF in SanFran to get away from his boring AF life with Armand, but Armand wouldn't LET him die. He tries to do the interview in 1973 and Armand INTERRUPTS. He does the interview in 2022 and Armand INTERRUPTS. Over & over, Louis is trying to GET OUT, and he can't. This is what I mean by BLACK HORROR, cuz unlike y'all Gothic experts in the fandom, I actually have analyzed similarities between Black!Louis in IWTV, and THE Black Horror film, Get Out.

Rolin Jones constantly stresses the (over)emphasis he puts on psychological horror in IWTV, AND the effects of gaslighting and manipulation in abusive & traumatic relationships, particularly when there's already a power imbalance stemming from race & sexuality, and the withholding or resistance of knowledge in a teacher/student dynamic. The whole point is about POWER & CONTROL. It's not that one has all the power/control & the other one has none. It's about who has MORE than their FAIR share. That's what IMBALANCE means. 🤦🤦🤦 Yes, Louis allows Armand control over his life, and Armand takes ADVANTAGE of that trust and goes behind Louis' back & lies & schemes in ways that are a VIOLATION.

Just because Louis gains (temporary) socio-economic status/power as Lestat's lover does NOT mean that he is EQUAL to Lestat, and just because he loves Lestat & WANTS to be with him doesn't mean he NEVER recognizes the ways that he IS under Lestat's thrall--

"in the well with no bottom" | "We're not slaves. Maybe mindless accomplices." | "We were compelled to sleep in the same chamber together again. He would have it no other way. We would spend our hours enduring, with little pretense of getting along, locked together in hatred. He would have it no other way."

--and Daniel constantly called BS whenever Lou tried denying it:

"White master, Black student, but equal in the quiet dark." | "It's the abused-abuser psychological relationship I'm talking about. I mean, usually when you're a little too close to it, the abused still loves the abuser, but you flipped it completely on its head! Years later, you talk like he was your soul mate, like you were locked in some f**ked up gothic romance!" | "'He only beat me the one time, Officer. It's not his fault!' Classic Stockholm, eh, Doc?"

Here @pynkhues says they're not racist cuz they started reading two (2) papers on Black gender & sexuality--congrats. Thousands more to go, but you'll get there! 👍 Good news though: you don't have to read ANYTHING to see with your own 2 eyes what the show itself is messaging. The very fact that Black!Louis moves into LESTAT'S HOUSE the entire time they were together is a glaring red GAY flag. book!/film!Loustat lived in LOUIS' house, until Lou burned the plantation down and they purchased a home in NOLA together (with Lou's money). AMC!Louis doesn't TRULY embody Black masculinity, cuz it's a facade; he has a target on his back the entire time he's with Lestat; EVERYONE has something homophobic to say about Lou even associating with that flaming "queer, half queer" WHITE man (x x).

You know good & dang well that WOMEN were supposed to marry in & move in--NOT the men. Louis already had a mansion in his name--wtf is he doing moving into Lestat's townhouse on the white side of town like a WIFE? You know the whole DPDL family dynamic's further screwed up, cuz Levi's a mooch who ALSO MOVES IN, rather than doing what the man was expected to do and providing his bride with a home of HIS own.

I laughed up a storm when we found out Lestat gave Louis the deed--because it's ODD: interracial gay relationships were illegal, and Black people weren't allowed to own prime real estate in the segregated French Quarter where 1132 is. Lestat bought the house FOR Louis, but the Black people in Louis' life KNOW Louis' not embodying Black masculinity and TELL him so to his face: "Your white Daddy | The Housewife | etc." Louis tells Florence "it's half a mile BOTH ways, Mamawn," but Florence won't even set FOOT in 1132, which even the white folk know has "weird goings-on in that sodomite townhouse." The Alderman even tells Louis to put Lestat as "the public face of your operations" cuz he's white and he's the only one anyone's gonna listen to & respect, even though Louis allegedly gained REAL social status. 🙄

Lestat is the honeytrap BECAUSE white men listen to white men and are more receptive to them--on top of the fact that Lou'd already explained that the Azalea worked as a "revolving door of prey" so Loustat could EAT the Johns (mostly Lestat, cuz Lou'd already started hating killing people)--TOURISTS like the white man who asked them directions for the Fairplay. Les takes the man cuz he's going to EAT HIM. He asks him how long he's in town, to confirm if anyone would NOTICE when he goes MISSING. Pynkhues' post also conflates/ignores the timeline of events, as if Lou's a housewife DURING the time he owns the Azalea, which....NO. Claudia's housewife quote in 1x5 (c. 1925) and Louis owning the Azalea PRE-Claudia in 1x2-1x3 (c. 1910-1917) are 2 radically different contexts. 🤦 Yes, Lou IS revelling in his newfound high social status, and yes, he insists on paying Lestat back specifically so no one can throw the fact that he had to borrow the money to buy the Fairplay in his face. But this is NOT about Lestat as the "placating partner while Lou's king of the castle"--in front of all the most important white businessmen in the city, Lestat DISMISSES the Azalea as "Louis' HOBBY," just like rich husbands who keep their wives busy & happy buying them silly little nail salons & florist shops & dog grooming salons & fashion shops to run! (x x) 💀 Back then, male pimps/gangsters like IRL Tom Anderson owned brothels, but they sure AF didn't RUN them--that was the MADAME'S job, for women like IRL Bricktop Jackson. Louis was doing WOMEN'S WORK. By marrying Lestat, Louis' "civil death" was in full swing, it just took Storyville burning as the final nail in the coffin. After that, Lou's thoroughly domesticated and doesn't interact with businessmen like Tom Anderson for YEARS.

This applies not just to AMC!Loustat, but to book/film Loustat, too:

Louis is NOT the dominant one in Loustat's relationship--he's patently submissive, as he either willingly/reluctantly capitulates to the whims & demands of everyone around him--from society at large, to his biological family--to even his Blood family, yanked around by Lestat AND Claudia for his eating habits to his leaving NOLA. From Louis' conception by AR, the theme of SLAVERY was a main point--not just book!Lou's status as a slaveowner(par for the course for moneyed French white colonists in the 19th century American South), but also the power imbalance between Loustat that manifested as "need and control, with one vampire dominating another for companionship or slavery."

Lestat represents the man Anne wanted to be, as she was sick & tired of how victimized & depressed & submissive & CONTROLLED she (Louis) felt under her husband Stan (Lestat). Just because Louis mouths off does NOT mean he's the one in control--the stalemate at 1132 existed because Louis REFUSED TO ACT. His INACTION in the face of Lestat's domineering behavior was because he was afraid of the consequences of what would happen if he DID defend himself & stand up & exert kinetic resistance (a la the Alderman) or action (a la Grace's door): his power was in his submission, like I've said 1000x.

Mouthy Black people getting put in their place is the whole point of another Black Horror/psychological thriller with interracial dynamics, Antebellum (2020). Not giving away too much of the movie, cuz it has a major plot twist, but the visual motifs are all about covering/opening the mouth, cuz the story's about a bunch of people known for being vocal for Black empowerment, who're rounded up & sold into slavery to be tortured, raped & killed by their white masters. The mater of main character Eve (played by the GOAT Janelle Monae) claims to "love" her even as he rapes & beats her; traumatizing her so badly that she goes silent & is too scared to help the other slaves run away to freedom, for fear that she'll be BURNED again--her master burned an an iron brand on her, marking her as his property. The monsters are the white slaveowners. The film can be hard to watch cuz they don't shy away from graphic scenes; it's horrific.

Just like Louis all throughout S1, and Lou & Claudia at the Trial, they're forced into silence & punished for speaking up to defend themselves or exert any autonomy--which RACISTS see as "disrespect." 🙄😒 And Claudia's burned alive, her own words used against her to damn her to death. And Louis' memories are used against him, everyone from Lestat to Armand to even Daniel contradicting his words, till he can't be sure what's true or not, and just goes with whatever the white man says, he's been worn down so badly. UNLIKE Claudia, he CANNOT run away from Dubai--Armand wiped that impulse from him after his final "eff off and find me later" in 1973 SanFran. And we're just left with Armand's word that he was telling the truth about Louis "asking" him to.

Louis ENCOURAGES Claudia to leave & be free THRICE OVER:

1x5 when she runs away and Loustat BOTH let her leave--(Louis begs her not to go, but never actually STOPS her, cuz he KNOWS she's right to be mad at him. He spends the next 7 years sending out telepathic apologies, letting her know that he still loves & misses her and that she has a home to come back to--but that return is always on HER terms, NEVER his.)

1x6 when SHE asks him to come to Europe with her and HE tells her: "You don't need me. You think you do, but you don't. You're smarter now. You see trouble coming a mile away." LESTAT was the one who dragged her back home like a runaway slave!

ALL OF S2: "New Orleans, unhappy. Vampire homeland, unhappy. Paris, unhappy. Comes the coven, you're beaming like the whole world went technicolor. I didn't want to wreck that for you. You picked the coven! You left me! Go sit in your choice, Sister!" HE asks HER if they can go back home in 2x1; he follows HER lead, as he does from 1x6 all the way to 2x6 when he makes Madeleine for her so they can LEAVE Paris together--without him. ARMAND is the one who uses her family reunion with Louis as a trap to have them all hamstrung through the BONE so they cant escape when he puts them on Trial & kills Claudia, then spends the next 77 years covering up the details.

Coercing Emotionally leveraging her rebirth in 1x4 & physically assaulting her in 1x7 - Yes, agreed.

Lou's less concerned with "influencing Claudia's DIET" as he is about her SADISM/"extravagance" that LESTAT kept enabling/encouraging. His whole point about killing is that "you don't have to humiliate them;" then WHAT happens in 2x7? He outright tells Claudia when she's grossed out by him drinking fish blood that "it's not just what you eat. You can kill quick and painless." His open disgust over THEIR diet is no better or worse than THEIR open disgust for HIS. And they BOTH ganged up on him in 1x6 to force him to agree to Lestat rule about "when he hunt, we hunt HUMAN," rather than going by what Lou said: "I eat what I eat, she eats what she eats, we RESPECT our differences." But as soon as Lestat was back in the house & exerting more & more authority, the balance between Louis & Claudia evaporated. And even in 2x2 Paris, Armand noticed that "the male hunted to please HER."

WHEN does Louis guilt Claudia into staying? 🤨 LESTAT guilts Claudia into staying in his threats on the train.

Louis threw Lestat out of LOUIS' house; he got the deed baby! And Lestat had already BEEN gone--Lou just confirmed that Les could STAY that way--but NOTHING lil ole Claudia & crippled Lou could've done would've ACTUALLY stopped Les from waltzing back into that house, be serious. (As for Antoinette, who CARES?! 🤣 That's what that skank gets for sleeping with a married man!)

What does Louis being a former pimp have to do with how he treated Claudia? Did he pimp Claudia out to the public for money and have her walking the streets to promote his businesses and punish her when she refused? NO. But you know who DID treat her that way? ARMAND. And you know who told Armand that he didn't like it? LOUIS. (Please miss me with any & all pimp arguments.)

Louis definitely threatened Grace at the funeral, yes, but when did he strong arm his mother? 🤨 She was the one who refused to let him in his own house to see his sister & nieces (whom SHE was busy badmouthing to so they'd be afraid of him). Levi literally tried to FIGHT Louis to keep Louis off his own property, when LEVI'S useless arse never contributed one red cent to LOUIS' house! The door getting kicked in was an accident, but OH FRIKKIN WELL, it's HIS door. (Miss me with any & all talk about Florence & Levi, omg.)

Yes, Miss Lily was expendable. But her death was all wrapped up in Lestat's relentless barrage of Come to Me, leading to Lou's drunken suicidal death spiral running to the confession booth screaming about how he wanted to die cuz he was a dirty gay sinning pimp whose family hated him. He had no time to mourn Lily. He BARELY had time to mourn Paul. And once he was a newlywed getting his back blown out to the rings of Saturn every night, sorrynotsorry but chile ain't nobody thinking about the woman he paid to sit in a room and talk to him! 😅

If Louis had been literally any other pimp, and if the Alderman wasn't suffering from chronic Jungle Fever smitten with her, Bricktop would've been DEAD. It was illegal during Jim Crow for Black people to even look white folk in the eye without their permission--"get your hand off me, N****r!," let alone bash their skull in and cuss them out "You put a SIR on the end of that!" Be serious, and understand the gravity of the situation in that scene, and how remarkable it was that Bricktop was NOT tossed to the wolves, where the Alderman would've been able to do WAY worse than sodomize her. It's wild AF how modern white folk are more ignorant about the history of racism than Black people, like wtf.

Yes, Louis helped curse her into damnation as a vampire--in the book/film he drains her & almost kills her, and Lestat brings her back as a vamp; while AMC!Lou's actions killing the Alderman was the catalyst sparking the racist white people burning Storyville down--and Claudia's house with it. 😡 The "monstrousness" Pynkhues nastily accuses Louis of is willfully misdirected to absolve the white racists of blame in order to damn Louis. His killing that p.o.s. Alderman is NOT a Byronic act, its VIGILANTISM due to the RACISM he experienced at the Aldermand's hands, that he stood up against by killing him and then IMMEDIATELY REGRETTING IT as he saw the devastation that happened to Storyville--the Bryonic hero does not REGRET/REPENT his misdeeds--as you cited above! 🤦 Claudia is indeed "trapped in the body of a little girl," but Louis does NOT "imprison/trap" Claudia in that house--just like Paul, he was the one encouraging her to be free & LEAVE when he knew he wouldn't.

As such, misreadings like this totally miss the mark of Louis' character arc, and I'm mind boggled. "Defiance" had NOTHING to do with Louis leaving NOLA--he regretted leaving Lestat the entire time, and was constantly hallucinating Lestat cuz he just wanted to go back home--and the SECOND he got free of Armand's shenanigans, he was back on a plane and in a car driving WHERE? To NOLA. And WHY? "I came to see you," LESTAT. And any "defiance" against Armand would've amounted to EFF ALL if Daniel hadn't gotten the real script from the Talamasca.

Gothic Heroines - Female Gothic vs Male Gothic

And guess what? Queer Gothic sits in the middle of this venn diagram--or rather, it creates a brand new paradigm where vampiric Gothic Horror stories written by a white woman in the 1970s about a white bisexual man can now be adapted in the 2020s by a white male showrunner and his MULTICULTURAL TEAM of male AND female writers about a Black gay man who represents male AND female social anxieties & struggles alike.

Westengard, Laura. "Queer Gothic Literature and Culture." Twentieth Century Gothic (2022): 259-272.

Claudia & Louis often SHARE/SPLIT the role of the Gothic Heroine--deuteragonists are a thing after all. It does NOT "diminish Claudia's arc;" instead, it lends her a more nuanced characterization, BECAUSE there are ways that she CANNOT fulfill certain Gothic Heroine tropes on her own--she's A CHILD, ffs. Louis is Claudia's surrogate adult male/female the way Lestat is Gabrielle's surrogate adult male/female.

As I've said b4 (x x), Louis is the Mina Harker/Ellen Hutter to Lestat's Dracula/Orlock--there's no way on god's green earth that anyone can seriously claim that Lestat's the female-coded character in the Dracula/Nosferatu framework of vampiric gothic horror--or any of its incarnations, from Twilight to True Blood; Louis is the Bella/Sookie, NOT Lestat (or Armand). But Lou is ALSO the Jonathan Harker/Thomas Hutter--and SO IS CLAUDIA, who does double duty as the Lucy Westenra/Anna Harding, too.

In S1 Claudia assumes the "masculine" agency Louis is expected to have as the male protagonist, but fails to live up to due to all of those character traits (typically perceived as weak & "feminine"). He's not the damsel in distress, but CLAUDIA thinks he is ("the housewife;" "we're his slaves, and I will free us both!"), and acts accordingly. Claudia/Thomas/Jonathan has consulted the scholarly experts on vampires (her vampire books | Dr. Van Helsing/Prof. Von Franz) and returns from a long period of absence (ran away from home | traveled to Dracula/Orlok's castle) to warn her companion (Louis/Ellen/Mina) about the dangers of the Big Bad Vampire corrupting them ("His love is a small box he keeps you in, don't stay in it!" | "He seeks after Ellen, I know it!" | "I know where the bastard sleeps!"). C/T/J struggles to reconcile their desperation to save their loved one with the realization that said loved one is connected to the vampire by a bond stronger than they can understand or meddle with (Loustat's cord you cannot see | DracuMina's crossing oceans of time | Orllen's dream-possession). She's not the main heroine, but C/T/J still wins a significant victory by purging the world of the other threat/impediment lurking (Antoinette/Herr Knock/Renfield).

But S2!Claudia ultimately reifies the Gothic heroine format; "victimized, virginal and powerless while being pursued by villainous men." This isn't a return to the format, since she never left it--in S1 she also represents the Lucy/Anna; the main character's closest friend & confidante, who's viciously targeted by The Vampire--either as the bait to lure his primary love interest under his influence, or to demonstrate just how much control he has over everyone's lives. Bruce, Lestat, Santiago, Armand, and even Sam all participate in her murder; but LOUIS is also a victim of the Trial, powerless to help himself or either of his daughters--a la Anna/Friedrich Harding.

Anne Rice & Self-Inserts

Last part, cuz I've hit Tumblr's image limit, grrr! Something I almost never see anyone talk about wrt Anne Rice & LDPDL is how much alcoholism was a major inspo for her vampires. Sure, on the surface one can easily say: Lord Byron was an alcoholic bisexual depressed pretty boy drug addict etc etc too. But for AR, vamps are the Embodiment of Thirst (famously levied against book!Armand), and a large part of Louis' morose depression stems from his fighting his cravings for drink--alcohol as a human & blood as a vampire; following AR's experiences with her own alcoholic mother, whose "helplessness and need [for alcohol] echoed in Louis' mannerisms: guilt, insecurity, helplessness, a sense of isolation and secrecy, low self-esteem over-reaction to criticism, and intense sadness."

Everyone on the anti-Femme!Louis side is always quick to dismiss the AR evidence as irrelevant cuz Lestat was AR's self-insert, too~~! Sure, ALL characters that authors write are to some degree a self-insert, or based on different facets of themselves. But Louis is THE Titular Vampire, and the one she originally framed TVC's narrative around, to focus on Claudia's relationship/impact on him. His depression is HERS for losing her child and resenting her husband, and her MOTHER'S for her alcoholism. And I already discussed gendered Gothic Victorian depression/melancholy/mental illness wrt Louis/Ellen here.

Evidence has been provided from Jacob Anderson, the showrunners, and even Anne Rice herself about the femme-coded dynamics, motifs & influences used to create Black!LDPDL as AMC's racebent gay Black take on Anne Rice's originally bisexual Caucasian 19th century book/film character; but this is usually conveniently downplayed or outright dismissed by those who insist on seeing Louis as a perpetuation of the racist Black stereotype of the hyper-aggressive sexually dominant hyper-masculine threat to white/female innocence--a la his portrayal in the Theatre of Vampires' smear campaign of a Trial in 2x7, which was specifically designed to sentence him and his Black daughter Claudia to death for their "crimes" against the white male co-lead Lestat de Lioncourt.

As a femme!Louis Truther, I've been increasingly agitated by the gross inequity of the fandom's ready & willing acceptance of all the parts of Lestat that are femme-coded, and the otherwise blatant & willful ignorance of Louis' in kind. Lestat, the campy fan-favorite, is more popularly accepted in the feminine role, largely on account of his being their Maker, his aesthetic appeal to white feminine norms: his long-haired blondeness, and especially his exaggerated mannerisms; which are seen as feminine by modern audiences, but are actually a gender subversion in and of itself, as a hallmark of masculine ideals in 18th/19th century Europe--a historical fact that somehow never factors into how Lestat is analyzed by his fans (even the ones who hold media literacy and nuances about 19th century Gothic contexts oh-so-sacred). Instead, they fail to see past his epidermal layers to get to the substrata of his character/behavioral dynamics vis a vis that of his Black counterpart Louis.

It ticks me off something fierce, cuz I see it for what it is: RACISM--the inability of white people to see Black!Louis as a vehicle by which he can be related to on a (white)feminine level, let alone in classically heteronormative predominately white Gothic Horror or Gothic Romance that demonizes The Other: monsters, gays & Black people alike. AMC!Louis never stood a chance with y'all bigots; but y'all hide behind media literacy & white!feminism rather than just speaking your biases with your whole chest.

[nalyra-dreaming]

re: the Nickistat vs Loumand discussion, I agree with you - in the show, Nickistat will meet about a century before Louis is even born. He can't be an active factor in their relationship in the same way Lestat was with Loumand. That said, I bet what happened with Nicki will be used to inform/parallel the choices Lestat later made with Louis (and Claudia). And Lestat's current framing of his past with Nicki will be filtered through a post-Louis lens, so to speak. Louis is his great love, and I don't think the show's going to lose sight of that, ever.

I do get why some Loumand fans were disappointed, fwiw. Some Nickistat fans may be too, depending on their particular hopes and expectations, and which direction the show takes (knowing these writers...we can assume it'll be messy as hell). Loustat are clearly the writers' overall priority. It was a smart adaptational choice to build the story around their romance and everyone involved has done a wonderful job of portraying it, but I get that fans who preferred other book pairings or wanted more focus on polyamory might be bummed out. So I get the disappointment wrt Loumand's portrayal, even if I don't quite get why it came as a surprise to anyone. Rolin & co spelled out the fact that Loustat are the heart of the show from day one, and as harsh as this may sound, anyone who cannot stomach that idea probably shouldn't be watching from this point on (for their own sake tbh).

Well, as Sam already said in Autumn’s video, what happened with Nicki influences Lestat’s actions, and heavily. Wrt Claudia’s turning, too. So yes, I do think it will pay heavily into what happens to Louis and Lestat, and HAS happened with them, too.

As such I do think there will be further flashbacks and parallels.

But yes - as you said: they always said the show was built around Loustat… and without shade (!! because I DO understand the disappointment!!) - the other relationships (of Louis and Lestat) will be second place to that I guess - because this is what they are built around.

The show has made that clear and they do seem to follow through accordingly.

That said I do think they will do them justice. And I do think they gave Loumand a lot more nuance and thereby did them justice. Just… probably differently than some hoped.

And that will likely be the same for Nickistat.

Which… might be a bitter pill to swallow for some :/