#you didn't have to but you acknowledged my post

[dadrielle]

I am going to treat this as being in good faith even though I know you have copy pasted this same response on multiple posts.

It's fair enough to see this post and roll your eyes about it. I am being a sarcastic lil bitch about implications that really aren't meant to be there! Liam absolutely didn't mean to do this as an "Orym doesn't trust them" or "Orym doesn't respect their boundaries" thing, and I know that. And I know no one in game is gonna read it that way, either. I didn't tag this Orym specifically because I was picking at a small thing irritably and I fully acknowledge that.

But! There are 3 things I want to say to this on a more serious note.

First, I think we must acknowledge that the implications of listening in on one's friends over listening in on one's enemies are quite different. People have different reactions to different applications of Observant because the social stakes and boundaries are situational. It means something much different to punch an enemy combatant in the face than it does to do the same to your best friend, you know? And Orym is not omnipotent; he does not just automatically know everything that happens, despite how we all joke that he can see god with his high perception. When he chooses to listen in should matter, as should the implications. That's actually my main issue with this whole thing, but I'll get to that in a moment.

Second, I would just like to say while I'm sure you believe it's true I and others critical of Orym don't talk about any of Orym's actual flaws, the fact of the matter is there are many fans who do most of our character discussion privately with our friends instead of tumblr or god, even worse, twitter. And my Orym feelings aren't identical to every other person who is critical of him. As I said in the initial tags for this, I don't think this was the worst thing in the world, it just bugged me! That was just an emotional response, and those often pass. There are lots of moments in stories where my initial reaction is a strong negative emotion, because I am feeling the feelings of the moment, but then I love the full picture it creates. Imogen and Laudna's "did we break up" phase is a great example of that, especially Laudna's ongoing insistence that she was a dead end. It hurt to watch! It made me sad! But it really enriched the narrative! My actual, continuing issues with this Orym moment have nothing to do with Imodna, or the meanings of this moment in particular. It's just another expression of something I've been grousing about among friends for ages. I actually WISH it was Orym being fucked up, that it was something that would come up again later, something he might get push back on. I wish the implication that he feels the need to monitor Imogen and Laudna, that he isn't thinking about how they might feel about it, was a flaw that would be explored with the other characters. Instead it was just kinda there and I imagine no one else will ever have a reaction to it one way or another.

And that leads to the final thing: my biggest issue with Orym listening in is that it DOESN'T matter. It feels like at some point, Liam stopped having Orym engage with other characters and the narrative as actively. It's started to feel very repetitive, and I am deeply frustrated with it. I know he is a reserved, PTSD-laden soldier who uses his hard line morality and sense of duty to hold himself together, who refuses to tell his friends how he feels because he doesn't want to be a burden. I know this! And I think it makes for an interesting character and I want to love Orym as much as I used to. But this is an interactive game, an ongoing narrative, and after a certain point, choosing to have your scenes be solo and keeping your character from changing any of their stances starts to feel like refusing to give other people room to react and challenge your character, and refusing to engage with how others' narratives have changed. What Imogen expressed about not running in this episode isn't a revelation. She has, at this point, been saying some variation of it for about half the campaign. And he has told her he is proud, before. It was nice, then! But listening in to their conversation here and feeling proud in isolation didn't add anything new to the narrative. It could have, if it was a conversation, if he had talked to Imogen directly. But instead it feels so empty to me. Disconnected. It even sort of re-framed the moment as if it was about Imogen Finally Choosing To Not Run, instead of being about Laudna trying to reaffirm a future that keeps slipping from their grasp, one she only just started to believe in again on the precipice of Imogen possibly sacrificing herself for the world. It makes it seem like Orym has barely moved on from the solstice, like he hasn't registered how Imogen's narrative has developed since then.

There are so many things I would love to see from Orym that require acknowledging that things have changed. I wanted him to talk to Dorian instead of chasing after Dorian's dad to say he should be proud of Dorian, especially since Dorian had already had his big cathartic conversation. I wanted him to ask why Dorian has come to hate the gods so much, to ask him why it wasn't just the Spider Queen he was mad at. I wanted him to talk to Fearne about the fact that people outside the party have treated her with the same anti-Ruidusborn suspicion as Imogen, particularly in light of their conversation about taking Imogen out pre-solstice. I wanted him to actually internalize that he was wrong about there being nothing beautiful in Exandria before the gods, and to talk to Ashton about it in a way that starts with him actively listening to Ashton instead of just repeating the same arguments, even if he came out the other side still disagreeing. I wanted him to realize that there hasn't been any danger of Imogen running and that the core of her struggle now is with the fact that she's being asked to sacrifice herself. I wanted him to talk to someone about his guilt over killing Zathuda. I wanted him to acknowledge the hardness he put on when he tossed the locket on Bor'dor's corpse and declared this was war and what that hardness did to him. I wanted him to work on his flaws and talk to people! But instead, he listened and reacted in isolation. The fact that his reaction to Fearne asking him if he was ok as late as episode 95 was just "then why ask? You know the answer" instead of opening up is narratively a problem for me. The few times he has opened up a little have been wonderful but he's still holding most of it to the chest. So many emotional Orym scenes are people talking to him about his emotions and him not responding. We're in too deep, man! "If not now, when?" doesn't just apply to kissing Dorian, you know? He is running out of time to open up.

So. Do I still think listening in on that moment was sucky of him, even beyond the hyperbole? Sure. I think generally purposefully eavesdropping on something like that is sucky. It's a small kind of sucky, though. A blip. Because this is a story, the big sucky thing is that it didn't mean anything for any other character and felt just narratively disconnected. And I find that so frustrating because there are so many potentially meaty, interesting things possible in Orym's story, and I desperately want that richer narrative for him and for Dorian and for all of them.

You might not agree and that's fine. To paraphrase Orym's own words, every one of us forms our own interpretations with the lenses or prisms we see life through. Of course I'm gonna get more het up when this ongoing, general Orym frustration touches on something Imogen or Laudna related - they're my favorites! Of course that influences how I see things. I know they aren't everyone's favorites, so something like this moment won't be a domino-kick on tangentially related, piling frustrations for everyone. But it is for me. I'm not really trying to convince anyone I'm right, here, just to explain why I feel this way about it.

Sure would be fucked up if Imogen and Laudna, until only recently, had every single one of their private moments observed against their will, and then their friend decided to observe possibly their last private moment against their will, huh? :)

[pinkpastels113]

Tell us how you feel about arcane. Use your emotion words! Use a visual aid if you must, too lol.

you want some visual aid? i'll give you some visual aid:

that describes perfectly ab how i am feeling rn

first of all the LESBIAN SEX SCENE????!! I-??!! i knew that something was bound to happen (esp after meljay and the rated for sex warning in season 2) and i celebrated when they (finally) kissed but oh my god?? an actual lesbian sex scene? in a prison?? in vi's sister's prison?? after a parallel about how cait is always finding her in a prison and expected her to be there?? (with dramatic music and banter and soft giggling and the ANGLES and HAND PLACEMENTS??) I AM NOT OKAY

just that scene alone is enough to nudge me off a cliff. but moving on

how is JAYVIK more homoerotic than now-100%-canon caitvi?? that's all i have to say. (what do you MEAN that love conquers all?? that he loved and admired viktor for all his imperfections and that was what made him special and beautiful?? GET OUTTA HERE)

i did not know that i needed timebomb until this season but HOLY FUCKING SHIT why must you make ekko fall (surprisingly, even to himself) in love with jinx/older powder and have that ripped away from him not like two days later?? WHYYYYY (the dance. the "can we pretend it's like the first time?" the "oh and he's got lines." the nervous wave after he fucked up in that scene with dead vi and powder was like hmp and he goes :(. the mural. im sent. im gone. nobody speak to me.)

ISHA NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO (she was just trying to be like jinx and copy everything that she does and is and looked up to her as a hero STOP WHY MUST YOU DO THIS TO ME. also the song?? IM CHINESE BRO AND I WAS SOOOO EMOTIONAL OVER THE LYRICS like hit me where it fucking hurts why dont you)

i cried at how vander suffered a fate worse than death. @becasbelt can attest to that

caitlyn adfshjk i knew she would come around and she was and always has been my blorbo (even if she stayed evil) MWAH my female rage filled, slightly wild, grief clouded, confident, "im an excellent shot," sexy, " i am a decorated officer, leader of house kiramman, address me with respect, or keep your mouth shut." dictator, vampire, badass, mofo. YES

the way she said "no amount of good deeds can undo our crimes" hit me bc she's acknowledging that she went off the rails and did some pretty bad things to justify and achieve (which she didn't. not really) her goals

i LOVED jinx in this season. she single-handedly made it a comedy show and was the sole focus of a lot of the emotional damage the storytellers and animators wanted to convey

the way jesus came to be and then quickly became evil SDFHSDKJ i was legit like WEEO WEEO ABORT ABORT JESUS HAS TURNED EVIL (also want to point out the "no you wont" sky dialogue bc DAMN she really called you out huh viktor)

that alternate universe timebomb episode had me gasping so much (like SILCO?? WHAT ARE YOU DOING THERE?? WHERE DID YOU COME FROM?? what do you mean everyone is well and happy but at the cost of vi's death???) i think i had asthma for a split second there

MELLLL MY GODDESS MVP PLAYER you saved cait's ass so many times it's not even funny and ugh the way you finally stood up to your mom (very cleverly too, i might add) ugh i applaud

EKKO MY KINGGG the way he hurts himself so bad turning back time and specifically saving jinx from offing herself BYE

HEIMERDINGER MY TINY ANNOYING/affectionate FURBALL WHYY

no but yea i am ruined and my emotions have faded away into numbness and i hope this post was relatable to the people in the arcane fandom and i also agree that this season was way too condensed and rushed and the last episodes in particular needed at least a couple more to drag out the events and character development bc at times when i am supposed to be cheering i am crying and at times i am supposed to be crying i am screaming and at times i am supposed to be screaming i am Horny and at times i am supposed to be Horny my heart is wrenching but only a few tears slip out bc IT IS CUT TO THE NEXT SCENE AGAIN??? does that make sense??

(also do we think jinx is actually dead or no. im still not sure but obv i would hope/am hoping that she is lmao)

[olderthannetfic]

/post/767033281734688768/i-hate-the-convos-about-passing-but-i-do-think I'd love to agree with this, because it touches on a point I've made constantly in response to "but bi people in f/m partnerships don't need to worry about being with their partner in public," which is "true, but to say they're privileged because of that also means closeted gay people are privileged, and a non-passing trans man with a cis male partner is privileged, and a lot of people would be mad as hell if you said that." It's not that individual instances of privilege in comparison to other queer people never occur, but deciding "x identity is inherently privileged" isn't actually a conclusion you can come to because of that. Any passing privilege, whether it's bi people in f/m partnerships, closeted gay people, non-passing gay trans people with cis partners or passing straight trans people with cis partners, inherently relies on your identity being secret, and being forced to lie about your identity just to maintain privilege isn't privilege in the same way cishets are privileged. It's not "privilege" in the truest sense, it's...survival? Which I feel is what this anon sort of fails at recognising, even if she recognises that any passing privilege is conditional and you can pass and also be oppressed, because like...at the end she says we all need to band together as a community and lift each other up, but that sentiment is sort of incompatible with the earlier sentiment of "people that pass, now is our moment to put ourselves on the line to help the less privileged!" and like...that's actually just going to endanger the people that pass. It's not actually the responsibility of people that pass to be allies or human shields right now. Can't we, you know, call on FUCKING CISHET PEOPLE to step up to the responsibility of being allies right now? There are way, way, way many more of them than us anyway. For most people that pass, there are still going to be many aspects of their lives affected by queerphobia. If op can acknowledge that, and she did, then she might be able to see why "people that are only suffering slightly less than other queer people, it's OUR RESPONSIBILITY to be allies right now!" might feel dismissive. (Also as people in the notes pointed out, "aroace women aren't affected by abortion bans" is a very very very ignorant opinion to have. I'm getting sterilised despite being aroace because, you know, rape exists, and aroace women face high rates of corrective assault.)

--

Cleaning out my inbox from a couple of weeks ago.

Finding all the asks I didn't read for obvious reasons.

[va1kyr14]

Right, I have time to sit down and really digest what happened yesterday so here goes. This is mainly going to be about Caitvi but will contain others.

Be warned if you haven't watched it!

So firstly what a fucking ride.

The animation, the story and what they have done is absolutely incredible and have set the bench mark for future studios because my tiny brain is blown.

But diving into the things that I thought could have been better, like a lot of people have said, the pacing seemed off when they nailed it in S1. And yes I did wait until everything was released to share my thoughts. We probably got even more Caitvi content than S1, but with everything going on everywhere and it being a faster paced in regards to action, It did seem like the relationship from S1 to the end was just a bit off. Not saying it wasn't incredible, it was, but I think there were things that didn't add to the story much which could have been replaced with other character progression.

Having said that, I watched all of S1 all in one go when it came out, and I think that if we did the same with S2 and one straight after the other, I don't think we would be necessarily seeing it as much. Just my thoughts.

We didn't get an Caitlyn apology only an acknowledgement apart from when she was speaking to Jinx and an angry Vi separately. We could argue that the way she spoke to Vi before the spice was her was of apologising but I don't know I really would have liked a better explanation.

I did love the two sides of one coin but not the fact that you can't have a universe where both sisters live. That broke my heart but understand it. I also do think Jinx survived, and got out the vents and went off in the blimp at the end. I think Cait knew too, being her smart self but knew that Vi would go after her if she knew. That was a sweet scene at the end - even though not a fan of pirate Cait as I said in a previous post. I hope if they do something in the future she has like a fake eye or something I would prefer that over a patch.

Now moving onto the SEX SCENE....

Holy fucking shit. I don't know what I expected but it wasn't that. The animation, the fucking intimacy the likes I have never seen, it was perfect. I do think the setting was a bit weird but when you have all the pent up frustrations and lets be honest they are dramatic lesbians, Its going to happen. I would have liked to have seen it maybe in Cait's bed if anywhere but the urgency mixed with gentleness and all the little micro actions.

The PULL IN AFTER THE UNDOING OF THE BUCKLE.

I can't. Like I am speechless.

It was everything I hoped from a first time, from the giggles to everything else and just every tiny action jesus these animators are something else. I am not ashamed for Netflix to watch the algorithm and see I have watched that same 2 minutes for about 9 hours straight.

It has broken boundaries, not just for queer representation, the fact that neither of them died and got a happy ending in something like Arcane is remarkable, but in regards to animation of a sex scene a lesbian one at that, I think the benchmark has now been set and it will be known as this generations' Korrasami. This is will go down in history and I am not even being dramatic.

Anyway that was more of a ramble than an in depth post, and I have no idea what to do with myself now. We have AO3 and fanart and I guess we will have a bit more content until the end of the month with promotion but I guess when you have a hyperfixation you aren't ready to say goodbye. So I raised a glass to all the content creators who are now going to carry on the mantle. I will be reading and liking everything I can, I salute you.

To summarise, the series could have been better IMO but thats what happens when expectations are so high, there was none of that in series 1 and it was perfect in my eyes. You can't please everyone, but I think Arcane as an overall package is wonderful and Caitvi will live on in my heart and others which have created a benchmark for queer content and I am so proud of everyone involved.

And to all the fellow queers out there...

We did it, we won.

[oodlyenough]

Just using a cut to spare people's dashboards the length lol:

I agree with most of this too. I didn't touch on everyone (incl. Ekko) in this post because when I started to write my s2 thoughts they were too long to fit in one post so I just arbitrarily broke it into chunks lol.

I think for all the valiant effort of the art team to include a lot of different races, body types, etc in the cast, the actual story has some issues in that regard. I don't/won't get into race a ton just because it's not really my wheelhouse, but I definitely agree that where they make cuts can be telling, whether by accident or not. Sevika MUST have had dialogue at some point in their 2-hr-finale draft that got cut, for example, it's the only thing that makes sense to me. They should have done a lot differently with Sky but they especially should not have written a Black woman into that role.

Across both seasons I felt like Ekko in particular was extremely lovable but not ... um... dynamic? as a character. Like he's just so good, at everything, good hearted and a good leader and a good inventor etc, that they didn't seem to know what to do with him storywise so he gets benched for acts at a time or not really acknowledged. Episode 7 was maybe my favourite ep of the season and I thought was good for him, but even there I would have liked to see Ekko struggle a little bit with having to leave this great timeline, or (if they'd structured the story differently) question whether he was right to go try to change time back or whatever even if it meant dooming the cities and Powder and Mylo/Claggor/Vander. (Again they just avoided this conflict by having the "good" timeline continue on without him, with an alt Ekko in his place, rather than just disappearing entirely... which works for the multiverse plotline, but means there's no real moral dilemma for Ekko or anything).

I'm less sure about the women in this particular instance because I do think Arcane is pretty dominated by female characters (which is great) and in the specific cases of Vi, Jinx and Caitlyn I don't really think the lack of screentime is the issue so much as just what they chose to do with that screentime and some of it ... not ... being very good. For most of the season it felt like Jinx was the only character consistently appearing, while others popped in for one ep per act. But they spent so much of that screentime on Isha only to kill her off and kind of shrug it away, for eg. I don't feel like things got cut from Jinx's story so much as I feel that her story just was not very good -- and mostly that's how I feel for Vi and Cait too.

The other social elephant in the room is homophobia I think. Cait and Vi being explicitly romantic is great, but having seen the awkward-as-hell China edits, the admission they got a "slap on the wrist" and had to dial down the sex scene, or even the waffling Linke does with Jayce and Viktor in interviews, I have to wonder how much that plays in. Cait and Vi can be in a relationship only as long as we can cut out or edit around their romances overseas, you know? So their relationship has to be kind of a side thing, it can't be the main story like say Catra & Adora's was, or contrast with Jayce and Viktor, whose relationship gets extremely centre-stage in the plot, but always toes the line of plausible deniability.

I am also curious why every episode is confined to 40 minutes, apart from a 50-min finale. I think even ten more minutes per episode might've helped some of these issues. I'm going to assume it was more an issue of production time/budget, because a show like this takes so long to animate every frame. But... yeah. It hurt lol.

more arcane s2 thoughts in no particular order. this is pretty negative. woops

Cait, Vi, Caitvi

despite being what initially got me watching to begin with caitvi just never ended up being my primary interest with this show, so going into s2 it wasn't like I had very well formulated expectations or hopes. I think if I had I would maybe feel disappointed? They had some nice moments, they got the kiss and the sex scene, they're clearly endgame, etc, and that's nice, but it also felt like their relationship was so ... never really the star of the show or focus of the story to the extent I expected it to be. Did they even get a big fight-together battle-couple moment in the last ep, I don't think so? I didn't find the resolution to their Act 1 breakup especially good, I think Caitlyn owed Vi an apology and Vi deserved to be angry for longer than ten seconds.

I generally feel across both seasons that Vi's pain and trauma is rarely given as much weight as other characters', I was pretty underwhelmed by Caitlyn's dictator arc after being extremely interested in it at the end of act 1...

I dunno. I hope their stans liked it and are satisfied getting to see them kiss and have sex and be together and I wouldn't downplay the significance of The Couple in Arcane being a lesbian couple. But I wasn't personally very compelled or moved by it.

Jinx

Like the above I'm not a Jinx academic by any means but I think if I were I would be frustrated by how cyclical her arc was in season 2. And no, having Silco show up to be like "it's a cycle" doesn't really justify the narrative interludes. Isha is a hard sell of a character for me because I don't ... generally want little kid characters around ... and I found Jinx (basically) looking straight into the camera to say "gee you are just like me, Powder, when I was a little kid, which reminds me of being Powder, is this how Silco felt, is this how Vi felt" to be hamfisted. But some of the scenes with the two of 'em and Sevika were cute ... only for Isha to die and Jinx to be depressed, again, and then come through the other side, again, and then "die", again. Like if we wanted to deal with depressed Jinx we started off s2 that way...

I've seen other posts by Jinx fans that articulate much better the ways in which she goes from the driving plot force in s1 and main autonomous actor to just kind of being wafted around by plot in season 2 so I won't repeat them. But I think they are right. I also question the way her mental illness was portrayed -- or rather wasn't... -- in season 2. Powder in the AU showing no sign of illness (despite baby Powder in the main timeline already having some of that going on, pre-Vander death)... I mean, sure, she's got a support system etc in that world, and one can argue we don't spend enough time with AU Powder to necessarily see it, but combined with the Isha stuff it just kind of felt like a weird message.

Sevika

I love Sevika, one of my faves from s1. I was so excited she seemed to get a bigger role in act 1 and then in the first ep of act 2. And then she never spoke again. What the hell man... like damn... really?????!? Not a WORD in act 3? I'm sure this was some of the stuff they trimmed to get that finale down to 50 minutes but god that sucks, so much, in ways a wordless shot of her in the council chamber can't really resolve. Which leads me to

Piltover-Zaun

I have to admit I don't think the class politics in s1 are as good as they were reported to be, so I didn't have high hopes, but MAN is Piltover going "hey we need cannon fodder <3 thanks" not... a reasonable resolution... especially after an indeterminate time of Piltover being EVEN MORE oppressive with Caitlyn enforcing martial law. It was sooooooooo ridiculous. Also, lol @ the show acting like hextech is solely responsible for the suffering of the undercity. If only Vi, Jayce and Viktor weren't around we'd have a equitable utopia. Sure Jan.

Sky

One of the most offensively written female characters I've seen in recent media. A spectacular, zero-effort failure from the writers. What a horrible decision to write this poor girl, a Black woman no less, and give her absolutely no characterization outside of an unrequited crush on a gay white man. In season 1 I could forgive most of it because a show like Arcane needs redshirts and it's just unfortunate they made this particular redshirt a young Black woman. There are so many other complex and developed women in the show, I thought, they can afford to have some minor ones who aren't.

But oh my god season 2. The ghost hallucination which they never even clarify as being "really" Sky or just being the Hexcore or just being his own imagination of guilt because neither the show nor Viktor give enough of a fuck to explain fhglakhdglh. Even posthumously she barely has any dialogue except to reference off-screen conversations with Viktor we never see them have and then die again. "No you won't" ?????? It is ridiculous that they wrote this.

[katsy-kitty]

I'm up-to-date with my notifs, but I may not respond right away.

I do read what you write, though.

And everyone has been so kind to me it makes me feel seen and heard and yes I let you know me see me I gave you a rare gift

and you did want it :3

tee-hee

sorry the sillies got to me

but I'm still sad so

oscillating between just sad and the other thing, but I'm still NOT an active risk so no worries

[dukeofthomas]

Jason Todd's the aroace guy who doesn't realize he's aroace but is also not oblivious to how big a driving force sexual attraction is for other people. He's the type to dislike and judge men for thinking with their dicks so much and kind of think himself better than them because of the fact that he doesn't

[front-facing-pokemon]

[mushyposts]

TUMBLR PLEAAASE LET ME POST THIS NOW PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE.

OF COURSE!!! This is the sort of analysis I could honestly talk about for hours, and if you have ANY more thoughts on my fic, please please PLEASE dont be scared to message me and hash it out!! I absolutely love the chance to think critically and analytically about my work.

You are absolutely not projecting, and even if you were, that would be entirely valid!! Creativity exists as a vessel for us as humans to feel, and if my writing at all helps you process any feelings you have around the themes I explore in it then I think i have more then succeeded in my task as a writer! : D

I also think that as a writer, I can put as much intent as I physically can into my writing. I can spend hours working to make sure a certain theme is perceived the specific way I want it to be, but if someone takes it a different way then I cant change that! I can take it as it is, and from there move and try to approach the theme in a different way, but people all have different live experiences that will make them see what i write differently. My experiences with parental figures, their presence, lack of, and their affection towards me will always be different to yours for example, and that means you will see how I write the parental dynamics in my writing different to how I do! Does that make sense?

Okay onto the actual analysis LMAO!! I think that people get caught up in this idea of "The choice was made for the greater good, so he should be absolved." and although yes, there is merit to understanding Hakoda didn't want to leave and was doing what he thought was the best choice for his kids and the future of his tribe its also SUPER important to understand that there were other ways.

A few things when considering the argument of Hakoda taking ALL the men, is firstly that we don't actually know how many people were in the "fleet" and there is some defence to the idea of them needing every working hand they can get, however I also think that alongside this argument is if Hakoda was doing this to protect his tribe it would have made sense to at LEAST leave enough men to defend them, or train Sokka and the other younger boys to have some form of defence.

I think the closest we get at seeing how many are in the fleet is pre-black sun, when they all meet up, and even then those numbers are skewed because of the involvement of other groups of people. EG: The swamp benders, the earthbenders and then the people who took residence at the northern airtemple. I do, however, personally believe that there should have been some men left behind to defend.

Another thing to consider is the canon timeline for when Kya dies and then when Hakoda leaves and then to canon actually is kind of inconsistent? We can assume Hakoda left around when Sokka was 13, but during the flashback of Kya's death along with the flashbacks in Bato of the water tribe where we see Hakoda leave, Sokka actually looks a lot younger. As far as I'm aware, as a show only watcher who doesnt actively intend on reading the comics, we dont really know how long the time between Kyas death and Hakoda leaving is. I even say at the start of my fic that I fucked with the canon timeline a bit to make it line up a bit better.

I think the show acknowledges Hakoda's abandonment and the complex ways thats hurt both Sokka and Katara in subtle ways. Katara very outwardly displaying her upset, albeit initially passive aggressively, she does eventually burst out, telling him "we needed you." and Hakoda apologises. Sokka is more internal, he obsesses over his ability to explain his plans, how he's perceived by his peers, an obsession with masculinity and what it means to be a man when you were never truly taught it in the first place.

I also think something that people tend to get mixed up with when it comes to critiquing Hakoda as a father, is they often equate being a bad dad, to being an abuser.

Hakoda, at least in my interpretations and I never intend for him to come off as so, isnt an abusive father. He is not a perfect father, he has made many choices that led to the long lasting hurt of his children. Speaking in the development of my own fic and how i've worked with Hakoda's character, he is an absent figure who was faced with an impossible choice and should have thought through it in more depth. He made a choice, and although its hard to fully say without a doubt he chose wrong, it had severely negative ramifications on the mental well being of his children.

Theres a lot to be said on the nuance of abuse, neglect, absent parental figures, especially fathers, and I don't want to speak TOO heavily on this because again, its such a nuanced and complex topic that I think I couldn't even begin to unwrap in tumblr reblogs. Theres some incredible fics out there exploring this with Hakoda and Sokka's dynamic, and I even have a one shot in the making all about this stuff in the canon universe seperate from my writing, but I just REALLY want to emphasise that I am so aware of how Zuko will come off to Sokka as a replacement.

I think in Zukka fics, or any fic with their dynamic, Sokka is often used as a tool for Zuko's healing, and his own trauma and negative experiences are put on the backburner in turn for Zuko's more outwardly present trauma. This is never something I want to do in my writing, I want to give a stage to each characters trauma, experiences and lives and try to show that things arent always as clean cut as they seem.

Hakoda abandoned Sokka and Katara. he left Sokka to be a man, without truly giving him the tools to do so.

Hakoda saved Zuko from death, and gave him a chance at life again.

These are two things that can exist at once, and the existence of one does not negate the other. People are a mess of good, bad, neutral, and its so hard to untangle it. Sometimes it doesnt even need to be untangled, sometimes you just need to hold the mess that people are and know it isnt a slight on you. You didnt cause the tangle, some tangles just are, yknow??

I also do personally believe in canon there are a lot of gaps that dont fully make sense in reference to Hakoda's character, and I think he honestly could have been executed a lot better in canon, so thats also something I like to consider whenever I am thinking too hard abt Hakodas character!!

I hope this made ANY sense at all. I usually have to sift through my writing like, a hundred times to get any kind of sense out of it, but truly this has been such a pleasure to write about!! : D Ur thoughts are so well written, and its incredible, as i said before, to see people picking up on the more nuanced things I'm trying to set up for future chapters!! it helps keep my steam for writing this honestly WAY bigger fic then I intended going!! : D I am MORE then happy to indulge!!!! If anything, this is indulging for ME! So thank YOU!!!

(Also, to answer ur tags, it isnt bad ur a bit mad at Hakoda!! He's flawed, thats okay! He's made mistakes just like anyone does. His just have more ramifications since he's the adult. I am a HUGE Hakoda stan and I do love him, but trying to work around canon and make him be a good father... A bit tricky!!)

I already put this on ao3 in a comment but you made me cry so you have to see it twice now. I know this entire story is Zuko-centric but I literally can't stop thinking about what this au means for Sokka.

Ok I just have to say I felt so heartbroken for Sokka here. All I could think about was how all of a sudden there's a boy in the place he's supposed to be. HE should be travelling with the men, HE should've been with them for the last three years, HE should be trusted enough with all this important stuff he should know if he is the next chief/acting chief.

He is being told this new kid has seen and done things the most skilled of warriors couldn't have done, like he is this almost untouchable standard Sokka can't reach. Then to be told he's taken Sokka's place in the tribe as Hakoda's and Batos' adopted child, teaching him how to be a man over the three years Sokka didn't even know his father, never a letter, never knowing when they would come home. Then being told by that same kid that he was only playing war. not to mention the piercings and jewellery he's adorned with.

Sokka has been the leader of the remnants of the Southern Water Tribe for three years, and due to the strict gender divides, had no one to teach him how to lead in the way a chief would. He has been the one hunting, defending, in charge of the future of their civilisation, the education of the children, which is really important in their culture. the memories of his father would be so twisted to the memories Hadoka has of Sokka. Sokka, in the months before he left, lost his mother, protecting his little sister. he then saw his father fall deep into depression, becoming very detached, and from what is described, angry and violent, not towards him, but that his still scary behaviour to witness. Then, his father left, and he was told he couldn't come, and that he was in charge of the village. Even though it was probably to boost his ego at the time more than anything, the impact on Sokka in that moment, combined into quite literally what his job becoming.

Just imagine when he finds out the secrets Zuko's hiding and how his father and Bato knew and didn't tell him. Sokka has struggled with feeling like he isn't important, as a non-bender and his relations with his sister, her being a prodigy + a bender, and his father, always feeling like he wasn't enough for his dad, not good enough, not smart enough, not needed, but the Zuko's good enough, Hakoda loves him.

Zuko, who has had an incredibly traumatic and difficult childhood, the last three years of his life is where he has found and made a spot for himself in a positive community that loves him and supports him, Sokka has become increasingly more and more isolated, and his sense of self has changed even more dramatically in the last few weeks.

Sorry for the long rant, but I could just feel Sokka's fears and insecurities screaming at me throughout the chapter. Love this work though, just cried for Sokka <3

HIII OH YOU SO GET IT!! OH YOU SOOOO GET IT!! The fic is for SURE Zuko-centric, but I have been intentionally layering on the potential for his arc to align with Sokka's in completely the opposing way. Zuko has everything Sokka wants, he has a space with the crew, the warriors. he spent the last three years with his father and Bato, bonding, developing his identity as a person alongside the tribe, welcomed in, he has gotten to be everything that Sokka has always wanted. Meanwhile, Sokka has everything that Zuko wants. Sokka was home, somewhere safe with people who cared for him and looked up to him, with his sister, away from his parents and in a position where he was in charge of his own life. Its such a twisted, complex situation where the two crave, desperately, what the other has without thinking about the context. Without thinking of what got the other to the point of having what they wanted, both in turn. IM SOOO happy to see someone talking about Sokka ohhhughhh im so fucking happy. I think a lot of people have focused on Sokka's initial attitude towards Zuko, without thinking about every single thing you've brought up in this beautifully constructed comment, of which I am really excited to eventually flesh out when I am back from hiatus. Sokka, more than anything, wants to be a warrior alongside his father. For Zuko, he doesn't think Sokka fully understands the gravity of what that would look like, especially after having experienced such a heavy loss as he had recently. (RIP king im sorry) but for Sokka, he see's a replacement. he doesnt know the nuances, not for lack of intelligence but he just literally hasnt been told and although he is owed explanation he isn't owed Zuko's story in its full, of what led Hakoda and Bato to the decision of keeping him on board. I firmly believe if Zuko had have been older, or had have been a child from any other nation, Hakoda and Bato would have not kept him. I actually go over this a lot in the early chapters where they're deciding wtf to do. It genuinely ended up being a problem of "well. No matter where we put him he's gonna get killed. How fucked up is that, safest place for this kid is LITERALLY on a warship of the enemy. great." I also think acknowledging the fact that Zuko HAS had a lot of support and comfort in the last three years whereas Sokka has not is a super important point to be made! Despite the current circumstances, and the ones that led Zuko to being in the position he is/was, Zuko did have support which Sokka lacked. TBH, if I hadve had more wiggle room and decided to fuck with canon more then I already had, I would have left a good amount of the warriors in the SWT, unlike in canon. Or had Hakoda go back to leave soldiers there when he realised they were going to be gone for longer then what I am assuming was initially planned. However I was more then aware that would SIGNIFICANTLY change the circumstances of Sokka's experiences and how it aligns with Zuko's, in canon and in the fic, so i chose against it. This is such a sporadic messy reply I am just so happy to get a comment picking up on all the stone I've been laying for a big discussion on the details of Sokka's own trauma and how its going to clash with Zuko's.

All this to say, Sokka will absolutely be getting his turn to hash out everything you've said here and I can promise you no stone will be left unturned when it comes to his trauma and life experiences!! I think a big thing I am most excited for is having the two hash it out and realise where their lives overlap, where their feelings and experiences align and managing to acknowledge that each others traumas dont cancel each other out. Zuko's experiences do not cancel out Sokka's, and Sokka's do not cancel out Zuko's.

[yardsards]

whoever popularized the obsession with "growth mindset" in education owes every disabled kid an apology letter

[edennill]

The entire discussion was completely tangential to this but I partly misread a post as a joke to the effect that "Well, the people actually responsible for all the deaths in [game] are the devs", and tbh as a statement this is quite relevant to my main fandom.

I will write about it more at length one day, but to be concise — I do not think we can discuss questions such as "Why didn't the Valar do more?" and ignore the very doylist reason that if you've decided to have the spiritual embodiment of evil wage very physical war upon your heroes, you do have to come up with an excuse for why the spiritual embodiment of Good (I'm simplifying the moral pattern a bit here, but I don't want to discuss fictional theology at length right now and ultimately it all boils down to the same in this context) doesn't equally physically solve the problem for them — in order to even have a story.

As far as such excuses go, "the collateral damage — which the antagonist is the only one with approximately minus hundred reasons to care about — would be too high" is not a very poor one, but most of the surrounding discussion scrupulously avoids admitting why it even needs to exist.

[coquelicoq]

"i already knew that you liked me, but do you know i like you?" she's not actually dead. she's got eyes. and ears. and a brain. i think maybe she figured it out.

[velvetvexations]

If you want to argue about that specific post, that I had the restraint to not engage with on your own blog, I need you to acknowledge

Sure.

how you trolled the #transmisogyny tag, as you often do,

It's a social media website.

did not show me the same restraint!

I wouldn't call not engaging with the post that sparked your OP here to be "restraint." It is, again, a social media website and everything I post except a vent once in a blue moon is meant to be engaged with.

You came onto my post to, best I can guess, imagine the post I was referring to, imagine that I read it wrong, and present the "correct" reading of that imagined post.

And I turned out to be correct. I'll now explain the correct reading of the actual post.

I'm pretty sure that what I said lines up with what the anon said in the post. I am open to the idea that I'm wrong, and I'd welcome anyone who isn't you to talk to me about it and whether or not anon has an incomplete picture of what transmisogyny is.

Anon was arguing against strict definitions of TMA/TME because of how hard these things are to define. In that sentence, they were asking a hypothetical question about a trans woman - does she suffer transmisogyny if she has not yet suffered anything directly relating to her transition? In context, it's pretty clear the answer is "yes." The point they're making is that transmisogyny is more than seeing an AMAB person in a dress and yelling a slur at them. Transmisogyny takes many forms, often invisible, insidious, and affecting people you wouldn't know it to be affecting.

I thought this section of the reply was going to take longer, honestly.

it is an educated guess that you believed my post was in communication with your discussions of male/female socialization

The general discourse but not involving me specifically lol.

last time we did a diskhorse, You did something pretty interesting! Did you know that you did this? because it sends a specific message!

Yeah, I honestly didn't handle that very well. I didn't intend anything I said to ask you to or imply you should divulge your trauma but I did aggressively insist you were talking about something you insisted you were not talking about and interrogating you about if you were really thinking of cis people doing that. I'm very frustrated with critique deflection and though I tried to play it both ways by acknowledging you personally may have gone through an example of an accusation of critique deflection being bullshit, it was very poor of me to treat the situation the way I did. I did not do you right there and I regret it. Trans women often have claims of transmisogyny unfairly dismissed and in this case I was way too aggro about what I assumed the post was about, and my attempts to be diplomatic were disingenuous and insufficient.

They are really showing their whole ass when someone who thinks they are not tme also thinks that transmisogyny only affects transfems after they come out.

[moe-broey]

Alfonse calling Lif a Bastard in the same way a sibling who holds an extreme level of resentment towards another sibling might

NOT a sibling coded interaction between them, despite the example. It's more about one denying the other of that shared family of origin due to feeling personally slighted and as a consequence of the other's personal failures. Your stupid ass ways have hurt both the family I feel a level of responsibility for (no matter how conflicted I am about that it's MY burden to bear ESPECIALLY because you fucked up as severely as you did) AND ME. Bonus points when directed at a full blooded sibling, legitimacy REVOKED you are NOTHING to me

... Writing all that out, initially starting out as an elaborate self-hatred bit (will never NOT be hilarious to me as a concept, and this one in particular has LAYERS to it) and having the dawning Realization. The core feeling this is coming from, maybe would be WAY more effective as a concept between SHARENA and Lif. Then getting achingly conflicted because that's just. NEVER the angle I take with them. I think she ABSOLUTELY has valid reasons to potentially get to that point but I. I want her to love him no matter what. Plus the unmatched comedy of her just accepting she has two older brothers now and she's going to subject BOTH of them to immense psychic damage through The Power of Love. Then I run a tumblr discourse simulation through my head like okay Misogynistic???? To expect the girl to "fix" a broken man through 💖 Love 💖 no matter what?????? A sentiment you do ideologically agree with (to specify -- it is a misogynistic trope and absolute fucking bullshit dogshit in real life), it should never be a woman's job to "fix" a man. You acknowledge the cisnormativity of that statement and take shrimp color damage from the fact that you're a trans man. Someone who was raised with this sentiment being a widely understood way of life especially from your mom's side in particular, and someone who, despite the epic new (not at all new at this point) gender identity, is often still bound by the expectations enforced upon you. Also what are you, still Christian???? You hear your mother's voice. "Family Forgiveness is Important -- I hope that one day you can see that. Like I Did 😇💖"

You have died. Badly.

[deancasforcutie]

AU where SPN actually makes the obvious references to Rocky Horror like you'd expect and we have to fight to convince people "yeah it's because camp horror but HERE'S WHY it's also in a gay way" instead of just accepting we can never make anyone understand the unhinged Queer Cinema of their Pink Flamingos reference rabbithole that extends through IYKYK references coding Dean and Ash as queer apart from Sam and the twitter background of SPN's first openly gay writer Eric Charmelo whose co-authored episodes kept throwing in queer film references just because they could and all throughout the set dressing of s10 as they canonized Dean and Crowley fucked and oh my god open the schools this show is deep-cut queer poetry and assimilationist lgbts can't READ 😭😭😭

[millionsknives]

yes, the plans that i could not share with you (because the haters would sabotage me) were that i was taking on LACC in my vash getup :)

i have so few pictures of myself but i got so many compliments (especially on my arm) and plenty of other people took pictures of me. and normally i don't like attention but i will be honest with u. under these circumstances i loved it. my arm held up really well through 8 hours on the convention floor and i have never been prouder of anything i've made. it's articulated incredibly well, no part of it gave out or required repair, it's never uncomfortable or a nuisance to wear, and i have enough range of motion to do relatively complex things like tying my shoes.

originally i was not planning to try to meet anyone famous because 1) it's expensive and 2) the lines are long and 3) i feel weird and annoying approaching literally anyone for any reason BUT. the spot where i met up with my sister just happened to be right next to johnny yong bosch's table. right when he started signing things. so i said LOL ok i'll do it.

it was super chill, i asked him how it felt to get the call that they wanted him to come back 20 years later for a trigun reboot and he said it almost didn't happen -- that since they recast everyone else for stampede they considered recasting vash as well (and i said WOW i'm so glad they didn't) and he said he really enjoyed getting to come back and explore a darker take (i forget if what he said was a darker take on vash's character, or just a darker trigun in general) but it was briefly surprising 2 me that he considered stampede to be a darker version but i get it, especially when u consider that there is not a lot of comedy in those 12 episodes to balance out the grief.

ANYWAY he was impressed with my arm and i asked him if he would sign my coat :) so he signed the lining but he was also like u know what, i'm gonna give you a second autograph just because. so he signed a print for me as well (free of charge!!) and the print with the blue signature matches my famous paintings that i always film in front of (that's providence baybee)

other stuff from the con under the cut

cosplay notes:

i saw 3 other vash cosplayers (a 98 vash, a stampede vash, and a purple coat vash) and no shade but i definitely had the best arm build. peace and love to all of them though

i saw 1 1/2 wolfwoods. 1 was the aforementioned mullet wolfwood from yesterday's post (ww if you’re out there ww) and the 1/2 was the 98 vash cosplayer’s gf in some kind of goth-ish dress and she was carrying a punisher

mullet wolfwood if you're out there i regret not getting a picture with you so much. i am deeply ashamed and i have no excuse because i ran into you twice and both times i was too embarrassed to ask for a picture. i just want you to know that your punisher was swag and your earrings were yolo and we would look very good together

i expected to see a lot more trigun tbh. los angeles where u at. 4 vashies at a convention of 120,000+ people is nothing. one guy even walked up to me like wow i love ur vash, i haven't seen a lot of trigun at this con and i was like I KNOW i thought i'd see a lot more

theeeee costume of all time award goes to the cad bane cosplayer i saw on the balcony. spare hand in marriage dude (gn) you looked so good

second place for costume of all time goes to the other mother cosplayer who had button eyes and these crazy finger appendages and never once broke character even while waiting in lines

i took 100 points of psychic damage from this one guy who (and im not kidding) was at least 6’4’’ and wearing platform boots and was dressed as the mfing onceler. with the stupid top hat he was fr 7+ feet tall (i saw him duck to get through a doorway).

someone was there as the brawny paper towel guy?? just walking around in a beard and flannel carrying a pack of paper towel rolls?? go off king

i saw 5 nightwing cosplayers but only 2 were biblically accurate (had ass)

the nanami sweep at this convention was so real u all SHOWED UP. and everybody ate. i saw at least 12 nanamis and not one of them was a flop.

i have never seen so many spider-mans in my life

other things:

fig. 1: this extremely hot captain america on a very large poster was about 2 make me act unwise. hi gorjus................................. nice eyebrows

fig 2: i saw this sign a couple blocks away from the con and i did a triple take. 🔥🔥🔥TRIMAX MENTIONED🔥🔥🔥

fig. 3: i saw all 4 hobbits in panel and can confirm elijah wood’s laugh is ten times more infectious in real life. before they were even done sitting down, dominic monaghan switched around all of their name cards so that none of them were seated behind the right name. as u might imagine much of the panel's content was reminiscing about LOTR, but i heard some stories that i hadn't heard before. they also talked about video games, other projects they are working/have worked on, how their kids feel about their dads' LOTR roles, how much they love ian mckellen, and how they would love to see something happen for the 20th anniversary of ROTK this year. sean astin (the legend) took shots at the stranger things writers (basically said joyce could never be happy with hopper) AND EVERYONE CLAPPED LOL. billy and dom talked about the best food in NZ, their show billy and dom eat the world, and the unfortunate events that led to the friendship onion's hiatus. it was a ton of fun to just watch them be themselves with each other, you can tell that these guys are all so fond of each other and love each other so much.

and finally, fig. 4: i bought these beautiful prints from @/batinyourbelfry and the skeletal washi tape from @/skeletalacademia (both on IG)