#why is he so concerned about headcanons. my brother you control the canon ???

[yoinkschief]

Every time I finally start feeling some sort of blissful about the Eddsworld fandom and how cool it is Hargreaves starts hating on the fandom again

[kiwibirbkat]

Au where Luz is also the Golden Guard!

(Yes I know that this is a pretty common au, shut up 🖕🖕🖕)

When Luz is about 4, while Manny and Camila are taking a nap, she wanders away. She goes into the shack near her house and *gasp!* The portal is there while Eda does Eda things. So Luz goes through the portal.

Cut to Hunter and Belos. Belos is somewhat panicking because, Holy shit, they don't usually pop out this early. I headcanon that Grimwalkers usually pop out at ages 10-12 because like, still an easy age to manipulate, but a lot easier to deal with than someone younger. However, Hunter (always the odd one out) popped out at the ripe old age of 5. Belos doesn't have a single fucking clue on how to deal with small children, so he's just... Sending Hunter out with whatever coven scout pisses him off because apparently this weak ass 5 year old is too small to start training and will be until he's like. At least 8.

So Hunter is out and sees Luz. And he's super excited to see someone around his age, because all the people in the Emperor's Coven are oldddddd. And they're fast friends until Hunter sees Luz's ears and he's like.

Hunter: Woahhhh, youw eaws awe wound!

Luz: Yah

Hunter: Do you wanna meet my uncle? I wanna sow him youw cool eaws

Luz: Oki

So he takes her to Belos who's like. Why is another random child here- Holy shit that's a human!!!! So Belos is then like. Well. Hunter seems to like her. And he'll probably be easier to deal with if he has a friend. And it's not like it's uncommon for me to train the magicless. It might be different because she's a human, but that's all the more reason to keep her! Plus, two Golden Guards? Both of which, now that I think about it, will probably be more obedient if they've had training from a younger age... This will work out well, I think. Probably. Maybe.

So he keeps both of them!

(He tells Luz that she was born from a literal half witch, that she's half human, half witch, (which is why she has no magic and her ears are round) but that her mom died in child birth and her dad followed soon after as an unprotected human in the Boiling Isles. He says that Hunter's family, always so kind, adopted her before being killed by the evil wild magic!)

At first, he's harsher on Hunter, because Come on, Luz is human, not evil like these demons! but because she's younger and understands less, she's more rebellious than Hunter. So the abuse is now on both of them. And anyways, some humans are just evil like those creatures! If she's in the Boiling Isles, it's probably fate anyway! Not trickery like it was with that wretched witch who mind controlled his brother- he's getting off track.

So Luz grows up in the same tiring, abusive, and unhealthy environment as Hunter, but with one change from Hunter's treatment in main canon. Belos realizes that if he punishes one Golden Guard for the others mistakes, it has much more effect on both. Of course, if one does really well, he gives them validation like a loving uncle, even if the other one does badly. And of course he still punishes them individually for minor mistakes! But for worse mistakes? He forces them to watch as he hurts their sibling for their mistakes. (He does still hurt them afterwards, because while most of the time he's faking with not having control over the curse, when he gets really angry, he does actually lose some control.)

This leads Luz and Hunter to both have incredible self hatred, because instead of just thinking that they deserve the punishment they get, they also have to watch someone else suffer for their stupid mistakes. One of the only people they actually care about, no less. So they're even more under Belos' control then Hunter in the actual series with the combined guilt, fear, and concern for their sibling keeping them in line.

Hunter is basically just... Hunter in canon but more compassionate towards Luz. That and being even more brainwashed by Belos, somehow.

Luz is kinda herself in the show? Like, she still copes with humor and all that, but her jokes are a lot darker. She joins Hunter in the PTSD squad. She's terrified of upsetting authority and terrified of failing. She hates herself even more than she does in show, so now she will freak out horribly whenever someone (other than Hunter) is concerned for her because she doesn't deserve this, it's her fault this happened, she's a parasite

[iobsessoverfictionalmen]

Hi, can you make headcanons about yandere elijah mikaelson x fem human reader

Thank you for the ask! I can absolutely do that; headcanon requests for the characters I write for are always open! I hope you enjoy these headcanons. AN: This ask and my response to it deals with yandere content, canon typical violence, and behaviours. This means it will have dark elements. I do not condone yandere behaviours in real life. 

First off, I headcanon Elijah as being a worshipful, protective yandere. He would never hurt or compel his darling.

The first Mikaelson you meet is Klaus.

You met him when he saved you from a rogue vampire. You weren't sure why he saved you. Was it because he felt merciful? Or did he just want to destroy the rogue vampire and you happened to be there?

Either way, you thanked him and to your surprise, he froze. Because of his history of manipulating and being manipulated, he had no idea how to respond to genuine emotions.

The next day, you made a quiet inquiry (read: you bugged Marcel) and found out that Klaus loves to paint but that he was running low on a particular colour.

Elijhah's obsession with you begins when he sees you standing on the other side of the front door with your thank-you gift for Klaus.

After learning the story of how you two met from his brother, Elijah finds ways to 'accidentally' run into you when you are in New Orleans.

The third time this happens, he invites you to the Mikaelson's home. It takes some time but you eventually agree to visit him. Elijah controls his expression, giving no hint of the happiness he is feeling inside as it wouldn't be proper to act this way now he reminds himself and he departs after placing a gentle kiss on your hand. He is a gentleman after all.

When Elijah returns home, you're all he can talk about.

Rebekah grows tired of Elijah talking about you the fifth time and leaves.

Consumed by jealousy and wondering what makes you so special she decides to track you down. She reassures herself that she's simply doing this to protect her older brother.

When she does track you down, she demands that you explain what happened the night that you met Klaus. You do so (more than a little scared - there's an Original vampire standing opposite you) and Rebekah feels herself calming down. Like Klaus, she can smell no dishonesty or deception.

From that point on, she and Klaus do absolutely everything they can to keep you and Elijah together. It's been eons since they've seen their brother remotely happy and now he is happy. They don't care that you're human.

When you visit the siblings, you have a fantastic time but you are curious and a little concerned as to how they know so much about your passions and about you in general.

Between Elijah, Klaus, and Rebekah you are the most protected and spoilt being in New Orleans. You don't even have to say that you want or need something. If your eyes linger on anything for more than half a second, it's yours. Thanks to Elijah and Rebekah, your wardrobe is filled with stylish clothing and accessories that suit you perfectly.

Being Elijah's darling does come with quite a few risks and you have had the conversation many times about being turned into a vampire.

Elijah wants you to spend eternity by his side and it would be an added bonus if you had more tools at your disposal when it came to protecting yourself.

Elijah destroys any vampire or supernatural being that has the slightest connection to his father. With some persuasion, he teaches you some self-defence moves.

Despite his best efforts (and they are considerable), Mikael finds out about you. He journeys to New Orleans in an attempt to use you as bait to draw Elijah out. The first vampire is astounded when he sees his three children united, standing shoulder to shoulder to protect you from him.

But you're not unobservant. You've heard the whispers about Mikael and how he's relentlessly pursued his children across centuries and continents.

And so, you do a bit of tracking of your own. You find a coven of witches and convince them to cast a protection spell. The spell activates when Mikael is processing the fact that his children are working together and protecting a human. The spell casts him out of New Orleans.

That night, Elijah cradles you close. He murmurs words of praise about your bravery and determination. Immediately after, he warns you of the dangers of magic. How it always demands payment and how the balance must be maintained at all costs.

He tells you the story of how and why he, his siblings, and his father became the Original vampires.

[fagsystem]

Do you ever have a headcanon no one else has and it is not necessarily based on canonical evidence but it is really good you swear?

I present to you: Luigi struggles with drug addiction.

Hear me out. I promise this is not just me projecting.

The version of the Mario universe I have in my head is not quite the movie verse, but it begins similarly with them being from the human world.

I believe that the addiction began in high school. There are two ideas I have for this. Number one, Mario tried alcohol and some drugs and dragged Luigi into it. Mario was just fine and never got addicted, but Luigi fell into it hard. He has always been quite anxious and drugs make his head go quiet. This route opens up a lot of good Mario angst, where he feels forever guilty about being the reason his brother got into drugs in the first place.

The second idea that I have is that it was a rebellious way to try and get out from his brother's shadow. In this version Mario would not touch drugs because he knows it's a dumb idea and that he has no impulse control. Maybe he'd drink a couple of times at parties, but that is about it.

Luigi ended up falling into a bad crowd. Mario did not like them, which pushed Luigi into them. These people probably liked Luigi because they found him funny, especially how scared of everything he was. I would say his first time drinking and then his first time smoking weed probably happened due to peer pressure.

He quickly found out that drugs were fun. He had always been such an anxious person and when he was intoxicated he did not feel so bad anymore. I would say it rapidly spiralled out of control from there.

I personally headcanon that Mario and Luigi did not really have the best family, they only really had each other. Luigi was clearly getting worse and worse and needed help, but people only cared when Luigi did anything that impacted them. When he tried to bring up his concerns to his parents, it was shot down with how Luigi was doing fine at school unlike a certain someone.

So Mario was on his own trying to help. And Luigi did not want help, especially not from Mario. He kept trying but there was not much he could really do.

I have the idea of it reaching a catalyst where Mario got a call from Luigi at about one in the morning. Luigi was meant to be at home in bed, so he was really worried to hear the blasting music in the background. Luigi asked Mario to pick him up, and Mario was out the door in a heartbeat. When he got there, he found out his brother was having a very bad trip. He ended up spending the night helping Luigi through it.

The next day he tried taking to Luigi about it, but Luigi was once again brushing him off. The left over fear from last night for both of them quickly turned into anger. They had a big yelling match.

After a long time of yelling at each other, Luigi demanded to know why Mario was still on his ass about everything. Mario shot back it is because he loves him. Luigi bursted into tears and began insisting that he shouldn't. He had been so awful to Mario for so long, he had no redeeming qualities, and at this rate he probably was not going to live that long. Mario was horrified. He did not know what to do so he just hugged his brother while he cried.

With everything aired out on the table, Mario threw himself into helping Luigi. Luigi was not willing to quit anything, so instead he encouraged harm reduction. He made sure Luigi ate at least three meals a day, helped him with schoolwork. It was a really difficult time, but by the time they were adults Luigi was mostly sober and clean from everything. Getting a job and having responsibilities really helped. If he spent his money on drugs, that actually meant something as he needed that money for food and rent.

(By the way, I still think Luigi getting clean and sober would be the same in the other idea. Mario would just feel even more responsible for taking care of Luigi than he already did. Also, make no mistake, this second route has a lot of Mario angst too. He was not the one who should have been responsible for Luigi, and it happening during his developmental years means he will likely never not feel responsible for taking care of his brother.)

For years he was doing good. He spent his time doing everything he could to support Mario the way Mario had supported him during those years. He picked up extra hours, handled most of the chores around the house, and refused to even look at any sort of drugs or alcohol. Whenever things would get difficult, he managed to push through because he could not do that to Mario again.

Then they ended up in the Mushroom Kingdom. They were in an unfamilar world where it seemed like everything was able to kill them. They were going on dangerous adventures with what felt like no rest. They were key figures in a war and were responsible for defending the lives of thousands.

And Luigi felt useless. There was a reason everyone called him Green Mario. He just was not good at any of this. Sure, he was helping, but he was not good at this. All he really could do was follow his brother into danger and do his best to keep him alive. And Mario if he thought Mario was bad at taking care of himself before, he was surely mistaken, as the only reason Mario ate, hydrated, engaged in any sort of hygiene was when Luigi made him. All he was good for was playing support for his brother and that was fine, Mario has more than earnt his support.

What was not fine was that he was so scared. So scared that it prevented him from being able to do his job and support Mario. He'd have a panic attack in the middle of cooking because the meat sizzling on the pan reminded him of how it sounded when he got hit by a fireball. He'd forget to tell Mario to drink water because he had a flashback to when Mario almost died. He'd shake too much during a fight to be able to land any hits, his breathing so strained that all he really could do was try not to pass out or hit his teammates.

He did not mean to get back into anything. It was meant to be just one time. On a visit back home he ran into one of his old friends from high school, got invited to hang out. They were smoking weed. They offered it to him, he declined. They had all grown since high school, the gentle ribbing about, "Oh, same old Luigi, scared of a little plant," was not actually intended to pressure him into it. But it was all the excuse he needed.

It was just one time. Then it happened again. And again. And eventually he was spending all of his spare time in the human world with his old friends, drinking and getting high like old times. He picked smoking up again too.

But he was not in high school anymore. Stakes were higher. His withdrawal symptoms made it damn near impossible to get anything done. He did not know what to do. He tried to stop, he really did, but he always found himself going back.

Mario has known something was wrong but did not know what. He was scared to tell him. But eventually one day Luigi cooked Mario's favourite dinner and came clean. He knew Mario was upset, but Mario buried those feelings to reassure him.

They developed a plan similar to last time. Since Luigi could have nicotine without it making him unable to fight for hours after, he began smoking a lot. With encouragement from Mario, he replaced it with vaping.

I would like to say that he gets fully clean from all drugs after a while. The vaping comes back every now and then when things are particularly stressful, but Mario (and his friends too, both from the human world and the Mushroom Kingdom (cough and Darklands Bowser hello)) would always be there to support him.

[mangosaurus]

@sleepyjuniper GRRRRR okay without doing a full cross comparison, here are my largely unedited thoughts:

a traditional love triangle pits two opposing parties (persons A and C) against each other which compete for the object of their affection (person B)

this 1) creates a mutual rivalry between persons A and C, and 2) renders person B a passive player

more often than not, the rivalry between persons A and C begins when person B takes interest in A or C, sparking jealousy in the opposing party (if person B likes person A, then C will become jealous)

the traditional love triangle is resolved when either person A or C bests the other by proving themselves the "better" choice, winning over person B; any power which person B holds afterwards is derived from their connection to their "endgame" love interest

so in a traditional love triangle, persons A and C would be kenji and darius, while person B would be brooklynn; after kenji and brooklynn got together, darius would become jealous, and his relationship with kenji would suffer as a result. the brothers would fight until brooklynn succumbs to her "true" feelings and leaves kenji for darius. brooklynn's life with darius would permit her the girlboss status she always deserved (🙄), and kenji would probably suffer some kind of cosmic retribution from the universe for chasing brooklynn away/being a generally shitty boyfriend, idk

this is ... so far from the case for camp cretaceous & chaos theory, though

first off: darius is fully supportive of kenji and brooklynn's relationship. he doesn't even catch feelings for her until after they break up. you can headcanon that he had some semblance of a crush on her beforehand, which is perfectly fine, but canon states otherwise

second off: kenji doesn't push brooklynn away; brooklynn pushes kenji away. their relationship doesn't fail because he's controlling or dismissive of her—on the contrary, brooklynn was the one who neglected him. kenji is probably the textbook perfect boyfriend: he takes her out on nice dates, he compliments her, and he's presumably supportive of her career. the problem is when brooklynn gets too deep into her investigative work, and even then kenji seemed to have tolerated that until it reached a breaking point (i believe the line was "i can't keep doing this anymore")

third off: kenji and darius's relationship becomes strained not because kenji suspected darius of having feelings for brooklynn—it became strained because darius seemingly failed brooklynn. if anything, their mutual love for brooklynn relieves some of the tension between them, as it's in the aftermath of darius's confession that kenji is able to look at darius as his brother again ("we're brothers, right?"). although kenji does ask darius if brooklynn loved him back, the question that weighs heaviest in the air is why darius wasn't there for her. kenji isn't concerned about being the one brooklynn loved; he's concerned about brooklynn being loved the way she deserves

fourth off, and i think most importantly: brooklynn isn't robbed of her autonomy in this situation. darius never looked to push his feelings onto her ("i wasn't even going to tell her"), and brooklynn remains a sovereign character outside the love subplot. not only has she always been a girlboss™ (huge oversimplification of her character, but it's what i'll use for lack of better term), but she also continues to be one. her character is the least we know about right now, which is exactly what pushes the mystery—the primary plot—forward, and thus our protagonists into season 2. brooklynn is the one pulling the strings right now on both a metaphorical and metatextual level, and that remains true regardless of whether she ends up with darius or not. her autonomy and intrigue as a character does not hinge upon the outcome of the love triangle; she is as active a player in the story as darius, kenji, and the rest of the cast are

currently thinking about how chaos theory turns the traditional love triangle on its head and i'm actually half tempted to write a post about it but i just know that if i do it's gonna turn into an entire essay and frankly i'm not about that life right now

[pinketine]

My life is a fucking joke

So in honour of Apollo making good on my bold claim, here it is! The edited version of the ramble I made in my Jornoth pit on Empiressona! (Under the cut)

TW: Unhealthy relationships

As CEO of Jornoth, I find their dynamic to have the potential to be very interesting, as they have both been implied to have a lot of baggage in their pasts. (Shrub's call out on Xornoth and Joey's throwaway sentence about his empire only being found if you're lost, but I can talk about headcanons another day.) And how it manifests in violent ways, mostly to those around them.

From Joey's I think it's the way he attaches himself to things for me, especially family dynamics. Examples of this are how he acts like a father figure to the Tiger Blood Prince (or an actual father since he mentioned having raised him from a young age), him calling Sausage his brother and of course, him calling Xornoth his boyfriend and husband.

It's obvious Joey is obsessed with Xornoth, to a concerning level, being disturbingly jealous of people he thinks they're "flirting" (read: corrupting their lands) with, going as far as to say he might kill Katherine over it. All of this, for someone who pretty much has never reciprocated their feelings.

And I think he's subconsciously aware of it, clinging onto any "kindness" they give him as proof that they love him, such as when they gave him warped corruption for his water temple. It might also be why he's so easily jealous, it could be hidden insecurities at work!

The only reason he wouldn't tear this world apart for them is because he wants it all to himself. Blood of innocent animals has been spilled just so that he can summon them. Hell, Joey killed a parrot, something that seemed to upset him slightly and is even more disturbing when you realise he mentioned being part parrot once, all for them. That seems to be his only motivation now, Xornoth Xornoth Xornoth! And I get that the original appeal was them being able to give him what he wanted, power over all the other kingdoms but that barely seems to matter anymore! It's just them.

He literally kidnapped Gem and Scott, who, if X Life is canon, were once his friends on the coven! And even if they weren't, Gem was still his first ally and Joey used to want to build a statue of him and his other allies in one of his temples!! And now here he is, perfectly callous towards them, all for that demon!

He loves passionately, obsessively and loudly. He can't stop himself from professing his love constantly to those around him, and his love sometimes turns violent to those who try to get him to realise how awful this all is.

He loves them like it's a religion, decorating his temples with their corruption, sacrificing everything he can for them. It's terrifying.

But what about Xornoth?

Some say that the opposite of love is hate, but I personally think that's it's disinterest. Love and hate are both passionate, all consuming emotions. But with disinterest? Nothing is there.

They don't seem to care for Joey. Sausage was their champion, after all. They seem to avoid him at times. But Joey is definitely.. special.. for them. Let me put it this way:

Xornoth has an amazing pawn in Joey, and I think they know that.

That's why, in my humble opinion, they have yet to outright reject him.

They've avoided answering his questions, and left the wedding. But it's never been an outright no. They know how he feels and yet keeps doing things for him, telling him that he doesn't need the corruption, he's already with them, (and giving him more regardless later on), kidnapping Shrub for him (that may have had ulterior motives, but it all seemed to be very much for him. Dungeon in his place and all.), arriving when Joey voices wanting to summon him.

It all gives Joey the false hope that they love him back, and it keeps him obedient and willing to do anything for them.

They needed little to no mind control for him, he was perfectly wrapped around their finger.

So we have disinterest versus obsession! Fun!

What is also fun is how their colours work

They both have the colour red in common, a nice thread tying them together for once. But I see red as more Xornoth's colour, the invasive violent colour of the overworld. Meanwhile I imagine Joey to be gold, like his precious totems, ironically a healing colour against corruption. Together they make a red and gold/orange duo, the exact opposite to the Flower Husb@nds' green and blue.

And well yeah, they kind of are their opposites. Both are messy but in different ways. Jornoth's messy is violent and destructive to everyone involved.

I just think that when it eventually breaks apart, the fallout isn't going to be pretty.

Anyways that's my thoughts on canon Jornoth!

[absolutepokemontrash]

MC is Half Demon and Blah Blah Blah-

Time for the Group Retreat!

Part 1 Part 2 Lessons 1-5 Lessons 5-6 Lessons 10-12 Lessons 13-15 Part 3 Part 4

I’m quite hyped for this one, ladies, gents, and esteemed readers! For simplicity’s sake, since this is before M!MC and A!MC arrive, L!MC will go back to being referred to as just MC. Enjoy the Headcanons!

Since the previous Underground Tomb incident ended much less violently, Lucifer is now more worried than angry about MC’s rampant shennaniganery.

Like... his kid was poking holes in his totally foolproof “Your cow-uncle went to live on a farm in the human world” story. What if MC somehow got into the attic and got hurt?!

It didn’t help that they were still in this weird phase of their father/child relationship. On one hand, Lucifer obviously cares for his kid, and his kid likes him... but it’s also only been less than three months and we all know how emotionally constipated Lucifer is.

MC’s also getting REAL sus of all the secrets their dear old dad is keeping... doesn’t help that they STILL haven’t went up into the attic.

Anyhoo~ the announcement for the retreat was a barrel of laughs.

“I’m proposing, a group retreat!”

Everyone met Diavolo’s announcement with the exact same confused reaction. It’s like the entire assembly hall was doing the ‘Guy Blinking’ meme.

“A... group retreat?” Lucifer repeated slowly. “For what reason exactly, Lord Diavolo?”

The Crown Prince was giddy with excitement as he explained. “MC told me about their middle school overnight trip and it sounded like it would be quite fun!”

Simeon, Luke, MC, and Solomon were all seated next to each other in the ‘exchange student seats of less importance’. Luke leaned over and whispered a question to MC.

“Why are you so friendly with the crown prince?”

MC smirked and shrugged. “Lucifer had the Demon-Flu and couldn’t go meet with Lord Diavolo last week so I went for him. Lord Diavolo’s surprisingly bad at Connect Four but has really good luck in Snakes and Ladders.”

Luke’s jaw dropped in complete and utter shock and horror.

“We’re playing CandyLand and the Game of Life next time, want to come?” MC added.

“Play CandyLand... with him..?” Luke looked at Diavolo, who was still explaining his plan for the retreat, then looked back at MC. “I’ll only go to shield you from his corrupting influence.”

“Yeah... Corrupting...” MC had to hold back a laugh at the thought of Diavolo, who during MC’s visit lit up like a Christmas tree upon being called ‘Dia’ and believed that Mood Rings were the greatest human invention ever, being a corrupting influence.

“MC! Torture dungeon or no!?” MC was snapped out of their conversation by Mammon shouting at them from his seat.

“What?”

“Do ya think there’s a torture dungeon under the castle, or not?”

“I’m not sure,” MC turned to Diavolo. “Lord Diavolo, is there a torture dungeon under the Demon Lord’s Castle?”

There is in fact, no torture dungeon. Presumably...

Everyone packed up and headed out to the Demon Lord’s Castle!

The fabulous seven all broke several speed limits and traffic laws in order to be there early. Listen, they had to get there before Purgatory Hall, it was a matter of pride.

Besides, what’s the Royal guard going to do? Arrest six of the seven rulers of hell and a kid? Ha. No. Not when Diavolo controls their paychecks.

The rooming situation remained the same, Asmo, Simeon, and MC were roomed together, and MC got to watch Asmo get psychologically profiled by Simeon. It was truly a sight to behold.

MC was nice enough to assure Asmo that they really liked him and thought he was very sweet.

Asmo, not used to being complimented on his personality, almost started openly weeping.

So, the tour of the Demon Lord’s Castle began! Asmo got yelled at by his ex in the painting and the usual batch of idiots got sucked into the catacombs under the castle.

Lucifer wasn’t terribly sure how or if he should express his concern for MC being stuck in the labyrinth.

All these new fatherly feelings of worry are very very odd. He didn’t worry this much for Satan, mainly because Satan was usually the threat.

Even as a baby...

Lucifer found himself checking his DDD every few minutes to see if MC had texted or called from wherever the painting dragged them to, never mind that if they did text he’d hear the phone ding.

“Lucifer, don’t worry too much,” Diavolo patted Lucifer on the shoulder, a bright smile on his face. “Your brothers and MC will be perfectly fine! There’s nothing too dangerous in the catacombs that they wouldn’t be able to take care of.”

Resigning himself to the fact that MC was under the care of his last choices for babysitting, Lucifer put away his DDD. “I know they’ll be fine, but I’m not overly pleased with the situation.” He shot a glare at Helene in the portrait, who rolled her eyes and crossed her arms.

“Lucifer worrying about someone, I’m truly, genuinely shocked.” Hearing Satan’s attempt at goading him, Lucifer, flawless demon that he is, resisted the urge to throw his DDD at his brother.

“Quiet, Satan.”

————

“WHY THE FUCK IS A SNAKE DOWN HERE?!”

“ITS HENRY 1.0!”

“YEAH THAT REALLY CLEARS STUFF UP, LEVI!”

MC and Levi continued their screaming match as the group ran for dear life from a giant snake.

Yeah... nothing the brothers couldn’t handle... sure, Lord Diavolo...

They made it out of the scary catacombs... don’t worry.

Lucifer did that parent-thing where he cleaned the catacomb dust off MC’s face with a napkin.

Yay! Parenting!

Failed pillow fight attempt #1 happened that evening. Because Mammon was obsessed with being the fun-uncle and saw his brothers encroaching on his place as favourite uncle.

MC doesn’t know how to break it to him that he’ll probably always be the favourite uncle and he doesn’t have to be such a dumbass to keep his spot.

Scavenger hunt went on as canon dictates.

Asmo had his diva tantrum and stormed off, but MC also wanted to win so they didn’t go after him.

Clearly expecting someone to go beg him to come back, Asmo was very annoyed when no one went after him.

“Um, helloooo? Anyone going to comfort me~?”

“Nope.”

“Well I don’t want your comfort anyway, SOLOMON.”

It was very close, L!MC insisted their loss came from sabotage. No evidence was found but just LOOK at Satan’s face.

Time for the Formal Dance~

If you’re wondering why Luke didn’t say anything when MC was suddenly poofed into their demon form, you’re assuming that Mammon wasn’t in on the “let’s prank the chihuahua” plan.

“Mammon..? Is MC behind you?”

“Nope! Why?”

MC was able to get to the other side of the ballroom with Luke none the wiser! Hell yeah, nothing like screwing with your friend!

So it’s canon that Lucifer is like, a solid 20/10, therefore MC is ADORABLE. What I’m saying is, some of the younger demons asked them to dance.

Asmo was also being MC’s hype man, which was very nice of him. Mammon also tried to give advice on how to be cool and suave. Beel was there for moral support.

“Alright kiddo, you need to be aloof and mysterious! People love aloof and mysterious, that’s why I’m so popular.”

“Don’t listen to him, MC. He flew into a wall as a kid and it killed all his brain cells. Just be proper but not snooty, sweet but not saccharine, friendly but not annoying,”

“Ask them if they want to share some of the hors d’oeuvres.” 

“Okay, first, aloof and mysterious are the last words I would ever use to describe you, Mammon. Second, Asmo I have no clue what you’re asking me to do. Third... Beel that’s the best advice I’ve received in recent memory.”

None of that mattered anyway because MC got swarmed with dance offers.

“Well,” MC smirked and held out their hand at the demon that was bold enough to ask them to dance first. “I admire the confidence.”

The demon’s smile brightened, then dropped completely when their gaze drifted behind MC. “I uh... on second thought... I’m gonna...”

MC’s potential dance partners all quickly scattered to the snack table. The half demon growled and turned around to see their father acting like he didn’t just scare away MC’s groupies.

“Father! What was that for?!” MC huffed, Lucifer rolled his eyes and grabbed MC’s wrist and began to pull them away from the dance floor.

“You’re too young to dance.”

“That’s crazy! They looked like they were my age.” MC protested, their wings fluttering in annoyance.

“Even if they looked to be your age, MC, they’re hundreds of years older.” Lucifer said calmly.

“What about that equivalent age stuff you told me about? Like how Luke is hundreds of years old but by angel/human standards he’s technically younger than me?”

“That doesn’t matter right now.” Lucifer lightly pushed MC towards the hallway that led back to their room.

“But I want to dance with someone!” MC felt their wings involuntarily fluff up.

Lucifer turned and smiled at his dear little brat, crouching slightly to get to their level. “Not on my watch.”

MC’s face was literally this: >:0

Lucifer is out here being the dad in every comedy that involves someone bringing home their partner to meet their parents.

MC was banished to their room, they spent their time angrily reading the manga they had packed.

When Levi escaped the party slightly later MC grilled him for details of what went on after they left.

“Nothing too interesting... except... um...”

“Spit it out, Levi!”

“...lrddiavlondlucferdnced”

“I can’t understand you, stop mumbling.”

“Lord Diavolo and Lucifer danced together...”

“...”

“...”

“I MISSED THAT?!”

So yes, MC’s desire to get a picture of Lucifer sleeping stems from VENGEANCE!

How DARE their father send MC up to their room and make them miss their OTP dancing together!?

So they call up their troupe of idiots and get ready to go be menaces to society.

MC also invites along Asmo because he seemed like he could use the adventure.

And because MC couldn’t plan the prank without Asmo noticing so it was better to just implicate him as well...

“Grrr...”

MC brightened and clapped their hands. “I know that growl!”

“It’s not my stomach, I packed snacks.” MC couldn’t see this, considering the room was pitch black (it must’ve been some kind of magic because demons have excellent night vision), but Beel waved a bag of chips in the air and got to eating.

“No, I’m not talking about your stomach, Beel.” MC skipped towards the source of the growling despite Mammon and Levi’s pleas for them to stop.

Ah! There he was!

“Cerberus!” MC cooed, the three headed dog stopped growling and barked happily. “Whose a good boy? Is it you?”

Cerberus let lose a bark that would probably make anyone crap their pants, but MC giggled and kept petting him. “Yeah! You’re the good boy! You like cuddles! Yes you do! Yes you do!”

A flash of light from a camera caused MC to drop their baby talk voice and stare angrily in the direction where the light came from.

“Whoever took that picture better delete it or I’m going to feed you to the dog.”

Cerberus growled in agreement. What a good boy.

“Well, as nice as this is...” Asmo huffed. “We’ve clearly been duped because this is not Lucifer and Diavolo’s room.”

“Oh well!” MC chirped and continued to pet the three headed dog. “Look at the doggy!”

“MC, you’re crazy. Dontcha ever forget that.” Mammon whimpered as Cerberus growled at him.

So yeah, they couldn’t get out of the room, so they ended up opening up the other door and falling into the catacombs like a bunch of lemmings.

Asmo charmed Henry, and they got out of the labyrinth no problem.

Yay! No consequences! Oh no- hi Lucifer.

Lucifer gave them all the mother of all lectures. Satan showed up with the rest of the gang and brought popcorn.

Belphie wasn’t there, okay? Satan needed to be a little shit for him.

Ah yes, the pillow fight... Mammon’s crusade to be the best uncle culminated in a massive pillow fight that ended with MC, Lucifer, and Diavolo standing over everyone’s unconscious bodies.

So they uh... won the pillow fight.

MC couldn’t sleep. They legitimately couldn’t. As exhausting as the pillow fight victory had been, everyone was snoring, and MC was bleary eyed and awake at one in the morning.

They eventually sat up and looked around, Asmo was passed out in a very unflattering position, Solomon was chanting god knows what in his sleep, Levi was half hanging off Simeon’s bed, Simeon and Luke were sleeping like angels (hehehehe-), Beel was in the middle of eating his pillow in his sleep, Mammon appeared to be dreaming about winning the lottery, and Satan was... suspiciously absent.

He was there a minute ago... weird.

Deciding that this wasn’t worth it and they should just go sleep somewhere else, MC got out of bed and avoided stepping on anyone as they vacated the room.

The Demon Lord’s Castle at night could rival the House of Lamentation in terms of overall creepiness. MC had gotten used to the spirits and curses that littered their home, but they had only been to the Demon Lord’s Castle once before, so they were extra careful not to accidentally touch anything. Their stomach rumbled and they frowned.

Damn, they had the midnight munchies... they needed a snack.

MC made their way to the kitchen and on there way, noticed a peculiar room through a half open door. Taking a few steps back to peek into it, they noticed... doors. A lot of doors. And ivy covered steps. There seemed to be no rhyme or reason to any of the placements, and the room was... weirdly chilly.

“You can come in if you’d like, MC.”

Barbatos’ voice nearly caused MC to hit a high note that they hadn’t been able to hit since their voice began to change. They straightened out their wrinkled pyjamas and stepped inside.

The butler himself was walking down one of the flights of stairs.

“Um...” Quickly remembering their manners, MC straightened their posture and cleared their throat. “Good evening Barbatos.”

Barbatos smiled and inclined his head in turn. “Good evening to you as well, MC.”

“How did you know it was me outside? You were up there a second ago.” MC asked.

“It’s a part of my powers. I can see possible futures, and I foresaw you passing by my room and getting curious.” Barbatos explained.

“Oh,” MC said, half nodding and continuing to look around. A the sound of a door closing out of MC’s vision made them squeak and look around for the source of the noise. “What was that?!”

“It’s nothing to be worried about.” Barbatos raised his hands in a placating gesture. “These doors in my room are gateways to different timelines and some are gateways into the past of this particular timeline. That was another version of me passing by.”

“Does this... happen often?” MC knitted their eyebrows.

Barbatos hesitated before answering. “Not really. It’s quite rare. Lord Diavolo has expressly forbidden me from using my full powers freely.”

“Ah... makes sense...”

“Now, I believe you came down for snacks?”

MC blinked in surprise. “How did you- oh... the time magic...”

“Yes, the time magic. Now, would you prefer yogurt and fruit, or apples and peanut butter?”

“Yogurt and fruit please!”

I’m sure MC’s knowledge of how Barbie’s room works will totally not come into play later. I’m sure.

Solomon and MC graced the brunch table with their cooking. I think you can guess how it would have turned out if Barbatos hadn’t intervened.

Rest In Peace to Beel’s tastebuds.

Anyway, the rest of the retreat was all fun and good.

MC may or may not have slipped up and called Diavolo ‘Dia’ in front of Lucifer. It would’ve sparked a lecture if Dia’s puppy-like excitement wasn’t so damn adorable.

Lucifer’s got a heart... somewhere... it’s probably all shrivelled up and tiny, but I’m sure it’s there.

Everyone went back home, brought closer together through... pillow fights and surviving Solomon’s cooking I guess..?

Anyway, MC got home, unpacked their stuff, watched Kakegurui with Levi and Mammon, let Asmo paint their nails, made and ate dinner with Beel, continued their piano lessons with Lucifer, and received a 100% fake smile from Satan.

It was a nice day with their new family, MC curled up in their bed and prepared to go to sleep.

“Help me!”

MC lurched upwards in their bed, whipping their head from side to side, trying to find the source of the voice. Their room was completely empty, the perks of being half demon extended to being able to see in the dark. No new smells either, they were alone in the room.

Auditory hallucinations were common before falling asleep after being sleep deprived, creepy, but not too unusual.

“MC!”

Okay- that one couldn’t be ignored. It was common knowledge that the House of Lamentation was definitely haunted in some capacity, but the ghosts never really bothered the demons living inside, MC was partly convinced that some of the ghosts didn’t even notice that the demons were there. So it couldn’t have been a ghost calling their name.

“MC! I need help!”

The voice reverberated through their head, like it was trying to hit every part of their skull to make sure it was at least felt if MC couldn’t hear it. MC massaged their scalp and got out of bed.

The House of Lamentation at night truly lived up to its haunted reputation. Cold, clammy, dark, even by demon standards. No spooky old house was going to scare MC though, they walked down the hall with their head held high.

They walked closer to walls and furniture, knowing that the floor was less likely to creak in those areas. How did they know that? Mammon had told them it worked like a charm. Well, it’d work better for him if he stopped tripping over the furniture and alerting Lucifer.

MC was much more nimble and careful, stepping slowly and lightly around the hallways until they reached the door to the attic. They reached out to clasp their hand around the doorknob, then froze. It smelled like…

Oh no.

MC leapt away from the door like it was rigged to explode if they touched it and practically dove for cover into an alcove. The all too-recent smell of Lucifer’s fancy cologne and the increasing sound of someone coming down the stairs made them clamp their hand over their mouth and crouch down.

What was their father doing up there?

He had said the attic was full of old junk and there was no reason to go up there, so why exactly did he-

The door slammed open and Lucifer stomped down the hallway back towards his room, MC presumed. They were about to let out a sigh of relief when the footsteps paused. MC felt their heart drop right into their gut when they heard the footsteps coming back in their direction.

What were they going to say to him when he found them? ‘Sorry! This isn’t where the bathrooms are!’ The last thing MC wanted was to add to their father’s ever growing list of stresses. MC was totally responsible and grown-up, their father didn’t need to worry.

MC clamped their eyes shut and tried to slow their heart rate. Demons were beings of darkness and shadow, they could blend in quite easily. They took a deep breath, cleared their head, and felt the shadows of the hallway shift and cover them like a blanket.

Lucifer’s footsteps stopped, MC heard a tired sigh, then the footsteps started up again, this time in the direction of his room.

They allowed themselves a sigh of relief before relieving themselves of their hiding space and opening the door leading to the attic staircase.

If the rest of the House of Lamentation was considered clammy, cold, and foreboding, the attic staircase was that multiplied by a factor of twelve. MC felt themselves shudder involuntarily when they stepped closer to the staircase. Every primal part of their brain was telling them to turn around and walk away, but one tiny part was holding them back. They placed their foot on the first step, waiting for any kind of resistance, nothing other than the feeling of passing through invisible cobwebs.

“MC?”

Upon hearing their name, MC craned their neck to try and get a look at what could be waiting for them at the top of the stairs.

“Are you coming, or not?”

The cascade of warning sirens that began to blare in MC’s head went ignored as they continued to scale the staircase.

When they reached the final step, they were met with a long hallway, with a single door on the right side of the wall.

“H-hello?” MC tried to instill some force into their voice, but it still ended up quavering a little.

“Down here.” Someone knocked on the wall next to the door, almost causing MC to jump.

Oh. Oh no. MC stood straight in front of the door, and when they saw who was looking back at them they nearly passed out.

“Belphegor..?”

Belphegor’s eyes flashed as he gave MC a once over. His eyes narrowed when his gaze snapped to MC’s. The analytical expression melted into a lazy grin.

“That’s me,” he said softly. “Nice to finally meet you, MC.”

[iamanartichoke]

Another totally unprompted ask, on the assumption that you are definitely no longer in need of them… another thing I’m trying to work out about Loki characterisation in preparation for perpetrating fic torture on him is how suicidal the poor sod is most of the time. This is another thing I’ve seen referred to a lot but only in passing. Though obviously this is a pretty triggery topic, so ignore if you want.

I am always in need of totally unprompted asks, otherwise I just assume no one wants to talk to me lmao

So, hoo boy. I have been mulling over this for, apparently, three days now bc there's just ... there's a lot to unpack here. Putting under a cut for obviously triggery content and also for length bc fml.

In my opinion, the response to "how suicidal is Loki most of the time" is "very, but whether or not he wants to do anything about it varies from moment to moment" (see what I did there? I'll see myself out). In other words, I have always had a headcanon that Loki is consistently, passively suicidal. This is a headcanon that comes straight from TDW, bc I'm certain that Loki never had any intention of surviving their mission. And that could be a whole other post, really, but the point is that even though this is a TDW-centric headcanon, I have come to adopt it as applying to Loki in general as well, not just in those specific circumstances.

When I say passively suicidal, I mean that Loki is just sort of ambivalent about the value of his own life. He feels like he doesn't deserve to be alive, and feels like there's little point in being alive. Which - I don't mean to sound all gloom and doom, like, poor uwu emo Loki (and I kinda hate that I have to pause to disclaim that, no, I don't just have a fixation on Loki being depressed for funsies/the aesthetic/whatever); I think that this mindset stems from really complicated places that I'm not sure I can articulate, but I will try.

I view Loki as someone who suffers from a severe inferiority complex, and I feel like it stems from being abandoned as an infant. Loki's life started with a traumatic event and, even if he doesn't remember the event itself, the feelings he experienced stayed in his subconscious. Feelings of loss, of fear, of despair and abandonment, of suffering - these are all feelings that burrowed into his bones and lived there for his entire life, feelings that colored how Loki viewed himself as a person as well as how he compared to the people around him.

Keep in mind that Loki didn't know he was abandoned until the events of Thor 1, obviously. We don't really know how old Loki is, in human years, but I have always assumed that he and Thor were at least adults (not teenagers), maybe the equivalent of early twenties - and the reason I bring that up is because it means Loki made it all the way to adulthood carrying the weight of a trauma that he did not remember or even knew had happened, so to him, there was no real reason for how wrong he felt. There was no explanation for the feelings of loss, of neglect, of fear. So on top of struggling with those feelings, Loki was also burdened with the alienation that comes with wondering why one can't just be like everyone else, why one can't just "snap out" of depression, why one's sense of self-worth has always been lacking.

So imagine what it's like to grow up as Loki. He was traumatized as an infant. The trauma has been with him his entire life, along with the confusion/alienation of not understanding why he feels the way that he does, and then on top of that, his basic personality lends itself toward introspection and isolation, so he likely felt even further removed from Thor and from his peers. Loki's too smart for his own good, and he's got an enormous capacity to feel and I feel like this is a combination that works against him as much as it does for him, bc it probably means he spent a lot of time examining himself and identifying all of his perceived flaws - and then berating himself for said flaws.

People with depression are probably pretty familiar with the bully that lives in your head, the one who is always there to remind you that you're stupid, or ugly, or that nobody likes you, or that you have nothing of value to contribute to anyone, etc. Loki's no different; he's got that bully in his head, too. Add onto this the fact that his brother is literally perfect, that he feels his father doesn't love him (or love him as much), that his interests in things like magic are looked down on in his culture, and that he's a prince (meaning that along with the privilege comes pressure, and being in the public eye, knowing that everyone around him is comparing him to Thor as much as he compares himself to Thor, well.) and you have a total clusterfuck of a mindset, and Loki's been existing inside of that clusterfuck for nearly all of his life.

I always go back to the quote where, when filming I think the vault scene, Kenneth Branagh directs Tom by saying, "This is the moment where the thin steel rod holding your brain together snaps." And it's such a significant moment for Loki bc this is where it all crumbles for him, learning the truth, but I also fixate on the "thin steel rod" part of the quote bc that's not how one would describe a healthy, stable person's mind. The implication, to me, has always been that Loki wasn't that stable to start with due to his general upbringing, his internal struggles, and his personality, so of course the devastation of learning he's adopted, and Jotun, would send him over the edge. One doesn't go from zero to 60; one doesn't fall over the edge unless they were balancing fairly close to it in the first place. And to me, the "thin steel rod" basically equals the aforementioned clusterfuck of a mindset.

THE POINT IS. (Holy shit, I ramble.) This is the foundation on which I'm basing my headcanon that Loki neither values his life nor feels as if he even deserves to live it - bc his default mindset is one of inferiority, of loss, of pain. And I think that going from being a general unstable person pre-canon to being passively suicidal post-canon is a thing that happened because, somewhere between the vault in Thor 1 and the dungeons in TDW, Loki just stopped caring.

Life is exhausting for everyone, but even moreso when your mental load becomes more than you can carry. Loki is exhausted. His experience is that things just keep getting worse and worse for him - he's never been valued, he's always been found wanting. He discovers that he was literally thrown away as an infant, unwanted and left to die, and things haven't gotten much better for him since then. Everything that can go wrong, does go wrong. His plans spin out of control. He's unable to prove his worth and his value and when he is, in fact, rejected, he literally tries to kill himself (only to survive and end up in an even worse situation).

It all just continually goes downhill, and Loki is fucking exhausted. He's done. He has no hope that anything is ever going to change - he will never be valued or even seen, he's unable to connect to anyone, he has no family (aside from Thor, but their relationship is so fraught with pain). As far as he's concerned, his life has been nothing but a waste since he was born and if no one else values it, why should he?

So - passively suicidal. He places no value on his life, and doesn't shy away from situations that could cost him his life. It's possible that the only reason he's not actively suicidal is bc his previous attempt not only failed but led to such a horrible situation that he's probably too afraid to intentionally seek out death again. He doesn't want to fail and end up worse off for it.

And - not that you asked this in particular, but - my biggest disappointment in the series is that none of what I've just written is addressed in a satisfying way (to me). That is, we don't get any real explicit acknowledgement of the trauma of Loki's abandonment as a baby or how that affected his mental health growing up; we don't get to explore how devastated he was to learn of his adoption; we don't ever see him reconcile his ingrained belief that jotuns are monstrous savages with the fact that he is jotun. He says "I betrayed everyone I loved, but I'm different now" and we're supposed to infer what he means without Loki actually articulating why he feels that he's the only one who should be held responsible for all these things that had happened or what "I've changed" even means to him (aside from not betraying Sylvie).

I would have liked to see these things addressed for a lot of reasons, but one of those reasons is that I would want to see how Loki comes to terms with all of his issues and his pain enough that he stops being passively suicidal. We never get to see that; after TDW, the time that passes allows for Loki to kinda chill, resulting in the Ragnarok version, but if there was any real healing or recovering going on, it was happening off-screen, with the audience expected to just go with "yeah Loki was going through it for awhile but he's kinda better now."

Furthermore, much of what I've written here is based on prime Loki's development through TDW, but doesn't account for series Loki's split from that timeline nor the theme of "Lokis survive" that's so prevalent in the series. So I don't think the "passively suicidal" headcanon is really appropriate for series Loki but, at the same time, I'd like to have seen why. I'd like to have seen Loki learning to value his life, or where the "we survive" mindset comes from, since that's not really been a thing before now. (Out of universe, I suspect it comes from the context of Loki just not dying whenever he tries to, but since TDW and IW haven't happened, and Loki didn't intend to survive his fall from the bifrost, framing Loki as an innate survivor doesn't really make sense, but to be fair, I'm just being picky.)

So, yeah. I'm not saying Loki doesn't experience growth or development in the series, I'm just saying that his arc left much unsaid and, furthermore, framing his growth as "wanting a throne to not wanting a throne" without addressing that Loki doesn't actually want the power of the throne, he wants the value and self-worth he associates with the throne, is - well, again, unsatisfying. Not bad, but it leaves viewers like me wanting bc we're cognizant of how much more could have been done.

I ... am going to end this now. This is probably nonsensical and all over the place, so I'm very sorry, and I'm sure this is why I don't get meta-starter asks lmfao bc no one's out here trying to read my dissertation submission for a Ph.D in Loki, but well, sometimes it just be like that.

Thank you for the ask and the opportunity to ramble.

[apollosgiftofprophecy]

I do recall suggestions that they give the throne to *others*, to create a new Olympian- similar to how Hestia did Dionysus. (How does THAT apply?)

You're right! There was discussion in The Tower of Nero about replacing Apollo's spot on the Olympian Council, so the thrones can't be too connected to them.

Plus, they didn't even have those thrones until Hephaestus arrived (I have that in my timeline as after Ares & Athena's birth, but before the twins', so the Elder Olympians and Ares & Athena did not have thrones for a while.)

Hestia abdicating technically doesn't come from the myths, and was the assumption about why sometimes Hestia is the twelfth and why it's Dionysus other times, but since that's what happens in the RRverse, we're just gonna roll with it lmao

Anyway, the above does support the idea that the thrones themselves are not connected to the gods- so this leaves the question of why was Dionysus so concerned then?

I propose now: The thrones are manifestations of human culture. They are made up of the domain whatever god the throne is assigned too. So just like Dionysus says, if they thrones are destroyed, so is human culture and the gods will weaken alongside it, since the thrones are connected to human culture, and more specifically, their domain of human culture.

Which also leads to the question- if Zeus has such control over immortality, why hasn't he taken it from his brothers? Or any other he deems a threat?

Zeus has taken it from Poseidon once! But I personally headcanon that the Laomedon servitude did not completely drain him and Apollo of their immortality, since it is myth-canon that they are both still very much gods during this timeframe, and both use godly skills to get the job done (ie, Poseidon uses his super strength and Apollo his lyre).

With Apollo's time with Admetus, I think Apollo was drained a bit more of his immortality, but he still had it in him because, as Apollo himself tells us in The Hidden Oracle, he made Admetus's cows have twin calves, a clear indicator of godly power.

ToA is when Apollo was sucked dry. And honestly, during the first two times, I don't think Zeus has much interest in depriving Poseidon or Apollo of their power- or at least, not all of it.

If he is willing to do so at the point of ToA...then why hasn't he?

(the below thoughts are inspired by @tsarinatorment, mainly from authors notes/behind the scenes thoughts)

I think it's because, unlike Hades, Poseidon, and Apollo, Zeus has not gotten a power boost from his own belief. Zeus's belief stems from a paranoid need to be in power and to stay in power- that is not a very good cornerstone for self-belief.

Tsari once said something along the lines of "the tighter he holds on, the more power slips through his fingers" and I think that also applies here. The more he hunkers down and insists he's in the right, that he has all the power he deserves, the more it slips away.

And how about granting immortality? Beyond apollo- and dionysus- ascending on their own, the gods have been known to make *other gods*, seemingly independent of worship- and possibly, the self belief of the individuals they immortalize.

Granting immortality seems a little trickier to pin down. Apollo tells us in The Dark Prophecy;

It is no small thing to make someone a god. The general rule is that power trickles down, so any god can theoretically make a new god of lesser power than him or herself. But this requires sacrificing some of one’s own divinity, a small amount of what makes you you—so gods don’t grant such a favor often. When we do, we usually create only the most minor of gods, as I did with Parthenos and Hemithea: just the basic immortality package with few bells and whistles. (Although I threw in the extended warranty, because I’m a nice guy.)

This is an interesting concept, but also one I scratch my head over because a lot of mortals have been made immortal over the course of mythology, and also I just don't quite understood why a god's power would have anything to do with creating a new god. I think @fearlessinger once talked about this in the Discord but I don't quite remember what she said XD

Plus, Dionysus wasn't made a god- like you said, he became one himself. And Artemis's hunters! They have immortality (albeit with strings) but it's still immortality! But Artemis is no weaker than the other Olympians (I think Rick kinda shot himself in the foot here lmao).

putting on our clown hats to figure out What The Fuck Is Going On in the big wide world of the RRverse haha!

what are your thoughts on the olympians’ thrones? we know that they are connected to the power of the gods, and that kronos’ tactic was to destroy olympus/their thrones in order to weaken them (so when kronos destroyed the arm rest of ares’ throne, did that weaken him during the battle with typhon?)

but why should the destruction of their thrones weaken them? isn’t the source of their power, their divinity, well, themselves? and what of minor gods? or what about during the first titanomachy? sorry for the lengthy question but it’s all very confusing and im interested in hearing your take.

SO

THE OLYMPIAN THRONES

first let's see what Dionysus had to say about this in The Last Olympian

"Whichever! Now listen, the situation is graver than you imagine. If Olympus falls, not only will the gods fade, but everything that is connected to our legacy will also begin to unravel. The very fabric of your puny little civilization—"

"Yes, yes. Your entire society will dissolve. Perhaps not right away, but mark my words, the chaos of the Titans will mean the end of Western civilization. Art, law, wine tastings, music, video games, silk shirts, black velvet paintings—all the things that make life worth living will disappear!"

"—the other gods would never admit this, but we actually need you mortals to rescue Olympus. You see, we are manifestations of your culture. If you don't care enough to save Olympus yourselves—"

Let's look at the third part first! Dionysus tells us that the gods are manifestations of human culture. And as we know, in the RRverse, the gods have moved around with the flame of progression, where the most human power is allocated. This is why they are in the US in the RRverse, and why they tend to reflect a more American culture (ie, Zeus in a CEO suit, Poseidon as a fisherman, Ares is a biker, ect.)

So what I'm getting from Dionysus's explanation here, is that the gods and human culture are intrinsically intertwined with each other. You can't have one without the other and all that. If human culture fades, the gods weaken, and if the gods weaken, human culture fades.

Something interesting to note here is that Dionysus says that the gods will fade if their thrones are destroyed...interesting, considering Dionysus and Percy also discuss how Pan faded.

But Pan didn't fade because of a lack of human belief/culture - he faded because his domain was being destroyed. Helios and Selene faded because they lost faith in themselves.

I think Dionysus might be overexaggerating a bit here. I don't think the gods would have necessarily faded if their thrones were destroyed- just significantly weakened. And perhaps, weak enough that if they ever just decided to give up...they would fade.

(Which brings up an interesting notion of Dionysus fearing them fading, because maybe that implies he thinks not all of them have the willpower to push through that...food for thought)

Kronos destroying Ares's arm rest is curious, since after the defeat of Typhon, we see the Olympian gods and nothing is out of the ordinary, even with Ares. So I'm guessing the arm rest getting cut off didn't exactly affect Ares, but if a larger piece of the throne or even the throne itself was sliced up? We'd have a different story.

I believe the source of the gods' power comes from a variety of places- mortal belief, their thrones, and belief in themselves. We see the latter occurring with Apollo in The Tower of Nero especially, where he's able to bring himself back into immortality on his own willpower, and I think we even see this happening with Hades and Poseidon, leaving their respected realms to come to the aid of Olympus and leaving behind their grudge (Hades) and ego (Poseidon) for the greater good.

This brings up an interesting idea, then. The Olympians have three main sources of power. But are they even aware of the third?

Because think about it. People, in series and out, have automatically assumed Helios and Selene faded because of a lack of mortal belief. But, that is not what happened, for they were still majorly worshipped- instead, it was a lack of faith in themselves. They lost their sense of self.

So I think the "power ranking" of these sources go as follows;

Belief in self

Mortal belief

Thrones

Mortal belief is often talked about, especially in ToA where Nero tells us mortals gave him a prolonged life and eventually immortality. He does not have a throne like the Olympians, though he does have a fasces, where his immortality is stored.

Could it be that the Olympian's immortality is stored in their thrones? Maybe. But remember, Nero is a wannabe god. There has to be drawbacks to that, and I bet the fasces was one of them. He has to contain his immortality in something, while the Olympians do not, because they are immortal. Full stop.

Now minor gods...this is a bit trickier, but I think minor gods have a power scaling of their own. The Olympians are on another level for godly power- they are The Squad so to speak.

How powerful minor gods are I think depends on their domain, as well as mortal belief/their own belief.

Hecate, for example, is probably exceptionally powerful for a minor goddess because of her position as the goddess of magic, the Mist, and crossroads among other things (did you know she has some influence over prophecy? ;3 she and Apollo were two sides of the same coin when it came to prophecy).

Iris is probably not as powerful as Hecate is, because, uh, rainbows aren't exactly powerful when it comes to magic XD

As for the Elder Olympians' power during the Titanomachy...that's also interesting to think about. Imo, I think their power grew over the time of the war, since they didn't really have the opportunity to fine-tune anything what with being in Kronos's stomach and all lol

Zeus probably got more practice in when he was young, but probably not as much when he became cupbearer. And I also think the symbols of power of the Big Three help channel their power- which now has a funny image because here are the guys learning how to focus their power with training wheels while the girls are just fucking around and finding out.

Demeter probably strangled a few people with her plants. Hera probably unleased a hoard of peacocks on someone. Hestia no doubt set a few things on fire.

lmao, that's funny to think about.

Anyway, finally got around to this one!!! :D

[otakusheep15]

SFW Alphabet - Solomon

This is for my best friend/mother as she is the biggest Solomon simp I’ve ever seen lol. Also, this is gonna be angsty cause I love writing angsty Solomon

A = Affection (How affectionate are they? How do they show affection?)

He pretends to not like affection, but he’s a softie and we all know it. Really, all he needs is a hug and he’ll just melt on the spot. 

B = Best friend (What would they be like as a best friend? How would the friendship start?)

One word: chaos. You two as best friends cause untold destruction and cause Lucifer several migraines per day. Being besties with him also means being besties with Asmo, so be prepared for that as well.  

C = Cuddles (Do they like to cuddle? How would they cuddle?)

He loves cuddles. Maybe it’s just the fact that he hasn’t had much physical contact in who knows how long, but he loves any form of contact. His favorite ways to cuddle is him on his back with you either laying on top of him, or on the side of him with your head on his chest. 

D = Domestic (Do they want to settle down? How are they at cooking and cleaning?)

I can’t see him as the type to settle down, be he’d consider it depending on the person. And while he’s a terrible cook, he’s not half bad at cleaning and other household chores. 

E = Ending (If they had to break up with their partner, how would they do it?)

He’d be super blunt about it. Honestly, he’s scared to get with anyone to begin with since, ya know, immortality and all, so it’s been a while since he’s actually had to break it off. His main goal when breaking up with someone is to get them away from him, so he wants to make sure the way he breaks up with them will make them want to stay away. 

F = Fiance(e) (How do they feel about commitment? How quick would they want to get married?)

Afraid of commitment. I imagine the last time he tried to commit to someone was before he became immortal, so having to watch them die made him vow to never get that close to anyone again. Then he met you, and all of that has been thrown out the window. He might try and rush things a bit, but he just wants as much time with you as possible. So, while he is afraid to commit, he’ll do it for you. 

G = Gentle (How gentle are they, both physically and emotionally?)

He’s bad at human interaction, so he might not know if he accidentally hurts you, but he’ll be quick to apologize once he realizes. Honestly, he’s better at being physically gentle since he can control that better than emotions.  

H = Hugs (Do they like hugs? How often do they do it? What are their hugs like?)

Loves hugs. They’re one of his favorite things ever. He just finds such comfort in them, and they’re great for stress relief. His hugs are a bit on the aggressive side, but they’re still very enjoyable. 

I = I love you (How fast do they say the L-word?)

He’d say it on accident. And then he’d try to play it off to hide how embarrassed he is. It is pretty early on, but he does mean it with all his heart. Please say it back, he hasn’t heard it in a while. 

J = Jealousy (How jealous do they get? What do they do when they’re jealous?)

He gets extremely jealous. Like, you spend so much time with the brothers and he can’t stand that. Of course, he would never admit it, but he would try everything he can think of to get you away from them. Once, he almost resorted to food poisoning out of sheer desperation. 

K = Kisses (What are their kisses like? Where do they like to kiss you? Where do they like to be kissed?)

His kisses differ depending on his mood, but they’re usually soft and full of passion. His favorite place to kiss you is your neck because it gets a nice reaction out of you. His favorite place to be kissed is the top of his head cause he’s secretly a big softy who wants to be babied.  

L = Little ones (How are they around children?)

He’s not the most fond of kids, but he’ll tolerate them. They’re are fun to tease though, especially Luke. 

M = Morning (How are mornings spent with them?)

he’s either waking you up at the crack of dawn to work on some new potion, or he’s sleeping in until past noon and refuses to get up. Regardless, you are not leaving his side. If he gets up, he’ll drag you up with him. If he wants to stay in, he’ll hold you there until he’s satisfied. 

N = Night (How are nights spent with them?)

He’ll usually be up late working on something or other, but he’s never up for too long. He jins you in bed when he’s done, and he’ll cuddle the crap out of you an an apology for keeping you waiting. He’s also fond of talking to you about random stuff that happened throughout the day until one or both of you fall asleep. 

O = Open (When would they start revealing things about themselves? Do they say everything all at once or wait a while to reveal things slowly?)

This man is one of the most secretive people to ever exist. He wants to open up to you, honestly he does, but he just can’t. he’s so worried that all of his emotional baggage will drive you away, and he couldn’t stand losing another person he cares about. So, he keeps everything hidden. With time, he’ll start opening up if you push enough buttons. 

P = Patience (How easily angered are they?)

He’s really good at pretending he’s patient. On the outside he’s his same-old self, but on the inside he’s fuming. His patience tends to wear especially thin around the brothers (except Asmo). It’s a mixture of jealousy for how much time they spend with you, and anger that they refuse to make a pact with him. But he keeps it all under wraps. 

Q = Quizzes (How much would they remember about you? Do they remember every little detail you mention in passing, or do they kind of forget everything?)

He does remember a good bit of information, but he sucks at remembering small details. For example, he may know what month your birthday is in, but he cannot remember the actual date. Or, he would remember your favorite movie genre, but not your favorite movie in said genre. He tries his best though. 

R = Remember (What is their favorite moment in your relationship?)

He loves this one time where you tried to help him cook something. You were tired of dealing with the mess that is his cooking skills, and you wanted him to make something that wouldn’t kill you. Everything started out fine until you accidentally get some flour on him. It wasn’t much, but still. He just turns to you without saying anything before launching some flour right back at you. And then the casual baking session turns into an all-out food war. The kitchen is a mess and you two end up getting scolded by Simeon later, but it was totally worth it.  

S = Security (How protective are they? How would they protect you? How would they like to be protected?)

Oh he’s very protective. I mean, you’re a defenseless human surrounded by powerful demons who want to eat you, of course he’d be protective. He would never mean to over-bearing, but he can come off that way sometimes. He used to protect those he cared about before he became immortal, so the habit comes back with you now. He doesn’t need protecting for obvious reasons, so it’s all the more reason to focus on protecting you. 

T = Try (How much effort would they put into dates, anniversaries, gifts, everyday tasks?)

Surprisingly, he prefers more lowkey dates. Maybe it’s because he rarely gets any alone time with you, but he loves just chilling out together practicing magic. if you did want to go out, he would take you somewhere in the Human World to get away from all the chaos of the Devildom. 

U = Ugly (What would be some bad habits of theirs?)

Obviously, his cooking could kill a man, but we’re gonna move past that since it’s low hanging fruit. Besides that, he has a tendency to by pretty cunning and he’s always planning some kind of prank. He also has a tendency to get jealous of the brothers a lot, and that can make him salty when you guys can finally hang out. 

V = Vanity (How concerned are they with their looks?)

He used to be pretty concerned with his looks, but he’s gotten over it. He still tries to look decent since he is in the presence of some powerful demons, but it isn’t at the forefront of his mind. Although, since becoming besties with Asmo, his vanity has started picking up again.  

W = Whole (Would they feel incomplete without you?)

Maybe yes, maybe no. He’s had to deal with loss several times over, so he could probably learn to deal with it like he did before, but you could be different. It really just depends on what kind of impact you have on him during your time together. 

X = Xtra (A random headcanon for them.)

We all know that it’s basically canon that he and Asmo have hooked up before lol. But I also lowkey think he’s hooked up with both Barb and Satan. I have no real reason as to why I think this, but I do and I’m sticking to it. I don't even ship it that much, I just think he would do something like that. 

Y = Yuck (What are some things they wouldn’t like, either in general or in a partner?)

He actually doesn’t like someone he knows he’d get attached to. He doesn't want to go through that pain again, so he wants to remain distant. Also, he doesn’t like someone who doesn’t understand or accept what he’s been through and what he’ll continue going through. He wants someone who understands and who he can talk to about it. 

Z = Zzz (What is a sleep habits of theirs?)

He gets very clingy in his sleep. If he’s sleeping with someone, they can expect to be trapped in his arms until he wakes up. And if you try to escape, he just hugs you even tighter. 

[yukipri]

One Piece Mermaid AU!

Featuring Luffy as a rubber mermaid who can’t swim, and Ace who carries her on his back as they pirate together.

＊Genderbend warning, fem!Luffy

Sliding in last minute for MerMay, bc idk about you, but I need something to mark that May has passed this year...

~~

PLEASE DO NOT REPOST, EDIT, TRANSLATE, OR OTHERWISE USE MY ART. To share, please reblog! Reblogs and comments greatly appreciated!!!

~~

Base headcanons for this AU beneath the cut! ↓ ↓ ↓

Luffy's a mermaid who was raised in Fuusha village, just like in canon. And, just like in canon, despite being a mermaid, she SUCKS at swimming, a fact that Shanks finds absolutely hilarious. She still wants to become a pirate, she still eats her devil fruit and becomes a rubber mer(?), she still gets kidnapped by Higuma (who sees her as an excellent way to rake in cash, given how valuable mermaids are on the slave market), and Shanks still gives her his hat.

As a devil fruit user, Luffy's already atrocious swimming skills are now at zero. She can still breathe under water, but will sink like a stone, her strength sapped by the sea, and if she loses consciousness she'll stop breathing too. Needless to say, she stays out of the water, and the villagers come to accept that sometimes, mermaids just live on land.

Garp still comes back, and is still furious at her wanting to become a pirate (and inwardly, extremely concerned that a bandit tried to catch and sell her), and still takes her to live at Dadan's where she meets Ace.

Ace has no idea what to think of the weird fish-brat who he's now told is gonna be his sibling, and resolutely ignores Luffy. He's inwardly slightly impressed as Luffy continues to follow him through the mountain every day, not even particularly hindered by lack of legs and using a mixture of crawling, squirming, hand-walking, and ricocheting forward with rubber arms to move.

Luffy still meets Sabo the same way as canon, and is still caught by Porchemy, who at first is thrilled because a mer brat! That'll bring in WAY more money than the spare change Ace stole! But in the end, he loses his temper at Luffy's stubbornness and still beats her to a pulp.

Ace and Sabo still rescue Luffy, and they still exchange sake cups and become brothers.

Yes, brothers.

Because at this point, neither Ace nor Sabo nor any of the bandits, nor anyone really on Dawn island save Makino and Garp actually know that Luffy's a girl. Not even Luffy.

The three brothers promise to each other that they'll all leave the island when they turn seventeen, setting out to sea to become pirates (Ace and Sabo are honestly a little concerned, given how often people try to sell Luffy, and how despite aquatic appearances Luffy's vulnerable af in water, but decide to wait and see. They have seven years together, Luffy ten until seventeen, who knows how much stronger their baby brother will get in that time).

Sabo "dies."

Ace and Luffy continue to train, and things don't change until Ace is seventeen, shortly before he sets out to sea.

He's let Luffy crawl into his blanket to sleep with him (partially cold-blooded, Lu gets cold easily when inactive), and Ace realizes that his lil brother's chest feels a bit lumpy.

Concerned, he makes Luffy have it checked out by the bandits, who are shocked to find developing...breasts?

That can't be right...right?

Dadan makes a call to Garp, who snorts and says of COURSE Luffy's a girl, didn't he say granddaughter?

No, he had not, he had only mentioned "grand child."

Everyone is shocked, but none more so than Ace, who really doesn't know what to do with this new information.

(Luffy's not quite sure what a "girl" is, and when she asks Ace, Ace honestly doesn't know how to define "girl" either, so she doesn't get what the big deal is)

Ace realizes he's troubled because he can't remember the number of times he's rescued Luffy from potential traffickers, and the number of times he's heard the lament, "Pity it's not female, it'd be worth quadruple," from the kidnappers before he beats them to a pulp.

He already had doubts about letting Luffy go out to sea alone, three years after he's left. But now knowing that Luffy's a girl, and one of the most sought-after species that traffickers target...he knows the world out there is much bigger than a teeny peaceful East Blue island, and Luffy may not get lucky every time, and may not be strong enough in just three years.

But at the same time, it's not like he can order her to stay here. There's no way Luffy'd listen; the sea calls to her, freedom calls to her, and Ace understands that more than anyone.

Sabo, Ace thinks, what would you do?

The night before he leaves, Ace tells Luffy that there's been a change of plans.

He's still leaving for sea. He's going to get stronger, and work his way towards becoming Pirate King.

BUT, three years later, Luffy will NOT leave Dawn Island alone.

Ace promises that he'll come back, a stronger pirate capable of looking out for his baby brother (because girl or not, they exchanged vows of brotherhood, and that's something that can't be changed).

He refuses to let Luffy be his captain, he's still got his pride, but maybe, maybe if Luffy becomes strong enough, he'll let her be co-Captain.

Luffy is thrilled, because she wanted to be pirates WITH Ace, and grudgingly accepts the compromise, and promises to train and wait for Ace's return.

Ace leaves Dawn island, and makes a name for himself on the Grand Line (he's PISSED when he finds out he's eaten a devil fruit, because now how's he supposed to rescue Lu from drowning when he can't swim himself???).

He even eventually makes it to Whitebeard, and eventually comes to admire the man. Whitebeard invites him to his crew, and Ace honestly replies that a large part of him wants to accept...but he can't. He promised his baby brother that they'll be pirates and co-captains together, and he can't join another pirate crew without Luffy agreeing too. Even so, and he knows it's selfish of him, he wants to call Whitebeard his father.

Whitebeard tells him that Ace is already his son, regardless of where his allegiances lie, and gives him his blessing to return to East Blue to fetch Luffy. Whitebeard laughs that he can't wait to meet the lil brat that Ace speaks so highly of, and for Ace to hurry up and come back to the New World so they can meet.

Ace plans on traveling light, his former crew all choosing to join the Whitebeard pirates except for his first mate, Deuce. Ace loves his crew, but they're also his crew, and knows that he wants to make their crew with Luffy. So he thinks he and Deuce will be a good starting point (You're just bringing me along bc you want someone who can swim on the crew, Deuce accuses).

As they're planning on leaving, Marco lets slip to fellow commander Thatch that he heard that Ace's "little brother" is actually a super cute girl.

The next morning, Thatch shows up too, insisting that he come along, because hey! He's been with the Whitebeards for ages and hasn't been to Paradise in a while, he wants some change! And won't it be nice to have someone as reliable as him along, just until they get back to the New World and reunite with the Whitebeards? Really he has no ulterior motives like wanting to check out Ace's supposedly hyper hot baby brother-sister!

Ace is suspicious, but Thatch is already on board and the other Whitebeards are already waving so he lets it go.

(Shortly after they leave, Thatch discovers a devil fruit. Deuce tells him to sell the damn thing, it'll taste like shit, but Thatch thinks boy wouldn't it be great to be able to woo Ace's hot brother with a really cool devil fruit power. So he eats it, and yeah it tastes like shit, but now he can control Darkness which is sorta badass?)

(Somewhere on the Whitebeard ships, Blackbeard is still waiting for someone to find the darkness devil fruit, and well, it doesn't happen)

Before Ace returns to Dawn Island, part of him still hopes that Luffy looks passably like a guy. Having been to Fishman island, having befriended Jinbe, he knows that while mermen can still be targeted, mermaids are exponentially more vulnerable. He's learned the kinds of clothing that can help conceal tails, and is hoping that there's a slim chance they might be able to be pirates without the world knowing that Lu's a mermaid.

His hopes are shot when Luffy rockets into his arms at the dock, and his face is immediately buried in enormous tits that definitely weren't there three years ago.

Despite Ace's growing concerns (and red face; why does he feel so hot??? It's not his devil fruit...), Ace lets Luffy give Deuce a beating (why me?!) to claim her position as Ace's Co-Captain of the newly established ASL pirates (because if we're pirates together, Sabo has to be with us too!).

Luffy's gotten a lot stronger, but is still utterly ignorant of the outside world and the dangers it holds (such as the drooling Thatch who immediately wins Luffy over with his cooking despite Ace's burning glares). She's reckless and falls into the ocean every damn day, and while Deuce dives in after her and they've discovered her useful ability to talk to fish to ask for help, it still gives Ace heart attacks.

They still pick up more crew members while in East Blue, including Roronoa Zoro, Usopp, and Sanji, a pervy cook who competes daily with Thatch for Luffy's affections through food (Luffy appreciates the food).

At Arlong Park, Luffy encounters fishmen for the first time in her life. Arlong mocks Luffy's choice of friends and family, and invites her to join his crew made of her own kind. Fishmen and mer are the superior race, and Luffy will make a fine wife, Arlong says.

Luffy breaks his nose off, and Nami joins their crew.

Luffy's chosen mode of transportation is on the back of one of her sturdier crew mates, usually Ace, but often Zoro too. She unfortunately hates all the long skirts/robes Ace suggested for her to hide her tail, and so Ace has decided that being as intimidating as possible while carrying his brother glued to his back is the only way to go.

Needless to say, news of the former Spade Pirates Captain + Whitebeard Commander Thatch (are they an extension of the Whitebeards??) establishing the new ASL pirates spreads fast. That, and rumors that there's a beautiful young mermaid on board who can't swim. And despite the strength of the crew and their attempts at vigilance, Luffy's still dumb and gullible, and is kidnapped (and rescued) a dozen times before they're even on the Grand Line.

(after a few times, Luffy's uncharacteristically quiet, and privately asks Ace if they can break up the crew. She's holding Ace back; she not only made him come back to her, but half their adventures just seem to be her crew rescuing her. She's strong enough to defeat enemies, but not save herself. Ace tells her to shut up, and never bring this up again; they're BROTHERS, and he's not going to leave her behind or make her abandon her dreams when she can't accomplish them alone, and that's his choice. Luffy doesn't bring it up again, but works harder than ever to become stronger and earn recognition as co-Captain when the world seems intent on thinking of her as Ace's pet.)

During one of these kidnappings, Luffy's successfully brought all the way to an auction house before her crew can rescue her. An auction house that unbeknownst to them, was under investigation by the Revolutionary Army.

Liberating slaves is an unfortunately common mission for them, and Sabo's doing final sweeps as Koala frees the last of them when he notices a tank stowed away in a corner. He's familiar with these tanks, used to showcase mermaids in the rare occasions one can be caught, and it looks empty but he's still drawn to it for some reason.

It's only when he gets closer that he notices a mermaid crumpled at the bottom of the enclosure. She's completely slumped over, and he's afraid she's already gone, even as something about her screams with familiarity.

He's cracked the tank and has reached in to pull her out, when the wall behind him explodes in flames, revealing a furious Ace who snarls at the strange man with his hands on his baby brother...

...and then Sabo's memories come back.

~~

Something like that???? For an initial HCs dump????

This AU has continued! A LOT! Check out the comics, illustrations, and text stories for this AU under the Mermaid AU section of my One Piece Masterpost!

As always, REBLOGS, tags, asks, and comments greatly appreciated!

Advance posts for this AU and more are on my Patreon! (Patreon(.)com/YukiPri)

[prince-of-elsinore]

Sam and Dean: psychological analysis and headcanons

In response to this anon ask from the 66 SPN Questions:

6. Do you have any psychological headcanons (or canon interpretations) of the characters?

Anon, this is probably not what you asked for. But I started writing, and kept finding more I wanted to say, until I thought--why not just say it all? And by all, I  don't actually mean all--this is by no means exhaustive. But it was a wonderful, self-indulgent opportunity to organize my thoughts on Sam and Dean's psychologies, and even find some new ideas as I was writing, and to put them out there so others can read and discuss. (Always happy to discuss any of this! Inbox is open.)

As a disclaimer, I know most of these thoughts are probably not original and may be retreads of many things fandom has been discussing for years. I'm not claiming to be breaking new ground here. Also, I sorta float backwards and forwards chronologically in my discussion--some parts pertain more to them when they're young, some to when they're older, and I don't always clarify which. Also, these are generalizations! I point out patterns I notice; that doesn't make them all hard and fast rules, because Sam and Dean are each human and complex!

Here's what you'll find below:

1. Core motivations 2. Happiness 3. Approval and secrets 4. Approval from authority figures 5. Need and attachment re: others 6. Sympathy and empathy 7. Walls—hiding vs. performing 8. Need and attachment re: each other 9. Ambitions and goals 10. Normality and monstrosity 11. Guilt and self-loathing 12. Autonomy and sacrifice 13. Personal identity 14. Concluding observation

1. Core motivations: Dean’s purpose is to protect Sam, obviously. Sam’s purpose, though a little less clear, is to save Dean. Sometimes it’s explicit, as in s3 and s9-10. But I think Sam also wants to save Dean, in general, from himself and from the life. It’s why he pushes against Dean’s obedience to their father. It’s why he tells him to get out and go to Lisa after he jumps in the Cage. At a certain point, I think Sam accepts he can’t “save” Dean without changing who he is, so he chooses to stick by him—because at least then he can make Dean happy.

2. Happiness: Dean’s happiness—or perhaps contentment is a better word—is knowing that Sam is safe and alive. Sam’s happiness is Dean being happy. In Sam’s world, things are good when Dean’s good. I think that, conversely, Dean wants Sam to be happy, and Sam wants Dean to be safe, but they both know and to an extent accept that those things are not within their control, so they focus on what they feel they can control.

3. Approval and secrets: They are each other’s north stars, guiding principles, in different ways. For Dean it’s “look out for Sammy,” for Sam it’s “what would my big brother think/do.” Dean doesn’t need Sam’s approval. Sure, he loves it when Sam admires him, but if he feels he needs to do something against Sam’s approval, he doubles down because approval from Sam is not the top priority. He’ll do what he thinks is right, especially to keep Sam safe, no matter what Sam thinks about it. Sam, on the other hand, does crave Dean’s approval and cares very much about his opinion. It doesn’t mean he won’t go against Dean (all the conflict of s1-5!), but it affects him differently. This leads to different kinds of secret-keeping: Sam goes behind Dean’s back to avoid his disapproval; Dean goes behind Sam’s back so that Sam doesn’t interfere with what he thinks needs to be done.

4. Approval from authority figures: Dean does crave approval from others—specifically, respected authority figures. The big one is obviously John. I think in a way it’s Mary, too, when she comes back. But it only applies as long as the person has his respect. Sam doesn’t crave approval from other authorities in the same way, perhaps because his primary authority figure growing up was Dean.

5. Need and attachment re: others: Sam is the only person Dean cannot live without, but he also makes outside connections of a friendly nature fairly easily. He’s the more socially outgoing brother who latches onto people like Gordon, gets friendly with Ash, and forges connections with Jo and Charlie, just to name a few (and Castiel at times—though their relationship is so inconsistent and often convenience-based I hesitate to include it in this category). Though Sam is Dean’s core need, I do think Dean thrives with other friendships. I’m not talking about found family, though I’m well aware of Dean’s tendency to call people “family” quite readily. Honestly, I think this is a manifestation of his craving for connection with others. Dean has an affectionate and playful nature, and let’s face it, Sam isn’t always super receptive to that—so naturally, Dean seeks out people who are. (I think this is also, in some cases, related to Dean’s craving for approval from others). Of course, none of those other relationships come close to the depth of his relationship with Sam, and when his relationship with Sam is at its best, I don’t think Dean really needs anything else to sustain him. But in reality, it can’t always be at its best.

Sam, on the other hand, doesn’t forge outside connections easily—but when he does, they tend to be deeper than Dean’s easy casual associations (even when Dean has real affection for someone, he tends to keep the tone of the relationship light). It’s pretty clear Sam was a loner kid, and I imagine it took him a while to find friends at Stanford, and even though he loved Jessica he still clearly kept many secrets. That’s the thing with Sam—he’s got walls. Dean’s got his own walls, but they’re different. Sam can seem emotionally open, but he protects his innermost self very carefully and rarely puts his emotions out there in a truly open way—even less than Dean does. I think this is a consistent personality trait for Sam, not one born of trauma (though perhaps exacerbated by it at times). In fact, it’s in later seasons that I see Sam finally, in rare moments, let down those walls, with Rowena and Jack. When he’s young, I think this was partially a coping mechanism he developed for hiding his desires/feelings, even from himself, because he was so unhappy with his life. It means that even though he’s an introspective guy, he’s not as self-aware as he thinks he is until he’s older and more mature. He’s very good at self-deception when he’s young, because as a thinker, he can convince himself of just about anything.

To circle back to attachment, what this means to me is that Sam, while he certainly appreciates close friendships and has a lot to offer those he cares about, doesn’t crave friends in the way that Dean does. I think he desires to be understood (this is a natural human need) but he’s much more comfortable with himself than Dean is, and is somewhat of a loner by nature. This means he’s also not (usually) going to be too affected by the status of his relationships with others. Dean is much more volatile and easily hurt by others (this is where Castiel is a great example).

6. Sympathy and empathy: On the surface, Sam appears to be the caring, sensitive brother, while Dean is brash and insensitive. This is a very incomplete picture, however. It mostly comes down to the difference between sympathy and empathy. Empathy is an involuntary response, whereas sympathy is something that a person chooses to express, though that doesn’t make it necessarily superficial—it also comes from an emotional place. Dean tends to be more empathetic, and Sam more sympathetic. Dean, despite his performative walls, is more easily affected on a visceral level by others’ emotions. He is more sensitive, more easily hurt or swayed to anger, and also more easily experiences empathy. This has nothing to do with what Dean thinks is right—it’s another involuntary emotion. He is sometimes moved to express this feeling, but he’s not generally concerned about appearing sympathetic. Sam, with his careful emotional walls, isn’t generally so viscerally affected by others, but he is kind. This is expressed as sympathy, because he cares about others’ feelings, and he wants to be good/morally right. On the one hand, it comes from an intellectual place—“it’s socially acceptable/morally right to express care for this person” (which Dean is less likely to care about)—and on the other, it is an emotional response—“I know what that feels like”—but a more regulated one than empathy, where one almost directly experiences another’s emotions.

7. Walls—hiding vs. performing: It’s interesting that both brothers have their own walls, which they construct as a form of self-preservation, but they have different levels of effectiveness in protecting themselves from outside influence. One difference might lie in what the walls were built in reaction to. Sam built his walls at a young age to separate himself from the outside world because, ironically, it was precisely what he desired, but was not allowed to have. He therefore consciously distanced himself from it, to dull the pain of not having it. The goal of those walls was to have something to hide behind, where he could remain generally unnoticed, so he could conceal his pain from outsiders and even from his family.

Dean took a little longer to build his walls—or at least to consciously do so. He already no doubt fashioned himself after his dad as a kid, and often put on a brave face—for Sam, for his father—when he was not feeling brave. He therefore became accustomed to performing at a young age, and performed many roles for both Sam’s and John’s benefit. He was unconsciously building walls with these performances, concealing his true feelings and desires. Later, I think this started to become more intentional, especially in relations with women/sex partners and especially after the Stanford split, as Dean realized how vulnerable to hurt his sensitive nature made him. It was much safer to perform all the time, and never let his real feelings show. For Dean, even more than Sam, I think he often lost sight of what those real feelings were behind the walls as he tried his best to be the performance he was putting on.

For a visual metaphor, I think of it this way: Sam is a boy at the center of a self-constructed labyrinth. He is almost always able to maintain control over how close people get (except when a few slip past his defenses, at which point he may be susceptible to manipulation). Despite all those elaborate passageways, though, there’s still Sam at the center. It’s lonely there, but he knows himself pretty well at least. Dean is a man in a mask who wants the mask to be his real face. He does everything he can to fuse himself and the mask together. They probably are fused at this point, so it would hurt to take the mask off. His memory of the face under the mask is hazy. He’s afraid, if he looks under the mask, he’ll hate what he sees. He’s lonely because no matter how close others get—and he lets them in close, can surround himself with people—none of them will ever see his true face. But he’s convinced himself it’s better this way, because if anyone saw his face, they’d hate it.

8. Need and attachment re: each other: Clearly, both brothers need each other. Sam’s need for Dean is different than Dean’s need for Sam, though. The way I see it, Dean’s need is one that requires reassurance. Perhaps it traces back to the concern about Sam instilled into him at a young age. I think it was strongly exacerbated by the Stanford split, when Dean realized his and Sam’s desires didn’t align. In Dean’s mind, Sam left once and can do it again—he’s always waiting for the other shoe to drop. Sam, on the other hand, has always been able to rely on Dean as a rock, a constant in his life—to the point that, in a way, he takes it for granted when he’s younger. Not in a spoilt, ungrateful way, but in that way that we, as children, might take our parents for granted—they’re always going to be there, right? That’s why, on the few occasions where suddenly, Sam isn’t sure of Dean’s devotion, the rug is ripped out from under him and he’s completely adrift and distraught—seasons 4 and 8 come to mind. Sam needs to be the center of Dean’s universe. When he fears that that’s shifted, that Dean hates him or has chosen someone else over him, it turns Sam’s whole world upside down. For Dean, the fear is that Sam will leave, but it’s a constant, background worry. For Sam, the fear is that Dean will hate him, but since he can usually count on Dean to be obsessed with him, it only comes up now and again. Only Dean can truly hurt Sam, while Dean is vulnerable to hurt from others—though, as always, the deepest hurt can only come from Sam.

9. Ambitions and goals: Sam is the one with greater needs and ambitions outside the scope of their relationship. For Dean, if he’s got Sam and he’s got hunting, he’s content. His greatest accomplishments are taking care of Sam and saving people, and that’s all he needs. I see Sam as craving other sources of fulfillment, though—academic/lore study for its own sake (the pursuit of knowledge), and a leadership/mentorship role. I thought it was very fitting that Sam finds these in late seasons, with leading hunters against the BMOL, then leading the apocalypse AU hunters, then mentoring/nurturing Jack. Dean has always had (and needed) a mentor/leadership/nurturing role with Sam, but Sam also thrives when he’s able to step into that role for others.

10. Normality and monstrosity: I’m just going to link to this post rather than repeat myself.

11. Guilt and self-loathing: This is something they both struggle with and at times, are defined by, but it manifests differently. I think their Hell traumas exemplify their different brands of guilt: for Dean, it’s perpetrator’s guilt. He knows he did something terrible and feels he can never atone for his past actions. For Sam, it’s victim’s/survivor’s guilt. He may not have done anything wrong, but there’s a certain amount of self-blame, especially for perceived weakness. This is another theme for Sam; one of the main faults he sees in himself is weakness—too weak to save Dean from Hell for instance—and as a result tries to shoulder things alone (killing Lilith, Hallucifer, etc). Sam has a need to fix things, to prove to others and himself that he is capable. Dean, I think, sees his main fault as neediness, but really, it’s a deeply buried sense of innate worthlessness. He was taught from a young age that his brother’s life—not his own—was of the utmost value. He internalized that his life was only worthwhile if he could save others, and has trouble with the idea that he, himself, has value beyond what he can do for others.

12. Autonomy and sacrifice: The above leads Dean to have a very constrained sense of his own autonomy. In general, he values duty/loyalty to others over autonomy (although when it comes to cosmic beings, he’s all about free will—see this post if you want more thoughts on that, and Sam’s autonomy). Often, his desire to control others comes from a place of frustration when Dean feels they are neglecting duty/being selfish. I think partially duty towards others is really a deeply ingrained value for him, but there may also be some buried jealousy at play, in that Dean wishes he could act with more freedom, put himself first every once in a while, but doesn’t know how to. Sam tends to value autonomy over duty (this doesn’t mean he doesn’t believe in any sort of responsibility—he’s willing to sacrifice for the greater good, after all).  This means he also tends to respect others’ autonomy, though we all know he can get plenty unhinged where his brother’s safety is concerned. The theme of Sam and autonomy has been talked to death so I’ll stop there, but you can click the link above if you want more.

13. Personal identity: One of Dean’s biggest struggles is with how much of his personal identity is received rather than self-determined. He is tasked with taking care of Sam and he is trained to be a hunter; these become the foundations of his identity. He says it himself: taking care of Sam is not just what he does but who he is. Then in season 3, his own subconscious mocks him for his lack of originality, styling himself and all he loves after his father, showing that this is a source of deep insecurity. This discomfort with himself contributes to his fear of being abandoned and left alone with himself. He doesn’t know who he is without Sam—or rather, is convinced he is nothing without Sam, which is why he fights so hard to keep him by his side. It also contributes to his general desire for friends, or better, family: people who won’t abandon him.

Later in the series, I think Dean has come to embrace his genuine self more. He’s nerdy and excitable and playful—and I don’t see this is as regression, but rather a healthy embracing of what makes him happy—not tastes inherited from his father. If it seems juvenile, it’s because it’s the first time in his life he’s allowed himself to express and explore these things. I think his relationship with hunting is also healthier; it’s no longer something he does because it’s the only thing that can give him worth. He does it because he believes it’s right and genuinely wants to help people. He has a more complete sense of self, and while it’s still totally tied up in Sam, he has gained some self-worth.

[I should note that basically everything I’ve written about Dean supports the headcanon that Dean has BPD—a headcanon I accepted after I realized this. For some more great writing on Dean and BPD, see this post by @venhedish.]

Sam has always known what he wanted for himself and rejected what was given to/allowed him. Wanting what he couldn’t have, from a young age, helped him develop an individual sense of self, not defined by others. I think it’s this difference in their sense of individual identity that leads some viewers to think that Dean loves Sam more than Sam loves Dean. He doesn’t, and losing Dean is just as huge a loss and a grief for Sam as losing Sam was for Dean. Dean is central to Sam’s life, and he can’t feel complete without him; however, his identity and every desire has never revolved as entirely around Dean as Dean’s has around him, so Sam has a foundational sense of self that even losing Dean can’t completely destroy. It’s what allows him to rebuild in grief and carry on (whereas I have no doubt Jensen’s right and Dean would waste away in the back of a pool hall without Sam). Dean’s central role in Sam’s life never disappears, though, and it is, in fact, what allows Sam to carry on; an effort to honor his brother’s memory, living in a way that would make him proud. There’s continuity in that for Sam; the craving for his brother’s approval and happiness never disappears. Seeking those things is what makes Sam happy, both in their domestic years together before Dean’s death and in the years after. They are both, after all, co-dependent!

14: Concluding observation: Sam and Dean have many similar issues, desires, and insecurities: the desire for a normal life, the fear of their own monstrosity, the desire for love and friendship, their need and love for each other, their desire for approval/to be admired, resentment at their childhood, the feeling of being impure and unworthy, the desire for freedom, issues with bodily autonomy. Sometimes these are seen as the purview of one brother or the other exclusively, but that’s almost never true when you consider canon as a whole. The difference is in how these things are internalized, sublimated, reflected, and expressed for each of them. It makes sense they would struggle with so many of the same things, because their lives are deeply intertwined and they are in the same boat most of the time.

[moonsoupstar-ao3]

Chapter 2 (ALSO SPOILERS FROM VERY LATE IN THE MANGA IN THIS PART)

I think something I usually don't acknowledge (and like, as an unconscious act) is that Yukio has as many answers as Rin around their births and all the demon stuff

Yeah, he was an exorcist and could fight along side Shiro (one thing Rin in the manga openly told him he was very jealous about) but he never got proper answers for his questions

I think that's also one of my favorite things about aoex and the way they portray the brothers as two sides of the same coin, both are struggling and have their own problems but they also share lots of the same troubles and stuff

They hurt each other, but never to a psychopath degree that other animes usually show between siblings or friends that "truly love (platonically) each other", and they care and they love an they envy so, so much

One got the chance to understand to some point about their situation from the start, the other got time to grown up like a "normal" person (or at least as much as the inherent demon's abilities allowed him)

That's probably another point that made me so frustrated with Yukio at the end of the Past Arc, he could have answers, Rin was so willing to share them with him because he probably knew or had guessed that Yukio wanted them as much as him, but he refused, he didn't want to know anymore

And it took me just one more chapter to understood "why?", he wanted to die, he was ready to sacrifice himself, and he probably thought "what is the point of knowing then?"

I guess I just wish he agrees to see the past with Rin once everything settle down and the timelines come back to normal, it's gonna hurt him, it's probably going to ruin so much of him that isn't fully broken yet, but I believe is for the best

ANYWAY, BACK TO THE ANIME JSVDBDN

I'm still not used to this Mephisto

Ok, no, I'm sorry, I know what I said literally one line above but I can't just shut up about Rin and Yukio, I love them both too much

IT'S SO PAINFULLY OBVIOUS HOW MUCH YUKIO CARED FOR RIN AND HOW MUCH HE WAS WORRIED ABOUT HIM BEING AN EXORCIST

like, c'mon, he knew they were Satan's sons and that there was so many weapons pointing at them

And I'm fully convinced half or more of his worries about Rin not being able to control his flames was for Shiro's death and that their father's death would go in vain, but the rest was totally "fuck no, you WILL NOT put my brother in this mess!!!!"

This is canon in my mind, no one can convince me otherwise, Kato told me herself

I love that no one trust Mephisto lmao

Yeah, don't give that bitch a chance, he doesn't deserves it (I love him)

YUKIO AND SHIEMI SCENE WAS SO CUTE

I just noticed Yukio's eyes are also like Rin's

Sorry I won't shut up about them, that's what happens to me when you put my babies on screen for more than half a second

RIN FACES ARE THE BEST AS ALWAYS

Kamiki is so lesb coded I swear "I JUST WANNA BE FRIENDS WITH YOU (Paku)" ok girl

My headcanon is that she's bi but heavily girl inclined, but fr canon anime/manga is just sooo queer coded anyway

Yukio is pulling so much "gremlin youngest sibling" energy is amazing, good for him

I love how the animators hid the guys crossdressing jsvdjdjjd

SAY IT SHIEMI SAY IT

GIRLS SUPPORTING GIRLS IS WHAT WE ALL DESERVE

Rin: "I'm really pretty, right?" Yes, baby, you're

Yukio, Tanaka and Shima looked almost good actually

I love that it showed how Lewin was actually concerned and then all goofy again

AND THIS TIME I ACTUALLY LIKED MEPHISTO'S VOICE WHEN HE SPOKE GERMAN

Lucifer's eyes shining in the dark were actually quite unnerving

THE ENDING SOUNDS SO CUTE I LOVE IT

and the little drawings :((((( I'm in love guys

That's Mephisto's phone??????????

I started watching aoex season 3

So I decided to share my thoughts as I see the chapters (NOT SPOILER FREE)

Chapter 1:

not a full fan of the new art style but not a hater either

can't forgive them for taking away my troll clown though

also the voice, dunno, maybe I'm remembering the voice wrong in past seasons but yeah, not for me (especially when he says "eins, zwei, drei" I just feel like is the wrong tone)

also, I love the pace of the chapter but am really bitter that they cut the bestism (Angel & Lightning) first show time together so short

THE GEHENNA SCENE WAS SOOOOOO, loved the light hint to trigger response from Rin

uhhhhh what else....

THE SHAPESHIFTER BATTLE

so, so good, when Rin, Izumo, and Shima attacked and the camera was moving I didn't know where to look at

I'MMA FIGHT WITH MY BARE HANDS ANYONE WHO DARES SAYS MY BOY RIN ISN'T SMART AFTER THIS SEASON

alright then, time for chapter 2 :D

[transguyedgeworth]

HALLO i hope all has gone well with bugs and such ur probably dealing w that as i type this but i have more headcanons >:) so! i hope these are helping deal with evil evil bugs

-maya still has a bunch of mias clothes she gave some to lana and some to pearl but sometimes she’ll wear a sweater or something that was mias

-phoenix doesn’t really like hospitals

- reminds him too much of bttt and falling

- yes i think capcom should have realized that falling off a damn bridge should give a man a good bit of upset and trauma capcom i am outside your door

- miles bottles up his feelings A LOT because there wasn’t any place for feelings in the von karma house. he’s trying to get better though

- he mostly bottles up his anger because he sees mvk in himself whenever he gets angry because mvk would be angry a lot

- fran also does the same but with any happiness or personal pride she may feel

- they both try to work on it, maya and phoenix are good influences on them

- miles has visited mvk in jail once. he won’t again

- franziska will never visit him

-miles likes to knit

-maya is sooo superstitious not like ohh if i break a mirror i’m dead but like Bigfoot Is Real and I Saw Him At Gourd Lake

-edgeworth and phoenix go often to a little coffee shop and always get a pot of tea

-sometimes phoenix brings flowers

-LMAO edgeworth asks what they are sometimes and unless they’re the two types of flowers phoenix knows he has No Idea

- the bathroom at wright and co is haunted

- maya attracts ghosts like nobodies business

-fran is afraid of spiders and maya is Violent towards spiders

- fran will shriek from the other room and maya will run in flip flop in hand, take one look around the room, and chuck her shoe at the spider. she never misses.

-maya LOVES that bakery they investigated in that one case i cannot remember the name of the one with the like. french dude? and tigre?

-pearls and maya make a scrap book for wright and co

-phoenix still draws (he was an art student and i am projecting onto him) sometimes but always drags edgeworth to art museums and talks about the art

-building on game night with the wrights they also have video game nights. phoenix is so bad and maya is still competitive but fran and edgeworth when paired against each other are Scary

-fran also sometimes lets her little brother win and gets dramatic about losing but it makes her happy to see edgeworth excited

- edgeworth has a journal bc someone once suggested it and he writes in it so often

- he also carries a certain picture of him larry and phoenix when they were kids and his signal samurai keychain in his inner pocket and fiddles with the keychain

-maya loves decorating the office for holidays

-the only thing phoenix can make well is soup and hot chocolate and he makes them at least twice a month when it’s cold

-edgeworth won’t admit it but he’d rather eat phoenixs almost burnt soup and melted bar hot chocolate than the stuff from the fanciest restaurants

- when edgeworth and phoenix propose they both propose at the same time and it’s so awkward but so so funny they both say yes of course but phoenix will tell that story to anyone who listens

ok that’s all for now! idk if i have any more (that’s a lie i have so many thoughts about them but idk how many of them are coherent) anyway i wish you best of luck with all the hubbub!!!

everything is going well thank you for the concern!! housing sent someone out to fix up the hole in my wall that they were coming through and the pest control guy just left and is now treating the outside of the building. these are absolutely helping me deal with the stress so thank you for sending them in! 

starting strong with the clothing thing, i love love LOVE your interpretation of the fey clan so much. it is canon in my brain now. capcom wishes they could think of this shit. also giving some to lana? precious, sentimental, amazing. lanamia nation rise up. thank you for my life. the detail about maya believing in cryptids and the bathroom being haunted? accurate and hilarious. and yes big agree that she still likes tres bien (i’m pretty sure that’s the name), she worked there briefly so of course she’d have a soft spot for it. i literally adore the idea of maya being hella Into Stuff, like cryptids and holiday decorations and winning at game night, and the scrapbook idea slayed me on sight. i am in tears.

LITERALLY WHY DOES CAPCOM IGNORE THAT PHOENIX HAS BEEN THROUGH SOME SHIT??? like what the hell. man almost died and then like two days later he’s like “lol i’m Completely Fine :)”. unrealistic. capcom let him be Affected by experiences please. 

kinda building off of that, AGAIN WITH THE WRIGHTWORTH STUFF MAKING ME TENDER??? i love them goin on little dates and being domestic... art museums and coffee shops and phoenix being Dumb about flower breeds and miles loving his cooking.... i am Soft i am Yearning. AND THE PROPOSAL THING!!!!! I HAD THIS SAME FUCKING IDEA GET OUT OF MY BRAIN!!!!! IT’S JUST SUCH A THEM THING TO DO...

and oooh edgeworth. good for you king, journaling and knitting and stimming and learning healthy ways to cope with your emotions. also the anger thing i totally get. like not to Overshare or anything but i used to have a lot of issues expressing my anger because when i did it reminded me too much of my dad so i feel that. 

the vk sibling stuff also spot-on tbh. good that they didn’t visit manfred except for miles’ one time. fuck that guy. let him rot. they are Learning and Growing together.... fran letting miles win at a game also perfect. she cares about her little brother even if she has trouble showing it sometimes. also love that her one weakness is spiders. that seems very fitting to me and i LOVE the image of maya just. chuckin a shoe across the room to defend her Wife from the eight-legged terror.

also you are free to send me incoherent thoughts if you want that’s the form most of my thoughts take anyway fjnfjsf i’d still love to hear them if you’re willing to share!

[imaginaryelle]

I just re-watched THAT scene and a thought hit me: Lan Wangji just stands there watching Wei Wuxian fall from the cliff... Why doesn't he jump onto his sword and swoops down to at least try to save him? Or is he all out of spiritual power? Or does it simply take to long to start and rev the sword? Not saying it's a plothole, I was just wondering...

I mean, I think this is a fair question and I know I’ve seen it discussed elsewhere. I just can’t seem to find the post or remember if any conclusions were reached, so I’m excited to dive into this. As always if anyone has insights or headcanons they want to add on to this, please do.

Because I like pictures, here’s ep 33 Lan Wangji holding his sword and staring in horror as Wei Wuxian falls (what is Jiang Cheng thinking? Who knows.) 

Why isn’t Lan Wangji doing anything? He just stands there for long enough that Jiang Cheng backs away and leaves him on the outcropping, all alone.

Poor guy.

Okay, moving on. I think there are at least two ways to approach this, and one is from the production perspective (since this cliff encounter is a thing that only happens in the drama) and the other is from the in-universe perspective (aka, Doyalist vs Watsonian), so I’m going to look at both.

For the production pov, there’s really only one scene (I think) where we see anyone actually riding a sword in the drama, and it’s when they’re confronting the water demon/abyss in Caiyi (ep 5). At that point there’s no prep time, everyone just jumps up and then steps onto their swords (which is actually even more ridiculous to me than the image had already been in the novel because I thought they were at least riding on the scabbard but no! Riding the bare blade like a skateboard. I love it.)

How majestic.

Lan Xichen is the only graceful and cool person here. The only other sword-riding shot in this scene that shows more of a person’s body than their head and shoulders is when Lan Wangji drags three people into the air at once and we get a brief glimpse of Su She’s feet kicking wildly.

So, based on this scene’s execution and the general scarcity of other sword-flying scenes (even with the Nightless City confrontation, Lan Wangji just flies in with his quqin, no sword under his feet), my out-of-universe theory would be a combination of budget and aesthetic at play. If the production can get by on wire work with super extra long jumps that don’t seem to require actually riding the sword, they will. It’s logistically simpler, and it frankly looks better on screen. It’s also a staple of the entire film genre, whereas this sword thing is not, so the crew and effects people would have more experience with it as well. (In-universe I have a lot of questions about Wei Wuxian’s retained ability to do those jumps. Do they not use spiritual energy? Does he still have spiritual energy, just not a golden core? Is he using resentful energy instead? How does this work?)

From a more story-side view on the production, they’re working against the fact that they changed the plot to add Lan Wangji’s presence at Wei Wuxian’s death and they want to capitalize on that relationship, so having Wei Wuxian knock himself over the edge as he destroys the seal (or something where he steps back as Jiang Cheng rushes him or any other number of possibilities) no longer fits with the emotional beats they’re trying to hit. Also they really need Wei Wuxian to die here for the plot to function. Having Lan Wangji mount a sword and swoop down to try and save him again just adds extra complications and delays the desired outcome of WWX = dead and LWJ = distraught. In that sense, it really does start to look like a plot hole, because it feels like they’re ignoring the capabilities of a character in order to get the result they need. I do think they try to address this, but since multiple people have this question and I personally had to watch the scene more than once while actively thinking about it to notice all the relevant details… the efficacy of those efforts is maybe questionable. (Also like.. why does Jiang Cheng wait three days to go look for Wei Wuxian’s remains? Why is anyone waiting at all? Why is anyone surprised they can’t find a corpse when the visual we get implies Wei Wuxian is falling into lava? There are many, many questions that can be asked here and for a lot of them the out-of-universe answer is probably going to resemble “because the plot/original source material demands it” without much helpful in-universe support.)

In-universe (and probably more pertinent to your question), yeah, Lan Wangji could be low on spiritual power (and upon rewatch, I think he genuinely is). He could be physically exhausted as well as injured, too. For someone who carried three people in two hands 2-3 years ago and canonically has only gotten stronger since, he sure is having trouble pulling one person up over the side of a cliff. And that exhaustion really isn’t outside the realm of possibility, no matter how strong and powerful he is. He just traveled pretty far! If the theories that he found A-Yuan before coming to Nightless City are true (since he’s not injured in those flashbacks), he likely spent a ton of spiritual power even before getting into this battle where he first confronted Wei Wuxian and then started fighting pretty much everyone on the field by himself. Then, in a moment of fear-induced distraction, he gets injured! He’s actively bleeding! So yeah. He could definitely just be physically exhausted.

All that blood loss is not a good sign, and it actually speeds up (visually) as he expends this effort. We can see his arm trembling all throughout this scene, and then his grip slips (thus the face). Even after that he slips again, not losing his grip, but losing the strength to hold himself up at all. In the end he’s literally just lying on the rock depending on gravity to keep him in place and putting everything else he has into holding on to Wei Wuxian. He can’t do more than glare in Jiang Cheng’s general direction and tell him to stop.

Bichen is right there. If he had spiritual power left, I think he’d probably be sending his sword out to block Jiang Cheng’s angle of attack. That, or he needs two hands to accomplish such an action (It doesn’t require hand motions later/in the future, but maybe he develops that skill precisely because of these events). So yes. He’s physically exhausted. He’s spiritually exhausted. But I think there’s more going on here, too: He’s also at the end of his rope emotionally, and that’s how he ends up standing there, horrified and unmoving.

He’s had a rough time recently: Everyone hates his best and only friend/love of his life, and he has to listen to them call for his death/judgement at fancy dinner party meetings on and off for over a year. No one will listen to him when he tries to present a different view. Even his own brother is (not unreasonably) much more concerned about Lan Wangji’s personal safety than what his silence on this issue is costing him emotionally, and his uncle is distinctly unsupportive of the friendship from the beginning.

I think Lan Wangji spends a lot of time questioning his upbringing in those months (we see him actually verbally do so when he’s punished after Wei Wuxian’s death, but I think it starts well before that). What is right and wrong? Who decides it, and how? When does justice and holding people responsible for their actions turn over into unjust persecution? What is true, and what is a lie, and how much does that matter when weighed against social/political/spiritual harmony? These are concepts that are buried pretty deeply in the Lan Sect’s teachings but the world is twisting all of them before his eyes, and I have to think that takes a toll on him. Additionally, just as things start looking up (they let him write the letter to invite Wei Wuxian to Jin Ling’s celebration! They listen to him, other people support his idea!), he has to deal with the facts that:

1) His best friend who he’s in love with just killed a bunch of people, including Jin ZiXuan and some of Lan Wangji’s own Sect brothers.

2) Wei Wuxian is clearly losing control of his resentment-based cultivation path, and is thus personally in danger on a spiritual level, and

3) Everyone now wants to kill Wei Wuxian again, possibly even more than they did before, and anyone who supports Wei Wuxian is an enemy of the entire cultivation world.

Later in the series, Lan Wangji says he regrets that he wasn’t at Wei Wuxian’s side at Nightless City. That he didn’t support him, despite what we see of him trying to help Wei Wuxian find Jiang Yanli and then, after she dies, stop him from killing himself. To me, this could very easily imply that Lan Wangji is still trying to walk a tightrope in those scenes, or perhaps trying to be a bridge. He’s deliberately not choosing a distinct side, because he refuses to hate and reject Wei Wuxian, but he’s also refusing to declare open support. He’s acting entirely on his own, in a balancing act between friendship and love vs his family, his entire life’s teachings, and all of his society. Certainly I find that sort of situation exhausting, and I’ve never had to do it for something so high-stakes or large-scale.

Then there’s the actual cliff scene itself, where he’s visibly desperate. How intense does an emotion have to be for Lan Wangji to so clearly show it?

Wei Ying, he says, come back. He knows Wei Wuxian is breaking down. He at the very least guesses that he’s going to do something wild like step off that outcropping, which is why he follows him in the first place. But he has no idea what to do, so he tries the same thing he’s been trying for years: Come with me. Let me help you. This is a bridge, and he’s offering to help Wei Wuxian cross it. But just like every other time he’s tried it since the Sunshot Campaign ended, it doesn’t work.

Note that Lan Wangji actually is flying here, without the sword, so if he doesn’t have any spiritual power when Jiang Cheng shows up, this is probably a last, desperate burst to go with this last, desperate act.

I don’t think he really has a plan here. Not a new one, anyway. This is a still a plea of Let me help you. And, notably, Wei Wuxian doesn’t accept his help.

Not once during this whole scene does Wei Wuxian reach up with his free hand or try to help Lan Wangji help him in any way. He smiles, and he says: Lan Zhan, let me go. Because he doesn’t want a bridge. He doesn’t want to go back. Honestly it’s a pretty explicit and heartbreaking message: Lan Wangji’s offer of help is not enough to make Wei Wuxian want to stay alive. Not right now. He needs more than that. He’s lost too much to believe, right now, that anyone is going to choose him and his side, or that he���s worth that effort. And to be clear, Lan Wangji isn’t even offering that in this situation. Wei Wuxian is one slippery handgrip away from death, and Lan Wangji is still not saying “You, I choose you.” From anything Wei Wuxian can be expected to infer, his offer here is no different than it’s ever been: let me show you the way back to the right path. Let me help you fit back into the world the way you used to. And Wei Wuxian can’t do that; he has no golden core, it’s literally impossible even if the rest of the world would let him try. But at this point he doesn’t want to go back either. He doesn’t even want to try. That world hates him, and willfully misunderstands him, and has taken too many people from him now for it to be worth staying in. He wants to die.

And then Jiang Cheng arrives.

Wei Wuxian’s reaction to his brother’s presence is to smile, say his name, and just–accept his hatred. He closes his eyes and waits for the sword to fall even as Lan Wangji calls for Jiang Cheng to stop. The only time he shows distress between stepping back off the cliff and his actual death is when Jiang Cheng twists his sword and compromises the stability of the outcropping so that Lan Wangji is also in danger.

I think it’s possible that if Jiang Cheng had also reached for him and tried to pull him back up, things might have gone differently. Maybe that would have been enough to alter Wei Wuxian’s thinking. But as it is, when Wei Wuxian falls, he falls with his limbs relaxed and a smile on his face. There’s no flailing and screaming like when he was thrown into the Burial Mounds (in ep 33. There’s some arm-waving in ep 1). And I think that moment of him pushing Lan Wangji back and then letting go, more than anything, is what stops Lan Wangji in his tracks, because Wei Wuxian could have saved himself. He had strength and energy left. Enough to push Lan Wangji up and back and nearly to a standing position. He could have accepted Lan Wangji’s help, easily. But he didn’t, because he wanted to die, despite all the effort and inner turmoil Lan Wangji has gone through on his behalf (most of which Wei Wuxian doesn’t know about but, still).

That’s a pretty serious emotional kick in the head. Lan Wangji cannot ignore, at this point, that even if he did have any physical or spiritual energy left, Wei Wuxian doesn’t want to be saved. And that’s when we get this face (actually from ep 1):

He has nothing left. He has at this point spent over a year, maybe two, trying to save someone who, when it came down to the final moment, didn’t want to be saved. There’s nothing more he can do, in this state of exhaustion and despair, and it wouldn’t matter if he tried.

Personally, I think he looks like he’s about to be sick, and I don’t think it’s just the image of Wei Wuxian falling and dying that’s working on him here. It’s also the knowledge that he fucked up. He didn’t do enough, or more accurately, didn’t do the right things, in order to encourage Wei Wuxian to keep fighting for himself or anyone else (I’m not saying this is a healthy or reasonable thought, I just think it’s a thought he’s having). And I think this realization plays directly into how he treats Wei Wuxian when he comes back sixteen years later. He knows that questioning Wei Wuxian on his path of cultivation doesn’t go where he wants it to, so he doesn’t do it. This time is going to be different. He’ll break rules. He’ll drink alcohol. He doesn’t scold Wei Wuxian for making dumb, selfless decisions like transferring the curse mark from Jin Ling’s leg to his own, he just accepts it and expresses concern over Wei Wuxian’s well being. He stops asking if he can help and starts just doing it: Wei Wuxian can’t walk so he’ll carry him. Wei Wuxian needs someone to speak for him, so Lan Wangji will do that, with his brother and with the whole cultivation world. And then we come to this:

This is exactly the same move. Wei Wuxian will protect Lan Wangji, but not himself.

But.

Lan Wangji is no longer trying to be a bridge. He’s not going to hold out his hand for Wei Wuxian to accept or disregard. He’s crossed over to be on Wei Wuxian’s side. And that’s what makes the difference.

[gisellelx]

How do you think things would change for edward and carlisle if carlisle had never changed esme? do you think carlisle ever would have changed anyone else? would edward have still left for his "rebellion"? would it have changed the roles that they play?

They eventually become that friendly but reclusive gay couple in your neighborhood that you don’t know very much about but who seem very happy. 

Here’s why. (This got long. I have thoughts.)

Carlisle and Edward are two of the most heavily queer-coded characters in the entire saga. I respect a good Jasper/Edward or Jacob/Edward, but I don’t see those coming from the way the characters talk about each other in canon. Those are slash ships which exist because people want to see that ship. They’re fun, but it’s never felt as “oh yeah of course, these two” like C & Ed.

They already have what seems to be a very intimate relationship in canon. It isn’t his brothers Edward turns to first to ask about having sex; it’s Carlisle, who is ostensibly in the role of his father. Edward’s brain in Midnight Sun is about 50% Bella, 50% Carlisle, 50% the sky is falling. (I realize that’s more than 100% which seems about on par for Edward’s brain.) 

He uses Carlisle’s face to recenter himself when he encounters Bella in MS. He talks about how Carlisle had so many complicated emotions toward him, and then says that for himself, “Love [for Carlisle] came easily.” 

Meanwhile, Edward is pretty oblivious to Bella as a woman beyond her scent, aside from wishing she’d wear the green sweater more to keep him from feeling too horny. He has never been interested in Tanya, even though she’s repeatedly been interested in him. He notices that Siobhan is curvy, but doesn’t apply this same gaze to Bella. 

Carlisle, for his part, is somehow totally unaware that Esme, who probably made very clear she thought he was crushworthy in 1911, has somehow also fallen for him. Edward has to “be on hand to caution Carlisle” that she’s going to be in love with him after her change. And while I don’t personally hold the headcanon that Aro and Carlisle were ever sexually involved (though I enjoy that ship), it certainly seems likely that Carlisle had a certain amount of intimacy with him based on the way Aro greets Edward and then Carlisle in the saga. 

And then there’s the simple fact that where Carlisle has watched other vampires turn mates, or turn allies, he picks this seventeen-year-old boy without having any sense that he might be gifted. He just think he’s beautiful and kind and full of youth. Ohhhhh kaaaay... They are both heavily, heavily implied to be at least bi, if not gay. Men are on the table for them both. Mind you, I don’t think SM meant to put that on the page. But that’s what��s there. 

So Carlisle changes Edward. He, for whatever reason, doesn’t change Esme. Maybe he leaves her in the morgue. Maybe they never go to Ashland. He’s having the time of his life finally being known by someone, and not only known, but known in this deeply invasive, intimate way. They become as close as they are in canon. 

Edward, in my reading, rebelled in part because he was supplanted by Esme. He was heartbroken. Maybe he didn’t realize he was in love with Carlisle, because in that time period, and with their backgrounds, that would’ve been impossible to admit to himself. But he reacted like a teenager who suddenly has to share his parent with whom he’s very close. No Esme, no sharing, no rebellion. 

This probably then means they don’t ever end up in Rochester--maybe they stay in Ashland longer, who knows. Realistically, as soon as you start to remove a piece of the story, the dominoes fall very differently, although it’s hard to say because it never seems like SM had a clear idea of why any given character did a given a thing, just that they did. The only time we ever even get a whiff of something like this is that Maria came to visit when they were in Calgary and they had to move right after she did. So we don’t know why they moved to Rochester, which makes it hard to say if they still do in this AU.

Let’s say they do end up in Rochester, and they’re still doing the friend/father/son/hell no we’re not gay thing. Carlisle finds a woman in the street who has been brutally gangraped and left for dead.

He does not have a wife whose own history of sexual assault he is thinking of.

He does not have a son whose unhappiness he is trying to assuage. 

Edward has never rebelled; Carlisle doesn’t need to do something to keep him around. He has no model of a female companion healing his own heart, so he has no reason to feel even a twinge that such a thing might be true for Edward.

So he spirits Rosalie to the hospital and does his level best to treat her. She dies despite his efforts. It’s very sad; another instance where Carlisle feels inadequate against the world. He turns to Edward for comfort, just like always, and gets over it within a few days. Edward and Carlisle go on living their lives together. They are deeply affectionate, deeply concerned with one another, and very, very close.

One day, they’re having a conversation about something, or nothing, doesn’t matter, and noses get too close, and bam. Suddenly they’re both thinking, My god, I’m kissing my best friend and this feels so much better than I ever would have imagined. 

And that’s it. It’s not easy; they have a lot of self-loathing to get over and their relationship is rocky for years. Sex is fraught with feelings of shame and sinfulness, mostly on Carlisle's part. But slowly they do come to accept themselves and each other. The remaining decades are filled with them trying to slot themselves into society. Being vampires already means they have to hide a lot; compared to that, hiding homosexuality is downright simple. Stonewall happens; they watch the fallout at a distance, afraid to become too involved for fear of outing a lot more than their sexuality (or at least they convince themselves that’s the reason; a lot of it is also internalized homophobia). Edward probably develops the self-control to practice medicine also, or otherwise finds something to occupy himself while Carlisle is working. He doesn’t present himself as a high school student because the last thing they need is Carlisle being accused of statutory rape on top of sodomy, so he’s billed as Carlisle’s equal. 

By 2021, they’re experiencing a very pleasant whiplash about how different their lives have become in the last 30 years. They get married in an Episcopal church in the 2010s. Edward still isn’t very religious, but it is very meaningful to Carlisle. They’re out at work. They don’t march in pride parades, but they do allow themselves to be seen being a little affectionate in public places. It feels good. But they’re still vampires, and they still have a lot to hide. So they keep to themselves and keep their heads down. 

And every now and then, their neighbors get a glimpse of these two beautiful young men walking arm in arm at twilight. And the neighbors’ concerned thought as they watch them isn’t "I wonder if they're vampires" or "I wonder if they're gay" but "I wonder why they don't own a dog."