#than an asshole with the most inconsistent characterization

[lollytea]

The Blight family are so interesting IN THEORY. In execution they are....😬

[local-pal]

Dooming about Arcane Season 2, send help.

I’m throwing this word vomit on here. I'm sorry in advance.

So, Viktor’s been my favorite League character (for lore purposes only, I don’t reeeeeally play him much) since I can remember. And I don’t know if it’s nostalgia or fear of change speaking here but I didn’t care much for his character in Arcane. 

I don’t think lore Viktor is perfect, far from it. Though his characterization has come a long way ever since he was just a silly evil communist Russian stereotype, he’s not that developed and you can kinda tell the current lore was being held back by having to fit in the already established role he had, and the canon at the time. Like him being kind of a one-dimensional asshole even before he turned into the Machine Herald—because Jayce was also an absolute asshole and assholes only really do well with one another.  His silly goal of turning all of Runeterra into machines, or whatever the writers feel the Glorious Evolution is at the time. Blitzcrank just being shoved in there. His discussion with Jayce being only glazed over. His characterization is also really inconsistent in the games. I can’t blame League of Legends because his model and voiceover are incredibly old (ASU with Arcane, maybe?), but Legends of Runeterra’s feel like the writers didn’t really read through all of his lore and kinda stuck with the old evil communist Russian robot thing a bit. Also, his role as the one enhancing the Underground’s people has kinda been replaced by both Renata Glasc and some other cards of Legends of Runeterra. He doesn’t have much left at the moment.

So a complete retcon might not be that bad? But I’m not at all hyped for the lore being replaced with the one in Arcane. The following is all speculative—Internet-friendly itemized list coming up.

1| The Marketing

Viktor wasn’t really marketed as a main character in Arcane like how Jinx, Vi, Cait, and Jayce were. Honestly, I was surprised he was even there at all when I first watched the series. He didn’t get a skin, didn’t get merch (as far as I know), didn’t get a (now discontinued) Path of Champions story, nor an icon in the game. 

As far as I can tell from the marketing for season two, this is the case again. I don’t wanna sound like I don’t like the characters, because I loved Arcane (I watched it eleven times in the first year!), but I’m not happy with the story focusing on Jinx and Vi again. I felt like their relationship was almost established, with some more screen time in season two to fully cement the way the writers wanted it to go. Like there isn’t much to do unless they want to kill or redeem Jinx, at least from what I can see. I really hope I’m wrong and they do something more interesting with her, though I could not imagine why. 

So, does the marketing imply that the story is not gonna focus on him? I would be extremely disappointed. I think his character is the best to focus on the political themes on Arcane, but I’m not a writer.

2| The Season Is The Same Length As The First One

I don’t feel like there’s enough time in a six-hour show to tackle this as a main plot point and Viktor’s transformation into the Machine Herald; and they said this was the finale. And I honestly fully expected it to be the story of season two. 

Do I sound entitled? I feel like I might come off entitled. Maybe I do feel entitled.

Viktor’s (and by extension, Jayce’s) was always one of the most interesting stories League had for in my opinion. Not much of the Piltover and Zaun lore tackles any themes quite like his, as superficial as they might be. At least it kinda tries to say something about transhumanism and how people from oppressed groups have to try much harder than those from privileged ones (by pointing out the difference in Viktor’s and Jayce's attitude towards work, and both of their origins and perception by outsiders.) This is kinda what Arcane is trying to convey for much of its runtime as well, so it seemed like a good fit.

I highly doubt that’s gonna happen now. At most, they show the beginning of his life as the Machine Herald, but I honestly don’t think we’re getting much of what comes after—things like the work he does in the Undercity, his cult, all of the rumors, a deep look into his philosophy, Jayce’s feelings about his transformation. It seems like there’s not enough time. And I’m not even getting into my issues with his characterization in Arcane. So I guess it’s time for…

3| The Hexcore: Oh my God. Please don’t do this to me, Arcane.

They are sooooooooooo gonna make the Hexcore corrupt him and turn him insane. The more I think about it, the more convinced I am. Please let me be wrong. Please let him become radicalized (by the war?) and let all of his further development come from him and not from an entity that’s making him insane. That would make his entire character so easy to dismiss by the story. “Oh, he’s just insane now.”, “Oh, the Hexcore is putting all of its ideas on his head, this is not really him.” (Remember how it’s implied that it’s alive and it learns?)

I think I was always interested in thinking how could this philosophy (the Glorious Evolution) sprout from a somewhat normal person, albeit one under a lot of emotional distress over his banishment from Piltover. How much is it his actual ideology and how much has it been distorted by rumors or so? Because he seemed fairly reasonable in his color story. It seemed interesting to explore—something like the actual man, Viktor; and the legend, the Machine Herald. He even has a cult, come on. 

For what it’s worth, I’ve been dooming about this ever since the third act came out. I thought killing Sky was gonna be a turning point of some sort. I don’t know, I kinda deluded myself while I was watching. I was like, okay, THIS is the beginning of the Machine Herald! But I’m hazy on how act three Viktor is gonna come to similar conclusions to those of the Machine Herald himself. Which is why I’m scared they are gonna take the easy way out and make the Hexcore speak to him. This has been very exacerbated by being told that Arcane is canon now. And I’m sure they’d said they wouldn’t do that. I don’t know what I expected from Riot and how they manage the story. 

I hope I’m so wrong that I’m gonna look back at this and laugh myself to tears at how pessimistic I was being. He did look a little bit evil while confronting the council.

4| Jayce.

Contrasting what I feel about Viktor’s character, I think Jayce’s characterization in Arcane is superb. He might be my favorite character? Though they kinda took lore Viktor’s story and stole it from him. (A bit of a tangent, but if we’re lucky we get some parallelism if Viktor is ever exiled from Piltover without Jayce defending him. Kind of a “he did it for you but you won’t do it for him” kinda way, even when both had a lot to sacrifice. That would be fucking cool.)

I guess I’m worried about his willingness to use weird-ass magic to enhance people, unlike lore Jayce. Where is the Divorce Arc going to come from? Using Hextech as weapons? Are they not gonna present an opposing view of transhumanism? Everyone except Heimer seemed pretty on board, to be honest. And that might change with him getting to see other sides of the Undercity, so I don’t even know.

It kinda feels like they swapped their stories and viewpoints. In Arcane, Viktor is the one to oppose progress by wanting to destroy the Hexcore because it took a life. Though it might be just the guilt of the moment. My Viktor would never oppose progress for something as insignificant as that, come on! (/hf)

They BETTER give me toxic yaoi, too.

5| The Rest of the Lore.

So, are they gonna re-write everything? Jayce and Viktor being the ones pioneering Hextech has so many branching consequences for the lore at large. What happens with Camille? How fast is Hextech gonna develop? Noxus getting involved in the war between Piltover and the Undercity? Where does Swain fit in all of that, or is he not contemporary to these characters? They mentioned building Piltover specifically to flee the unyielding reign of mages; are they gonna elaborate on that? Are the Rune Wars going to be relevant like Heimerdinger said? 

The good thing about Arcane being self-contained used to be that nobody had to think about what they were retroactively changing. This is going to be a clusterfuck.

[ormymarius]

Do you consider comic!Orm (from New 52) to be an anti-hero or outright villain? Personally I think his actions attacking the surface were justified considering that, from his perspective, it seemed like an uncalled for attack on Atlantis, and the Justice League were too self-righteous about his retaliation (as if he had attacked the surface for fun instead of a valid reason.) This leads to my second question: how tf did he forgive Arthur for locking him up and not even bothering to visit him? Did they ever talk after that? I know Orm loves him, but is he That forgiving? I assume he'd see Arthur as a traitor for siding with the surface over Atlantis (in his eyes) so do you think he'd still consider Arthur fit to be king of Atlantis after that perceived betrayal?

On that same line, do you agree that Orm's motivations do not stem from desperately wanting the throne? To me he's not a ruthless power-hungry asshole willing to sell his brother in order to be king, he just wants what's best for Atlantis. Sorry for the long ask, but the whole Throne of Atlantis arc is so interesting to me!

I consider new 52 Orm to be partly an antihero because we didn’t get to see enough of him being one tbh. But to me he’s more morally gray than anything else. I also think he was justified, he was doing what a good king would and defending his people even if Vulko manipulated him into doing the whole thing. Orm is a victim just as much as anyone else was.

I think the Justice League (if they were well written) should’ve communicated with Orm more clearly instead of outright attacking him and treating him as if he were a monster and a supervillain terrorist (which is what the surface labeled him for defending his people ://)

I don’t think Orm ever forgave Arthur for locking him up on the surface and it’s the reason he’s so pissed at Arthur in the first place, that’s partly the cause of their beef — Arthur abandoned him. They didn’t really talk after that.

Also, Orm was poorly written when he appeared in an actual Aquaman comic after years as a villain. His characterization was so stupid and inconsistent in KSD’s run, I don’t even wanna talk about it lmao. + Aquamen was just as stupid. Anyway, Orm doesn’t love Arthur anymore or consider Arthur to be fit for king like he once did. Orm resents him. But as far as most sibling relationships go, deep down you’ll always care for them in some capacity even if there’s lots of resentment there. That’s the thing with family.

I agree that New 52 Orm wasn’t power hungry at all. He just wanted to protect his people and Atlantis. He’d do anything for them. That’s just who he is.

I don’t think Orm should be written as wanting the throne anymore. It’s a dumb motivation and it doesn’t go anywhere, it lacks for interesting stories and it’s overdone. I think Orm should be more of an ecoterrorist like Poison Ivy if you will (someone who will commit to extreme violence for the protection of the environment). It would make Arthur and Orm’s dynamic more interesting, as Arthur can agree with protecting the environment but he can’t agree with Orm’s violent tendencies for protecting the environment. That’s my take.

[britcision]

Anyway in case anyone was wondering why I do firmly aver I did not get to DPxDC from DC and am not a DC fan despite having consumed all of the Harley Quinn and Suicide Squad runs up to 2018

(And have an exciting grab bag of shows, movies, and assorted trivia under my belt besides

Batman vs Dracula was fucking great fight me)

It’s because DC as a whole is hostile as fuck to the concept of being a casual fan

(And about 90% of the main heroes annoy the hell out of me for the very tropes that DC is known and praised for in their heroes I am here for villains, antiheroes, and sidekicks exclusively)

There is no such thing as consistent characterization, especially as you consume more content or fall down a rabbit hole, and the rabbit holes are ENDLESS

Everyone cameos everywhere else, referential jokes are often dropped in as Easter eggs for people who have read every single other DC comic put out in the same decade and yet within the same comics you get glaringly inconsistent characterization and different retcons for the same events

Big stories are retold and retconned every couple years, we got 3 separate Spiderman origin movies and the exact same Batman origin in more than half the live action movies; DC PAYS PEOPLE to make up their own different versions of canon events

There is a REASON that the Marvel and DC cinematic universes are both officially divorced from comic canon; the sheer volume of canon content is inaccessible to most of the population, and DC and Marvel know it

That’s why the New 52 was a big divorce from all previous canon too - it’s an on ramp for new fans, because sorting through the web of old content is off putting as fuck

It’s the one thing not a single DC fan I’ve spoken to who complained about “canon characterization” has bothered defending or even acknowledging, and yet it has been the core of all of their arguments:

“Canon is what I want it to be, not what any of the sources say”

And listen, I was a Torchwood fan, we were the archetypal example of “canon only happened if I acknowledge it” (so sad that show ended after only two seasons and nothing else ever happened again Children of Earth who), you just gotta acknowledge that that’s what you’re doing

But you frankly cannot have a serious conversation about canon characterization with someone who does not acknowledge entire swaths of canon and cannot understand why that makes their argument completely invalid

Any kind of conversation about the “right” characterization for a DC character necessarily has to involve the acknowledgement that it’s your personal preferred characterization, not a One True Canon, because I guarantee there are canon incidents for every single big name and most of the small ones that directly counter the ones you like

You may note I share a bunch of posts with things like “My Batman would never do this”, as opposed to “canon Batman would never do this”

Hell, on Batman specifically there are hundreds of beautifully put together posts talking about how the different canon runs get him wrong; I too prefer a Bruce Wayne who does genuinely care about his family and tries to protect them, but isn’t perfect or always right over the massive asshole elitist who just grunts and treats them like soldiers

Canon Batman slaps his kids around, it’s the meme that broke containment and you don’t have to like it or accept it as something your Batman would do!

But it’s still canon

Both versions have a massive well of canon support, and exist simultaneously in the multiverse

Every single characterization of a character is true and exists in the multiverse

And that is why the idea of a “canon version” of any DC character is utterly meaningless

TL;DR: write DC characters however the fuck you want and do not worry about it for more than 10 minutes together, that is what the paid DC writing staff do

There will be at least two pieces of canon media to back up whatever interpretation of the character you pick

Not everyone will like that characterization or agree with how you see the character, and that is all fine and good! But “canon” is meaningless in this context, neatly encapsulated by the “multiverse” explanation

Everything is canon, which means that nothing is canon

[itsnotthaaatserious]

i'm a casual reader of lore olympus. i enjoy it passively for what it is and check tumblr after updates just to ruminate on it a bit or catch the thoughts of other fans. i have no intention of talking about lore olympus at length or even really using this blog because, honestly? lore olympus is not that serious. it's a soap opera inspired by greek myths with a pseudo modern aesthetic. it's campy, cookie cutter, and sure as fuck not the place i would go to to get a fresh or faithful take on the persephone/hades myth. i mean it's a webtoon for fuck's sake. a cursory look at the art style and marketing will tell you all you need to know about how deep this story's going to be.

And yet. the tags on this godforsaken website are absolutely overrun with anti lo / lo critical hot takes expressing the oh-so-novel idea that lo isn't very good, to which i say... no shit? the art's inconsistent/disproportionate. writing is often mid. characterization is... ok, i'll show my hand here. I think a lot of people's problems with the characters themselves is just a fundamental disagreement on interpretation, because the greek gods are by and large colossal assholes and can be twisted to be as saintly or sinister as you want them to be. that particular point is just a subjective "noooo my greek god/goddess blorbo was done so dirty" without taking anything else (such as creative decisions) into consideration. but i digress.

my ultimate point here is the pseudo intellectuals getting worked up over a webtoon soap opera are fucking annoying. greek mythology has been adapted TO DEATH because it is the most well known mythology in human history. if you don't enjoy lo there is nothing wrong with that. after all, as i already said, it's not that good - it's the equivalent of trash tv. so why the everloving fuck are so many people so pressed and dedicated to criticizing lo? literally just go find a different adaptation. lo is hardly a cultural juggernaut forever tainting the high-brow sophistication of greek mythology (lmao) and your constant need to fill the tags with criticism is more indicative of how emotionally invested you are in this comic than the actual quality of the comic itself. i swear to god almost all these posts i see average under a 100 notes. lo barely has a fandom presence on tumblr. the fuck are you all doing.

anyway *steps off my soapbox*

[forcebookish]

Rank the ofs characters from favorite to least favorite

Ps love your blog 😊

HMMMMMMMM, i'm going to stick with the main boys and cheum because i either have next to no opinion about the rest of the cast (yo, plug, dan, gap, etc.) or you already know i fucking hate them (atom, boeing); i like april well enough, but she didn't get much screentime - i think more of her than the other supporting/guest roles, but her position as cheum's girlfriend kind of just made her likable and that was it.

all that being said, i think these are going to be obvious, if controversial, but get ready for a lot of words regardless. hopefully no one finds this through the search function 😅

1. top

MY SON!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! i genuinely love everything about him. i think he was actually the only character who never went out of his way to hurt someone, was only ever mean to or fought with people who started (and deserved) it, and even tried to be friendly with people who treated him like garbage. he was always sweet with mew, only ever yelled to defend himself (and even with mew, just barely raised his voice), and truly was never the asshole the other characters, the fandom, or even top himself made him out to be. even the stuff that was actually true that the fandom hated him for was hot lol can't account for taste *flips hair* and he was so loving!!! i don't know why people didn't get that!!! plus the way he wraps himself around someone when he kisses? 👌👌👌👌 despite his limited screentime (🤬🤬🤬🤬), he still had the best character development and backstory.

2. mew

not a surprise that everyone (except boston lol) loved him. i didn't always like his choices and i think the writers dropped the ball on him hard with some very bizarre character inconsistencies but barring most of episode 10 and 12, he's like top said: cute, sexy, and interesting. like. so sexy. soooooo soos ossoso so sos fuckign sexy oh my god. he wasn't naive or bland, he had so much more going on, and i loved how playful and competitive he was. i don't have a lot to say about mew tbh i just love him haha

3. nick

WHAT A FREAK OH MY GOD. i think he fell victim to more drama contrivances than i would have preferred (the audio being edited, him never confronting sand about stealing it or telling mew who stole it, dan disappearing from his life, his whole storyline completely forgotten). really, the only bad dude of the bunch who i loved because he was so... fascinating. and again, didn't really do anything just to hurt anyone; there was no malice in his actions, he just was... a freak lol but it was weird how much it felt like the drama didn't really care about him?? for example, i HATED his ending. while rejecting boston was the right thing to do, what happened after that!??!???? did he move out?? did he go to america? did he keep working at dan's office??? what happened to him!!???!??? justice for nick!!!!!

4. cheum

i really like how serious she is most of the time but that she also has a goofy side. however, it didn't make any sense that she went from feeling for top and relying on him to going back to calling him an asshole. it would have been way more interesting (and lbr, realistic!!!) if they became friends again. plus her just instantly forgiving atom for lying about boston just because he was a babygay??? come on. other than that, i think she had some pretty consistent characterization and growth: she was probably the only one who really cared about their friendships, and to a fault (wanting to help mew, being frustrated with ray overlooking her, dropping top without trying to understand him, and giving boston a second chance just because she felt guilty and wanted everyone to get along again), which was an interesting trait/direction. plus, her wanting to kiss ray was so real and iconic.

5. boston

yes, he's higher on the list than i ever would have expected. i still hate him: there's the sexual assault and coercion, creepy creeping, talking shit about or screwing over his "friends," only apologizing when it was demanded of him (and even then, half-assed), and only ever caring about himself. but! at least he did it in an interesting and not annoying way. i was never bored or annoyed when he was on screen; as much as i hated him, i did kinda wanna see what he was going to do. it was even almost fun to hate him! i think they could have done more with him (his subplot with atom was pretty pointless - his fucking top should have been enough for him to end up friendless lmao), like his dad's verbal abuse/not being out to him or his parents' divorce, and had been more honest about what everyone actually saw in him. he was an asshole to the point where it was unclear why anyone liked him lol but i do like that he got what he wanted in the end, and in the worst possible of circumstances! i wouldn't say he got his true comeuppance, but it was a cool end to his arc.

6. sand

oooh, sand and ray fought hard for who i hated more lmao but in the end, there were at least a few things i liked about sand: smashing his phone to steal the sex tape (seriousSLY WHA TWAS THAT OMG IT WAS AMAZING fucking lunatic), making plum wine, and his relationship with his mom. then why isn't he higher than boston? while boston has pretty much no positive attributes as a person, the things i hate about sand as a character outweigh those few things i like about him. the way he lets ray walk all over him no matter what, can't forgive top for boeing when boeing was obviously a fucking dickhead, doesn't apologize to top for ruining his life, pretends to give a shit about mew when he just wanted to blow up top's life and get back at ray in the process, and somehow being kinda... boring? the aforementioned stuff i liked was certainly interesting, but most of the time he just kind of... followed along with ray; there wasn't that much more to his arc, it was just a cycle of abuse. plus, the fandom claimed that mew thought he was better than everyone, but sand actually thought he was better than everyone, and never acknowledged that anything he did was bad. everything was justified to him. and he clearly is addicted to alcohol too like why did he just keep drinking with ray when he knew ray was an addict!!! come on, dude!!

7. ray

like boston, why do people like this guy!!???!????? characters and viewers alike! every single thing about him is annoying. in the first episode, i thought he was just quick to anger and therefore actually had the potential for being my favorite character, but he's just a whiny little bitch. the way he talks, the way he treats his friends and especially sand, the way he BARELY EVER apologizes for the worst of what he does (apologizing for not telling mew and cheum about being hospitalized but not about yelling at them and exposing their secrets; apologizing for calling mew dumb but not SCREAMING AT HIM FOR NOT FUCKING HIM????????????!!!!!!!!!!!?!!!!!!???!???????!???) (i think the one time he did was only when he kissed mew and that was just because mew was going to cut him out of his life, i don't believe for a second it was because he actually felt bad about it), how he always brings up his dead mom as if that's an excuse to treat everyone like shit, and the way he gets away with everything. fucking everything. he should have gone to jail! twice! he spends the whole series denying the fact that he has a problem and then goes to, what, a week of rehab and just is perfectly fine? that shit with boeing was so out of line and yet sand was the one who had to apologize for it?? what the fuck??? acted all high and mighty at top despite CHEATING ON MEW?? AND NOT BECAUSE SOME ASSHOLE TRICKED HIM HE REALLY DROVE TWO HOURS TO FUCK SOMEONE ELSE AND THEN FACED NO CONSEQUENCES FOR IT SERIOUSLY FUCK THIS GUY. i really truly cannot think of a single thing i like about him lmao completely insufferable. hated nearly every moment he was on screen. i probably would have liked the series 38402390483024 times more if he weren't in it. AND I HATE THAT I WROTE THE MOST ABOUT HIM OUT OF EVERYONE

moreover:

in general, it's actually kind of a bummer that the writers felt like they needed to include sandray at all. they were the only characters in the main cast who were wholly made up and not based on anyone irl and it made them the weakest links. i'm going to sound like a hypocrite because it pisses me off when people say this about topmew, but i think the series would have been improved without sandray.

that's not me hating on firstkhao!!!! i wish they had shined in their own series, because their talents were wasted in this one and their fanbase overcompensated for it in nasty ways. i have a hard time believing that they would have been so popular if they weren't played by firstkhao.

if the writers had incorporated some elements of ray's character (his crush on mew, bringing up his family life as an excuse for bad behavior, the way that the other characters actually like him for some reason) into boston, it would have made for a better character and the whole series would have come out a lot cleaner. his motives for fucking over top and mew would have been clearer and the tension with nick more complicated - nick could have been the one to expose topboston. the shit with boeing could have still happened, but just with The Bar Singer, and more time could have been spent on it to flesh it out. they didn't need to have the boyfriends, friends with benefits, fuck buddies theme - it would have worked just as well with just boyfriends and friends with benefits. nickboston's relationship went from fuck buddies to friends with benefits in two episodes anyway. and aprilcheum and plugyo could have had more screentime!!!

WOOF! the tenses in this were a mess, sorry. i wanted to include screencaps too, but i didn't want to gather them soz. anyway, this was fun to go through, anon! when i really look at it, the characters who went through the least amount of character development were the ones i hated the most, hmm 🤔 thanks for asking and loving my blog! 🥰

[beevean]

I was actually talking about how the Sonic franchise in general has had so many adaptations with wildly different interpretations of just Sonic and Eggman alone, than whether their characterizations in the games themselves were consistent or not. Which is what I was trying to get at with Ian's whole inconsistency excuse, because IDW is still(I guess) supposed to be seperate from the games, and starting from scratch after Archie's cancellation. The dude and the other creative staff have some degree of control over this seperate canon. Just because he thinks Sega is being inconsistent in the games doesn't mean he can't at least try to maintain some of it within the continuity he is working on, or at least establish some basic rules for it and follow them. He talks like as if Sega is holding him at gunpoint to make the writing decisions he's been making recently.

But yeah. As far as the games themselves are concerned, Sonic not being a self-righteous douche, and Eggman being kind of an asshole, have been very consistence traits of their's throughout it's history, even during the so-called "Dark Age" and "Meta Era".

Good point. This is why I'm not bothered by the Boom versions of the characters: sure, Knuckles is dumb and illiterate, and Eggman is a softie with a crush on Sonic, but they also never pretended to be the original Knuckles and Eggman.

When Sonic X, arguably more faithful to the games, turns Amy into a yandere and Eggman into an anti-villain, we start to have more problems... but again, that is technically an adaptation. X!Eggman never became canon to the games anyway.

As for IDW... you know what he could have said? That. IDW Sonic is not quite the same as SEGA Sonic. It's an AU. It's his interpretation, much like Sonic X interpreted Sonic as a big introvert who spends most of his time napping and running. What, are the fans really going to question that? They'd just say that his version is better anyway :V but at least he'd be honest about it.

But of course, saying that he's following the SEGA standard elevates his writing much more :) this is the thing. He wants to parade his writing as being nearly official. He can't just admit that IDW Sonic is his interpretation of Sonic: no, that is canon Sonic, he's just that good and influential.

He talks like as if Sega is holding him at gunpoint to make the writing decisions he's been making recently.

He may hate the word "mandates", but he sure is happy to blame them for writing choices his fans don't like.

[sacersanguis]

can we stop exhausting ourselves with discourse over whether this 'x' comic writer fucked up jason todd's character or not and just agree that almost every writer who has written jason post-resurrection as red hood has screwed up his characterization so bad with scott lobdell being one of the worst offenders?

[ultfreakme]

Before I got into the MCU people who watched it told me that all the movies are interconnected and meticulously thought out so everything makes sense, down to the finest detail so I shouldn’t just brush off little things when watching. 

Chief, the MCU is hot garbage mess where none of the writers, directors, scriptwriters, no one can agree on what exactly is supposed to happen. I’m sure 70% of the people in charge of writing hate each other and the characters they write for. Every time they had to make an Avengers movie, they begrudgingly chuck characterizations at each other, have zero agreement on anything and just, film their bullshit.

The MCU is so inconsistent it makes wattpad bad boy x good girl stories look coherent and better built.

The most glaring example is Steve’s arc in Endgame. It’s such a huge plot hole, if anyone thought on it for more than 3 seconds they’d have seen how terrible it is.

Another is Howard and Peggy. Are they so incompetent they let Arnim Zola, a notorious Nazi asshole, build a supercomputer in one of their secret bases when the story keeps insisting that they’re most badass of all?

The MCU is a group project where no one likes each other, no one met for more than 5 seconds, and each of them gave separate presentations on the same topic, and all of them did the assignment so laughably incorrectly that it’s not even funny anymore.

[bigassheart]

I’ve seen a couple posts about how everyone was wildly out of character and totally inconsistent this season and I’m just like... were you guys paying attention? 

1. Luther

Arguably the biggest shift in character between the two seasons, but it makes sense. Luther spent a year fending for himself and thinking his entire family was dead. 

This is the first time in his life that he had to hold down a job and actually live on his own. It was literally his first time living out in the world among anyone other than his family, and you can see in his reactions with the other characters from that life (the boss, his landlord, those kids that idolize him, and the waitress) that it has really mellowed him out. It has allowed him to be more normal, despite being very much not normal. You can see the way he’s so much more comfortable in his skin. Literally the only times he looks uncomfortable is when he’s fighting people, shirt off and body on full display. He’s still not comfortable with that, but he’s not trying to hide under huge overcoats anymore. He has people in his life who accept him for being a little weird, but really do treat him normal. 

So is he a little less uptight and mission focused? Yeah. Because he can finally see another life, and it’s the life that he honestly did want in season 1 but felt like he couldn’t have because he was number 1 and he had a responsibility to his dad, his family, and the academy to be the leader. Having a year on his own frees him of all that. 

But he also spent all that time thinking his family was dead and feeling so guilty about it. You can see in his very first interaction with Vanya, where he suddenly feels that responsibility again. He brings a gun, not knowing what’s going to happen and, despite what he told Five, he absolutely does still have that lingering feeling of responsibility. But then he sees Vanya and she’s not a threat and everything he has been holding in for the last year comes out. Because he does feel guilty as hell for what he did to Vanya, but also for the fact that his actions pushed her into causing the apocalypse. He spent a year with the knowledge that he did that and thinking that his family was dead because of his actions. 

He’s willing to listen now because he spent a year living in a world where his actions killed his whole family. And now he finds out that that didn’t happen and he has a second chance. Of course he’s going to take it! 

2. Diego

In the first season, Diego finally admitted that he wanted to be close to his family and that he cared about them and wouldn’t leave them again. He confronted the guilt about leaving, which he had previously denied. He realized the difference between revenge and honoring someone’s memory. But despite all that, he never confronted the reason why he, a grown-ass-man, wandered around the city as a leather clad, mask wearing vigilante. 

So when we see Diego show up in 1963, that’s still who he is. He wants to be that hero and he finds an answer for how to be that hero in the first several minutes that he’s there. So he takes it. I mean, what else is he going to do? His family is gone. Maybe they’ll show up again. Maybe this is it. Either way, he’s on his own like he was before, so he’s got a duty to be the hero he has chosen to be. 

And then he meets his dad again. Everyone keeps telling him he has daddy issues, and they’re right. He absolutely has daddy issues. He’s still trying to simultaneously prove that he’s good enough for his dad, but also doesn’t need Daddy’s approval. Except he does need it. He still desperately craves it and he feels gutted when his dad denies him that approval, even falling back into the stutter he had as a kid. 

Now, despite the way we joke, Diego is not dumb. He is so observant and he makes some of the most poignant statements about his siblings and the way they see the world. He sees the people around them and he understands them, but he has never been able to completely turn that gift inwards and see those same things in himself. In this season, Lila breaks through all that and he finally sees himself in her at the end. 

“Do you know how hard it is to trust people when your whole childhood was bullshit manipulation? Then why would you do that to me?”  

Diego sees himself in Lila, in her failure to break away from her mother despite the fact that he knows she wants to. In the final episode, he sees that she is just like the rest of the siblings, but she doesn’t have to be. None of them have to be stuck with their daddy issues, because they have each other. They can support and care for each other. It’s the last step of the growth he started in season 1, moving beyond his tendency to define his life and his family through their father. 

3. Allison

Throughout season 1, Allison struggled with whether or not to use her powers, but it was all centered around getting back to her daughter. When she appears in 1961, that motivation is effectively removed. She thinks everyone else is dead. She thinks that she is stranded in the past and that she will never get back. She finds a group of people to support her and before long... she finds her voice again. 

It’s no coincidence that Allison’s first spoken words in the series come right after she gives Ray that pamphlet with a bunch of added notes. She finds her voice in the civil rights movement. She finds her power there. She finds a way to help change the world, to change reality, and she does it without her powers. 

This is something she struggled with through the entirety of season 1, feeling inadequate for using her powers to get what she wanted, not knowing if anything was real or earned. Now she has the chance to earn everything without those powers and she is thriving. 

And then she is forced to use her powers again. It all turns out fine, but now she’s showing off and experiencing all over again how good it feels to have power. She spent two years in a world where she was denied equal treatment, where she could be arrested and assaulted for any reason those with more power came up with. And now she feels that power... She doesn’t have to wait for people to give her respect. She can demand it. But the pain is still there, and it’s not enough to just be respected, because these people have hurt her. They almost killed her husband. They have used their power to cause pain to her and all those who look like her time and time again and now it’s time to understand what it’s like to be powerless, to be hurt and to be unable to stop it and... 

And it’s scary. It’s scary to have that much power, to see how you could become the kind of person who uses your power to hurt others. And she knows that her power has hurt people she loves and suddenly she’s right back where she started. 

Only not entirely. 

She doesn’t shy away from her powers in the final fight. She is obviously still finding that balance and I would expect this struggle to continue for her in future seasons. Power can be addicting and Allison’s power is so strong. She knows the danger there, but she also knows that sometimes it’s needed despite the danger. 

4. Klaus

Klaus is an addict. He finds obsessions to bury himself in to avoid dealing with reality. In season 1, he buried himself in drugs and booze. When he shows up in the 60′s, he finds a new drug to bury himself in: adoration. 

Klaus is so impulsive and it’s not difficult to connect the dots of how one thing leads to another until suddenly everything is out of his control. Honestly, that’s the story of Klaus’s life, no matter where he goes. And then something changes. He gets tired of his cult and leaves. Except... that’s not really the reason. 

After all this time, Dave is still the love of his life, and he knows he has an opportunity. He knows where Dave will be at this one time and he knows exactly what he has to change to keep Dave alive. 

He also knows that Ben is going to have thoughts about this. 

I know some people were disappointed that there wasn’t more Klaus and Ben bonding this season, but it makes sense that there is tension there. I think a lot of that tension comes from Ben’s circumstances, which I’ll discuss later, but Klaus is also not responding to that tension well. 

They are fighting more than ever (not that they ever didn’t fight in season 1, where they spent much of their time being snarky to each other and Ben literally punching Klaus in the face for being an asshole), but the fighting is about something new this season. Ben wants his own life and Klaus is not in a position to give Ben what he really wants. We also learn that he has been carrying around this guilt for the last 17 years about forcing Ben to stick around as a ghost. He forced this half-life on his brother and now that it’s not enough for Ben, Klaus doesn’t want to deal with it. So he avoids and deflects and snarks and we see the toll on their relationship. We see it in the way he tries to deal with his plans around Dave entirely on his own. He focuses so much into that last ditch effort. He’s already in such a low place before this, so when that fails, we see him snap. We see him give up and crumble. And Ben falls back to his old role, trying to save Klaus from himself. 

But the tension isn’t gone and Klaus’s guilt isn’t gone. We see it again when Klaus finally agrees to let Ben possess him. Klaus has always been afraid of his powers and being possessed is just as terrifying a thought as being surrounded by the dead. And yet he gives Ben that chance. It’s the last good thing he can do at that point. 

I do wish we had gotten more closure for Klaus and Ben’s story. I think Vanya’s reveal could have been given a little more time, but that’s not really a problem with inconsistent characterization, so we’ll save that for another post. 

5. Five

OK, who would argue that Five was out of character or inconsistent? He’s obsessed with stopping the apocalypse, is willing to cross a lot of lines to save his family, and constantly frustrated by his family’s failure to go along with his plans. This is textbook Five. 

What I loved about this season was that we got to see Five finally meeting his father again. They interact as two adults, not as a child trying to find away to become his own person, frustrated by a lack of trust from his father. It allows Reggie to see Five in a different light and to actually provide advice in a constructive way, something he has almost never been able to do when viewing them as his children. But despite outward appearances and despite the fact that Five is a grown man, he still sees his father the same way he always has. He doesn’t register Reggie’s advice as advice. He hears that he’s striving beyond his abilities and that maybe he can only travel in seconds. He hears his father telling him he can’t handle time travel. That’s why he doesn’t try to actually take the very good advice until the very end.  

An old dog can still occasionally learn a new trick and Five proves that true. 

6. Ben

As I mentioned earlier, Ben is chaffing at his ghosthood. Maybe it’s because Klaus has been sober enough to keep Ben around solidly for 3 years. Maybe it’s because Ben is no longer spending all his time trying to keep Klaus alive and sober. Or maybe it’s the fact that he has finally found someone that he actually wants to spend time with. Whatever the reason, Ben wants to be alive this season. 

Again, as I mentioned, that’s causing some tension. Ben doesn’t want to be tied to Klaus, but Klaus is ignoring that because he feels so guilty about it. Ben doesn’t want to admit that he was too scared to go into the light on his own, so they’re at a bit of a standstill. 

And then Ben gets the opportunity to be alive again, if only for a while. And in a lot of ways, it’s wonderful! But it’s not the same as being truly alive. 

So when the time comes, when he’s faced with that light again... he’s not afraid. He knows that it’s time to move on. He knows this isn’t where he should be, but he also got the chance to be there for his family. He misses them, but he got to talk to Diego and Vanya. He got to save Vanya. He got to save Allison and Diego and Klaus and Luther and Five and the whole world! So while he would have stayed, he’s not sad about leaving anymore, and he’s not afraid. 

7. Vanya

OK, she was a little out of character because... you know. She had amnesia. 

But aside from erasing her past, the amnesia allowed us to see Vanya without the anger and resentment that plagued her for all of season one. Vanya was always someone who was kind and loving, someone who cares enough to leave peanut butter and marshmallow sandwiches out for a missing brother for years. Someone who knows the pain of not being seen and who will always take the time to truly see other people. She’s someone who wants to love and to be loved and to protect those she loves. 

That was all here, with or without the memories. And as soon as the memories came back, so did the guilt and fear about what she had done, what she had become, terrified of what was inside her in a way that she was not when her powers first surfaced. But Ben is used to being afraid of what’s inside of him. He knows she’s not a monster and is the perfect person to explain that to her. And this time around, she has experienced the love and care and attention of her siblings (and Sissy) to back up those words. That’s how she finally accepts them as truth, how she finally accepts her power as a part of her. 

Overall, there are things that I wish this season spent more time with, but there was nothing that I felt was out of character or wildly inconsistent. The characters still struggled with all the baggage from their shitty childhood, their fear of their powers, and the guilt in their past. Some struggled in new ways this season and some continued old struggles that had never fully been resolved. The season felt very different than the first, but it still felt like the Umbrella Academy. It was a good mix of new and old and a good mix of feel-good moments we have all been waiting for and frustrating and sad moments that just come with having a complicated family. I loved this season. And now, I’m going to go re-watch every episode. 

[greywindys]

Hi! As a gorillaz newbie, I really wanna say thank you so much for posting amazing/informative stuff! Your fics and posts feed me well.

I have a question tho, where did you get the idea that 2d cares about the public eye and considers himself as a heartthrob? (sorry if this sounds aggressive it's a genuine question) bc to me, who doesn't know much abt 2d's character other than seeing him in MVs and some interviews, 2d seems to live inside his own head and aren't quite aware of things happening around him. (It's not like I see him as a 'clueless baby cinnamon roll' tho, I think he's a lovable dude with generally empthy head lol.)

Just wanted to ask a professional to better understand 2d's character!

No problem, and thank you! This question also doesn't come across as aggressive at all. 2D has been cinnamon roll-ified, so it can be hard for newer fans to figure out that he was written as kind of a douchebag in earlier phases. TBH, I don't consider myself an expert on him by any stretch. I'm frustrated by his character on most days lately, and a lot of how I characterize him is how I think he could be based on the mixed, inconsistent canon we've received.

Anyhow, personally, I don't see him as a lovable dude with an empty head. That sounds very close to cinnamon roll to me. That's maybe half of who he is at most, imo.

So...heartthrob. Here is what 2D was doing between P1 and P2

Additionally - He’s said some less than kind things about women in ROTO - “Yeah she’s nice. I fancied her since Murdoc lent me his copy of the Wickerman. But her arse looks a lot smaller in real life.” (about Britt Eckland) and from a 2001 interview - “Christina’s (Aguilara) out straight away for looking like a man in drag. She looks like the singer of Twisted Sister or that other bloke Courtney Love. Urgh!!” 

...Very typical fuckboy stuff, overall. I could probably find more, but you get the idea, hopefully. Never forget he that he’s a rich, white guy.

As for his relationship with his image? He was pretty cocky and full of himself and all in all, enjoying his fame in ROTO. He's aware of his talent in P3. I don't think he's unaware of how much fans love him in general. I can't remember the exact source, but sometime in P4 he comments on fans throwing bras and such on stage at him...and he knows Murdoc is jealous of him over how popular he is. He's laughed about this, and teased Murdoc about it.

To me, it makes sense that this would make him feel superior to Murdoc to an extent, and that he would drink up the compliments. This is perhaps a little headcanon-y, but I kinda think of it like, he relies on fan approval because he never gets that sort of positive feedback from Murdoc...it's a superiority thing, but it's born out of his own insecurity on some level. Murdoc may not ever truly love him, but his fans do. I think 2D would be very sensitive to any changes in this dynamic because it's so tied to his self-esteem and what he feels entitled to aka fan sympathy. "I'm in this band with this asshole, I've suffered, but they'll always love me more, so I'll always have that to hold over him." Take that away, and it's like, wrong. He can't process it.

I’m trying not to make this excessively long, but if you have any other points you want clarified or expanded upon, just lmk! This is my start lmao.

[stanfordsweater]

@aftershocked

moving this here because you’ve brought up a TON of points i’d love to dig into and the tumblr reply system is garbage--

(under the cut: much talk of possessive sam vs. possessive dean, benefits of a long-running series, ooc actions vs. consistent characterization)

“they change a lot over 15 seasons but it's consistent enough” i feel like differences and inconsistencies in episodes/writing/seasons are one of the reasons (besides personal preference) that ppl get twisted around when it comes to possessive sam and possessive dean, like it’s easy to focus on one or two things w/o taking larger patterns or predominant characteristics into account.

also it’s easy to focus on like, smth happening a few times that is in contradiction to something that happened many other times, & not want to Deal with the complexities & contradictions—but the complexities are the best part! i’ve seen you talk about it before too, the benefits of a longrunning series where we get to really watch the characters grow from young men to essentially middle-aged,

you get to actually have characters w the kind of multifaceted personalities you’d expect of, like, normal people (just way more fucked up and traumatized). so yeah, dean isn’t always straightforward in the way he’s content with keeping sam with him, and can dip into weird behavior (ESPECIALLY in the sort of parental “i make the decisions around here” sense)—

but his general preference, his base character, does not lean towards possessiveness at all. versus sam, who SEEMS like he’d be more grounded and chill, but is actually the crazy jealous guy. that kind of irony, those kind of subversions, are what make them enjoyable as characters and contribute to why possessive sam is so much fun to explore,

bc you Wouldn’t think he’d be the one who’s jealous enough that even when dean gives sam so much of himself already, sam still wants more. you’d look at him and expect him to be the brother capable of letting go, of being halfway normal, instead of like, sam’s built so much on seeking dean’s approval and lived his life at the center of dean’s universe,

so he’ll reject anything that threatens to change that dynamic. like the contradictions are weird and spicy and i like them a lot and god i love sam’s reactions to benny so much. i’d feel bad bc i really like benny & he deserved better, but it’s too much fun to see how much sam of all people unreasonably, irrationally, illogically hates the guy,

just because he represents someone dean might, might, might possibly actually like more than sam (even though we, the viewers, know that’s impossible). beautiful

--

yes, you’ve hit on so many great points here! firstly, the inconsistencies in characterization: i think it’s very easy to see why people get annoyed by the writing, and i do think it’s occasionally justified; however, i’ve always found it a lot more rewarding to think about it as the same kind of inconsistencies that real people have! sam and dean might make “ooc” decisions and it’s okay because real people do that too, out of anger, resentment, sadness, trauma... it makes sense, to me, that they aren’t the same people they were fifteen years ago. getting stuck in one ‘mode’ of characterization is damaging to an overall reading of the show, but at the same time it’s okay to latch onto one era if that’s what you enjoy. it only bothers me when people take characterization from one era (for example, dean’s ptsd, anger, and jealousy over amelia) and apply it to every version of that character.

dean’s parental sense of possession over sam is one thing i do agree with wrt the possessive dean takes, and i think they’re more memorable for a lot of people because they’re not what you usually see from a family show-- it’s weird for dean to feel that way, and i don’t know if i’ve ever seen that intersection of parental ownership and romantic partner jealousy. it’s important that this comes out when dean is under pressure, not all the time-- AND it’s essential that sam does not cave to this. it gets iffy during dabb era, but i still don’t see sam immediately caving to dean’s demands. a good example is the scene where dean holds a gun to sam in season 15, which i see fairly often as an example of dean demanding obedience from sam... but sam doesn’t cave! and sam doesn’t even flinch, because he’s used to having guns pointed at him, and he knows that no version of dean could ever kill him. dean knows this too, and dean is the one who caves, as per usual. this is only not the case a few times in canon, like season 4, parts of season 7, and season 9, all for different reasons i won’t get into now. it’s remarkable when dean doesn’t go along with what sam asks, which is why it sticks in people’s memories, imo. dean is very loud with what he wants and what he thinks is best, but if sam disagrees he will argue dean around to his point, or he’ll go behind dean’s back to do it anyway (case in point, season 11 with the cage.)

anyway-- “the complexities are the best part!” and “you get to actually have characters w the kind of multifaceted personalities you’d expect of, like, normal people (just way more fucked up and traumatized). so yeah, dean isn’t always straightforward...” TOTALLY AGREE. i love the times when the brothers are making decisions that fandom disagrees with, because it’s interesting. the show is here to provide a compelling story. i’m not going to lie and say i always agree with that story or those choices, but it’s fun for me to try to get into why a character would make that decision, not just rail against it. i like the dudes we have in canon! they’re fun!

this is why possessive sam slaps for me. what you said here-- “sam, who SEEMS like he’d be more grounded and chill, but is actually the crazy jealous guy. that kind of irony, those kind of subversions, are what make them enjoyable as characters and contribute to why possessive sam is so much fun to explore” yes yes yes. 100%. and we see these subversions right from season one! it’s not new that dean isn’t actually the uber-confident womanizing asshole, but if you aren’t paying attention it can sneak up on you, i guess? and sam, who comes across as the level-headed one in common archetypes, the soft-spoken college boy, crashes the impala into a building. in the first episode. and in route 666, he  follows a crazy instinct that is proven correct and saves their lives (because he’s intelligent!) but toys with the chance that it could have failed and killed dean (because he’s reckless!)

the fact that we have all these examples of the ways the brothers fail to fulfill the tropes they would in a less-interesting tv show means that possessive sam makes so much sense. sam is built up as the independent brother, the one who left home, the rebellious one, but he loves his family and he needs dean. he needs him. “sam’s built so much on seeking dean’s approval and lived his life at the center of dean’s universe...” i love the way you put this. sam has had dean’s attention and protection for most of his life, and hell if he’s giving it up now for some two-bit vampire, lol. sam is independent, but like with everything else, dean is the exception. sam’s desperation for dean’s approval and attention is absolutely hilarious in the benny situation, because, like you’ve said before, benny is the least-threatening dude ever. he’s so nice. and the fact that sam won’t rest until he dies is-- well, i’m being a little uncharitable, i don’t think sam wanted benny to die, but he sure didn’t shed any tears over it.

the contradictions are delicious. i do think some of it is that dean gets his friendships fulfilled outside of sam, so sam is in a category all his own, while sam doesn’t have as many relationships as dean does so dean is fills all of his categories. but then again, that isn’t always true. it shifts over the seasons and even through episodes. broad trends!

[kachinnate]

i feel like wrt jared’s character, there is easily the Other Side of the spectrum of people who make him haha funny memeboy bathbomb cronch but ppl just wanna Not acknowledge it

like…… cuz alright class let’s dissect WHY we hated bath bomb era jared …. he was reduced to like three characteristics/personality traits and we hated that bland surface level characterization and begged those people to grow up and have nuance bc he is More than just that

,,,and yet on the other side of it

a lot of.. Perceptions i’ll say of jared get dangerously close to making him JUST into the misunderstood gay teenager who doesn’t mean any of what he says in an act of Angsty Cognitive Dissonance…. just misunderstood just sad n queer if he could get over the internalized homophobia he’d be fine whatever whatever

which yeah depending on who you are you might agree that the latter is better than the former but when you really think about it they’re Very much so similar ! i do think — at least in FANON — that universally we all seem to agree that.. yeah dude he copes differently than evan and as such gets misconstrued and misunderstood, yeah it’s more believable that he would be gay more than anything, and yeah things are definitely not perfect in his world if you pay attention to the things that are blatantly there…… but then if that’s it, if that’s all he is, then what is his place in a story outside of shipping…. when he gets with evan or connor what else is there to him?

and it gets to the point too that people get so attached to this weird version of jared that exists in their mind that’s very much … like, somewhat musical jared but more tortured and concentrated into something specific, that anything outside of that is suddenly a massacre to his character. like fuck dude, i also love him as a character, but it’s getting to a point that i almost want to go Back to people focusing way too much on his Questionable lines and accusing him of being an asshole ????

there’s like a very very specific difference between being frustrated at an adaption!jared’s character because it seems to be made into something completely different COMPARED TO THE ORIGINAL (NOT fanon!), as in given lines or behaviors that are inconsistent with how he was on stage, and then being entirely way too upset that fanon jared isn’t like the jared on screen in a movie you already don’t want to like going Into it…. and also a character who is inherently not going to get the Most character development as is anyway given that he isn’t the main character !

[adobe-outdesign]

The Big Grand TIOL Review/Critique

I’ve been covering my thoughts on this a bit during my liveblog, but I figured I should punch out a proper review.

No spoilers review: This one’s a bit tricky in terms of reviewing it. The reason for this is that, in a way, I feel like some its weaknesses are part of its design, so it’s not fair to critique them.

Basically, DCTL is the essential BATIM novel, in that it does exactly what you’d expect a BATIM novel to do. Don’t get me wrong, it was by no means paint-by-the-numbers, but you had all the BATIM staples in there. Game-canon characters, the machine itself, people getting turned into cartoons, the Ink Demon killing shit, ect ect.

TIOL is different because it’s basically an in-universe memoir written by Joey about his life and philosophy. So the thing is, when you boil this book down, it’s kind of almost not a BATIM book in a way. It features a game-canon character and dives deep into his backstory, but most of the book has little to do with the studio until like the last 4/5s or so.

So on the one hand, I feel like that’s a problem, and we needed more game-canon characters, more about the cartoons, ect. But then again... it wouldn’t make sense for Joey to spend his entire life rambling about the studio instead of talking about his early years at all, would it? So in a way I can’t really fault the book for it.

In terms of flaws, it honestly has less than DCTL--while DCTL had some major glaring problems, TIOL is fairly solid all around, but is less of a satisfying read due to its premise, making it hard to compare the two.

In terms of whether or not you’d enjoy the book, I guess it’s most important to know what you’re going to get out of it. If you’re like me and like extreme character studies and backstories, de-fictionalized in-universe media, and long philosophical talks, you’ll probably really enjoy it. If you don’t and want something more standard for BATIM, stick with DCTL.

Overall, I enjoyed the book, though I do like DCTL more at the end of the day. I’ll give this one a solid 6/10.

Spoilers below the cut:

The Good, the Bad, and the Ugly

Okay, I lied. I’m not gonna include an ugly section this time, mostly because, as I said before, this book has less glaring issues than DCTL did. With that said:

The Good

If you like Joey, you will love this book. I’ve said before that Joey is the best character (strictly speaking) in BATIM because he by far has the most depth, showing a layered and interesting character. This book takes that and runs with it, giving a deep look into his psychology, philosophy, and overall explaining a lot about why he does what he does and his way of viewing the world. It’s legitimately well done and makes you look at his character in a new way, and as someone who loves character studies this whole thing was a real treat for me.

They do a very good job making this feel like an actual memoir. Nathan is editing and leaves footnotes, he wrote a foreword explaining this is a reprint, Joey blatantly lies a few times because that’s what he’d do, ect. 

Also, if you enjoy foreshadowing dialogue--which I do, very much--there is more than enough of that here.

This one might be cheating because it’s probably unintentional, but there is a ton of Joey being gay in this book, some of it really overt. I’m not going to go into it much here as Dreamfisher already summarized everything for me, but yeah, there is no way this man is straight.

Everyone who was OOC in DCTL seems to be better here. Sammy, while still an asshole, is neither as big of an asshole as he was in DCTL nor is he being racist. Bertrum is still affable towards Joey, but here it makes sense because they literally just met, and unlike in DCTL he even corrects him on his name.

Other characters get some screentime, and while brief, it’s nice to get some more characterization for them, especially because a few of them never showed up in DCTL. Jack Fain in particular gets some much-needed characterization and really shines here, as well as Nathan.

While it’s not overtly ha-ha funny, I did chuckle a few times. Most at Nathan’s notes, as half of them are just blatantly contradicting Joey’s lies.

We get a bit more info on Henry and Joey’s relationship, as well as how the cartoons were made.

The Bad

As mentioned above, there’s weirdly not a ton of BATIM content in this. Sure, it’s about Joey, but the bulk of the novel features book-canon characters only and is more focused on how he got where he ended up than stuff regarding the studio. It doesn’t really feel like a BATIM novel until about 4/5s of the way through. Like I said above though, I don’t know how much I can critique that, as it’s kind of inevitable with a memoir.

There is a lot of navel gazing in this. If you like philosophy you’ll enjoy it, but if you don’t it might get irritating, especially when it’s just Joey’s opinions over and over.

While we get more info about Joey and Henry and how they met, there’s not much info given on their relationship. Joey just talks about how much he totes didn’t need Henry while Nathan indicates that it was way more personal than that, but we never learn how personal. It makes sense as Joey’s the one writing this, but it still would’ve been nice to hear some more remarks from Nathan on the matter or something.

There’s like a 50 page or so detective mystery that I didn’t really care for. There was nothing really wrong with it, but it didn’t feel like it told us a ton about Joey, and there’s not a lot of emotional investment as we don’t know these people. Combine that with the mystery being unsolvable to the reader (because Joey leaves out crucial information until the reveal) and it just kind of felt like a pointless side detour, and like that time could’ve been spent on something more interesting. Most we get out of it is the origin of Bendy’s name.

There’s a weird inconsistency where Joey claims he made Bendy (not surprising), but he also goes over the moment when Bendy was made and it blatantly shows the two collabing, so at best he would’ve been Bendy’s co-creator. It’s just strange that he would describe the process like that instead of changing it to fit his lie. I think the implication is that the process itself is fake--that Henry had nailed Bendy’s design when he first showed it to Joey--but like I said, the scene contradicts Joey’s claims regardless.

There’s not really a... plot? Not surprising as it’s a memoir, but some memoirs do a good job of building a climax by showcasing an important moment in the person’s life. Here, because things are being told out of order, we never really get a climax, as there’s no action and Joey’s little emphianys are scattered throughout. There’s kind of just a lot of people standing around and talking and not much actual action going on.

I was kind of hoping this book would go into Joey’s black magic stuff. I need to make this clear: I don’t think BATIM should ever go into this too much, as it’s really just the macguffin that explains the plot, and it wouldn’t make sense for Joey to sit there talking about all the cool satanic bullshit he’s been doing lately anyway. However, Joey’s mentioned the “Gods” before, so I was kind of hoping for something about his thoughts about religion or something that would hint at the demonic stuff. He thinks about the afterlife a lot, but that’s about it.

Overall

Like I said, you have to know what you’re getting into when you pick up the book. If you read this and it sounds like something you’d enjoy, then grab it. If not, then don’t bother. For me, personally, I’m glad I read it, even if it wasn’t quite on the same level as something like DCTL.

[mega-ringsandthings-world]

I’m rewatching all my fave? english-centered period dramas in preparation for  new one coming out, twq, twp, tsp, the tudors, and I know we all love the tudor family here, but good lord was twp such a mess that I ended up actively hating every Tudor character in it. (which was kinda the point, imao) The twp show was based off phillipa gregory's books (that are even worse than the show) and they both shredded the characterizations of everyone in them to the point that they might as well be OCs based on historical figures. Literally the only reason I was able to make it through was because of the actors. jodie and jcls acting carried it at the best of times, and JCL is hot, so... and I’m so glad they got michelle fairley and essie davis as EW and MB, or else it would of been unwatchable.  I couldn’t really root for either lizzie or henry, because their characterizations and personalities were so inconstant and varied wildly from ep to ep, its like I was watching different people in each ep. nd that’s a big part of why I favored the York plotlines/characters more, at least most of them (except lizzie) stayed constant in their characterizations/motives (even if all they were consistent with was revenge against the tudors) And rooting for the tudors in general was hard too, since the show was bending backwards to make them all assholes. (JT gets a pass tho, he was just trying to raise his kid right) No one was really likable, you get a good moment with someone and then the next moment they’re doing something batshit, e.i, henry’s good for a while and then starts being a dick, (wtf was up with imply he slept with cathy gordon and him being such a bitch to lizzie out of the blue?) or you’re starting to sympathize with Margret Beaufort and then she kills another kid, which like, the decision to have her kill the two princes was a choice, and I won’t hesitate to say I enjoyed the drama it brought. Along those lines, the show is marginally enjoyable if you divorce it from the history its trying to retell and treat it as a game-of-thrones-bodice-ripper-drama, which was the intent of the author in the frst place, but whatever. That some of the best acting on the show came plots/situation that weren’t even real irl is wild, and that says a lot. henry’s talk with lizzie about her loving him, but not like she did w/rIII, and his depression-breakdown (never happened),  over his mother being a murderer and the whole thing with Richard Jr./percy warbeck was just juicy, later moments with lizzie and the bit when she talks to richard jr./pw in the tower and his laugh reminds her so much of her father? and then the execution scene? good shit.  A fave bit was henry sitting all despondent in his room remembering the killing of richardIII, and yes they did actually have richardIII buried alive in this show, jfc. It goes again to the bad characterization that ep 1 lizzie would have strangled him outright if she’d found that out, but lizzie in this ep would have been meh. Speaking of which, the short-lived friendship between richard jr./pw and teddy was extremely sweet, which made their executions all that more horrific. within the narrative of the show, R jr./pw seemed like he would have actually made an excellent king, he never seemed anything but kind and honorable, although adamant about his claim, and lizzie’s fear he would kill her children, which was  not unfounded of course, was also made mostly her entire basis for having him killed in the show, even though he was never presented as someone who would do that? make it make sense, or at least hint he would want to harm the kids after taking the throne, instead of showing him as incredibly nice. And in this show, with richard jr./pw being the actual richard, and mb having tried to kill him as a boy and framing richardIII for it, he’s more than justified in wanting the throne and justice. except that never happened irl, and the show has me rooting for a pretender instead of the certified monarchs, which are SUPPOSED TO BE THE “HEROES” OF THIS SHOW. and like, claimants to the throne are usually entitled fucks by nature, I don’t know why everyone hates richardjr./pw for being entitled, when every person who ever laid claim to a throne ever does so on the belief of entitlement to that throne?   And tell me how there was more chemistry between lizzie and faceless richard III in a four-second flashback than she and henry had in most scenes? I’m not saying that lizzie and henry didn’t have chemistry in the show, because they did, (at least the actors did) but once again, their inconsistent characterization marred a lot of scenes that would otherwise be amazing. Then the whole thing where henry r*ped her nd it was shown to be directly caused by her mentioning her relationship with richardIII? Messy, messy messy. after that, it was hard to “feel” lot of her and henry’s scenes even in better contexts. I ship lizzie/richardIII out of spite for that nasty-ass scene alone, because I can’t sit there and watch lizzie falling for her rapist. and then lizzie is vilified for her relationship with richardIII, yet the show implies that Margaret B is in love with her own brother, has lizze taunt her over it, and then present JT marrying/ MB her arranging his marriage as a tragedy for MB? Sir? Ma’am? Jasper Tudor straight up implying that his sister should get a fucking annulment so they can be together, and MB actually considering it gets a pass? more like margaret lannister. Then they bring up richarchIII as a gotcha to lizzie every other ep? someone inform henry that his beloved mother wants to fuck her brother, his beloved uncle and see if he keeps throwing rIII in lizzie’s face every five minutes. EYE. god, this show is bad, bad.  Don’t get me started on the burgundy plot. if you’re going to have the duchess start a war on a whim, at least imply she was possessed to do so by EW’s magic, or have the balls to make her stepdughter’s death actually the fault of the tudors. And poor fucking maggie. it was hard for her irl, but it’s intolerable for her within the show.   Sorry, this got long, I’m ranting at this point because holy hell ITS BAD. If you take it as a show that’s supposed to be about real life historical figures it’s a trash fire, but you really should just watch it as a story like bridgerton. makes it more tolerable.  You know you’ve lost it when a show that’s supposed to be about the unification of two great houses and the love story (not that it was reallly that great of a love story irl either, but that’s for another day) between the scions of those houses gives me hives and makes me wish the burgundy plot succeeded.   

[kanohivolitakk]

Have you done Krekka for the ask game? I know you're a huge Nidhiki fan, curious if you have any thoughts on his partner?

I haven't gotten Krekka yet actually. So far I only done Toa Ignika and Axonn for the Bionicle ask game (which Im still accepting). That being said great choice. Krekka isn't necessarily a big favorite of mine (partially because I'm not that fond of the "dumb brute" archetype barring a few exceptions), but I have to admit I do have a soft spot for the big guy. Krekka is a relatively simple character when it comes to characterization/backstory/role in the story (especially when compared to Nidhiki), but that doesn't mean I don't have any "deeper" thoughts regarding him or that there isnt stuff worth discussing.

Anyways some thoughts/headcanons/general musings:

This is a weird thing to start with but... Krekka is kinda adorable for me. I think its kinda this ...overgrown puppy (bulldog??) vibe due to his loyalty and dumbness. I admit BOADH is a big reason for me feeling this way since it gave him a few moments that made me go "AWWW he's so cute". Just..love his loyalty so much.

His undying loyalty makes him stand out for me across the other dark hunters. While many dark hunters we ha e are opportunistic and schemy, Krekka is just...very loyal. Maybe too much so. But I love that he is loyal. Feels refreshing tbh.

And now I cant help but feel that TSO is just "guys stupid but at least he wont double cross me and is easy to keep in check" when it comes to him.

Not to go woobifying villains but I genuinely dont think the guys that bad. Hes just really stupid, overly loyal and doing his job. Its kinda like w Lariska being a decent person despite being a knife happy murder girl although to a much lesser extent since guys a literalminded fool and also just smashy boy.

I do like his backstory of being a former guard who lost his job and started wreck havoc until one day a dark hunter found and hired him. It isnt anything too complex but it works well for his character and explains why he is so loyal to Dark Hunters. It also helps bringing a bit more light to his homeland and I love when we get more info of places through character backstories, makes the world feel more real that way.

Also can Gorast please stop hurting charaxters I like. This is the reason shes my least favorite character in the 2001-2008 storyline that isnt just a glorified extra or a plot device.

When it comes to Krekka, one scene I always think of when I think of him is in BOADH where he temporarily forgot to fly and Nidhiki was just "WAIT A MOMENT LARISKA TOLD ME YOU CAN FLY????" and Krekka just goes "whoops I forgot". That was adorable honestly. You dumb idiot, forgot you could fly.

Also, I know he's kinda "the idiot character", and while I am NOT saying he isn't, I do think its worth pointing out that he's basically literal minded. In BOADH (again) when Nidhiki tried to do that training scenario Krekka basically was like "wait I’m here, there’s nothing there why should I move there". This is

Another thing I really like about Krekka is that how, despite being an absolute idiot and tool, he still is willing to sometimes not take Nidhikis bullshit, see preventing him from getting the Zamor launchers (geez BOADH did a lot for this guys characterization lmao)

I sometimes call him truck boy because his name is one letter off my languages word for truck.

Also unless canon/word of Greg says otherwise I don't think every member of his species is as stupid as him. Like possibly on similar level but still.

It is made pretty clear that Nidhiki couldn't stand Krekka at all, but I do genuinely wonder how Krekka feels about Nidhiki. Based on the little we have I'd say he liked him to some extent or at the very least, didn't hate him to the same degree. I also have to wonder how aware he was about Nidhikis haterd towards him.

I also love the idea that when Nidhiki was mutated, Krekka just...wasnt afraid of him at slightest, no fear in this dumb boy. (I also like the idea he didnt recognize him at first and Nidhiki just, had to explain to his thick skull who he was. It took a while but eventually he got it.)

On a related note, I find it interesting how the LOMN website describes him working with Nidhiki because guy knows where to get the good jobs or something rather than being his goverment (read TSO) assigned partner The way the twos relationship were described makes it feel that by this point the staff hadnt figured out what they wanted to do with Dark Hunters , or if it even was an organization or just these two tools.

Its really interesting for me how Krekkas characterization not only varies between the books/comics (where hes more intimidating and him being a simpleton isnt as pronounced) and the movie (where hes more of a dumbass) but also how his characterization evolved. Like, his loyalty wasn't that pronounced trait but now I feel its just as important part of him as him being a dumbass (which is to say, very interesting)

I remember how the aftoermentoined Metru Nui movie website described that Krekka hated toa to the point wouldve hunted them for free if Nidhiki didnt make sure the two would get paid. I feel this is somewhat early installment weirdness as it isnt mentioned anywhere else but at the same time Krekka being willing to fight without payment sounds 1000% in character if you ask me

Something I have been confused over: when exactly was Krekka recruited to the dark hunters??? The timeline is very vague about this and I wish we knew.

It's been AGES since I watched my home countrys dub of LOMN but what I recall I really liked Krekka's voice in that dub. He sounded more badass and I loved it, the VA had a pretty unique sound. Sadly dont think there is any clips of the LOMN dub, which is a shame. UPDATE: I rewatched the dub and I love the voice itself but felt the voice direction made him sound kinda inconsistent

This is more a "Nidhiki and Krekka related thought" rather than just Krekka related but one thing I really like about Krekka and Nidhiki is that how they are like a more serious and competent take of "those two evil henchmen with contrasting personalities" trope. Often these types of villains are rather goofy, but these two could be rather dangerous as well and I really like that. I also like their dynamic of just doing Nidhiki being done with Krekkas bullshit. One of the main reasons I wish LOMN was a miniseries rather than a movie is because I really wanted more screentime with the two.

On a related note can I JUST SAY I LOVE the way the two compliment/pararell each other. From design (Krekka being bulky mostly blue colored, Nidhiki being slender and monstrous, mostly green colored) to personality (Krekka being foolish and simpleminded but loyal Nidhiki being cunning and ambitious but treacherous) to powersets (Krekka being strong physical attacker, Nidhiki being weaker(??) but faster and more special attacker).Heck, even their backstories have similarities as they both lost their orginal purpose in one way or another and didnt have anywhere to go but Dark Hunters (the main difference being that Nidhiki inflicted his fate upon himself by betraying the toa while Krekka didnt really do anything iirc)

Now for something crossovery, Krekkas and Nidhikis dynamic reminds me a lot of Kronk and Yzma from Emperors New Groove. Yes I have drawn a parody of the "pull the lever kronk" meme, yes I intend to make more screencap redraws. They also remind me a lot of Mummymon and Archenemon from Digimon 02, partially due to the dynamic (smug spider that tries to be cunning and intimidating but gets outclassed by most other villains in that + loyal blue dumb boy) partially due to their ultimate fate being rather similar.

I don't know how familiar you are with the franchise, but Krekka reminds me a fair bit of Gamel, one of the four villain generals in Kamen Rider OOOs, mainly because "the dumb brute major villain that's kinda cuteish and loyal a f while everyone else is an asshole".

I remember reading a p good oneshot fic that was just him accidentally killing a civilian when all he wanted was a hug and...honestly that is p much what I imagine him being like. Guy may be strong, reckless and a fool but like I said I dont think hes all that bad and just a puppy. An overgrown, moronic puppy but a puppy nontheless

For AUs, I remember I have thought once of "What if Krekka survived but Nidhiki died" and just ...guy wouldve been very lost and confused and unsure what to do tbh. He would most likely returned to Dark Hunters but Mata Nui knows how say TSO wouldve felt about that. Its not too complex au yet but I am thinking of developing it further one day.

Thank you for asking.

Sorry this took longer than expected. I had too many thoughts and half of them were deleted so. I hope its worth the wait tho. I do have a lot of Krekka thoughts and tbh wasnt sure if I was even able to get them all here.

(I am still doing the ask game so if anyone wants to send me a bonkle I will try to give thoughts, meta and headcanons on them)