#implied james tartt

[fanficfanattic]

Trick or treat! 🦇

Because I am desperately trying to actually get Boots to Bottles moving forward, you get a little treat from it!

It’s already over 2,500 words and I have Jamie only finally having finished talking about Pre Dad and Beginning of Dad time.

“But the shine on having a kid with learning difficulties despite mad footy skills faded pretty quick. I’m dyslexic, so I stayed late after school working on how to get better at me reading. Or having someone doing reading with me so I could do me homework faster.

He wanted me to spend that time getting better at playing. And it didn’t matter explaining that all the academies have education requirements. Which is when he really started in on the names, didn’t he?

Which I were already used to with me classmates. People were either too smart, which were considered bad. Or normal which was good. Or…I don’t actually gotta use the word, right?”

And he finally looked up but it was to lock eyes with Doc Sharon. She was the one who told him that ‘facing reality’ didn’t mean accepting the labels others put on him. That was a phrase society used to keep people down.

She didn’t disappoint, letting him know with a nod that he was okay not saying it. Roy had taken an especially deep breath right after he said it, making him brace for whatever he was gonna hear from the coach. But he didn’t say anything at all. Plus Keeley had grabbed his hand when he said that, which were nice. It kind of felt like the whole room disagreed with his dad actually.

“Like, I know even now people think I’m thick. Which can be true. But I actually like learning. Just gotta do a couple extra steps to really do it properly. It doesn’t make me stupid, cause the actually stupid thing to so would be giving up just cause things are hard.

And I don’t do that. I’m not afraid of hard work. Wouldn’t have gotten to the professional level at all if I were. And wouldn’t have come back to Richmond if I let having to prove I deserved to be here intimidate me.”

[antitheticallyargumentative]

I’m going to attempt to explain why the ending of Ted Lasso re: Jamie and his dad, bothers me so much. I know a lot of other people have made posts about this, and excellent ones, too, but I also have a lot of thoughts. These are just my opinions. Feel free to disagree. Feel free to discuss with me why you disagree. I love respectful conversations.

 This is gonna be long. sorry guys.

tw/cw- James Tartt Sr., abuse, The Amsterdam Thing

not detailed, but they are mentioned. proceed with caution and take care of yourself, please. <3

It is not the decision to have Jamie reach out to his dad that I hate. It is not even the decision to put Jamie’s dad in rehab (though I do think it was… A Choice.) To me, it’s very unsurprising that Jamie would try to reach out to his dad. Not just because of who he is as a character, but because of what this kind of lifelong abuse does to a person’s psyche. A lot of kids who come from abusive or neglectful homes have an incredibly hard time cutting off their parents. Even if they’re scared of them, even if they’re angry with them, there is still a deeply ingrained need to be loved, that maybe this time it will be different. They’ll mean it when they say they’ve changed. They’ll love me. Going no contact is fucking hard. It’s also fucking dangerous. As much as Jamie says he’s done everything he has to spite his dad, there is a part of him that deeply, desperately craves James’s approval. Of course he would visit him in rehab, because, if he’s in rehab, he’s trying, right? And maybe this time it will be different. 

But it won’t be. Because James Tartt has a pattern. A pattern of playing super dad, presumably where he cleans up his act and “makes an effort” with Jamie. Does father-son things with him, talks to him outside of asking for game tickets or telling him he played like shit (I’m hypothesizing here), lulls him into a false sense of security. And then what happens? Well, things like Amsterdam happen. And I highly doubt that was the only time he pulled that act. He likely also pulled it when he first came back into Jamie’s life, and probably other times after Amsterdam, too. What he doesn’t do, ever, though, is apologize, or take accountability for his past actions. Because James is a narcissist. At least, that’s what I would say. He feeds off Jamie’s fame and success to make himself feel bigger, important, entitled. And narcissists lack empathy. They struggle to take responsibility for their actions. They’re also, commonly, very manipulative. 

James is not an abusive piece of shit because he’s an alcoholic. He is both an abusive piece of shit AND an alcoholic. Not only does acting like he was horrid because he was drunk perpetuate the stigma of substance use disorders, it also completely takes away accountability.  James going to rehab does not change what he did. It does not fix what he’s done. It does not mean that he is magically going to win father of the year because he got sober. More likely, he’s going to continue to the cycle. I truly do not see a way in which we get to the happy ending of the show. Which brings me to my final point. 

This is not a happy ending. Jamie going to see his dad does not fix things. Jamie forgiving his dad does not take away from his trauma. Jamie should not have to forgive his dad, not for James, not for himself, not for anyone. The thing that bothers me most is that the show plays this scene like it’s closure. Like everything is OK now, and they have a good relationship, there’s no fallout, no consequences, nothing left the heal. And I’m sorry, but that’s bullshit. 

The things our parents do and say to us cut deep, at least in my experience. It doesn’t matter if they apologize, it doesn’t matter if they learn and grow, it doesn’t matter if we forgive them. That hurt stays. It sticks. You remember it. You feel it. There is no way in hell that seeing his dad wouldn’t be incredibly difficult for Jamie— just judging from what we’ve seen in the show. There’s no way it wouldn’t bring up all the trauma James has put him through, even repressed. It would not be easy. It would not be happy. And I don’t think it would be healthy. 

Whatever Jamie eventually decides to do regarding his relationship with his dad, whether its cutting him off or choosing to forgive him, which personally, I don’t think he should (but I also know that cutting off a parent is no easy feat), it would take time, it would take effort, it would be a struggle. It would take actually working through the years of abuse and trauma caused by his dad. And we don’t get any of that. We get “forgive <3” and problem solved! And honestly, I think that’s a dangerous message to be passing out. 

Thank you for coming to my Ted Talk. (Hehe, get it?) 

[toxicroyjamie]

i honestly dont even think jamie enjoys alcohol that much, especially when he's in an upset mood

I agree! I think Jamie is exclusively a social drinker, and even then doesn't like being DRUNK drunk. He'll have 1-2 if everyone else is drinking but he doesn't like getting sloppy to the point he can't take care of himself

He doesn't drink the beer Ted buys him in Lavender, and I think that was because he knew he was depressed and didn't want to start relying on alcohol for mood regulation. I have alcoholism in my family and I very consciously avoid drinking when I'm upset because I'm worried it'll send me down a slippery slope. I only drink when I'm already having a good time :)

[kvetchinglyneurotic]

🌹

Love your work. ❤️🩷❤️

Thank you! 🩷

Two days before Jamie’s fourteenth birthday, dad slung an arm around his shoulder and said, “how would you like seeing Amsterdam, lad?” Of course Jamie wanted to go: he’d never been outside of England but he used to sit with mummy in the library with a stack of travel books between them and flip through the glossy pages together, trading ideas for where they’d go once he was a famous footballer. “Are you sure, baby?” mummy asked him the night before they left, sat on the edge of his bed as he packed so he wouldn’t forget anything. And maybe part of him felt a little sick at the thought of spending all that time alone with dad but it was a stupid, childish part. He crammed it down with the socks shoved into the bottom of his bag. “You’re just jealous ‘cause dad actually spends time with me,” he said. Mummy sighed, long and slow. Leaned over to smooth a hand over his hair and left it there like she was trying to memorize the feel of him, and then she pushed herself to her feet and walked out, shutting the door softly behind her. But the next morning she came to wake him smiling big — she’d had her shifts moved around special, she said, so she could drop him and dad off. Took a picture of them at the harbour and gave it to him printed and framed when he got back; Jamie in a t-shirt and cap they’d bought at the gift shop with dad’s arm slung around his shoulders. Squeezed him tight against her when they called the boarding, planted a kiss on his cheek and then did the same for dad like they were a regular family. “You boys have fun, alright?” Dad gave him a shake, body vibrating as he laughed. “By the time we’re through, this one here’s gonna be a man, ain’t that right, son?”

[coachbeards]

thinking about brendan’s q&a session where someone asked him how much money beard had made moonlighting as a biter and he just replied “hard to do math when you’re at rock bottom”…hm.

[jamiesfootball]

100K!!!!!!!! That is a staggering amount of words. I am in awe of your talent and creativity. I think i speak for all the people when I say we are going to devour every single one.

Congrats! And thank you for sharing your gifts with us :)

I have been saving this with no real idea of what to post here (other than a rose wippet, obviously).

Then I found this bit. I've technically posted it before, but it's undergone a few changes and I like it better now. So as an ode to how all writing is progress, and the more you do it the better you get at it, I shall post it again!

From the the 5+1 jamie falling asleep pavlovian fic:

New Wembley looked fucking gorgeous, his dad's mates kept saying.

In the back of his head Jamie agreed with them but it was a distant thought. Deep into stoppage time, Chelsea wrestled for possession, and with his heart in his throat Jamie watched slack-jawed as Chelsea gained possession, #6 taking off on a breakaway that looked more like a warpath as he tore up the grass running down the pitch.

Roy Kent's a demon on two legs. That's what his attacking coach at the academy said, scoffing at Jamie's form as he elbowed his way up from a rough tackle. He'd snap you in half like a twig if you that indecisive in a challenge. You need to be more aggressive, Tartt.

Jamie was at least a head shorter than Hammond, easy; he hadn't had a growth spurt yet like him or any of the other boys in his year had. He had to make up for it somehow.

He had to play more like Roy Kent.

Amateurs, the word crossed Jamie’s mind as the defense crowded Kent. Never let Kent feint left. You got to take out his dominant leg while he's on the inside.

Kent reared back his leg like a battering ram.

He barely tapped the ball.

The goalie was too fast. He sailed through the air, and the ball rolled smoothly into the net over the patch of grass where he'd just stood.

The crowd at Wembley screamed.

Jamie lurched forward with an ecstatic, “Yes!”

Remembered where he was too late, didn't he?

Mum was always on him for getting too distracted. Because he wasn't on actually on the pitch, was he? He wasn't at Wembley, one face in a singing crowd chanting, 'He's here, he's there, he's every-fucking-where.'

Jamie Tartt wasn't anywhere; Jamie Tartt was at his dad's flat in Manchester, with his dad and his dad's mates crowded around drinking cheap beer and wearing sky blue, and Jamie's skin prickled under the sudden chill in the air as they turned to look at him.

He fucked up bad. He fucked up bad.

[fanficfanattic]

Def good insights here. I understand Isaac being mad, because it is a human response. But him having the opportunity to take that anger out on Jamie, and then taking said opportunity? And then bringing others in to abusing the situation? Was not his best moment.

But that is one of the things I find interesting (and unbearable) is that Jamie coming back has made him into an easy target for anger and mockery. And his position feeling tenuous plus wanting to be accepted means he just takes it. Without any complaint at any time in the next 1.5 seasons.

It’s almost like he’d been trained from a young age to allow himself to be berated and belittled. Without hitting back. And had to find a way to move forward despite the extra hurdles.

And boy does that make me sad. Even when he is embraced and part of the team family. People will revert back to punching bag/scapegoat Jamie. And he allows it as though it is a service he is providing.

Another Ted Lasso, Jamirle Tartt obersvation. And there might be a few as I rewatch and blog my thoughts out there, because I love Jamie and his arc.

In season 2, when he comes back, it is his first time back in the locker room. He steps up and apologises, and the team pretty much tell him all that he needs to apologise for and why they dont like him pr want him back. And to be fair, most of them were valid reasons and things he should apologize for cause he was a prick. Like calling Colin a worm, or hitting on Bumbercatch's mum in front of his dad (even if that is a little funny And he probs meant nothing by as flirting and shwoing off, that's just his personality).

But the part that seems really unfair to me is that Issac blames him for getting them regulated, and the whole team jumps in to agree. And shout at him for it.

Yeah, Jamie didn't do anything wrong in that scenario, and he doesn't owe any apology to anyone for that. His a professional football player, and his job is to play the best he can for his team. His team was Manchester City at that time. He owed it to his team mates, coaches and the fans to give a 100%. He didn't get you regulated. Your season performance did.

I get it felt personal and maybe he took some joy in it. (I don't blame him for that eithier, from Jamie's perspective, (which is a separate post I want to make as I think his season 1 storyline is a completly differnt story in his eyes.) He got pubically benched for not being a team player, told to man up and get over himself, he did that and shared personal information and tried to buy into the Lasso way, only to get told the next morning he was getting sent back to Man City. We know it wasn't Ted who did that, but he doesn't. To him, he did what was asked and then got sent away anyway. If I was him I would want some instant caramel too.) and I mean my team I go for has lost a final in over time, after the siren to a free kick and I don't have a lot of love for the player from the other team who did it cause that hurt to watch but I don't blame the player.

So yeah, Jamie owes apologies, and I get the 5eam aint thrilled to have him back at the beginning, but no one should have made him feel bad for the Manchester City game. Jamie also didn't hurt Roy in that game. Roy hurt himself in a legal tackle. Jamie did nothing wrong that game.

[lunar-years]

do you have any hurt/comfort jamie fic recs? looking for physical injury in particular, but i’m a sucker for emotional hurt/comfort too :)

of course! here u go

Gen -

held onto hope (like a noose, like a rope) by scarlettroses - tw James Tartt Sr. abuse; emotional hurt/comfort and it's heavy but it's so good! Jamie's dad is very ill and Roy & Keeley etc. help him through that.

My troubles are all over, and I am at home by Vamillepudding - tw James Tartt Sr./canon-typical abuse; canon divergence where Roy sees Jamie and his dad in the boot room during the season one finale, instead of Ted

The Hedgehog's Dilemma by @kvetchinglyneurotic - tw James Tartt Sr./canon typical abuse; season one canon divergence where Jamie's dad calls him and insists he come up to Manchester, right after Jamie got benched. Roy worries about where he's at and then we go on a fun speedrun of character development & friendship :)

every emotion that i'm meant to express by @babytarttdoodoo : Jamie has a panic attack during Mom City and Roy & Keeley help him through

Lemons and Lavender by LivingProof - tw James Tartt Sr.; a car accident puts Jamie in the hospital, his dad comes to see him but luckily Roy and Ted are close behind

Roy/Jamie -

I Get By With a Little Help by @belmottetower - tw rape facilitated by James Tartt Sr.; Jamie rape recovery hurt/comfort with, as the tags imply, much more comfort than hurt. There is also a second part with even more comfort :)

Somethin' Stupid by @catalogercas - appendicitis on the bus to an away game! oh no! Not yet complete but chapter 2 of 3 was posted today and it is amazing.

Falling Up by @catalogercas - amnesia!Jamie. all that from doing headers with Phoebe :( it's not super angsty and in fact is very cute. Jamie even meets the yoga mums in the funniest way. incredible content.

i watched the world without knowing what to look for by buckstiel -future fic about the injury that ends Jamie's career

Roy/Jamie/Keeley -

the body of someone you love by @goodmorninglovelies42 - Jamie gets into a minor car accident and needs stitches, Roy does not handle this well

Love Me For Who I Am (Where I Am) by pepperlandgirl4 - Jamie is injured during a match and it results in temporary amnesia shortly after rjk all get together

Chase All The Ghosts From Your Head by @valonia47 - tw for implied homophobia; Jamie is beat up by a crazy City fan at a nightclub with plenty of comfort afterwards from Roy, Keeley & his mum <3

bruised like violets by inlovewithnight - tw stalkers/kidnapping - Jamie gets abducted and it's very scary for everyone involved... but luckily there is a happy ending and lots of comfort! :)

the blood in your mouth, I wish it was mine by inlovewithnight - tw non-con, Rupert Mannion; I feel like i put this on every rec list lmao but i truly do love it. very dark but the rjk comfort is sooooo my everything

they threw me a whirlwild and I spat back the sea by inlovewithnight - tw abuse/semi-graphic description of hand injury; James Tartt Sr.'s mates pay Jamie a visit, Jamie calls Keeley (and by extension, Roy) to help get him to the hospital

no amount of coffee, no amount of crying by shampoobaby - allergies!! classic sickfic, Jamie has hay fever :( poor bb

P.S. If you are one of these authors and I have not tagged your tumblr it simply means I do not know it, but please drop me a comment or message if you'd like and I will update the list with your blog accordingly :)

[goodmorninglovelies42]

My least favorite take is that the story of Jamie’s dad is about substance abuse. It’s not. Addiction is a disease. At least in the US it’s classified as substance use disorder. And it’s a treatable condition that should be viewed as a public health matter and not a moral matter.

But that’s not the issue with James Tartt, Sr. The issue with James is that he’s abusive — physically, emotionally, and sexually — towards Jamie. Now, maybe that is exacerbated by substance use, particularly alcohol. But that doesn’t fully explain or excuse behavior.

And again, I believe that people can change. No matter how old they are or what horrible things they’ve done. And I believe that *societally* those people deserve second chances. But believing both of those things doesn’t require that the the *individual* they harmed extend forgiveness. Those are complex and individual choices.

The show implies that James Tartt Sr. is in rehab. And I think that’s great. People should absolutely get the medical treatment they need (AA isn’t evidence based, btw, but that’s a discussion for another day). But getting treatment for substance use disorder doesn’t automatically fix the behaviors he engaged in, even while under the influence. And me saying that doesn’t mean I’m demonizing people with substance use disorder.

[fanficfanattic]

Gotta poll below for the Family Curse fic. But first! Background:

Jamie says he’s injured, he is, Ted yells at him, but before he can go do cones Nate runs in saying a baby appeared in the middle of the pitch out of nowhere. Ted & Beard assume he just somehow missed seeing the baby when he first went out, which, rude.

But Jamie asks if the baby is in a Man City onesie, hole in the shoulder? And Nate was like “How would I know that?” Which is when Jamie realizes that Nate didn’t bring the baby inside!

Roy is convinced this is some elaborate prank or revenge or something on Jamie’s part. Which Jamie is confused about. How is a magic baby either of those things? But more importantly, he’s saying the baby is him. One day after his first birthday.

See, his family is cursed:

At some point in their lives, they get haunted by their past selves. First day is the day after their first birthday, second the day after their second birthday, etc. Until they catch up to their nearest passed birthday.

Each generation has the mysterious day it shows up happen earlier and earlier. No one can figure out what triggers it. But the rules are always the same. 12:01 clicks over and your past self appears at your home. In the room that you are and with no one else present.

Jamie’s past self appears by 10:01 and at Nelson Road. On the pitch, in front of Nate, and now he’s told 30 some people what had otherwise been a secret his family has always taken to the grave.

So I have to figure out the actually injure reveal.

1) One idea is that the skeptical Roy “it’s a trick!” can easily be addressed. If the baby has the same birthmark on his lower back that Jamie does, same person. It’s only when he’s unzipped his jacket (no shirt under it) that he remembers why he wasn’t planning to train today. But it’s too late, the bruises on his body are now very obvious.

2) My second idea is that Georgie and Simon show up to help the first few days. So the lads are on the pitch doing drills and Jamie is holding Baby Jamie on the sidelines. Simon gets to him first because Keeley had greeted him and Georgie at the front of the building. They were jump hugging and screaming so Rebecca lead him out to the pitch.

When Georgie gets out on the grass she shouts her customary “JAMIE!” And he hands the baby off to Simon so he can catch her up when she throws herself at him for the hug. Ted is even treated to Simon’s commentary about “here they go again”. Except Jamie screams fuck and clutches his ribs.

He explains with all the excitement he’d kind of forgotten the ribs. But he’s all right. And she unzips his jacket right then and makes Simon come check him over. (This Simon is an EMS lol).

[fanficfanattic]

Every part of this reads as very, very James Tartt Sr.

The fucking coward.

Final Round: Jamie + standing up for himself

Late again, but here is my fill for Whumptober day 3! I used the alternate again, "brass knuckles". Warning for James Tartt Sr, some semi-graphic violence, and tooth injury. Also it's technically speaking Hurt No Comfort, but only because the Comfort is imminent rather than on-page. Roy's on his way as we fucking speak.

Summary: Jamie doesn't just fight back this time. He wins.

Read on AO3 ->

@vigilanteavengerqueen @halinski @fanficfanattic @izzyspinkytoe @nerdyglassescheeseychick @princess-charmingx

Sign up here to be tagged when I post Ted Lasso fic.

[antitheticallyargumentative]

Hi! I would very much love to hear the entire long rant about Ted and Jamie’s relationship!

I love you for indulging me.

A little disclaimer that I in no way hate Ted. I love him. He has good intentions. He's just a flawed human with a lot of his own baggage that hinders him from actually being able to objectively see Jamie's situation for what it is. And that leads to him offering shit advice. He seriously fucked up when it came to Jamie, (in my opinion), even if his heart was in the right place. So here we go.

TW- mentions of mental health issues, canonical suicide, and abuse and trauma

The way I see it, there are several things happening here. 1) Ted sees Jamie as a surrogate son-figure, because he misses his own son and Jamie is a little bit wayward and lacking his own father-figure, and that activates Ted's savior-complex-I-can-fix-him ways. 2) Ted sees Jamie as a little part of himself- his own inner child. The sixteen year old boy who brutally lost his own dad and never worked through the grief. 3) Jamie sees Ted, at least a bit, as a form of father figure, in the way that he both wants his approval and is innately distrustful of him. (Mind games.)

The problem then lies in the fact that Jamie is not truly either of these things that Ted sees him as, and Ted cannot be a healthy male figure for Jamie because he has too much of his own shit to work through, first. And Jamie also has his own.

I think that, at his core, Jamie wants to be a good person. His time at Richmond has seen him growing into one, and in his head I think he at least partially equates that to Ted's influence. So he wants to stay in Ted's good graces, because like he's said he never got a lot of support from older male figures, and that's clearly something he craves. He wants Ted's approval, but there's also the fact that Ted has left him during confrontations with his dad twice, and in Jamie's eyes, sent him away to Manchester City right after he started trying. Need for approval paired with feeling like he's walking a very fragile line and can't quite trust anything about his relationship with Ted to stay safe.

Ted holds onto a desperate need to fix things. When you see someone hurt themselves, or lose them to mental illness, it's traumatic. It makes you wonder if you could have, should have, done more. Seen it coming. If you could have stopped it. Ted said to Dr. Sharon that “I wasn’t ever gonna let anyone get by me without understanding that they might be hurting inside.” So now he walks through life trying to make sure everybody stays OK, except for himself. And you can't do that. It's not healthy. So when he sees Jamie, this twenty-something-year-old kid with a fucked up relationship with his dad, Ted can't see it clearly. He's so caught up in his own father-related trauma that he projects that onto Jamie. He gives Jamie the advice that he means for himself. Ted needs to forgive his father, so that he can process the grief and the trauma and move forward. Ted needs to give that to himself. But that is incredibly dangerous advice to give someone who's father is clearly shown to be emotionally and physically abusive.

Ted and Jamie both have a lot of father-related trauma. But their situations are not at all applicable to each other, it's just that Ted can't see that because he hasn't worked through any of his own issues. Which leads to complicated relationships and shitty, dangerous advice. There we go.

Woo! That was long.

[writer-and-thrasher]

Blending In (Now Complete!)

Chapters: 6/6 Fandom: Ted Lasso (TV) Rating: Teen and Up Audiences Warnings: No Archive Warnings Apply Characters: Roy Kent, Jamie Tartt, Bex (Ted Lasso), Phoebe (Ted Lasso), Keeley Jones, Rebecca Welton, Georgie | Jamie Tartt's Mother, Will Kitman Additional Tags: Pre-Relationship, Feelings Realization, Make-up, Post-Canon, Fluff, Mostly Fluff, Last Chapter will be a bit angsty, Warning: James Tartt Sr., Mentioned James Tartt Sr., Referenced Violence, The Author Does Not Wear Make-Up, 5+1 Things, Light Angst, Angst, Hurt/Comfort, Implied/Referenced Child Abuse

Summary:

Quickly, he grabs the contour stick from her bag, getting to work. He’s done Bex’s make-up before, way back before he dated Keeley and they were just blowing off some steam, and he knows she usually goes for a more feminine look. Jamie, however, is plenty familiar with more masculine contouring and begins to trace out straight lines around the edges of her face.

Or, 5 times Jamie does someone else's make-up and 1 time he does his own.

---

It's done!! This is my first ever completed multi-chapter fic, and I'm so so proud of it. Hope y'all enjoy!

[scintillatingshortgirl19]

I want to clarify something re: my issues with the James Tartt storyline.

I've been seeing a lot of posts and comments talking about how everyone deserves a shot at redemption and that that should not mean "everyone but James and Rupert" - and I want to say I think those posts are absolutely correct. As a lifelong villain fan I actually have massive, massive issues with the concept of any fictional character being considered by fandom to be truly "irredeemable" (especially since that line seems to be different for every single person), and I often hate the ideas fandoms tend to pass around about what fictional characters do or do not "deserve," so I want to make it clear that my issues with James' implied redemption have absolutely nothing to do with whether or not I think he deserves it. I strongly believe addiction is a disease and that everyone - even abusive, terrible people - should get the chance to change. This is especially true of fictional characters, since exploring concepts of second chances and redemptions within a story doesn't pose any risks to real-life people.

That said, these are the reasons why I think this whole thing was absolutely terrible from a storytelling perspective.

There are stories that are served well by canon leaving some things offscreen and letting the viewer fill in the blanks, but I don't think that's remotely the case here. To do this story justice, they needed to give it time. They needed to give it at least a modicum of buildup. They needed to show us this journey, rather than just telling us about it in a brief, sunlight-doused clip and saying "be happy about this, damn it!" Seeing them happy and smiling together is an enormous leap that should've taken much longer to get to than the show implies, and as a result it feels extremely jarring. Jamie reconnecting with his dad is an incredibly messy and complex storyline that needed to develop over time, and it was a huge mistake to just gloss over it like the writers did.

Show me James hitting rock bottom and how he ended up in rehab. Show me Jamie's conflicted feelings about reconnecting with him. Show me Jamie coming to an understanding that not reconnecting with his dad is also a perfectly valid option, and that letting go of his fear of and anger at James is not dependent on Jamie giving James any more of his time or energy. Show me Jamie being fully, actively aware that no matter what he chooses, letting James back into his life is not necessary for Jamie to move forward and grow as a person. Show me Jamie putting up boundaries to protect himself throughout this process - physically and emotionally. Show me James getting to know his son as an actual person and not just an object to use for his own selfish ends. Show me the emotional journey of this father, ravaged by addiction and his own unprocessed trauma, learning how to love and take a genuine interest in his son for perhaps the first time ever. Show me Jamie talking to his friends about this and getting their opinions and support. Show me Jamie having sessions with Dr. Sharon so I know he isn't undertaking this journey without therapeutic guidance.

You could make the argument that all of the above is implied, and you'd probably be right. But at the end of the day, I maintain that this father and son journey needed to be given actual screentime - especially because James' abuse of Jamie was given so much screentime, not to mention the additional bomb that was dropped on us in Sunflowers about what James did to Jamie when he was fourteen (and then was never brought up again, leaving me to assume Jamie still has yet to even realize that that was an instance of sexual assault). James verbally, emotionally, and physically abused Jamie for years, and the story did not shy away from showing us the effects of that. The story of Jamie reconnecting with this man should have been a half-season arc at minimum, and they had no business showing us that without also showing us Jamie processing the trauma they told us about in Sunflowers.

And it's frustrating because the more I think about it, the more I love the idea of a story centered around a son and his abusive father reconnecting and the messiness of that father trying to become a better person and heal from addiction and the complexity of that son trying to reconcile his love for his dad with his need to fully recognize and process what was done to him. I would love an exploration of James' past - maybe his dad took him to a red light district when he was 14, too. Maybe that was all he knew, and he certainly hasn't processed his own trauma, so of course he did the same thing to his own son. Maybe the cycle of abuse goes back generations and generations, and James and Jamie BOTH get to break it, not just Jamie (although that could only be true for James in a fairly limited sense, considering the permanent damage he did to Jamie cannot be undone). Anyway, my point is that it all has the potential to be so, so compelling - but the way they executed it just felt so oversimplified and rushed and cheap, and also sent some really problematic messages.

Tl;dr: I do genuinely think that, given proper time to develop it, there could've been a way to do this story well. This was not it.

[liesmyth]

Yeah, I mean, you can take it that way if you want. But Jamie says that 1) his parents split up when he was very young 2) his mother got him into football (and didn't care how he played) 3) his dad "started showing up" when he got good.

Like, having seen James I struggle to believe James would care about his primary-school-aged son, especially as we know for a fact that he wasn't involved in Jamie's budding football career. Having seen Georgie, I struggle even more to believe Georgie would let any overnights happen when Jamie was a child tbh, because there's no way a man who walked out on his toddler kid would retain custody.

With everything we've seen in canon, from the house Jamie grew up in (that's a boy who was cherished growing up!) to the way he smiles fondly at those exuberant, mouthy estate kids (that was 100% Jamie as a child) to the way he acts and behaves (bounces back, emotionally resilient, fundamentally happy person with healthy self-worth and a solid work ethic) - IMO none of this points to "Jamie was around his abusive dad as a child" beyond the fact that canon doesn't go out of its way to explicitly say it didn't happen.

icon what’s the fanon jamie grievance…. I love your take on him so much, i’m so curious lol

Ok, disclaimer that I'm not vagueing @ anyone specific with this, just a general trend I've noticed.

The TLDR is that Jamie gets the over-the-top woobie treatment, an old fandom tradition wherein you have a special guy and he HAS to be the saddest guy ever. This is fine! It's yummy! BUT it's a very liberal interpretation of what we're actually shown in canon, and I hate that it's treated like the assumed default.

This goes for a lot of things—for example: nobody around Jamie thinks that he’s thick or slow and Jamie sure as hell doesn’t think so!—but the biggest offender TO ME is that Jamie’s dad wasn’t around during Jamie’s childhood. Period. We’ve known this since S1! His dad left when he was very young and only showed up once Jamie “got good” enough that he was a serious prospect for a professional career and gave James clout and bragging rights and access to his favourite club. (So, not as soon as he got scouted, because so many boys get cut. We're talking England U16 at the earliest.)

Broadly… there’s kind of a tendency in fandom to give Jamie, like, some kind of Dickensian orphan backstory. Like James should define him, when he's just one (1) piece of a much broader mosaic.

Jamie is so many things. He’s remarkably well-adjusted, emotionally open, he IS a prick, he has a very healthy self-esteem and a very solid perception of his own self-worth. He is a hard worker who enjoys a good night out, he's a competitive elite athlete who doesn't wallow in self-pity (cough. Roy)—and he also has a shit dad, but it isn't THE thing that defines him. He's much more complicated than that! There were many more influences in his life than just his dad’s sporadic presence!

Again we’ve known since S1 that his mother was the one who got him into football! I guarantee that he's had some good coaches before Ted, as well as a normal amount of mediocre ones. He’s had friends before Richmond and girlfriends before Keeley, even if it wasn't serious. He's had teammates he liked and a team he was happy to be on. He just… had a more varied life than just overwhelming misery.

Personally, I find all of this way more compelling than if he’d “just” had a sadfest sort of background. Some people don’t, and that’s great! Some people like different things for their faves. Some people project a lot on their blorbos. All of this is fine and it can be super fun, but it bugs the hell out of me when it’s treated like a general assumption— again, it’s totally cool if you want it to be like this! We all let headcanons colour an interpretation, I sure as hell do that. Buuut there's a difference between "this interpretation is a bit far fetched but I don't care because it's fun TO ME" and "no actually THIS is how it is even if canon disagrees".

Follow-up ask answered here

[leeofthestone]

How differently would we feel about Ted’s final piece of advice to Jamie if, instead of the word “forgive”, he’d used the word “accept”?

Just accept him vs just forgive him.

By accepting that his dad is who he is, Jamie can let go of trying to change him, of wishing he were different. “Forgive” implies not only acceptance, but also reconciliation. The latter is the dangerous part when dealing with an abuser like James Tartt.