#i will smeagol here for the evening

[harmcityherald]

no. I am mid century mfer all the way. I'm staying right here in the manor in 1970 with my wood paneling and matching dinner plates. forever. yes.

[sunriseverse]

can’t wait for ef to come out and just continue drawing the characters the way they are in my head rather than as their la actors. i will not see it <3

[were-wolverine]

batfam as new girl quotes

steph: where are you, tim? this place is fancy and i don’t know which fork to kill myself with.

***

dick (16 y/o): i’ll take you through the whole thing. i’ll be like your guide.

jason (13 y/o): like gandalf through middle-earth?

dick: ok, first of all, let’s take the Lord of the Rings references and put them in a deep, dark cave where no one will ever find them.

jason: except smeagol. he lives in a cave.

***

tim: you text me “happy monday.” what am i supposed to do with that?

damian: oh, i don’t know. maybe have a happy monday?

(he’s trying to be nice)

***

jason: would you consider us adorable?

dick: no! we’re adult men.

dick: we’re cute.

***

cass: you always see the worst in people.

damian: yeah, because people are the worst!

***

steph: i mean, bruce, we love you, but…

steph: but you’re not a man of the people.

bruce: of course i’m not a man of the people. i’m above the people.

***

cass: we’re a family. families talk about things.

jason: no, families ignore things until they go away.

***

new parent bruce: dick, do you want to go to sleep?

9 y/o dick: no way.

bruce: if you do, i’ll write you a check for $6,000.

***

duke: what are you doing in here?

tim: eating cookies and avoiding confrontation.

(in the bathroom at a gala)

***

steph: jason, come on, that’s like the president and the vice president not being best friends.

jason: they’re not best friends.

steph: come on. everybody knows they’re best friends.

***

dick: i’m in love!

damian: titus, clear my schedule. i need a word with our brother.

***

steph: duke, those shoes are not brown! they’re green!

duke: you guys are idiots! they’re as brown as money.

cass: what color is kermit the frog?

duke: brown! he’s a brown frog.

tim: duke! you’re color blind, dude.

***

bruce: darn it! has anyone seen my croquet cleats?

***

tim: hey guys, do you think i’m a good person?

steph: you’re a terrible person. it’s hilarious.

***

dick: i’m very quick on my… uh…

jason: did you just forget the word ‘feet’?

dick: feet, yeah.

(he’s been awake for 72 hours without sleep)

***

duke: i can’t believe i didn’t notice this before but damian, you are legitimately crazy.

damian: i think we’re all a little bit crazy, don’t you, thomas?

duke: no, i mean, you’re like aging ballerina, child chess prodigy, professional magician crazy.

damian: it’s my grandfather’s fault.

duke: yeah okay fair enough

***

tim: if i was doing something stupid, you definitely would be involved.

dick: yeah, you’re damn right i would be. and i would probably be there to make it even stupider.

***

bruce: has anyone seen my good pea coat?

***

steph: i brake for birds. i rock a lot of polka dots. i have touched glitter in the last 24 hours!

steph: and that doesn’t mean i’m not smart and tough and strong.

***

jason: are you insane, bruce? we’re not ready.

jason: that’s like taking a musical from rehearsals straight to broadway. you got to workshop it first.

(pushing the theatre kid jason agenda)

***

dick: you realize i say goodnight to you every night and you never say goodnight back?

dick: what is the problem, jason? do you not want me to have a good night?

jason: oh my god you’re so overdramatic

***

tim: please don’t mistake my measured blank tone for calmness, as i am filled with waters of rage.

(he’s at a gala)

***

bruce: damn it! i can’t find my driving moccasins anywhere!

***

duke: what a dumb idea.

duke: do it.

(he is an enabler)

[ineffectualdemon]

Hey remember when I said "you know I thought Sam was a bit mean to Smeagol/Gollum at first but then remembered that he canonically knows that Gollum ate babies and I have to admit I'd be Sam in that situation"

And people were like "no you don't UNDERSTAND there are deeper emotional and symbolic narrative things at play here. It's not about eating babies, Sam doesn't care about him eating babies. It's bigger than that"

And I'm just saying that Sam was a hobbit of the people. A simple down to earth hobbit

And narratively for Frodo there might be some deeper symbolism making him more tortured and needing to be nice to Smeagol/Gollum, but to Sam that guy ate babies and you don't like or trust people who eat babies

And like for having to hang out with a serial killer/baby eater Sam was being relatively chill!

But I am on team Sam with this because if Baby Eater Smythe joined my party and promised to guide us somewhere I would also be so distrustful and aggressive!

He's not even "no I won't eat babies anymore. I think that's bad" Gollum would still eat babies if they were available! He probably ate babies on the way there! He is objectively pro baby eating!

He's not sorry he ate babies and reflecting! He's just like "you have the nuke I want and since you could use it on me I'll play nice" like !!!!!

Frodo is busy being posh and artistic and tortured and being like "the narrative parallels between us are too much! If I knew about the Picture of Dorian Gray and Jekyll and Hyde I'd be making veiled references to them in my diary that I also do not have rn"

Like the guy is going through it. Like a 15 year old traumatised girl with the older boyfriend that she does not like and who treats her like trash but she thinks she deserves (she does not)

*cough*...okay anyway

Meanwhile Sam is just like "the creepy dude eats babies. Gandalf told Frodo he eats babies when I was 'trimming grass' why are we trusting a guy who eats babies? Frodo I love you but did your arts degree fail to teach you not to trust baby eaters? More importantly he tried to kill you. I was there. This sucks."

And he's RIGHT

TBC I like the story as it is as a story I'm just saying that if I was in Sam's place I would have been worse to the Baby Eater who tried to kill my QueerPlatonic Soulmate

[jessiarts]

Pumpkin Stencil Fundraising Game: Round 4!

So not only did we met our weekly fundraising goal last week , but in a surprise turn of events, we surpassed it- by a lot lol Meaning, you guys finally get your Gandalf Big Naturals pumpkin stencil! You can find the stencil for free download on my Ko-Fi

Also here are again the previous stencils you guys earned in past rounds

Again, all these stencils are available for free download on my Ko-Fi, under the "Free" section of my shop.

Alright, on to this week's goal:

For those unfamiliar- Welcome to Round FOUR of our fundraising game, where we're fundraising for this Verified GFM organized by Tasnim Alhamss (on line #663 of Operation Olive Branch's spreadsheet), who is raising to try and help evacuate the rest of her nieces and nephews (her sister's 3 children, as well as her brother's 3 daughters) from Rafah. And in exchange for meeting these weekly fundraising goals I make free pumpkin carving stencils for you guys based on whichever fandom character wins the poll below!

This week our goal is to increase the amount currently raised from £33,511 to £33,600 by Friday, Oct. 4th. That's less than £100 pounds- I have no doubt we can do it!!!

How can you participate?

If you vote in the poll, please also reblog this post so it can reach more people

If you are able, donate to the GFM linked above (even just $5 helps so much!)

If you can't donate, don't underestimate the power a reblog can have to help meet this goal!

Like this post so you can find it later and track the progress!

Now it's time to vote on what stencil you want me to create when we complete this goal!

Again, I ask that if you vote in the poll to choose the stencil, please also reblog this post so it can reach more people!

I also just wanted to thank everyone whose reblogged these fundraising posts so much. Every dollar helps these children stay safe and gets this family that much closer to being able to evacuate, and every share makes it that much more likely that they'll meet their goal. So once again thank you to everyone who has been reblogging these posts!

Again, we can do this! I'll be updating this post as we go along to keep everyone updated on the progress!

Update: I realized I forgot to remind you guys that you're playing against TikTok. (To refresh the rules: Whichever opponent meets their goal first, and/or raises the most by the Oct 4th, wins an additional stencil!

Tumblr’s Progress bar: 11%

TikTok’s Progress bar: 76%

[novelmonger]

Continuing to watch through the Writer/Director commentary of LotR (with Peter Jackson, Philippa Boyens, and Fran Walsh) and jotting down any new-to-me information I come across. Here's what I gleaned from TTT:

When they got the New Line logo to put on the movies, it was very old and scratched, so PJ gave it to Weta to touch it up. They joked about how they should bill New Line for it XD

Originally, the studio wanted TTT to start off with a prologue too, with Cate Blanchett narrating what sounds like it was basically going to be a "Previously on..." spiel, even though they didn't like the idea of the prologue in the first one. Thankfully, these three ignored the studio's advice both times XD

The Uruk who says "Manflesh" is also the guy in Sauron's armor in the prologue!

In the scene where the Rohirrim find Theodred, it's not actually raining! They used rain towers for the close-ups, but any wide shots just have CG rain. I would never have guessed!

Andy Serkis did the voices for the Uruk-Hai who says the "maggoty bread" line, and the orc who says, "Yeah, why can't we have some meat?" (The actor in the suit for the latter is, of course, Jed Brophy, who went on to play Nori in the Hobbit movies.)

Somehow it never registered for me that Orlando Bloom has brown eyes, and so he had to wear blue contacts when he played Legolas ^^' But sometimes he wasn't able to wear the contacts (or forgot), so there are some scenes where they had to fix it in post.

PJ called the Treebeard from the animated Bakshi movie "a walking carrot" XD He also said that Treebeard is his favorite character!

The scene with Smeagol killing Deagol was originally going to be a flashback right after Frodo says his name, and then the Nazgul shriek would pull the audience out of the flashback. They decided not to do that for pacing reasons and because we haven't spent much time with Gollum yet, so that's why they put it at the beginning of RotK instead.

Bernard Hill had his son with him on the shoot and would play with him in his downtime on the Edoras set. Puts things into perspective when you hear that he was the one who came up with the line "No parent should have to bury their child."

They were originally looking at Bernard Hill for Gandalf! (I feel like I've probably heard this before, but anyway.)

They filmed a flashback to Aragorn and Arwen's first meeting?! Viggo shaved to make himself look younger, and it was a scene of the two of them "frolicking about the forest." It was originally going to be put in the Lothlorien sequence, but they cut it out in favor of that scene between Aragorn and Boromir, because they decided it was more important to earn Boromir's death scene than to remind the audience of the romance. I agree with that decision, but it would be cool to see that footage! (I say as someone who prefers to skip the TTT Aragorn/Arwen scene entirely XD)

Originally, the warg battle was going to happen at Edoras itself. It was going to be at night, everything was going to be on fire, and ultimately that was going to be the reason everyone evacuated and went to Helm's Deep. Also, a warg was going to be set on fire and end up dragging Aragorn through the streets, and that was going to be how Aragorn would be left for dead. Ultimately, the reason they did it the way they did was because the studio wasn't sure Weta could do a flaming warg (something all three of them laughed about, considering everything Weta did manage to do with flying colors), and because it would have been a nightmare to light the Edoras set at night, because that location was so remote and so windy. Which is why every scene in Edoras takes place in the daytime!

In the scene where Faramir talks about his dream where he saw Boromir in the boat, you can see a sort of pinkish color in the water around Boromir's body. That's because the dye from his shirt (surcoat? idk) was leaking out into the water! XD

When Andy Serkis did ADR for the Forbidden Pool scene, he couldn't manage to sing the song off-key, so they had to use the audio from the motion capture footage XD

They shot some additional footage of Aragorn unconscious on Brego's back, riding past an orc encampment, that they never ended up using.

Theoden was originally going to give a speech to the soldiers in the armory, but Bernard Hill's performance was so inspiring that it defused most of the tension they were trying to build up before the battle, so they took it out. Would love to see that footage!

So the boy Aragorn encourages before the battle ("There is always hope.") was Philippa Boyens' son, who was 13 when they filmed the scene. But by the time they went to do ADR, his voice had broken, so they had to get a different child actor to say his lines.

Aww, the extra who was missing an eye said he always felt self-conscious about his missing eye, so he always wore an eyepatch. But then after they gave him a close-up and the guy saw the movie, he said he felt much better about his appearance! :')

Treebeard's line "I always like going south; it feels like going downhill" was ad-libbed!

When Saruman turns and reacts to all the water pouring in and washing his machinery away, that shot was actually a reaction shot to Wormtongue on top of the tower from the RotK movie that they repurposed for this scene instead, since they hadn't shot any reactions to the flood.

At least at the time of the recording of this audio commentary, the final shot of Gollum, where he's arguing with himself and ultimately decides to lead Frodo and Sam to Shelob, was the longest CG shot in any movie. (I tried to google what the current record is, but couldn't find anything, so if anyone knows, I'd love to hear about it!)

Fran Walsh: "All cinema storytelling, to a degree, is shallow. That's the nature of the medium. You've got two or three hours to present a world and a dense story with a hundred themes and a ton of backstory, in this instance, and 22 characters...so you can only really have the veneer of depth. You really can't have anything that comes close to the depth of the books, or the experience of the books. So I think what we attempted to do was to use the language of the books where we could and to certainly invoke them, the iconic images, where we could, but to keep the storytelling very much...to modernize it, if you like, in terms of cinema language. So we didn't, for example, use the style of storytelling that was in the books between these different after-the-fact storytelling, of Sam and Frodo and then a chunk of the Aragorn story. We completely undercut it. That was a far more immediate and engaging way to connect it to the audience. You can't really hope to satisfy people who adore this book, with the movie. You can only ever give them the sense of what might have been. That's all a film can do. I think, in that sense, films...I mean, they're entertainments. They're just not going to give you the pleasure that a book can give you."

[thecalvinistkat]

Sonic Prime and Lord of the Rings: A Cross-Character analysis

So we all saw how Nine acted when he was hocked up on Prism energy…

that’s rough buddy

…but did anyone notice the similarities between him and the previous wielders of the Prism shards?

It reminded me a lot of Lord of the Rings, actually. The wielders of the Prism are so overcome, so intoxicated by the sinful energy that they cannot help but act irrational and ruthless.

And, if given the opportunity to hold on for too long, I’d imagine it might even become a Smeagol/Gollum situation. I mean, Dread was calling his shard “me beauty”— not all that far off from “my precious…”

I’m not saying that Nine and the others shouldn’t be held responsible for what wrong they did. But at least a part of them was acting under the maniacal influence of the Prism. I’m reminded of Paul’s words in Romans 7: 19-20:

“For I do not do the good I want, but the evil I do not want is what I keep on doing. Now if I do what I do not want, it is no longer I who do it, but sin that dwells within me.”

On an opposite note: Sonic’s willingness to sacrifice himself points to his purity and goodness, and is almost sort of maybe possibly absolutely reminiscent of martyrs and saviors such as Jesus. Now don’t confuse what I’m saying here. I’M NOT SAYING THAT SONIC IS HEDGEHOG JESUS, OK. Please don’t make Jesus the Hedgehog a thing.

(That will immediately reverse the redemption that Jesus gave you when he died for your sins /j)

What I am saying is that all good stories have a hero, and the writers have to get inspiration for that hero’s qualities from somewhere. J.R.R. Tolkien and C.S. Lewis both got their inspiration for their fantasy worlds (Hobbit/LOTR and Narnia, respectively) from the Bible’s story and message, so I don’t think that it’s a stretch to say that some of Sonic Prime’s heroic qualities are reminiscent of Biblical heroes.

After all, where better to get inspiration for a good savior than from the Ultimate Savior?

Sorry for the long post; here’s a Tails Chao

TLDR: Nine, Dread, and Thorn Rose were influenced by the sinful power of the Paradox Prism in the same way that Smeagol/Gollum was influenced by the sinful power of the Ring; Sonic’s heroic sacrifice is reminiscent of Jesus.

[fipindustries]

and while we are on the topic of dehumanizing, this reminds me of a shower thought i had the other day regarding harry potter.

yes, this is going to be yet another take about re-examining an element of that blasted series under a much more critical light now that i find the author to be a horrible person, but bear with me.

to my defense, i actually genuenly did thought this back when i was a kid reading these books, way before i knew anything about rowlings opinions on trans people, or indeed about trans people at all!

it always was a little weird to me those moments where dumbledore tries to stomp out of harry any inkling of empathy or mercy he might have towards voldemort.

i can think of three specific instances.

first instance is in book 6 when harry is feeling weary about the idea that he is predestined to kill voldemort because of a prophecy. dumbledore then exclaims something about how of course that harry has to kill voldemort, but not just because the prophecy says so, rather because of all the evil things he did that make him deserving of death. so harry thinks of all the crimes voldemort commited and he feels uplifted by what is descrived as "righteous anger"

the second instance is also in book 6, right after harry learns about the tragic story of voldemort's mom, where he actually feels kind of bad for her and asks why she had to die. to this dumbledore immediatly asks harry, almost incredulously "are you feeling pity for voldemort's mom?". to which harry instantly corrects himself and tries to spin it as somehow her fault for not using her magic to save herself and thus abandoning her baby.

then the third instance is near the end of the final book when they are at king's cross purgatory vision, where harry finds voldemort's mutilated soul, that looks like a wounded baby that was skinned alive and is desperatly crying. harry's first instinct is to want to help him but dumbledore steps in and is like "you should step away from that". when harry asks what is it dubledore is like "ignore the baby harry, he is beyond help". after a while, harry stops feeling sorry for the baby and he starts to find the baby's desperate cries of pain annoying.

so in here we see three instances where dumbledore's advice makes harry more callous towards voldemort.

and to be sure. voldemort is ontollogically evil. he is the devil. as evil as evil gets. kind of the whole point is that this is the uncomplicated fully evil villain against whom all scorn and harm and violence is morally justified.

not saying this is like the worst message ever. having absolute evil that has to be vanquished by any means and against whom is really not worth to waste time considering their humanity is like, normal everyday stuff. this is a children's story so is not aming for moral complexity here. but still, as a kid i was not used to seeing a child hero that was presented with a Hated Enemy that he was fully justified in killing no questions asked. even aang, who is told by every mentor he has to kill ozai, he at least struggles with the question. luke tries to redeem vader at every turn. frodo makes a genuine attempt at being nice to smeagol and lets saruman go after the take back the shire. superman never ever killed. and then comes harry, a child hero from a children's story and the message is "yeah some fuckers just need to fucking die, the end"

[yelmor-boots]

okay, so this is a beast of a post.

since i've officially watched all 'the hobbit' movies now (as well as 'lord of the rings'), here is my personal ranking of all the movies in a list.

LoTR: Two Towers

LoTR: Return of the King

LoTR: Fellowship of the Ring

Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey

Hobbit: Battle of Five Armies

Hobbit: Desolation of Smaug

i talk a lot about the movies under the cut ( i accidentally started rambling, whoops ) don't feel like you have to read it all but if you want my supper cluttered opinion, go ahead (spoilers btw)

favorite one overall is clearly 'Two Towers'. it follows three groups of characters in the best fucking way. (Aragorn, Gimli, Legolas | Samwise, Frodo, Smeagol/Gollum | Merry, Pippin) it's been a while since I watched this one but i would really love to rewatch it one day. (we rented this one so we don't have it anymore)

i initially had 'Return of the King' as #4 but i honestly can't rank it that low. everything about this one is perfect and it gave me and my sis some good fucking inside jokes. also aragorn and eowyn slayed imma be real

'An Unexpected Journey' almost came above 'Fellowship of the Ring' but then i remembered the other half of fellowship and i had to rank it higher. maybe i just love the lotr characters more, i dunno, but their journey impacted me more and had me more excited. also, 'one does not simply walk into mordor.'

'An Unexpected Journey' is the only one I've actually rewatched (even if it was only the beginning) solid movie, something old and charming to it. i did watch it when i was younger but i fell asleep multiple times and just caught tid bits of it, so going through it again i annoyed the piss out of my sis by yelling 'i know that part!' over and over again

'Battle of Five Armies' was structured really well. the fight scenes could not have gone any better. the elves, the dwarves, the orcs, all their different unique styles. solid three hours of fighting if you want that. (i would gush about this a little more but i would probably end up repeating myself a bunch and sounding more a mess than typical) ((also this is going on too long))

'Desolation of Smaug' by all intents and purposes should've been ranked higher. if something has a dragon, I'm gonna watch it. (i recently realized i had a not-so-secret love/obsession for dragons) and Smaug being that gold-obsessed dragon from storybooks gave him such an interesting twist and gave me a real appreciation for that trope and he looked really cool and he was probably my favorite part of the movie- (unfortunately i just had a bad experience watching the movie because i was being constantly interrupted to the point that i completely lost track for like two hours. but even with a rewatch, i probably wouldn't rank it higher, but i would definitely have more love for it than i currently do)

Favorite Characters

LoTR: Gimli (i can finally remember his name), Frodo (pathetic bitch, like me fr), Pippin (protect this tree-loving, goofy ass, bard at all costs)

Hobbit: (no character really stuck out to me in the way lotr characters did but these ones did stand out) Balin, Gandalf, Galadriel

and special shout out to:

aragorn (king, literally), legolas (especially from lotr where he's only quiet until he says some wise shit), smaug (big, fire kitty), galadriel (yes, again, i didn't think much of her until the hobbit but lowkey what the fuck, awesome, talented amazing, showstopping, hot as fu-what?), and eowyn (pick your head up queen, your crown is slipping)

and because i can't shut up and this is such an impeccable series

i couldn't pick one, so the two most impactful scenes for me was-

lotr: when the ring had been destroyed and frodo and sam are on the rock surrounded by lava. frodo is remembering everything about the shire and home and he probably finally feels normal again. they were also giving ship vibes, true, but their dynamic in that moment is also so special and i want to rope this into the end where he gives him the book before leaving and the ethereal lighting of it all is everything and-

hobbit: i wasn't too 'wowed' by thorin (he just doesn't match up to aragorn for me) but his character direction is something i can gab about on a later date (cuz i fucking love it dude) . other than that, he didn't touch me emotionally or anything. but holy fuck when the credit mucic started playing?? the song is 'the last goodbye' and i immediately thought of his death scene and the funeral of all of who passed and let me tell you, i have never teared up for movies or songs or stories but i got fucking close during that song man and that's gotta account for something (I've watched endgame with tony stark as my favorite character if that gives you any inclination how much that credit song fucked me up)

and lastly, my favorite songs

The Last Goodbye (this fucking song made me love thorin so much more and it also stole my lunch money, yes 911? i would like to report a crime-)

Edge of Night (wasn't expecting it, thought i'd hate it -because i get uncomfortable with characters singing in movies- fucking loved it, obsessed)

Misty Mountains Cold (had no reason to go so hard, jesus christ-)

I See Fire (i knew this song since i was a kid, never knew it was from the hobbit, got really excited when i heard it at the end of of desolation of smaug)

if you read this, you deserve a reward. but I'll settle for requesting you either reblog or comment with something about lotr/hobbit that you really love. like your favorite movie, character, scene, whichever. i'd love to see all the different things that was special to others (and it doesn't need to be as long as this, please, save yourself the stress)

[ach-sss-no]

SH liveblog ch 2 First chapter & explanation | Next chapter

Outwardly: dumbly, I shamble about, a thing that could never have been known as human, a thing whose shape is so alien a travesty that humanity becomes more obscene for the vague resemblance.

~ Harlan Ellison, I Have No Mouth And I Must Scream

I FORGOT I DID EPIGRAPHS!!!! Ooooh they're so pretentious!!! But so much fun! For me choosing them, anyway.

No, I did not include AM's hate pillar message anywhere. I should have.

Ah right this is the 'baby backstory' chapter. We're transported 500+ years into the past.

"What's that then?" she asked right away. "Did you steals something?

In retrospect I wish I had made her use verbs normally. Smeagol in the book speaks with standard grammar when he drops 'villain mode'.

The boys looked at each other for a moment. They steeled themselves up and said in unison: "[Sméagol's parents are] Both dead. Fire."

TBH I wish I had just. Made him a normal orphan with parents that died of the flu or something. This is too extra for my taste. I think I was trying to draw a thematic parallel to Frodo's parents mysteriously drowning, or just working in fire as a recurring theme but it's just too much. It's too edgy. I don't like it.

By the way, I looked up other people's Sméagolfic before writing this because I consider 'what other people are doing' to be a part of fanfic reasearch for various reasons (what do people know about the character, what do they expect to see, am I about to write the same story someone else has already written to the extent that it becomes awkward, etc) Multiple people had used a very similar thread of 'Sméagol's mother died giving birth to a non-surviving sister when he was about 5' and it was so similar I wondered if it might have been from a letter or something, but if it was, I never found a source. Fanon does tend to memetically spread.

Béagol had been a greedy idiot. He had married a crazy woman from the settlement just downstream, who would go from laughing to sobbing in the span of a minute and paddled around in the River in full skirts like a child. When asked why, he had said that her wide, pale eyes had moonlight in them.

I wish I had made Smeagol's mother be normal too. Just like a completely ordinary hobbit. I think I was hinting that some of Sméagol's seeming corruption comes from odd genetics out of a contrary desire to make it even more confusing where he stops and Precious ends, but it never goes anywhere.

Sméagol's mother is never named in this, but I privately named her Minnow. For her silver eyes, which look like a minnow's scales. See, there's a reason I didn't include that.

there was something particularly unpleasant sounding about 'Sméagol', and it meant 'someone who creeps into holes'

This is canonically the meaning of his name and I included it here because I wanted to make puns and allusions to it later without requiring the reader to have semi-obscure canon knowledge from the appendices. I could expect people to have paid that much attention for a Silm fic but not for Gollum.

He did not like being touched. He would not speak. After he was fed, he curled up on the floor and went to sleep. His hair was matted.

I understand the temptation to make Gollum a feral child but again. I kinda wish I had just had him be normal. But then again, maybe that's coming from my past fandom self, living through the era when every single thing that might be interesting or unusual about a character (whether an OC or a headcanon about an existing character) drew Mary Sue accusations.

Sméagol slept quietly on the floor. He looked sickly pale and filthy and just as bedraggled and tragic an orphan as you'd wish.

I think I was also trying to 'echo' his current predicament in the fic's canon timeline where he's once again needing to be adopted after becoming helpless and alone after a lot of traumatic incidents, some known and some that will be never known because Smeagol was the only witness and he can't communicate what happened. And I'm sorta trying to sell this muderhobo as sympathetic because oh look he was a baby once too! I still wish I'd had him just be normal.

Back to present day...

Gollum was weak yet, very weak. Men had to take care of him. They picked up Sméagol and moved him around like a poppet.

Gollum is sort of dealing with the discomfort of being reliant on others by mentally characterizing the men in Gondor as inhuman entities with no personal connection (at this point these are all big strong buff guys that can drop kick Gollum if he suddenly turns out to have been faking and ready for murder. Aragorn thought of everthing). I really, really wanted to avoid too much angst or hurt-comfort (this is NOT supposed to be a whump fic, just a fic where my protagonist needed a hard reset- batteries ejected, the works) but I think, realistically, Gollum should be experiencing more mental discomfort.

Although he is good at compartmentalizing and repression.

Gollum is being given a bath, which he is able to enjoy despite not really liking to be helped, because he likes water so much.

they wanted to scrub his skin, they said something about it having a 'residue' on it

Tolkien refers to Gollum as a small, slimy creature exactly once in passing. I don't think he meant that Gollum is coated in mucus like a frog, but he should have been more specific.

I did this because I thought it was funny and also to really push 'The worst ways that Gollum is inconvenient are not even his fault'.

"Does the Men like riddles?" he asked. "No," said one of the Men.

Here's a secret: I hate writing poetry of any kind and I hate every riddle I wrote for this fic. Let's politely ignore them all.

By the way I don't remember why I decided that no one in Gondor wants to play riddles with Gollum ever. I might have just thought it was funny.

Gollum is being given his bath in what's essentially a utility closet because he throws so much water around. I think I got better at logistics as the fic went on? It doesn't entirely make sense that Gollum is somewhere so public. It must be fairly public, because Merry and Pippin turn up because Pippin sees a random closed door and remarks on it. This leads to Gollum inviting him in because he's lonely for his own kind (although he's not aware of that and is just saying he wants to see a hobbit without noting why)

"So you're Gollum!" the more pitying one said. "We've heard a lot about you. My name is Meriadoc Brandybuck, but I'm always called Merry." Meriadoc! Now, that was a proper name, not a bit of nothing like 'Samwise'. "And our name is Sméagol," he said politely. "My name is Sméagol. Sméagol sounds nicer, eh, it does. Doesn't it?" "I suppose it does," said Merry, also quite polite, "I beg your pardon. Sméagol, then.

Interestingly, he never asks to be referred to as Smeagol in canon. I thought surely he would get tired of being called Gollum and say something eventualy, though.

They no longer kicks us into corners and says 'vile, horrid' when they sees Sméagol, now Sméagol is petted and given nice things and hobbits comes to say hello. Is he not so ugly and nasty anymore?" And, of course, the real question was, when would they revert to their former opinions of him and start kicking him into corners again?

I think his main arc for this fic ends up being learning to believe that this will not happen.

"Yes. Do you have a last name? While we are making introductions is a good time to tell us, if you do." "A last name?" "A family name," said Pippin. "No," said Gollum. "If we did we have losst it."

I considered assigning him a last name but eventually decided 1) his weird feral clan probably didn't use them 2) I did not want to be cheeky enough to rename a Tolkien character.

I was considering the name Muckpaddle if anyone is wondering (you weren't)

He did not know that he was expecting something to happen until it didn't happen- the little nudge at the back of his mind that sent an already sensitive temper absolutely raging over, over something or other, to smother to death the still small voice of I did something horrible that can never be undone, and perhaps to only exile me was an act of kindness. This nudge did not happen. He was left with only the knowledge that he had done wrong, and his natural inclination to self-pity. "We are bad, so we have no family," he said, "and, we are old, so very old they would have died by now anyhow, we guess, yes, even the littlest cousins... no family, no name... gollum!"

I don't know how much of him in the books is Ring and how much of it is just an unpleasant personality. I guess here I went with 'homicidal rage = Ring but whiny selfish baby = that's just him'

Merry is looking for noncontroversial topics of conversation so he asks about boats.

"They did not have any boat. We made ours," said Gollum. "Used to make them from reedses…

Tolkien said Sméagol's clan made reed boats.

Aha! He had known that if he stayed here long enough, someone would require something from him in return. Making a reed boat would be an easy enough task. "Of course!" he said. "Good Sméagol helps hobbits however he can. But hobbit musst give us reeds."

He would need more materials than just reeds but I either didn't know that or thought he would have forgotten or left it out.

Merry and Pippin leave, Gollum is taken away and put to bed in his room and left alone. Time passes.

Gollum wakes up with the intuitive knowledge that someone is lurking outside the door.

"O," he cried, "who is there?" This was a sure sign that he was getting spoiled, because he knew one ought never to alert a mysterious presence that one had caught on to it- orcs had given themselves away to him that way too often for him not to know better!

I don't think this is the first time that Gollum is musing on how to avoid a dangerous monster only to casually reveal that he was the monster.

Anyway it's Bilbo (and I'm not totally happy with some of his dialog in his scene, I think later Bilbo scenes are better. I've loved the character since I was a kid but it doesn't follow that his 'voice' is as easy to learn)

"Is this Baggins?" he asked. He was certain it was, but equally certain that it shouldn't be. How could Bilbo be here? Where had he come from?

This is another point where information cannot be conveyed to the reader because Gollum cannot know it; Bilbo is here (and is a little bit on the warpath) because he's just recently seen Frodo and been horrified at his condition and partially blames Gollum for it.

They banter a little (Bilbo is justifiably aggrieved, Gollum is lonely and helpless enough to put aside his grudge so he just kind of says whatever will keep the conversation going and avoids apologizing for anything) until-

"BILBO BAGGINS, WHAT ARE YOU DOING?" It was Gandalf!

I had not yet committed to making this fic a 100% serious and earnest project. If I wrote this chapter over again I would cut this My Immortal reference.

But I didn't cut it, and it's still here, and I have a certain fondness for it.

"As for you," said Gandalf, "asking riddles, of all things! I have quite by accident begun a research study- how far beyond a hobbit's natural lifespan must one live before he behaves like an adult? Bilbo has not managed it and neither will you. I wonder if another span of centuries would teach you good sense."

This is more anachronistic language than I would choose to use now. I confess I find it really amusing that everyone is just so offended that Gollum wants to play the riddle game. Even though it doesn't totally make sense?

The chapter ends there, Gandalf leaveds Gollum alone to think about what he's done

[princessfantaghiro]

I know there's still a lot of time... But I wonder... How Andy Serkis & Peter Jackson will lead the plot and the character of Gollum in "The Hunt for Gollum"? They both did an excellent work with Him in the Trylogy!

The Cursed/Fallen Hobbit is one of the most fascinating characters in Tolkien's legendarium.

In "The Lord of the Rings" we can see a huge difference between two different hobbits: Smeagol and Bilbo.

For Bilbo, the golden disc is basically a "cool gadget". A toy, used - I suspect - mainly for pranks. 😉 Or to hide so that he won't be disturbed by ppl when he needs it. In "The Fellowship of the Ring" Bilbo hums happily to himself, being invisible. The One Ring accompanied the Hobbit from Shire for many years, and "didn't do anything" to him...It gave him a very long life in return. Long enough that Bilbo started to get bored. He stopped enjoying it. [At least, his existence in Middle-earth.] Because we know that Valinor is a whole different story. 😉

I'll move on to the second Hobbit though.

Smeagol was ready to kill his friend for The One Ring, the very moment he saw it... Charmed by the beautiful object and the power of its Creator, he committed the crime.

This murder caused great suffering, and split his self in two. Next to the "good" Smeagol, appeared the "bad"- Gollum...

"They" - the two selves of the Hobbit; corrupted by his own darkness and greed, love and hate each other at the same time.

However, both love the "One Ring" above all else. [Or Sauron himself, who "is" the One Ring. Showrunners of Rings of Power admitted that already.] It became an absolute obsession for them. They only think about It. They only need It.

The One Ring stayed with "them" for 500 years. When Smeagol/Gollum loses it; Sauron orders to torture the crature to reveal who has it. Gollum talks the truth about Bilbo. And then Sauron orders his orcs to let the unfortunate Hobbit go free. The Dark Lord showed mercy to a creature that seemed so tiny, insignificant and miserable...

One creature, Gollum; that everyone is disgusted by. One that everyone is afraid to look at. One that the Lord of Darkness shouldn't even pay attention to. And here you go. Sauron, at the end of his corrupt and unimaginably long life, STILL CARE that such a Gollum lives and is free... Maybe this will annoy someone, but I like noticing such "little things"/flashes of light in "The Monster Called Sauron."

P.S. I think he liked it when Smeagol/Gollum adored him. They petted him, called him "My Precious"... 😉

PPS. I wonder if Sauron will appear in some form in "The Hunt for Gollum". I would really like to.

I won't get my hopes up for Charlie, but... heh. They don't punish for dreaming. "Not Yet". 😉

[frodo-with-glasses]

More Reading Thoughts: The Shadow of the Past

"The blame was mostly laid on Gandalf." Whatever you did, you've been officially labeled a Disturber of the Peace...

Something about "but the growth of hobbit-sense was not very noticeable" cracks me up

I love the fact that Frodo kept throwing birthday parties for Bilbo after he left. It's so sweet.

I would much rather go to Frodo’s Hundred-weight Feast than Bilbo’s Party of Special Magnificence, actually; twenty guests and several meals “at which it snowed food and rained drink” sounds much more my speed X-D

“Bilbo isn’t dead.” “Where is he then?” “🤷‍♂️”

F in the chat for Folco Boffin, who was mentioned like once in this chapter and never comes into the story again

"Merry and Pippin suspected that [Frodo] visited the Elves at times, as Bilbo had done." TEA???

Frodo's wandering in the autumn has such an evocative and melancholy feeling to it. So much so that I wrote a poem about it last year...

Part Two of me wishing the movies could have shown the Dwarves passing through the Shire on their way to the Blue Mountains

Sam be like "Dragons and Ents are real, I tell you!" and Ted Sandyman like "press X to doubt"

Our first glimpse of Sam's unassailable trust in Frodo and his wisdom 💚

And now! Exposition dumping, with Gandalf.

I hate the fact that I can't see or hear the word Eregion without getting war flashbacks to Amazon's Rings of Poopy

Ooh, remind me to write an essay about the invisibility power of the Ring(s)...

"[Bilbo] would certainly never have passed on to you anything that he thought would be a danger." Oh boy, would you look at the time, it's Crying About Adoptive Relationships O'clock

"'There wasn't any permanent harm done, was there?' asked Frodo anxiously. 'He would get all right in time, wouldn't he? Be able to rest in peace, I mean.'" OH BOY, WOULD YOU LOOK AT THE TIME—

Literally Gandalf: "Hobbits are my special interest"

"It is quite cool." It sure is, Gandalf. Wicked. Radical, even.

Low-hanging fruit, I know, but I had to 🤣

Speaking of low-hanging fruit, here's a joke I made two years ago about the "until Spring had passed into Winter" line:

He threw a luau barbecue one breezy summer night/Invited all his turtle pals to come and have a wiki bite/The turtles started walkin' there as Lance began to swing/The one that lived across the street arrived there in the spring...!

"I wish it need not have happened in my time." "So do I, and so do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us." Still a line that goes so, so hard, right in the middle of this exposition dump.

I like how in Gandalf's story, he makes Deagol talk normally, but Smeagol still has all those verbal idiosyncrasies that are iconic to Gollum.

I'm still trying to remember who it was that pointed out that the last syllable of Smeagol is the first syllable of Gollum. Blew my mind when I saw that, I tell ya.

"I can put it no plainer than by saying that Bilbo was meant to find the Ring, and not by its maker. In which case you also were meant to have it. And that may be an encouraging thought." "It is not." 🤣🤣🤣

The thought of Gollum creeping through a window to snatch a baby from a cradle and eat it is at least seventeen different kinds of Not Fun. Thanks, Tolkien.

I have very little to say about Gandalf's retelling of the Ring's story—and Frodo's frightened and naive questions—except that it's almost as hard to tear your eyes away from the book as it is for Frodo to throw the Ring into the fire.

"I do really wish to destroy it! Or, well, to have it destroyed. I am not made for perilous quests." Oh, Frodo, bby...

I love how Sam's spying is so artfully foreshadowed here X-D You just go whistling away down that path, buddy! Nobody suspects a thing!

All Frodo has to say is "I suppose I'll have to go running into danger alone to keep everything and everyone I love safe, even if it means never coming home again; it's a pity, but I'll do it" and Gandalf is like "Frodo have I mentioned lately how much I love you and hobbits in general". Which. Mood! Big mood!

SUDDENLY, SAMWISE GAMGEE!

Good gracious did I need Sam and his comic relief after this heavy chapter X-D Bless you, Sam, you loveable dummy

I wonder what hobbit idiom Tolkien "translated" into "Lor bless you, sir". I'm not sure the hobbits have a concept of Eru Illuvatar as a benevolent God who hands out blessings; and if they do, I somehow doubt they'd have quaint little figures of speech like this. But I'm just nitpicking at this point because it's fun.

"There ain't no eaves at Bag End, and that's a fact." SAM 🤣🤣

"Mr. Frodo, sir! Don't let him hurt me, sir! Don't let him turn me into anything unnatural! My old dad would take on so." Have I mentioned that I love the heck out of Sam?

Frodo is "hardly able to keep from laughing", which, MOOD!

Sam heard that Mr. Frodo was going away and audibly choked. GAH I love him so much

Frodo sure knows how to threaten Sam LOL

"If you even breathe a word of what you've heard here, then I hope Gandalf will turn you into a spotted toad and fill the garden full of grass-snakes." 🤣🤣

"'Me, sir!' cried Sam, springing up like a dog invited for a walk. 'Me go and see Elves and all! Hooray!' he shouted, and then burst into tears." Oh, Sam. I love you.

[mai-komagata]

rest of rings of power

here is what i think will happen in the rest of rings of power, season by season. (if they get renewed for 5 seasons). I'm deciding the show will end with Sauron being defeated by Isildur, and him refusing to destroy the ring. I think there might be an epilogue with him losing the ring/gollum finding it as a denoument/tying the hobbit plot to the main plot, but that would be the absolute latest the story would end. I will also buck the trend and think the destruction of Numenor won't happen in season 3, just so they can keep the characters/numenor around for as long as possible, so i think this will be in season 4. So brief outline:

Season 3: I think the main thing that needs to happen this season is Sauron needs to make the one ring. I don't think this will be the first thing that will happen. I think this might happen towards the latter half of the season, and all the fallout from that will wrap up the season. I think Durin becoming king, and how he deals with the dwarven rings will become a big plot point in this season. I hope he can reconnect with elrond as a result. Maybe we'll see dragons (but that might be a plot in later seasons, since there is not much else for the dwarves to do later). Sauron also needs to start doling out the rings for men. I think him meeting Kemen will happen and be a major relationship he will have this season. Maybe meet Theo too. I don't think Sauron will sail to Numenor, but maybe some of his rings will be shipped there. I think Gandalf will finally meet up with the elves and the main plot. What im curious is if they ever bring in Saruman. But i think Gandalf and the Elves meeting might be what these characters do. Maybe we get more elven lore like building Imladris and Lorien, or we meet up with the Silvan elves in Greenwood. Honestly dunno what the hobbits will do. I'm hoping they reconnect with their family and settle in the banks of the anduin. After the one ring gets made i expect some sort of telepathic confrontation with the elves, specifically Galadriel. And the numenoreans might notice something is up and come capture sauron. Season 4: Main plot will be Sauron in Numenor. I expect most of the plot will follow the Akallabeth. I expect Elendil and Isildur to come back to middle earth, and like, establish some sort of kingdom or settlement. Maybe they meet up with Gil Galad and the Elves. Maybe the Dwarves get attacked by Dragons at this point, maybe some of the rings get destroyed. The Elves will freak out a bit b/c they can no longer use the 3 rings. Galadriel's wounds might reappear -- maybe Gandalf will help her or something. This seems really light on things that happen, but i expect it will be a very numenor heavy season, since we won't see a lot of those actors after this, they will maximize their airtime. Season 5: Sauron comes back to middle earth, much worse for wear. I will assume they will give him a new form, even if it is not completely book accurate, I don't think he'll be a masked form all season. They might give him the adar treatment of "still hot, just scarred". I will expect him to start building some sort of deception/relationship with Elendil and Isildur. Especially after he lost Tar Miriel, maybe that is an avenue for reaching out to him. I feel given the tenor of the show, they will show them having some connection to sauron for the final confrontation to have emotional heft. Elves can use the rings again! but they can sense sauron isn't really gone, they just don't know what is up. If Cirdan hasn't given up his ring to Gandalf I expect they'll introduce this at some point. Ringwraiths come out in full force. Hobbits are doing some thing, maybe they introduce Smeagol to them somehow. Or maybe Nori will be his "grandmother" but he is born later or something. Things build up so the final battle will occur towards the end of the season. Everyone who is a main character still alive will be here somehow. lots of people die, it will be very sad.

Battle happens as expected, with Sauron shenanigans as to why Isildur decides not to destroy the ring. some denoument for everything else. Elrond finally gets his ring. Galadriel is in Lothlorien, at ease finally. One ring gets found by gollum. maybe sauron is a blob again. the end. -----

This is why the show hires actual professional writers, so things aren't as boring as what I'm describing, lol.

I expect the main relationships we'll see with Sauron are Kemen, Ar Pharazon and Isildur for each of the remaining seasons. Maybe Earien and Miriel in there, too. Honestly the main unknown i have is what they will do with the hobbits from here on out. Maybe they'll establish the beginnings of the shire, too. What plots/characters do people think I missed? Do people think some events will happen sooner or later?

[shirefantasies]

Why is Tolkien so charitable regarding Frodo's missteps? After all, Tolkien conveniently and entirely blames all of Frodo's missteps regarding his handling of the ring on the ring itself.  "I do not think Frodo's was a moral failure. At the last moment the pressure of the Ring would reach its maximum -- impossible, I should have said, for anyone to resist."- JRR Tolkien. One can't imagine him saying anything remotely like this about the others who tried to take the ring. It's only Frodo's actions that Tolkien excuses by saying that anyone in Frodo's position would have done the same thing.

Hi there! Not sure if this comes from dislike of the character or just Tolkien’s handling, but if it’s the former I know I have characters I wouldn’t want someone to push me to like so I for sure will be surprised but respectful if Frodo is a character you don’t enjoy. Having people try to change your mind can be exhausting and annoying lol, so this’ll focus on just how I take things in the story personally! I am by no means a huge Tolkien scholar, but here’s how I take that situation with the ring and some evidence for the points as I at least see them (with some general agreement from other fandom and analysis discussions and conventions with other LoTR fans as well!). Hope this is at least an interesting read and I’m pretty darn flattered you chose me to ask this to ☺️

1. The ring bears a heavy weight (literally) on everyone’s decisions interacting with it, but I’ve always taken the story and Tolkien’s words on it as a bit of commentary on the folly of man, and as a religious person the concept of original sin. I.E. that we as humans (men, hobbits, dwarves, and even elves included in this setting) are simply not perfect and cannot be. Part of that evidenced in quotes like that from Tolkien himself but also scenes where even characters seen as beacons of good, strength, wisdom, morals, etc. do show temptation by the ring or that it would turn good intentions to evil. Galadriel and Gandalf, for example, are some of the most powerful beings and they tell Frodo that they would become corrupt and misuse the power they already have and that of the ring. Boromir as a character shows this too, because he is held overall pretty blameless too despite doing a bad thing. I love Boromir personally but nearly every fan on here I interact with does too and many discussions are had around his desperation, his life experiences up to the point of the fellowship’s travels, and how we all believe him to be a good man that made bad decisions out of both the influence of the ring and the pressure put on him to be his people’s hero. So I hold Frodo and Boromir especially on an equal ground of people who are flawed and strained, people tired of fighting and who just want an escape, frankly, a solution they don’t feel is coming especially not through the dark lens of the ring and its temptation to trust the way it warps you.

2. I think part of why Frodo gets emphasized in what can seem like the ‘oh he did no wrong’ narrative comes from the simple fact that he’s one of the characters who holds/interacts with the ring the longest. Besides characters like Bilbo and Gollum, we don’t see as much detail on a long time spent with the ring- in fact, beyond the what the Smeagol flashbacks do Frodo is the main indicator of it all for readers/viewers. Most of the other characters only touch/hold/carry it briefly, not for months like he does. So the weight of it does not fall as heavily on them, but we do see that Sam, the chief hero of the story (Tolkien’s words!), even hesitates before giving the ring back to Frodo after carrying it for a fraction of the time. Would Sam have been driven that much further down by it if he had been the one to carry it? I believe so, though it would have manifested differently (Frodo is more a quiet, brooding type who spits venom on occasion where Sam is much more a man of action and outward anger, so the ring would have twisted that and I think he would have been more tough and explosive while Frodo got nasty if that makes sense). Bilbo and Gollum take on similar traits when they try to snatch the ring and I believe Frodo would have descended further into those, too, with even more time carrying the ring.

3. If we’re looking at LoTR also as a showing that absolute power corrupts, we have to have someone like Frodo fail. We have to show even a ‘little guy’, someone young and joyful at the beginning of the story, someone with innocent beauty, falling to it for that very idea that anyone would. It’s almost easier to believe that one of the aforementioned beacons of power and strength like, say, Gandalf, would fall because they already have power to go to their heads. We see this with Saruman, for example, and how he literally falls from grace and dies trying to dominate. But a hobbit and a young innocent one falling when he has nothing of the sort is more telling and tragic. He never wanted this, in fact though he is brave enough to take it on he also tries to give it up numerous times because of the pressure that ultimately threatens to crush him. It’s a cautionary tale that’s sad because it’s true- pressure and power get to us.

4. I totally agree that Frodo made some bad decisions on his own, too! Once again, nobody’s perfect so as an author I can see why it’s realistic to have him screw up, but for sure I would not blame the ring on every single bad thing Frodo has done! The ring definitely amplifies and warps things, but one of the biggest tells of that is Gollum. Sam doesn’t trust him and is right to do so, and while Gollum is very essential to the story, Frodo does let fear and a desire to do every single thing right (again, pressure, imo a big theme here lolol!) take over the decision to trust their shady guide and then the ring takes the stress of that and Gollum’s words and twists all his feelings of exhaustion and resentment against Sam.

5. We’ll never know for sure, but I’ll wrap this up by saying I do personally believe that Frodo is by far not the only person who would fall in this way. He isn’t a perfect character, either, but that is exactly why what happens happens. But then that logic can by applied to many others too, like not only more obvious targets like Boromir or Gollum but even Gandalf, who feared what he would do with ring in hand, would succumb. The concept of the folly of man is especially interesting to me outside of ‘man’, like in the case of Saruman who is supposed to be of great wisdom and purity as a white wizard, but even he falls short. Even the Valar can fall short. Tolkien to me exemplifies the idea shown biblically that anyone can fall, even angels like lucifer/Maia and Valar like Sauron and Morgoth, if they let greed follow their hearts or do not trust the guidance of others. In this case, for Frodo that was Sam. Distrusting Sam gets him in world of trouble, Tolkien lists Sam as the chief hero, and to me the other core of Lord of the Rings is that NO ONE in that story can do it alone. Frodo would have died and fallen all the way without Sam. Rohan had to come to Gondor’s aid. The Three Hunters would not have succeeded if just Legolas or only Aragorn set out and I firmly believe that. Friendship and trust are what keeps us afloat, and Frodo’s mistrust in that, greatly amplified by stress, exhaustion, and indeed the ring, is his undoing. Human nature and evil temptation are a heck of a combo, friends!

Again, hope you find this an interesting read and even if you still don’t personally enjoy Frodo as a character I understand! I hope this comes across as just an analysis, for I don’t like debating and want to be respectful. People with the ‘I’m right, you are wrong’ mentality are a huge turnoff for me so I try to avoid that type of thinking. Thanks again for giving me a lot of food for thought anon, feel free to stop by more if you want to talk so long as this blog can keep a tone of study, not debate 🫶🏻

[saephrond]

"— Gollum is pitiable creature, bound and broken by his own desires. He is what we might become should we let greed take root in our hearts. Yet, I cannot fully condemn him, for his suffering is his doing and undoing. He was born of darkness and is shackled to it by his own will. His tale is a sorrowful one. How fragile we are, when we lose sight of the light...

In the deep bowels of the Misty Mountains, Gollum's bony fingers possessively clutched his "precious" as it glimmered even in the absence of light. His hollowed eyes hadn't strayed from it for long, entranced by a presence that entirely consumed him. Now and again, cracked lips curled into a wicked smile. And at other times, features twisted with terror and hands trembled as though Gollum longed to tear himself away from the ring, but could not.

"My precious, my precious," he crooned, muttering nigh of incoherently amongst the shadows. It was his, and it soothed him to speak to it. To nurture it like it was his child. Yet, somewhere deep in his broken mind, crept a memory. One of the world beyond these damp caverns, of sun on his skin, and laughter in his throat.

Now, such memories only caused him unrest, forcing him to battle his own demons. Much worse -- himself. But, the Ring was his world, all he had possessed. And, he clung to it like a lifeline, even as it strangled him and perverted his soul.

"Let it go," Smeagol's weak voice whimpered and pleaded. "We don't need it. It's tricksy. Nasty. It's hurting us!"

Gollum's eyes flashed with anger, his lips peeling back in a snarl. "No! Foolish Smeagol!" He hissed, clutching the Ring tighter. "It's ours, don't you see? It keeps us safe. Safe from the dark things that would eats us up!" He leaned close to the Ring, a fevered glint in his eyes. "Yes. Precious watches over us."

Smeagol whimpered again, curling up within Gollum's mind like a wounded, cowering creature. "But, but it lies! It makes us hurt! Remember! We remembers the grass, the rivers, the…the friends!" His voice was frail against the weight of Gollum's fury.

"No friends!" Gollum spat, shaking his head as if to rid himself of Smeagol's words. "They would take it from us! Leave us alone with nothing. We keeps it, we keeps it, and we don't let them take it!"

Yet a tiny, trembling part of Smeagol persisted, pushing through the darkness. "Please, let us be free," he whimpered.

"Free? Free!" Gollum mocked in scorn. "What would we do then without precious? Go back? Be hurt by them, laughed at by them?" He shook his head violently, dismissing the thought. "No. We belongs here now! We belongs to…it."

Falling silent, Smeagol retreated into the depths of his mind where he felt safest, and Gollum let out a sharp, echoing cackle. He held the Ring close to his breast, drifting deeply into the darkness, for it promised him everything he could ever desire. And through his greed, it would feed on the scraps of light in him, leaving nothing but a faint flicker of who he once was.

[readinginithilien]

Gandalf the unreliable narrator

I am re-reading the story Gandalf tells Frodo about Gollum's origins and it is hilarious. Gandalf clearly makes most of it up. After all, there are basically no eye-witnesses or records to any of this save Gollum who spent a thousand years alone under a mountain and only told that story to Gandalf under torture, as we later learn. So here is what Gandalf tells:

people akin to Hobbits lived at the shores of the Anduin - that is an educated guess. He knows that Hobbits, allthough their own history goes only to the beginning of the Shire, have moved their relatively recently and must have come from the east, some of them even lived in the north of Rohan for a while. He also knows that Gollum had more in common with hobbits than any other species, including a love for riddles and memories of a life that could be hobbit-like.

Gollum came from the wealthiest family there, which was led by a matriarch - nope, Gandalf us making that up. Even if Gollum still remembered both his family and their wealth, despite living a lonely, independent and completely posession-less (except for the ring) existence, what exactly is he supposed to have told Gandalf about that?

Gollums real name is Smeagol - I mean, could be. Only he would know, maybe he told Gandalf that. Maybe he made the name up, maybe it was someone else's, maybe it was actually his. No way to tell.

He had a friend like Deagol - honestly, that sounds to me like Gandalf wanted another character in the story and looked at Hobbit naming conventions (Frodo son if Drogo). Other people where probably involved in the story, might as well call one of them Deagol.

Smeagol liked roots and beginnings, caves and deep pools - Gandalf is obviously extrapolating from Gollum living in a cave. Why Gollum would tell something like that, even if it true, is beyond my imagination. And I cannot imagine that as the only explanation.

Gollum's people swam a lot and build reed boats - well, Gollum swims well and has a boat, and if he hasn't developed boat building on his own, he probably was already proficient in it. And we assume his people lived at the river at least. But might as well have been a fisher man or shipwright by profession.

One day, Deagol and Smeagol made a trip to where there were nice flowers by the river, where Deagol went fishing and Smeagol looked at roots - well, that sounds like setting the scene. And I still am convinced that the whole Deagol-found-the-ring-first story was Gandalf's way of impressing onto Frodo that the ring can lead you to murder.

Deagol fished and found the ring when being dragged into the water by a fish - not even Gollum would necessarily have seen that part. It's as likely an explanation as any. And we know the ring was last seen on Isildur swimming through the Anduin.

Seagol looked at Deagol looking at the ring from behind a tree - Gandalf is not a bad storyteller

Gandalf quotes the direct words Smeagol and Deagol exchange, something I doubt Gollum would remember

Smeagol kills Deagol and hides the body so noone ever found it - again, this sounds to me like a warning message to Frodo more than based on what Gollum told Gandalf

When Gollum found the ring made him invisible, he liked to go around and sneak up on people, but they kicked him and he liked to bite their feet - bite their feet? Really?

In the end, Gollum was kicked out - well, I can see the resentment of that lingering, Gollum might have told that

He traveled up the Anduin and ended under the misty mountains after the sun became to strong to him - he must have somehow gotten from the Anduin to his cave, and he does not seem to have missed the sun. The rest I'd call speculation

While all of this is a very good story, we know Gandalf has very few sources:

his limited knowledge of Hobbit history

what Bilbo told him

what he found in the archives of Gondor

what Gollum told him under torture

I see very little of the story coming from any of these sources. So in conclusion, Gandalf made most of that up, partly to have a nice story, and partly to teach Frodo some lessons.