#have i said that i like the idw sonic characterization. a lot. A LOT.

[felikatze]

i think idw is based because now we know sonic the hedgehog's opinion on the death penalty

[siggiedraws]

What’s your thoughts on idw silver, I personally think he is ok but I feel like the idw comic didn’t really do very well with his character.

I can't say I like him... at all.

American Sonic media already has a history of needless and quite frankly terrible changes, whether made out of ignorance, xenophobia towards Sonic Team/SoJ, some vague, made-up sense of marketability, or all three. So, I'm already wary of media like that. They always change fundamental aspects of Sonic's appeal and are supremely unenjoyable to me as a result.

To stay on track here - why do I dislike IDW Silver? The main reason is that I think he's portrayed as way too polite and nice to people. He has no backbone. It's as if he was just based off of popular fanon or Archie comics, rather than the source material. I don't blame anyone for thinking Silver is some timid, polite sweetheart if fanon and IDW/Archie is all they have consumed, but I'm doing my best to dispel that notion for the sake of conquering misinformation. As a casual fan, it is understandable to have misconceptions, but I'm going to be much more harsh to official media.

I need to hammer home the fact that Silver is rude and often talks down to people. Sonic '06, Silver's debut game, showcases this very well. In an '06 cutscene, he talks down to Sonic after attacking him when his guard was down. The casual stride over to a wheezing, incapacitated Sonic kills me. The disrespect is fucking crazy.

In the level Flame Core, he acts haughty and superior about his abilities, even letting out a light chuckle at how pathetic the enemies are. And, a detail that is easy to miss, he doesn't even apologize for trying to kill Sonic.

That's not even mentioning the Rivals games being a wonderful source of Rude Silver™, where there are too many snide remarks to count.

IDW Silver is a telltale case of Silver's nuance being stripped so that he only represents one trait of his- that trait being "naivety." Silver's naivety is mentioned twice by Blaze in Sonic '06 because this is relevant to the story. Naivety is Silver's fatal flaw that leads to him being easily manipulated by Mephiles. However, his naivety isn't due to some innocent, childlike outlook on the world. Silver takes everyone at face value and always assumes people are telling the truth to him due to a lack of social skills. This is why, when Silver mentions something outlandish or unbelievable to people, he is confused why they don't believe him. This is shown in both Rivals 2 and the Sonic x Silver wallpaper cover story.

IDW seems to completely miss this nuance and conflates "naivety" with childlikeness and innocence. When you realize this, decisions put towards Silver's characterization in IDW makes a lot of sense - his hyperactive excitement and adulation over Whisper is a good example, but how he doesn't talk back to Sonic calling him "flatware" in Issue 8 particularly bothers me.

Realistically, Sonic would immediately get thrown into a wall if he said this to Silver.

Portrayals like IDW Silver are just so utterly confusing. How in the world does Silver get misconstrued this way, into something entirely opposite of what he is, in both fanon and official media? To be completely honest, it makes me frustrated. I want things to change and I feel like I have to speak up. I ended up writing an essay about Why Silver is Rude. I'm sorry anon.

[twipsai]

^this is me when someone respectfully disagrees with me btw

ANYWAYS! pls dont take this as me arguing in a mean way or anything, i love Sonic a lot!!! and i like talking about it and i think you bring up a lot of interesting points!!!! so im gonna go over it all in maybe a not super cohesive way???

i wanna start by acknowledging what you said at the start, "the wording of the second bolded point echoes IDW Sonic's wording of his principles in IDW #2 that Amy swoons over" and clarifying that i was referencing It Doesn't Matter from sa1 and sa2,,, (the full lyric is "Don't ask me why; I don't need a reason / I got my way, my own way!), and the reason why i alluded to it is because i was trying to make that connection that Sonic still has the same basic principals that he did during the adventure era, but i guess i wasnt clear enough oops ^^; i honestly completely forgot that theres a reference to that lyric in idw #2 but,, uh, happy accident i guess?

ok now onto my actual thoughts

i actually wanna agree with you on that first part, cuz as i think about it its something that makes a lot of sense and i havent really been able to fully wrap my head around it -- Sonic being reactive to whats in front of him is exactly how he is!!! idk how i didnt realize that before lol

as to what you said to my first point, i think that theres a level of dissonance between the games and comics with the threats theyre dealing with, and it kinda prevents me from explaining myself with examples. this MIGHT be a reach!!!! im sorry if it is BUT im gonna compare satbk and frontiers for a sec, since we're talking about satbk a lot here (as we should. its such a good game)

(and im not sure if youre lumping in Sonic in IDW with Sonic in Frontiers? a lot of people do but. idk maybe you dont lol. for the purposes of my point i will)

i think that there are parallels to be drawn between how Sonic treats Merlina and Sage, vs how he treats King Arthur and The End. he has a lot of patience for Merlina and Sage as he realizes theres a lot more to them besides just wanting to kill him, but he'll still take what they throw at him like he takes anything else. then you compare that to Arthur and The End, and Sonic is like. ready to destroy those guys. and i think that, while Sonic is first and foremost just living in the moment and reacting to what people throw at him, i also think that theres a huge difference between when Sonic is fighting a person and when Sonic is fighting a powerful entity. granted, he didnt know that King Arthur was an illusion, but he did know he was an immortal tyrant associated with hell. i mean. the underworld

i would love to use an example from the comics showing how he does treat similar scaled threats the same way but i. cant! because he doesnt face threats like that in IDW! hes dealing with things like "the dragon is back" and "that girl has psychological issues". the only thing that comes close to the world-ending threat that we see in the games is the metal virus, and it was both a lot more complicated than typical "defeat the bad guy, save the world" that we see in the games. now, that does NOT mean i dont think the games have complex stories but if i delved into every situation Sonic has been put in then we would be here for so long. and i dont wanna do that. so yeag.

basically to sum up my points above, im saying that the reason IDW Sonic has been pretty lax with his enemies, and even tries to help some of them, is because theyre not really the same level of threats as most of the villains he faces in the games. he can deal with them fine without ending them outright, so he doesnt really have an issue with letting them live. hes just kind of easy-going and chill like that. at least thats how i see it, maybe im missing something?

also, to your point that "Sonic doesnt fight for freedom, he fights against oppression" i just. do not agree lol. i mean, hes been associated with the Freedom Fighters since 1993, but theres also some more direct reference to it in reference to specifically Sonic

the Sonic Adventure Stylebook, page 9 (translated) - "He loves freedom and hates crookedness. He is impulsive and short-tempered, but also has a kindness that can't be ignored when someone is in trouble."

Sonic the Hedgehog Encyclo-speed-ia, page 13 - "Sonic is usually laid back and cool, but he's driven to fight injustice - not in the name of the law, but for the ideal of freedom."

and then i WAS going to add more examples, but the wayback machine is down right now so. can i just say source: trust me? sorry i wish i could add more examples :( i dont wanna dwell on this "for freedom or against oppression" point too much though, cuz i honestly think its just kinda arguing semantics. as well as the fact that i feel like both things are true, i just kinda didnt phrase it well in my original post

um. and now i kinda wanna go completely off the rails so please be nice to me but im gonna say something that may be controversial,,, i am of the mind that, because IDW is canon material, then it shouldnt be seen as a different character than how Sonic was written in some earlier games, even if it seems like it. because its just as much as source material as anything else! i really just think that most "out of character" things are more akin to different facets of a character. i think that writing off all of Sonic in IDW because some things he does contradicts what he does in the games is just kinda. idk. i dont like how quick people are to do that. i mean like, i got into Sonic because of IDW, and then i went and played the games and it never really felt any different to me -- just Sonic responding different to different situations. maybe i need to do another read through of IDW! but i really dont think that writing off an entire canon comic series is a good thing to do when looking at the facets of a character's personality. that could just be me

anyways ummmmm yeah i dont really have anything else to say? i dont disagree with everything you said, but there are some things that i dont think are quite right,,, hopefully this all makes more sense than my original post cuz i dont think i did a good job articulating my points

um. idk what else to add. bye bye i hope you at least liked my drawing of a super sad alien

"sonic just wants to be best friends with his enemies"

WRONG thats only in the idw comics. extremely loud incorrect buzzer.

[shadamyheadcanons]

i love that you don’t put sonic as a jerk in your headcannons but rather supportive! this is so cool, because sonic really wants all of his friends to be happy and with amy wouldn’t be different, specially since they’ve known each other since they were children and sonic himself said that she is a special/dear person to him so i agree he would be happy if amy and shadow got together. as much as i love sonamy, i also love shadamy (sorry for the long ask it’s just that is not that common seeing sonic being portrayed like this in some ffs)

Thanks for the compliment! This one means a lot because I think I’m actually harsher toward Sonic sometimes than a lot of modern shadamy writers are. I say “modern” because new “Amy goes for Shadow because Sonic is a jerk” stories are actually few and far between. It’s easy to think they’re all over the place because there absolutely are a lot of them, but the ones I run into are usually from, like...2012. If you sort by Date Updated on AO3, it tells a different story, pun intended. I believe there are three main reasons for this:

1. Since half of shadamy fans started shipping them in SA2 two and a half decades ago, a ton of us are in our 30s now, writing more mature stories with more fine-tuned characterization. This is one of the advantages of having an ancient ship.

2. It’s a tired trope. We’ve all read a million of them. Most people don’t like how Sonic acts in them for his sake, but my biggest gripe is that they undersell what Shadow has to offer. He’s not just good for Amy because he’s Not Sonic, he’s good for her because of who he is.

3. Sonic treats Amy much better than he used to. The reason “Sonic is a jerk” fics were so common 10-20 years ago is because he was a jerk, almost exclusively to Amy.

These fics exist because no other character works better than Shadow as an arbiter of justice for something that bothered a lot of Amy fans at the time.

More on this under the cut. Lots more. I got kind of carried away.

It’s easy to forget how bad Sonic was when we have games like Frontiers and comics like IDW and Mega Drive now:

Between new fans who aren’t as familiar with older games, longtime fans who haven’t looked at their history in a while, and fans who love Sonic and just don’t want to see him in a bad light, tons of people sweep his old behavior under the rug without even realizing it.

I don’t think any of that is fair to Amy.

A brief reminder of their dynamic in the past:

1. Constant abandonment. He ran from her in Sonic Adventure...

...Sonic Heroes...

And four times in SA2 alone! More on that later.

2. Standing her up on dates. This mostly happened in Sonix X...

[Episode 42, episode 45]

...but there was also Sonic and the Black Knight, where he didn’t show up, didn’t apologize, never made it up to her, and made no attempt to reschedule.

3. Uh...literally hurting her, for some reason...?

At the end of Sonic Riders, when he didn’t feel like properly handling a hostage situation:

Oh, welcome back, episode 42! Didn’t expect to see you again:

The new version of Sonic Generations altered this cutscene, thank god, but back in 2011, players saw this:

4. And the worst part of this, to me, is that he lets her get her hopes up. It’s not just the almost-dates he skips. Knuckles teases Sonic in Heroes, saying, “Are you playing with that girl’s heart again, Sonic?” It’s intended as a joke, but then he does things like this:

Sonic X, episode 52. You know what roses are, Sonic, you know how she’ll interpret this, and you know you won’t follow through.

I know I’m picking on Sonic X a lot, but it was pretty popular at the time, even among fans who didn’t touch the games or comics. This was how they saw these characters growing up, and it made its way into countless fics.

But even after all these years, no matter which continuity you work with...he still won’t give her a solid “no.”

Not liking someone back is fine. Not being interested in a relationship is fine. But letting her believe she’ll win you over if she chases you long enough isn’t, and that’s what he’s doing to this day.

Fans throw around the same tired old “justifications” over and over for why he is/was like this to Amy, but they don’t hold water. People say he’s mean because he doesn’t know what to do with his feelings for her, but he liked Elise, too, and he was nothing but kind to her.

(Putting this here because although fans don’t like to admit it, Elise was indeed intended to be a love interest. She and Amy are presented on par here, so if you think he likes Amy, then he liked Elise, too. You get exactly the same result regardless of who you choose for this trial.)

The other frequent “justification” is that he ran and lashed out because he was afraid of her, often accompanied by awful Amy hate (“stalker,” “psycho,” etc.). This also doesn’t work because Sonic was always harsh to Amy no matter how gentle she was. Classic Amy is the sweetest, most adorable little munchkin in the world...

...and he still ran away.

^ These are from the same exact comic, by the way: IDW Sonic’s 30th anniversary. Five pages apart. How in the world could anyone not want her around?

Amy had more spunk in Adventure and Adventure 2, but she was just as sweet, and he still treated her like a pest to be swatted. The ending of her story in SA1 is this:

But...why should she have to? He treats everyone else with the same baseline of respect, at least until they give him a reason not to. Why is it just Amy? He wasn’t just mean to her, he was uniquely mean to her. She didn’t act out until Heroes in 2003, when she’d already been ignored for years. Standing on the sidelines wasn’t working, so she tried being more “proactive.” Was it the right way to do things? No...but I honestly can’t hold it against her. It makes sense in context. She was a kid, and kids act out when they’re neglected.

And this is where Sonic Adventure 2 comes in.

SA2 was pivotal for Amy. Nearly everyone tossed her aside; Sonic left her behind four separate times in this game alone. First was right after she broke him out of jail on Prison Island. He ran off the second her back was turned:

Second, he and Tails both walked away from her after Eggman blew up the moon. She easily could’ve gotten arrested here.

Third, Sonic and Tails made a plan to stop Eggman right in front of her, blatantly leaving her out of it as if she wasn’t even there:

...which, if you’ll recall, led to Eggman holding her at gunpoint:

...and when Sonic set out to rescue her, this was his recap:

This does not work as a joke given how they treat her. He pretends she doesn’t exist to her face, then says this behind her back.

And immediately after that, when it was time for them to save the world, they left her alone again.

I can’t speak for anyone else, but I was furious by that point.

But then...something interesting happened.

A photoset or gifset can’t do this scene justice, but I think most shadamy fans have already seen it plenty of times. For the few who haven’t, you can watch it here.

The contrast between Shadow and Sonic is impossible to ignore. By building up this moment the way they did, the writers primed us to notice it.

Sonic runs from Amy’s hugs, while Shadow would like more of them, please and thank you.

Sonic pretends she doesn’t exist, while Shadow’s moved to tears and changes the course of his life because he values what she has to say.

Anytime they’ve interacted since then, he’s been uniquely respectful and gentle with her. It’s what she deserves, and for a long time, this was all we had. He was all we had.

The other half of the equation is that it is very, very easy to picture Shadow taking Sonic and the others to task for their mistreatment of her. As a blunt person who’s not afraid to confront Sonic, Shadow is the most believable candidate to this day. The only person to fully respect her from the start also happens to clash with the person who hurts her most often? Of course those fics exist. It’s a perfect storm.

And it’s no wonder that this attitude persists somewhat even now, because Sonic is still doing this, even if he’s “nicer” about it. That prison escape from SA2? The one he never thanked her for? He still gives all the credit to Tails for that, even up through Frontiers:

Amy. Amy broke you out of prison. Tails broke in, and then she snuck through a maximum-security prison, somehow stole a card key, and saved your life. We’re in the 2020s, but he’s still disrespecting her. And don’t get me started on the TailsTube Secret Santa episode.

It feels like Sega wants us to forget all of this ever happened, and it has some very confusing results. From that same Sonic 30th anniversary comic from above, the one where he and the others abandoned her:

Like...this? This is lying. He’s just lying to her. I can’t tell if they think we all collectively have amnesia or if it’s some weird, mean-spirited joke at her expense. I genuinely don’t know what they’re trying to say.

It’s not enough to pretend it never happened and move on, not to me. Sonic should be held responsible for what he canonically did. Him supposedly being bad with feelings didn’t make it hurt her any less, and he’s older than Amy, so he should’ve been the mature one.

The longer the writers keep this up, the worse Sonic looks, and I don’t think that’s what they’re aiming for. Ignoring the problem is not a solution. Amy might forgive, but I’ll never forget.

I just want to see a canon apology so I can reason out why she put up with it for so long. I want to at least be able to buy her having a crush on him. I can do that when he’s being selfless and heroic. I can’t do that when he treats her like the plague, and pretending he never did doesn’t match the Sonic I legitimately like. I bet a lot of s0namy fans would like to see a resolution like that, too.

Sorry to turn your thoughtful compliment into a rant. I really do appreciate it, and I’m glad you enjoy the stories!

[speedofsoundsketches]

I personally believe if Idw wrote Maria that way and they said "we're just expanding on the character " fans would throw a fit. Dont get me wrong, the Sonic Ova will always remain superior to whatever American Sonic story product comes out. But cant help there seems to be a lot of forced hype over a short manga that's just mostly okay with a lot of flaws.

I can only speak for myself but part of my major problem with IDW is that the attempts to “expand on the characters” are usually by making them speak out loud their thematic modus operandi instead of allowing things to be said on a subtextual level. It’s why Sonic expositioning on his “le principles” sounds insanely forced because he’s never done something like that in the games or at least, never required an essay worth of words to do that. In the games, this is done by letting characters speak through actions first and punctuating that with clear, concise statements during peak moments of clarity. Sonic simply saying “What you see is what you get! I’m just a guy who loves adventure!” after going through an entire game of him showing us this about him is more convincing than long prose on why he thinks everyone should live exactly like he does in a holier-than-thou manner. (Which is such an antithesis of Sonic’s character in the games, he is far more humble and intuitive than ppl might expect.)

The manga did imo a better job of not only writing Shadow than he is in IDW but it was all largely game compliant. Nothing in it really contradicted anything already done in the games in terms of characterization. It just feels like “more of the same” but now we get to see some of the sad, bittersweet and touching sincere friendship between Shadow and Maria, plus the foundation of all the tense internal conflict and insecurities Shadow will have to face and eventually make peace with. Plus my goodness, the RANGE of emotions he has and that he’s not some completely unreachable hardass but has complicated and deep emotions. Plus the action in it? Ooooo stunning. Him knocking out soldiers and stopping a bullet all while tying it with emotional internal declarations he was struggling with and determining that he does still have purpose even if curing Maria failed is so PALPABLE. STANDING OVATION.

His beautiful thoughts on Maria and what she means to him after she dashes away all his fears that she sees him as a tainted experimental animal like the other scientists did when facing their doom like bruh I’m in tears. It’s so well interwoven with the outward kinetic battle and leaves enough room for that which is left unsaid. Shadow speaks through his actions more than words but his thoughts and feelings just heighten the emotional peaks in this short story.

It’s not perfect but this is literally all I’d ever want. Contrary to popular belief, I’m not actually that difficult to please. Just write characters as they are in the games and I’m happy!

[kingmaxstatic]

In Defense Of Lanolin, A Post About Perspective, Flaws and Development. (Part 2: Lanolin's Sugar, Spice and Everything Nice.)

Read Part 1 Here!

Like I said, the OG post was so long with JUST me bringing up the specific events I had to, eventually, make a part two. In this part I'm gonna be discussing Lanolin as a character! Moreso why she's probably the way she is currently! I'll also be discussing her role as a character.

Posting this here as well! I'm not saying that people disliking lanolin is bad but I do think the hate is over done!

Lanolin was introduced to us in issue 2 (WOW she was early in) She didn't really have much of a role at the time. She was a background for a while before being being re-introduced with a whole new look and personality during the Urban Warfare arc!

However she does go through more than that! In multiple arcs you can see her in the background. Most note worthy being her outfit change becoming more battle ready more time you see in the metal virus arc!

Her sense in style goes from something you'd wear during the summer time for a nice day out to something you'd wear for battle. I think that says a lot about what she went through. She goes from the jittery little thing to someone more strong.

So let's get this out of the way, Lanolin is traumatized by the badnik raids and probably even more so by the Zombot virus (and EVERYTHING ELSE she was caught up in)

"I never wanted to feel so helpless and unprepared again."

I feel a lot of Lanolin's "bossy" and "brashess" comes this. She acts the way she does because she doesn't want herself feel that way ever again. Trauma changes people, speaking from experience.

Whisper is also an example of this being shown in IDW sonic. She seems much bubblier in the past but now she's quiet and reserved because of the death of her team mates. I also want to add something ELSE to this (not to pull these events out again).

"I didn't want ANYONE to feel that way."

cut to me in a therapist chair. I believe a lot of the causes of Lanolin's biggest blunders does come from a place of not wanting anyone to feel helpless in the way SHE did. It's why she goes to protect the "new scared guy" (and manipulator with years of experience). It's why she reacts with such fear when the track breaks. It's all done out of this desire.

It's her moral code.

Also I think whenever she fails this it sends her into a pit of self loathing and I have the panels to prove this check this out. Take a look at this.

THAT right there is Lanolin's guilt. Can we talk about Lanolin's Guilt? PLEASE sonicblr I've been dying to talk about Lanolin's guilt with you ALL DAY okay?/ref

Lanolin openly acknowledging that she's afraid of failing others (in the sense of making people unsafe) in Urban Warfare (I feel at least) is a small but important key to understanding Lanolin's mindset. Lanolin feels GUILT every time she's done something to hurt others. It's why her eyes go so ghost wide when the track breaks.

Because she's put people in danger.

NOW I think Lanolin's biggest flaw is that she's not only blunt but I think she forgets that she can ALSO put people in danger (on accident, of course). When she realizes it I think it mentally comes crashing down for her. Girl DOES NOT handle failure well.

(screenshot added because it's cool, her powers are cool)

Lanolin's role in the comic is pretty clear as day, at least to me. She's the straight man! (Well probably not straight and not a man) Basically a straight man in media is someone who takes things seriously. It's their job to point out the utter bonkers stuff going around them and go "what?????"

Which is one of the first things we see her do in the first scenes she's in! I personally love how much her personality clashes with the others, adds some nice chemistry to the mix!

Characters that are typically characterized as "serious" will ALWAYS clash with the goof balls. It's the charm of the dynamic.

I don't know why people hate her so much, genuinely. She shares a lot of character traits with some fan favorites! I do think there might be a uh... bigger reason as to why people hate her.

"Max. What the hell are you talking about?"

Haha. Well. There's two characters I want to discuss for this that do share traits with her and are fan favorites. Other than characteristics.. there is one key difference I want to discuss between Lanolin and these two characters. And this is the hard part where despite the meme I talk about more difficult subject matter.

"What's the main difference between lanolin and these fan favorites?"

ah! Well uh.

Their Genders.

(and well alliance for Starline shurgs very loudly)

Yeah this is unfortunately discuss fandom sexism. It's not lost on me that people absolutely ADORE Shadow and Starline. Characters that are often ones to resort to whatever tactics they deem necessary to achieve their end goals. These tactics can include violence. Hell we know Starline is down right PETRIFIED of failure (issue 50). Shadow is also known for taking charge on things and boldy assuming stuff (SA2). Hell he even assumes himself to be an android at one point.

These are both characters that share a LOT character wise with Lanolin. I know for a FACT if Shadow was the one who kicked Silver out of team dark he'd still be loved. If Starline was in Lanolin's place you'd have people going "Oh guys hear me out owo,,". You know it's bad when I've seen more genuine hate and vile spread about the traumatized teenager than the grown man who canonically helped caused a zombie outbreak (and so much more!!!). I'm saying this and Starline is my favorite Idw character! Keep that in mind while reading all of this!

People would've adored Lanolin if she was a guy. I'm betting it RIGHT now. She wouldn't be "bitchy" she'd be "determined and strong". She wouldn't of "gotten what she deserved" there would've been posts about how it "wasn't his fault <:[[[[".

Why do I say this? Because I've seen this happen in fandom.

Again

And Again

And AGAIN.

HELL Even to the extent that people have called Mabel Pines, A 12 YEAR OLD. A Manipulator. Princess Bubble gum wasn't being nice to Finn she was "leading him on". Rose Quartz wasn't a morally gray figure she was "a reckless person".

Lanolin isn't "just doing her job and making a mistake" she's "being a bitch and getting what she deserved".

I'm gonna keep it real with you guys, I was considering deleting this last part of the post but I genuinely think it needs to be said, Lanolin's hate feels SO deeply rooted in sexism. Espically with all the talk of her "getting what she deserved". I'm so stuck on that because it feels so... gross. Saying you want her cooked. Saying you want her dead. Feels so gross. She's a teenager, most likely. Even then she openly acknowledges she's inexperienced.

She's learning, let her learn. Like everyone is letting Surge learn.

Am I saying everyone who hates Lanolin is a sexist? No. Am I saying that Lanolin would've been given more slack if she was a man? Abso-fucking-lutely.

WHOA that got super serious real quick haha! Well!!!! That's the post! Sorry guys I tried to keep this one light hearted but I genuinely felt like I had to get that last part off of my chest. I really hope the next "character deep dive" I make is more light hearted. Thank you for reading!

[crusherthedoctor]

💕 🖤 (the last one is excluding IDW because we all know the answer to that :P)

💕: What is an unpopular ship that you like?

Sonudis. Ha ha ha, so funny, please laugh.

Crusher X Scenery Porn. Ha ha ha, so funny, please laugh.

The writing room X Someone that's not Ian Flynn. Ha ha ha, so funny, please laugh.

Okay being serious, I don't know if it's the mindset of "I've already dipped my toe in cringe, so I have nothing to lose", but ever since someone corrupted me with the Sonudis initiative (:P), it seems to have created a side-effect that's left me more open to other ships when I previously wasn't all that prone to shipping, which is ironic because I thought you were supposed to be less prone to shipping as you get older, not more. D: But hey, I can still talk about other things relating to characters, and it's not like I stop looking at characters as their own individual entities even if there's shipping involved on my part unlike most Whispangle fans, so it's perfectly harmless, right? ...r-right?

Alas, since I can never catch a break (at least in the Sonic fandom; thankfully I have better luck elsewhere, as MarioXVivian is fairly popular <3), the ones I've warmed up to still seem to be on the rare side of the scale, with the only non-Eggman X Himself/Sonic X The Floor exception I can think of being that I don't mind Sonaze. Sonic's dynamics with Elise and Shahra have endeared themselves to me despite '06's... 06ness with the former, and previously being indifferent for the longest time with the latter. If the jokes I've made about Knuckles being a sheep shagger are any indication, I might be interested in Knuckles X Ariem as well, even though there's pretty much no basis for it beyond one throwaway compliment. I dunno, it's one of those ones where I can see them relating to a lot of things, and I just find the idea cute. Sue me.

I also might like Tails X Amy... and Tails X Marine if that counts as relatively unpopular... @beevean might have also warmed me up a little bit to Knuckles X Amy... and I kinda find Sonic X Rouge interesting too...? Like I said, I know I went past the cringe barrier ages ago, so fuck it.

...Does Staregg count these days, since people keep insisting that Starline's transformation from Something Actually Refreshing to Snively II: Colgate Edition was anything other than a dumbass move on the writers' parts?

🖤: Which character is not as morally good as everyone else seems to think?

I didn't even think about IDW Sonic when I answered this before. I guess my dedication to Eggman's proper characterization manages to overpower even my distaste for Mr. Principles lol.

So for another one... idk, Bowser? While I do think Eggman is much more consistently cruel and prone to sadism on the whole, you don't need a master's degree in Mariology to know that Bowser is not who you'd call a saint either.

[randomthefox]

"Sonic fans have more mandates than SEGA does" Well gee, MAYBE if you same dipshits who *love* whine about SEGA having rules for THEIR characters, thank Flynn for popularizing that, MAYBE you'd see less discourse about (sane) fans taking issue with whenever SEGA's rules aren't being fully adhered to by him or some other insecure fuck who cares more about getting their dirty fingerprints all over Sonic! Yet they still wanna wonder why nobody outside the fandom still respects Sonic as a brand. Because the fandom sure learned to not to.

It's so fucking annoying.

"This moment is an example of bad writing because it is OOC to Sonic's established characterization and personality traits."

"WOOOOW SO YOU'RE SAYING SONIC ISN'T ALLOWED TO EVER ACT IN DIFFERENT WAYS GOSH TALK ABOUT MUH MANDATES!"

This is what I mean when I say IDW fans always argue in bad faith. They never engage with the actual argument being made. They're always putting words in your mouth and responding to a strawman of their own construction.

It's frustrating to me because I never do that shit. I don't just completely fucking ignore their argument and pretend they said something else instead for the benefit of painting them as some unreasonable easily dismissed gremlin, like they do to us. I'm always willing to meet their arguments halfway and a lot of the time I go even further than that and go out of my way to try and dissect what they said to try and properly understand what they're trying to communicate but probably have difficulty articulating properly. I don't just completely change the terms of the debate and treat them like they're saying something patently absurd so it can be disregarded without proper refutation.

IDW fans are all just a bunch of assholes.

[noeggets]

Noeggets has a lot of deep thoughts about Shadow's characterization

it's so sad that Shadow was only a project to gerald, like we all joke /think that Shadow was "part of the family" but he was only a cure to Maria, that man was not as good a person as we think he was IM NOt SAYING HE WAS BAD but i usually see him depicted as super super kind to Shadow but i was reading the lore of SA2 and watching an analysis video and if the president never asked him to make whatever he asked him to make Shadow very well would not have been created.

It's so dark and so sad, like he manipulated Shadow when he went insane how do you think it feels to Shadow to know the person who made him didn't truly love him? like neither of the things that created/help create Shadow really truly loved him, he's only a cure, he's just a thing to reach immortality, he very well could be immortal himself, Shadow i don't think he can die cause he was created to not be able to catch any disease and be immortality it's self.

How do you think that feels? to just be a thing? Biolizard is just a failed attempt at making Shadow based on Chaos, those Chaos things in the ARK are failed attempts at Shadow also based on Chaos, i never knew this until i read the wiki 2 days ago SA2 has such a dark story i feel so bad for Shadow

re-thinking what i used to think about IDW Shadow lemme explain

And now that i know all this about Shadow the way he acts in IDW makes a little more sense to me, we all thought he was stupid when Sonic said "don't touch those zobot guys you'll turn into one" and Shadow was all "yeah, i dont care this wont effect me" HE WAS LIKE THIS FOR TWO REASONS

he was mad at Sonic cause his whole thing i want to achieve world peace i already talked about how IDW Shadow doesn't have as much compassion as the Shadow we all know from any other game but this is Eggman we're talking about, with everything Eggman's done up to this point do you think Shadow believes there is any good in him when he rarely does anything good Shadow has seen? Time eater, Sonic unleashed, Shadow is not ignorant to Eggman waking up a monster inside the planet everybody whether we seen them or not knows sonic unleashed happen, Sonic brings up sonic unleashed in IDW so it canonly happened. i remember reading that Knuckles and Shadow were gonna be in Sonic unleashed and if that's true SHADOW IS AWARE OF THIS

Eggman is a threat to the world to Shadow but he allowed the doctor to be cause Sonic keeps him check, Sonic is starting to be "unable" to keep him in check from Shadow's view, Shadow was there in forces, he witness what Eggman did to greenhill, he fought infinite who is a merc hired by Eggman mercs off people, Shadow is trying to save people that's his whole thing. After what happen to Shadow in Episode Shadow in forces do you think Shadow would hold any sympathy for Eggman the next time he physically see's him? After what he did to the world, after what he did to Omega? right in front of his eyes? Using Infinite to corrupt Omega and scare him Shadow cares about Omega that's his friend i had a point but i forgot it dang it anyway Shadow was in the war,

i remembered it a little bit i think i think i was gonna say something about when GUN sent Shadow to rescue Omega idk i haven't touched forces in sometime, and Shadow didn't come back as well as Omega. Eggman immobilized Shadow Shadow does not think the world is safe with Eggman around i think that was my point i don't remember...

ANYWAY that's why when Shadow came to see mr tinker he was pissed that Sonic allowed Eggman to be, this is dangerous to Shadow. when Shadow was getting mad at Sonic cause Sonic was preaching let Mr. Tinker live Shadow was thinking about the bigger picture: This man is terrorizing people and the only way to keep everyone safe is getting rid of him, this may be the only chance we get, but he let him live because Sonic explained that Shadow did bad things in the past as well so does that mean Shadow gets to go down with Eggman?

Shadow was mad at Sonic and the mess he made, Shadow was being compassionate i just didn't see it or understand it until now, it shocked him greatly when he was consumed by metal virus because he truly believed he could not catch a disease, this is a disease, so he wasn't being stupid i will admit he should have been more cautious not to put it to the test if it would work on him but Shadow was so sure he couldn't catch it, cause he believed he can't catch any KNOWN diseases this was a new disease his body wasn't created to understand therefore it works on him.

We thought SEGA didn't know what they were doing when they were writing IDW Shadow BUT THEY KNEW WHAT THEY WERE DOING people probably don't even care or remember about when that issue came out and everyone got so mad that Shadow was written "wrong" and being "stupid" but now that i have a understanding i think understand what he was doing and his thought process.

Shadow is moving up on my favorite list for this i feel so bad for Shadow F in the chat for Shadow his story is so sad like really. also heres an old thing i did that's really valid now

[number-one-shadisper-shipper]

excuse me, sorry for popping here uninvited but, what was the point of that meme?

because, like, i can count on fingers the number of people in this website who actively criticize the idw sonic comics, so it's not like liking them here is a controversial opinion,

then i can only imagine it's all a big deal on twitter, as far as i heard every discussion is a big deal in there

Hey, no problem, all are welcome!

I would agree with you that most people are pretty good about the comics, which I am grateful for. But that being said, even on here I have seen a TON of complaints about them.

Idk why, but the recent Spring Broken one got a lot of people ripping on it, when I think the worst you can say is that it was a little meh (I liked it but I can see that some people would find it boring). And overall, I've seen lots of complaints about the characterization and about Ian Flynn as a writer. I'm perfectly fine with having a few criticisms, I do too, but I try not to let it get in the way of my enjoyment.

And again, I think most of the fandom here is pretty good. I probably wouldn't have made the meme if I didn't think that a lot of people would agree. I'm just sad that I've seen quite a bit of negativity lately. But the meme isn't aimed at anyone in particular or anything.

[canonmisogynyvictimstournament]

PROPAGANDA

AMY ROSE (SONIC THE HEDGEHOG)

1.) Amy’s characterisation has experienced several generations of misogyny, right from her genesis: She was designed as a girlfriend, but it eas then decided they didn’t want Sonic to have a girlfriend. First instance she’s a damsel in distress that he resents for being there and crushing on him, and this is echoed in the comics. She is then presented as pathetic, chasing and stalkerish, as well as sidelined in the games in favour of other characters despite being very strong. Her stories are often those with the most emotional weight, but the reading is coloured by other characters underestimating her importance there. She then enters a pushy and blind era where she becomes a mockery of her past self. A universe reset rebranded her as a feminist, but that often comes off as a bit pickme, and they frequently failed to hold her femininity and also combat capabilities in hand at once. She is finally getting a bit more stable characterisation and treated a bit better, but I still don’t trust the writers with her. Ultimately, it often felt like the creators didn’t like her, and only had her there because they were made to; and that sucked as a little girl sonic fan.

2.) She started out as the token Girl One in a 90’s property, and her first appearance was as a damsel in distress, which isn’t great to begin with, and she wasn’t playable for a long-ass time outside of spinoffs. The Sonic Adventure games redesigned her, made her playable, let her fight back against her would-be kidnappers, and gave her a major role in saving the world by letting Shadow talk to someone not game with destroying it. Then from Sonic Heroes to Sonic and the Black Knight, and the anime Sonic X, her character was reduced to ‘hehe funny obsessed fangirl is obsessed’ a lot of the time, losing her compassion and a good deal of her social awareness. In Sonic 06, she literally said that she’d sacrifice the rest of the world for Sonic, which, my girl would NEVER in SA2. The Archie comics weren’t kind to her either, as their explanation for the redesign was that Amy wished to become older, so they aged up her body, BUT NOT HER MIND EW EW EW. I’m sure there are other crimes the Archie comics did to her, but that’s not my knowledge base. THEN the writers tried to backpedal in the early 2010’s, but by attempting to undo all the 'crazy’, they took out Amy’s drive and convictions (Sonic Lost World just letting Amy sit and watch Sonic do all the work my beloathed). The Sonic Boom spinoff series tried to pivot and make their version of her a girlboss, but Rise of Lyric was SO BAD. Sonic Boom: Fire and Ice made an alternate version of her a damsel in distress, again, which while technically true to Amy’s roots, does not fit her Boom characterization AT ALL. The Sonic Boom cartoon was a screwball comedy, and they at least lampshaded a lot of Amy’s previous writing problems, but they didn’t give her much to do either, mainly making her 'the sensible one’ whenever Sonic wasn’t available for deadpan responses. They’ve been doing a bit better lately, with Amy usually involved in world-saving matters, and she was prominently featured in Sonic Frontiers, even if she was trapped in Cyberspace. The IDW comics are also treating her wonderfully, from what I’ve seen.

3.) when she was created as a character, she was made solely to be sonic’s love interest. in sonic adventure, they tried to rewrite her and flesh out her character more by making her realize she’s more than her crush on sonic and she finally realizes she’s strong enough to do things without him. sonic team IMMEDIATELY undid that in sonic heroes which came out soon after. they made her entire character in that game obsessed with sonic and based her entire story around him. she was obsessed with him unhealthily in that game because god forbid team sonic let’s a strong female character exist. many of the sonic games took away her quality of being strong without sonic by writing her to only be obsessed with him and not do anything without him. in many modern games, she’s improved more, but misogyny has really screwed her over as a character.

ABBIE MILLS (SLEEPY HOLLOW) (CW: Racism)

1.) Abbie starts out as one of the two protagonists of the show, only to get almost entirely sidelined as early as season 2, getting less and less screen time and allowed no relationships, either platonic or romantic, while the other lead Ichabod Crane has a seemingly infinite amount of them. It got bad enough that her actor wanted to leave the show, which they did by having her sacrifice her soul in the season 3 finale for the male lead to live, and then they ended the show after season 4 anyway, because guess what, it’s a bad idea to entirely sideline and eventually kill off one of your leads!

2.) She was killed by the narrative to advance her white male co-protagonist’s plotline and I’m still mad about it, Abbie deserved so much better. This is an example of racism in the narrative too and it extended to the production of the show, see news coverage:

3.) Look, I only watched the first season but they killed her off the show SHE was a co lead of!! Misogyny AND racism, all rolled into one. I remember seeing the fan reactions and I was so mad on their behalfs. They wrote her off her own show and from what I recall, gave her less and less screentime leading up to that. Truly, she deserved so much better and I will always be upset by this.

[galsgeneration]

Same asker as the previous query about ships here. I wanna know how you feel about Shadow/Espio. It’s one of my fave ships, but there’s so little content for it even compared to other rarepairs. I feel that it’s OOC to some extent, as most ships with Shadow are (including Sonadow imo, even though I love that ship too) but I’m curious if/how you think Shadpio could work. And what you think about their dynamic in general. I’m always researching them but I assume you’d be more knowledgeable.

That's an awesome question! There's a particular charm in Shadow and Espio's dynamic when we get to analyze the characters' individual traits being displayed in the short interactions they've had thus far.

Considering the definition of "ship" in fandom usually leans toward romance, I personally can't see Shadow involved in some form with any of the characters, judging by how he thinks, acts and what we can conclude from his dangerously pure nature in the canon material (including Sonic X, as his characterization in the japanese script is faithful to his game counterpart). Espio, on the other hand, appears to be slightly more open to a conventional approach on the matter, but that would require further development and exploration on his relationships with other characters beyond the Chaotix, like Sonic, Rouge, Silver, etc.

As for creative content taking from the canon, it's only "out of character" if the intention within how they think of the other is somewhat changed, along with the characters' core traits, main relationships and their influence (or not) in the context of the specific moments they share with one another. With that being said, I can only say my personal thoughts on them based on what SEGA has already explored/showed, without going into "shipping" and "TV tropes" territory or "non-canon" media (i.e. Archie comics and The Murder of Sonic the Hedgehog).

Shadow and Espio share a few similarities here and there, when it comes to their methods and decisions upon facing the emergence of a threat and the opportunity to strike at the right moment (i.e. their stance on Mr. Tinker/Dr. Eggman before and after the Metal Virus incident in the IDW comics, except that Shadow was hellbent on taking him down straight away while Espio only verbalized the idea to Sonic after having to deal with the outcome himself). They are not opposed to killing, either.

Although Shadow is cold-natured (bearing in mind he's also a man-made weapon), Espio has a rather calm, stealthy and deadly approach in battle that's almost a parallel to Shadow's more feisty, ruthless combat style. Their fighting tactics are precise and deceptive, whether in an ambush or general warfare - each in their own specialty, since Shadow is a master in Chaos Control and Espio a nin-jutsu specialist ninja - and they're equally confident in their skills. Striking from behind and when the foe least expects it can be quite their thing, too.

I enjoy the first look we got into their dynamic during the Semi-Hero route of Shadow the Hedgehog (2005), after the events of Sonic Heroes. Understanding that Shadow was seeking for the truth about himself and his past, it's easier to picture how Espio could affect and assist Shadow in the future (if SEGA ever considers the idea) after they situationally teamed up when infiltrating Dr. Eggman's database. Espio had asked Shadow if he felt like giving him a hand in looking for some information the Chaotix needed at the time, and Shadow hoped to find something useful about himself. Therefore, the mutual aid would only be beneficial. In one of the japanese summaries of the game for the boss battle following this specific mission, Shadow acknowledges Espio's role in defeating the Doctor and escaping the electronic world with him.

Something I also find curious is the way Espio managed (or at least tried) to bring Shadow back to the present throughout the mission, upon noticing how much the doubts and misleading offers kept getting at Shadow. There's a lot of cool and high-spirited lines coming from Espio to ground and help Shadow zero in back on his main goal (i.e. "Stop thinking about it, let's just keep going"; "It's all nonsense talk to trick you at the end of the day"; "Right now, let's focus on defeating [Dr. Eggman] to get out of here."). Hence, I can see Shadow being neutral towards Espio as he never stood on his way, nor manipulated him for his own gain (Espio doesn't like dishonesty, after all!).

Despite the whole ordeal Shadow went through in his self-titled game, it's a fact that Shadow can be impulsive when dabbling with danger, meaning he can be distracted once caught up in his own thoughts/emotions or the thrill of a challenge sometimes. It's a nice detail in opposition to Espio's cautious behavior, since he isn't distracted easily; even when his team is at risk, he attempts to keep himself level-headed and not lose his focus.

Still, something they absolutely have in common is an interest for dangerous missions and (the semblance of) perfectionism. Espio enjoys the "aesthetic" of staying in the shadows, though he sometimes makes the mistake of sneezing and compromising his invisibility; Shadow is a perfectionist by his own standards and doesn't tolerate anything but the ultimate performance from himself and others (even if he miscalculates at times due to a myriad of reasons). The manner that Shadow and Espio see the topic of perfectionism and balance can be an intriguing point for conflict, too.

On another note, during the only verbal interaction between the two in Sonic X, Espio asks Shadow if he's going to rescue Dr. Eggman after the Chaotix gave him a ride, in which Shadow responds that his only target is Dark Oak. This also shows how Espio doesn't know exactly/can predict Shadow's motivations or actions, but his optimism remains present nonetheless. Regardless of the events in the anime not being canon, we can see how direct and brief their conversations are, especially after Shadow's clarification (and subtle correction). This aspect is not different in the mainline games, as they only address the other when it's extremely necessary, or if the situation calls for a change.

All in all, I believe Shadow and Espio, as a dynamic and hypotetical "pairing," can be very interesting if we put these moments into perspective instead of latching onto popular tropes we find oftenly in the fandom (it's also the case for many other fictional ones).

My thoughts and considerations on them got longer than I intended, but I hope this is what you expected to read (and understand) from how I view them! They do have the potential to work as an intriguing, fleeting duo in the absence of the Chaotix and/or Shadow's usual allies, but that's all up to SEGA. 😜

[blazehedgehog]

You need to reread Archie Sonic. I can assure you, it was not as nearly as good as you thought it was, and the IDW comic is not as nearly as bad as you think it is. Slow arcs doesn't mean bad arcs, and there's more character development than just "Surge attacks Sonic." And this arc clearly had an ending. Stop letting the metal plague arc overright your critical thinking skills. It was *years ago.*

My question to you is this: are you involved with the production of IDW Sonic? Because if you aren't, it sounds like you're taking something personally that was not directed at you and have saddled yourself with the responsibility of teaching me a lesson.

I'd like to point you to this post from six months ago, where I had nothing but nice things to say about IDW Sonic. I ran across it recently while digging through my blog for a different post (which I could not find, thanks Tumblr Search). Contrast that with the post where I say "the last six months have been kind of boring in retrospect."

I think I'm allowed to say that. I'm allowed to be bored. A story arc that amounts to "Eggman built a really big and scary city" feels weirdly low key and kind of bland (he's built a lot of cities), and none of the other story arcs feel like they've been paying off.

Coming at me from the angle of "WELL ARCHIE SUCKS TOO YOU JUST DON'T REMEMBER IT" is very strange to me, because that's just, like, your opinion, man. You even suggest the concept of opinion itself is fallible.

And maybe mine is. I dunno. Who I was yesterday is not who I will be tomorrow. But who I was when Archie was good thought it was great. I was practically counting the days for new issues. I was about to start a monthly comic review column for TSSZ just to have an excuse to get a subscription.

I was a different person back then. But also I was feelin' pretty high on IDW Sonic just six months ago and now it feels like they're stalling.

Yes, I said it's felt like something has been missing for a long time, and to some degree it has. The world of IDW Sonic revolves around six characters and four or five locations, and some of those locations don't have very strong identities outside of "it's like the place from the video games." The depth and the breadth of Archie isn't there.

But you at least had intent. Surge was interesting, Starline was interesting, Belle was interesting, Sonic jabbing Eggman about Mr. Tinker was interesting, everyone jabbing Sonic about letting villains go all the time was interesting, Tails was desperately trying to use the non-violent approach with Kitsunami. There was strong characterization for miles.

What have we had over the last six months?

Surge came back, and she repeated a longer, slower version of the same interaction she had with Sonic in issue #50.

It was revealed that Surge is having PTSD hallucinations of Dr. Starline.

Eggman built another city, but this builds and repairs itself, which doesn't actually mean anything given we've never drawn attention to how Eggman builds or repairs his cities before. The dude has a robot army, it's reasonable to assume he's always had cleanup and repair crews. Telling me it's "special" now isn't really exciting.

Tangle said the wrong thing, upset Whisper and they had a girlfriends moment about it. But given Tangle was just being the way Tangle always has been, this isn't exactly a major event.

We were introduced to Lanolin, who so far has very little backstory and barely established a personality besides "does not want to put up with Tangle's shenanigans." So like half the cast, then.

Team Dark was retconned back into existence, so Shadow gets to be part of stories again.

It doesn't feel like this is going anywhere right now, and the world around it isn't robust enough to pick up the slack and keep it interesting.

And you don't have to take it personally. You don't have to hit back. It isn't about you.

[cosm1cbrownie]

unironically i kinda hate how sonic feels and acts in newer media (specifically prime and a bit of idw)

rant/tangent time wooo

note: might be a bit unorganized due to this being on my old azz galaxy s7 edge lol

alright. So i just finished reading the idw sonic comics allll the way up to the the most recent side comic, Scrapnik Island #4.

So like, while reading the main idw comic i kinda felt like.. sonic was just kinda a dick near the end for no reason??? Like yeah hes mostly fine in the beginning but once we get to the point where people put these high expectations on him and hes basically under a lot of pressure (which i understand) but i feel like the way they are characterizing him is just :

"haha sonic doesnt care and acts on inpulse like a dick and doesnt recognize the shit hes done and is basically a little shit lmao he also is just kinda and idiot and seems to forget things on the basis of when it most convient for him !!!"

i didnt really feel much of it in idw until the later chapters, but it started to get prevalent when i was reading these in between me watching Sonic Boom. (The Show, which is my favorite outside of AOSTH.)

Now personally, i think Sonic Boom's charactasation of Sonic is probably the best one we have had in a long while. Although its a comedy, i like how sonic is aware of what's going on and takes into account what his friends are suggesting.

Like the episode where he does something that affects a citizen of the town, (minds going blank on what the towns name is lmao) and when his friends (and the other villagers) let him join the whole "talk about our feelings" club thing,

at first, he opposes the idea of apologizing saying that calling people "people" isnt bad, (ik this was played for jokes it still supports my argument.) they encourage him to recognize that what he did was wrong,, and they tell him to go apologize, and he does, albeit with a bit of "ok fine i admit it pls go away" but atleast he doesnt outright deny it or seem stupid for trying to do so and failing.

Thats my issue with prime, sonic just seems like an oblivious idiot who doesnt recogize how to read the damn room and listen to his friends when it matters most. He acts like a tiny child, which doesnt make sense to me, because hes been through adventures and times similar to this and for most of the newer media they dont wanna recognize sonics shortcomings and upbringings as a character at all??????? Like i think frontiers got it right with the story, and sonic who understood what was going on and stopped every once in a while to smell the roses and help his friends!

But in newer media outside of frontiers, it seems like sonic doesnt know how to smell the fucking roses every once in a while and stop thinking on impulse, like they are making him seem like he only acts on impulse, all the damn time, with no regards of what was or is being said to him or even taking it into account???

Like yes, we fucking get it sonic can sometimes act on impulse when hes in a stressful situation thats what makes him seem real, makes him seem human.

But, when you make him into this douche canoe who acts on inpulse all the time, disregards his friends when it matters most, and casually dissapoints them when ever he feels like it, or when it benefits him (cough cough the picnic scene in prime), i dont think most people would want him to have a good time, which im sure is the reason why most people, including myself, thought sonic deserved that punch from shadow. (who is great in prime btw, was okay in boom too but needed more time to flesh him out outside of 3 eps hes supper immature and i love him lmao) He's a dick. And i dont like him.

So, i hope to god they rewrite sonics character in prime s2 because he was unrionically just a giant fuckin dick instead of a snarky but caring 'anti hero' (like in boom) and that makes me really mad grahhhh

[also side tangent i dont hate prime (lemme make this clear) this whole sonic rant was just me nitpicking how sonic is currently in media outside of frontiers

ALSO ALSO SIDE TANGENT 2 HOW DID THEY FUCK UP SONIC SO BAD BUT GOT SHADOW ALL GOOD AND SHIT????? WHATT???? BRO THEY ARE POLAR OPPOSITE CIRCLE GRAPHS WHICH OVERLAP THEY ARE NOT THAT HARD TO MAKE SOBS INTENTLY]

[renapomissing]

Comic Sonic Super Study 6

Not just a study. It's a super study. Because there's another S I could fit in there.

This one's a lot more positive than the last one. This post also features a dead Superman.

Anyway! Onto Issue 20! This is a milestone for us! I think we're gonna get along juuuuust fine for the remaining 600+ issues we're gonna be together, for the rest of the entire Archie continuity, including Mega Man, due to the crossovers, and then when we switch to IDW (Cuz let's face it, IDW's definitely gonna make it to 100 before I finish this). Yep. We're gonna be in this for the long haul, y'all. Maybe after this, we can do Sonic Underground, even though it's not a comic, and TV doesn't rhyme with Sonic.

One thing you may notice about this issue is that Sally is in-character again. You may also notice that this story was not written by Kanterovich and Penders.

Make of that, what you will.

It was written by Angelo DeCesare, for what it's worth, and he's been on a lot of the issues up to this point. Also, the weight jokes are back, which, again, makes sense when you consider that DeCesare comes from that era.

Anyway, when the crew thinks Sonic is dead, they hold a memorial service with a crudely made statue of him.

First off, I love that Tails is their best artist. But also,

A couple of things here. One: I know you're alive, and we're going to avenge your death.

Two: Tails has immaculate handwriting.

Lastly, however, Tails’s unwavering faith that Sonic is alive is very sweet, and surprisingly consistent with what his character would go on to be, considering how little they had to go off of. Somewhere out there, there’s an alternate history where DeCesare was the one who handled the majority of the Sonic comic, instead of Ken Penders, and I feel like that reality has a much calmer, more unified fanbase. The cancellation still happens, because Archie grew to not want Sonic, but hey. Clearly, he can write more serious stories, since this one actually works quite well with the increasingly dramatic tone of the book. He’s also the one writer who seems to have no interest in the Sonic and Sally romantic pairing.

We could have had DeCesare

YO, THEY DID THE ROBIN DEBUT POSE WITH SONIC AND TAILS

I feel kinda bad now, because I neglected to mention the "Death of Superman" homage they did way back, so, uh...

FEAT: SONIC WITH A SINGULAR BLUE ARM!

This one's from the miniseries #2. Not to be confused with the actual second issue, #1. I'm not sure why they started from 0 either.

Anyway, continuing with issue 20, it' i's pretty messed up that Robotnik doesn’t really think much of the Freedom Fighters if they don’t have Sonic. And judging by his reaction when he read Tails’s letter, that might not be too far off from what Sonic thinks. But can you blame him? Their job usually amounts to pointing Sonic to Robotnik, and giving him the opportunity to strike. Yes, I said that the Freedom Fighters are allowed to be competent more than the game characters (at least, in the post-Jason Griffith era), but that’s not a very high bar to pass.

We get to the second story of the issue, and

Penciler Art Mahwinney and inker Rich Koslowski are a fantastic team. I love their art. They’re the same team who did the art on In Your Face, and I want more of them, even if I know this era will eventually end.

It’s also a little funny that the first story from this book features Robotnik, and debatably Sonic doubting the competence of the other Freedom Fighters, and then the very next story opens up with Sally actually being hyper competent. See? I am capable of saying nice things about Kanterovich and Penders.

Issue 21:

EY YO, IT’S AN ISSUE WITH SPAZ ON INTEREIORS! Savor it while you can, cuz this… this comes to a hard stop, if I remember correctly.

This panel is perfection.

Also, I’ll say right now, this is probably some of my favorite Sonic characterization. My ideal mix is this, and the Griffith era. I regret that he was missing his attitude.

Oh, how ya doin', Toei Sonic quills? Didn't expect to see you here.

All right, remember what I said about my ideal Sonic characterization? Maybe not this. This is Sonic treating this like a game, and it’s drawing Sonic’s reasons for doing this into question. Not too into this.

Not you, though, Spaz. You're doin' great. Love the motion blur.

So far, this is my favorite depiction of Sonic's speed in this book. I can feel the drag of the wind, and the whole thing just has this kind of weight to it that I love. It's easy to draw Sonic running fast, but it's another thing to make him feel fast, and for me, this is it.

So, in this book, we see what would happen if Sonic fought Amazo.

Bro, this panel goes so hard. Shoutout to the way Spaz draws Robotnik. Shoutout to Spaz, really.

Well, this post got really long, so that's it for now. Tune in next time, when we talk more about how awesome Spaz is!

[prowerprojects]

I wasn't gonna bring up this conversation on my blog because I feel like I always end up being negative when idw is brought up, and I don't actually enjoy being negative... (Also I have to note that I'm not some kind of character analyst or anything)

But I absolutely love your analysis on game!Sonic, it perfectly encapsulates why I love him!

He's already the coolest person in the world, he can't exactly get development unless he's gonna develop into a completely different person because he's already well, peak, like you said. I don't really understand why a lot of people don't want him to be cool, but want his personality to be kind of a... stepping stone on the way to... maturing? Growing up? I don't know. If it were true, I would actually feel tricked, they spent so much time pretending that Sonic is the coolest, but now it turns out he wasn't? Does it make me a dummy if I believed that he was?

(And I guarantee whatever it is people want Sonic to struggle with there's more than likely already a sonic character that has those struggles, maybe they should get a bit more love instead of both making Sonic ooc and making this other character feel redundant)

But now onto the actual conversation:

The canonicity of IDW

Here's what I think: nothing changed. IDW didn't suddenly became more canon because of that livestream. I think those people misuse the word "canon" a bit, same with them proclaiming Sonic Prime "canon". What they actually mean is that they're "canon" as in they take the elements from the games and base themselves off them, and aren't creating a completely new alternative universe compared to the Paramount Movies, for example, or previous comics/cartoons.

I mean, Sonic X had them all be Space Aliens; Satam had a completely different world that had nothing to do with the games just with Sonic, Eggman and Tails in it; Archie wasn't even canon to satam, not to mention the games; aosth was a Looney Tunes parody; Sonic Underground; Fleetway had the whole Kintobor thing, Tails being from alternative dimension and Evil Super Sonic; the old manga was a Captain Marvel parody. Even if those things do resemble the games, it's just barely.

But when you read IDW, you should assume that the events of the games had happened as they did, and 40 issues in it wouldn't suddenly get revealed that Sonic and Tails met when Sonic saved Tails from drowning, or that Sonic was literally in the delivery room when Tails was born or something. (Same thing with Prime)

However, it does not mean that the events or characterizations in idw have any bearing on those of the games. I mean, they literally don't. Since idw takes place after Forces, and Frontiers makes references to every game under the sun, why not anything that happened in idw? Why is Tails still so hung up on Infinite, when it would make more sense for him to bring up Metal Virus (or at least bring it up in addition to Infinite), an event more resent and utterly traumatizing (my baby was catching Ls left and right).

What Idw is, and will always be, is secondary canon. Canon, as long as the new game doesn't come out and contradicts it, and as such, easily ignorable. Secondary canon is a very widespread thing, it doesn't mean that the things that are considered secondary canon are bad, it's just that things that are considered primary canon don't need to take them into account. That's all. It's not an insult or anything.

Having 60+ issues of mandatory reading is not a good idea, people aren't gonna do it, and Sega would not take that risk. (Especially since a lot of countries don't even get those comics published.)

I mean, look at what happened in Dragon Prince. (And apparently the Rise of Skywalker, I only learned about it from the GamesCage comments, I've never seen a Star War)

I've seen a lot of people being upset, and a lot of people celebrating, but all I'm gonna say is "eh". It's all the same as it was before. (Also sorry if I sound a bit... idk condescending, explaining what secondary canon is and whatnot (and not even giving the actual definition), not my intention, I've just been thinking about it for a bit so I wanted to get it all out.)

My opinion on IDW being canon to Sonic

I watched a video by GamesCage on the topic, who I've been watching a long while on YT before subscribing to him recently on Twitch, and it reminded me of my own thoughts on the matter as well!

But first some preemptive notes because I am entering Sonic discoursespace:

This is just some guy's opinion about a little blue dude! That's it! If you hate it or me personally because of it, I refer you to this image:

I won't ever go into using insulting or uncivil language. But because this is an opinion essay and I got opinions up the wazoo, I'm also not trying to word things in some neutral, disinterested way to appeal to all audiences here

That being said, game-story-wise, we don't fuck with meta-era shit here. I Do Not See It

I'm all for chats and discussions about the topic, agreement or disagreement alike in response to this essay—things just ought to stay civil and respectful. Think of WWSD (What Would Sonic Do?) and the image above

Sonic's morality and what IDW misunderstands of it

Though I respect what the IDW team does (I fondly remember following Evan Stanley's Ghosts of the Future on Deviantart back in the day), I don't prefer their characterisation of Sonic, and that alone is enough to have me a little chagrined as to IDW's integration into the games' canon. I think it's because, ultimately, it detracts from what makes Sonic's character—specifically his morality—unique and appealing to me. Though he isn't nearly as anti-hero in nature as characters like Shadow, Sonic still has moral tendencies that are atypical for characters that occupy the hero role as he's been avowed to have in the games, e.g. being labelled Team Hero with Tails and Knuckles multiple times

To give some sense of signposting, here are the headings of this essay:

Sonic distinctive moral thinking - The games' simple, reactive Sonic - IDW's merciful, principles-first Sonic: on freedom and oppression - Sonic's self-centred in a way, though, right? The mascot problem - "What's your idea then, genius?" – the reader reading this - Why keep things static - Examples of peak Sonic Conclusion

Sonic's distinctive moral thinking

To contextualise my judgement of Sonic as distinctive in his moral thinking, I think there is a tendency in Western media to give heroic characters very merciful streaks. Think Superman or Batman—codes of never killing or always offering mercy, often with backstory or informed moral reasoning behind it. While these streaks are understandable, they appear often and thus don't ring as special or particularly unique to me. Sonic has always been interesting to me because he explicitly does not entertain such clear moral principles. His attitudes embodied in his SA2 theme "It Doesn't Matter," Sonic Unleashed, or the Storybook Series (Black Knight being my favourite), show that he just does what he thinks is right and shows no qualms using considerable force (lethal in the case of Black Knight) if he has to against those he thinks are doing wrong—even against people who he would be friends with, like Merlina. He does not barter or reason; he takes action, moves before he thinks, and follows his heart

The games' simple, reactive Sonic

From my interpretation of Sonic regarding mercy, examples from the games show how he isn't interested in rehabilitating or looking for threats to neutralise like some Miguel O'Hedgehog. These tendencies become most apparent when his friends are involved. A standout example is when Amy protects E-102 Gamma from Sonic, convincing Sonic that he isn't like the other badniks. Another, more indirect example is Gemerl, where Sonic fights and subdues him from causing more harm but Tails is the one who reprograms and rehabilitates Gemerl, who lives happily with Cream and Vanilla with his more peaceful disposition. Sonic doesn't go out of his way to help Gemerl post-defeat, but he doesn't doubt or attack him further after his integration either

At heart, I find Sonic to be a reactive, not proactive, hero. He won't go out of his way to check if the day needs saving—he's not a dutiful guardian doing patrol like Knuckles or a principled fighter for an organisation like Shadow—but if Sonic sees someone in need, he won't just pass them by. And I find Sonic's moral judgements to be simple, instinctual, and self-centred in the most literal sense. They come from his bias towards his friends' judgement and what he believes to be right, regardless of how others may judge his actions. I've only mentioned some examples, but they highlight to me that Sonic is neither healer nor hunter. His main priority isn't rehabilitating or reasoning with his foes—he will do what he feels he needs to do, even if that means destroying something or someone for good. But, as Amy for E-102 and Tails and Cream for Gemerl show, he won't go out of his way to make sure threats are dealt with through violence if his friends vouch for them.

IDW's merciful, principles-first Sonic: on freedom and oppression

In IDW, the topic of him showing so much mercy and espousing freedom as an ideal he thinks everyone, even his enemies, deserves makes him much more merciful and deliberate in his mercy than I like him to be. I want to discuss this by briefly expanding on oppression and freedom, a topic that comes up in Surge and Sonic's fight and Surge angrily questions why Sonic wouldn't just end her. Sonic essentially answers it's because he values freedom for all, including his enemies', because he can exercise his freedom to stop them. It's representative of why I think some fans take issue with Sonic's characterisation because it warps how much Sonic might believably value freedom versus oppression on two flops: on philosophical concepts and characterisation.

IDW's concept flop, to me, shows a fundamental misunderstanding on the nature of oppression and freedom, assuming some inherent ranking of freedom above oppression. The two are different things: freedom is a kind of instrument, a means of doing things, a concept that has no content in and of itself. In other words, you have the freedom to do X; having freedom is only meaningful insofar as it enables to do what you want. Oppression, however, is not an instrument in the same way; it makes far less sense to say 'you have the oppression to do X' or 'you are oppressed to do X' like you could for 'freedom' and 'free'. Freedom, precisely because it is an instrument, enables far more flexibility—both good, evil, and neutral acts can arise from it. Oppression is a state of being with an inherently negative core, predicated on suffering and the oppressed being harmed.

Quick and messy take from me on this: freedom for all and oppression for some is worse(!) than freedom for some and oppression for none. But here's something that has a source, leading to the characterisation flop: according to Sonic Adventure's DX Director's Cut manual, the only thing Sonic hates is oppression (for, presumably, anyone). Honestly, you don't even need a game manual to tell you that. I think IDW writers make the mistake of assuming the inverse to be true of Sonic as well: that the thing he loves most is freedom (for, presumably, anyone).

Oppression being the only thing Sonic hates does not mean freedom is the only thing Sonic loves.

It may be notoriously slippery to insist on a consistency in the Sonic franchise (or maybe franchises, plural), but this philosophical gloss on freedom and oppression starts to explain why IDW's characterisation strikes me as inherently contradictory to Sonic's preexisting values. Namely, it shows how IDW commits a false equivalence between the two and assigns it to Sonic. Sure, Sonic likes freedom, but that's different to showing mercy and second chances. IDW ends up conflating the two. As a result, IDW has Sonic care more about the principle of freedom than about the feelings and suffering he knows he or his loved ones have gone through. Put another way, it makes little to no sense why Sonic would prioritise freedom for all, even his enemies, when he has been shown to much more consistently put the most weight on what his friends feel and what he himself thinks. IDW does little to no detectable work establishing why Sonic would have such priorities either

Also, not a real argument—just taking things to the extreme in a throwaway thought—but could you imagine Sonic in the beginning of Unleashed actually considering Eggman's pleas saying he's changed and telling Eggman he...values his freedom? Like. c'mon

Sonic's self-centred in a way, though, right?

How about that self-centred angle, though? Sonic's way of thinking is highly independent—he will do what he thinks is right, first and foremost. It would be easy to claim that IDW's characterisation is just a mindset Sonic just holds in the comics, and that alone passes muster; his brand of ethical egoism admittedly does a lot as writerly cover to justify nigh anything about him. Looks like a hedgehog, smells like a hedgehog; chances are it's our hedgehog, right?

I disagree. One: if IDW is considered canon and yet is just so different to what's appealing about Sonic in the games, then the decision to make IDW Sonic canon, to be frank, kinda sucks. That ain't my Sonic—that's some Marvelised-DC version of him trying to moralise that I don't find compelling, distinctive, or endearing.

Two: even if you try to adopt the angle that upholding freedom for all would just be what Sonic believes to be right, it would still be the same as saying Sonic cares more about philosophical ideals than what he sees right in front of him. He's famously poked fun at Knuckles for being gullible before—why is Sonic himself showing that same gullibility and benefit of the doubt towards hostile enemies or those who have notably wrought so much damage to the lives of those he loves?

The trouble is that IDW builds no meaningful narrative foundations on top of which to stake this claim on Sonic's mindset when the games exist. Like, I don't even privilege the games just because they've been around first and for longer (even though, hey, that is true)—he's just cooler in them. Sonic is no philosopher; he's repeatedly shown it's genuinely not that deep when it comes to his moral thinking in the games. All it is is that he has a good heart. As a result, it comes off as a considerable mischaracterisation to show his enemies mercy mostly in the name of freedom or hope for their change (i.e. lofty ideals) compared to something actionable he can do (i.e. kick their ass and break their tech so they don't hurt anyone he cares about again).

The mascot problem

GamesCage mentions a worthwhile point which he calls the mascot problem. Sonic, as a mascot for Sega, has certain narrative lines he cannot cross or change for good. Like with Mario, there is a clear status quo to maintain; for one, Eggman cannot ever truly be vanquished. However, unlike Mario (with the one exception of Super Mario Galaxy), Sonic routinely has narratives that he and his friends undergo. There has to be this delicate balance that Sonic Team, IDW, and anyone writing for Sonic must contend with as a result. You have to write stories—events and plot where characters grow and change and are affected—but maintain the status quo where many fundamental things cannot change

In other words: how do you explain that Sonic never gets rid of Eggman or his other enemies because he, as a company mascot, cannot ever do so?

IDW does this one way by assigning Sonic an inadvertent little philosopher's cap, which I've already opined is a mischaracterisation. It also just generates another kind of untenable narrative problem that's even harder to reconcile: how do you justify that Sonic, hero with a heart of gold, just lets his enemies keep on going for freedom's sake? Arguably, all that does is dress up the mascot problem but with worse consequences—it makes Sonic less likable. It casts him as someone who essentially ends up condoning his enemies' actions, which has already led readers to question his judgement and whether they would even want to root for a character like that when you have an alternative and contradicting blueprint that the games have already provided for him. Like, my boy embodies direct action and IDW turns it into direct-ish-but-hey-do-what-you-want-who-am-I-to-judge action. Dress it up however you want; it's a nerf on who he is

"What's your idea then, genius?" – the reader reading this

In my eyes, what could work for the mascot problem is falling back on the static nature of the characters that have already been long established. The basic formula is there: Eggman is tricksy, proactive, and two steps ahead, but Sonic is always good-hearted enough, reactive enough, and fast enough to catch up by the end.

Elaborating on that formula, you have enough of Sonic's existing characteristics to justify why bad things keep happening despite his presence. He's not like Iron Man, who takes it upon himself to leverage his resources and power to look out for the world when no one's really asked him to. Again, Sonic is a reactive hero; he's not a ruthless hunter and he likes his peace and quiet as well as his adventure. He'll do what he can to fight what's right in front of him but may miss the bigger picture or potential traps by going in too fast. That happened in the beginning of Sonic Unleashed and it made sense. Even in Black Knight, you had him try to whale on King Arthur armed with just a decreasing number of chilli dogs. In an extended or episodic storytelling format, this allows other characters to shine—Tails's powers of analysis, Amy's ability to connect with others emotionally, Knuckles' sense of duty—by contributing to plans and helping Sonic because he has persistent, character-defining flaws. Highlighting his non-proactive and chill nature allows for arcs with more breathing room, too, where the characters aren't going up against some world-ending force or they all hang out. On that front, I'd say IDW has done well giving other characters that spotlight

Briefly touching upon Eggman's characterisation and how that might address the mascot problem, his tried-and-true tendencies should be relied upon, too. He is incredibly intelligent but also a massive narcissist—it makes sense that he has his own sense of short-sightedness where he prioritises and secures his own well-being above all else and underestimates the importance or wrath of godly and natural entities he frequently exploits and disrespects. Because of how strong and distinctive Eggman's brand of narcissism and villainy is, it is honestly fitting that he will never change; that alone explains how often he will cause trouble and will never fully succeed. And that also justifies why Sonic will always be the one to fight him. Both have their imperfections and flaws and that has them in a deadlock.

Why keep things static?

Now, this might bring up the question of static-ness. It might seem like an odd solution to mascot problem to just lean into it. Surely, there has to be greater justification or some potential for change for things to stay interesting, appealing, and compelling for Sonic and his stories.

In response, here's my hot take: ya don't need any of that.

Here's a longer version of my hot take: in any given narrative, Sonic is at his best when he does not grow or change. Sonic is already peak. Others may flounder and oscillate, but he remains steadfast with his heart of gold. He is a pillar of strength. He is static. Think of him in the Sonic Adventure games, characters and humans' reactions to him in Sonic X, the knights of the round table's reactions to him in Black Knight, Chip himself remarking that Sonic has such a good heart that not even the powers of a fucking dark primordial god infecting and transforming him can change who he is on the inside in Unleashed. When unstoppable forces come about, lo and behold, he is the immovable object they meet!

Sonic always stays on the move—that's how you can justify all the amazing, different, wild stories he'll go through, because he is an adventurer at heart. You don't need to humanise a character and subject them to point-A-to-point-B arcs to make them enduring, beloved characters. Just because that's a common format for characters and stories and comics to take nowadays doesn't mean that it's a good fit for Sonic. He's never been one to do something just because everyone else is doing it anyway. I, no joke, think Sonic should be treated like a mythical folklore figure, never-changing and transforming the lives of those he meets before breezing on by—and what figures are more enduring in our consciousness than those of mythology?

And, to refer to IDW, there isn't any need to wax philosophical on top of that. Like I've repeatedly said so far, Sonic is no philosopher (and saying this as someone who did philosophy for undergrad, thank fuck for that). Leave the philosophising and podcast soundbites and video essays to the fans—in fact, I'd even wager the simplicity of Sonic's premise and character, or, hell, even the dissatisfaction that can come from that, is why his fandom even thrives (but that's definitely a separate topic).

Examples of peak Sonic

I forget which interview this was, but Sonic's characterisation was inspired off of Bill Clinton (aged like milk I know; this was before his scandal with Lewinsky), from the idea that actions speak louder than words for him. Obviously, Sonic does get in his quips with his friends and enemies alike, but he's not supposed to be Marvel superhero about it and isn't actually a massive braggart. Even the first episode of Sonic X shows his confidence and demeanour so well—he doesn't need to moralise or talk your ear off for you to know he'll fuck you up. And that's just so much cooler than what IDW accomplishes with their version of Sonic

Like, consider my beloved Murder of StH, which the IDW team had a considerable hand in! Sonic—while recognising that the train is more advanced than other badniks, exhibiting personhood and consciousness—still has the sole objective of destroying the train. Everyone shines and, granted, the format has it so that Sonic doesn't really appear till the end, but he's characterised pitch-perfectly there, instilling so much hope and forward momentum not only in his gameplay but in the heart of the player. Honestly, his late contribution arguably echoes Sonic X, where he often disappears or does his own thing, too

Even in a game or storytelling format where he should be front and centre, you could even explore some big themes with Sonic precisely because of his mental and emotional fortitude! The Storybook Series are so stellar in this regard—you got Sonic helping out Shahra, domestic abuse victim, on dealing with sadness, and him helping Merlina with existentialism and death of all the fucking things. And he doesn't flap his lips about it; he shows it through his actions. He's the protagonist but not in a traditional sense—he's the support and passing through and being unfathomably fuckin cool about it. Any lessons he ends up teaching you is not because he's out to teach you—it's because he's just living his own way and, wouldn't you know it, you just happened to be around for the ride

Conclusion

I'm not excited about IDW Sonic being considered canon because he comes off as an overeager philosopher's take on him when game Sonic is fuckin goated with the sauce. Though the story ideas and arcs in IDW seem cool, Sonic is the heart of the series, and if he's off, then the whole thing ends up a little wonky for my tastes.

To be clear, I don't have issues with different iterations of Sonic as some blanket rule—if the writers do the work to establish why and in what ways Sonic in a particular story is different, then that's just plain fun. Movie Sonic, Sonic Prime, and Sonic Boom are all examples of that. But, above all, the kind of Sonic I adore (and there are in fact many kinds) is the one who you meet and your life is irrevocably changed for the better as he hangs out for a while but never for long. In pivotal moments in the comics, IDW Sonic misses the mark on that for me

Though Sonic Team are making clear moves to integrate all the iterations of Sonic as canon regardless. I do wonder if that, as a move in itself, is the meta-narrative equivalent of Sonic Team changing game-mechanic tacks every game after '06 and Unleashed—a well-intentioned but misguided way to try to appease everyone which I've always thought is the most anti-Sonic thing you can do, but that's just the mascot problem in corporate as opposed to story form.

I was fine with Sonic Twitter just saying 'Everything is canon' as a non-starter – I'll just see how they do what they're intending to do and if I don't like it, then I always got an AO3 account handy