#especially Garth and Wally

[givemewallywestorgivemedeath]

hello, i would like to hear about the titans fantasy au O.O

Oh man, you really shouldn't enable me like this... but if you insist!!

Alright, here's the setting: We're in some weird Lord of Rings/DnD fantasy setting with various magical creatures and inconsistent technological developments. Were tunics worn at the same time as ball gowns? Were carriages used at the same time as broad swords? I don't know! And I'm not doing any historical research! It's just haphazardly medieval!

Donna, for the most part, is relatively unchanged. She fits into this setting rather well. She is the demigod daughter of Zues, warrior in training, third in line to be Queen of the Amazons. At 13 years old she is a new arrival from her island nation and she is hoping to learn monster hunting (she's hoping to learn by doing). The one condition of her joining Diana was that she was supposed to stay with Diana at all times. Both of them nodded and smiled in agreement when their mother, the Queen, said this. Both immediately parted ways once their boat hit the shores of this new and exciting world.

Speaking of new and exciting, the King of Atlantis' ward is tagging along for the first time to see the surface world. Garth is fascinated (and a little terrified) and he's hoping to learn new types of magic! The Crown Prince (his older brother) Koryak says that he will make a fearsome mage one day and he really doesn't want to let him down. Garth imagines that one day his brother will rule as King and Garth will be there at his side as the Head Mage. He really has to work on his skills to get to that point though! Hence studying abroad. He's also... maybe... looking to meet some friends. Or any friends, really. He doesn't have any and he's heard good things.

Lord Richard of Gotham is so tired of politics. His... 'father' is the Crown Prince, next in line for the throne of Gotham. Not that anyone, including Bruce, is happy about it. The Kane family has had the crown for centuries and now, because the King only had daughters and Bruce's mom had the audacity to marry a Wayne (their rival house), they stand to lose it all. Thankfully, Bruce's status as Crown Prince is only temporary. As soon as Princess Kate Kane is married off, her husband will automatically be next in line. (Although they've sure been taking their time with that. What's the hold up?) So Bruce doesn't have to ever worry about being King and Dick (as Bruce's totally legitimate love child that Bruce didn't make up to make sure Dick could inherit everything if he ever died, don't do the math on their ages) doesn't ever have to worry about the throne at all. Sure, he's technically second in line but it's as far away from reality as a nightmare and just as scary. For right now all Dick has to worry about is being a squire, going on adventures and learning how to be a great knight! What could go wrong!?

Crown Prince Elroy is fucked. Seriously fucked. The old Crown Prince Oliver saw Roy at an archery competition and decided 'Yeah, that one.' Ollie offered him a room, food and all the arrows he could ever want. When Roy found out that Ollie was taking a page out of Robin Hood's book, Roy was overjoyed. The two of them had a blast stealing from the rich and giving to the poor. It was great! And then Ollie's father, the King, found out. He disowned Ollie, not that Ollie cared, and life went on as normal with one major giant exception. The King didn't have any other children (legitimate children anyway) and Ollie was now disowned. So the King legitimized Roy as Oliver's bastard child and heir. Or, sorry, Elroy because apparently 'Roy' wasn't fancy enough. Now Elroy is the Crown Prince. Elroy is under lock and key so that Ollie can't influence him. Elroy is being forced to study. (The King promised him that this was just to make Ollie see reason but Roy isn't so sure... the King is putting a lot of effort into his training...) The only saving grace is that Roy is being sent away this summer to learn sword fighting. Archery is 'a cowards sport' apparently and Roy 'needs to expand his horizons'. Well.. they certainly agree on that last one. Roy is making a break for it and he's not coming back.

Wally is a young apprentice working for his Uncle Barry. He's learning how to make medicine and treat wounds and find useful herbs. At least, he's learning that sometimes. A lot of his time is spent being a delivery boy. Uncle Barry says that's an important part of any medical treatment, actually delivering the medicine. Wally thinks that he just wants him to burn off energy. Regardless, Wally spends most of his time delivering medicine and he does it well. It helps that he can cross the continent before most people can blink their eyes. He can't tell anyone that though. Barry has made that part extremely clear. As far as their patients are concerned, Barry is a local doctor who just lives outside of whichever town they're in. There's a lot of things Wally can't tell people. Like how his eyes glow and magic lights up on his fingertips when he's excited. Or how he doesn't really like hats, he just has to wear them to hide his slightly too pointy ears. He gets it. He does. He's heard the whispered stories of fae, the hushed talk of changelings, he's read the old cracked tomes on the Elven Folk. He knows what people will think he is. But he isn't. He really isn't. He's just... Wally. And sure, he might be a little bit odd but he's just as human as the next guy, he swears!

Donna finds herself left on the doorstep of the greatest monster hunters in this new world. Garth is accepted to shadow some of the best defense mages ever. Dick finds himself stopping in with some fellow Knights (he is soon to be one after all) on his way home after a particularly hard mission. Roy finds himself shipped off to learn sword fighting from some 'trusted experts'. Wally is on a routine delivery run to drop off some supplies for his Uncle's good friends. Whether it's fate or something far more sinister, they all find themselves at the temple of the Knights of the Emerald Flame. Sir Hal Jordan, who was not ready for the sudden onslaught of children, panics and gives them a mission to get them out of his hair.

The rest, as they say, is history.

[actiondetectives]

I'm a real sucker for matching variant cover sets so I'm starting an appreciation series for them!!

Starting off with my all-time favorite set, World's Finest: Teen Titans #1-6 variant covers by Evan "Doc" Shaner

I'm an extremely obsessively huge fan of so normal about the titans so they will probably come up a lot during this, but this cover set is by far my favorite!! While connecting covers are very cool, the simplicity of this one's matching while highlighting each individual character across the 6 issues is just sooooooooooo good to me. Each one encapsulates the entire character is just one page so well and aaaaaaaaa thank you doc shaner. ALSO this series itself is phenomenal it's such a great introduction to the team it's written by Mark Waid and I would highly recommend it!!

[covertblizzard]

Teen Titans Chronology

Era 1: Superhero Names & Funky Nicknames

The Brave and the Bold (1955) #54 The Brave and the Bold (1955) #60 Showcase #59 Teen Titans (1966) #1-20 The Brave and the Bold (1955) #83 Teen Titans (1966) #21-22

This is the peak silly era. Goofy nicknames, (mostly) goofy one-off villains, occasional team-up, etc. As far as I'm aware, none of their real names are ever mentioned within their own title and it's just their superhero names.

It starts with Robin, Kid Flash, Aqualad (in the first Brave and Bold), with Wonder Girl being the first addition when they are officially first called the Teen Titans (in the second Brave and Bold), so I'm counting the Fab Foursome (Cool Quartet? Fantabulous Foursome?) of them as the starting point. They're a team up to #18 with occasional guests from Speedy (#4 - with notes that there were an "avalanche of mail" asking for his inclusion, #11), Beast Boy (#6 - rejected by the Teen Titans and apparently previously the Doom Patrol for not having a guardian's permission slip, interesting note that he already had movie offers here), and Starfire (#18 - definitely not who you're thinking of and instead a Russian boy).

Issue #19 is when they become "Fab-Four-Sometime Five" where Roy joins and Garth takes a break, so the main four changed. There are then two more team ups with Jericho (#20 - also not who you're thinking of but some boy name Joshua) and with Hawk and Dove (#21).

I think only Mad Mod became a long-term villain (?) but the list includes: Mr Twister, the Astounding Separated Man, Beast-God of Xochatan, Akkuru, Ding Dong Daddy Dowd (Demon Dragster), Diablo, The Ant (less villain and more blackmailed by Mr Krask), Mr Baltzer, Mad Mod, Honey Bun (and a spy Karl Larner), Captain Tiger, The Scorcher, The Gargoyle (who makes a reappearance in #35), Captain Rumble, The Dimensional Caper (from Dimension X), Le Blanc, Punch (Sylvester Sepastopol), Fat Cat.

Era 2: Real Names, New Teammates, Mr Jupiter, and Solo Storylines

Teen Titans (1966) #22-31 The Brave and the Bold (1955) #94 Teen Titans (1966) #32-34 World's Finest Comics #205 Teen Titans (1966) #35-39 The Brave and the Bold (1955) #102 Teen Titans (1966) #40-43

This part of the story starts to have a bit more personality and it is a lot more character-driven as opposed to (short) plot-driven stories. Their real names are finally used and they're shown to hangout as civilians and not just superheroes.

This starts at the end of #22 when Donna Troy is given a name, a backstory (one of many), a new apartment, a roommate Sharon, and a makeover. Dick and Wally was previously named in #83 of The Brave and the Bold, but Roy gets named in #24. In a way, this makes Donna feel very much like the living center of the Titans for me, her development begins with the Titans and she's intrinsically tied to it very personally (and this also feels reflected in how Garth views Donna as the "TITANS FOREVER" among all of them). After all, at this point, there's no separate comics she is in unlike the other 4 main titans. She is also the only single character that appears in every single comic with no exception (other than the very first, but they weren't known as Teen Titans then either).

There aren't so much guests as much as two new permanent members - Lilith who joins right before Mr Jupiter comes into the picture in #25 and Mal who joins right after in #26. During this time, 6 of them are mostly all there and are led and trained by Mr Jupiter. The longest disappearance is when Dick goes to college (from #25-32 except for a single appearance in #28) and occasional disappearance when they stay behind to take care of Mr Jupiter's lab (sometimes it is unexplained but I chalk most disappearance up to this). From #26 onwards, all but 6 issues are not related to Mr Jupiter (#28-29 led by Garth, #31 led by Wally, #34 and #42 led by Donna, and #43). This era also seems to establish Wally (and Donna) as de-facto leader when Dick is not around.

All other guests are really more part-time members such as Hank and Don who do their summer stint from #25-#30, Gnarrk who first appears in #32-33 and comes back in #39, and Garth who appears in #28-29 and #40.

For the first time (as far as I'm aware), a known villain gets brought into the story - Ocean Master (Orm) and an alien leader Mofo in #28-29 with Garth going after him. This part also established the easy-to-get-into-fights, easy-to-get-out-of-fights (among themselves) dynamics that I associate with the Titans. They start to place more importance on their insecurities and friendship.

There are also 2 main "friends get brainwashed" (for extended period) type storyline during this period of time (which later seems to become quite commonplace among the Titans): once with Donna (#34 which Wally doesn't see) and once with Garth (#40).

This is also the only era which has quite a lot of additional separate solo storylines. It start with Donna if you count "The Origin of Wonder Girl" in #22 (although it's kind of more like an additional story where everyone appears), and then Wally and Garth (with Tula) in #30. Garth (#30, #35, #36, #38) and Lilith (#36, #38, #41, #43) have the most with 4 each, Roy (#35, #38) and Hank&Don (#31, #39) have two each, and Mal (#35) and Dick (#36) have one each (like Donna and Wally). Superboy (young Clark) actually also has two - one with Dick (#36) and one with young Ollie (#37) that doesn't even have any of the Titans in it.

Crucially, contrary to how modern comics love to portray Batman and Robin's view on the Teen Titans, Batman actually fully supports the Teen Titans in the original and has never been shown to do otherwise almost at all. In fact, he is the one with the most team-ups with the Teen Titans and the team-ups almost always happen because he needs helps "relating to the teens" and he specifically calls on them, with full respect for them (even purposely allowing Wally and Donna to punch him real hard that one time to solidify their cover). The only mentor who does show disapproval is actually Aquaman (in Era 3), who does so because Garth gets mysteriously sick which he blames on the Teen Titans (sort of half-correctly).

Interestingly, up to this point there are actually more team appearances of what I'm calling Alternative 5 or Alt5 (Wally, Donna, Roy, Lilith Mal) than of Fab5 (Dick, Wally, Donna, Garth, Roy). In fact, up to this point there were 12 appearances of Alt5 over 5 appearances of Fab5. This is mostly because Roy and Garth actually have very little team-ups because Roy became a permanent basically the same time that Garth stopped being a permanent member.

Titans Villains (other than Ocean Master hat one time) in this era: Hell's Hawks, Harry Tout, Dr Pauling, Councilman Buckminster (Santa Claus), Demoness possessing Magda Drachwyck (Miss Wickersham), Calibano Della Loggia (x2), Four Horsemen of the Apocalypse, Black Earl of Moray, Captain Barstow's Phantom, Lord Beetle

Era 3: When Fab5 was Defined, More Teammates, Teen Titans West, and Splitting Up

Teen Titans (1966) #44-53 The Brave and the Bold (1955) #149

There was a more than 3 years gap from the last issue #43 in February 1973 to issue #44 in November 1976 which translated to a 2 year in-comic hiatus of the Teen Titans. There's also a change of regular writer from (mostly) Bob Haney to Bob Rozakis. All this culminated in a change in tone of the characters being a bit more aggressive and antagonistic towards each other, especially with Roy (note: Snowbirds Don't Fly happened in 1971 so it's not because that occurred in between the break since it actually happened before the break). They fight a lot more this era and the storylines are longer and bleed more into one another.

Another obvious change is that Wally is shown to be way more into Donna than before (in his thoughts especially) instead of their more casual flirting. Wally does eventually confess to Donna who rejects him in this era. The other "official" relationships are Mal/Karen and Lilith/Gnarrk (funnily because Mal/Lilith was a thing for a bit).

In story, Mr Jupiter decides to close shop (unknown reason) and so they broke up, with Mal taking care of the labs and the rest pursuing their individual careers instead as they agreed upon (but Mal is unhappy about). This... doesn't really make sense because I'm not sure what "individual career" Donna has, but never mind.

Lilith is no longer in the main team (later explained that she settled in the West Coast with Gnarrk which is very contradictory to her last statement in #43 that the Teen Titans is her family). Garth comes back from #45 when he is mysteriously summoned by Mal's horn and it's like he never left. He wants to resign in #51 because his insecurities making him physically sick, but he agrees to finish the mission and they all ended up disbanding anyway. Karen appears first in #45 as Mal's girlfriend and joins as Bumblebee in #49, but Duela joins the team first in #46. Because of these lineup changes, Fab5 appearances started to catch up to Alt5 until eventually Alt5 (15 appearances) just barely edges out Fab5 (13 appearances). Interestingly, Dick-Wally-Donna-Roy-Mal actually end up appearing most (17 appearances).

They (it's honestly mostly Dick, Wally, and Donna) discuss the idea of a new headquarters first suggested by Donna in #45 (like I said, she's very much the living centre of the Titans). Dick makes the decision (because he is Leader-Man and Bruce is funding it) to have their headquarters as a restaurant front, Gabriel's Horn (named after Mal's horn given by the angel Gabriel in #45), run by Mal and Roy (the jobless duo apparently) in #46 and they set it up in #49. Mal and Roy also started forming the rock band The Great Frog (a job!) in #45 which plays in their restaurant.

Teen Titans West first meet up and is established in #50 with some familiar faces (Gar, Hank, Don, Lilith, Gnarrk) and some complete newbies (Bette, Ch'al) to the roster. Issues #51 and #52 have the East and West team up, resulting in basically every Titans ever joining with the exception of Tula (but then again, at this point she only appeared in Garth solo story and never in the main storyline). At the end of which, they have a big feast (sponsored by Dick) and decided to part ways to improve and work towards eventually becoming the future Justice League (as they were always meant to).

The final story #53 establishes their origin and formation story which includes Roy, but had Roy basically saying he wanted to be involved only whenever he wanted and not permanently (ahem commitment issues), establishing Fab5 as the clear founders of the Teen Titans in the last issue.

There is a third "friends get brainwashed/used" (for extended period) type storyline with Lilith (#50-52), except she's not evil, but her powers are manipulated for evil. With Duela, there is also the first instance of villain's children in the Titans (in future there is Joey and Rose most prominently), setting up the stage for Titans raising villain's children. They actually brought Two-Face in to visit Duela at least once (right after a crime too???) which is... interesting?

This era has many more appearances of known villains including Dr Light, The Fiddler, Two-Face, and Mr Esper (Captain Calamity). The final issue is where Antithesis first appear (he is a recurring villain or at least comes back in future issues), and the remaining unimportant ones are: The Wreckers, Flamesplasher (x2), Sizematic (x2), Darklight (x2), and Rocket Rollers led by Brian the Brain.

Finally, there are some unexplained mysteries. Where the hell did Mal's horn go since it went missing in #49? Who is the blonde "Little Queen" that Garth meets from #36 (because I don't think it's Nirka McDuff from #40)? Who are Lilith's parents? What's up with Mr Jupiter? Is he Donna's dad (#35)? Do they ever make use of the possibly haunted mansion and fortune they inherited in #43? Why did Mr Jupiter not bother to make Roy, Wally, and Lilith face their fears (#38)? Does he think redheads have no fears? Are we going to address the fact that Lilith is apparently Juliet reborn (#35-36) and decided to give up Romeo (who she was very enamored by for a while) for Gnarrk?

To be continued~

Some Statistics (For Fun)

Most to least appearances, we have:

Donna (60) - only missing from the very first story before they were coined the Teen Titans

Wally (58) - missing from 3 stories all during Mr Jupiter era (twice unknown reasons and once because he is watching the lab)

Dick (54) - missing from 6 issues for his college

Roy (41)

Garth (37)

Mal (28)

Lilith (22)

Mr Jupiter (12) - not a Titan but I was curious so I counted him

Hank and Don (11)

Karen and Duela (8)

Gnarrk (5)

Gar (4)

Bette and Ch'al (3)

Tula (1)

Most to least trio appearances (within Fab5):

Dick-Wally-Donna (50)

Wally-Donna-Roy (38) - the love triangle lmao

Dick-Donna-Roy (33)

Dick/Donna-Wally-Garth (32)

Dick-Donna-Garth / Dick-Wally-Roy trio (31) - DWDG and DWDR limiting factor

Wally/Donna-Garth-Roy (14) - Roy/Wally-Donna-Mal/Lilith have more than this (25, 23, 19, 18)

Dick-Garth-Roy (13) - Fab5 limiting factor

For quartets, Dick-Wally-Donna-Garth (DWDG) quartet (31) ends up exactly equal to Dick-Wally-Donna-Roy (DWDR) quartet (31).

Special note that because of Lilith separation in Era 3, even though Garth is brought back, the Rebirth "OG" line up (Fab 5 + Lilith) actually only has 3 appearances together. On the other hand, Alt 5 + Dick have 9 appearances (but no Garth). World's Finest line up (Fab5 + Karen) have 7 appearances but only 4 of which Karen is actually Bumblebee and fighting with them, while the Silver Age Final line up (Fab5 + Mal) has the most with 10 appearances.

Ultimately, Lilith does still make more sense to me than Karen to balance the team with more girls, because she definitely was there earlier, had more appearance than Karen, and also doesn't have the additional association of joining because of Mal since she predates Mal. That said, the girl with the most Fab5 teamup might actually be Duela who also has 7 appearances with Fab5, all of which she is on their side (although half their issue was trust which wouldn't make so much sense if she was with them from the beginning). The person with most Fab5 teamup is unquestionably Mal though (10). It's curious to see what is more "valid" but my personal opinion is that there is no point in making a Fab6 just let leave it be and acknowledge it as product of its time.

If you want to have a look at the data out of curiosity, it's here.

[celaenaeiln]

What do you think of Nightwing/Robins relationship with each of the Titans through the years? Specifically Roy, Donna, and Wally.

With Donna and Wally it’s so fluffy! With Roy however I feel like they are either partners in crime or hitting each other where it hurts

You're so right anon. With Donna and Wally things are pretty much perfect but with Roy, Dick's relationship is back and forth but it's not because they don't like each other. It's because they like each other too much.

Donna

Donna is EVERYTHING to Dick Grayson. She's his sister, best friend, other half. Hardcore ride or die. He literally walked her down the aisle the day of her wedding.

Tales of the Teen Titans Issue #50

She also said she would follow him all the way down to hell and she damn sure means it.

Justice League of America (2006) Issue #50

These two aren't going anywhere but to each other.

Wally

World's Finest: Teen Titans Issue #5

Wally just loves Dick a lot. Like if he could Wally would just live with Dick forever and the two of them would just be happy for that.

You've probably read my other posts about Wally already but I'll collate them here just because it's a long time and it's a nice refresher.

Dick and Wally's friendship post

Dick as Wally's lightning rod post

How Dick and Wally in a relationship would go post

Roy

Like I said. It's not a problem but Roy's relationship with Dick is based on the fact that he loves Dick too much. He thinks Dick is the best thing in the world to ever exist. All the Titans think that but Roy wants to BE Dick. If you look at it, Roy's relationship with Dick is a parallel to Jason's relationship with Dick and Donna, Wally, and Garth's relationship with Dick matches exactly with Tim's relationship with Dick.

Jason thinks the world of Dick Grayson and tried his best to live up to him. He tried to fill in Dick's shoes which is exactly what Roy does.

Teen Titans (1996) Issue #13

He loves Dick to an extreme that he wants to emulate but finds himself struggling because he doesn't believe he achieves that. So, he acts out in order to recieve attention from Dick and Ollie and so on. He gets aggressive with the people he loves because he wants them to look at him. He wants to keep them looking at him. Which is the reason for the back and forth between best friend and angry friend moods he has going on with Dick. It's born out of respect and love and need for acknowledgement from the person who he considers is the greatest to have ever existed.

The reason I bring up Jason and Tim is because it's the clearest way to explain Dick's relationships with the Titans. The Titans and Dick's brothers hold him in the highest esteem - they just react to him differently. Wally,Donna, Garth, and Tim love Dick and think of him as the peak of perfection. So, Wally and Tim especially celebrate it by using him as an inspiration to be greater. In similar ways, Jason and Roy love Dick and think he's the peak of perfection and want to be him. They use him as inspiration but at the same time they feel the need to compete with him to prove their worth. Where Wally and Tim have just accepted that Dick is the best and can't be achieved by anyone, Jason and Roy actually do try to be like him. However you know what they say about Icarus - don't fly too close to the sun. Meaning, don't be too overly ambitious and greedy. I don't think there's anything wrong with what Jason and Roy do but the impact of what they're trying to achieve has negative consequences on their mental health.

They love him, want to be him, but personally feel they're falling short of him which brings in the mood swings. The rest of the Titans and Tim have a fluffier relationship because they don't even bother. They've just accepted that Dick is the best and go about on their day. So in summary, Roy's relationship with Dick is fraught with tension because of insecurities as a result of hero-worship. But truth be told, Roy loves Dick just as equally as Wally, Donna, and Garth. He simply shows his love a different way to him than they do because they're all their own individual people.

In terms of Dick viewing Roy, Dick is Roy's hardcore friend. He's a real one. When Roy was struggling with drugs, Dick single handedly dragged him into Rehab because he was there for him. Because for Dick, it makes him happy seeing Roy happy and successful.

The New Titans (1988) Issue #101

Titans (2008) Issue #23

And Roy literally holds down Dick when he freaks out and chases after Kori after she gets possessed at their wedding. The friendship they have is not the smoothest friendship but it's a real one. They need each other because when they're each at their worst the other other one comes in slaps the other around, gives a twisted love confession in the form of threats, and then they get better.

New Titans (1988) Issue #101

Dick is stubborn as hell but Roy is willing to put in the dirty work to pull him out. Same goes for Dick with Roy.

Outsiders is probably the best explanation of their dynamic. Roy put together the Outsiders because he didn't want Dick constantly depressed WHICH IS EXACTLY WHAT WALLY DID WHEN HE PUT TOGETHER THE TITANS IN TITANS (1999). But it comes off differently because Roy is more aggressive in the way he shows love. If Roy needs anything, Dick's there for him immediately.

Action Comics (1938) Issue #631

THIS. This scene is them.

They're a flipping hot mess that love each other. In other words, Roy and Dick's friendship is what you get when you put two egoists in a room together and tell them that they're going to die only for them to start beating each other up because they're each screaming that they love the other more and neither refuses to let the other one go first. Kinda like the song Style. They fall apart and then they fall back together for an eternity.

[jinkoph03nix]

So. I made some bad decisions and a DC comics Formula 1 AU is the result of them. More info under the cut I guess lol.

TEAMS

Note: this is a no capes AU, and all sponsor companies are neutral parties because of it.

Wayne Industries (makes engines)

Bruce “Batman” Wayne

Tim Drake

Damian Wayne (backup)

Dick Grayson (former driver, no longer associated)

Jason Todd (former driver, retired due to injury)

Lexcorp (makes engines)

Clark “Superman” Kent

Conner Kent

Jon Kent (backup)

Queen Industries (makes engines)

Oliver “Green Arrow” Queen

Roy “Arsenal” Harper

Artemis Crock (backup)

Star Labs (makes engines)

Barry “Flash” Allen

Wally “Flamebird” West

Bart “Impulse” Allen (backup)

Atlantis (uses Star engines)

Kaldur’ahm/Jackson “Manta” Hyde

Garth “Tempest” Ranzz

Arthur “Aquaman” Curry (former driver, retired, now team lead)

Themyscira (uses Wayne engines) 

Donna Troy

Cassie Sandsmark

Diana “Wonder Woman” Prince (former driver, retired, now team lead)

Lantern Corps (uses Lex engines)

Hal Jordan

John Stewart

Kyle Rayner (backup)

Zatara (uses Wayne engines)

Zatanna Zatara

John Constantine

Kord Industries (makes engines)

Ted Kord

Jaime Reyes

Hawks (uses Lex engines)

Carter Hall

Shayera Hol

DYNAMICS

TEAM

Hawks and Zatara are relatively low performing teams, but have loyal fans that root for them as underdogs.

Kord makes its own engines but has only started recently, and used to be a relatively low performing team but has begun to make progress.

Lantern Corps, Themyscira, and Atlantis are all solidly performing and occasionally make it to top spots.

Wayne, Lex, Star, and Queen are all top performers, and all make their own engines. 

Wayne tends to perform the best overall and has the largest fanbase, but also has some of the most vocal critics, including some coming from inside the house.

INTERPERSONAL

Dick Grayson used to drive for Wayne but is now retired and fully supports his boyfriend Wally West's team, which initially caused a scandal when they started dating.

Jason Todd also used to drive for Wayne but got seriously injured during a race, prematurely ending his career. Nowadays, he's mostly out of the public spotlight.

Jason is also secretly dating Roy Harper, but the public has not found out yet.

Kaldur'ahm and Garth have the fiercest intra-team rivalry in the league, but it mainly stays on the racetrack.

Tim Drake and Conner Kent have the most public inter-team rivalry, but also regularly flirt with each other. The internet eats it up.

Roy and Wally have somewhat of a rivalry, but it’s less obvious to those on the outside.

Hal and Barry also have a bit of a rivalry during races, but are close friends outside of them.

Tim Drake and Damian Wayne have a very big rivalry but because Damian is consistently a backup driver, it normally does not gain much publicity. They, however, do not limit their rivalry to the race track.

Donna and Dick used to be rivals, but are now good friends and work together helping F1 Academy.

Bruce and Clark are constantly rumored to be secretly dating, but these rumors are unfounded (at least for now). They do not consider each other rivals beyond being the two drivers consistently vying for the top spot in races.

Jaime and Bart are really close friends, but rarely race each other because Bart is a backup driver. They hang out a lot in the paddock, however, and fans love their interactions.

Arthur and Diana used to have a massive rivalry, and it has continued into them both being team managers.

People speculated that Dick would’ve been contracted by Lex if he had kept driving, as he was pretty good friends with Clark especially.

PERSONAL

Bruce and Clark are hailed as the best two drivers on the track currently, and both have massive fan bases.

All of the Wayne drivers tend to be more serious/argumentative over comms, and are very competitive.

Bruce and Tim are a powerhouse for racing strategy, and their calls are almost always the right ones, even if their pit team doesn’t always trust Tim’s calls yet.

Bruce gets called a DILF a lot, but doesn’t know what it means, so he ends up accidentally playing into it

Dick Grayson used to be a fan favorite and The Eye Candy for the league. He was majorly respected by his team and fans because of his smarts and because he had a far more approachable personality than the rest of the Wayne drivers.

Since Dick left, he has functionally become an Instagram boyfriend for Wally. He also helps out with some of the F1 Academy/driver talent finding programs in addition to helping support Star.

Jason Todd used to be a very competitive driver and got a lot of fans because of his creative shit talking before he retired.

The Lex drivers are known for being very friendly both on- and off-track.

Conner tends to be reckless while driving, which has resulted in several times where Tim has gotten mad at him because of it.

Conner is very much a PR liability and will say the most random and out-of-pocket shit when you least expect it.

Conner is seen as a very “cool” and fashionable driver, which has gotten him a lot of fans.

Tim and Conner are both fan favorites and projected to be the spiritual replacements for Bruce and Clark when they eventually retire.

Bruce and Clark are both speculated to be preparing to retire soon, but still haven't done so.

Clark presents himself as more of a goofy dad off-track, and the other Lex drivers usually rope him into doing social media stuff.

Roy Harper and Artemis Crock both are highly competitive drivers and are the most likely to be guilty of swearing over the radio, which their fans all find funny as shit.

There’s also a very dedicated portion of the fanbase that finds Roy incredibly attractive.

Roy has fully shown up to race weekends with visible love bites before and has never acknowledged them. Most people suspect he's just dating a random person from his personal life that he doesn’t want to reveal because they’re not a public figure, but there is an extremely dedicated conspiracy community that thinks it’s Jason. Most people just meme those guys. Jason finds this funny as fuck.

Oliver Queen tends to be generally serious during interviews, but is also is down to do any social media trend he gets roped into. His fans call it cringe, but they keep watching regardless.

Oliver Queen’s wife Dinah Lance isn’t really associated with racing but she is an entertainer that is often featured at races. Outside of that, she doesn't pay much attention to the sport.

The Star drivers are all very friendly, but are very creative shit talkers over the radio.

The Star drivers are also known for their reflexes being very good even compared to other top teams, but are also known to overestimate the power of their cars.

Barry is seen as a goofy dad both in and out of the car, and will regularly crack jokes during races.

Barry also has a proven track record with very good strategy calls, rivaling those made by the current Wayne drivers.

Wally tends to be a bit more willing to take risks during races, but it generally proves well for him as he’s known for being really good at overtaking people.

Bart earned his nickname for just how risky some of his driving calls are, and they don’t always pay off. This is the main reason why he’s usually on backup.

Bart is also a PR liability because of how much he will run his mouth during interviews, which also makes the decision to keep him on backup easier.

Arthur is a really chill coach off-radio but is highly competitive on-radio, especially against Diana.

Kaldur'ahm tends to be a pretty chill driver but still takes his job seriously. He is mostly a team player nowadays except for when he’s dealing with Garth's antics.

Kaldur will try and one-up Garth’s attempts for fastest laps, and usually succeeds.

Kaldur is also seen as one of the better-looking drivers, but his fans tend to be more chill about it.

Garth is highly competitive but primarily against Kaldur, and does shit talk Kaldur if/when he successfully one-ups Garth.

Donna and Cassie are a fan favorite team, especially among younger female fans, and they are both incredibly sportsmanlike and personable. 

Cassie tends to be a pretty funny during interviews, but Donna tends to be slightly more reserved. Both are well-respected.

Donna also helps out with F1 Academy.

Diana is a relatively strict coach but makes good strategy calls and is highly respected by her team and fans. She also regularly hangs out with her drivers and acts as a mentor for them both.

The Lanterns are an older team and a bit more reserved than other teams, and are also very sportsmanlike. This gets them a lot of respect from the general racing fan base.

All the Lanterns are veteran drivers as well.

Hal tends to get called a DILF by fans, and while he takes the dad part in stride, he tries to avoid joining in on social media trends to avoid stoking the rest of the sentiment.

The Zatara drivers both tend to get a lot of thirsting from fans, and while they definitely play it up, they mostly treat it as a joke.

The Zatara drivers also tend to be pretty chill. Both realize and accept that they’re not the most competitive drivers, so they instead attract fans by being quite creative shit talkers.

Kord is an underdog team trying to become a consistently high-preforming team, and have a lot of people rooting for them because of it.

Jaime is a fan favorite especially because he’s pretty funny and a lot of people find him good looking.

Jaime doesn’t always make the best strategy calls, as he’s relatively new. He's getting better thanks to Ted's mentorship, however.

Ted is a bit of a goofy dad personality and is a veteran driver. His veteran status allows him to better mentor Jaime while still being the primary driver for the team.

Ted’s husband Michael Jon Carter is the gay equivalent of a massive wifeguy (positive), and shows up to all of Ted’s races. Fans find it very cute.

The Hawks are pretty chill, but also seen as very tired and not as invested in the racing anymore.

The Hawks also realize they're not a very competitive team, and do not pretend to be.

There’s been rumors of the Hawks disbanding for some time now, but they keep coming back because no other teams have been formed to replace them.

That's all I've got for right now, we'll see if I update this more. If you want to see more from this AU, let me know! Also you can blame @fivespade for me posting this (thank you for dealing with my ramblings about this AU bestie) :P

[incorrectfabfifteen]

Hello, welcome to Incorrect Fab Fifteen, a blog about all things Silver Age Teen Titans! I've come up with the term Fab Fifteen to broadly refer to all of the members (which I'll explain below) as well as a natural expansion of the Fab Five (plus, it's better than just calling them the OG Teen Titans or the 70s Team).

For DC newcomers, don't be afraid of some of the comic terminology present, they'll make sense with more exposure.

Introducing: The Fab Fifteen!

Dick Grayson

Full name: Richard John "Dick" Grayson

Alter Ego: Robin I, Nightwing, Batman III, Red X

Birthday: March 20th

Love interests: Bette Kane (Pre-Crisis), Princess Koriand'r, Barbara Gordon, Helena Bertinelli (DCYou), Bea Bennett [There's probably more, feel free to send an ask so I can fix this]

Reading recs: The Judas Contract, The Cheshire Contract [collected as Nightwing: Old Friends, New Enemies], Nightwing Vol 1 by Chuck Dixon, Batman & Robin, The Black Mirror, New 52 Nightwing by Kyle Higgens

Wally West

Full name: Wallace Rudolph "Wally" West

Alter Ego: Kid Flash I, The Flash III

Birthday: January 16

Love interests: Donna Troy (Pre-NTT), Rachel Roth (🤨?), Frances Kane, Linda Park, Jesse Chambers

Reading recs: Born To Run, Savage Velocity, The Flash by William Messner-Loebs and Greg LaRoque, The Flash by Mark Waid, Flash Forward, The Flash by Jeremy Adams (especially The Return of Wally West and One-Minute War)

Donna Troy

Full name: Donna Hinckley Stacy Troy

Alter ego: Wonder Girl, Troia (Who Is Wonder Girl? until Total Chaos; JLA/Titans until Infinite Crisis; No Justice onwards), Darkstar (Zero Hour until Meltdown), Wonder Woman IV (Who Is Wonder Woman?)

Birthday: April 26

Love interests (oh boy): Dick Grayson (FORMERLY), Wally West (only during the Silver Age + some weird thing during DC Rebirth), Garth (Titans 2018 + Titans United), Roy Harper, Kyle Rayner

Reading recs: Who Is Wonder Girl? [Collected in The New Teen Titans Who is Donna Troy?], Wonder Woman By John Byrne Vol. 3, The Return of Donna Troy, Wonder Woman: Who is Wonder Woman?, Titans: The Spark and Into The Bleed

Garth

Full name: Prince Garth of Shayeris

Alter ego: Aqualad (also legal name until Crisis), Tempest

Birthday: March 6

Love interests: Donna Troy, Tula Marinus, Dolphin, Lilith Clay (temporary)

Reading recs: World's Finest: Teen Titans, Death of a Prince, Tempest by Phil Jimenez, Aquaman by Peter David, JLA: The Obsidian Age, Aquaman: Underworld

Roy Harper

Full name: Roy William Harper Jr.

Alter ego: Speedy, Arsenal, Red Arrow

Birthday: November 1

Love interests: Donna Troy, Jade Nguyen, Kendra Saunders

Reading recs: Snowbirds Don't Fly, The Cheshire Contract [Collected as Nightwing: Old Friends, New Enemies], Arsenal by Devin Grayson, Outsiders 2003, Justice League of America 2007, Infinite Frontier, Green Arrow 2023

Lilith Clay

Full name: Lilith Jupiter-Clay

Alter ego: Omen

Birthday: Not stated but her debut was November 18

Love interests: Gnarrk, Donald Hall, Garth, Bette Kane

Reading recs: The Terror of Trigon, Teen Titans by Dan Jurgens, Teen Titans: Life and Death, Titans Hunt (2015), Titans Rebirth

Mal Duncan

Full name: Malcolm Arnold "Mal" Duncan

Alter ego: Guardian (Pre-Crisis), Hornblower, Herald (Post-Crisis), Vox (Infinite Crisis until Flashpoint)

Birthday: Not stated

Love interests: Karen Beecher

Reading recs: Silver Age Teen Titans, Titans Hunt, Titans Rebirth, The Other History of the DC Universe #2

Fun fact: Mal Duncan was featured in the first interracial kiss in comics history with a goodbye kiss between him and Lilith!

Karen Beecher

Full name: Karen Beecher-Duncan

Alter ego: Bumblebee

Birthday: Not stated

Love interests: Mal Duncan

Reading recs: Silver Age Teen Titans, Titans Hunt, Titans Rebirth, The Other History of the DC Universe #2, Doom Patrol by Keith Giffen

Don Hall

Full name: Donald Hall

Alter ego: Dove

Birthday: Not stated

Love interests: Lilith Clay

Reading recs: The Hawk & The Dove, Silver Age Teen Titans, Crisis on Infinite Earths

Hank Hall

Full name: Henry "Hank" Hall

Alter ego: Hawk, Monarch (Armageddon 2001), Extant (Zero Hour until JSA)

Birthday: Not stated

Love interests: Dawn Granger, Ren Takamori

Reading recs: The Hawk and The Dove, Hawk and Dove: Ghosts & Demons, Hawk and Dove (1989), Birds of Prey (2010)

Dawn Granger

Full name: Dawn Marie Granger

Alter ego: Dove

Birthday: Not stated

Love interests: Hank Hall, Sal Arsala

Reading recs: Hawk and Dove: Ghosts & Demons, Hawk and Dove (1989), Birds of Prey (2010)

Duela Dent

Full name: Duela Dent

Alter ego: Joker's/Riddler's/Penguin's Daughter, Card Queen, Harlequin

Birthday: Not stated

Love interests: Earth-1 Dick Grayson, Earth-3 Dick Grayson

Reading recs: Silver Age Teen Titans, Teen Titans: Titans East

Bette Kane

Full name: Mary Elizabeth "Bette" Kane

Alter ego: Batgirl (Pre-Crisis), Flamebird (Post-Crisis, current mantle), Hawkfire (N52 Batwoman only)

Birthday: Not stated

Love interests: Dick Grayson (Pre-Crisis)

Reading recs: Teen Titans Vol 1 #50-53, Hawk and Dove Vol 3 Annual 1, Beast Boy (2000), DC's Legion of Bloom

Charley Parker

Full name: Charles Edmund "Charley" Parker (human name); Ch'al Andar (Thanagarian name)

Alter ego: Golden Eagle, Hawkman IV (Rise of the Golden Eagle)

Birthday: Not stated

Love interests: Kendra Saunders (I think?)

Reading recs: Hawkman: Rise of the Golden Eagle,

Tula

Full name: Tula Marinus

Alter ego: Aquagirl

Birthday: Not stated

Love interests: Garth

Reading recs: Tempest by Phil Jimenez, New 52 Aquaman, Mera: Queen of Atlantus, Aquaman by Kelly Sue DeConnick, Aquamen

So a special note: despite Beast Boy being a part of the Titans West (as well as appearing in the above photograph), they do not count as part of the Fab Fifteen, mainly because he's already part of the New Teen Titans. Also note that this acc won't be using the New 52 version of Duela Dent (although the Gotham Knights version is fine so feel free to send in any hcs about her)

Also you maybe be asking why Gnarrk's entry is below instead of with everybody else. That's because Gnarrk was never a Titan in the first place. Sure, he appeared as part of the title and was there when the Titans West was formed but he never actually joined the team at all. Gnarrk becoming a Titan became a thing when he was introduced following the New 52.

Gnarrk

Full name: Unknown

Alter ego: Caveboy

Birthday: Not stated

Love interests: Lilith Clay

Reading recs: Titans Hunt (2015), Titans Rebirth

Uhh, yeah, so that's the Fab Fifteen! Again, don't worry about this technical jargon if you're a newcomer and you just wanna look at the other posts, we're all here to have fun.

[mysterycitrus]

im redesigning the titans so for my own personal reference —

dick has curly hair, maybe in the range of 3a-4c type curls. he doesn’t really take care of it but they coil super easily, especially when it’s longer. he keeps it at his shoulders, maybe with a fringe. he ties it back a lot. darker complexion, a strong nose, dark blue eyes. he has a beauty mark on his left cheekbone. he smiles like his dad, but he has his mother’s eyes. the shortest titan, but it’s easy to forget because he always seems much taller than he is

donna’s got curlier hair, with proper ringlets. she and kory do each other’s hair, and she’s a big fan of oversized claw clips. a roman nose, olive complexion, brown eyes. wide shoulders, strong arms, big fan of bangles and bracelets and rings — always in silver. if someone buys her gold jewellery she gives it to dick. the tallest, along with garth. she smiles with her whole face.

roy’s very tan, very freckled, with high cheekbones and an aquiline nose. his hair is more of a dark copper, and his eyes are hazel. he’s always stubbled, no matter the time of day. broad shoulders, and he’s got a tummy! lots of upper body strength. long, calloused fingers. he’s slowly growing his hair out, and it falls very straight. he’s taller than dick, but shorter than wally

garth is almost as tall as donna, high body fat as an underwater dweller, and always smells of the tide. curly hair that’s always crusted with salt and sand. the clearest skin — so soft to touch. dolphin braids his hair for him, so it doesn’t dry weird when he’s on the surface. keeps having to adjust his posture a little, when he’s walking around. his eyes are violet, like a sunset

wally is pale. very light complexion, pale eyebrows and eyelashes, lots of freckles, light green eyes. he keeps his hair short, and it’s always blown up off his forehead. roy calls him sonic the hedgehog. very lanky, with a runner’s build. upturned nose, strong jaw, struggles to grow facial hair. roy’s hair is red, but wally’s is almost a strawberry blond. when he goes outside without sunscreen, he crisps up like a bacon rasher

[allovesthings]

One of the things I find really frustrating with the Devin Grayson Nightwing run is the lack of consistency between the titans, the rest of the batfam and the Nightwing title.

I know Donna is dead (I think) either at the same time or right before his building blows up but I know because I looked it up, not because I read Nightwing.. Why is Nightwing not allowed to grieve for her in his own comic ? Why is this, as in the death of his best friend, not even mentioned ?

Worse than that.... Why is nobody but Alfred there after his building blows up ? Where is Batman ? And the Titans still alive ? He has a large group of friends. Are you telling me Roy or Wally or Vic or Garth or just anybody else from said group would not look for him after his entire building blows up, which made the news, especially considering Donna just died as well ? I get that they have theirs own comics, but guest starring has been a thing ?

Also Babs is literally Oracle and Dick collapsed, crying in her apartment a few days ago when Haly's cicus was destroyed ? Why is Amy the only one worrying about where he is sleeping ? Babs is Oracle, her literal role is to be eyes for superheroes, right ? And Nightwing is again, I feel like emphasizing, on the news, on a rampage (sort of, he is not killing anyone).

I also understand that Dick is probably isolating himself but Nightwing is having a full-on mental breakdown on the news ? Where is everyone ?

Also, sidenote... Fucking Wally, as in, one of Dick's other best friends, went to check on Babs after their break up, but not Dick ? Why couldn't he do both ?

[royboyfanpage]

https://www.tumblr.com/big-gay-apocalypse/732547558666289152?source=share

how do these pannels make you feel. they make me feel sad

Hi anon!

For context these are the panels Anon sent me-

For starters, it's totally understandable that these panels make you feel sad! That's clearly what they were written to do.

However.

I can't take it seriously because it's RUDY WEST. Rudy West is not comparable to Oliver Queen! Rudy West is absolutely not a better father than Ollie!

I mean, aside from the fact that it's pretty hard to be a worse father than Rudy West and Roy would absolutely not be "a better person" if he was raised by the Wests, like. Ollie and Roy didn't have that much of a bad relationship when Roy was a teenager. Obviously Snowbirds happened and that changed their dynamic and created a whole lot of tension they had to work through, but this is clearly pre-Snowbirds, and since Ollie still has money+Queen Industries it's also presumably pre-Hard Traveling Heroes, which is where the idea of Ollie not being around stems from. Was there conflict? Sure! But not to the extent that the Teen Titans would be blaming Ollie for how Roy is (actually, the "its not his fault the way he was raised" angle is more accurate for Dick than Roy, but I'm not gonna get into that). And I am doing a lot of explaining and defending for a man who's competition is Rudy West.

Fundamental misunderstanding of Ollie and reducing him to "Batman with arrows" my beloathed.

Also another big issue is the fact that Roy's meant to be some spoilt rich brat, which doesn't really make sense?? I mean, Roy grew up on a reservation, and at this point he's living with Ollie who, based on this panel, is implied to still be at least kinda socialist in this timeline. He's not gonna be some disconnected nepo-baby who shames Wally for his parents' financial status, even at his most insecure, which I guess is the angle they're taking here.

And also why is Garth the one defending Roy? Garth doesn't care about Roy at best at this point, and actively dislikes him at worst. Especially considering Roy's treatment of Garth is arguably worse in this than in the original Teen Titans run. Idk, it feels like it's trying to make Garth into the quiet emotionally mature kid in this scenario, which i don't feel is very accurate to who Garth actually is (I'll admit I'm only recently getting into Aqua comics so I don't have a complete grasp of Garth's character, but I get the impression that he's definitely not as much of a pushover as this comic presented him as- in the original Teen Titans run he was bantering as much as the others were, and he did have moments where he'd get aggressive, such as when the Titans refuse to help him because of their 'vow')

I'm not gonna say I hate this comic. There are some parts of it I really love, like

These panels are cute as fuck and I adore them. I think that the comic really works as its own story outside of the main Teen Titans continuity, with its own interpretations of the characters and their stories. But if you try and apply it to the original Teen Titans series, it does get kinda messy.

So yeah, in conclusion, the panels are sad if you look at them within the story, but I just can't take it seriously in a broader scope because y'know. Rudy West. I'm not even that big of a Flash fan and I still know Rudy West is the worst guy.

[wellzofyouth]

What are some of your unpopular comic opinions? Dc or otherwise

I'm gonna do milquetoast unpopular opinions because I don't wanna argue with anybody today

stop writing superbat so sanitized!!! I want Bruce to ruin Clark's life in the best way possible. But also make it cute! I want to feel the yearning and I feel like most art fails to reflect that. Like they'll make Clark a masculine Dom top and a r*pist and I'm just like okay. I want them to be pathetic together.

Also people who hate on superbat for being toxic are incredibly boring and uninteresting. Also I see this criticism a lot from *certain* people but Superbat isn't OOC. In fact see point 8* for my feelings on that

Also I would like more stories from Clark's perspective without him being evil 😇 give him sexual repression and survivors guilt too. I want more stories about him being an immigrant.

People who call Bruce abusive are so fucking annoying I'm sorry. Especially because I'm not a fan/don't read most of the shit they're pointing to but also because the standards of child abuse changed during history and comics reflect that. Like fucking get over yourselves he's not real. God forbid you bring up the writing of some of their faves....

People would complain about batfandom getting their characters wrong/clogging up the tags are just as annoying as people who do those things. Yall are just going to have to accept that Batman is THE most popular superhero in DC and that people are going to relate him to your character. For good reason too since he is in every comic basically. Just block or move on already. Literally mute the tag like I do. You're not oppressed for being a green lantern stan. Well maybe you are if you like Guy.

Garth should be in more adaptations and media wtf????? He's basically a khia

Teen titans and Yj cartoons are both different shades of mid. I don't like Starfire in TT at all :/ and Yj just blows. Teen titans is iconic though and I loved it as a kid.

Wally is unfunny. :/ no hate to him tho. I just don't find the way most writers write funny characters to be funny. Probably because they're all cishet white guys who take themselves too seriously.

Clois loves to watch real housewives together ❤️ I know this in my soul and I will not hear otherwise. Not even unpopular just a headcanon

OOC doesn't exist for comic characters. I used to believe otherwise but I am fully on the team of OOC doesn't exist. There is simply too much history for most of these characters to have one based solid characterization so I will never hate on fanon. People on here can be such pretentious little fucks when it comes to other fans. Like just mute or block bitch damn. They don't hurt anyone by saying Tim drinks coffee and plays fortnite

I dont like most canon straight ships sorry 😭 I'm not naming names but they're all boring as hell. That does not mean I hate all straight ships. I can only see some characters like Dick as straight unfortunately and I do like batcat and clois but the others are just so.... yaoi and yuri won this round. They're all gay people to me

But also I dislike most popular ships in this fandom in general. Yall are missing out some good ass yuri to pair up men with no chemistry. Come on 👎👎👎👎

Green Lanterns are all hot asf. Not even unpopular I think. Hal, Kyle, and Alan are easily the hottest DC men and it's not even close.

Idgaf about any comic post 2011 and barely anything post 2003

[whatohitsonfirewelp]

If that happens I’ll just pretend it doesn’t exist. I absolutely refuse to even Acknowledge that.

Several things here:

1) Donna is a MINOR here. She's like 16! Can we not sexualize her???

2) Why's Wally Naruto running? Also why does his face look like that?? Also his fingers (which are yellow for some reason???) are sticking out of Garth's crotch in a very odd way.

3) Dick's cape clips behind Garth??

4) Garth's dramatic ass pose. This part is actually great. Garth should do more dramatic ass poses.

[necrotic-nephilim]

Dicktim for the ask game:

Dick starts to have feelings for Tim, but he's scared because he's absolutely convinced he's straight. He goes so far as to even try to kiss Roy, which… doesn't make things better between them, and Garth which was just wet. And then Tim starts the transition as a woman, and Dick be like, ahhhh, so that's what it was. He can work with it :D

for the ask game!

!!! transfemme Tim supremacy. god i love any flavor of trans/genderqueer Tim. especially when everyone around Tim is either supper supportive or instantly clocks them as an egg, it's delightful. here are some thoughts (note: i'm using he/him for Tim up until transitioning just bc. ease of understanding)

having feelings for Tim comes with equal confusion and guilt. Dick has known Tim since he was a young teen and even now that Tim is growing into an adult, Dick is hyperaware of the implications that could come with it. but more than that, he's just *confused*. he doesn't mind the jokes about his sexuality because he knows he's comfortable with it. he experimented a bit in his teens and came to the firm, comfortable understanding that he's straight. so feelings for Tim are. confusing, to say the least. before Tim comes out, he's not particularly obvious about being an egg. he's only dated girls, even has a bit of a skater boy persona going on, so it's not easy to clock how deep in denial he is. so Dick is baffled on every level. he's googling it, kissing his prettiest male friends to see if maybe he is bisexual and this is just a late awakening. but it's definitely not and it's definitely just a complex for Tim. for a while Dick lives in denial of it convincing himself some wires got crossed or something because he would never like a guy and he'd especially never like Tim, someone who should be a little brother to him. and for a while, it almost works. Dick is able to compartmentalize and bury the feelings so deep he's mostly functioning around Tim, save for staring a little too long when he notices Tim is letting his hair grow out and watching Tim apply stage makeup to cover bruises. but he's mostly fine.

it's the Caroline Hill cover that gets Dick to break. Tim is trying to be as casual as he can about the idea of going undercover as a woman. Tim doesn't want anyone to think about why that would be his cover of choice so he just blames it on being so androgynous and no one really comments bc really, they've all had their weird fake identities. but when Tim has the long hair, the flawless makeup, and just a little fake padding in the right places it makes Dick choke. which feels horrifically objectifying to Dick and he feels even worse about his crush now. especially the way Tim talks when dressed up as Caroline. a softer voice that's clearly trying to be more feminine. and there's just. the way Tim seems so *comfortable*, as Caroline. like this is a natural, second skin to Tim. it sends Dick on a panicked spiral, wondering if this counts as some kind of horrible fetish or something. he's so guilty he probably vents to Donna or Wally about it, just to get his feelings out about the whole thing. they comfort him and talk him through it, finally convincing him to just talk to Tim. because the worst that happens, Tim rejects Dick and Dick can properly move on. and the best that happens, Dick can explore this weird feeling.

of course, Dick chooses the most awkward way to do it. instead of just talking to Tim about his feelings, he casually mentions Caroline Hill and how nice Tim looked. how it seems almost natural for Tim. and Tim *panicks*. because this is the first time anyone has called it out, and Tim is as deep in the closet as you can get. he ends up awkwardly mumbling that he liked being Caroline a lot, hoping the conversation will be dropped. but Dick presses and Tim ends up. accidentally coming out in a rushed word vomit that Dick barely understands. it ends with Dick blinking a few times and finally softly asking if Tim wants to be called Caroline with she/her pronouns. and when he gets a small yes, Dick immediately switches. he's so caught up in supporting Caroline, he doesn't immediately think about the crush. it takes a few days of watching her come out to everyone else and wear her hair more femininely, put on makeup, before Dick is suddenly *very* rudely reminded of his crush. because Caroline just seems a lot happier as a girl, and it seems so obvious now that she's out. she redesigns her suit to be more clearly female and that's when Dick can't hide the crush anymore. not for lack of trying, but the first time Red Robin patrols and clearly is a woman, Dick walks straight into a pole. (bonus points if Caroline's new suit is very unternet inspired, being visibly Nightwing-inspired just to make it worse for Dick) and Caroline, who's still anxious about her transition and being perceived as a woman, at first thinks it's about that. which leads to Dick awkwardly explaining his crush and well. in a way, it's the most gender-affirming thing for a straight person to have a crush on Caroline before she even came out.

their relationship is slow and careful, especially anything sexual. Dick is still acutely aware of the age difference and how they met muddling things, but Caroline brushes all of those concerns. she's an adult, she's consenting, and dear god who hasn't had a crush on Dick Grayson. i think it's sort of funny if when they start dating, Dick forgets to mention that Caroline is Tim Drake, who transitioned as a trans woman. so he talks about his girlfriend Caroline to his friends, who are very confused about who this Caroline girl is. Steph and Cass help Caroline learn silly things like "girl code" and Dick is prepared to curbstomb anyone who misgenders her. he's ready. probably a little too ready. their relationship flows so naturally Dick doesn't know how he didn't clock it before. his crush just feels obvious now. he doesn't want to be overbearing and wants to make sure she's going at her comfortable pace with her transition. but Dick is the type of ally boyfriend to google *everything* and help Caroline through deciding if and how to go onto hormones, how to legally transition, all of it. it's their version of date night. that and patrolling together, but that one is a given. it doesn't take long for the public to figure out that Nightwing and Red Robin are together (i think it's funny if no one can decide if there's a new Red Robin or if the old one transitioned. it's a hotly debated thread on reddit.) because of how affectionate Dick is. and of course Caroline just bluescreens under any affection from Dick bc this is her childhood crush, absolutely smitten for her.

i love exploring sexual headcanons for trans characters bc it's different for everyone. i'm a bottom Tim truther, so i think bottom Caroline works great in a gender-affirming sort of way, with Dick using very feminine words in sex. i do still think she would dom Dick, riding him or edging him. it's not what Dick expected, but he'll definitely take it. Caroline just likes reducing Dick to a begging mess. i also think there would be a mommy kink. i believe in Tim being called mommy even when he's not trans, so if she's trans, she's *definitely* being called mommy. gender affirmation and kinky fuckery. two birds one stone. she also likes letting Dick braid her hair and help her do her makeup. Dick buys her all kinds of nice lingerie to try on and then ruin during sex. it's a win-win for everyone.

[babygirlhaljordan]

hi! ive been talking in the dc server and with the help of some ppl, i’ve created a role swap au—in which the love interests and heroes switch roles. i hope you enjoy :3

roleswap titans au

leader: kory anders. (lives in gotham after being abandoned in the streets by her sister when they crash landed on earth. raised by catwoman. wanted a team to not only help the world but to not feel alone. for all catwoman’s strengths, emotional connections aren’t always her strongest thing. especially to a kid.) replaces dick grayson

report writer: linda park (gained super speed after recreating the accident that happened to flash to investigate what happened at star labs. she joins titans by claiming she wants to learn how to be a better hero but really… she wants to know their hero identities & uncover who the flash Really Is. will she use her connection to the hero world to figure out their identities or will she learn to be the hero she claims to be?) replaces wally west

redeemed hero: chesire (“saved” by roy harper. she initially refuses to work together with the titans but the more they live with each other, the more she thinks twice about not corporating. can she move past the path she believed she was destined for? or will the titans efforts be in vain?) replaces roy harper

atlantan: dolphin (quiet kid from atlantis. she wandered into earth after being attacked by atlantis’ army for her mutation, stranded and alone. it’s only by being recruited by kory anders that she’s learning to find her footing (or fins) in the world. is she capable of working together with the cast? find out) replaces garth (aqualad)

the bow and arrow: speedy (the one that “saved” chesire. lots of people teased that he only joined bc he had a crush on kory but really… he wants to help chesire. and he’s willing to do whatever it takes to aid her. he thinks being with ppl their own age would help them adjust and fit in) replaces donna troy

[gabbynyssa]

Wait... Does anyone have an AU where Jason was taken out from under Bruce's wing by Dick and he got permission to share the Flamebird mantle from Clark and Jimmy?

I was thinking about how it's a shame that the duo nature of the names has mostly been forgotten to the point of Jimmy just having the name pre-Kandor in MAwS. And then I started thinking about how, in Webtoon RHatO, Jason picks a phoenix for his new symbol as the series is ending. A literal bird of flames.

Like... He still gets the red theming, you get to explore the difference in how Dick and the Titans raise Jason contrasted to how Bruce (and Alfred and Talia trying his best to fill the gaps) did. Does he see Roy and Garth as older brothers in this world? Does he do reckless hijinks with Gar and Wally? Does Wally completely lose track of who anyone means when they say "Jay" in conversations? Does Dick keep him alive, or does Slade become Jason's resurrection & villain arc catalyst? Does Jason come to love Bludhaven or does he have to throw himself back into Gotham and get closure before he can be mentally in the present anywhere really? Does he still say "Oh my goodness gracious, I've been bamboozled!"? Does Dick go back to school after Jason graduates? Does Jason make Dick question the whole cop day job thing?

Tim ends up even more of a question mark if both Robins officially distance from Batman. Like... Does the fanboy follow to the Titans and stay, or does he still try to get someone to be Robin and get mixed up in it himself? Or is that whole scenario avoided as Nightwing gives Bruce a gentle talk about needing a support system of his peers instead of a father figure he won't call one and a series of children he doesn't have the support system to help as-is and Bruce gets like... The Outsiders into Gotham and opens up to Jim and stuff?

Tho also there's always the preexisting alternative Robin even if Bruce isn't building a team of peers he actually talks to... Anarky was introduced to be a new Robin before Tim, and it would certainly be interesting to see how he'd fit into the role, especially with a Bruce that's questioning what the role should even be. He'd still be dealing with a very intelligent kid with lots of attitude and questions for authority right after Jason left when someone actually answered some honestly. There'd be tension between Bruce's set in ways, his guilt, and his desire to do the best he can by this kid. And the kid himself had a lot of potential development set up in early stages that instead kinda just became "actually this kid can just do anything, fuck it" for a bit, then he got dropped. Like... He already mirrors where Jason went in the main continuity in some ways, so exploring him trying to fill those shoes (but ultimately realizing he should've been being himself the whole time) in a world where Jason is on a different path could be neat.

Also random sidenote, thinking about who else might hero in Gotham reminded me that Jay Garrick was based in Gotham way back when... Would be interesting to see an exploration of a world where Batman is the current hero of Gotham and the Flash was the one before him and how the eras differ and what factors led to that.

[zahri-melitor]

My comments on the Extended Generational Sorting Algorithm:

Gosh there are some murky in-betweens here.

G-1 – JSA and teams like the All-Star Squadron and the Blackhawks. The WWII edition. This is occasionally merged with G0 as timelines shift, but includes Hippolyta, Ted Knight, Sandra Knight (as Phantom Lady), Alan Scott, Jay Garrick, etc. A lot of this cohort have aging issues and several have grandkids in G1 or G1.5. Zinda simultaneously belongs to this group and G1.5.

G0 – JSA, the gap between WWII and the first JLA. This is the younger JSA cohort who aren’t so tied to WWII and the gap after. Dinah Drake. Ted Grant. Johnny Quick. Giovanni Zatara. Walter Chase (the Acro-Bat). Bruce’s parents. The Kents. Jim Gordon. Etc.

G1 – JLA land! Bruce, Clark, Diana, Ollie, Barry, Hal, Arthur, etc. You know them. Your idea of a headlining JLA includes these folk.

G1.5 – Birds of Prey and JLI zone. Characters too old to be Titans cohort but younger/clearly different than the G1 headliners. Barbara Gordon and Dinah Lance are the stalwarts of this group, plus I’ll add Helena Bertinelli, Cameron Chase, Kate Spencer, Kendra, etc. I guess I’d probably put Harley Quinn, agewise, here too. Also would add Beatriz, Tora, Booster, Ted Kord, etc. Guy and Zatanna sort of bounce between here and G1 depending on storyline.

G2 – it’s the Titans! Dick, Donna, Wally, Roy, Garth, Victor, Gar, Kory, Raven etc. Their agebounds are probably Roy as the oldest and Gar as the youngest, though Gar’s given to them as a courtesy – he’s realistically a member of G2.5, he just hangs with G2. We also add Kyle and Connor and Jesse Quick etc to this cohort despite them not being core Titans given their strong connections to particularly Donna and Wally.

G2.5 – The JL Taskforce kids and Jason’s non-existent team. Ray Palmer’s Teen Titans. This is a group of individuals that has never properly coalesced. Overlaps in age with both the bottom of G2 and the top of G3 but distinctly don’t belong to either. Jason, Ray, Grant, Argent, Cynthia, Eddie, Snapper Carr, plus Danny Chase and arguably Gar all fall into this group. Rose Wilson overlaps with G3 but vibeswise probably also belongs to this group. I am tossing up whether Anissa and Jennifer Pierce belong here or in G2.

G3 – Young Justice. Tim, Kon, Cassie, Bart, Cissie, Greta, Anita. Cass Cain belongs here despite being the same age as several G2.5s. Steph, Charlie, Black Alice, Jaime, Zachary Zatara, even a handful of the newer folk like Jinny Hex slot in here. Several Supergirls including current Kara, Courtney Whitmore IS a member of this group and the three oldest Marvel kids (Billy, Mary and Freddy) are currently aged into this.

G4 – Damian’s Teen Titans. Damian, Jon Kent (yes even still with the age up), Emiko Queen, Ace West etc. If they are still a teen right now in DC storytelling or SHOULD be a teen, they belong here (if they’re a teen and SHOULDN’T be they’re probably a G3/G5). The Gotham Academy kids. Arguably the Titan Academy kids too? Agewise the DEO Titans kids but spiritually probably not (also the chances of us ever seeing them again is…low) The younger Marvel kids (Eugene, Pedro and Darla especially) are with this group.

G5 – so this group are either alternate G3 or G3.5s. Too new and too un-networked with G3 to be absorbed. Jace Fox, Yara Flor, Jackson Hyde, Duke Thomas and the We Are Robin cohort all belong here. Kong Kenan, Avery Ho, etc also are members.

G6 – Titans Offspring Gen. Almost everyone in this group has been artificially aged, which is a thing, hey. Lian, Irey, Jai, Cerdian, Robbie. Maxine, obviously. Otho and Osul-Ra.

G7 – Help I’m From Earth-One: Power Girl and Helena Wayne.

G8 – The Lost Children – also Help I’m From Earth-One in a lot of respects but they’re in their teens, not adults. May get folded into other groups if they get more use.

[floralovebot]

yknow i think a really fundamental misunderstanding current dc writers have with garth is that he genuinely wasn't a child soldier like dick or wally. sure he definitely comes from that era and there Are undoubtedly aspects of his character arc and relationship with arthur that are similar to the classic mentor/mentee relationship, but their core relationship didn't start with that. arthur originally only brought garth along because they were just besties. arthur was living it up homeless style with this random orphan he found and they got into some hijinks together. then shit happened, he becomes King, but he's not going to abandon garth so he continues to bring him along.

part of garth growing up was him having to take things more seriously and learn to handle hero shit. like. he was really just randomly thrust into that world because arthur Became a big hero, not because arthur intentionally took on a protégé.

so when i see dc writing rebirth garth or even yj garth as this Cool Kid who was taken under arthur's wing and trained to become a Cool Hero, it's just,,, it's a Huge misunderstanding of garth himself but especially their relationship. his daddy issues are amplified because he always saw arthur as this cool older man who took him in as a son, not as a student. unlike a character like dick who has issues with bruce because bruce himself treats him as both a son and student, garth really became the student in response to arthur's duties, after they already had an established relationship. and even then, garth was never meant to be arthur's protégé in the way the other kid sidekicks were.

like. garth became arthur's sidekick because he wanted to be there. he wanted to be with His Dad and help him on these important missions. he didn't want to be alone anymore, and if that meant risking his life for arthur then fucking whatever, he'll do it. while arthur did take on the role of mentor and garth was very much his sidekick, garth was never the Child Soldier or the Protégé like the other sidekicks. like i'd say that's actually a huge part of his character arc. current dc writers will Never be able to capture garth in the right light if they continue to paint him as the same kind of sidekick the other titans were.