#do I think vader was redeemed? no

[secondstar-acorn]

hey besties we aren’t talking about Luke’s pain and trauma enough

[jinxessticktogether]

there's that specific brand of villain that's like - you're only a villain because you gave into your deepest fears and allowed them to control you, and now you've gone way too far to ever be truly redeemed.

like, they are beyond a shadow of a doubt a villain and should be seen as such, but there's still a certain tragedy to it, y'know? that tragedy of like "damn, you would've been a decent person if you'd just had some therapy, but now look at you"

[tranquilitybasehotelcasino]

the key to appreciating this character to the fullest extent is understanding that he should be worse

i love kylo ren i think he’s awesome and cool for the express reason that he sucks. and he’s stupid and he’s lame. like i can never do apologism for him because i would like him less as a character if he was a better person. you will never catch me saying he doesn’t suck because there is often great peace and wisdom in enjoying a guy who sucks. which is why i’m getting into heaven and other people aren’t

[stealingpotatoes]

Luke: I must fight Vader alone and redeem him.

Ahsoka: yeah kinda tried that kid but ok

i know this is a reference to the tl4j ot au, but do you ever think about how Ahsoka feels knowing that she -- Anakin's padawan and pseudo-sister who fought alongside him for years and was one of the people -- failed to get through to him? not even failed, she DIED in one timeline. but luke got through to him, luke brought him back to the light and anivader didn't kill luke, he saved him. he and luke barely ever met and were always enemies but he got through to anakin. do you think ahsoka feels jealous? or do you think she wants to feel jealous but every time she looks at him all she can see are the best bits of his parents and how can she POSSIBLY feel anything but love for him?

[david-talks-sw]

Debunking myths in the GFFA: Luke Skywalker isn't the One True Jedi™ and doesn't "reject the Jedi teachings."

The myth:

Luke's Jedi mentors - trained to be dispassionate and mission-driven - callously tell him to let his friends die in service of a greater cause.

"In The Empire Strikes Back, Luke becomes Yoda's Padawan, and there are echoes of Anakin's training and the dilemmas he faced. Like Anakin, Luke is told he is too old to begin the training. Like Anakin, he has a vision of his loved ones suffering in captivity, and receives cold advice from Yoda, who tells him to sacrifice Han and Leia if he honors what they fight for." - Jason Fry, “Family Tradition; Rejecting the Jedi Teachings” Star Wars Insider #130, 2012

The intended narrative:

The Jedi are actually right on all points. Luke isn't ready or fully trained and he's arrogantly letting his emotions rule him and rushing into danger. By ignoring them, Luke gets himself into a spot of trouble that actually jeopardizes the lives of the very friends he tried to help, as they now need to rescue him.

“It’s pivotal that Luke doesn’t have patience. He doesn’t want to finish his training. He’s being succumbed by his emotional feelings for his friends rather than the practical feelings of “I’ve got to get this job done before I can actually save them. I can’t save them, really.” But he sort of takes the easy route, the arrogant route, the emotional but least practical route, which is to say, “I’m just going to go off and do this without thinking too much.” And the result is that he fails and doesn’t do well for Han Solo or himself.”

“Luke is making a critical mistake in his life of going after- to try to save his friends when he’s not ready. There’s a lot being taught here about patience and about waiting for the right moment to do whatever you’re going to do.”

“Luke is in the process of going into an extremely dangerous situation out of his compassion— Without the proper training, without the proper thought, without the proper foresight to figure out how he’s gonna get out of it. His impulses are right, but his methodology is wrong.”

The myth:

The Jedi want Luke to repress his feelings and kill his father, to destroy the Sith, their religious enemies. As emotionally-detached Jedi, it is inconceivable that a Sith would come back from the Dark Side, and thus wrongly believe that the only solution is to kill Vader.

"It's easy to miss that Luke disagrees sharply with his Jedi teachers about what to do. Obi-Wan and Yoda have trained Luke and push him toward a second confrontation with Vader. He is, they believe, the Jedi weapon that will destroy both Vader and the Emperor. When Luke insists there is still good in Vader, Obi-Wan retorts that "he's more machine than man-twisted and evil." When Luke says he can't kill his own father, Obi-Wan despairs, "Then the Emperor has already won."  But Obi-Wan could not be more wrong. It is precisely because Luke can't kill his own father that he defeats the Sith." - Jason Fry, Star Wars Insider #130, 2012

The intended narrative:

The Jedi never tell Luke to "kill" his father. That's just a fact.

They tell him to "confront" and "face" him.

Their bottom line is that Vader and the Emperor need to be stopped.

If Luke can manage to do so without killing his father, that's great.

"In Jedi the film is really about the redemption of this fallen angel. Ben is the fitting good angel, and Vader is the bad angel who started off good. All these years Ben has been waiting for Luke to come of age so that he can become a Jedi and redeem his father. That's what Ben has been doing, but you don't know this in the first film." - Star Wars: The Annotated Screenplays, 1998

(credit to @writerbuddha for finding the above quote)

The problem is: Darth Vader has a track record of murdering loved ones who refuse to kill him. Be it his wife...

... his father/brother...

... and if you're going by Canon, his little sister.

As such, there's a very strong chance that Vader might do the same to his son as well.

“A Jedi can’t kill for the sake of killing. The mission isn’t for Luke to go out and kill his father and get rid of him. The issue is, if he confronts his father again, he may, in defending himself, have to kill him, because his father will try to kill him.” - 1981 story conference, from The Making of Return of the Jedi

Now, as the last Jedi left, the fate of the galaxy rests entirely on Luke's shoulders.

If he dies, then the galaxy and its billions of inhabitants are doomed to live in a tyrannical dictatorship forever.

“He knows a confrontation is brewing between Luke and his father. Ben hopes Luke will either save his father or kill him, because whatever extra powers Luke's got in his lineage, he is the one person that can probably fight his father and win.” - The Star Wars Archives: 1977-1983, 2018

There's a time for talking things through... and a time to do your duty. Above all else, a Jedi's duty is to end conflict.

Obi-Wan was once tasked with this same duty.

And while he managed to weaken Vader considerably (thus avoiding the catastrophe of a full-powered Vader being unleashed onto the galaxy)... because of his attachment, he failed to kill Vader.

Twice, if you include the Kenobi show.

(A show which, per Pablo Hidalgo, is one of George Lucas' favorite recent Star Wars projects, a tidbit that doesn't surprise me one bit considering how much the series perfectly aligns with what Lucas said about Star Wars (see here, here and here))

Point being: because Ben failed his duty, the galaxy suffered for it.

Luke is now in danger of doing the same.

If he's unable to end the conflict in a peaceful way, then Luke needs to be ready to do so in a more permanent manner. Because while Luke has qualms about killing his father, there's a very big chance that the feeling won't be mutual.

So Luke isn't rejecting his teachers' orders to kill Vader. He's saying he's unable to confront Vader altogether, because he'll be half-assing the task. In the (very likely) worst case scenario where reasoning with Vader fails, Luke is concerned he won't be able to follow-through and do what he must.

Further, there's also a worse outcome to Luke dying: Luke joining the Dark Side and becoming yet another asset of the Emperor, more dangerous than Vader himself.

It's thus essential that Luke steel himself and mask his emotions, because the Emperor is a master manipulator who'll likely attempt to corrupt Luke via the strong emotions he has for his friends.

Obi-Wan is not telling Luke to repress his emotions. On the contrary, he acknowledges that these feelings do Luke credit. But the fact remains that when your opponent can jiu-jitsu those feelings against you and your friends, you need to keep a poker face.

And judging by how close the Sith Lords come to seducing Luke to the Dark Side...

... that advice is completely on point.

The myth:

"It isn't Jedi teachings that save the galaxy, but bonds the Jedi tried to forbid - such as the love of a father for his son, and a son for his father. Emotional attachments, in other words." - Jason Fry, Star Wars Insider #130, 2012

The intended narrative:

In Return of the Jedi, Luke isn't doing anything different than what other Jedi have done.

He does his best to avoid lethal force unless he deems that it is necessary (see his fight against Jabba's hostile forces).

He sacrifices himself for the greater good and let himself be captured, in order to allow the mission to be carried out.

He tries to reason with his enemy, hoping to avoid conflict.

He spares his enemy, showing mercy.

That's all standard Jedi stuff. We've seen other Jedi do all those things, both in the films and The Clone Wars.

If that isn't enough, just look at how Lucas describes what Jedi normally do (left), versus what Luke does in Return of the Jedi (right):

See what I mean? There’s pretty much no difference.

In Lucas' narrative, Luke isn’t “better than” or “rejecting the teachings” of the Jedi who came before him. He’s following the Jedi path. And he's really good at doing so.

Because this idea that Luke "rejects the teachings" makes no sense! They're Lucas' teachings. He agrees with the Jedi, they're the mouthpieces he uses to deliver the audience his own values.

Lucas having his main character do something he'd ideologically disagree with is something that doesn't make sense.

And part of this confusion comes from a misunderstanding of the word "attachment", in Star Wars.

It doesn't mean "emotional attachments" or "feelings" or "affection." It comes from the Buddhist principle of non-attachment.

It's not about depriving yourself of relationships or affection, it's about accepting that everything comes and goes and letting go of those very things you hold on to, when the time comes.

Lucas makes a distinction in his discourse between attachment and compassion.

"The whole idea of the movie, ultimately is that you have the Light Side and the Dark Side. The Light Side is compassion, which means you care about other people. The Dark Side is you care only about yourself. And you are obsessed with yourself. Getting your pleasure and getting all your stuff. The other one, you give it to everybody. You give goodness and health to everybody else.  So the issue of love... there’s a line between loving somebody compassionately and caring about them and helping them. But the other line is not to be greedy or... once you are greedy then you get fearful. You don’t want to lose what it is you have that you are getting. So you have to learn to give up everything. And ultimately for a Jedi Knight, it’s very easy to give up." - Celebration V, Main Event, 2010

In-universe, this is something Anakin knew the theory of, but never really applied all that much.

Luke on the other hand, was able to learn the lesson and apply it.

Speaking in Lucas lingo, it's not Luke's attachment that makes him spare Vader. It's his compassion. And in turn, that compassion inspires Vader to do the same.

"It really has to do with learning. Children teach you compassion. They teach you to love unconditionally. Anakin can’t be redeemed for all the pain and suffering he’s caused. He doesn’t right the wrongs, but he stops the horror. The end of the Saga is simply Anakin saying, ‘I care about this person, regardless of what it means to me. I will throw away everything that I have, everything that I have grown to love - primarily the Emperor - and throw away my life, to save this person. And I’m doing this because he has faith in me, loves me despite all the horrible things I’ve done. I broke his mother’s heart, but he still cares about me, and I can’t let that die.’" - The Making of Revenge of The Sith; page 221

Or, to put things more simply:

Attachment (selfish love), is what makes Anakin do this:

Compassion (selfless love), is what makes Luke do this:

Now, could Lucas have made his narrative more explicit, to avoid confusion? Maybe.

But I think it's also fair to point the finger at the biggest cause of these muddied waters:

Simply put, the Expanded Universe (the Star Wars books, novels and games that spun out of the films) established new lore elements that didn't necessarily align with Lucas' vision of things. Namely:

Jedi can get married, and Luke marries Mara Jade.

Jedi can begin their training as adults, and Luke takes on many apprentices that are already adults.

When considering George's minimal involvement in the development of EU stories, it's easy to see why these plot points were allowed to come through.

But when he made the Prequels, his headcanons came to light and the above plot points needed to be retconned.

George Lucas' narrative:

"Nope. You can't be a Jedi and be married."

This isn't actually coming out of left field.

When Timothy Zahn asked for Luke and Mara to be married or engaged, back in 1993, Lucasfilm initially vetoed the idea.

And over the years, Lucas and other Lucasfilm employees have made it it clear that "Luke getting married" did not align with his vision (so much so that it's a plot point in Attack of the Clones).

So the question becomes: why can't Jedi get married?

It's about commitment.

Simply put: you can't have two marriages. Eventually, your commitment to one of them will falter and you'll ruin them both. A Jedi is already married to the cause and to the Order.

If they want to get married, they have to leave the Jedi.

"One of the things [the Jedi] give up is marriage. They can still love people. But they can’t possess them. They can’t own them. They can’t demand that they do things. They have to be able to accept the fact, one, their mortality, that they are going to die. And not worry about it. That the loved ones they have, everything they love is going to die and they can’t do anything about it. I mean they can protect them as you would ordinarily protect, you know, ‘Get out of the way of that car.’ Somebody charges you with a gun, you knock the gun out, but there is an inevitability to life which is death and you have to accept that." - Celebration V, Main Event, 2010

And this is another example, really, of how Lucas' own values and past experiences shape the Jedi's teachings.

Marcia Lucas divorced George because he was constantly working on Star Wars, even when he wasn't directing it, which she said led to an emotional blockage in their marriage...

... and this leads us to the reason why George didn't double-down on the success of the Original Trilogy: he decided to take time off to raise his three kids as a single Dad.

He learned his lesson, reasoned that he wouldn't be able to be both a good, present father and a successful blockbuster film director.

When you're dealing with time-consuming commitments of this scale, you need to make a choice, or you'll end up (half-assing and thus ruining) both of them.

"Nope. Jedi get taken in as babies for a reason."

Once again, this has to do with Lucas' definition of "attachment."

"Jedi Knights get taken from their families very young. They do not grow attachments, because attachment is a path to the Dark Side. You can love people, but you can't want to possess them. They're not yours. Accept that they have a fate. Even those you love most are going to die. You can't do anything about that. Protect them with your lightsaber, but if they die they were going to die. There's nothing you can do. All you can do is accept that fact. In mythology, if you go to Hades to get them back, you're not doing it for them, you're doing it for yourself. You're doing it because you don't want to give them up. You're afraid to be without them. The key to the Dark Side is fear. You must be clean of fear, and fear of loss is the greatest fear. If you're set up for fear of loss, you will do anything to keep that loss from happening, and you're going to end up in the Dark Side. That's the basic premise of Star Wars and the Jedi, and how it works. That's why they're taken at a young age to be trained. They cannot get themselves killed trying to save their best buddy when it's a hopeless exercise." - The Star Wars Archives: 1977-1983, 2018

Jedi need to maintain objectivity and neutrality, in their day-to-day lives of mediating peace between planets.

And learning to "let go of your attachments when the time comes" is part of that training. But it is something that takes discipline and time, and thus the child needs to be young enough to develop this skill. Otherwise, they end up like Anakin, who always struggled to properly learn it and eventually was doomed by his greed.

This being part of Lucas narrative is also evidenced that in his earlier plans for the Sequel trilogy, he'd have Luke train children, not adults like he does in the EU.

"Luke is trying to restart the Jedi. He puts the word out, so out of 100,000 Jedi, maybe 50 or 100 are left. The Jedi have to grow again from scratch, so Luke has to find two- and three-year-olds, and train them. It’ll be 20 years before you have a new generation of Jedi." The Star Wars Archives: 1999-2005, 2020

The EU's retcons of Lucas' narrative:

Now, obviously, the addition of all these rules and other elements such as midi-chlorians... it does something to the older audience. They grew up on the Original Trilogy, dreaming they could be a Jedi too if they just believed enough. Now that bubble is burst.

"Wait, if I'm a Jedi I can't get married?! And I need to be taken in as a toddler, with a certain kind of blood score?! That's bullshit!"

More importantly... it goes against about a decade's worth of established EU lore (which Lucas never factored into his storytelling)!

So what does Lucasfilm Licensing do? They go with it.

They take these "weird" rules the older audience and authors don't like, and retcon a new narrative around them to ensure both the books and the new films all stay canon within the EU own continuity.

George Lucas revealed new information about his universe in Episode II that ran counter to earlier stories of the Expanded Universe. Among the surprises: the Jedi Order is monastic, with love and marriage forbidden to its members. This would necessitate reforms to the Jedi Code over time to separate the ancient era when Nomi Sunrider was married to a Jedi, seen in the Tales of the Jedi (1993–94) comics, as well as the post-Empire era when Luke Skywalker married Mara Jade in the comic series Union (1999–2000). LucasBooks also needed to create plausible exceptions for Ki-Adi-Mundi, a Jedi Master who had multiple wives in the Prelude to Rebellion comics (1999). - Pablo Hidalgo, The Essential Reader’s Companion, 2012

When it comes to Luke specifically, the narrative becomes:

"Uh... y-yes. The old Jedi Order forbid marriage, only took in toddlers and had a blood pre-requisite... which was weird, wrong, too detached, too systemic, and part of why their Order failed! But, uh, Luke's New Jedi Order allows marriage, unlike his dogmatic predecessors, because anyone can be a Jedi guys!" Hahaha! (fuck's sake George)

But as already explained above: those new rules aren't meant to be perceived negatively. It would make no sense if they were, they're based on Lucas' own values.

You know what it does do, though?

It cements the narrative that Luke is the One True Jedi™, who rejected the dogmatic teachings to forge a new path forward.

That's not the intended narrative of the Original Trilogy, nor the six-film saga as a whole.

If you've made it this far in the post (congratulations) and are interested to read another all-encompassing post about that, you can check out the link below :)

[galactic-rhea]

you know, maybe I'm wrong, but my interpretation of Anakin/Vader and Redeemed Anakin is that he pretty much is aware he's terrible. He pretty much thinks of himself as a monster even before becoming Vader, he considers himself one as soon as he had to leave Shmi to survive as a slave alone while he got to become The Chosen One and travel the stars (his basic understanding of love is self-sacrifice), he knows the tusken massacre was bad, he knows murdering disarmed Dooku was bad; he knew turning against the jedi and helping Palpatine was bad; he's extremelly self aware of his violence and hates himself for it.

I think it's easy to think of him as nonchalant or as sort of a shameless dick about it all because his General At War Persona was to be jokey and pretend he's having fun. He's very confident on his ability for Murder (tm), he (tragically) became one of the Best general jedis in the order by becoming good at murder, he's useful when he's being murderous at the right people; so he has no doubts on his abilities on this regard; that doesn't mean he isn't aware of how fucked up and cruel it is, but he keeps doing it, and it's all he knows; he was born in violence, raised in violence, taught to yield a extremelly dangerous weapon, groomed into violence, rewarded for violence, cheered for violence, with Ahsoka then he had to teach violence, and then violence just became something that ran in his blood, it came to him easily, too easily because he was never given the means to deal with such a extreme hyperviolent paradigm. So yep, he knows he's good at murder and little self-preservation.

And he probably despised himself for it, he saw himself as less than a being with human rights, he saw himself as a weapon and he hated not being seen as a person, and at some point he became apathic about it, the fight left him as soon as he had no future with a family. As Vader his hate and anger is just cold fury, is mostly apathy and a void of emotions, there's just pain and self-disgust and regret and old anger, there's not even trying to be something else anymore, it's all he's ever been good at and all he's being asked to do.

So redeemed Anakin (which canonically just means Ghost Anakin lmao) acting oblivious or playing the dumb or victim card it's just something I can't even imagine him to do; like Anakin is aware of being violent and messed up and Bad, but he is completely unable to concieve the idea of having been a victim because besides violence, Anakin's other big trait is that he never ever processes trauma and he horrifically has a history of blaming himself instead of the people who owned him.

This guy, when he was at his best as a Jedi, was pathologically prone to suicidal missions even when it wasn't a necessity, he thinks he's an asset, a means for his superiors to impose their stance and chose to own it, instead of blaming his superiors he just hates himself because he can't stop pathetically reliving when he left his mom behind, when he carried her corpse, when he retaliated against even innocents including kids, when he hurt Padmé, all the times he failed, and the he lived in his personal, fitly created just for him, inferno and had no plans to escape it until one certain sunshine farmer showed up, and all because he thinks he deserves the torture and the abuse and being owned because he's just good at murder and nothing else.

So yeah, no one probably hates him more than himself. Someone could tell Ghost Anakin he's a monster, the worst thing that ever happened in the galaxy and he would say "Yes." And no attempts at arguing or whatsoever, his dignity couldn't be lower if he tried, he would half-heartly agree if someone like Luke said the emperor did him wrong by, y'know, torture him? But then he would also say something like "Well, yes, but cruelty is the way of the Sith, what else could be expected", he's just terribly messed up and couldn't stop himself from defending, at least a little, his literal groomer and abuser and master, and he certainly won't expect forgiveness, like,,,,at all. He can, and will, make excuses for people directly hurting him, but he also would retaliate in terrible ways against anyone, guilty or not, if it meant doing it for someone he cared about.

So Anakin is just...used to being used, and falls easily into being used because it's what he knows best, freedom feels useless and uncertain after he lost padmé.

It's an increíble vicious circle: He worked himself hard to be useful because being useful it's what makes people like him and a means of survival, he then hates himself for being just useful and loosing his personhood, and because he hates himself and thinks he doesn't deserve any sort of...human rights, he keeps on being a mere weapon, an object, but what a good and expensive weapon at least, repeat.

So nope, this guy would be completely unable to even dare to play the victim or excuse himself, even less act as if he doesn't understand he did wrong.

[marvelstars]

I really love Luke as a character but sometimes I don´t like how fandom pictures him as this little flower who would not hurt a fly and always tries to seek peaceful solutions to conflicts, like I get it because I don´t shut up about his part in redeeming his father on ROTJ either but people forget he almost killed his Dad before he did it.

Luke isn´t just a sweet little fellow who would his risk his life for friends and family to the last consequence. Luke isn´t just loyal to fault, he also is a soldier and if he needs to take a life because he is fighthing a War he will do it, no questions asked but he also won´t hold it agaisn´t his opponents if they do the same with him because again, it´s a war.

Another thing I love about Luke is that he truly doesn´t care much about authority, he is concious of it and has not trouble doing what his uncle tells him to do or the rebellion leadership tells him or to seek Yoda and Obi-Wan´s counsel when he has doubts but he also gives his own mind and in the end defines his decisions acording to what he personally believes it´s better acording to his personal philosophy, so he asks the rebellion for permission to train as a Jedi and leaves with or without permission, adds his own little mission on ROTJ to take Darth Vader out of the second Death Star before they blow it up and also tells Yoda and ObiWan in no uncertain terms that he wasn´t going to kill his father.

So in short Luke is this

But he is also this

It makes sense and I love that for him.

PD: Shadows of the Empire is from Legends but pictures Luke so perfectly that I wanted to add it.

There is an episode in which Luke and Leia are trying to fight off Black Sun because some of their operatives have been working with the rebellion but also betraying them, Prince Xizor was playing off the Empire and the Rebellion hoping they destroyed each other. So Leia gets into Prince Xizor Castle to spy on him but he captures her using a mind control pheromone so Luke decides to go with Lando, get Leia out and destroy Xizor´s castle while he is at it.

At the same time, Dath Vader was chilling in his own Palace on Coruscant, he was thinking about how to solve the lastest test of Palpatine in which he has to defeat Xizor ´s criminal organization that was growing too powerful within the empire but without his master having to notice it because currently he is an ally of Xizor and Xizor believes he can take Vader´s place alongside Palpatine.

So Vader is chilling and thinking about an elabore strategy worthy of Games of Thrones or the Padrino when his child out of nowhere makes Prince Xizor Palace explode. This act gives a reason for Vader to destroy the rest of his organization because Xizor was also partially working with the rebels.

There´s not need to say Vader was totally heart eyes for his kid after this. Like that´s his boy, look at him go. Also Xizor messed with his Kid, he is going to lose everything, Xizor is actually lucky he didn´t know Leia was also his kid imo. Those Skywalkers :)

[maidenvault]

RotJ makes a point of letting us know that Leia is Luke's sister, they've known this on some level for a long time, and he probably cares more about her than anyone in the world because this gives so much more weight to his conflict at the end of the movie, and I think this is a huge thing people overlook when they argue that him redeeming his father represents a rejection of the old Jedi ways of non-attachment. Because in the moment he has to let go of Leia and his friends to be able to actually save Anakin.

When Obi-Wan tries to convince Luke that he has to kill Vader and there's no other way, he doesn’t really discuss it as an issue of Luke having an attachment to him. I think he knows this isn't really the Jedi way but just like in the previous war, they don't seem to be faced with any good choices. Obi-Wan believes what Luke wants is truly impossible and, having failed to stop Vader when he could have before, of course he's trying to stop Luke from making the same mistake.

But it's significant that in the same conversation, Obi-Wan does warn him that his love for his sister could be made a liability if he's not careful. When Luke learns he has a twin and reveals how strong a connection he feels with Leia because he doesn't even have to be told who it is, Obi-Wan's response sets up how this will play into the climax of the film:

"Your insight serves you well. Bury your feelings deep down, Luke. They do you credit, but they could be made to serve the Emperor."

Then when Luke is brought to Sidious, he reveals to Luke that the Rebellion is walking right into a trap as a way to torment and provoke him. Luke gets angrier and angrier while helplessly watching the fleet get ambushed and finally does just what Sidious wants and tries to attack him. But it's Vader specifically threatening Leia that makes Luke totally lose control of his feelings and fight him in a rage.

Luke is basically facing the same kind of test he failed so badly in ESB by running off to help his friends. When Yoda is trying to make him see he's not ready to face Vader and keep him from going to Bespin, he says something that I think is such an underrated quote in its importance to Luke's whole journey:

"Decide you must how to serve them best. If you leave now, help them you could, but you would destroy all for which they have fought and suffered."

Luke is really lucky he doesn't get killed in Cloud City (or captured, which I think at this point could have resulted in him being turned). Yoda knows Luke is the one person with a chance of defeating the Emperor and Luke just about throws that away.

But at the end of RotJ when Luke cuts off Vader's hand, he surely is reminded of his failure at Bespin and sees the path he's starting down by succumbing to his fears like that again. He stops because he sees he's betraying his loved ones and everything he is. He can only throw away his weapon and confidently tell the Emperor to eat shit then because he's no longer afraid of dying or of those he loves dying. He's done what his father couldn't do and kept his soul intact, which is what Leia would want. Because real love isn't selfishly trying to save someone by betraying what they believe in like Anakin did with Padme. And it obviously has to be an incredibly powerful thing for Vader to see his own son able to do this, even comparing himself to the man he once was ("I am a Jedi, like my father before me").

We remember everything working out okay so it's easy sometimes to forget that Luke gives this triumphant speech when the rebel fleet is getting pulverized outside and things overall still look pretty hopeless. He probably expects he could die at this point. But like Obi-Wan in his own death scene, he knows nothing can destroy him now. And it's the love he feels for his family that gives him the strength to let go.

[maxwellatoms]

Do you have a favorite of your own characters? Or certain ones that you feel particularly connected to? I feel like creators tend to put bits of themselves into their characters--are any of them like that for you? Just wanna say your work is a huge inspiration to me and really helped shape my art and taste in media growing up, thanks for putting your work out into the world!!!

Theoretically, I love them all.

They're all a part of me in some way.

I've discovered over the years that I just can't handle characters I can't relate to. Most specifically, Billy, Mandy, and Grim are major facets of my personality. I purposefully related them to Freud's Id, Ego, and Superego, but they're all very specifically also a part of who I am. Billy is my fun-loving lust for freedom from schedules and consequences. Mandy is the part of me that realizes that Billy will destroy us all, so there must be structure. Grim is just trying to live his life. He wants to watch TV and pet cats, but life (unlife?) just won't give him a break. He's the viewpoint character to my Asperger's.

Irwin is the sad-sack/misguided hero redeemed, which is always a trope I love.

Eris is specifically the Discordian Eris, but also the extreme end of that Billy lust for freedom and the will of the RNG gods. (Good gravy -- my current BG3 playthrough)

Nergal is my love for Lovecraftian/Howardian Mesopotamian deities as has-beens.

Jeff the Spider (quite literally me at the time of his inception) was Too Nice, and therefore a sucker.

Hoss Delgado is the knowledge that if you gaze too long into the abyss... you end up with a chainsaw for a leg.

Then (because this is a collaboration) you've got characters who are primarily created by and representative of other people. For example, Fred Fredburger was created by C.H. Greenblatt. Sperg was created by Gord Zajac (as was Hoss, really). Boogey was created by Spencer Laudiero. All of these artists infused some piece of themselves into the character.

This is (IMO) where it gets fun. It's the ultimate Role Playing Game. It's childhood play made manifest. I've got my Luke Skywalker figure and you've got your Darth Vader figure and we've got two COBRA H.I.S.S. tanks and a Muffy from Battlestar Galactica and we're gonna hash this shit out.

Ideally, I think I'd want a "Simpsons World". A world where there are zero (or as close as possible) extraneous characters. Everyone represents something and everyone matters. I was so close with B&M. Fingers crossed I get there one day.

[asocial-skye]

This is probably elaborated on a lot more in detailed meta, but for all of the shit that Lucas has pulled and all of his questionable decisions, Palpatine is probably his greatest triumph as a villain within narrative. Yes, he is absolutely a cartoon with no redeeming qualities, and Anakin definitely has a more dynamic character arc, but it's still incredible.

Star Wars as a franchise is associated with war and wartime: laser sword battles, epic forbidden romance, last stand trench runs against powerful enemies. It's all action, stylized violence and "rule of cool." There is good character writing and plot of course, but the public perception of Star Wars as a whole is about the cool space wizards and laser guns.

So it's absolutely curious that Lucas, in a trilogy that he said was geared towards children, had his villain do none of the things that made Star Wars so famous. Palpatine never fought ever. Except in Revenge of the Sith, Palpatine's horrible crimes all stemmed from his politics, and his cunning. Part of the Jedi's blindness to Sidious was that he was playing them on a field that they didn't expect: politics.

The Jedi are not politicians, nor have any interest in politics; the movies make this painfully clear. (The fact that the Council just goes and attempts to execute Palpatine, a popular leader who was "democratically" elected-I will give the Jedi credit; Palpatine is a monster, and killing him then and there was probably necessary- shows that there aren't the most politically minded) Palpatine literally does more damage to the entire galaxy that has repercussions for a generation- seriously, people like Biggs probably lived and died within the Empire- than Anakin could ever do during Operation: Knightfall or even as his tenure as Vader. And the Jedi can't do anything to stop it because they refused to play the game. In fact, one could make the argument that refusing to play only meant that Palpatine could carry out his agenda even faster.

It's almost like the bad guy won because any damage wreaked by an army of space wizards can be done a thousandfold by one politician. And it's like the lesson is that if you turn a blind eye to the injustices in your government, the corruption festers until it turns into something unspeakably horrid, and by then it'll be too late.

That's something to think about.

[grumfield]

Since you’ve read like…all the books why do you think that Anakin is such a polarizing character? Beyond the oblivious. I feel like there’s strongly opposing viewpoints which feels wild. But you’re pretty impartial when necessary and also well read in this world so I’m curious what you think!

wow I love it when y'all give me asks that let me flex a bit more of my top-down muscles like this. super fun, thank you!

I think it, first of all, this is a very "fandom" conversation. Popular cultural conversation is generally no more than "Vader was sympathetic but bad, Jedi cool." so these more intense debates kind of predicate on the idea of peoples' personal investment in the charactesr beyond the movies. Even though the movies do provide context--and have a very overt George Lucas messaging of "Jedi wrong, love is what saves"--the average person doesn't really think more on it or try to reconcile beyond what the movie itself shows. So TLDR this is sort of presuming the people having this discussion have delved into other works.

I think it comes down to how much and what media beyond the movies people engage and prefer with because there are so many prequels projects, all of them written by different people with different perspectives (at least in legends...i'll get to the disney POV soon), which is the beauty of multimedia works.

Legends projects in general tend to be more critical of the Jedi, majorly, I think, because George Lucas had control. Lucas was, obviously, critical of the Jedi, and his projects reflect that. Most of them are takedowns, and don't really show the Jedi in a particularly favorable light.

Disney, on the other hand, definitely skews more in favor of the Jedi. I don't think this is actually a Disney perspective, I think that this is a popular perspective that was ingratiated into their framework. IMO many people think of the Disney era as against the Jedi, but to me it's definitely "pro" in the sense that they are effortlessly cool + flashy, there's very little bureaucracy, and the characters at fault are not at fault for systemic reasons, but rather personal failure (which I feel like is seen in the Acolyte).

In Disney narratives, Jedi structures are not the issue, flawed people are. Whereas in Lucas narratives, flawed people are not the issue, Jedi structures are.

For example, I've noticed a lot of Legends books portray Anakin's relationship with Padmé as the thing that saved him, which is a very Lucas perspective to hold, since his entire thesis of Star Wars is that love is what redeems. In opposition, though, a lot of Disney books pose their relationship as what caused his downfall, because if he'd never been in a relationship with her he wouldn't have fallen because she wasn't there. Similarly I think that Jedi Quest is a very unsympathetic look at Obi-Wan that holds him responsible for Anakin's downfall, whereas Deborah Chow's Obi-Wan show is more sympathetic and frames him as generally without fault to what happened. Different strokes for different folks.

Given that Anakin is space JesusJudasSatan, makes him the ideological battleground for these perspectives, which creates a character whose various story plots and circumstances, depending on the writer/creator, is at least always a little bit in contradiction even if his actions are the same. Because he simultaneously is so many different types of things at once, and I think it just comes down to which works they're exposed to/are most drawn to.

But, building off of that: I think the main culprit, in broad strokes, comes down to which piece of media a person views as their canon: Lucas's movies, or Filoni's Clone Wars. Which, IMO, ultimately follow two completely different characters both named Anakin Skywalker, but this post is getting too long so I'll get salty about that some other time.

[lessnowon]

confession: TRoS ruined kylo/ben for me, despite not liking him previously.

when i watched TFA in the movie theater, i absolutely hated kylo ren (not in an "anti" way, it's simply a sign of a good villian). TLJ put him on thin ice with me because like 🤢 re*lo foreshadowing (yes in an anti way, but not the point of this post so dont @ me) but i otherwise still loved to hate him, even if i didn't understand why so many fans liked him. but then the dreaded TRoS happened and i was like... "huh, i miss kylo ren?"

i mean, i know that character development is a thing, but... what happened to my darth tantrum? what happened to "let the past die, kill it if you have to"? like, it baffles me that he ends TLJ having killed his master, been rejected by rey and rejected her in turn (again), claimed the title of supreme leader, and then been publicly humiliated by his uncle/ex-master—and then in TRoS he just... ditches everything he has achieved, lets go of all the perceived wrongs against him, reverts to ben, and kisses rey? and oh by the way it was Palpatine, still, all along?? isnt this supposed to be a new story?????

obviously he wouldn't end the final movie of the trilogy in the same as he was halfway through or at the start, but i think it's stupid that he had so much build up as a villain, actively rejecting the light side and redemption at every single turn—and he had many, many opportunities—only to spend most of the third movie on the side of the light, helping to defeat the exact same villain that was defeated three movies ago

like yeah, okay, he "finished vader's business" and "killed the past" by finally defeating darth sidious, but idk... the guy started out the trilogy so determined to uphold vader's legacy that he led the slaughter of every student at luke's temple a la anakin at the end of RotS, that he murdered and tortured innocents for years, and instead of realizing that "letting the past die" includes vader's legacy and making his own way, redeemed or not but still remaining kylo—or, hell, even evolving his ambition into the determination to outdo vader where vader fell short; killing the past by becoming the new, more powerful evil—he, what???? learns that he can just shed years of deliberate bad choices because none of it was his fault anyways, and all he has to do is repeat the past to be redeemed because he is just doomed to be an echo of his ancestors that contributes nothing genuinely new to his family history, anyways?

yeah i preferred the unstable and immature yet wildly overpowered possible-sociopath on the cusp of shedding his blinders and coming into his own...

[shrinkthisviolet]

1, 7, 8, 9, 19, 21 for Star Wars for the ask game please?

1: the character everyone gets wrong

Luke Skywalker. Everyone writes him as naïve and happy-go-lucky, but like…no?? Even in ANH, he’s snarky and impatient, and he develops throughout the OT into a badass who suffers no fools. Yes, he’s kind and generous towards his loved ones, and he’s very friendly, there’s no doubt about that, but like?? Writing him as an innocent ball of sunshine who can do no harm is just wrong. Luke is kind, but he’s not naïve—he knows fully well what Vader has done and how evil he is, he just also knows, has felt, that there’s good deep down in Vader. He believes when no one else does because he knows he can get through to Vader and change his heart, and he’s right!!

7: what character did you begin to hate not because of canon but because how how the fandom acts about them?

Kylo Ren. The way some parts of fandom used to (probably still do, but I wouldn’t know) paint Han and Leia as abusive/awful parents and make Kylo the perpetual victim who was forced into every decision he made…as if he wasn’t like 23 when he destroyed(?) the Jedi Academy* and joined Snoke, as if every decision after that wasn’t his own decision—like, come on guys.

*I know there’s a comic that said apparently a lightning storm caused the fire that destroyed the Academy? But Wookieepedia said he’s the one who summoned the storm in the first place, so 🤷‍♀️ who knows. In any case, the distinction is irrelevant to my point

8: common fandom opinion that everyone is wrong about

Anidala isn’t abusive, and I’m sick of people saying that.

“Oh but he choked her!!” Yes, that’s what happens when you fall to the Dark Side and your good traits are twisted/corrupted. You act in ways that are not like you! This is how the Dark Side works (despite what some Star Wars media would have you believe, the Dark Side corrupts, it’s not freeing. It’s an illusion of freedom, but it’s just a trap)

“Oh but Anakin forced her into it!” Nope! He confessed to her, and she turned him down initially, but she made the first move, and there’s no indication that she was forced into marriage.

You don’t have to like them, but saying they’re toxic/abusive is incorrect and I’m tired of seeing that take.

On that note, everyone attributes Vader’s salvation to Luke, and says he’s the person who always believed in Vader…but don’t forget that Padmé did first!! Padmé was the first one to always believe in Anakin, even after the worst had happened, because that’s how strong their love is! Because Anidala was true love!

9: worst part of canon

If not for the sequels, the Luke/Leia kiss would be here. I still hate that so much.

Taking the sequels into account though…the Rey/Kylo kiss. Absolutely awful. Putting aside the fact that I don’t like the ship, there isn’t really much development for this as a ship. Sure, there are some hints of chemistry here and there (mostly in TLJ with Rey slowly developing an interest in redeeming him), but they’re far outweighed by: Kylo kidnapping and torturing Rey, Rey trying to kill Kylo, Rey metaphorically closing the door on Kylo at the end of TLJ, and Rey killing Kylo in TROS and only undoing it because she felt Leia die.

Rey appears to have a change of heart about Kylo in TLJ, but that’s very clearly undone when he refuses to turn back to the Light Side (again, she metaphorically/telepathically slams the door on him)! And she literally kills him in TROS and only undoes it for his mom’s sake! And yet suddenly in the final scene she’s calling him “Ben” and putting her trust in him?? Nope. Not buying it. If I did ship this, I’d be very disappointed about how it was handled, because that’s just sad

19: you're mad/ashamed/horrified you actually kind of like…

I'm intrigued by Vaderdala as a concept 😅 not in a genuine healthy relationship way, I think that bridge is burned post-ROTS, but I find the idea of them in a Padmé Lives AU very intriguing. Vader ofc would still harbor feelings for Padmé, and deep down, she would too (she does canonically believe in his goodness), but her loyalty would be first and foremost to the Rebellion and her kids…but also those feelings keep drawing her back to Vaderkin, because a not-so-small part of her wants to redeem him and get her husband back. And he, ofc, wants her by his side as his Empress. It’s just fascinating to me imo

21: part of canon you think is overhyped

ROTS. Listen, listen, I love it too, okay? I love all 3 of the prequels in their own ways. But…even people who hate the prequels claim ROTS is “the good one”, and I just…don’t get it? What exactly makes ROTS sooo much better than the other two? It’s not like ROTS is a perfect movie by any means, it has flaws too, just like TPM and AOTC do. It even has a similar tone. People seem to love it because it’s the moment of Anakin’s descent into Vader, and believe me, I love it too, but…some people love it disingenuously, I feel. One of its big flaws is the lack of Padmé scenes in it, with them all being deleted, so the fact that it’s the most loved of the prequels despite having the least amount of Padmé in it is…weird, ngl

And yes, I know people have complained about those scenes being deleted, this is a common complaint, but that doesn’t seem to have dulled the general consensus that this movie is (one of) The Best Ever.

(On that note though, if you haven’t read the ROTS novelization, please do, it’s absolutely amazing and tbh I’m enjoying it more than the movies, simply because it has more space to expand on certain characters and what they’re thinking, and thus expand on certain scenes. AND it adds the Padmé deleted scenes back!!)

choose violence ask game!

[short-wooloo]

With the news from Adam Driver about how kylo redemption was never the plan originally and his story was basically meant to be reverse Vader, I'd like to resurrect an old conspiracy theory of mine about Rise of Skywalker

So the duel in the ruins of the death star, y'know how it ends with Rey stabbing kylo and then she heals him?

Well I believe he originally was meant to die there, Rey killed him in anger, and it causes a breakdown in her, she's upset not only that she failed Leia and couldn't redeem kylo, but also terrified by her anger, scared that she truly is a Palpatine, and from there we get our pep talk from Luke and final battle with Sidious

Basically I think Rey healing kylo was a last minute addition to the script (probably at disney's insistence)

And the rest of the film doesn't exactly prove me wrong

How does kylo get to exegol after Rey took his TIE fighter? Well apparently in the exploded, sitting in water for 30 years ruins of the death star there's not only a functional imperial TIE, but one with a hyperdrive too

What does kylo do upon reaching exegol? Fight the knights of Ren, something Rey herself could do or perhaps even better you could have had the Knights fight Finn, Rose and the Resistance soldiers

Does kylo meaningfully contribute to the final battle with Sidious? Not really, he gets drained of his life force by Sidious (so basically he inadvertently helps him) and is thrown down a hole for the rest of the battle, Rey does all the heavy lifting from there

The only meaningful contribution kylo makes after his "redemption" is sacrificing himself to revive Rey, which may not have even needed to happen because the only reason she was so drained is because kylo being there caused Sidious to realize he could absorb both of their life forces to restore himself (so in a way, it's his fault!) Alternatively it could have just been written that Rey passed out due to exhaustion and was otherwise fine

So yeah, that's my conspiracy, not that crazy, perfectly reasonable from my perspective

[phantomchick]

✩ WEEKLY FIC ROUND-UP ✩

Naruto

Hear the silence by EmptySurface the self insert fic that got me to start giving other SI fic a chance, continues to be great

the name of the game by a_sassin Follows the story of a civilian shogi player in the Naruto world and all the shinobi trouble she gets dragged into.

If You Give Me A Sword by TakaGang Ichigo (from Bleach) is the firstborn of the Uchiha mainhouse and Itachi is relegated to middle child.

Senju Of Wave by TheBeardedOne Naruto raised by Tsunade au

With Friends Like These by RecklessWriter sasuke time travel fix it

BNHA (can't believe the manga's ending in 5 chapters? Time flies)

The Democratic Republic of One for All by featherlessquill (CinnamonScribbles) All Might tells Izuku he can't be a hero, the echoes of One For All vote and decide they think he can and give Izuku the quirk

Harry Potter (disclaimer: I'm not a terf/transphobe fuck jkr)

Encounters of the Future Sort by CalmlyErratic The fifth marauders + Lily and Snape travel forward in time to Harry's fifth year. Chaos and angst ensues.

Harry Potter and the Philosopher's Snake by gonzoclock James and Lily baby trap Voldemort without his knowledge, Harry is Lily and Tom's bio son.

Fascist ideology in the Harry Potter Fandom. [Or, for real everyone, we are in the middle of a global rise in fascism please *think* about the things you're reading and the ideas they're platforming.] by skeli666 excellent meta is excellent

Star Wars

Biting His Own Tale by ADragonsFriend Anakin time travels, this does not make stopping Palpatine's plans magically simpler. Cathartic for those who wanted Darth Vader to actually do the work to atone after Luke redeemed him and for those who find prequel fix its unrealistically easy with just knowledge of Palp's identity/the clone chips sometimes.

Batman

Wings over Gotham by icarus_chained platonic abo my beloved, divergent from no man's land on, one of my favourite series

straight back by TheResurrectionist That oliver gets mad at batman on his friend bruce wayne's behalf fic. If you follow my tumblr you've already seen me reccing this but still can't leave it out

let the light in by TheResurrectionist that other great platonic ollie & bruce fic

Chronicles of Narnia the seas of all i knew by softtooth_jpeg edmund/caspian, I love the way this fic goes into Edmund's psychology and why he acts the way he does at the start of the lion, the witch and the wardrobe, top tier writing

Four Thrones by shinealightonme A short but great fic that shows the Pevensie's transition from the end of the lion, the witch and the wardrobe to kings and queens.

A:TLA

Waiting on that morning sun by DustOnDaydreams

“To the Generals, Admirals, Officers, Soldiers and Sailors of the Fire Nation, Halt your advance. Pull back to your nearest military stronghold, and await further orders. Do not engage any forces unless absolutely necessary for your own defence. Put out any fires you come across. Sign it only with the full list of the Fire Lord's titles." “Your Majesty, do you not want to put your name to the missive?” A young pimpled scribe squeaked out to the shocked silence. “No. I want them to obey the order.” Or Zuko's transition from child soldier to young monarch in charge of a corrupted nation

MARVEL

(Un)Fortunate Circumstances by lomku au where Tony and Steve meet differently

Or how Steve wakes up from the ice in the SHIELD facility, runs into Tony, and kind of kidnaps him in his bid for freedom.

Even the Score by Sineala for phoenixmetaphor stony oneshot, Tony high in the hospital panics and attacks Steve. Super good.

Sucker Punch by Sineala Angst. Angst. Angst. Oneshot. Steve never quite warms to Tony Stark, Avengers benefactor. The Molecule Man never strips Iron Man out of his armor. Life goes on for the Avengers, but as disagreements split the team -- and Shellhead and Winghead -- again and again, Steve wonders why Iron Man always picks Tony over him. And when Steve finds out, it happens in the worst way possible. Captain America was a good man by ElnaK inspired by Sineala's work this is Tony's side of the fic, "Sucker Punch". IT'S SO GOOD BUT PREPARE FOR ANGST.

yugioh

Legally Insane by Xparrot continues to be my fave yugioh fic

Percy Jackson

ATLOP: Trial by Fire by WardofWinters (QoLife)

Percy was having a normal day at the beach, until he decided to try to waterbend like Katara from his favorite show.

Nothing to make a song about but kings by iwillpassthis

It’s a fortune that Poseidon has a mortal son, because when an ancient curse hits his kingdom and all the sea gods disappear… well, someone must rule.

Original work

The Gift of Perfect Knowledge by BookmarkBookworm

[galactic-rhea]

I love your empress padme au, they should be evil and unhinged. I'm misly curious as to what the kiddos are up to, (and some of the other characters, I imagen they're mostly side eyeing anidalla like "wtf is happining over there???") Anyways I kind of love the consept of "evil chaos family fun"

Neither of them are stay at home parents but the imagen of vaderkin in a frilly apron trying SO hard to cook for his family has popped into my head and will not leave

Vader should get a cloak wich has "property of Padme" embrodered on the back

dfkjgnkjngfdjk thank you, Padmé would ask him to cook with an appron and nothing else

About the question, well! Just yesterday someone asked in the comments about the twins too! And well, you see, I'm undecided! This will get long!

See, when I originally envisioned the empress Padmé AU, what I had on mind is that Padmé spent about 5-6-7 years with the rebels, and that's why we have Vader as...as we known him, you know, almost-classic Vader. Unknown to the rebeels that Padmé's goal was sliiiiiightly different as theirs. She would have the twins (or at least, known where they're being hidden, and visint them and everything) and her goal would be to reunite her family, she's a bit obssesed with having her family fully and complete.

But! The idea that, for example, after having the twins she was unconscious for several days or something, and it was decided that hidding the twins was the better choice and told her they died it's so very tasty and angsty! Vader and Padmé would be EVEN MORE codependant and messed up out of the grief (also THE GUILT Vader feels about thinking he caused their kids death as he sees Padmé so distraguth?!!!! He wants to constantly kill himself, he probably wants Padmé to kill him, tasty angst) If she believes her twins to be dead, then she believes she only has her husband, and she's very overprotective of him (and possesive, a lot).

And then you would have the plot following slightly similar to the movies, but now the twins have to redeem BOTH of their parents who are kinda enabling each other so hjhbdgdfsf

(Either Leia wasn't given to Bail and Breha because...come on, or I'll have to invent a super duper and convenient explanation)

Also @squad-724 suggested the idea of Padmé and Vader somehow sort of bringing Ahsoka (inquisitor ahsoka, wahoo!) into this and now I won't stop thinking about it (unconsciously) having Ahsoka as their stand-in-daugther because they lost their twins. Messed up, messed up and all these conflicting feelings guys!!!!

BUT! On the other hand, Imperial twins raised by both EVIL PARENTS is super fun, like, this poor galaxy can't catch a breath. Because my Vader raises the twins AU have them being double agents with Vader trying hard to cover them up so the emperor won't kill them. But here it probably makes them less likely to turn against their parents! However, 5-6 years being raised among rebels, and then being raised in the imperial palace and becoming prince and princess and at the very least knowing your mom kinda betrayed the rebels is probably enough to give you suspicion and "huh,,,this is kinda bad? Maybe"

For Padmé and Vader though, I think it would bring a very devoted and angry protectiveness for both Padmé and Vader; they aren't that invested in the empire and power tbh, they just want to have their Little House On The Prairie fantasy with a family fully complete and safe, at all costs. It would make them even more of a team and less weaknesses. Though, I once kinda as a joke just imagined Padmé getting tired of all of it and going "ah whatevery, let the galaxy burn by itself while we ran a way somewhere" and that's it because seriously Padmé wanted to actually give up on all the work, no big redemption or big epic dramatic moment, the imperial family just disappeared one night and no one knows what happened (surely they were murdered?) when they're just chilling in some super random and secret corner of the galaxy doing, idk, the most boring thing ever, farming. Luke and Leia get bored and become spice smugglers . The end.

For the last question, though, I think half of the people think Padmé is a victim of this terrible situation somehow (oh noooo, she was kidnapped by that monster, who knows what she's enduring, or she's being mind-controlled :( ), that she's some sort of puppet empress while Vader actually makes all the choices because,,,come on, that was the emperor's second hand right there. The other half of the people remember Padmé was a bit of a political apprentice for Palpatine, and they're also both from Naboo, and it was also thanks to her Palpatine became the Chancellor, maybe she did want power from the start, maybe Naboo is fucked up, never let politicans from Naboo have power again.

And then there's the third secret thing, which is only a very limited number of people like Obi-Wan and Bail (and Padmé and Vader's palace staff lol), that are fully side-eyeing her.

There's also the problem that since she actually worked with the rebels, she,,,knows a lot, she probably knows almost all the names of the rebels' leaders, she probably knows there's a underground society helping jedi run and to which planets. She knows so much, and yet she doesn't actively chase them (or more like, she doesn't actively send Vader to chase them), and if she does send her husband, which is rarely since she wants him to stay where she can see him (remember when I said obssesive and possesive and overprotective?), she's probably doesn't tell him that much info because it's entertaining, giant galactic chess game, lmao.

Also, her empire isn't half as awful as Palpatine's, like, it's still very bad but it's leagues better and she does probably finally forces the good charity projects she never could as a senator, and well, complacency it's extremelly dangerous for freedom. So there's that.