#cw Nazis

[velvetvexations]

im white so idk if I'm overstepping here, and I know others have said this more coherently, but every time I see people compare being a man to being white it feels so?? Especially when it's a trans man like, what, does that mean race is equally binary and also transitioned to? I wish people would just say that being a trans man is, idk, like being ace or bi, in terms of being just as invisible aside from needing a joke, a scapegoat, or at BEST tolerating when needing an in to divide the queer community (which, btw, is none of these demographics’ fault). Even then i tfeels a bit....overly simplified?

I d k it just always feels kind of obnoxious, esp now that white CIS people are getting in on this like???

I think that's just normal, honestly. It can be present in different groups to different extents for various reasons but people tend to prioritize their own suffering and feel offended when others come close to infringing their oppression copyright. There's a bit in Maus* where the author is baffled by how racist his Holocaust-survivor father is towards Black people that I think about a lot. Intuitively, going through oppression yourself should make you a turbo-progressive, but humans are more complicated than that.

*if you can stomach a pretty harrowing depiction of the Holocaust, Maus is a true work of art and I heavily recommend it; it's less about the Holocaust itself (although it goes through the period in exhaustive detail) and more the author's relationship with his father

[foone]

I want you to think about this as a writing exercise, not a poll about your personal morals/politics.

So imagine you find a crashed time travel attack drone. It's got enough fuel left for one last trip: you tell it when and where, it warps through time, and now it's got about the equivalent firepower of an helicopter gunship.

So you could shoot a person, a crowd, level a smallish building, take out an entire meeting room, sink a boat, crash a plane, or blow up a car.

Where, in all of time and space, do you think would be best to send this thing to change the past?

I was sorta assuming "for the better", but if you just want to see the world burn, feel free to suggest chaotic options.

Any ideas where you'd best us this power? I mean, the obvious one is blow up Hitler. Maybe fire on the Beer Hall Putsch? That'd get him and much of the Nazi leadership as well, and all before Hitler got national headlines.

But I'm wondering if there's was a meeting sometime in history with a bunch of particularly bad people where you could take 'em all out at once for a better "return on investment".

[shyjusticewarrior]

So I work retail. When they no longer need someone they called for, they say "cancel [employee name]" on intercom. And it got me thinking what if the batfam did that.

Tim: Cancel Red Hood.

Duke: Damn, what'd he do? Naziism?

Jason: What- I have killed nazis. I'll kill one right now!

[whirlpool-blogs]

hi have we talked about gale recreating russelsheim as some kind of headfucky experiential therapy. bucky on his hands and knees on the floor while gale fucks him from behind, a gun pointed to the back of john’s head. he’s calling him terrorflieger and schwein and john is shaking so badly his ankle bones are rattling against the floor but he’s whispering, eyes squeezed shut, that’s me, that’s what i am. and then at the end of it all, gale pulls the trigger and there’s an empty click at john’s head and john cries out so loud it’s like he really is dying. and then gale pulls him into his arms and says, see, you’re alive, you’re alive

[meyerlansky]

>vent about antisemitism in the hbo war fandom last night

>wake up and check activity page

>"oh a few new likes on my mota gifsets from a blog i don't recognize! ...and they followed and unfollowed very quickly. hm."

>check their blog

>literal neonazi shit two posts down

this is what i'm fucking talking about. if you're going to participate in a fanbase for a piece of media that deals directly with wwii in europe, you need to get way better at recognizing neofash propaganda, especially the flavor that valorizes the american war machine and uses media that does the same valorizing—like every hbowar installment—to further their rhetoric. you need to be thinking much more critically about the ways groups like this are using rising antisemitism to disseminate genocidal beliefs to people who otherwise wouldn't find those ideas palatable. you need to be a lot more fucking careful. there is a neonazi presence on this website, and fascist groups WANT images like those in the post i'm talking about to spread without commentary to solidify their ideas in public discourse. you need to be able to recognize it when you see it, and you need to be not only prepared and willing but ACTIVELY SEEKING to shut it the fuck down immediately.

in terms of practical things you can do to learn to recognize fash and nazi propaganda, this document is a good starting point, though it's from 2021 and some of the entries are dated. online fash iconography co-opts things—like the american war machine, as mentioned—that will make it easier for nonfash people to digest, and can be very quick to shift to stay ahead of the public awareness that it IS in fact fascist. staying aware not a one-and-done thing. you have to keep doing it.

[recreationaldivorce]

Hey guys quick question what's that on the plane behind you.

[anarchotolkienist]

I watched an introduction to the World of Darkness setting Hunter, which makes the case that it's a game about being a punk - the isolation that comes with being one of the few people who see the oppression of the world for what it is and doing something about it, when noone can be trusted to help you and you are the only people who seemingly care which can then cash out as hating the humanity you're supposed to protect because they feel complicit, and so on. I sort of get it, for an experience of really annoying 90s hardcore who takes The Scene and Punk, Man, way more seriously than it deserves, but I also feel like it's way closer to the Nazi Punk experience than any normal ones.

The whole experience of the world being that it's run by monsters who only seem human even through they aren't, that you can't fight back against except by cleansing it (the title is even, probably (?) by accident, the title of the pre-eminent neo-Nazi serial killer novel) but you'll be seen as a murderer, finding connection with other people who have Seen it online and only online (what is Hunter-net but Stormfront? However much I dislike the punk scene, normal punks hardly go about finding their political community on a forum, they do so at gigs and in bands, parts of the scene. Only the Nazis really prominently featured the forum as an organising tool). Like the theming to me really strongly implies that you're a neo-Nazi in a world where neo-Nazism is just kind of ontologically correct (because there actually is a conspiracy at the top to keep the blood-sucking élite and their influence secret and it is partially based on what kind of human runs the show - the universe has oil companies that are massively destructive, not because they exist in a social structure, but because they're run by an evil cult to the Lovecraftian entity the Worm, and that sort of thing). It's kind of hard to imagine the endgame of the Hunters being a popular revolution establishing different structures and ways of living with one another (any kind of left-wing revolutionism), rather it seems to be a cadre of murderers Who Have Seen the Light rising up in cell structures until they eventually manage to purge the government of the inhuman beings that corrupt it and use it to cleanse the world of the impurities that prey on people.

I don't think that any of this was in any way intentional, so I don't really know where I was going with this, other than I guess be careful how you imagine your radicalism and the things you fight against, because you might accidentally become a Nazi. It's happened before, and it will keep happening until the left takes Fascism seriously as a force that we have interactions with ideologically.

[max1461]

The thing about the Nazis is like. You know, at some level you don't expect evil people to actually look evil. Like you just think "nah they probably looked like regular guys, I mean this isn't a movie, awful people just look regular in real life". And then, no, they all actually look like the slimiest motherfuckers alive. Like look at these people:

Like, I didn't cherrypick here! These are like, the top fucking guys!

[elierlick]

90 years ago today: On May 6th, 1933, Nazis stormed, looted, and burned Magnus Hirschfeld’s Institute for Sexual Science, Europe's center of queer and trans culture. I colorized these gruesome photos to point out this wasn't that long ago. People alive today can remember these events. We will not go back.

[dernisseznirp]

Ich hab Grad den gruseligsten Wikipedia Artikel gefunden :)))

[velvetvexations]

One rebuttal ive seen very often to "bigots see you as a man" is "if TERFs thought we were men, why are they teaming up with (right wing) men to hurt us?"

And while thats not entirely wrong, I have to point out that there are other TERFs/radfems who are Very Upset at others for teaming up with right wing groups. The video essayist Shaun did a video on Posie Parker (a transphobe who Does Not call herself a feminist) who mentioned that when Posie & her group started teaming up with right wing groups and saying "sacrificing womens rights to stop the trans cult is just a sacrifice we'll have to make", other radfems were furious. (Please keep in mind I am not defending any terf/radfems, theyre all awful regardless)

I dont blame trans women & femmes for not like, looking at the things terfs post, bc I understand not wanting to crawl through their hateful rhetoric, 100%. But as someone who has, they absolutely do Hate Men. Thats like, the core tenent of radical feminism.

lmao yeah I recently told one complaining about it that I thought it was hilarious all her friends were turning out to be Nazis

[shu-of-the-wind]

this is the third fuckin time today i've seen people throw the "queer people were killed during the holocaust too shut up" shit at jewish folks so i will say it ONE MORE FUCKING TIME because i am TIRED OF THIS: the reason queer and trans people were targeted by the nazis is because the nazis were antisemitic. the nazis believed that any and all societal "degeneration", including queer people, was caused by jewish people and judaism in general.

cw nazism, shoah, discussions of shoah, transphobia, discussions of mein kampf and hitler's worldview, discussion of nazi legal theory, etc below the cut

the entire fucking reason that queer and trans folks were targeted by the nazi regime is because they were seen as a direct representation of the impact of jewish people on aryan society. magnus hirschfeld, who founded the institute for sexual science, was a jewish man. that is not a fucking accident.

hitler believed that the world was solely ruled by the quote-unquote law of the jungle; that is, people had to suppress any tendency for mercy or compassion in themselves and take what they wanted to survive. carl schmitt, a nazi legal theorist, believed that "politics arose not from history or concepts but our sense of enmity; our racial enemies were chosen by nature, and our task was to struggle and kill and die." (quote from black earth by timothy snyder.) hitler believed that jewish people who "introduced the false distinction between politics and nature, between humanity and struggle. . . . [that] ideas of political reciprocity, practices in which humans recognize other humans as [human], came from jews." (id.)

to the nazis, recognizing trans people and queer people and queer identities was a distinctly jewish idea. which is not to say it's not impossible that nazis would have targeted queer people without the antisemitism component, but their rhetoric was always interwoven with antisemitism and antisemitic racial hygiene arguments. you cannot separate the murders of queer and trans people during the holocaust from antisemitism. that violence was born from it.

[anghraine]

nelayn replied to this post:

Bleeh... My current experience as an immigrant has been like... "I am very much "white" and thus perceived as part of the (British) majority but that also I end up flattening all of my cultural and ethnic characteristics in day-to-day life in order to (succesfully) blend into the background of a dominant (Anglo) culture". That must get even weirder in a US context (and must have been really hard for your grandmother!)

Yeah, that's really familiar! My grandmother can be seen as a "normal" old white lady here and very much is in many ways, but also as "ethnic" in ways that are vaguely embarrassing and which she's often quietly repressed (and she is not a quiet person!). She pretty much actively assimilated into my grandfather's Irish-American family as a young woman and, at the same time, maintained her ties to the local Greek communities, and has been thrilled that one of my cousins and I actually ended up interested in her experiences and background. But it's a very unobtrusive thing despite everyone knowing her general history. Like, last year she called and admitted to the small rebellion at age 87 of sending me my yearly package of Greek pastries to align with the traditional Orthodox calendar instead of the Catholic one (she formally converted to Catholicism in 1957, I think?).

And, yes, it's usually possible here as well to be taken for Generic White Person without much difficulty, especially now. But in my experience, there is a certain weirdness among some of the, hm, more or less Anglo crowd if the "ethnic whites" make a point of doing things differently from more mainstream white US culture, and especially if they prioritize preservation of their particular subcultures above racist solidarity with whiteness more broadly.

Also in my experience, most people here who don't have ties to Greek-American communities use "Greek" in a way that is almost always completely divorced from any living Greek culture or Greek people of any nationality who have existed in well over a millennium.

When people here begin a sentence with something like "the Greeks believed" it's almost invariably about a sort of western fandomized soundbites version of ancient Greece and no other part of Greek history. Even when people are talking about more recent history like WWII, you get stuff about how much the Nazis loved "the Greeks" or "Greek art" or "Greek culture" without any acknowledgment that "Greek culture" as understood and fetishized by German Nazis does not correspond to the broader reality of Greek culture, art, people, anything. And I've almost never heard it accompanied by any reference at all to what this supposed love for Greeks meant in practice during the Nazi occupation.

So it's like, nobody was going to e.g. use slurs or violence against me when I mentioned having a Greek grandmother in high school. My classmates just went, "huh, really? You don't look like a philosopher!" All this is not The Real Racism of America or anything, nor necessarily universal at all, but I do find it really uncomfortable and alienating in the context of my specific family experiences.

I don't know how much of this you've experienced where you are! For me, the whole "Greek" as interchangeable with "westernized -> Anglicized -> Americanized ancient Greek" thing (when it's not just. fucking university fraternities) has been pretty inescapable. I guess it's more frustrating because in my particular (maternal) family, I had a distinct impression that anything about me that could specifically derive from my grandmother's culture or ethnicity was considered obtrusive or embarrassing or unattractive. My mother's family outright said many times that my grandmother's maiden name is objectively unpronounceable, etc etc.

And my grandmother repressed so much that it took a long time to realize just how connected to the local Greek-American community she is, while my bio father (her son) knew basically nothing. He had never eaten any Greek food (even baklava!) until I recommended a restaurant to him after his mother had been sending me food for years.

Were her family's objections more along the lines of "he's the wrong kind of Christian and from a different culture" variety?

More or less, I think! I recently found out that her mother, who was definitely caught up in the Greek-American community, was married after my great-grandfather died to a different immigrant from Greece (and a nearby area) born in the 1890s who also worked on the railroads, and that guy is listed as my grandmother's father in some documents—but it's definitely a different man, and she's never mentioned him or her stepsister through him. So her family definitely had a preference for the girls staying within the community, finding nice Greek Orthodox men to marry, all of that, and she went off and instead got pregnant and married my grandfather at age 20 after converting to Catholicism.

(Converting didn't keep her in-laws from looking down on her, however. Some of them still do, even, which has always seemed wild to me from a bunch of Irish-Americans only a couple generations removed from starving in County Cork, but I guess "not revisiting what we experienced on today's immigrants" has never been a priority for a lot of Irish-Americans.)

(Obviously I have no experience or exposure to the kind of WASPy attitudes and racism and "othering" you're talking about. I'm sorry you (and others in your family) have to deal with that, even at this level.)

Thank you! And like I said in my other message, I appreciate your help and patience immensely, especially as a US American who's not only far off in the diaspora but in circumstances that are messy and fraught given the specifics of my family history, the people involved, the oddities around my grandmother particularly, etc. It's made a big difference.

[whirlpool-blogs]

read here

Rating: E

Tags: Truth Serum, accidental/forced love confession, Torture, Gale is emotionally split open like a ripe peach, and John absolutely does not have a good time, fuck or die blowjob, Blood and Injury, Hurt No Comfort, Dead Dove: Do Not Eat

@crowthis @thebuckys ❤️

and thanks to everyone who interacted with this fic's WIP posts along the way :)

[chambergambit]

"As I flipped through the pages I realized, my God, it's all scenes of [Nazi] occupied Paris. And I knew I'd found a treasure," she says. "And then I read the little note in the front. 'If you find this album,' it said, 'take care of it and have the courage to look at it.' I thought, someone sent a message in a bottle and I just found it." But there was no indication of who had taken the pictures, and with good reason. During the German Occupation of France, the Nazis strictly prohibited outdoor photography; taking pictures without an official permit was punishable by imprisonment or death. Colaux told NPR she felt compelled to learn who had snapped the mysterious photographs. So she called her friend Philippe Broussard, an investigative journalist with the respected daily newspaper, Le Monde. Together, they embarked on a four-year search for the unknown photographer.

Fascinating article, highly recommend.

[lorbanery]

Oh

oh no

I just understood why they made Hughes a Nazi in Conqueror of Shamballa and I hate how much it makes sense and is also kind of a horribly poignant peek into him as a character

because, in both worlds, Hughes enthusiastically threw his support behind someone planning a violent coup

Like, the implication here is that he has legitimate gripes with the government and is willing to support someone who seems motivated to do something about it.

It's horrible seeing him be a racist, xenophobic, antisemitic asshole in Germany.

But the fact of the matter is ... he was racist in Amestris too. Being in the Amestrian military during the Ishbal genocide and having all of his friends be traumatized over their own direct part in it doesn't stop Hughes from judging the handful of Ishbalans that make appearances.

Even if you argued that German!Hughes was much more bigoted than Amestrian!Hughes, or at least was more vocal about it, then that begs the question of how an intelligent, empathetic man like him could have been convinced that all of Germany's ills were the fault of anyone they considered "non-Germans" just existing in Germany?

But again, this is also the man who was convinced to just go along with Mustang's plan to recruit an eleven year old to the military in a capacity that would have said eleven year old committing genocide the second Bradley found another enclave of brown people he didn't like.

Like, do I think they probably had a Conversation about how fucked up it was off-screen? Yes. But A) we didn't see that conversation if it did happen; and B) even if it did, Hughes still very much did just go along with it.