#but she was actually batMAN before she was batGIRL
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xevishi · 3 months ago
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everyone raise a glass to THE female batman
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lazerswordweilder · 1 year ago
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Personally I think the Justice League not knowing Batman had kids would be more bad at social things Batman rather than paranoid Batman and they found out like this:
Justice league, minus Batman: *walks into the meeting room*
Superman: *freezes*
Green Lantern: what’s wrong?
Superman: …Batman. Why do you have three heart beats and why is one of them a cats?
Batman: *throws cape over his shoulders revealing Damian sleeping on his lap and a cat sitting on his lap* this is Robins cat Mr Whiskers
Flash: you have a side kick?!
Batman, confused because he thought they knew: no? I have a team?
Wonder Woman: a team?
Batman: Nightwing, Red Hood, Red Robin, Robin, Batgirl, Signal- I thought you guys knew this *pulls out his wallet and pulls 50+ family photos out of that* how did you not? Have none of you pick pocketed me? *the Robins always steal his stuff and he assumes that both his teams do the same things*
Superman: I’m sorry, what?
Batman: how did you not know?
Green Arrow: well you don’t exactly talk about your life
Batman: yeah but you should’ve figured it out, I give figuring out your guys secret identities out as things to do when the Robins are bored. Who did you think looked after Gotham when I couldn’t?
Flash: I thought your power was being two places at once?
Batman: ??? I don’t have powers?
Everyone: WHAT
Batman: I never have?
Superman: how are you such a good fighter then?
Batman: I trained for two decades?
Flash: what.
Green Arrow: wait, why did you call them ‘the Robins’ I thought there were only two Robins?
Batman: well they were all Robin at some point, most of them anyways. Dick was the first Robin, then he became Nightwing. A while after that I found Jason and he became the second Robin, he died and then got resurrected and became a crime boss for a while and changed his name to Red Hood. And while Jason was dead Tim showed up and became Robin, Tim became Red Robin. And Damian is the current Robin.
J’onn: why do you call them by their real names, I know you know everyone’s secret identities but isn’t that rude?
Batman: what do you mean? They’re my kids? I’ve adopted all of them?
Everyone: WHAT
Superman: Wait, circle back. One of your kids got resurrected and is a crime boss
Batman: he isn’t bad, he just isn’t offically part of the team anymore but we still work togther all the time-
Flash: offically? What is there a list on the Gotham police website.
Batman: yes, it can be wrong sometimes though, they thought Batgirl was my sidekick way before I actually started training her. It took me a while to realise I couldn’t convince her to stop crime fighhting.
Green Lantern: you don’t make them when you adopt them?
Btman: NO! She was like 12! I don’t make kids fight! She wouldn’t stop and it would be mroe dangerous to leave her without proper gear or any way to call for help, and I didn’t want Nightwing to fight when I adopted him he chose to himself and when I said no he went out after Zacoo anyways, and I found Jason stealing my tires so he already knew I was Batman-
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emacrow · 7 months ago
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Batfam tried to bribe the banshee child to get their stuff back.
Originally post here.
The one to figured it out was Tim who sacrifice his first camera that he still kept from back then when he stalked batman, the other two original robins and that it still have some film left in it. It was still a bit damaged and covered in tape on the camera and on the strap.
Alfred gave danny Bruce's father, Thomas's baby blanket in exchange for his favorite spoon.
Dick painstakingly gave his zitka elephant plushy for his mask, only to watch wide eyed when danny misty breath made a form of a miniature zitka the actual elephant doing one of her favorite tricks. And no he didn't cry after he left the room.
Damian offered secretly offered one of his most cherished drawing he had kept as a child, that remind him of Danyal..
Barb offered her old Batgirl costume, the one that still had a tear in it before she became the oracle..
Bruce offered one of his mother's pearls, the few that he had left.. from that night. When he gave it to danny in his tiny hand, all he felt was a sense of cold shiver that wrapped around him like a warm yet cold hug.
Duke gave him one of his first glasses that was a bit bented when his power came in, that were left discard in his draw as a reminder.
Leaving all but Jason todd who didn't know what to give Danny to have his red hood helmet back..
He tried one of his first gun, nothing..his black jacket, nothing.. it took Jason a long time (7 months tops) to figure out what to give danny.
It was 3am in the morning that he snucked in the Wayne Manor, peeking in the newest room for their youngest adoptee who was wide awake again.
Jason pulling out something from a pouch. It was old, torn and still had charred of ashes damaged but he kept it for his own selfish reasons..
He gave danny his Robin's cape, the original one that brought memories old, good and bad..
Danny held his Robin's cape and look at it, not saying anything with his eyes glow brightly before looking up at Jason with the most heartbreaking watery eyes.
He got up slowly, and hugs Jason close, chirping softly that made Jason's eyes glow a bit, before big drops of lararus pits liquid drips down from his eyes.
Just two broken core boys comforting one another, despite the puddle of lararus pits beneath them both that glow brighter and clearer then jason ever seen lararus pits have then it usuall musky growing green form... Jason close his eyes slowly as he gently hug the ghostly boy back.
Jason will never admit to anyone of what he gave that night or why he was asleep in Danny's nest the next morning after, but he suddenly felt some kind of unmoveable weight being lifted from his shoulders..
Until he saw on the news that The Joker was found dead with his ears, eyes and nose bleeding with a horrified look on his face.
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rizzanon · 13 days ago
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Ages and background info
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m.list
Current timeline:
Bruce - 42
Dick - 25
Jason - 20
Cassandra - 20
Tim - 17
regressed!reader - 16
Damian - 11
Alfred - 64
Barbara - 28
Stephanie - 18
Duke - 15
sadly Duke won’t be making an appearance anytime soon because I think he only comes around in the timeline when reader is like 17/18¿? 😔
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Background info (Alfred, Bruce, Dick, Barbara, Jason centered)
You don’t know who your mother is. You were left at the doorstep of Wayne Manor the moment you were born. (don’t ask how she managed to get through Wayne Manor’s cutting edge and state-of-the-art security system..) Bruce took you in and became your parent after getting a paternity test that proved that he is your father. At this time, it was Dick’s first year of being Robin.
You’d be initially taken care of by Alfred during your early years. When Bruce was busy fighting crime or with board meetings at Wayne Enterprises, it was Alfred who rocked you to sleep, tended to your needs, taught you how to read and draw. His soft and steady preference was reader’s anchor in that big, lonely manor.
Growing up, you constantly heard about your father’s brilliance—Bruce Wayne, the untouchable billionaire philanthropist, praised for his endless contributions to Gotham. The public’s expectations for you, his daughter, were impossibly high, and your every achievement was either dismissed as trivial or compared to his legendary feats.
You worked tirelessly to prove yourself worthy of the Wayne name, pouring everything into becoming the perfect daughter. But no matter how hard you tried, there were always people who’d be better than you in certain aspects, you can’t always win, can’t always get the top place. And that was the only thing the public focused on.
It hurt, but you buried the pain, telling yourself to try harder. Because that’s what it meant to be a Wayne—always striving, even when it felt like no one cared. You hoped till the very end that one day, your achievements would actually mean something to your family. To your father.
And mind you, this was before you found out your father was the Batman. And when you did, that’s when you changed trajectories and tried becoming a vigilante just like your father, like your siblings. You took up the mantle of Batgirl at 13, you trained hard, trying to hone your skills. But you weren’t meant for this life of crimefighting. You were always sidelined, and at every moment, it felt like your family was waiting for you to fail badly, so that they’d have a reason to prevent you from picking up the mask ever again. You could never be good enough, strong enough like your family. But you still pushed through, tried to prove yourself, and that was ultimately the cause of your demise.
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When Dick was still in his pre-teens, I would think that he liked the idea of having a baby sister. Whenever he wasn’t off at school or out being Robin, he’d always come and play with you. But as he grew older, his teenage years, Dick would spent less and less time around the manor, and more time with his friends and the Teen Titans. He’d be consumed more and more by his missions and bonds with his teammates.
At first, you didn’t mind of course. He was your big brother. He always promised to make it up to you, he’d always promise to come back. But as the days stretched into weeks, and then months, his time spent with her became shorter, and his attention became more divided. He still loved you of course—he always tried making that clear—but his life was no longer centered around the manor, around Gotham. And by extension, that meant you too.
But that changes when you find out about your family being vigilantes. You’d feel betrayed at first upon finding out, especially because they hid this from you for so long, and if you hadn’t found out when you did, you doubt they’d even tell you.
And that makes you want to prove yourself to the family, and that’s what makes you pick up the mask and become a vigilante as well. Dick was definitely against this, and that’s what initially causes your relationship to strain with him. After all, this was when Jason had just died not too long ago. But you were adamant. With that, he did try to train you for a bit, but he ultimately ended up focusing more on Tim, who was the next Robin, and Bludhaven. He “left” you to figure out the ropes of this yourself. He was sure that Bruce or Barbara would train you.
This widens the gap between you and Dick, and at first, you ruled it off as him gaining control of his life and trying to figure out what he plans to do with his responsibilities. But then as the years go by, you notice the blatant distinction between the way he acts around you versus your other siblings.
He kept his distance from you, his interactions were friendly, but always brief. He didn’t exactly linger to check on you or talk to you after patrols. At first, you thought it was Jason’s death that was making him distant, that he was just coping in his own way. But as time went on, it felt like he didn’t see you as worth the effort. Or maybe he just thought you were fine. When he did make plans with you, most of the time, it’d get postponed, or it would slip his mind. He never really thought it was a big deal, and what made things worse was that you never pointed it out as well.
You didn’t want to confront him about this. Maybe you were just afraid to break that loose strands that was holding your relationship with him. Your bond with him. Or maybe you did not want to admit that the bond was basically non-existent.
Whereas Dick remained blissfully unaware of the way he’s treating you. Did he notice that he doesn’t spend as much time with you as he does with the others? Maybe. But did he choose to do anything about that? Not really.
Maybe one day he’ll come to realise the consequences of his actions. That maybe, he wasn’t the best big brother he could be for everyone. Dick Grayson was a man who cared about many things, a man who wore his heart on his sleeve. He was fiercely loyal, protective, and deeply committed to the people he loved—whether it was his adoptive family, his friends, or the people of Gotham. But that didn’t include you.
Dick’s commitment to his own life and responsibilities, both as Nightwing and as a person, pulled him further away from you. He was no longer the older brother who would spend hours with you, teaching you how to be better, how to be a hero. Instead, he was often wrapped up in his own struggles—focusing on Bludhaven, or dealing with the aftermath of Jason’s death. Even when he did offer advice or training, it always felt half-hearted, like he was only doing it because he had to, not because he wanted to.
There were times when you did try to approach him, to bridge the gap that had grown between you two. You wanted to confide in him, to seek his guidance and maybe find the comfort you desperately needed. But every time you tried, it was like talking to a wall. He was distant, distracted, and no matter how much you tried to show him how much you were struggling, he never seemed to truly see you.
The bitterness began to grow, and with it, resentment. Why didn’t he care about you like he used to? Why was it so easy for him to focus on everyone else while you fell to the wayside? It hurt more than you wanted to admit, especially because you still looked up to him, still wanted to be close to him the way you had when you were younger. But now, as the years went on, you realized that maybe the bond you once had was slipping away for good.
He was still the person you wanted to be, but in a way, he had moved on from you. And as much as you hated to admit it, it was easier to hide behind the mask and do things on your own. Because at least then, you wouldn’t have to face the painful truth: Dick Grayson, the brother you looked up to so much, no longer had time for you.
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As for Bruce, I don’t want to make it seem like he didn’t care about you. Bruce loves his children, and I don’t want to take that trait away from him. But at the same time, you have to admit that he’s quite emotionally unavailable. From the moment you were brought into his life, Bruce is terrified. He doesn’t know if he can be a good father to raise you, especially with his line of work. And it’s not like you were like Dick. Dick was a growing boy, you were just a baby. Completely dependent on him. You were so and fragile in his arms, and he thinks you’d break if he held you any tighter.
Bruce wanted to love you the way a father should, but love didn’t come easily to him—not in the way most people understood it. His life was a constant battle, filled with shadows and danger, and the idea of bringing a child into that world felt wrong. He couldn’t protect you the way he wanted, not with Gotham always demanding more of him.
So, instead of letting himself get too close, Bruce focused on what he could control: providing for you. He made sure you had the best of everything—your education, your safety, and most importantly, Alfred.
In truth, Alfred did most of the parenting. Bruce rationalized that it was for your own good. Alfred was patient, kind, and steady in ways Bruce felt he could never be. Alfred would shield you from the darkness of the world Bruce inhabited. But deep down, Bruce knew the truth: he was keeping himself at arm’s length because he was terrified of failing you.
But with him keeping you at an arm’s length all the time, Bruce is unaware of the repercussions of his actions. That in a way, he was in fact failing you. Just, not in the way he thinks. He doesn’t necessarily realise how much of your life he’s missing. Sure, he knows he misses out on some of your events, but he tries to make up for it by gifting you more toys and clothes.
Though, that could only work for so long. By the time you were in your pre-teens, you needed more than just trivial gifts.
You needed your father.
But Bruce couldn’t see that. He never did. He only just checked in on your well-being through Alfred. And everytime Alfred tries to tell him about how you needed him in your life more, Bruce always ends up brushing it aside, claiming that you only just need Alfred.
And then comes Jason’s death. That puts a huge hole in Bruce’s heart. The death of his son is something that will haunt him forever. He vows to never fail like that again, not with anyone else he cared about. This was the whole reason why he kept his vigilante life in the dark from you. But you found out anyways. And when you did, you wanted to follow in his footsteps.
That was the last thing he wanted you to do. He tried to dissuade you from this path, but you were determined. Stubbornness was the one trait you did share with him. And eventually, he relented.
He always assigned you cases that he thought was “safe”. Cases that he knew you could handle. But everytime, you demanded more, and each time, Bruce always said no. You were his daughter, he couldn’t risk putting you in dangerous situations. He knew what you can or can’t handle. And unfortunately, that did not change over the years. He was fixated on the very fact that you weren’t cut out for this life of crime-fighting. And you never will be.
Which is why he only watches from afar, the gap between you and your father growing too far apart for any of you to try and bridge it. He only gets updates about you from Alfred, and even that was rarely asked about. And eventually, you just fade into the background, into the shadows of the family.
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As for Jason, I believe there would be two parts for him. Before his death, when he was first brought into the family by Bruce, he was this small, energetic boy who had a certain sass to him. He was only 4 years older than you, and that allowed you to build a fairly close bond with him. That is, before he suddenly becomes “busy” with other stuff. Though he spent lesser time with you, he always did try and check in with you when he could. You two always read together in the library, he’d tell you all sorts of stories about Crime Alley.
But that all changed when he died. Jason’s death left a void in everyone, including you. You didn’t understand why he died, what caused his death, and you were literally heartbroken. You saw how his death destroyed your family, and you tried desperately to fix it. But nothing ever worked. Which is why you shifted your grief towards your studies, trying to make sure that you could be the perfect daughter that could fill the emptiness Jason left behind. But nothing worked. You wanted to heal, wanted to help your family move forward, but without their support, it felt impossible.
When you take up the mantle of Batgirl, part of the reason is because you wanted to honour what Jason did. His time as Robin. You thought that maybe he’d be proud of you, for stepping up and doing this. And maybe, just maybe, you’d be able to become half the hero he was.
But no, Jason was far from proud. And you only know that once he is revealed to be Red Hood years later. Jason is furious. His fury cuts deeper than you expected, not just at the fact that you’ve taken up the mantle of Batgirl, but because of the underlying betrayal he feels.
He looks at you, his younger sister, the one who was supposed to be protected, and sees someone who is willingly stepping into the very nightmare he couldn’t escape. The life that broke him, the endless cycle of violence and pain, and the years of grief and rage that had consumed him. He sees you and wonders: Why? Why would you choose this path, knowing what it did to him?
His anger isn’t just about the mantle—it’s about the idea that you’re following in his footsteps, as if you’re willing to become just like him. Worse, you’re doing it without understanding what it costs. He doesn’t want you to end up like him, as someone who can’t find redemption, who is trapped in a life of revenge. He’s already lost so much—first to the Joker, then to Bruce—and now it feels like he’s losing you too. The only family he has left.
But for you, the choice to take up the mantle was about honoring Jason. You didn’t want to replace him. You didn’t want to erase the pain he went through. But as much as you wanted to fight for the family, you couldn’t help but feel like you needed to prove yourself in a way he never had to. Your family was broken, and you thought that maybe, by stepping up, you could fix it. Maybe you could become the hero Jason never got the chance to be.
But that’s not how Jason sees it. He’s angry, and hurt, and feels betrayed—because he knows what you don’t fully understand yet. This life doesn’t fix anything. It destroys. And if you keep going down this path, you’ll end up like him—scarred, alone, and full of rage that will consume you, just like it did him.
The tension between you two becomes unbearable. The sibling bond you once shared is strained beyond repair, and Jason makes it clear that he’ll never accept you as Batgirl. He’s no longer the brother you knew—the one who once taught you how to laugh, how to stand up for yourself. Now, he’s just a stranger, a man whose hatred for the life he was brought into has twisted him into something unrecognizable. And you? You’re just another casualty of it.
No matter how much you try to explain, no matter how much you try to reach him, the gap between you two widens. He’s Red Hood, and you’re Batgirl. The two identities, both born from tragedy, will never be able to coexist peacefully. Every time you suit up, every time you fight to prove yourself, you feel the divide grow stronger. You’ve both chosen your paths, and with that choice, you’ve irreparably lost each other.
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For a while, you only ever saw Barbara as the GCPD commissioner’s daughter, Dick’s friend. She had always been around, and was a frequent family friend. You never really understood why she was so deeply tied with your family until you found out the truth.
When you found out that she’d been the first Batgirl, you were amazed, and frankly, you wanted to be just like her. She, who has done so much and fought alongside your family in many battles, who has done so much to protect Gotham. Maybe this was the way for you to get close with your father and older brother. You had to prove yourself through this. That’s what you thought.
Which is why when you approached Barbara one day with the idea of being Batgirl, you expected support, encouragement, maybe even a bit of excitement. After all, she had once worn the cape and fought crime in Gotham’s shadows. But no, apparently you were getting in over your head.
Barbara’s face hardened the moment you mentioned the mantle. Her mantle. She immediately refused, telling you that it was dangerous. At first, you thought she was being protective. Jason had died not too long ago doing this, so maybe that’s why. Which is why you relented. But as she continued, you saw the weight of her words—the deep, painful truth that came from experience.
She recounted her time as Batgirl, her fight against the criminals of Gotham, and how the Joker had shattered her body and soul in a way that no physical injury could ever heal. She spoke of the night she was shot, of how she had lost everything—her mobility, her sense of security, and even a part of her identity. It wasn’t just the pain of what happened to her body—it was the mental toll of knowing that every choice she made brought her closer to losing herself.
You were taken aback, shocked by how strongly she felt. Was she really trying to stop you from becoming Batgirl? After everything she had endured, you couldn’t fathom why she wouldn’t want you to follow in her footsteps. But Barbara wasn’t just speaking from a place of worry; she was speaking from experience. She had seen firsthand how dangerous this life was, how it consumed you piece by piece, and how it left scars that would never fade.
But even as you understood her perspective, the desire to prove yourself still burned fiercely inside of you. You wanted to be more than Bruce Wayne’s daughter, more than someone who had to hide in the shadows. You wanted to stand beside your family, to help Gotham in the only way you knew how. You wanted to honour Jason for what he did for Gotham, and continue it for him. Which is why you relented, and eventually, just like everyone else, Barbara gave in. Because she knew couldn’t change your mind no matter what. Which is why she takes you on and helps with your training.
However, just like Bruce, she too only assigned you cases thst she knew you could handle. Even though Barbara had reluctantly agreed to help you become Batgirl, it was clear from the start that she wasn’t going to make it easy on you. She trained you relentlessly, teaching you the ins and outs of combat, tactics, and the stealthy finesse that Gotham’s criminals required. But even in her guidance, you could feel her hesitation. She never pushed you too far, always stopping just short of testing your limits, as though she was holding something back.
She would assign you cases, but they were always ones she knew you could handle—petty thefts, low-level gangs, the type of cases that wouldn’t put you in direct danger, that wouldn’t challenge you too much, and that she could step in and call someone else to take over if things ever went south.
At first, you didn’t mind. You were just glad to be training, to be doing something. But as time went on, the restrictions started to chafe at you. You could see how Barbara’s protective nature was keeping you in a bubble—one that was too small, one that didn’t prepare you for what Gotham truly was. You didn’t want to be stuck fighting the small-time criminals; you wanted to face the real threats, the ones that could change Gotham for the better after being dealt with.
The frustration mounted. Every time she handed you a case, every time she stopped you from pursuing something more dangerous, you felt your desire to prove yourself slipping further and further away. You knew you couldn’t keep doing this forever. Gotham was too big, the stakes too high, and you were capable of so much more. You had to break free from Barbara’s shadow, from her protective grip, and finally prove that you were ready for the challenges that came with being Batgirl—not just in name, but in action. Which is why you started doing more. Did more than you needed to, took one too many unnecessary risks.
But everything shifted when Barbara took in Cassandra Cain and Stephanie Brown, both taking up the mantle of Batgirl at some point. It stung. The sense of being sidelined was undeniable, and it hurt more than you had expected. Were you really that replaceable? Did you being Batgirl mean nothing?
Barbara’s training shifted with the new additions. She wasn’t the same mentor to you as she had been when you first started. She had become consumed with building Cassandra and Stephanie up, preparing them for the same Gotham streets that had torn her apart. Except, it was obvious that Barbara saw then as more capable, more stronger to take on the streets. More prepared than you’ll ever be. You were no longer her first priority. In fact, you were hardly a priority at all.
The worst part was how Barbara handled it. Instead of talking to you, explaining her choices, she just… distanced herself. There were no more long training sessions, no more subtle encouragement. Your bond, the one that had felt so strong when she first took you in, weakened and thinned, becoming strained and distant. It was as though she had replaced you with them. Maybe she had.
It wasn’t just the feeling of being replaced by two new recruits; it was the complete lack of acknowledgment of everything you had sacrificed, everything you had worked for. You had pushed through every painful night, every bruise, every tear, just to earn your place. But now, it seemed like all that hard work meant nothing. You were left alone in the shadows once again, watching as the people you cared about, the people who had once been your mentors and family, moved on without you.
The rift between you and Barbara widened with each passing day. You tried to hold on to the hope that things would change, that things would go back to how they were before. But deep down, you knew they never would. Barbara had chosen her new proteges—her Batgirls—and you were left to try to make your own way in a family that no longer felt like your own.
And as the years went by, you still held onto that mantle, and Barbara grew more distant. She checked in on you doing patrols and missions as Oracle, but that was that.
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Part 2 (Tim, Cassandra, Stephanie, Damian, Duke centered)
lmk your thoughts on this because this has been on my mind for so long <33
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wonderjanga · 3 months ago
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Marvel Being the First Hero to Debut
Let me explain, in the 50’s, precisely 58, is when the Batson’s died. Then, two to four years later, the time bubble appeared. (60-62) In 59, there was a sighting of a red blur flying across the sky, but nothing really came of it.
Now, fast forward to 95. The time bubble pops then instead of twenty years later. So boom, Billy, Mary, and Freddy are now in the mid 90’s. The news catches sight and confirmation Marvel exists like a month after the bubble pops when he’s fighting some random magical monster. His official “debut” as Captain Marvel. Now, Billy superheroes his way through the two thousands. He meets Clark when the Kryptonian is like 17 or so in 2008, and Clark is just gobsmacked at the thought of another Kryptonian (he was a little disappointed to find out Marvel wasn’t) and the fact that there’s someone out there who’s also abnormally strong and fast and also has weird abilities. Mary and Freddy become national treasures. (Their Marvel forms make them look like teens) The three go to Gotham (2009) and they happen to meet young Batman, Dick Robin, and Barbara when she’s still Batgirl. Mary and Barbara get along, Freddy and Dick get along, and Batman tolerates Marvel’s cheeriness. The Justice League is formed(2010), he isn’t invited. (He kinda was. The team came together during a crisis, aliens, and they all worked together. He left before he could actually be apart of the “let’s be a team” discussion.) Then, he continues to superhero, the Teen Titans are formed some time later (2012), Billy doesn’t really care (he does, he’s jealous he can’t join because his Marvel form looks like an adult) but Freddy and Mary do cause they join. (It crushes him inside slightly) Then, Billy gets actually invited to join the JL cause they were like “wait, does he even know he’s kinda in the league?” (2015) Then he joins, and they all think he’s gonna be this super wise, stoic older hero. They think this cause Billy started avoiding press as the years went by, so there’s rarely a video or photo of him being a dumbass and not listening to Solomon. So they’re a little confused when they meet a mid twenties, maybe early thirties something guy who also kinda, might, may be related to Supes, judging by how friendly they are to each other.
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haveihitanerve · 6 months ago
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Dick Grayson is Bruce Wayne’s ward and Robin is Batmans son, there is no argument from either party. They get no say. Its just how it is. JL members have also dubbed him as Batmans feral gremlin demon thing and Batman the Devil himself who crafted Robin using his own soul. Robin cackled madly after hearing that. Batman laughed and the JL is extremely concerned and afraid now. Nightwing is Batman’s son and partner and he is Bruce Wayne’s most common rescuer, even though his main territory is in Blud. 
Jason Todd is Bruce Wayne's son and Robin is Batmans son, and both very much adore this title and treasure it. Red Hood is not Batman’s son, but he is Bruce Wayne’s. 
Tim Drake is Bruce Wayne’s emotional support child and child. Not son, his child. Robin is Batmans loyal partner and Batman is his father figure and mentor. Red Robin is Batman’s son. Drake has been disowned from the family and does not exist. 
Stephanie Brown is not Bruce Wayne’s child. She steals his food and his money and his children on occasion but she does not really belong to him. Try telling him that though and you've got another thing coming. Robin is Batman’s greatest  annoyance and she wears that as a fucking badge of honor. Batgirl is actually Batman's nemesis but not in like a Joker kind of way, more in a 'she steals things from his utility belt just before he tries to pull it out or drops encouraging notes on his patrol and also hacks his comms to play the same song over and over again' kind of way. Batman has been heard screaming her name like a curse on many occassions. Spoiler is Batman’s even greater annoyance and on occasion she allows herself to be his daughter. Batman does not get to decide these terms. 
Barbara Gordon is not Bruce Wayne’s daughter. He is her weird uncle who she also considers her mother and her step father who she also sees as her protector on the rare occasion she actually needs it but for the most part hes just the divorced father who shows up at her house sometimes asking for visiting rights. (sometimes she says yes) Batgirl is Batman’s loyal partner and confident and technically his daughter in law but she doesn't like that descriptor, but he is her mentor. Oracle is Batman’s stalker and ass kicker if he doesn't take care of himself. 
Cassandra Cain is Bruce Wayne's daughter through thick and thin and neither of them really get a say. Batgirl is Batman’s daughter and no one dares argue it. Orphan too. And Black Bat.
Damian Wayne is Bruce Wayne’s undisputed son, and Robin is Batman’s undisputed son as well (though heir is another matter.)
Duke Thomas is Bruce Wayne’s legally guarded(bruce is his legal guardian). The Signal doesn't associate with the Batman at all, but some consider him Batman’s mentee, and many would even argue Batman is very serious in his mentor/father figure role, seen on many occasions forcing a granola bar or hug onto the younger
All in all, every single child, adopted or not, it is very clear to every outsider, that they forced themselves into Bruce Wayne and Batman’s life and routine and while both males are vastly different, they clearly share the utter confusion about being parents, and whether they even are or not, because they don't get a say.
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drunkenkissesatdusk · 5 months ago
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can i order an older!batman!damian x reader they have a lot of children (biologically) and his family and friends does not know, i wanna know their reactions
yes your price is 1 order of creepcast merch for me since there’s 3 days left and i haven’t been able to get my grubby hands on it
YOU HAVE KIDS?
pairings — older!damian wayne — al ghul x fem!reader (could also be read as just reader since i never really use she/her much)
warnings — idk actually, pretty generic names for the kids but obviously you can imagine a different name if you want to (i just don’t like using d/n ykwim) (plus i only use them once)
summary — literally just the request but only with the batboys, batgirls, and bruce!!
notes — i hope this is good 😟
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━━━━━━━ TO BE FAIR, YOU should’ve told them sooner. well, Damian should’ve, they were his family. but, you’d never forced him too, since your account on instagram wasn’t followed by any of them.
“are you sure you want to do this?” you rubbed your hands along his shoulders, gently. you were due at the Wayne manor in a little for a small lunch, you’d never been one to force Damian into seeing them, since you understood, but you were surprised when he planned on going.
“yeah, i’ll have to do it sooner or later.” he grabbed your hand and peppered kissing along your knuckles.
“mom can i bring my doll?” your youngest daughter, just turning five with no front teeth, walked out of the hall opening holding her old doll passed down from you. smiling, you nodded.
“you gonna remember to bring it home, baby?” you stepped forwards, rubbing your hands through her messy head of black hair. she’d inherited more from her father.
“mhm!” she smiled, turning back to her room with a grin.
“can’t we have more?” Damian wrapped his arms around you, his head leaning snug against your shoulder. you put your hands over his, a soft laugh leaving you.
“not for a little bit, Dame.” you turned around with a grin, gently kissing him. you shared the small intimate moment without hesitation, bonded as one soul in the moment.
“mom! are we going yet?” your oldest, now eleven, walked down the hall. you turned to her, then to your husband, who nodded. your oldest daughter saw it, and walked over to put her shoes on.
getting your other three — your youngest and the middle boys (twins) — and helping them with their shoes, you were all off. the ride was peaceful, your kids finding themselves distracted with either the outside world or the toys you let them bring along.
“have you told any of them?” you had been holding Damian’s hand over the center console, your thumb in a constant soothing motion over his knuckles and the curve of his thumb.
“no, only Alfred. he’s the only one who needed to immediately know. besides, i told him first anyways.” Damian sighed.
“that’s fine, baby. i told you, you never had to.” you brought his hand closer to your mouth, gently kissing it. Damian smiled at you before the rest of the car ride was passed with ease.
Damian, getting out and opening your door, then began to help your youngest get out of the car. you helped the twins out, made sure they had the toys they wanted, and had them follow Damian to the front door.
on the way, your draped your arm over your oldest daughters shoulders, tugging her into you. she basically melted into you, her arm going around you in return.
Alfred opened the door, a wide smile crossing his face. “master Damian!” he was overjoyed, “lovely to see you.” he hugged the man before following up with greeting you and your kids the same way.
he led the six of you upstairs to where everyone else was.
if you could’ve had a camera, you would’ve taken a picture of the moment. their faces were covered in pure shock, staring at your kids. your hand squeezed Damian’s, which you had found yourself holding.
“well, if this isn’t news i don’t know what is.” Dick broke the silence first, stepping forwards and embracing Damian. respectfully, he shook your hand.
“these are our kids, Elliot and Titus,” he gestured to the twins, both holding their action figures and playing around with them — they were Red Hood and Nightwing action figures.
“our oldest, Lorelei,” he gestured to her, “and youngest Regan.” they looked like the two of you. your youngest had all of Damian’s features, and your oldest might as well have been your carbon copy.
the twins looked like a mixture, and you could see everything processing in their minds.
“why don’t you four come with me?” Alfred stepped forwards when he noticed the slight tension in the air.
your kids didn’t argue, following him out to the garden.
“how come we never knew?” Bruce, getting older and older each day, stepped forwards.
“because it was our mutual agreement. i told Damian he didn’t have to tell anyone he didn’t want to.” you defended you and your husbands decision instantly.
“doesn’t matter,” Dick stepped up now, “we know now!” he was grinning.
“did you really buy your kids Nightwing and Red Hood action figures?” Jason was grinning when he spoke up.
“the girls have Batgirl figures.” you informed them with a wide smile, “you might not have known them, but they’ve always known you guys.” you added, your hand rubbing comforting patterns into Damian’s back.
“does this mean we’re all aunts and uncles? well, grandparent for Bruce.” Tim asked. you nodded with Damian in confirmation. a challenging look flashed across all of their faces instantaneously.
“this doesn’t mean you guys can go and spoil them.” Damian said, trying to fight back a smile.
ever since being with you, he’d mellowed out and been less harsh towards people. something you hadn’t done on purpose. he was still mean when he had to be.
“don’t spoil them too much, we still want humble and kind kids.” you corrected Damian.
“i can live with that.” Jason shrugged.
“do they really have batgirl figures?” Cass asked. you nodded again in confirmation, mentioning how it was your idea.
“how old are they all?” Steph had finally asked.
“eleven, seven, and five.” you nodded, telling them which was which afterwards. you couldn’t specifically hear it, but you knew they were all ready to fight over the title of favorite.
after awhile at the manor, you all found yourselves back at home. you and Damian relaxed outside as your kids stayed inside, but every once and awhile, the younger ones would run outside and cause chaos.
“do you feel better now that they know?” you had your head against your husbands chest, listening to him and his heartbeat.
“a little. i… i’m glad they reacted how they did. i thought they’d hate me forever.” Damian admitted with a small laugh. you grinned.
“i don’t think anyone could hate you anymore, you big softie.” you teased him, holding open your arm when your oldest daughter came out to join you two on the hammock.
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masterlist — reminder that asks / requests are open!!
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elizabethemerald · 2 years ago
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Don't Sneak up on People with Swords
@im-totally-not-an-alien-2 made a prompt about Danny sneaking up on Jason Todd and @sky00asara made a comment in the tags about what would happen if Danny did that to Talia. So here is my version of that! Enjoy.
Talia al Ghul watched her beloved from afar. He was out, again patrolling his city for those he considered wrong doers. Her son was by his side. She scowled at how Damian’s fighting style had changed, softened in the company of her beloved. Despite her love for the man under the cowl, he had a tremendous ability to take even the most ruthless of killers and change them to spare the undeserving. He had even tried it with her. 
She was hidden on the roof of an abandoned tower nearby. The tower had succumbed to fire and was now condemned until the city got around to destroying it properly. For now it made the perfect place for her to observe her beloved and her son work undisturbed. 
“Excuse me?” 
Talia whirled, drawing her blade as she spun. Her blade moved fast enough to almost cut the air itself yet the small shape ducked under her stroke and back-pedaled quickly to move out her range. 
“Jeez! Why is everyone in this city so jumpy!” 
The voice more than anything made her realize that the person who had somehow snuck close enough was an actual child. Their black hair and blue eyes made her wonder if this was another of her beloved’s adoptees. Except surely this boy was too young to catch Bruce’s eye? 
“Well maybe you should not sneak up on people?” Talia hissed, her voice soft yet stern. To say nothing of how a child who couldn’t be older than five had snuck up on her at all. 
“Well maybe you shouldn’t brood on the roof of my home!” The child snarked back, just like one of the Bat’s brood would, completely unafraid of the blade still in her hand. Talia raised an eyebrow at him then looked around at the burnt skeleton of the building they were standing on. 
“This building is not fit for human occupation.”
“Neither was the last place I lived.” He said dismissively. “This place hasn’t even killed me yet, so it’s practically a paradise.” 
She was tempted to take the child’s words as sarcasm, yet something in the way he spoke made her think he meant it more truthfully. 
“You’ve died before?” Talia asked. She relaxed her hold on her blade, allowing it to rest at her side. 
“Oh yeah, I die all the time.” He said, then he looked at her curiously tilting his head first one way, then another. “You’ve died too, huh?” 
She nodded, now examining him closely, looking for the signs she would recognize. She could see the hint of a scar on the boy’s palm that might have caused a death. 
“What is it with this town that so many people have died and come back?” The boy asked, apparently rhetorically as he didn’t let her answer. “First the stabby Robin, then the stabby Batgirl, then Batman, and even Red Hood. It’s like everyone I run into is contaminated.” 
Talia’s eyes widened. 
“You can sense those who have utilized the Lazarus Pits?” She would have to inform her father about this child. He could put the entire League of Assassins at risk. The child before her just shrugged. 
“I have no idea what that is. Red Hood mentioned some kind of pit as well, but I’ve never seen anything like that. I just know y’all are contaminated with ectoplasm, though not enough to make a core.” 
“What is this… ectoplasm?” Another name for the Lazarus Waters? Had there perhaps been a Pit outside of League control? In the midwest somewhere based on the boy’s accent. 
“Oh it’s this stuff.” He held his hand out and Talia couldn’t help keep her expression of shock withdrawn despite all her training as his hand filled with the glowing green light of the Pits. He held the Pit Water in his hand then tossed the glowing orb to his other hand in a half juggle as if he weren’t carrying the League's greatest secret and weapon. 
Nevermind telling her father about this child, he could never learn of him. If Ras had the power this child had under his control the world would never survive. There was only one option. She needed to train this child to wield this strength. With the stealth he displayed in sneaking up on her and his power over the Pits themselves he could make an assassin like the world had never seen. He could be the next Head of the Demon under her guidance. She knelt down to the boy’s level, slipping her sword back away as she did so. 
“Tell me, young one. Are you living in this death trap of a building all by yourself?” 
“Yeah, but don’t worry, I’ve got it taken care of. I know I’m little, but that just means people are less likely to notice me. I’m able to steal all the food I need from that big box store down the street.” 
“Oh of that I have no doubt. My name is Talia al Ghul. What’s yours?” 
“Hmm. I’m Danny.” The boy seemed hesitant to trust her, which to be perfectly honest was probably a very smart thing to do, but at least she had a name for this gift of Lazarus. 
“Danny, how would you like to come live with me? You won’t have to steal any more, or worry about food ever again, and I could train you how to fight even better than the Bats.” 
He narrowed his eyes at her, looking her over closely. 
“Would I get a sword?” 
“If a sword is what you want, then once you were trained in its use I would acquire one for you.”
Danny looked like he was about to nod, but then he froze, his head tilting to the side as if he was listening to something. His eyes widened and Talia tensed. 
“Uh-oh. Fruit Loop incoming. I gotta go.” 
Talia half turned as she heard the sound of one of her beloved’s grappling lines catching on the building’s edge. By the time she had turned back to face him, Danny had completely vanished. She hadn’t even heard him leave. She stood and scowled as her beloved landed on the rooftop next to her. 
“Talia.” He grunted at her, glaring all the while. 
“Beloved. Must you ruin every nice thing in my life?” Talia snarled back. The boy, Danny, had the gift of Lazarus at his beck and call and Batman had scared him off. 
Bruce looked momentarily stunned at her fury, but quickly hid it behind his mask. However Talia couldn’t care less about her beloved right now. She just needed to lose him so she could return to find the boy. The boy who would change the world with his power. 
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vivalafxxku · 2 months ago
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Scruffing of the Robins + others
i wholeheartedly believe that Bruce is devastated when he can no longer or never got to scruff his kids. Not only is it because his kids have matured to the point that they no longer impulsively jump into shit and need to be physically pulled back, it's because they grew.
He nearly cries when he tried to scruff Dick (his Robin may have gotten better impulsive control, but he was still a little shit) and his son only rises to his toes rather than the air. A whole new wave of tears when Dick (while he didn't grow much taller) changes to his more streamlined Nightwing suit so there's nothing to scruff without accidentally hurting him. Dick would catch his look of discontent and laugh, saying that this was exactly why his suit was designed the way it is.
Then there's Jason. Jason who was always pretty small (street kid woes), so even at 15, Bruce can comfortably scruff him. And most of the time, Jason goads him into scruffing him 'cause it's fun. But then he died and when he came back, his son nearly towers over Bruce and weighs just as much and won't let Bruce within 6ft of him without risking a bullet to the shoulder.
Oh but he tries, out of instinct or maybe nostalgia? A whimsical wish for the past, for a different reality? Though it's not much of a scruff and more of a yank to the brown leather jacket collar that earns him a snarl on a good day and physical harm on a bad one.
Tim doesn't get scruffed much and Bruce regrets it in hindsight. But back then, he was drowning in grief and Tim didn't need much scruffing, the Robin was metaphorically scruffing him than the other way around.
By the time Bruce gets around to scruffing Tim, it's a rare occurrence. Tim has all the discipline in the world when in his company despite what his brothers and team say, mind carefully calculating move after move, from travelling the world (something Tim refuses to elaborate other than a splenectomy that Bruce had to dig to find out) during his little stint in the time stream. But when he does, it's a Dick situation all over again where he just rises to his toes.
Cassandra was much too elusive and disciplined to be scruffed (not to mention, too tall). His daughter, however, does find amusement in the impulse and allows Bruce to scruff her, pulling her knees inwards to have the full experience of being airborne. But it's not the same. It's a different kind of fond; it doesn't have the protectiveness laced in the action. There's no exasperation, no "hold on a minute, let's think about it."
Barbara, Stephanie and Duke were too tall when Bruce took them in. And unlike Cass, they don't indulge him either. The existence of Batgirl hinged on the fact that she listens to Batman and Bruce had his hands full with Dick and Jason. Stephanie teases him, rubbing in the fact that she's not actually his kid; therefore, doesn't have to right to scruff her. And Duke is much too awkward, too new, to know if he should.
Then, there's Damian.
His little boy that flinched the first time Bruce reached out to scruff him. Bruce was still working on getting Damian comfortable around him, to show that he would never lay a hand on him. Then he was lost in time. He considered himself lucky that Dick took up more than being Batman. He came back and all he needed to do was figure out his and Damian's dynamic as father and son. (Turns out, Dick made a habit of scruffing Damian. "Won't lie to you, B. It's pretty effective.")
It's only a matter of time before when Damian outgrows being scruffed. Bruce already missed 10 years with his boy on top of being lost in time and puberty is going to hit him like a truck in a few years if he is anything like Bruce.
But for now, he enjoys his little Robin's protests and huffiness when he tries to jump into the fray prematurely while his family listens in amusement through the comms.
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heybatterbats · 6 months ago
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I’ve been seeing entirely too many posts about how ace-spec people aren’t really LGBTQ+ and don’t belong at Pride. And I got mad about it. So…*aces your Batfamily*
Yes, all of them. Every last one is now ace-spec in some way. They even named their dog Ace.
Bruce is sex-neutral biromantic demisexual, and came out by accident at age 24 to a random reporter who was not expecting it. This sparked a social media storm that was only halted by the much bigger social media storm of Bruce adopting Dick.
The Batman has been asked his sexuality before. Bruce replied- perfectly straight faced- that the Batman is an asexually reproductive entity and creates its Robins via mitosis. A third of Gotham, most of Metropolis, and several members of the Justice League still believe this.
Dick is sex-repulsed biromantic asexual, and is of the type to make the dirtiest jokes you’ve ever heard because sex is a joke to him. Came out in the form of an acrobatics performance he did at a pride parade, wearing a terrible Batman costume with a bi heart as the Batsymbol, an ace flag cape, and no pants. The audience was ecstatic. Bruce was mortified.
Nightwing has never said his sexuality, but anyone who claims he’s straight is quickly met with pictures of the Discowing suit and up to a dozen laughing emojis.
Jason is sex-repulsed aromantic asexual. He’s not as vocal about it as Dick is, but he does like it to be known. He’s the type to make garlic bread/cake/world domination jokes. And ESPECIALLY dragon jokes. He kinda tends to just insert it casually into conversation, he didn’t do anything crazy to come out. It’s just a fact about him.
Red Hood claims to be sexually attracted exclusively to guns. Bruce hates this joke.
Tim is the opposite of Bruce- he’s sex-positive bisexual demiromantic. One of the few Batkids to come out while in costume- he got a concussion on a case and blearily mumbled into Bruce’s hair that he’s “you but backwards” and completely confused Bruce. Tim is a little shy about his identity, but since dating Bernard he’s been more open about it.
Red Robin is out as bisexual, but hasn’t added demiromantic to that. Tim is worried people will piece his secret identity together, since Tim doesn’t realize that most normal people are not highly skilled detectives who can tell a person’s identity from a single acrobatics move.
At the moment, Damian just thinks he’s feeling the normal “ew cooties” that most children do. In the future he’ll realize that he’s sex-repulsed ace/aro, although he’ll refuse to use those terms in favor of broodily muttering “this bloodline dies with me.” Ra’s has an actual heart attack the first time Damian says this to his face and has to go into the Lazarus Pit to recover. Talia has never been more proud.
Barbara is sex-neutral, demiromantic and asexual. She’s more outspoken about it than most of the family, and runs social media pages about disability and the asexuality spectrum alike. Aphobes and ableists that make the mistake of leaving comments often mysteriously find that their most embarrassing search histories have been sent to their grandmother.
Cass is sex-repulsed ace/aro. Steph was the one to explain sexuality to her, and also made her an ace ring. Cass told Bruce first, then the rest of the family. She’s never come out publicly- Cass doesn’t like media attention being on her- but some sharp-eyed Gothamites who are looking can spot the black ring on Cassandra Cain-Wayne’s middle finger in a few paparazzi shots the papers got their hands on. (I have a fic about this!)
Black Bat has never been asked her sexuality, mainly because she’s absolutely terrifying and nobody can stammer out the words when faced with her.
Stephanie is sex-positive graysexual grayromantic, and absolutely not shy about it. She’s almost as good as Dick at making horrible, filthy jokes. Has punched a guy in the face for aphobia, does not regret it. Stephanie is out and proud and loud about it.
Spoiler/Batgirl III have both been seen wearing a rainbow flag as a cape too many times for anyone to assume they’re straight.
Duke is sex-neutral demisexual/demiromantic, and is probably the most open about it of the whole Batfamily. He’s fully out and so is Signal, and will inevitably show up at any daytime Pride event just to say hi. Gotham adores him, and he’s practically the ace-spec community’s mascot. Can and will use the entire rainbow spectrum of light to create various pride flags over Gotham whenever he feels like it, and has started taking flag/location requests. Once turned the Batsignal gay.
Harper is sex-positive bisexual aromantic, and where Stephanie is loud about it, Harper gets violent. She carries a souped-up taser and doesn’t hesitate to use it. Has knocked at least four homophobes/aphobes out cold not counting the ones she beat up in the Narrows. Bluebird is not only publicly out as bisexual but wears two out of three bisexual colors, and while it’s not come up publicly yet, she won’t hide that she’s aromantic either. Along with Signal and Spoiler, Bluebird is one of the vigilantes that’s known for being specifically good at handling LGBTQ+ issues. She wouldn’t have it any other way.
After being forcibly outed as gay and then bullied for it, Cullen is still in the closet about the fact that he’s asexual and sex-repulsed, too. The first person he told after Harper was Alfred. By now the whole family knows, but they’ve been careful to keep it away from the media until Cullen’s ready to come out himself.
Alfred is sex-neutral, aromantic, and pansexual, though he’s older than some of those terms and doesn’t often use them to describe himself. Bruce didn’t know Alfred was anything but straight until he was almost seventeen, to which Alfred replied- signature eyebrow raise at full height capacity- that he had a career in the theater, Master Bruce, and no one who does that can possibly be typical in matters of orientation or any other aspect of life.
The outfit might seem antithetical to this, but Selina is ace too! Specifically, she’s sex-positive, heteroromantic and demisexual. The leather outfit is primarily for distraction purposes rather than true sex appeal. When it comes to Bruce, however, Selina’s more than once described herself as “morosexual.” Bruce, bless him, still has no idea what that means.
There ya go. Ace-spec Batfam. Happy Pride to everyone but especially all you fellow ace-spec folks who absolutely, 100% belong there.
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roseworth · 5 months ago
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what direction do you think they should have gone in with jason? as in where should he be now in terms of people and what he's doing
i think winick had it exactly right green arrow #69-72 and batman & robin #23-25. he was a villain but he had a Method and a Purpose. and usually that purpose was just to fuck with batman. i loooove it when hes a villain and hes very clearly doing bad things, but hes not just indiscriminately killing people. hes doing it for a reason, hes still doing the same thing he was doing in utrh by controlling the drug trade, and even when hes doing the right thing hes being an asshole about it
i especially love the ga issues because jason doesnt even talk to batman but bruce KNOWS what hes doing and he knows its about him. i love the bruce & jason post-utrh dynamic where they've both pretty much said everything they have to say and neither of them is changing their position, so now jason is just starting fires to get attention. "ok bruce you dont want to talk to me? thats fine. ill just follow you to star city then psychologically torture a teenage girl then blow her up in front of you" icon! i forgive him! i think its so fun when red hood is a member of batman's rogues gallery and bruce feels bad every time he fights him but also he kinda cant stand him since he knows jason is only doing it to mess with him and its working. but also jason is a Greater Good person so he DOES end up working with the bats sometimes just because theyre also working on the good side
anyways the ideal bruce & jason dynamic to me is "the love was there and it made everything so much worse" because jason is doing everything for bruces attention because he loves him and wants him to care about him but hes not willing to budge on his own morals and neither is bruce. and bruce loves jason so he doesnt want to arrest him or put him in danger but also hes killing people and doing terrible things and bruce is batman so he feels obligated to. yk. stop him. and as much as they both love each other they do not like each other at all
in my mind jason doesnt really care about any of the other bats besides dick & babs just because he knew them before he died so hes willing to hang out with them but they Do Not want to see him. like in brothers in blood when jason goes hiiiii dick <3 lets hang out <3333 and dick is constantly suppressing the cain instinct. he never really talks to babs pre52 i think theyre interactions would be very similar in that jason goes hey babs ur so cool <33 and she says jason get the fuck away from me or im activating the bomb in your helmet <3
but also with steph even though he didnt know her pre-death,, i think he would like her. i can imagine him doing something very similar to what he did with mia, basically finding her and going "quit your vigilante career. join my emo band" but i think she would end up being a lot more receptive to it than mia was ! like im thinking batgirl 2009 era steph so she would not be on board with the idea of joining him since things were going well with team batgirl, but i also think that any interaction between the two of them in that era would go well and end with them getting along :)
as for everyone else. i dont think he would care about any of them. theyre just kinda collateral damage in his war with bruce. like he gets involved with them sometimes just because of their proximity to bruce, or like i said earlier that he works with them sometimes because he cares about the greater good so is willing to help them when necessary. also honorable mention to aoifa's headcanon that jason doesnt actually know tims name because he just does not care. thats canon to me
so yeah in conclusion: he should be a morally grey villain that does what he does either for the greater good, or to fuck with batman, or both. and he has complicated relationships with all of them bc he likes bruce dick and babs but also kinda hates all of them and they like but also hate him too. and the rest of them he doesn't really give a shit about
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theloneotaku158 · 8 months ago
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As of Batman: The Brave and the Bold #12, local precious-gremlin-who-I-would-die-for, Maps Mizoguchi, is now officially(?) the sixth Robin. Or at the very least, she's now "in" on The Secret™.
If this isn’t a set up for her taking up the Robin mantle officially then I genuinely don’t know what is.
As one of the twelve Gotham Academy enjoyers in existence, I am having the extremely normal reaction of "FUCKING FINALLY! LET'S FUCKING GOOOOO--!"
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In all honesty, I'd be lying if I said I hadn't seen this coming from miles away. Like, Maps has appeared in a number of seemingly random cameo roles recently, including Batgirls (2021), and even technically as Robin in the backup issues of Batman (2016) #119-121, and in a short story in Batman Black & White. And most of those got collected in a standalone titled "Maps of Mystery", which specifically gathered all her appearances as Robin (and the Gotham Academy Belle Reve story).
And then, of course, her recent time-travelling Future-Trunks-esque appearance in Birds of Prey (2023), as the tech-based Meridian, from a potential future timeline where she apparently makes it as a superhero using gadgets she apparently designed, proving that she's hero material.
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That's not something you do for a character for no reason. That's the sort of thing you do when you want to keep a character in the conscience of your readers for whatever reason, because you have bigger plans for them.
Also interesting to consider that, in the "Mother's Day" story where this took place, Alfred is standing right there and not lying down six feet under wood, dirt and a stone slab, and that Bruce is in the old Batcave under the manor so he still has Money™. So we must assume this was some nebulous time in the past (after GA: Second Semester(?), but before City of Bane)... which I won't bother to analyse the exact timeframe of because DC doesn't care about the post-Flashpoint / New 52 / Rebirth / Prime Earth / idfk / Dawn of DC timeline, so neither should I.
But I think it's really funny that this presumably means Maps has known The Secret™ for a long time relative to present-day comics, but always acted like she didn't.
But if all her appearances are in chronological order, that means Bruce is only the fourth Bat whose identity she discovered.
Like, she discovered Cass' identity almost by accident on a trip to the zoo, Damian showed off his grapple gun and gave her an actual Batarang during the three hours he was enrolled in the school (as if she wouldn't immediately put two-and-two together even back then), and she even found out Terry fucking McGuinness would become Batman in a future via a time-travelling grandfather clock.
No I did not make that last part up. Read Gotham Academy istg.
Did Cass know that Maps had been acting as a Robin when she met her, both at the zoo in Batgirls and her future version in Birds of Prey?
Does Damian know the one (1) friend(?) he made in Gotham Academy is potentially in the running for his job?
Is Bruce himself aware that she knows as much about their identities as she currently does?
How is DC going to retcon this so it all makes sense in the barely-functioning canon of the modern DC universe?
I'm digressing. Where was I going with this?
Point is, she's destined to become a Robin, and I'm glad DC finally pulled their fingers out their asses and capitalised on that destiny.
Let's just hope it doesn't take another year for them to follow up on this plotline again.
Bonus: Jason Todd, after learning of Bruce taking yet another happy kid under his wing as yet another Robin, giving her some advice:
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suzukiblu · 7 months ago
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Ko-fi thank-you sentences for Derpsheep; a fake cryptid and a real romantic. (( chrono || non-chrono ))
“Oh! Are you not the kind of bird who makes the nest? Because I can totally make a nest, I can definitely do that!” its new Robin blurts eagerly, straightening up in the air and brightening in excitement. 
Dick cackles, and Tim makes a strangled noise and vanishes completely inside Robin’s wings. 
“Um . . . is that not . . .?” Its new Robin trails off, looking embarrassed. The Batman is . . . puzzled. It really never has had a Robin that nested before. They’re all different, obviously, but–
Oh, it realizes, and tilts its head. Perhaps this actually isn’t a new Robin. Perhaps this is something . . . else. 
Something–new, in a sense. 
There was Batgirl and the Spoiler, but this is more . . . Starfire, maybe. More like her. Something different, that isn’t from Gotham. Isn’t of it. Something new and shiny like a just-made, just-cut diamond with no history to it. 
The Batman prefers history. Prefers old and lovely things; the long, long line of preservation and protection. The cherished, and the stories that are cherished most of all. The history of a bloodline, of a name, and the loving fear of the dark, and the flip of a decades-old coin against the shine of a centuries-old jewel, and above all, the concept of justice.
But the Batman is also a thing of change, a thing that wants to keep moving, and a thing that wasn’t there, once, but will be from now on. A thing that wants to help bring something better. 
It wants better for Gotham. 
And Superman is something bright and constant in the world, and wants better for it. So then . . . Superboy is . . . not a Robin, but . . . 
Something new and shiny and just-made, and made of a dreaming for that “better”, when the Batman looks at him the right way. 
Something that came looking for its Robin with a diamond made just for him, and caught Nightwing without a moment’s hesitation when he asked, and wants to build its Robin a nest. 
Hm. 
Selina brings it diamonds, sometimes, wrapped around Cat-claws and a slick smile. But she never stays to nest. 
But not-its-new-Robin still tastes just a bit like Cat. 
. . . hm. 
kitten, the Batman decides after a long moment, and then pats the kitten’s curly fur with the trailing edge of its cape. It leaves the rest of it strung in a net, though, because Cats shouldn't be able to fly at all. 
Not that it's telling the kitten that, because then he might realize he can't and fall. 
“Uh–what?” The kitten blinks at him, though he leans into the petting just the slightest bit, feeling like a neglected alleycat that's just feral enough not to know what to do about being touched. Dick falls over laughing–though he doesn’t actually fall; not any farther than the ledge–and Nightwing’s discordant cackle echoes across the rooftops. 
“Oh my god,” Tim mutters under his breath, and sounds very “teenage” even in Robin’s voice. 
The Batman has learned about teenagers. 
kitten, it repeats with one last patient scratch behind the kitten’s ears, then draws its cape back. Strays don’t get used to being petted so quickly. 
The kitten . . . blinks, once or twice, his eyes very large and pupils dilated far past normal human proportions behind the flat opaque surface of his glasses. 
It does look very Cat-like, in the dark. 
The Batman hums its approval and pats Tim’s shoulder where Robin’s feathers drape and cover, and then turns to leave. 
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puppetmaster13u · 8 months ago
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For any of your cryptid batfam AUs. We know Batman thinks criminals are superstitious and cowardly. So how superstitious should most Gothamites be? What are some of the superstitions and things they do because of that? And what random BS do the Bat kids do to actively encourage the superstitions because they think it’s funny?
Vibrates in headcanons.
Okay, so, this is less just the criminals of Gotham- a lot of goons are just trying to put food on the table after all- and more of, Gothamites in general. Like they have good reason to be superstitious.
Like everyone already knows about the Court of Owls, if nothing else then from the Rhyme they use to get children to behave. But Gotham? Is Weird with a capital W even in canon. There are literal streets that disappear and only reappear on certain days, areas where on specific days gravity just doesn't work right, several portals to hell have been opened just in Arkham alone, and there's enough curses and cults to smother any other place.
Funnily enough I am actually currently working on a story that focuses a bit more on the superstitions of Gotham lol. Like a lot of this stuff? Not shit you're going to see in the more tourist-esque spots, but those are death traps already.
Now a lot of the habits and myths of Gotham start out as a thing about Survival. It started less with things about the Bats and more about the Rogues and how to survive.
Tiny plant boxes meticulously cared for, after one noticed how plants react when Ivy is around. They line the windows of almost every home despite the smog, and some even pray through them for their Mother to not attack today.
Small scarecrow dolls, made of grass balls and cloth hang from overhangs on roofs with rope like a hangman, a charm in hopes that the one walking the streets will leave them alone. It ends with some claiming that if you rip the head from the body of cloth, the Scarecrow will come for you.
Small candles and lanterns begin to appear on the windowsills of children, their own homemade batsignals. Some say if you're very good, gifts will appear beside it, while others claim that if you're very bad, the Signal will appear and take you away.
Tiny shrines appear on rooftops over the years, meticulously carved statuettes within. It started with one for the Second Robin, and some whisper about how the Red Hood emerged from it, was reborn through their prayers and gifts. Now there are more, offerings ranging from snacks to child's drawings to figures of clay. No one dares take things from it, the last time someone tried... well, let's just say it didn't end well.
The thing is? The Bats don't even have to do much to encourage this, and don't usually even do it on purpose.
Everyone knows what happened to the ones who tried to be a vigilante. They know of the first Batgirl, humanity slowly dripped away the longer she huddled in the Bat's shadow until she was twisting around just like it. Any child who had been making their own costumes, their parents burned it that night, terrified that the Bat would take their children to be its own next. The small child, everyone knew about him, a wee little thing with a camera clutched against his chest. They all saw him run after the Bats despite the protests, saw him run towards the Bat as bodies crumbled before it. They saw him grab its arm with such tiny hands, and the Bat, grieving, stopped. They all saw the Bat whisk him away, and once more whispered to their children to never follow the Bats into the shadows. They know of the girl cloaked in amethyst cloth, who chased after them despite the warnings and pleadings of others. She disappeared, and the faceless thing of chittering laughs that raced the Robin that appeared in her stead... Everyone knows what happens to those who offer themselves to the Bats, knowingly or not.
Robin can mimic voices, their own childish giggles and clicks echoing across the stone slipping into another's words. What is merely a game to them is horrific for anyone wandering the streets in the dark of the night. Some say that it can steal your voice permanently if it so wished.
Everyone in Gotham knows that the Bats aren't human. Oh they might mimic and pretend to be as such, or even had been at some point, but they're confident they aren't. Even if they put on an act outside of Gotham, corpse-like skin gaining hints of color like blood is actually rushing through veins, everyone knows that's what it is. An act.
The Bats themselves? Well, it keeps their civilian identity safe- and the shrines have helped them get children out of bad home lives and to safety, so they're not going to just... not encourage it.
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puppetwoman17 · 8 months ago
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Would you ever expand upon your joker junior thoughts more? I think that was such a well written idea and would love to hear what else you think about it
Oh my god yes. 100000% YES!
That post before was more of an idea vomit, didn’t cover all of what I thought, so I’m happy to hear someone wants to hear more.
So, JJ’s always been a tough convo for Tim. Obviously. But it’s not just because of how traumatizing the Joker can be, or about the shocks and psychological torture. It also reminds him of a grim time in his life. With Bruce still going through the motions post-Jason’s death, and Dick frequently spending all his time in Bludhaven, he hadn’t been watched much. Save for Babs, ofc.
That’s actually why they’re so close. She’s much more emotionally competent thanks to her dad, lol.
JJ wasn’t only a big thing for Tim, but for Gotham too. In a place like this, it wasn’t hard for whispers from the Joker’s men to travel to civilians and cops. Everyone knew why Robin was nowhere to be seen. Everyone knew why Batgirl looked the way she did, agitated and worried. Everyone knew why the cops searched that same warehouse over and over, never allowing anyone inside.
Which was also why no one was happy to see Nightwing, very obviously the first Robin, return after yet another sabbatical in Bludhaven. Of course, that stopped a little after everyone collectively realized that, oh crap, he doesn’t even know!
This begins a collective effort by the more clear-minded people of Gotham to NOT disclose anything JJ related. There has to be a reason, right? No way were they going to force Robin #3 to disclose anything he didn’t wait to. It didn’t hurt that a year or two later, a mysterious figure named Oracle began effectively making every news article or picture related to JJ disappear.
Everyone holds their breaths for the next few months. What if what happened to the second Robin happened to him? What if he was too crippled to go back out?
As the Batfamily grows bigger, it becomes way clearer that Robin #3 hasn’t said a WORD. Not even after they grow closer, when the screaming and murder attempts and arguments cease. He doesn’t say a word, so no one else does either.
Tim goes to great lengths to medicate himself against any variant of Joker venom or gas. The familiar smells just… bring things back to the surface.
He tries not to act like Jason whenever the Joker gets out of Arkham. It’s already hard for everyone to hold him back from killing the monster. Jason doesn’t need some second-rate copy of his trauma trying to get sympathy. Unlike Jason, he didn’t die. He didn’t come back differently, or lose footing on his life, his job, whatever.
It would just be better if Tim acted as aloof and concentrated as he always did. Not make a big scene, and follow Batman’s orders to a T. No need to worry anyone.
Honestly, the only reason no one notices the literal war going on in this boy’s head is because he doesn’t want to cause a scene.
Oh, and if you’re wondering what he says when one of the bats finds him the next night, still avoiding them…
Yeah, he full on denies EVERYTHING. Looks whoever it is, Jason, Steph, Dick, straight in the eye and says that what they saw was fake. Edited. Something to threaten Bruce with years ago. Tim just ran because…because…Anyway, he’s fine. Don’t worry about Tim Drake. He’s fine.
Babs groans over the comms when everyone hounds on her to tell them everything. Like hell is she gonna tell them a single thing until she has Tim’s full permission.
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aingeal98 · 22 days ago
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thinking of the differences in cass and bruce regarding their no-kill rules, and how cass’ rule is better in regards to the batman persona and what it stands for. death and bruce have an awful relationship, to say the least. he has gained nothing from death and murder, in fact it affects him so much that all he can do with death is just sit in its presence forever, without ever working through it (he literally refers to death as ‘a curse constantly hanging over him’ i mean that is not the most accepting mindset). with cass though? she can actively process death and even accept that it has happened. she isn’t like bruce, because she uses others dying to make her intense love and empathy stronger, while bruce just uses it to fuel anger and an onslaught of repressed negative emotions (which we all know can only last you so long before your whole body just gives out). i mean, the second bruces parents died, he separated the concept of murder from his life, (even though that is literally impossible, minhkhoa, ra’s, talia, selina, and basically anyone who has been in a meaningful relationship with bruce has pointed this out. i mean even a ghost martha wayne has told bruce there’s no avoiding death, only going through it). however, with cass? she literally was a murderer. one of the many reasons cass vows to never kill is because she actively sees herself in murderers, and thinks they all have the capacity to be redeemed, while bruce barely has an idea how to even process murder, let alone accept it or the people who do it (thinking of how he straight up denied that cass killed anyone, or was even capable of doing it, even with video evidence shown right in front of him, and im not even gonna get into the whole jason todd thing). cassandra could be a better batman simply because she can look death (specifically murders and murderers) dead in the eye and accept it, something that bruce cant even do. basically what im getting at is that, ironically, cass’ backstory of her being a murderer allows her to use the batman persona to its full unfiltered potential, something that even bruce is aware of. anyways here’s my cass should take up the batman mantle propaganda!!
I'm chewing on this like it's a five course meal thank you so much for this analysis there's so much to go through.
You're so right about their different mentalities like Bruce was ultimately a victim and his drive comes from both never wanting anyone else to suffer like that but also never wanting to be a victim again himself. And if does mean that his various complexes around death and crime can sometimes be very harmful to people he should be trying to save! Batman is a symbol and an ideal and no one, not even Bruce can truly live up to it.
Meanwhile Cass views herself as the perpetrator, the responsible party instead of a fellow victim tricked into killing a man. And her projection while again not in anyway perfect is definitely better for those around her than Bruce's because it's full of empathy and a belief for change. The heartbreaking part is that she's no less fucked up over the concept of death imo, she just directs it all inwards. Every life lost is a tragedy that Bruce and Cass both carry on their shoulders. The difference is Bruce views anyone who takes a life as having sacrificed a part of themselves they can ever get back, of ruining their life regardless of circumstances. And we really do get to see frequently in comics how that standard ends up harming innocents even as he tries to do good. Meanwhile Cass... Does actually hold quite similar views but she also stubbornly refuses to believe it's true for anyone else just because she cannot escape it being her own personal truth. They killed but they can change. They killed but they can turn their life around. They felt bad for a second there, I saw them. I'm going to help them because of that.
Part of it definitely comes down to the thematic cohesiveness of Cass's Batgirl run compared to Bruce's... Everything. But ultimately yeah Cass best Batman for multiple reasons and you can fight me on this.
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