#both these queer men looked at this character

[nqueso-emergency]

In response to this anon: "Fetishisation … as opposed to BT shippers who did literally that the second Buck came out and entered a relationship with Tommy. Instead of looking at the relationship the way the writers/creators intended it to be, BT shippers looked at it through the ‘two hot white guys’ lens and refused to see anything else."

BT fans have been accused of this for 10 months. I have a dozen screenshots of Buddie fans responding to every single twitter comment I made with "fetishizer." Yet for those 10 months, BT fans, INCLUDING ACTUAL GAY MEN, have tried to explain why we're so invested in this ship and that it really does have to do with a lot more than wanting two dudes to kiss.

The thing is, BoB's ignore those pleas, every single time. Or you mock them. Then you come back, for the 1000th time, with the same goddamn accusation. Meanwhile gay male BT fans continue to be called f**s, are sent photos of burning pride flags, are told they're a betrayal to queer culture for the sin of shipping someone different than them, etc., etc., etc. It's horrific.

But don't take my word for it. Here's a nice stroll down memory lane of just a few of the countless times BT fans have explained why they care so much about the character of Tommy, and are so invested in the relationship.

https://www.tumblr.com/mattdoestevan/756740520651489281/my-two-cents-on-the-whole-queer-women-projecting?source=share

https://www.tumblr.com/bucks-beast/752097399447699456/its-been-super-disheartening-and-angering-these?source=share

https://www.tumblr.com/nqueso-emergency/774947518720212992/for-a-fandom-so-obsessed-with-an-adult-mlm?source=share

https://www.tumblr.com/saintnoname2/751619199843139584/blech-when-bobs-go-after-actual-queer-men-for?source=share

https://www.tumblr.com/nqueso-emergency/774480853888811008/were-you-a-gay-man-decades-before-prep-came-on-the?source=share

https://www.tumblr.com/bucksboobs/751954725168201728/i-know-i-know-yall-are-desperate-to-find-any?source=share

https://www.tumblr.com/usercelestial/752120141831192576/real-gay-men-in-real-life-buck-and-tommy-both?source=share

That's like...the tip of the iceberg. So fuck everyone who makes broad sweeping generalizations about BT fans while simultaneously ignoring that we've spent the last 10 months trying to get BoB's to actually listen to us.

p.s. don't forget this video, which Tim reposted, about why Buck and Tommy's story is actually deeply romantic given the red string of fate theory (https://youtu.be/OMx6gcF6OAQ). Yet another reason people latched onto this relationship so quickly that has, guess what, zero to do with fetishization.

This! Adding the video because I love watching it.

[thefandomexpert]

skipping the ‘women are not a monolith’ bc that’s in another comment. all opinions herein are my own, i’m not prefacing each statement with that so if I say something you personally disagree with it’s not a problem these are just my Onions

first, this seemed very surface level. they’re missing a few big name primarchs for both columns which is baffling.

khan, gman, and vulkan are all standard, loyal, manly men ™️ who also happen to be textually ‘nice’ to mortals/are generally seen as well-adjusted individuals.

This poster has missed the fact that, as far as my corner of the internet is concerned:

1) khan has very little lore compared to his brothers. even if he’s cool he’s not Plot Relevant. there’s no character arc with him? he’s cool. that’s literally it. and i love him for being cool but there’s nothing for me to play with there

2) gman is the most basic white bread unless you like him in which case he’s a sleep-deprived ‘i didn’t ask for this’ ceo dilf scrambling for any sense of security who makes bad decisions in part because he’s sleep deprived and scrambling. i am willing to bet the latter characterization was not really considered when making this post, considering this poster doesn’t think he’s simped over (untrue)

3) vulkan, like khan, also suffers from having brothers that are more plot relevant, though he has more of a character arc (or he could if they brought him back). However, he also suffers from The Fandom Racism Problem. but we don’t need to get into that rn.

42k!Guilliman aside, there’s nothing interesting to be had there narratively, and the other two haven’t been lore relevant since the heresy, unless you want to count tts’ revival of vulkan.

guys i’m surprised are not on this list: corvus really should be up here considering his temperament, and sang?? and FULGRIM???? that says a lot about where the poster is coming from. like fulgrim is for the queers so i get missing out on him if u don’t get him but you didn’t think we’d like sang???? textually prettiest primarch????? the only reason i can think he’s skipped is because he is simped for and therefor is not a surprise

meanwhile,

1) angron is The Single Most Tragic Primarch of the lot, his inevitable clash with the imperium is very good for getting to the core of the Imperial Problem, and he’s a sympathetic and relatable character. i, too, would want to rip my dad apart if he didn’t take the painful metal contraption that made me fuckass mad out of my head even if he could, and made me leave my friends to die to boot. is clearly trying to do right but is forced to do otherwise in a way that’s far more poignant than guilliman or lion making a nasty genocidal decision ‘for the greater good.’ can be either a True Tragic Figure or a beast for a beauty candidate. if you wanted to fix-it one primarch and fix the whole plot by extension, the answer would not be hugging horus or letting gman take a nap: it would be handling The Angron Problem because he is the biggest most obvious example of the imperium Not Working the way it’s being sold. he’s fucking compelling. and he has the biggest rack aight look.

2) corvus is fandom bait full stop. wet cat of a guy who turns into a crow demon and bothers one of the more annoying traitors forever and ever. guilty about his tragic mutated kids. guilty about a lot of stuff actually. again, sad wet cat. and while he’s not plot relevant post dropsite, he’s still textually around and open for a dramatic return. and i mean. look at shrike. tell me they didn’t expect the hot topic kids to be rg players. go on. the only way they could have made him more baity is to put clip-ons in his hair and dress him up in plaid skirts and fishnet gloves. rawr means ily in dinosaur, i made u a cookie but i eated it ass primarch.

3) kurze is again equal parts tragic and potential beast to tame from a fandom perspective. he’s got a cool gimmick with the future sight and who hasn’t wanted to skin a few oligarchs you know? he’s surprisingly witty and he’s got that tall dark and triangle look the tumblr girlies tend to like. there’s a canon example of him keeping a human alive as a pet for multiple years even. you can make this work, easy.

i get the sense some people question why people would like the traitor primarchs, as if telling emps to fuck off and die isn’t the hottest thing a guy can do in this setting (again: one of the major reasons 42k!gman has any appeal is his disillusionment with his father and his genuine struggle to understand why imperialism isnt working out. you’ll get it eventually buddy). they all maim and kill people so that’s also just. way less of a factor than you’d expect, except if they do it in particularly clever or charming ways, which the standard Manly Men primarchs do not, and also we like villains here, sir.

guys i’m surprised are not on this list: mortarion lmao. he’s just as bad if not worse than curze from an appearance standpoint and he’s not a nice guy, neither is he a big scary aggressive protector/hunter/etc dynamic candidate. he’s just there and he just Sucks. and we love him for that. like people are nuts over this guy. which is excellent! but given what poster expected he should be a big surprise. maybe magnus - i can see some people missing his appeal as he’s touted as a nerd and he’s continually a massive loser in every sense of the word…as long as you’re unfamiliar with the wild popularity of the tts version. this may be a sang situation where he’s not mentioned bc he’s expected and proven to be simped over, no surprise.

Lmao

Primarch simps of Tumblr, what is your verdict? (No hate to OP, just poking fun)

[python-nebula]

Do you see the vision

[butchnavi]

got queerbaited into reading a book by chatgpt. is this rock bottom

[lwieserce]

why is gi twitter lately obsessed with discussions on whether what hoyo does with their ships is queercoding under censorship or queerbait

[chemicalarospec]

actually i'm so obsessed with the Julian&Sandy + Kenneth Horne and Stefon + Seth Meyers parallels. the "Straight Man" who can't help but crack a smile interrogating his (heavily coded as) gay friend(s) that calling "whacky" would be putting it very lightly. comedy hasn't changed in 50 years.

And hey. it's still very funny and endearing to me! The tried and true formula is great!

[oimoi-op]

About your tags on the Lucienne post: oh we usually aren't even half this nice LMAOOO I could be a lot meaner but like. Both our posting about her and also the anger and frustration comes from the same place of love for and fascination with her. There's so much to talk about it's insane

Literally tho like!!!!! she's such a compelling character on so many levels, yet a lot of the fandom reduces her to the "mom friend" or other similarly reductive if not misogynistic stereotypical roles so for me (someone not super involved in the fandom these days) it's so refreshing to see you and others discussing her on her own merits and not just an accessory/afterthought for someone's white slash ship lol

[butchladymaria]

I agree with your list ! People being asshole about lesbian & other headcanons gtfo! That list could work for many other things too.

But to be sure everyone don’t mix thing up i just want to point out that not liking/ not being fan of an headcanon don’t equal  being an ass about it. It’s the mean actions or words afterwards that are bad. 

hey! i’m glad you found it generalizable. there’s a lot of things on there that get used against pretty much any “diverse” perspectives both inside and out of fan spaces. as for your second point, i don’t disagree with you. there are some queer headcanons that i don’t personally hold, but i’m going to be cheering them on rather than contributing to the negativity we face on a regular basis. you can personally hold a different headcanon without being a jerk.

this is not @ you anon, but there are a lot of people who believe that underrepresented groups seeing themselves in characters — whether through the lens of race, gender, sexuality, disability, etc — is “politicizing” fandom and ruining it somehow, as though a white/cishet/male/abled perspective is the default in art and anything else is “tainting” the “pure” fanspace. some of them might believe those voices can exist — so long as they keep their heads down and don’t take up too much space. the fact of the matter is that’s a bigoted thing to believe. our existence has been politicized against our will. for the marginalized, fan spaces are just another front we have to push to participate in. if someone finds themself constantly disliking one specific type of queer/nonwhite/disabled/etc. headcanon and feels the need to say over and over how much they don’t like it, they ought to seriously interrogate why that is.

[ajdrawshq]

i finished 7th dragon a lil while ago n some of the worldbuilding is so funny i cant stop thinking abt it. why is the lost city of atlantis populated by catgirls

[riza-hawks-eye]

A while back, Neil Newbon confirmed on one of his streams that Astarion is Pansexual.

So this is why it bothers me seeing fandom say things like "Astarion just feels like a gay man!" and "I just can't picture Astarion with a woman" because like... Astarion is still a queer man. It's been outright confirmed by his voice actor. And his queerness and his attraction to men isn't diminished by the fact that he can also be romanced by female characters. Repeat after me: Pansexuality is an lgbt identity in it's own right and not just gay person lite.™

And I think an important aspect to Astarion's sexuality is the fact that the writers made his relationship with both men and women part of his backstory. It's a stark contrast to Dragon Age 2 back in 2011 where Ander's past relationship with Karl was completely omitted from his dialogue if he was romance by a female Hawke. The unfortunate implications here being that bioware didn't think their female player base would still wanna romance Anders if he had past relationship with men. That to make Anders palatable to a straight-girl audience, all traces of his bisexuality had to be erased.

Astarion's Pansexuality doesn't change depending of the player's gender. The language he uses for his past lovers is gender neutral, he'll still mention relationships with men regardless of who you are playing as.

There is no "Playersexual" about it. Astarion is Pansexual. And that matters.

Edit: I was just looking over the notes of this post after having it muted for months and it really reaffirmed my decision to mute it. Some of you are posting bad takes like you're in a bad take contest. Hope you recover from the trauma of having to acknowledge bisexuals and pansexuals. - Love my bisexual ass ❤️

[lesbianjackies]

i’m actually getting exhausted at this point guys yellowjackets is an extremely queer & sapphic show 😭 like no it’s not the L word. because it wouldn’t make any fucking sense for it to be the L word. these are teenagers from the 90s who have weird and complicated relationships with each other who grow up into emotionally stunted adults who continue to have weird and complicated relationships with each other. i need you to stop discrediting the extremely queer way jackie and shauna were written, the devotion courtney eaton and jane widdop played their characters as having for each other, the ways in which christina ricci has played and talked about misty’s sexuality and feelings toward men, the obvious ways in which travis can be read as a trans woman. i need you to stop discrediting all of this just because they’re not portrayed in a stereotypically sexual and romantic way, just because the themes of this show aren’t spelled out for you. not every queer person is going to look the way you want them to. not every queer showrunner (because, i will remind you, bart and ashley are both queer) is going to write queer characters in the most straighforward way. it’s frankly fucking insulting to see so many people accuse yellowjackets, a show full of beautiful and complex and fucked up queer female dynamics, of queerbaiting and not being gay enough. watch heartstopper if you want a romcom. this is something different. just because queer representation doesn’t look the way you want it to doesn’t make it any less queer.

[theflashjaygarrick]

After thinking about the comic fandom's prioritisation of white male characters I feel like it's a self fulfilling cycle.

Mainstream discourse around superhero comics is all about how white male centric the genre is. The general consensus in fandom is that women don't like female characters because they are badly written and 2-dimensional in most nerd franchises.

And if you go in with that mindset you'll fairly assume that the characters who have the best runs and most interesting stories are the white men. And if you look at fandom spaces and people are waxing poetic about characters like Jason Todd and Tim Drake and acknowledging that characters like Babs, Steph and Cass exist this only will reinforce this perception. So the person getting into batfam go and ask for the best stories about the Batboys or read summaries about their arcs, only seeing these women as background characters in male characters stories.

But the thing is that isn't strictly. I mean I 100% agree that comics are sexist and racist but that doesn't mean that there aren't phenomenal and iconic runs starring and entering female characters (including queer women, disabled women, and WOC). Cassandra Cain and Kate Kane probably have two of the best character bibles out of the entire batfamily in the form of Batgirl 2000 and Batwoman: Elegy. Selina and Babs both have more well received story lines/runs than Jason Todd does.

Great stories with nuanced female characters exist but the assumption they don't means that people don't look for them. So instead they draw upon stories with the Batboys (minus Luke Fox, JPV and often Duke) in their fan art and fan fiction and discussions and accidentally obscure the stories of female characters in the batman mythos even more.

And the cycle continues.

[maybe-boys-do-love]

Mix Sahaphap gets to perform (and has the performance chops to perform) in a style that I’ve never seen any other male actor get to embody. Mix gets to unironically play the #strongfemalecharacter. The Beatrice, the Elizabeth Bennett, the Jo March. Strong-willed, emotional, kind-hearted.

Not only do the plot points line up, but Mix, more than any BL actor I’ve seen, fully leans into the embodiment of this archetype. In his roles, he rolls his eyes, pouts, banters flirtatiously, softens his posture and expression at small details. He doesn’t over-exaggerate and imposition other characters but his face also doesn’t hold back his character’s thoughts and judgments. And when the moments arrive, he lets all the hurt and anguish pour out in shatters of tears and visible heartbreak—the star-counting scene, anyone????—in a way that harkens to the operatic emotionality of well-done melodramas, soap-operas, and their contemporary Thai equivalent of Lakorn. It’s only that these have never been men’s roles in those.

It’s no surprise that one of Mix’s roles—Cupid’s Last Wish—is explicitly a gender body-swap, and Tian in A Tale of Thousand Stars is (albeit explicitly denied within the show) heavily connected to gender body-swapping. What Mix specializes in as an actor, and does exceptionally well, has been defined as feminine. To depict a kind of queer expression in this style is novel because it’s not camp, it’s not okama, it’s not a soft or femboy, it’s not a BL twink (Mix has been mostly excluded from the schoolyards and quads of the BL universe except for a role as a senior crush in Fish Upon the Sky). It’s too sincere and too adult for any of that.

In Moonlight Chicken we get to see, without the pretense of gendered mysticism, this performance style’s seduction, warmth, wit, and explosiveness within the framework of a general gay form of expression. It says that this kind of femininity might just be a gay thing. Not all gay men exhibit it, obviously—queer men aren’t a monolith. Still, it gives us something to consider about how we observe performance of queerness on screen, especially in front of an audience that puts so much more emphasis on ships, heat, and pairing chemistry to assess how well they perform a BL role. Could we look for other features to judge performance of queerness instead of how well they kiss?

Seme and uke roles would be the major performance style categories loyal BL fans assess actors with, yet even within the archetype his character’s fill within BL narratives, Mix’s performances differ from the typical uke depiction in BL because he really doesn’t perform them as passive. Rather, Mix’s characters and his portrayal of them are dynamic and demanding. It certainly fits certain stereotypes of ukes (Gilbert!) and their gay stereotype equivalent of bottoms as pillow princesses and brats. Mix’s characters, though, have more drive, agency, and compassion than that, and he plays them with all of those currents running underneath.

We certainly have openly gay writer/director Aof Noppharnach to thank for writing this kind of queer character for Mix to play in Tian and Wen. But for Mix’s specific commitment to the performance starting off with his (debut!?) role in ATOTS, we first have Earth to thank for believing in Mix’s ability and recommending him to portray the role of Tian, and then Aof’s acceptance despite his differing initial expectations for the character. Mix, Earth, and Aof have all been open about how Mix in his personal life and nature holds a lot of similarities to both his role as Tian in ATOTS and Wen in Moonlight Chicken. Some people might knock points off his performances because he’s like them. But his relationship to the characters, rather than dampening my enthusiasm for Mix’s performances, helps me appreciate his willingness to give an authentic performance in a style that hasn’t been encouraged on screens previously. It’s made more impactful that he chose to risk vulnerability to bring something personal that had previously been excluded from screens because of its gender deviance (and in broader society explicitly condemned). This doesn’t make a claim on Mix’s actual identity, but simply shows his willingness to understand and perform the expressions of his queer characters with an effort at empathy that many other actors would feel challenged to bring.

Some actors are chameleons, but some actors have a gift of a type within which they can explore depths and range that no one else can best. For me, that’s what Mix does in his work when directors and casting understands his talent. There’s a BTS video of Mix actually fainting during a scene while in Earth/Phupa’s embrace on the mountain that immediately brought to mind the wildly famous final scene in the film Camille where Greta Garbo as Marguerite dies in her lover’s arms.

For Mix, it was a serious incident due to regrettably extreme conditions and requiring the on-set paramedics, but these levels of theatrics, for me, are emblematic of what Mix is capable of as a performer, as well. After all, he had to faint in Phupa’s arms multiple times on purpose. It’s the kinds of Old Hollywood and heightened sentimental romance realms Mix takes his performances to! Then he can turn around and make it look easy to take that same character into grounded quips or dedicated everyday tasks. It only takes writers, directors, and audiences willing to see that men can feel this way and act this way. Mix has paved the way.

[cinna-wanroll]

The Twinkification of Obi-Wan Kenobi

Hi everyone! I have emerged from the abyss to posit an opinion and analysis about something that has been ongoing in my corner of the fandom for some time now and I just wanted to share my thoughts. Please note that this is not meant to be a call-out post. If you have made references to Obi-Wan being a twink, we are cool, we simply have a difference of opinion! As always this blog is an open space where people from across the fandom are welcomed and loved.

With that being said:

The Co-Opting of "Twink"

It isn't uncommon to come across the term "twink" nowadays while scrolling the social medias. In fact, there are several videos referencing men, both real and fictional, using "twink" as a kind of affectionate endearment.

Is there a big, beefy man who shows his emotions in your favorite TV show? Chances are he has been called a twink.

Looking at a cute post of a straight couple? There is a chance the woman has captioned her post with: I love my twink boyfriend! :)

Is there a trans man on your for you page? Peer in the comments: chances are he, too, has people teeming in his comments to call him a twink.

Let us be clear: this is not what the word "twink" means.

The term "twink" is a queer term that has become so mangled and co-opted by cis, straight people (especially women) that it has become misused across the internet. So what is it, exactly? "Twink" is a queer identifier. Traditionally, the term refers to gay men who are:

Thin

Not very muscular

Not hairy

Young

Of course, there is always room for nuance. Also, there are so many layers to this conversation I have not and will not address fully. However, the main purpose of this conversation is to discuss its relation to Obi-Wan Kenobi.

So You Want to Woobify a Warrior

Most of the time when I see someone refer to Obi-Wan as a twink, it is in reference to mid-thirties, mid or post-war Obi-Wan. I am not going to address sexuality here because I am a firm believer in allowing people their interpretations of characters' sexualities. Instead, here are some photos of Obi-Wan Kenobi during and a bit after the era previously mentioned, and of his actor, Ewan McGregor:

Here are some things of note: Ewan and Obi-Wan are not especially petite. They are muscular, hairy, and visibly middle-aged. Or at least, visibly older than 20s.

In Karen Miller's Wild Space, Bail Organa throws up in his hands out of fear when Obi-Wan is having hallucinations and moves to attack him.

In Christie Golden's Dark Disciple, he punches a droid in the face and it stumbles back.

My point here is that Obi-Wan is intimidating. He underwent years of rigorous training, fought in battle after battle, and is an expert in martial arts. The chances of him escaping that with the appearance of being boyish, early 20s, skinny, and not muscular seem... slim. War does not typically have anti-aging effects.

I once saw someone on this app make a point that because Obi-Wan is portrayed as the more intuitive and emotionally regulated character in contrast to Anakin's brash violence, he is perceived as more feminine. Therefore, he is more "coddleable." And, furthermore, the "feminine" narrative lends itself to the stereotypical parts of the label of twink. (Again, there is a deeper conversation to be had there. I am generalizing).

Unless Obi-Wan has been extensively malnourished, shaved, and de-aged, I don't see sense in seeing him as a twink.

The part of all this with even more implications associated is that I see a lot of this mentioned in relationship to Obi-Wan being in a relationship with Cody. There is a lot of comparison there, usually positioning Cody as the strong, indestructible warrior of whom Obi-Wan is either envious of or saved by. The racist undertones there are infinite and have been addressed and readdressed, especially by POC in the fandom.

Anyways gorgeous people, this concludes my thoughts, as it is very late. I am hoping to be able to participate in Codywan First Kiss Bingo, but I was hit with the flu and have been working diligently to catch up in my uni classes. I love you all and wish you nothing but the best!

[0-therw-0-rldly]

I’ll preface this by saying I’m not really a shipper. I just enjoy canon couples on TV Series/films.

Terms I’d like B*ddies to remove from their vocabulary because they don’t know how to use them correctly:

Media literacy: For a group that uses this term a lot you sure do misinterpret everything in this show.

Queerbaiting: Going to expand on this one. A show that’s already been pre established for having queer characters simply cannot queerbait.

Ship baiting: While sometimes you can argue that they could be doing that, that’s only if you look at the show in a very biased manner. You might think this is the case but the general audience doesn’t think the way you do.

Ship war: This isn’t a one tree hill situation where there was Team Brooke Vs. Team Peyton where the middle guy (Lucas Scott) had canonically been with both women. This is people not understanding fanon vs. canon and not being able to just watch the show. It’s like playing quarterback on Madden and thinking you could be better than Patrick Mahomes.

Plot device: everything’s a plot device. Move tf on.

Predator: You sound like crazy MAGA supporters calling everything regarding the LGBTQIA+ community as predatory. Sit down.

Co-parenting: I know this is a big one and discourse was brought up during the hiatus. Oliver and Ryan have loosely mentioned this years ago but it was never to be taken this seriously. Do y’all even know what co-parenting is or are you that big of a donut? Buck is someone who loves his best friend deeply and by extension, his kid too. Him taking care of him frequently does not make him a co-parent. Maybe he is a parental or uncle figure, but he isn’t a co-parent. Also, I swear y’all need to learn how a will works. He is a GODPARENT, not a GUARDIAN. Stfu.

Hag: This especially applies to women, but to say that someone 25-30+ is a hag for still being in fandoms or enjoying tv shows/films is inherently misogynistic. Men are never held to this much criticism for enjoying fictional media, but women aren’t allowed to?

Queer Coding: people of the same sex “looking at each other”, hugging, or having intimate moments all together doesn’t make them queer coded. It could mean that they just love each other that deeply platonically. While representation is amazing and just because you interpret a character as queer coded (just like my ship baiting comment) doesn’t mean others interpret it that way as well. In addition, network TV has stipulations, and also actors are allowed to decline storylines. Ryan has mentioned his character is heterosexual an abundance of times which means (at least for now) that he isn’t willing to go for this storyline.

Dead naming: Y’all construing the fact that Buck wants people like coworkers and some of his former love interests, to saying Evan is his dead name is inherently transphobic because do you even understand what a dead name is? Evan Buckley is shown as being fine with being called Evan by both Tommy and his sister. I’m pretty sure some of his love interests have called him Evan as well.

Fetishizing: You guys saw two hot guys who “looked at each other” and for 6 seasons have wanted nothing but to see those two make out with each other. Those of us who enjoy Tevan saw Buck giddy at the thought of Tommy and have wanted domestic fluff for them since.

Anything to do with racism, homophobia, and misogyny: I’ve seen the way you guys have conveniently weaponized Henren and by extension Aisha/Tracie when you didn’t get the Ryan/Oliver interview, don’t try to act like you’re morally superior. Not to mention wanting a canonically gay man to die in a show and not even holding those who use your ship name to write CSA fics accountable because you’re petty and want to throw hissy fits. Anyone looking at your comments as an outsider would think you’re homophobes and yes queer people can be homophobic.

I do hope you can expand your vocabulary. 🤍

[ithinkthiswasabadidea]

I'm not anywhere really near or into Kingdom Come: Deliverance, but since the second game released recently, I've seen a lot of new attention on my social medias, particularly around Henry and Hans' relationship

And I, very obviously, love queer characters and relationships, and even moreso the canon ones, so I watched the IGN video explaining how one might romance Hans in the second game

Man. I was blown away.

By now I've played a handful of rpg's and romanced a handful of npc's, but not ONCE has the dialogue and action of a confession scene ever felt quite so real and as beautifully acted

I have almost zero other context about the games or characters, yet I haven't stopped thinking about that romance scene in days

That you build up the affection and genuine care for Hans through dialogue choices feels completely non-forced, and you can tell that Hans enjoys your presence and respects you immensely. Henry gently encouraging and helping Hans when he's uncomfortable, always concerned about his wellbeing. There's such a solid foundation of mutual trust that even I, as an outside viewer, can tell that both men truly would put their lives in the others hands

And then the confession scene itself? Henry coming to say goodbye, and because of the work that has been put in to convey Henry's feelings of care and devotion for Hans, it's Hans himself who starts the conversation. He tells a story that he 'doesn't have his own words for', displaying that he's uncertain about how this might go, but knowing that it needs to be said before Henry leaves. He's both deflecting and projecting, using this story as a way to cushion the segue into his own feelings, or the blow of rejection should it come. And as Hans imagines something terrible happening to Henry, he immediately gets emotional, voice shaking, knowing he'd be unable to help

There's a small moment as Henry reassures that he'll be alright, when he places a hand on top of Hans' and this small, delightfully hopeful smile appears on Hans' face. I take this to be the moment where Hans believes that Henry has understood his story, and his way of confessing his feelings, and that Henry feels the same way about him. Then Henry stands, moving to leave and Hans' smile drops. Perhaps Henry's confidence falters here, and before he can reciprocate his true feelings and kiss him, Hans is running on adrenaline and courage and pulls Henry into the kiss instead, before he can second-guess himself

It's awkward, uncertain. Hans has this almost crushing grip on Henry like he's barely sure what he's just done, just that he couldn't let him walk away without doing something . And when Henry turns his head and steps back, noises of shock and breathlessness, Hans jumps back like he's been burned and spurned. He's stammering and stuttering out an apology, quiet and upset, unlike his usual self

Hans' body language as he turns away, making himself smaller, making more space between them than is necessary, it displays how he thinks his actions have just been perceived - that Henry doesn't feel the same way, he just ruined a perfectly good friendship, he's made himself look weak. He rubs at his mouth like he wishes he could remove the feel of Henry's lips against his own, tries apologising again, gasping for air, screws up his face in anxiety or anger for his recklessness......

Then Henry makes his own decision and speeds back over to him, pulling him into an even more crushing embrace and kiss, before they make their way over to the bed

The acting direction here in this scene is just so delectablely real . It looks and feels like I'm a fly on the wall of a real life confession, where both men are less than certain about their futures, and even less certain about how their relationship is perceived in the others eyes. Hans is visibly scared of rejection when Henry turns his back, Henry is visibly coming to terms with what he wants in this moment

The reactions are the most natural thing in the world, especially in a game that strives for realism. There was clearly a great deal of care that went into writing and directing this relationship, and with how naturally it progressed to this climax

And I think that's where the divide is for me, when I think about the romance options in BG3 or other rpgs, because there is something more flowery and shiny about those romances that I've experienced. Like they're too perfect, too polished and rehearsed, no room to have any fuck ups or moments of imperfection. But it's the awkwardness and show of non-positive emotions and reactions, rather than immediate lust and experience, that really pins the Henry and Hans scene above the rest

There's probably more I could say, and I'm sure there's more that others who know these characters and the games could say, but I just wanted to get my thoughts into some words and hope that it strikes true with someone else

I don't think I've ever seen a romance scene in a video game, that has felt so genuine as this. A thousand kudos to the actors for Hans and Henry, and the writers and directors for this marvellously curated scene ❤️