#because also i feel like this is relevant too-
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bisexualbaker · 2 days ago
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Oh shit yeah I got this!
Okay, so our main characters, let's call them Steve and Monica, because I need names and don't want to think too hard. Anyway, they grew up together, were platonic ride-or-die for each other in high school, but drifted apart when they went to colleges in different states where they eventually settled down. Monica ended up in a very restrictive state and Steve ended up in a much more pro-choice state. They occasionally message each other on the internet, but nothing really meaningful, usually no more than a Hi on their birthdays or relevant holidays (etc).
Then one day Steve gets a call from Monica. Her recent ex-boyfriend—well, she'd really been thinking of breaking up with him for a couple of months before that, but the final straw was three months ago when she found him messing with her birth control. She immediately kicked him to the curb and went about disentangling their lives, went and got Plan B or equivalent ASAP, just in case.
Well, turns out it was too late: She was already pregnant, and didn't get real confirmation until very recently. And, well, surely Steve knows how things are in the state where she lives.
Steve does know how things are in the state where Monica lives. He also knows that Monica has never wanted to have children, since they talked about it some in high school. There could be various reasons here, from bad experiences with her own parents, to financial reasons, to health reasons, but he never saw fit to argue with any of them. Her choice, right? Meanwhile, Steve himself isn't really sure on the kids thing, but he's leaning towards "no thanks", because he is sure that anyone making the choice to bring kids into the world had better be 100% on board, and he's not, so that means no. (Also, if he feels the need to spend any time with kids, he's got local friends and/or family with little ones he can spoil.)
Anyway! Steve tells Monica that it sounds like she's been having a rough time, maybe he could come pick her up and she could spend a week or two at his place, get resettled after everything that went down with That Jerk (very clearly not saying what else they could, or rather will, be doing while Monica is visiting). Deeply relieved, Monica takes him up on his offer enthusiastically. Steve calls his job, takes a few weeks off of work, and drives over to pick up Monica.
They've got an appointment in Steve's state, but it's still some days away, so they take a leisurely trip back to Steve's. All the while they're reconnecting, and Steve is noticing that all of the things he liked about Monica as a friend in high school are still there, and are also things he'd really like in a life partner. Her sense of humor, her willingness to compromise, her determination to find a way to make things work, her money sense... She's also much more confident in herself than she used to be, which Steve finds really attractive.
Or at least, she's more confident in herself whenever pregnancy shit isn't getting to her. Steve already knew that pregnancy and kids aren't something Monica ever wanted, but if he ever needed more convincing, he's getting it both on this road trip and when they get back to his condo. Still, he does everything he can to try and keep Monica's spirits up, to distract her and/or make sure she's prepared for her abortion and everything it will involve. (All the while, he's also learning what he can to make sure he can help her through the aftermath. Apparently post-partum isn't necessarily just for giving birth; all those hormones and body changes can also hammer down after any other pregnancy ending circumstances!)
Steve drives her to the clinic, waits with her when she asks him to, waits for her during, and does everything he can to make her as comfortable as possible as she recovers. One thing after another is just more yes, yes, yes, this is what he wants in his life, Monica is who he wants in his life.
He's a bit stuck on how or if to confess, though; this was a deeply shitty situation for Monica, and it's also something he could hypothetically hold over her legally after everything, which he would never do, but he knows might make things more difficult for both of them. Then, a day or two before he's set to start driving Monica home, he checks in on Monica packing—only to find her crying.
Steve immediately asks Monica what's wrong, if he can help with anything, and Monica just starts crying harder. She ends up confessing her own feelings, how she started to fall for Steve when he didn't judge her for her shitty ex-boyfriend and how she wanted to terminate the pregnancy (which more than a few of her local friends had), and then everything else he did to make her feel happy and secure while helping her out just really sealed the deal! She got half way through packing before she realized that she didn't actually want to leave him, but she also didn't want to put pressure on him after he'd done so much for her already.
Steve immediately hugs her and confesses back, telling her he doesn't want her to leave either but didn't want to put pressure on her, and also maybe this was a little soon after all of the everything going on. But he would love to go out to dinner with her properly, before he takes her back home, and again when they get there, and then maybe they could see how things go from there? They can try doing long-distance for a month or two, and if they're both still certain, they can get together more formally and figure out where to live.
Fast-forward ten years, Monica and Jake are happily married, with three dogs and a tortoise. They still don't want kids.
The end.
Edit: Okay, this is not "and the person who got them pregnant", but it mostly still works!
there's an extremely niche plot in romance fiction wherein our invariably heterosexual leads fall in love after a night of passion leads to an unplanned pregnancy and they're now bound together by an impending child. I cast no judgment on anyone who enjoys this, but since I'm an evil gay and this is my personal nightmare scenario I want to see a zany romance novel premised on the opposite resolution: a couple falls in love while on a whirlwind roadtrip to obtain a legal abortion
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truelovepolinator · 3 days ago
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Nicola and Luke are ABSOLUTELY TOGETHER and have been all along and here’s how I know
(Friends, I’ve just finished this and it is INSANELY LONG. Like, two looong book chapters long. But I PROMISE it’s worth it. I was gonna cut it into multiple parts to make it more readable, but I’m going to be super busy over the next few days, so I wouldn’t have a chance to post subsequent parts until probably Christmas, so I’ve decided to drop it all now so I don’t delay the final victorious conclusion. Sorry, it’s so long, but I don’t really have time to rethink it and try to tell the story in a more concise way. Again, I think you’ll be glad you stuck with it if you want to feel as thoroughly confident as I am that Nic and Luke are absolutely together.)
(Also, I have to run now, but I'll come back to add relevant photos/videos as time allows. But I'm sure you're all familiar with them anyway.)
So I want to start by saying something I’m sure I’ll repeat. This is, of course, just my opinion and supposition based on the evidence available to me. But I also want to say, I am absolutely, positively sure now in a way I have never been. Genuinely not a doubt in my mind, and I think you’ll agree by the end of this.
It’s also worth noting that this may be nothing new to some of you. I’ve only been on this platform for a week and have barely scratched the surface of the great content here. So this is how *I* came to the final, joyful conclusion that everything is right with the world where lukola is concerned. I had long been sure they belonged together, but was afraid to embrace the theories about them actually being together now for fear of heartbreak, plus all the confusing signals about A & J, etc.
But all that changed a couple nights ago when I finally got the last piece of the puzzle I needed to see the big picture. There were just too many things that didn’t make sense, until they did! I literally couldn’t sleep that night (seriously only got about 2 hours) and then spent next day telling my husband the story for hours (in 20-30 minute increments as he could spare them during his slow, Christmas time work day).
My husband has been a patient, long-suffering skeptic through all of this. He’s put up with my rants and constant videos I just had to share, but he’s been completely convinced from day one that they simply leaned into their friendship to turn on faux relationship vibes for PR. He was absolutely sure it was all just make-believe for the fans. No matter what I showed him, he could not be convinced.
Until yesterday. Yes, I convinced the toughest skeptic in town.
I think it’s important to start with my journey into the Lukola fandom for context. I was a casual Bridgerton watcher until this season, and had never read the books. I liked season 1, I loved season 2, and I was looking forward to watching season 3.
I had planned to wait to watch the first 4 until the second half was about to launch (so I wouldn’t have to wait for more), but I realized after about a week that we needed to watch it immediately before everything was completely spoiled by timeline gifs and clips.
Needless to say, I was beyond hooked. Instantly. Season 3 was another level for all the reasons you all know. Finally I could engage safely with the fandom, but the process from occasional Polin/Lukola content to nonstop immersion took some time. So even following the second half, there was a TON of footage I hadn’t seen.
All of this to say, I basically missed all of the World Tour stuff as it was happening, and it took well into the summer to finally see so many amazing clips and edits that I was absolutely fucking sucked into the lukola wormhole. However, I was well behind many of you on the curve, and even to this day, I’m still catching up on things.
But by late summer, I was all in. I was sailing high on USS Lukola (or I suppose that should be the HMS Lukola!) because I saw exactly what you all saw. This was clearly real, their feelings were indisputable, and everything about their behavior and much of what they said was so far beyond PR, even “faking couplehood” PR.
They were real. Even if he had this dumb girlfriend. (I say that only in the good-natured, abstract sense that I wanted him with Nic, not in a personal “actually about her” sense. In fact, I’ve never said anything hateful about either A or J and I hope I never will.)
WHY AREN’T THEY TOGETHER???
I couldn’t resist the mystery.
It drove me absolutely crazy for months trying to understand why they weren’t together. Nothing made sense, but I mentally explored literally every possibility. They’re afraid of ruining their friendship? They’re afraid of disrupting the production if it goes wrong? These possibilities at least made some kind of sense and seemed to be the only explanations I could find. But in my mind, they weren’t good enough reasons to resist what these two so obviously had. Still, I’m not them, so that was easy for me to say. I had nothing to risk in this.
One or both of them is/are secretly gay? Soulmate besties instead of soulmate lovers? I didn’t think this was the case and nothing made me believe this. Yet, I was attempting to allow for every possibility. Still, with Nicola being the super vocal “gay icon” that she is, it was hard to imagine she wouldn’t live out and proud if that was the case. And apparently she lived with an unknown man for two years. Though she does always keep her private (romantic) life super private, so I suppose who knows? And, of course, Luke had two very public past relationships with women, but again, who knows, I suppose? This option doesn’t ring true at all, but it does exist in the universe of possible explanations for this inexplicable situation.
They love each other in a soulmate way, but somehow one of them just isn’t “attracted” to the other? Certainly, if the stories about Antonia were true, that might suggest that Luke might be attracted to an entirely different physical type than Nicola. But that didn’t ring true either because LOOK AT THEM TOGETHER! He can’t take his eyes off of her, let alone his hands. And the same for her. They are magnetized to each other. If that’s not attraction, what is?
One of them has baggage and isn’t ready for a real, serious relationship? This one seemed possible. People can have hang-ups or wounds for all sorts of reasons, and letting someone in – especially someone who might actually be your soulmate – can be terrifying. Self-protection by avoiding relationships and/or distracting yourself with less meaningful relationships is a natural way of coping with baggage. Yes, maybe this one? Neither of them seems obviously wounded, but what would I know? Most people don’t wear their wounds on their sleeves, least of all during a PR tour. Still, the energy flow between them seemed anything but wounded. It seemed like the healthiest, happiest thing in the world.
People kept saying, they’re blind and they don’t see it yet. But I don’t believe anyone can be that blind. Especially after watching all the countless edits and clips of their tour, which we know they did because Nicola is chronically online and sharing with Luke the best of it all (and sneaky Luke is likely lurking also).
So at the end of the day, I had no good explanation. It just kept not making sense.
Then those music festival photos of Nic and Jake (I’ll abbreviate sometimes for ease, but I do say their names) showed up. The fandom erupted into chaos with full reactions across the spectrum including a bizarre, almost immediate burst of (not yet named) jakolas, which felt like a disproportionate response to a few photos.
Admittedly, those photos did look quite friendly, and touchy, and yes, they stood arm-in-arm. But lots of friends stand like that at concerts. And Nic is known to be touchy-feely, so let’s not go overboard, I thought. However, I did acknowledge (in my head, I didn’t weigh in online at all) that it suggested that it COULD be romantic. I opted not to freak out, because either way, Nic’s love life is her own and I want her to be happy.
And it’s worth saying here that both of their private lives are none of my business, none of any of our business, and even writing this is completely at odds with that truth. I acknowledge that. But what I told myself, and actually meant it, was that I was going to stay out of it unless and until NicLuke got together. That was the only place I would invest my energy since they’ve both said they think it’s sweet that fans ship them. If they dated others, good luck to them. Be happy. But when the time comes…
Yes, friends, the time has come!!! But back to my story.
Note that (because again, I was still catching up), I hadn’t yet seen the swimming in Sorrento photos and had missed that piece of the puzzle at that point. Throughout this time, I’d see people refer to things on Twitter like everyone already knew what they were talking about, but hardly anyone ever took the time to explain. So I got lots of glimmers of things that others felt were notable, without actually knowing any details. Those pictures were an example. Another was the Claddagh ring.
I’m very grateful to some amazing deep dive blog entries by @threeacttragedy that explained the ring, “Bless the Telephone,” and other meaty, important history that I’d previously only heard mentioned in passing. In fact, one of her blogs is what first brought me here by referral from Twitter. And if you don’t follow her, you should!
In the past week, as I started reading blogs that broke down past dates and clues, I finally started looking them up one by one and trying to put the pieces together in my head. I’d seen the swimming photos by then, but I revisited them. I dug in to try to understand the references to a “New Year kiss” from the night the friend group (Rory, etc.) posted photos together from a Soho House party. I reviewed Hot Boy Summer, I rewatched the incredibly emotional video of Luke meeting Nicola’s mom, I looked at photos of the Claddagh ring and went to Chupi’s website. I learned about the LA photos from April, both Antonia’s version and the InStyle Polaroids. I reviewed all the photos of Luke and Antonia that I could find. And I reviewed all the photos and videos of Nic and Jake that I could find. Also, I listened to “Bless the Telephone” about one hundred times. Lol.
Regarding Luke and Antonia, I had the same response in this deep dive I’ve had every time. Weird. I mean, if I didn’t feel so strongly that Luke was in love with Nicola, and if I knew nothing about him except he was some hot actor, could I see him dating someone like A? Sure. But the fact that there are almost no pictures of them posing together, alone like a couple, is weird. Even if it’s super casual and she was just his date to some stuff. The fact that Luke looks grumpy in both sets of pap photos (premiere night and swimming in Sorrento), but A is smiling happily in at least one of the premiere night photos is weird. The fact that after the Sorrento pap photos, Luke seems to leave his friend group to come home early, and then stops liking any of his best friend Rory’s photos from there on, weird.
The fact that in the fall, she posts pictures harkening back to a place and time they were apparently together, but without any actual photos together, weird. And the continual drip, drip of Likes from Luke is weird. And then when a photo of Luke in a restaurant in Rome is posted by the restaurant, she immediately follows with a video story of someone making pasta in the same restaurant, weird.
Perhaps weirdest of all, the fact that she pre-posted the LA pictures, and then he gave other versions of the same shots to InStyle. Especially the switching seats thing. If my husband and I were taking pics of each other at a café, I’d take his picture in front of the traffic, and he’d take my picture in front of the restaurant, because that’s where we’d be sitting. Across from each other. So why switch seats to take the photos? It’s not like that street with traffic was such a fantastic backdrop that we’d each need our turn with that shot? And they’re the same, with the same table number, but different. Sure, traffic moves, but weird coincidence that they each had a white truck, but a DIFFERENT white truck. So, like I said, weird. Always implying they were together, but never actually saying/showing it. Weird.
I read all sorts of theories from pragmatic (we just have to accept that they’re dating) to hateful (they’re not together/never were, but she’s obsessed and keeps inserting herself in a pathetic, desperate plea for attention and followers) to seemingly far-fetched (some sort of NDA that means for some reason Luke is obligated to Like her photos). Only the first of these seemed plausible. I maybe didn’t like it (not maybe, I didn’t like it at all), but I thought, “Yes, I guess we just have to accept that they’re probably together until they tell us otherwise.”
(Though I held out a small sliver of “but we don’t know anything for sure until L and/or N tell us themselves” hope, which remains true even as I write this.)
Now, let’s talk about Nic and Jake. First, there were those shots from the concert (discussed above). Then, I believe, were the NYC shots (if I’m not confusing the order). In the NYC shots, they were both there, but they weren’t especially intimate in any interpersonal sense. Then, the pap shots on the street posted on DM, ostensibly catching them walking home together, holding hands and arm-in-arm after a night at the pub. With those photos came an onslaught of fandom fury and gossip site reporting about how “Nicola Coughlan confirms her relationship…” Same story runs across a bunch of trashy sites, all saying the same thing and citing an unnamed source talking about how besotted they were, or whatever the quote was.
Admittedly, I was among the furious fans. Not because of what the pictures showed. Again, I was trying to be serene and Zen about them and their private lives. I believed with all my heart that NicLuke belonged together, but if now wasn’t their time, I’d have to wait. I didn’t love that I’d heard he was only 24, but I was trying to balance my efforts to be a non-judgmental person with my discomfort over that issue and reminding myself that her choices are none of my business (unless she chooses Luke!).
So I did my best to refrain from judgment, even as I saw the fandom erupt into toxic madness about whether it was true, whether he was gay, whether the age gap was wrong, whether DM lied about the date, and if they did (which they did), why? But I figured, unless the photos were very, very old, things weren’t likely to have changed in their relationship over a couple weeks, so I wasn’t overly concerned about the date.
However, I was angry about all these stories (basically the same story across the board) announcing that she’d “CONFIRMED” the relationship. It made me very angry that they said she confirmed something when she’d done nothing of the sort. I wasn’t prepared to argue that she wasn’t dating Jake at that point, but why would they all run this story, with this headline, when what actually happened was a paparazzi photographer snapped shots and sold them, then the media drew conclusions from what they saw.
Nicola never confirmed a damn thing. So why were they running this headline so universally?
I was also angry that the photos existed at all. Photos in her neighborhood could reveal her location and put her safety at risk. Also, how did they happen to be there to take those photos late one specific night? Felt like they must have received a tip. But I moved on and forgot about that part.
Time went on and I saw more and more discussion of Jake’s sexuality. I don’t really want to get into that here because I don’t really feel comfortable speculating about anyone unless they choose to explicitly come out, but I did finally start poking around his page, Douglas’s page, etc. and began to understand why people were saying what they were saying. However, I reminded myself that bi/pan-sexuality exists and I wasn’t willing to partake in bi-erasure, so I held my tongue and kept watching.
Now, at this point, I want to remind us all that Nic has always been extremely private and uttered nary a peep in public about her romantic/sexual life. And fair enough. It’s none of our damn business. Also, she’s talked extensively about how women are not just men’s girlfriends and her feminist take on many things and how it doesn’t feel nice to know that people are more interested in her love life than her work. She’s worked freaking hard to achieve the success she’s now enjoying, and she certainly should not be reduced to a woman in a relationship. No matter who is on the other end of that relationship.
(Again here, I feel the need to acknowledge my hypocrisy in writing this, but I really do genuinely love Nic’s work and spirit and activism, etc. as well.)
So, in light of her position on all of that, we wouldn’t expect her to go public with a new love interest. The fact that she was papped with this guy (if indeed he was a love interest) was just an indication of how much her celebrity and profile have grown. There’s greater interest now and she’s more recognizable now, so it’s to be expected that she’d have a harder time keeping her love life private now than in the past. Not so strange then, that she got caught a couple times in paparazzi photos at this point.
However, would she really then go public with that guy? That would mark a radical change in her behavior just when you’d think she’d want to be the most private because the glare of the spotlight is brighter than ever. Still, she allowed a public photo with him, Camilla, and Evan Ross Katz to go out shortly thereafter. If one believed they were dating, that could certainly be interpreted as a launch. Yet, as I said, would she really do that if she were dating him?
Then he started popping up everywhere. I won’t get the chronology here right because I don’t want to research the dates right now, but there was the Charlie xcx concert, in which she appeared with Jake and Dylan, who is out and proud. The Queer premiere where he was just caught in the background of a fan photo. The simultaneously released photos from the red and gold restaurant (with a mysterious third person taking the photos). There was the apparently brunch-time photo of her with Jake and two others, taken by Dylan. And most recently, Louisa’s photo with Jake and Douglas (who is also openly gay and close friends, if not more, with Jake).
I’m not mentioning all the players in all of these because it’s not critical to the story, and I may be forgetting some photos, but there is a point to all of this. First, there’s potentially a notable shift in what she’s allowing to be shared here. Again, historically, she’s never shared anything about her love life. Suddenly, she’s letting him be photographed everywhere. Also, at most of these events, there were other queer participants and/or queer content (the movie premiere).
And while she’s never allowed her romantic life to be shared, you know what she has often shared? Photos with all of her platonic friends, including her huge friend group of many, many gay men. So this trend in what she’s allowing to be shared suggests that she’s telling a story and clarifying Jake’s role in her life.
But then there’s that one mystery release, the simultaneously timed restaurant photo drops. Clearly coordinated, clearly indicating they were there together. No indication about the third party. Why? Just enough to hint that there might be something going on, and to continue wreaking havoc in the fandom.
Because remember that toxic fandom bickering over all of this? The jakolas swearing they’re in love and soon to be engaged and furious at the lukolas for “being blind and refusing to accept the truth and it’s so disrespectful to Nic ('who you claim to love') by disregarding her feelings and treating the love of her life so badly. They keep showing you they’re in love and you won’t listen!” Etc., etc.
Meanwhile, the lukolas fall into a couple camps. By this point, most have decided Nic and Jake aren’t dating, but some remain circumspect. Some scream back at the jakolas, ostensibly in defense of Jake, saying very similar things about “Jake and his friends are doing everything in their power to show you the truth and you refuse to see it.” And a variety of other responses. Everyone’s mad at everyone.
And all of it, every bit of it, keeps us ALL talking about Nicola Coughlan and Luke Newton. Nonstop, every day.
Now, we are nearing the big mic drop of all of this, and I want to say at this point that we need to remember that Nic and Luke are HUMAN BEINGS who have a right to privacy. And they are celebrities living in a world that has an intense interest in their love lives. And sometimes, we might not feel good about the measures they must take to protect their privacy. We might hate those measures. We might feel manipulated, and we are. But if we love and respect them as much as I hope we all do, we can also understand and forgive them for taking such measures.
A quick review of important factors in all of this:
THINGS THAT TELL US IT’S REAL
The Galway trip and that very emotional introduction to Nic’s mom, which looked for all the world like a woman meeting her future son-in-law
The Claddagh ring and how she’s been wearing it
The things reporters, cast, and crew have said in passing and/or posted, not to mention recent open shipping from Ryan Wheeler and Shondaland’s IG
Everything we saw with our own eyes on the world tour, not to mention everything we’ve seen in the BTS
Little droplets of NicLuke over the recent months like Bless the Telephone and (not yet mentioned above) the S4 selfie and the photo of them in costume that Nic said she thought she’d shared, but now it’s ours (while she hasn’t posted any Jake)
The absolute consistency of all of this as a story that makes sense
THINGS THAT MAKE US DOUBT IT’S REAL AND/OR KEEP US GUESSING AND DISCUSSING
The premiere night pap photos (and though I didn’t mention it earlier, the fact that Nic went home that night so she wasn’t around for A’s attendance)
The friend group photos at Soho House with Luke, A and others
The weird LA InStyle photos
The Sorrento swimming photos
The multiple sets of pap photos of Nic and Jake, including grainy night-time neighborhood photos (with a woman walking a dog in the background)
The way every gossip news outlet ran the same “Nicola confirmed her relationship” story with the same headline and the same anonymous quote
The weirdly devoted, intensely defensive jakolas/Jake stans that seem to care about nothing but Jake/jakola out of nowhere and love screaming at and stirring up shit with lukolas
The chaos and constant discussion of all of this over the past 6+ months
The absolute inconsistency of any of this with anything in the top group
So, this mystery just gets deeper and deeper, and none of it makes sense. Every time I’d try to accept that they were just seeing these other people, something would bump in my head. There were just too many weird things that didn’t quite make sense and the biggest, weirdest one of them all was that NICOLA AND LUKE ARE CLEARLY IN LOVE WITH EACH OTHER.
So while the pieces would always almost fit, the puzzle never quite took shape. Until two nights ago when I stumbled on @lukolafan ’s page after they liked one of my posts. I scrolled down their page and found a link labeled “Lukola PR Strategies and Fake Narratives.” I cannot scream this loudly enough. GO VISIT THAT LINK!!!!! (I’ll add the links myself later if I have time.)
I did and it led to a series of Reddit posts taking an academic approach to teaching us, the general public (and lukola fans) PR Media Literacy. Among the various topics it discussed were things like:
“PR Firms and Entertainment Media: Coordinating “News” Across Gossip, Entertainment, and Official Publications,” which talks about using anonymous sources, more about staged paparazzi, and repeated narratives (“outlets echo identical stories, reinforcing PR-approved messaging, for example, multiple outlets platforms describing a celebrity ‘rising above’ a controversy, quoting the same anonymous insider” – Sound familiar?)
“The Invisible Hand of Celebrity Privacy: How PR Fabricates Narratives and Manipulates Fans,” which includes ways that PR strategies intentionally manipulate fans to fight/debate celebs faking relationships, and more (sound familiar?)
There’s honestly so much meat in all of these (there are a couple others as well) that they are ALL worth reading. There is definitely some repetition, but still, the content is super insightful and revealing and can help us all be more savvy consumers of media.
But I want to focus on two CRITICAL posts, in particular.
“The Role of Staged Paparazzi and Gossip Outlets in Celebrity PR Campaigns”
The first part of this piece talks about the method for staging fake paparazzi photos to create narratives. Two items of particular note (and I’m excerpting directly):
Quality Control of the Image: While professional photographers use high-quality cameras, staged paparazzi photos are intentionally manipulated to appear grainy or blurry. This adds a layer of authenticity to the photo, making it look as though the photographer stumbled upon the celebrity by chance.
Extra Figures in the Background: Another key tactic in staged paparazzi photos involves the use of background extras—people who might be walking with dogs, pushing strollers, or simply in the vicinity.
Think of Nicola’s photos walking home with Jake, a woman walking a dog behind them. Some of them are clear, but some are quite grainy, despite the fact that professional photographers have great equipment and are more than capable of taking a night-time shot.
Another excerpt…
Gossip Outlets: DeuxMoi and the Symbiotic Relationship with PR Firms
With the rise of user-generated content and anonymously submitted tips, gossip websites have become integral to the modern celebrity PR machine. Sites like DeuxMoi thrive on rumors and speculation, providing a platform for fans and anonymous sources to share celebrity gossip. PR teams exploit these platforms to feed their desired narratives without appearing to directly control the flow of information.
How Gossip Sites Like DeuxMoi Work:
Anonymous Tips and Leaks: PR teams often send anonymous tips to gossip outlets, offering details about celebrity activities or sightings. These tips are deliberately vague, leaving room for interpretation and speculation. Once posted on sites like DeuxMoi, the stories tend to snowball as they are shared across social media and republished by larger outlets.
Fueling Speculation: These posts generate buzz and speculation, keeping celebrities in the public eye without any direct confirmation. Gossip sites become a key player in amplifying the narrative, as fans, influencers, and media outlets continue to discuss and spread the information.
Mutual Benefits: While gossip sites operate independently, there is a mutual benefit to the relationship between them and PR teams. Gossip sites thrive on traffic and engagement, while PR teams can ensure their client’s name stays relevant in the public discourse. By subtly feeding stories, PR teams maintain control over how their celebrity’s narrative unfolds.
The piece goes on to give specific examples like Kendall Jenner and Bad Bunny, Tomdaya, Gigi Hadad and Zayne Malik, etc. then talks about fake fan interactions and how to spot them.
It offers key questions to ask about the photos you see (like what story is it telling and why and who benefits?) and then it gives this example. If your ears aren’t already fully perked, this will do it:
Example: 37-Year-Old Famous Actress and 24-Year-Old Lesser-Known Celebrity
Narrative of Romance or Distraction: In this case, the 37-year-old actress is likely fueling rumors of a relationship with the 24-year-old to either distract from something else in her personal life (like a real romantic partner) or to refresh her public image. The younger celebrity could be hired to play a temporary love interest or interest figure in the media, leading people to speculate whether they are more than just friends.
Creating a Romance or Mystery: The photo of them walking arm-in-arm, laughing, or holding hands might suggest that a romantic connection exists. This could be used to make the actress seem more relatable, desirable, or single, even if there is no romantic involvement behind the scenes.
Diverting Public Focus: If the actress is privately in a relationship with another celebrity or involved in an ongoing controversy, the staged photo with the younger celebrity helps to deflect attention. By inserting a "mystery romance," the public is more interested in who the new partner is, leaving the actress’s real partner or issues to stay out of the spotlight.
PR Stunt to Revitalize Publicity: The actress might not just be looking for romantic gossip but also fresh exposure. A curated paparazzi shot could serve as a PR tool to keep the actress's name in circulation—be it through romantic rumors, new partnerships, or simply new media content to fuel speculation.
Potential Body Double for Real Partner: If the real partner is shying away from the public eye or trying to avoid the media, the younger celebrity might act as a "body double" or decoy. This helps maintain an image of the actress being in a public relationship, while allowing her to keep the real relationship.
Don’t think I need to explain the relevance of this very specific example. There’s a lot more in the post, but I’ll move on for now to the next key post.
“Breadcrumbing and Coordinated Campaigns”
In this piece, they offer first some key breadcrumbing tactics, many of which sound awfully familiar.
Common Types of Breadcrumbs:
Cryptic Social Media Posts: Celebrities post vague messages or abstract references, sparking fan theories. Example: Harry Styles posts cryptic images or quotes, prompting speculation.
Coordinated Social Media Timing: PR teams synchronize posts to create the illusion of a shared narrative. Example: Taylor Swift and Karlie Kloss posted similar content at the same time, fueling relationship rumors.
Accidental Social Media Interactions: Liking posts or commenting on ambiguous tweets creates intimacy and speculation. Example: Kendall Jenner engages with fans on social media, fueling rumors.
Seemingly Innocent Photos: Casual photos subtly hint at a larger narrative. Example: Zendaya and Tom Holland posted photos together, teasing their relationship.
Cryptic? Like Bless the Telephone? Or a mysterious left-handed guy holding a phone in the background while Nic gets ready?
Synchronized like Nic and Jake at that restaurant? Or as far as that goes, like Nic and Luke with the S4 selfie?
Accidental social media interactions? I didn’t go into that here, but we’ve seen lots of odd likes and things, lots of Nic interactions, oh, and those RW and SL likes of late.
Seemingly innocent photos. Like very happy looking S4 pics and the “now it’s yours” BTS photo?
Perhaps most of this could be interpreted as just genuine fan interaction and fan service, which I think it is to some extent. It’s a natural part of the business. But it’s also very often done with intention.
But here’s the more important part of this piece. It gives some case studies (Ben and JLo, Shawn and Camila), then it gives two “abstract” examples.
YOU’LL LOVE THIS. Note that the second example changes to an actor and a musician, but don’t let that fool you. Keep reading for some unmistakable specifics.
Breadcrumbing with a Fake PR Girlfriend: Case Study of Celebrity 007
For Celebrity 007, breadcrumbing is used to create a false narrative about a relationship with a PR girlfriend. This helps maintain fan interest while deflecting attention from the celebrity’s true personal life.
How It Works:
First Breadcrumbs: The PR strategy begins with posts from both the celebrity and the PR girlfriend, hinting at a connection without confirming it. Example: Celebrity 007 posts a picture from a Paris restaurant or cafe in LA and the PR girlfriend shares a similar post from the same location but from a different day with different white trucks in the background (double check the Instyle Stunt images!!!)
Expanding the Narrative: Shared travel posts and indirect interactions continue the illusion of a relationship. Example: Matching geo-tags in posts from Rome suggest they were there together.
Indirect Engagement: Likes, comments, and ambiguous interactions increase intrigue without confirming the relationship. Example: The PR girlfriend comments, “Great to be here with you! 💖,” on Celebrity 007's post.
Paparazzi Shots: Carefully timed candid shots further reinforce the illusion of a relationship. Example: Paparazzi photos of Celebrity 007 and the PR girlfriend walking hand-in-hand, fueling speculation.
Note:
Café in LA, same location, different trucks?
Matching tags in Rome?
Likes and ambiguous interactions
Carefully timed (say at a premiere party) candid paparazzi shops w gf walking hand-in-hand
And then there’s the next one. In the interest of length since this is already hella long, I’ve removed some less relevant parts, but I encourage you to read it yourself.
Breadcrumbing to Hide a Real Relationship: Case Study of Celebrity 009
Why Hide the True Relationship?
In celebrity culture, the decision to keep a relationship private—or hidden—can be a strategic move, driven by a mix of personal privacy and professional interests. Some celebrities may choose to share their personal lives openly, but for others, particularly those who value their privacy or wish to control their public image, keeping a relationship private is key. This is especially relevant for two celebrities who are romantically involved but prefer to maintain discretion, despite public curiosity about their relationship.
Whether it’s a high-profile couple like Beyoncé and Jay-Z, or a less conspicuous pairing, the decision to hide the true nature of a romantic relationship often involves balancing personal desires with career strategy. In this scenario, let’s explore why two celebrities might choose to keep their relationship under wraps and the complex PR considerations that lead them to do so.
Media Scrutiny/Escaping Constant Surveillance: Navigating the Spotlight Together (I’ve combined two sections here for length)
When two celebrities become romantically involved, the media will inevitably take notice. The relationship can quickly become the focal point of constant headlines, paparazzi photos, and gossip columns. For celebrities who value their privacy, this level of scrutiny can feel overwhelming, as every public appearance or moment shared can quickly turn into speculation, even if the couple doesn’t wish to attract attention.
Romanticized Expectations: The Pressure of Perfection
Media scrutiny often creates an unrealistic, romanticized version of a celebrity relationship. Fans and the public tend to project their fantasies onto famous couples, imagining them as the perfect, unbreakable pairing. The real complexities of a relationship—differences, compromises, and struggles—often don't fit neatly into the idealized narratives created by the public.
For a couple like Actor A and Musician B, the pressure to live up to these idealized expectations can be exhausting. By choosing to keep their relationship private, they can avoid the constant pressure to fit into a preconceived mold. Hiding the relationship from public view allows them to keep things grounded and avoid being turned into a media spectacle.
Brand Control: Managing the Image of "Singleness" or "Availability"
For many celebrities, their public image is closely tied to their brand, and that brand may depend on their perceived "availability" or their status as desirable, unattached individuals. The way the public perceives a celebrity’s romantic life—whether they are single, dating, or in a long-term relationship—can have a significant impact on their professional success and marketability.
Creating Room for Desire: The Allure of the Single Celebrity
Consider Actor A, a leading man known for portraying romantic heroes on screen. The public’s perception of Actor A as a single, unattainable figure is key to their marketability, both in the media and as a brand. If they were to publicly reveal a relationship with Musician B, it could diminish that aura of unattainability. Similarly, Musician B may want to maintain a flirtatious public persona, which could be undermined if they were publicly involved with someone. By keeping the relationship private, both celebrities retain the allure of being desirable and unattached, feeding into the fantasies of their fans.
Avoiding the "Couple" Brand: Risk of Being Reduced to a Package Deal
When a high-profile couple’s relationship is made public, they may become known less for their individual work and more for their collective identity as a couple. In some cases, the couple's public appearances or shared brand messages may overshadow their individual projects. Think of Beyoncé and Jay-Z, who have an incredibly powerful couple brand that often eclipses their solo endeavors in the media. For celebrities like Actor A and Musician B, the fear of being seen as a "package deal" might drive them to hide their relationship. This allows both to maintain their distinct identities, keeping their projects and brands separate and preventing the public from viewing them solely as a pair.
Respecting Boundaries: The Vulnerability of Celebrity Relationships
Even when two celebrities are involved, the vulnerabilities of a relationship can become the focus of media attention if they go public. Romantic relationships—especially those in the high-pressure world of celebrity—are often fraught with ups and downs. The public might demand to know every detail, fueling rumors of breakups, infidelities, or relationship drama. By keeping their romance under wraps, Actor A and Musician B can avoid becoming the subject of constant gossip and can maintain some semblance of normalcy in their private lives.
Avoiding Disruptive Publicity
Celebrity relationships often attract media scrutiny not only about their romantic lives but also about how their relationship affects their careers. The public and the media often delve into the smallest details, speculating about how the relationship might impact their professional trajectories, previous relationships, or future projects.
Career Disruption: The Challenge of Balancing Love and Work
For celebrities like Musician B, a new relationship can take attention away from their upcoming album release or concert tour. The media’s obsession with their personal life might overshadow the launch of a new professional project. Similarly, if Actor A is in the middle of promoting a film or preparing for a big role, the press could focus more on their relationship than their craft, disrupting the flow of their work.
I won’t bother reviewing the relevance of all of the above. I’m sure you can see it plainly for yourself. The examples are absolutely, positively referencing Nicola and Luke, and the reasons for hiding it are super relevant. Especially boundaries, disruption, pressure to be perfect, and being reduced to a package deal.
Now at this point, it’s worth asking the question, do we trust this source? I don’t actually know who posted this content, so I can’t verify their credentials. Perhaps this is yet another PR person’s tricky efforts to continually confuse us and keep us guessing? That seems unlikely since the entire purpose is to help lift the veil on all the other tricks. If you wanted the other tricks to be effective, you’d hardly be revealing them to your target audiences.
But even setting that very logical assumption aside, the reason I know with every fiber of my being that it’s true is that this is literally the only version of events that makes sense of absolutely everything.
All those mysterious and confusing signals, all those weird photos and changes in behavior, all the inconsistencies between what we all saw with our own eyes (they are IN LOVE) and what we saw subsequently with the adjacents, all the tiny Lukola crumbs keeping us hanging on, and all the fandom bickering, especially from bizarrely rabid jakolas.
Every bit of it makes complete sense if we accept that Nic, Luke, and their PR teams have been using a classic PR handbook to distract us from the very real truth that they are together and in love.
Does it hurt to know we’ve been manipulated? You bet it does! But I quickly accepted that because I was so happy to have the truth verified at last. And because I understand why they would do it.
Relationships are hard enough when lived in private. No relationship, no matter how much people love each other, is without challenge. Even soulmates have issues to navigate. Can you imagine the pressure on them if the whole world was watching?
And their lives have added challenges. Travel and separation. Long work schedules that may often be at odds. Possibly romantic scenes with future co-stars that could stir up uncomfortable feelings. Career ups and downs that may not always synch up. Fans and media watching their every move, dissecting them, judging them, rooting for them, and just putting massive pressure on them. What if they fail? They’re letting down the whole world, not just themselves.
And what about Nic’s longstanding demand for privacy? And her emphasis that no woman is just some dude’s girlfriend. She wants to be known for her own work and achievement and passions, not for who she dates or marries. Even if it is wonderful Luke.
Likewise, Luke is just now achieving a newfound level of success. This is a moment for him to seize and make the most of. Being a hot, sexy, ostensibly single guy is good for his brand right now. Even if we know he loves Nicola, his stans need to be able to fantasize about him, which is easier if his relationship is unconfirmed.
And let’s face it, if they come out as a couple, IT WILL BE LUKOLA all the time. That will be the story. Certainly if they’d come out during the World Tour, every question at every stop would be about them and their personal “friends to lovers story.” It would be irresistible to reporters. Too good a story to ignore. And they’d spend way more time talking about their personal lives than about their work. Does that sound like something either of them would want?
And one last thing. Back to their changes in behavior. Does it make more sense that Nicola, who has always been super private about her love life, would suddenly be willing to be photographed constantly with her new bf Jake? Or that Jake is not her bf and she’s keeping her actual bf (or fiancé or husband) secret?
Meanwhile, Luke, who has always been open about his relationships in the past suddenly decides to tighten up and share absolutely nothing about his private life? Well, that makes complete sense if he’s now in a relationship with a woman who is famously private and shares not one word publicly. Suddenly, literally everything makes sense and is entirely consistent.
So there it is, folks. To me, this is the Holy Grail. There’s not a doubt left in my mind about them. They’re together and everything else – literally everything else – is a decoy and a distraction, and every bit of it comes straight from the PR playbook.
I’d like to maintain a sliver of hope that they’re leaving much of it to their teams and they’re not in on the worst of it, but in any case, I don’t blame them one bit for trying to protect their love. It’s too special to let it be destroyed by public consumption. You gotta do what you gotta do.
Given that I don’t actually know them and haven’t confirmed anything directly, I’ll leave 1.5% room for doubt, and adjust my certainty to 98.5%.
And you may dismiss all of this and draw very different conclusions, which is okay, too. But if I’m being really honest, I’m actually 1,000% sure. And I couldn’t be happier for them.
What do we do now? That’s up to each of us. Personally, I’m going to be blissfully happy for them, not sweat any of the distractions, let them live as quietly as they like, and patiently await the day (whether it’s very soon or far in the future) when they finally go public. I hope you’ll do the same.
And until then, I’m going to keep watching Lukola videos on repeat.
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leafatlaw · 3 days ago
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Sorry still thinking about Derap after that stream and- “Do you care about me or mapicc more?” Because what a stupid question, you shouldn’t ask people questions like that and expect an answer. It’s rude and hurtful, it’s only going to make everybody feel worse, because there is a wrong answer here, at least for Derap there is.
Because Derap probably cares about Zam more than anyone on the server. He cares about Atlas more than anything on the server. And he’s scared. Deraps a smart guy, he knows abit of how much Zam cares about Mapicc, he knows abit of their history. He knows just enough to know Mapicc is a threat to how much Zam cares about him. Like I’ve said in another post, Deraps really only got Zam, and he knows this, hence why he keeps testing him and quizzing him on everything. He’s trying to force Zam closer to him. He wants Zam to care about him as much as he cares about him. If not more.
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ghostlycod · 18 hours ago
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Saw your post about asks, and I feel in the same boat, so I thought if it's okay, I'd send you an ask. I've just flattered through your page, and I love your style.
1) Finding the perfect gift for any of the 141 members for Christmas.
2) Secretly placing mistletoe somewhere on base for Ghost to find.
Your writes are amazing, glad I found you! X
[[Thank you, babes!!!! Ah! Hi!
this is so relevant for me rn because I’m currently struggling to find my boyfriend the perfect Christmas gift lol]]
ghost - your first thought is to get him more masks, but everyone always gets him more masks. no, it should be something special. something personal. you don’t realize that for him, you’ve already given him the best gift: a Christmas that he doesn’t have to spend alone. a Christmas that he gets to spend with someone who really loves him. a Christmas that quiet and peaceful, with no yelling voices or thrown objects. a Christmas that’s warm and loving, with sneaky mistletoe kisses in the randomest of places and cozy socks. you’ve already given him exactly what he wanted and needed, anything else you get him is just a bonus.
price - seeing you enjoy the gifts he got you just to spoil you is enough for him. he doesn’t want anything else- no really, love. just wanna see you happy. but a nice case for his favorite vintage gun in his collection wouldn’t be too bad, or his favorite very nice cologne that always makes you want to bury your nose in his shirts and burn the scent on the inside your nostrils, or an expensive watch since that’s always his go-to accessory when dressing up
gaz - whatever he gets you is always so nice, always exactly what you needed, that it puts so much pressure on what to get him. he has to absolutely love it, just like you love whatever he gets you. box tickets to his favorite sporting event is up there for one of the best gifts he could be given, but I personally am a “gaz loves self care” truther. I think his guilty pleasure is skin care, a face mask every now and again (and a facial on you every now and again), and he likes very nice, soft lounge clothes to relax in when he’s at home. any of that kind of stuff would be great, but if you got him a couple’s spa day/massage gift certificate he would be over the moon.
soap - loves a joke gift. you could get him the sweetest, most personalized thing that you put so much time and energy and love into, and he would love it!! but he also would quickly forget about it and become obsessed with the pet treat launcher that you got as a joke gift. watching your very food-motivated dog/cat skid across the floor of your shared flat as they chase treats launched at high speed from the device in his hands is, frankly, hilarious. he will be doing that all day. best gift ever.
and I’ll just say it: any and every one of these guys would not complain about opening a box of lingerie from you on Christmas morning. especially if they get to see you model it for them, like, right now.
[[and thank you so much again for this request!!!]]
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zanarkandfayth · 2 days ago
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I'm just answering these because I want to, and skipping the ones that wouldn't be relevant or I don't feel like answering lmao
01. How many fics have you worked on since January? Hmm, five? I finished the Noct & Gladio one, I've been working on the rewrite of the aftermath one, I started the one inspired by @quartzguts fic Lost Signal (go fucking read this if you haven't), I did some more backstory for the college au, and I edited the secret one.
02. What’s something new that you tried in a fic this year? I've been trying to do a sliiiightly closer POV than before. I think it came out nicely enough in the Noct & Gladio fic. Definitely a challenge for me though.
05. What ships captured your heart? Ignoct still has my heart forever and always, but I've definitely had a growing fondness for Gladnoct. More platonic than romantic but I don't mind the romantic.
07. Did you write for any new fandoms or ships this year? I mean I guess the Noct & Gladio fic is the first time I've written a fic centered on the two of them. I thought about writing a fic for Sword AF, and for Breath of the Wild, but I didn't. I'm unlikely to for either fandom, tbh. Too many for ffxv to focus on.
08. What fic meant the most to you to write? Aftermath fic, even though I'm not finished with it. I've been basically writing it since 2019 and it's the most in-depth fic I've ever written and I've put so much fucking work into it and it's over 600K I'm super proud of it even if it's slowly killing me and the fandom will be 100% dead by the time I'm done.
09. What fic made you feel the happiest to work on? college au, my self-indulgent beloved. I have no idea if I'll ever successfully write you, but I love you nonetheless.
10. What fic was the most satisfying to finish writing? lmao I only finished the Noct & Gladio one so I guess that by default.
11. What fic was the most difficult to write? the one inspired by Lost Signal. I have it all plotted out and I'm excited to write it but fuuuuck when I tried back in the summer it was not cooperating. and then writer's block just came knocking in general. I've got one finished chapter and I low-key hate it so I'm trying to ease back into things with working on my rewrite of aftermath fic before I attempt this fic again.
12. What fic was the easiest to write? I mean the Noct & Gladio one was pretty easy to write once I kicked my own ass and stopped procrastinating on the battle scene lol.
14. What were your go-to writing songs? I like to listen to a lot of EDM stuff. Especially Industrial but other stuff too. KMFDM, Assemblage 23, Lost Signal, Neuroticfish, Rotersand, Seabound, Lionhearts, Covenant, Wolfsheim, Acretongue, Michael FK... I also listened to Linkin Park and the Ori and the Blind Forest soundtrack.
15. What was the hardest fic to title? only two fics got titled this year... the secret one I ain't sharing lmao and the Noct & Gladio one, which was actually hard to title. Ameliorate. It fits but I kinda hate it ngl. I couldn't think of anything better. I still can't. It's whatever.
16. What's your favorite title of the year? the secret one. I'm so mean for it but as soon as I was done editing I knew I HAD to make that the title. I'm sorry my beloved blorbo. it was just too perfect lmao. one of my mutuals knows what I'm talking about XD it's all good.
21. What's something that surprised you while you were working on a fic? Did it change the story? my ass in 2019: I already wrote a lot of Noct dissociating in Under Grey Skies, I don't need to do it in aftermath fic. my ass in 2024: huh, Noct doesn't dissociate enough in this fic. soooo I guess now that's gonna be a thing. it has very much changed the story, several scenes have been changed/added for it and I'm not entirely sure where I'm going with it yet but that's why I'm writing without posting for now. wasn't expecting to do it but we'll see what happens.
22. What writing programs did you use? Did you write by hand? no to by hand, I only sometimes do that for notes/plotting. I use scrivener <3333 I bit the bullet at the start of this year and used the money I had left from selling my car/after buying a freezer to upgrade to scrivener 3 and though I miss some things from scrivener 1, I mostly like it. I've gotten a lot more into the organisational features and it's been a godsend for making the rewrite of aftermath manageable.
25. How did you recharge between fics? Killed myself 100%ing breath of the wild. including all 900 fucking korok seeds. and then started playing tears of the kingdom with the intention of 100%ing that too but fuck me upgrading the armour was such a fucking slog even with duping diamonds for rupees and I still don't even have all of the sets collected and the koroks are more annoying this time and hhhhhhh I went back to fic to recharge from that fucking game.
28. If this were an awards show, who would you thank? @ivorydice for letting me endlessly ramble about my fics and helping me with plotting some of them. @quartzguts for writing an amazing fic that has inspired me with one of my own that I will write and finish eventually hrgh. @smallest-turtle for also letting me ramble that one time and for stabbing me in the heart with painful headcanons that made me think more about my own. literally anyone who's read my fics regardless of whether they've left kudos or comments or bookmarked them. anyone who talks to me. anyone who likes my venting as support. all my mutuals for being my mutuals even if we've never had a single interaction.
29. What's left on your to-do list for 2024? to just keep pecking away at the rewrite of aftermath fic. by the end of today I should have 38 of 62 chapters rewritten... send help T^T
30. What would you like to write next year? I just wanna finish aftermath fic for the love of god. pls. also the fic inspired by Lost Signal, and I'd like to maaaaaaaybe (big maybe) write a companion fic to the Noct & Gladio fic, showing Ignis & Prompto's hunt, but I don't actually have any ideas for it rn. so we'll see.
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A slightly revised version of last year's questions! Two ways to play: Reblog and have your followers send you numbers, or answer the whole list!
How many fics have you worked on since January?
What’s something new that you tried in a fic this year?
What piece of media inspired you the most? (This can be the fandom you wrote the most for, the one that spawned the most ideas, the one you thought about the most, etc.)
How many fandoms did you write for this year?
What ships captured your heart?
What characters captured your heart?
Did you write for any new fandoms or ships this year?
What fic meant the most to you to write?
What fic made you feel the happiest to work on?
What fic was the most satisfying to finish writing?
What fic was the most difficult to write?
What fic was the easiest to write?
What were your shortest and longest fics posted this year?
What were your go-to writing songs?
What was the hardest fic to title?
What's your favorite title of the year?
Share your favorite opening line
Share your favorite ending line
Share your favorite piece of dialogue
Share your funniest line
What's something that surprised you while you were working on a fic? Did it change the story?
What writing programs did you use? Did you write by hand?
If you had to choose one, what was THE most satisfying writing moment of your year?
Did you do anything special to celebrate finishing a fic?
How did you recharge between fics?
Did you create fanworks other than fic?
How many events did you take part in? (bangs, exchanges, ship weeks, zines, prompt memes, they all count!)
If this were an awards show, who would you thank?
What's left on your to-do list for 2024?
What would you like to write next year?
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bonefall · 2 days ago
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will gorse and lizard stay in thunderclan in BB?
(Magic 8Ball Voice) It seems likely
This is with caveats though-- I'm committed to two major changes;
Gorseclaw was previously cut from the LakexLizard litter, because the Dapple/Hare/Soft survivor drama works a lot better with only three very relevant siblings
Lizardtail and Hollowflight were merged into Hallowflight, a Dark Forest trainee who swam across the lake to warn the Clans that the DF was planning to attack kittens
Hallowflight is going to be the one who goes down in a fight with Splashstar, Harelight is staying alive in BB. Whether his dad sacrificed himself for him, or he's just watched another family member get bled dry by a tyrant, Harelight's done with RiverClan. In BB!TBC, he went into the Dark Forest to fight Ashfur as a Light in the Mist. So this is the loss of a very significant warrior.
Gorseclaw... for one, if they come back, they are going to get a Conflict Rename. There's a much more significant historical figure named Gorseclaw (adopted brother of Ripplestar), so this Gorseclaw needs a new one. There's also enough Gorse suffixes, imo.
For two, I don't want to put them back into HallowxLake's litter. I just don't need him there when Harelight being the last survivor of his family works so well, both for bloodline diversity and for the drama.
SO I'm thinking of aging Gorseclaw down to kitten or apprentice during BB!ASC, and having them be the child of Harelight. Part of the choice of moving Clans being, "I will not have my only child become a warrior for the Clan that killed its whole family."
If so, then I might change Gorseclaw to Coarseclaw, a reference to their fur texture and an indirect naming for their dead auncles. The litter all had matching hair names before Harelight got an Honor Title-- Dappletuft, Softpelt, Harefur.
There will also probably be further population shuffles, both for RiverClan and elsewhere. ThunderClan does NOT need Wafflepaw. They barely even use Stormcloud and they JUST got Sunbeam too. Finish what's on your plate before you get second helpings of fresh outsider cats
At the end of BB!ASC, I want an exodus from RiverClan. Some from other Clans will join, but many will leave. There needs to be lasting consequences from this arc, right now it honestly feels like the writing team has set it up so there won't be, and that's frustrating.
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laauranenn · 2 days ago
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in wbk fandom you can't have conversation about the writing, development and complexity, this fandom is overprotective about nii's mid writing, Any comments about his flaw in writing characters or this plot will be shut down , fandom only cares about shipping and yaoi
the side characters especially umemiya are well fleshed out with detailed backstories , everything in the plot literally revolve around umemiya , the antagonists like choji and chika revolved around their obsession with ume , tsubakino and sugishita backstories included ume too ,nii is focusing on exploring umemiya and his past more than his mc Sakura
Nii can't make Sakura the center of the plot, the plot always revolves around the side cast and their issues ,while the problem Sakura has with trusting people has been addressed and nearly settled, the root cause is still left in the wind. It feels like the issue was addressed, but Sakura himself specifically never got his past elaborated on, but there is prime opportunity for angst and character moments, as well as just humanizing Sakura.
Thank you so much for responding!!
When I said I want to have a conversation, I meant it!! I agree that when you've got a fandom for something, the fans tend to be protective of the media and its author, and that shipping is something that is very prominent in fandom spaces.
But for the sake of this conversation, I'm going to do my best to ignore shipping that isn't confirmed or implied in the manga, and I'm going to acknowledge flaws in the writing if the points you bring up are convincing!
(If it becomes relevant, I'll only bring up things such as Endo and Takiishi's relationship and Tsubaki's affection for Umemiya, but I don't think they'll be something I need to really get into. )
I disagree with all the plot revolving solely around Umemiya, despite how relevant he is to most arcs in the manga.
The reason that Umemiya is so relevant, and is so present in the story, is because Sakura is going to take his spot someday. Sakura comes to Furin intending to take the top spot, a position that is currently filled by Umemiya.
For Sakura to make it to the top and it mean something, we need to understand what the position truly entails, and how it came to be. Which is what all the information we get on Umemiya is for. We're learning of his journey to the top and how he has shaped the world and its inhabitants.
For Choji and the Shishitoren arc, I'd like to argue that his obsession with Umemiya is about his position, and not about Umemiya himself. Choji and Umemiya are essentially in the same position, just in different teams. Which is why Choji focuses on Umemiya the way he does.
Choji and Togame share the same notion of power being a means to freedom. Choji latches onto this and decides that he wants to be the strongest, and therefore the freest. But when he reaches his goal of being the strongest, it turns out to not be like how he imagined, and the team takes a turn for the worst because of this.
Umemiya, however, is the strongest of his team. Yet he isn't experiencing the same boredom and despair as Choji is, despite being at the top. This is what Choji is so focused on. It's less about Umemiya as a person and is instead about the position he's in.
Sakura does also play an important role in the Shishitoren arc. The whole conflict likely wouldn't have started, or wouldn't have gone the way it did if it weren't for Sakura being there. Without him, the conflict likely would've been resolved differently.
Sakura and Togame's fight is important for both characters. For Sakura, he has a fight with someone where they both respect each other, likely for the first time. And for Togame, Sakura opens his eyes to the ways he's been acting, the ways he's gone against his own beliefs in order to salvage what is left of Shishitoren.
As for Tsubakino and Sugishita, they've both known him for years and he's played an important part in their lives.
For Tsubakino, Umemiya has been his friend since their first year in junior high. He learns that Tsubakino just wants to be himself and love the things he loves, which Umemiya praises him for, and tells him he's going to help back him up if someone tries to hurt him again. And they've been close friends all the way to where we currently are in the manga! Umemiya shows up in Tsubakino's story because he's relevant. It'd also be a little strange for Tsubakino to be one of the four kings without Umemiya showing up somehow, don't you think?
And with Sugishita, Umemiya also plays a similar role. Sugishita gets himself stuck in a spiral of meaningless fights he doesn't even want to be a part of, which Umemiya then saves him from. Umemiya saves him and brings him the peace he wants. This then manifests into his loyalty to Umemiya, as well as his friendship with the four kings.
With Sugishita, this also gives us insight into why he seems to hate Sakura so much. From the start we've known the main reason for it, which is Sakura aiming for Umemiya's spot in the school. But with the most recent chapters, we see why exactly he is so offended by this idea. Umemiya brought Sugishita peace, something that Sakura is actively disrupting. How could someone like Sakura, who's constantly snapping at people, and running into fights possibly measure up to Umemiya and what he's done for Sugishita?
It adds another layer to Sakura and Sugishita's rivalry, which I find incredibly interesting!
It's true that a lot of side characters are getting detailed backstories, while Sakura hasn't really had one yet. But in my opinion, this works out nicely with the way it's executed. It adds to the worldbuilding and makes the characters and the town feel more real, more solid.
I've really enjoyed learning about all the characters, as well as their relationships with each other. It makes Makochi and Furin feel like actual places with actual people, rather than just something that's there to only serve the main character.
As for Sakura's lack of backstory? I can see why you're itching for one, but I can't see it fitting into the story well if we got it right now. I also don't think that there even is a lot to it, not a lot to tell. We've already got a lot of info about Sakura and why he is the way he is, even without a proper backstory.
Even the first chapter makes Sakura's past very clear. He's a boy who's been mistreated for his looks for his entire life. It's brought up a couple times in the first few chapters even.
"How ya look doesn't matter in a fight, that's why I came to Furin"
"This is more like it. This is the right reaction. Everyone is always pushing me away, rejecting me, dismissing me-"
Sakura is someone who's been isolated growing up. This shines through in the way he interacts with others. Sakura is much more confident in a fight, he handles himself better in a fight. But when he interacts with others in a casual setting, he stumbles and gets flustered easily. A lot of the things that show just how alone he's been are subtle or might even be played as jokes, such as the only contact in his phone being a bot that gives you the weather forecast for the day. He also takes things literally. This could be just a trait of his, but it's likely a result of his lack of experience in social situations.
It's a lot of little things that add up. He's slow at texting because he's had nobody to text. He holds a spoon weirdly, likely because nobody corrected him growing up. Doesn't know how to open a Ramune bottle as he's never had one before. (This last one could also just be coincidence, but it all does still add up.)
I'm satisfied with how much we know about Sakura, but I'd love to hear what you'd like to get from a Sakura backstory!! Because it is true we haven't gotten a lot of info on where he was before Makochi.
The lack of backstory for him is because Wind Breaker isn't about his past, it's about him moving forward from it. It's about how Sakura makes a space for himself in Makochi. It's a story about him being accepted, about how a boy hated by all others becomes the hero of the town!
Please do respond again!! Share what you think of what I've said and give me your own observations! I'd love to keep the conversation going :)!!
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master-jarrus · 3 days ago
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Yeah, I'm probably going to mix my headcanons in a lot
I know in the fanfic I will for sure have Kai's and Nya's discussions at least partially in there. Zane may be more of a mention because we don't need a full run down of the biological process for the story telling. Garmadon's and Mystaké's I will have in length a long with Misako approaching him and him just shutting down any potential for a puberty talk and she just laughs and comforts him.
I may have like a small epilogue or actual continuation of him actually going through it but I'm not certain yet
.
My relevant headcanons:
The spijitzu brothers have mothers but different moms
Garmadon is 1/4 dragon 3/4 oni, I hc Mystake as his mom
Wu I go back and forth on. I feel like he would have a human mother
(I think the egg thing is funny though and I would do it if I gave him a dragon mom and if I did give a dragon mom I'd probably have it be a taboo thing with one of the source dragons)
Lloyd is 1/8 dragon 3/8 oni and half human but the non human is stronger presenting because him suppressing the behaviors and traits came later
Theres some biology headcanons based off of lizards and octopi but I'm going to leave that as a mention in this post
(also because I know some one want to know why I even came up with the hc. I simply got too into world building while trying to shut down intrusive thoughts)
After puberty instincts start to kick up a lot
I hc that Lloyd had a long and delayed puberty so the instincts didn't really get him until beginning of Sog and even then they were fairly mild. Crystalized is when they really started to present and he was fighting to suppress them which was part of his valid moodiness
I think Dragons and Onis have mating seasons and they actually tend to overlap
I think physically Lloyd's oni form is actually a little more comfortable for him but he'd be most comfy in his in between form (in between dragon, oni and human)
However mentally human form is most comfortable. He's just familiar with it, he doesn't feel the confliction of looking like his dad, he doesn't worry about his friends hating him over his appearance (we know they wouldn't but Lloyd would be insecure about that)
Dragon form, oni form, in between form, and his human are all his "true" form. They are all truly Lloyd it's just a matter of how he chooses to present himself
In my mind though human form feels too small or even "itchy" (that's probably because I'm autistic with chronic pain that gets so bad my body just registers it as phantom limbs though)
Lloyd is exceptionally pretty by oni and dragon standards but he's a little small for dragons taste
Oni's decorate themselves with shiny rocks and pretty plants during courting so him being completely gold is very appealing to them
Dragons are indifferent to his gold color because it's not that rare but they are interested in any patterns and contrasting colors, also large horns and wings. Also the elemental powers they are connected too play a part in choosing a mate
Puberty must've been wild for Lloyd
Not because he didn't know what to expect but because he probably got multiple versions of "The Talk" and isn't even sure what is supposed to be happening anymore
Because like he probably got the human version of "The Talk" from all of the ninja
Nya also probably tried giving him a small summary of what girls went through when he asked about the period products in the bathroom one time
(Like an awkward "Well you know how the guys warned you about how your body has chanhed? Girls bodies change too but we get periods which is bleeding down there about once a month" while they are both wishing they never said anything in the first place)
Zane probably gave Lloyd like a full human biology lesson on it
Then Garmadon would've talked to Lloyd and was honest that he doesn't know what was puberty and what might've been from the venom. Not to mention he's not human so some things must be at least a little different
Then Mystaké probably got her hands on Lloyd and gave him a run down of what onis go through which probably left him super confused because what does she mean "horns are for displaying?" And "longer fangs are more desirable?"
Like theres no way he kept track of all the info
And he had plenty of ideas of what to expect but also none at all
And then when things just started happening he just went "this is probably normal" and decided to ignore it
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yanmuffins · 2 days ago
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also, another thing (yes, i'm trying to procastinate again and then making u bear with me rambling) I love to draw reader wearing alternative clothing, or sometimes, just some tomboyish, lil' punk inspired style
idk, I feel like it gives some more life at them or smth
we both know that I usually prefer to draw the reader fem, but If i, someday, decide to draw them male or just gn, I think I would still insist in something different from the usual
idk, for male I would probably draw them in more fem styled clothing, throw some pink around and poke at skirts and maybe some dresses-shirts, If i feel daring (which I prob would, y'know, with the whole male-reader-drawing thingy)
for gn, I would probably just draw them in mandrake male, firstly because the style is comfortable, both to draw and to wear, and secondly because it is a subculture of the country where I live, which makes me more happy to draw it
can I be so for real right now? I do not see vampire!reader wardrobe staying the same doll, rich girl, homeschooled, butler loving thing forever
yeah, I could still see them envolving into goth, maybe romantic goth while we're at It, but wouldn't It just be funnier If It didn't?
so, after the vampirification, what if the reader start wearing smth really different from the batfam?
like, gyaru, punk (but REAL punk, with with pointy hair and various piercings), or fem mandrake, but with the crazy male mandrake hair with these neon drawing at the scalp that glow in the dark
yeah, it's a big leap, but it's a fun one too
(or maybe vamp!reader could put some sexy leather too, idc, I just want to give the batfam a headache! 😉👍)
thanks for reading my rambling, I must go back to hating to draw Damian (←😒) right now 😔💔
girl we’re from the same country (≧◡≦) ♡
i want to ramble and prattle about this so hard and give it a super long answer but!!! SPOILERS for my upcoming post on vampire! reader’s fashion i’m afraid.
vampire! reader's overall style holds a place dear to my hear, and is also relevant to the fic!
i'm not gonna lie, i envision vampire! reader to be more on the hyperfeminine side of things. pre-vampire-embrace she already wore exclusively black (with pops of white), shades of grey and a daring burgundy here and there, and i decided on those colors mostly to match her somber/modest/elegant choices when it comes to clothing and to match the wayne and, overall, just gotham's aesthetic. even as vampire! reader grows out of her dolly-like clothes, she was pretty much raised on designer and that's pretty much what she wears and will continue to wear. as in, new dior spring/summer collection just dropped? gotham's local store already has it ready for her to pick up. it comes naturally to her, it's just how alfred/bruce (mostly alfred) raised her.
also, spoiler: she feels like dressing on old-timey, vintage outfits makes her feel closer to her grandma. this also thanks to alfred's influence, who gave her access to martha wayne's wardrobe. she does enjoy wearing her grandma's old clothes. not the pearls, though.
considering her clan (👀), it's very fitting.
however!!!
i do find the idea of an alternative vampire! reader very interesting and fun to play around with, giving her (or him. or them) different personalities, reactions and upbringings which will lead her to be more suitable to different vampire clans. stereotypical, yeah, but a punk or cybergoth vampire! reader would make a great brujah or gangrel. gyaru or lolita! vampire reader could be a toreador or a malkavian. she grows out of her frilly socks and petitcoats and really finds herself in alternative styles.
now with our current vampire! reader's style transition, i'll save that for that one (amazing) ask to really yap about that.
and honestly? i don't believe the clothes themselves would really make the batfam scream cry and throw up (with the exception of alfred, but he'll get over it). it might make bruce and dick side-eye her a bit, but jason would find vampire! reader's mandrake/punk hair awesome. steph would be in love with gyaru/lolita vampire! reader's outfits.
unless we're talking about sexier outfits, like you said, leather and such. which i won't expand upon here, but that would surely make them uncomfortable.
but, much like our og vampire! reader, what really bothers them is the change in attitude, in company, in behavior. she was so quiet and demure before, going out during business hours and mostly coming home before it got dark, or at least sticking strictly to curfew. she barely had any friends. but suddenly she's hanging out with some person she met who knows where, frequenting nightclubs and coming home close to dawn? acting distant and avoidant towards her family (who didn't really pay her much mind but that's irrelevant)? now that grinds their gears.
but if we want to get away from that hyperfeminity post-embrace, i can see og! vampire! reader gravitating towards something like this:
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eah-confessions · 17 hours ago
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i think people are too harsh on the apple and raven switched at birth theory. sure, people are not allowed to like it and i'm not against pointing out the flaws in it but i sort of think people are overly negative about it's flaws, and i hope that doesn't affect the creator. and i'm saying this as someone who doesn't agree with the theory and also heavily disagrees with it
first of all one of the takes ive seen is switched at birth would "destroy" the destiny themes of the show- to which i heavily disagree. i feel like if the writers added this revelation later on in the series if way too wonderland and dragon games didnt end the destiny arc it would point the flaws in the destiny system and change the relationship's the royals. both raven and apple's moms have one track mind and believe their destiny should be followed. it would be a massive revelation to the characters and affect their relationships. i dont think it would make all the "drama" useless considering how a lot of it stems from the culture of the fairytale world, and it would force the characters to really consider what the destiny system is. one of the biggest revelations it would be if the parents didnt know too somehow, and it was a mistake the doctors made and not intentional. (or even an ordinary citizen of bookend who was mad at the destiny system- just throwing ideas out) if the story suddenly went this way, i wouldnt like it but it doesnt feel impossible to be added to the ever after high story, given cerise and ramona's story being added late in the story or holly and poppy. i mean swapping two different babies compared to twins being born really close together is a huge reach- but still.
another thing i've seen is that because blond hair can be be recessive it disproves the theory. i understand the theory is mostly because of the hair colors of the characters not matching, but i dont really think this disprove it because it's really hard to dispute given how bare bones the theory is. many bad theories are intentionally or not intentionally difficult to disprove. i also thought, as far as i know never seeing both sets of parents even in an illustration for them is kind of suspicious to me. it would be interesting to see them focus on their family tree as well, but they didnt probably because that would kill the suspense of seeing these characters later on.
i do think this is a bad theory (its more of an idea than a theory), but an interesting story concept that could have even be considered for ever after high. i do think that its possible that this was an early idea for ever after high. consider the following: ever after high was in development for several years and wasnt even about fairytales at first, it was about witches. disney was even working on desendants as well. now part of me wonders if the reason that apple doesnt have black hair is because of disney and not wanting to make the characters too similar to disney's despite them having the well known versions of many characters. so they have to call back to the disney version (ex: adding yellow and gold in apple's design) without directly copying them. another thing that strikes me as interesting is that in one of the original versions of snow white she has "hair as black as ebony" yet in her future shown in the mirror we never see snow white in the future with the blonde turning into black hair. in fact its raven who undergoes more of a transformation. knowing how much ever after high uses the original source material of the original it's something to consider. another interesting thing to consider is the possibility if cerise was going to be more relevant this theme would make sense throughout the series, of inheriting a destiny that doesn't belong to you (i believe she was in the stop motion short) so with this i propose that it could have been considered at one point for the story, but didnt use it because it didnt work. another interesting idea is apple and raven not being switched, but being related somehow. like if the good king had a relationship with snow white but left her for evil queen and she had apple because of that. so apple and raven would be half sisters. again, not something i would want in canon but still interesting.
i know the original posters of these takes might disagree with me, but i feel like switched at birth- even though not a well carefully or thought out theory (literally just a "what if") can open up more discussions of the creative decisions on ever after high, and i feel like the community just going at this theory (as well as other communities going after theories that arent just "its not real") to me is sort of unproductive. ive seen too many takes on why it's stupid and i'm tired. i think the original creator, as far as i'm aware is a well read person who made one bad theory so when people say that it "lacks media literacy" i sort of get mad on their behalf, also hating that as a buzzword. so yeah, even though i think switched at birth is a "stupid" theory i think it's overcriticized in the fandom for being bad, when the concepts it has are really interesting outside of this theory. because the fact the ever after high designers made the child of snow white a blonde is very interesting from a design perspective because snow white is well known in many versions of her tale for having black hair. as well as the fact that ever after high was sort of mistreated by mattel and that affected the plot we were shown and how the fandom interacts with eah media. sorry if some people see this confession is just "people are too negative" but i do think people are blowing how bad this theory out of proportion. it's a bad theory with a lot of potential. i think this fandom in general has a lot of problems of overusing negative criticism and certain discussions becoming popular over others, like overfocusing on the selfishness of certain characters and whether or not apple (or raven) is a good or bad person objectively and arguing about it amongst each other instead of like... the larger actual story? i also think switched at birth would make a good AU and seeing what it would mean for their fairytales is so interesting. but not a good theory, no...
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sanityshorror · 3 days ago
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PLEASE give us some tips on writing horror, PLEASE
Honestly, I might do a video about this, as I get asked this/things along the lines of this rather often lol. Off the top of my head though, the most simple but important tips I can give:
Have an actual plot. It doesn't need to be super complex, it doesn't need to build an entire universe, it doesn't need to be ‘orignal’ (literally all artistic expressions are inspired by art that came before, it's impossible to create something truly original), and it doesn't even have to be unique. It just needs to be very solid and it should not be convoluted. And no, the horror of the story is not the plot of the story. The basic plot should be able to work in different genres. The story you tell with the plot and the execution is where you bring the horror.
Don't let your book become overly convoluted. You can tell a complex and rich story without adding every single detail about every single thing. Some things might seem a bit out of place without you including excessive lore, but it's better to just focus on the story you're telling in your book rather than try to explain every single aspect. Also, it adds much more mystery when you don't explain everything!
What is the villain's motive? What are the reasons for the villain's actions? And most importantly, what is your reason for telling the story? Do you have one? (Because you need to have one.)
Show, don't tell. This is off the top of my head without editing so it's not great, but as a general example of what not to write vs what to write: “He smacked the butt of his gun against her head and knocked her unconscious.” [❌] VS “Steel violently collided into bone creating an earsplitting, nasty, unmistakable cracking sound of a skull breaking. The woman's unconscious body thudded to the ground in an unceremonious manner. Blood poured from her head, pooling on the polished, hardwood floor on which she laid crumpled.” [✅] Same scene, but I don't think I need to explain the difference of why the first sucks and why the second is compelling.
If you aren't making yourself uncomfortable and horrified, you aren't going to horrify your readers. Push the limits.
Pacing: don't rush the story and gloss over important aspects of it because you want to get it done or you feel like it's just 'too much effort.' That does not mean adding filler to lengthen the story, either. All scenes and events should be relevant to the conclusion, if it's not relevant, then leave it out. If it is relevant, focus on writing it and doing it as well as you can. I would say for a short story, aim for a minimum of 4k words. For a book, a minimum of 25k words.
Bonus tip: over the top, excessive angst is not horror. Don't confuse the two and don't replace horror with angst. Yes, there may be a lot of overlap at times BUT you cannot write horror without the majority of the story being horror. I add this because I've seen a lot of new horror writers confuse the two and it just comes off as rather goofy when it's executed.
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mearchy · 3 days ago
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I actually think I put my finger on the thing that most bothers me about the perpetual pro vs anti Jedi discourse, which is that everybody argues for their interpretation of the Jedi as though the Jedi were a monolith. As though there were not 10,000+ of them spread across multiple temples, from many different homeworlds, with unique paths and individual connections to the Force. It doesn’t seem right to me to assert absolutes about what the Jedi code Actually Meant and whether it was too dogmatic or applied correctly by the Order or whatever when I think we can see in canon that you would get different answers about its meaning and application from the Jedi themselves, even the ones that inhabited and learned in the same temple. I feel like that’s the point of a lot of what we get shown in the prequels and TCW.
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endos are systems.
you are cool. YOU. ARE. A. SYSTEM.
#endo safe <3
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mistfallengw2 · 8 months ago
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Feel free to be more specific in comments/notes if you want! If you want to elaborate further, how do you organize them? By role, species, age, alphabetical order, vibes or something else?
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napping-sapphic · 5 months ago
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Breaking news!! Tomorrow’s forecast indicates that it would be a GREAT day for us to hold hands 👉👈
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anistarrose · 5 months ago
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My current version, of my ever-evolving theory, on what constitutes "aromantic stories" is that first off, there's absolutely a wide spectrum between 1, "this is explicitly undeniably about aromanticism," and 2, "there sure is a noteworthy amount of aro subtext, but representing aros clearly wasn't the author's intent." But the spectrum is best completed not as a straight line, but as a triangle, where the 3rd point is "the story probably wasn't created with aromanticism at the forefront of anyone's mind, but was created with subverting particular expectations related to romantic relationships in mind." And in my experience, a lot of juicy aromanticism-related experiences that are underrepresented in their own right can lie in that third option, regardless of whether the characters are aro-spec or allo or kind of whatever you headcanon.
So, what does make a story on this spectrum "aromantic?" IDK, I wouldn't necessarily include all or most of the firm 2s (unintentional subtext) under the aromantic story mantle. But when you get into the gray areas that inch a little closer to 1 and 3, let alone the gray area between 1 and 3 where intent is ambiguous but ultimately may not matter, it makes sense that different people will have different takes.
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