#batman: war games

[horsechestnut]

I just think it's really neat how much fans have latched onto the fact that Stephanie Brown was Robin.

Like, both in and out of universe Stephanie was never meant to be taken seriously as Robin. The writers only made her Robin so that her death in War Games would be shocking and Bruce only made her Robin because he thought it would make Tim jealous enough to come back. She only had the mantle for 71 days before being fired (for doing something that literally every other Robin has also done and not been fired over), and she was only active during 50 of them. There are only six issues where Steph is Robin in the canon timeline.

Her final words before her death are asking Batman (Batman, because even on her death bed he doesn't trust her enough to take off his mask) if any of it was real. Was she really Robin? And Batman assures her that of course she was, that she was part of the legend and no one can take it away from her. Except it's a lie, because despite his reassurances, Batman never puts up a memorial or does anything to preserve her memory. He never really thinks of her as Robin, and even her friends will always think of her as Spoiler before ever remembering Robin.

Meanwhile DC spent years ignoring her time as Robin, to the point where it was completely erased from existence for awhile. It's technically back now, because timelines are weird, but unlike the others it's never been altered. She's never been given a second chance at it, no one's ever gone back and added more issues or details about those 71 days, or even seems to want to acknowledge them most of the time.

But fans have clung on to it anyway. Sure, there are lots of people who make Robin posts that are just about the boys, but there are just as many people who are ready to fight anyone who doesn't include her. Maybe it was only for a little while, but she was Robin, and we're sure as hell not going to forget it. If DC isn't going to bother to remember, than we will.

Stephanie Brown was Robin. She was part of the legend. It was real. No matter what, no one can take that away from her.

[gnomewithalaptop]

mods are asleep time to post incorrect war games steph

+ bonus darla

Part 2/?

[havendance]

Setting aside the actual quality of the event itself, War Games is just a really good and evocative title. It's the contrast between the light-hearted image invoked by the title and the bloody reality. This idea of soldier boys playing at games who are suddenly confronted with the reality of war. It's about Bruce making a hundred contingencies and Steph setting it all into motion without really understanding what she's doing. The parts of them that are children playing with fire contrasted with the innocents caught up in the blaze when it burns out of control.

[jalapainio]

I'm working on my personal Batman Timeline, and I've just stumbled into 90s-early 2000s comics. And wow, a lot happens here, doesn't it? Knightfall, Contagion, Cataclysm, No Man's Land, Fugitive, and War Games all happen in the same period of time. Not to mention Batman Hush and Under the Red Hood that happened soon after that. Batman really was put through the ringer, wasn't he?

[briars-abound]

Just finished Batman: War Games and I have a lot of thoughts

[theriveroflight]

a timsteph during war drums one-shot! also on superlove

[bamboozled-distress]

trans rights!

[a-bad-case-of-the-stephs]

Let’s talk about the significance of how Stephanie Browns first ever appearance is tied directly to a TV broadcast about Batman, and how it perfectly explains why she's such a remarkable character.

Detective Comics #647

The full sentence the TV broadcaster says is “It’s not up to some masked vigilante to protect our citizens …. No matter how good his intentions…No matter how noble his cause”.

This scene asks us to compare the characters of Batman, who the statement is textually about, and Stephanie, who is viewing it and (presumably), being inspired by it. The panel itself seems to encourage use to try to apply these lines to Steph instead of Batman, framing the latter proclamation directly above her head, almost like a text box telling us this information about her. If we apply these lines to her, we can see an idea emerge.

There is this figure, who is not only not necessary, but unacceptable on the face of it, “…No matter how good [her] intentions...” / “…No matter how noble [her] cause…”

The first time we see Stephanie brown, she is being showcased alongside a condemnation, which is followed by her disregarding the message of this broadcast, and appearing for the very first time as Spoiler.

Dismissal and Stephanie ignoring this condemnation continues on to be one of the central facets of Stephanie’s character. In the same introduction arc we already see the dismissal/disregard dynamic established.

Batman and/or Robin tell her to Fuck Off, she chooses not to:

Detective #649

This pattern continues on for some time. She is dismissed by Batman

Robin #16, Robin #26, Robin #50 (1993)

And by Tim Drake/Robin:

Robin #25, Robin #35, and Robin #26 (1993)

And by her own mother:

Robin #71 (1993)

When she finally becomes an official part of the team in 2001, there is a break in this pattern. But, as always, Stephanie is eventually pushed out again:

Gotham Knights #37 (2000)

But, as always, Steph says “fuck that”, and refuses to stop.

Even in the face of dear friends agreeing she should give it up.

Batgirl #38 (2000)

And when Steph is brought in as Robin, she is again dismissed, in this case “Fired” soon after. She doesn’t quit of course, leading to the disastrous events of War Games.

Robin #128 (1993)

And when she comes back from being “dead” she is dismissed again, by Robin.

Robin #182 (1993)

This isn’t every time someone tells her to quit being Spoiler, but instead a showcase of how prevalent the Dismissal/Disregarding dynamic is for her character.

I am working on two other posts, one which will explain in depth Why the way she was “fired” as Spoiler has everything to do with Bruce Wayne’s own hangups and emotionally manipulative quirks and very little to do with her own skill level. The other will analyze why she feels the compulsion to be keep being Spoiler even after having Every reason to quit and being told to do so hundreds of times.

However, for the purposes of this post, all that matters is that this Dismissal/Disregarding dynamic exists and is a huge and reoccurring part of Stephanie’s character.

Whether or not you think she “deserved” how often she was rejected, and whether or not you think her disregarding the rejection was “good” or not doesn’t come into play here.

For now, let’s focus on the implications this dynamic has for her character in a meta sense, as a character who is used and discarded.

A character who is for all intents and purposes, the narrative punching bag. She endures character dismissal and belittling, three separate backstory instances of sexual harassment as a child and teenager, teenage pregnancy, abuse, taking care of a parent struggling with addiction, brutal and (debatably) sexualized torture, character assassination, death, retconned death, and further character assassination until 2009, where she finally gets her own solo comic, and a modicum of respect. The thing that separates the horrible shit Stephanie goes through and the bad things that happen to other characters is only rarely are Stephanie’s struggles treated as significant on their own, and almost always her narrative is used for drama or to prop up Robin Tim Drake’s plot. Very rarely does she get treated with the care and attention her character merits.

But let’s go back to that news broadcast, all the way back in Detective #647. How does she take it, when we are told, when Stephanie is told, first thing, straight out of the gate, plain and simple: No matter how good your intentions, no matter how noble your cause, you is not enough, or you’re too much, or your just not right?

It is met by a triumphantly tragic: “And?”

Stephanie hears from the VERY start the same refrain she will hear for years and years: she is not good enough, she needs to go home, she needs to quit and she does the exact thing she will continue to do every following time she is told this: she puts on the damn Spoiler outfit and she still tries anyway. Again and again.

The next time we see Stephanie Brown after this, the second time we ever see her character, she has donned the Spoiler costume, and she’s got to work. “And?” She seems to say. “As if!” She seems to shout. What a perfectly awe inspiring thing, and what a perfect summary of what makes Stephanie Brown so damn cool.

For better or worse, you cannot keep her down. I love Stephanie Brown so much.

And if you want to read a comic which understands this, which treats the terrific character of Stephanie Brown with respect and love, and which for the first time maybe ever lets her stubborn refusal to give up go her way? Read Batgirl (2009)!!

Batgirl #3 (2008) & Bruce Wayne: The Road Home - Batgirl (2010)

[alvivaarts]

AO3 is Removing 'All Media Types' without Public Input or Announcement. What Can We Do?

What's Happening?

For those who don't yet know: AO3 and the Tag Wranglers have begun to slowly remove the 'All Media Types' tag for older fandoms. Aka, removing the 'umbrella' tag for many franchises, and forcing franchises to be split by media, or to be shoved under one umbrella that does not accurately reflect the types of fics or source medias they come from. This has been slowly occurring with no official announcement, under the pretense that things will be 'easier' to manage, or that some users claimed that the 'All Media Types' tag was confusing. This has begun in secrecy, without genuine input from the userbase, and without any public announcement. (As of 9/5/2024 9:30 AM PST) Many of us are pretty confident in AO3 staff's decisions, but the fact that this decision is not only incredibly impactful, but made without public input, has deeply violated the condition of the site as an archive... an archive of OUR own.

Current seen issues and active risks:

Removal of 'All Media Types' automatically makes fics from different sources in the same franchise a 'crossover', forcing users to consider non-crossover fics 'crossovers'. So, any fanfic that spans or implements elements from multiple pieces of media in a franchise are now considered a 'crossover', despite being from the same franchise and not a crossover.

Removal of 'All Media Types' forces users to manually search for the fics and ships they want one by one through each fandom tag in a related franchise. (Imagine looking through all the separate DC or MARVEL movies one by one).

The 'include crossovers' and 'exclude crossovers' filters are now useless, and removing genuine crossovers (crossovers between franchises) must be done manually through the filter system, which can take upwards of half an hour, if not longer, with the amount of one-off genuine crossovers that exist.

Slightly smaller franchises are being shoved under the umbrella of a single, super popular fandom. (See, Sherlock Holmes. All Sherlock Holmes media has been relegated to the tag 'Sherlock TV', which confuses users, as the tag now includes not only BBC Sherlock, which is the umbrella tag, but any works based off of Arthur Conan Doyle's original works, the 2009 Sherlock Holmes films, and the 16+ Sherlock Holmes adaptations and international TV shows... none of which are BBC Sherlock.)

Anime and manga fandoms (especially smaller ones) are being automatically split by media type, without regard to the fact that many anime and manga adaptations are very similar, and/or authors tend to often implement elements from both anime and manga.

As far as we are aware, no one is going to be correcting any improper sorting resulting from this.

Accounts that are no longer active/accessible, memorial accounts, and orphaned fics and no longer be corrected by their original authors and are at risk of being misplaced into incorrect fandom tags. Unfortunately, no one can fix this but the tag wranglers, who were supposedly removing 'All Media Types' in the first place to prevent MORE work. Counter intuitive, isn't it?

Already, fandoms are being improperly split, others being improperly merged, and still more being far more confusingly sorted. This deeply damages AO3's integrity as an ARCHIVE.

What Can I Do?

As soon as it's back up again, make sure to stop by the Contact Support page! There, you're able to let them know exactly how you feel about this, and what fandoms your fear will be impacted by these changes. Many already have been.

In the meantime, make sure to contact AO3 on Twitter (or X): ao3org (AO3's general twitter page), ao3_wranglers (AO3's tag wrangler page), and OTW_news (the parent host of AO3).

There is also tumblr: ao3org (AO3's tumblr page) and transformativeworks (OTW's tumblr page).

And finally, the Organization for Transformative Works contact page.

If you are aware of any additional medias, please add them below to ensure that AO3 thoroughly understands the negative impact of this decision, especially the violation of trust resulting from making such a massive choice without impact. Be sure to share this information elsewhere, repost, share the links, and make a stink. Furthermore, if you are able, letting AO3 know that you are no longer comfortable financially supporting them in the future.

Be sure to also repost and list any fandoms you have personally noticed have been impacted by this change!

Already Impacted Fandoms:

MARVEL, MCU, Marvel Comics, Avengers, and related tags

Any Sherlock Holmes based Media

A Song of Ice and Fire (Game of Thrones, House of the Dragon)

World of Warcraft

Assassin's Creed

Monogatari

BanG Dream!

Jujutsu Kaisen

Disney (all media, now: Disney Theatrical Animated Universe)

DC and DC Comics

AND MANY, MANY MORE!

[martiniluvr]

“maybe I saved you in another universe.”

[horsechestnut]

Anyway, War Games bad, but I will be incorporating the idea that when she comes back Steph hates being called pet names into my personal head cannons.

[beauregardlionett]

it's important to go into your favorite tags on tumblr and change 'top posts' to 'latest posts' for enrichment because you will find some incredible stuff you wouldn't otherwise. it is also important to not do this because you will find posts with takes so terrible it fills you with enough rage to fuel an entire jet engine.

[havendance]

Anyway, Robin #129 is one of the issues of all time. Tim has retired from Robin but trouble finds him anyway. Gangsters are shooting up the school and he’s got to pull out Robin as Tim Drake. He’s the one who has to keep his head in a crisis. He’s the one who’s trying to keep everyone alive and he can’t.

[bobbinalong]

bruce didn't take the cowl off even in steph's final moments. not even then did he trust her with his face. he didn't give leslie any way to contact steph's mother, either -- presumably because the writers forgot she even had one or didn't think anyone would care. but i remember and i care. so in her final moments, steph was with a man in a mask whose lack of trust in her messed with her head and ruined her life, still begging to be acknowledged by him, to be called worthy, to be called real. and she deserved her mother to hold her hand or tim but bruce deserves to sit with that moment the rest of his life.

[frogaroundandfindout]

For a long time I thought Robin was his son, but now I know he was…chosen.

I don’t know much about their history except for what’s already passed into legend; Batman and Robin, the dynamic duo—mentor and sidekick—family by choice if not blood.

I’ve never caught his civilian name, but I do know that the first Robin has been heroing since he was a little kid—and that he’s friends with almost everyone in the superhero community.

I also know that even though things must have been rough between him and Batman sometimes, he’s wicked loyal…even now, even though he wears a different costume and answers to the name “Nightwing.”

(Batman: The 12-Cent Adventure #1)

[heroesriseandfall]

That’s fair! Steph is far from just a fun sunshine gf. Maybe someday fanon will allow a girl to have nuance……

With Jason vs Steph, I guess a notable difference here was that for Jason, it was writer Jim Starlin who most wanted to kill Jason off and he used the audience’s knee-jerk reaction to Jason and his own negative portrayal as a way to convince editorial (Dennis O’Neil) to let him kill Jason. (Though O’Neil still disagreed with Starlin’s conclusion that Batman shouldn’t have any Robin.)

Whereas for Steph, it’s editorial that wanted to kill her off and some writers disagreed. But then the writers have to kill her off anyway thanks to Dan DiDio, so they also still have to write in some reasons to justify why Bruce fires her to set up the war games murdering-Steph plan. Which imo is where her recklessness and violence is played up even though her being Robin was a consolation prize. I agree it’s not OOC, but it’s kind of like Jason where even when it’s not OOC (Jason had already tried to kill Two Face before Starlin even took over), sometimes negative aspects are being extra emphasized in preparation for plans to kill them off.

That’s my perspective on it, anyway!

Did Dick really give Robin away without telling Tim? Did Tim really see Damian in the suit and Dick just let it go? Did he really threaten Tim with Arkham? Was the Justice League and Titans really that bad to Tim, that he was cut off from everyone because of Dick?

How many times has Tim's line been cut? Has he been threatened with murder? How many times has Damian actually tried to kill him? Has Bruce and Dick and Alfred just ignore the threats? Because he was in the League of Assassins?

How much had Damian gotten away with that the other three Robins haven't?

Jason's only tried once, at the Tower correct? Or has it been more?

Did Tim really kill hundreds of assassins?

Dick has killed before hasn't he?

Who has the highest kill count? Jason or Tim, if Tim's is true?

How much is fanon and how much is canon?