#assuming that's a possible reason
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ebiemoon · 11 months ago
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tgcf donghua saved me thank u tgcf donghua
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balleater · 1 year ago
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i've already made posts about this so many times but every time the raven queen's ascension gets brought up and its talked about like she did it for immortality or purely for power it makes me go a little insane because the story of her being a follower of the god of death before her and taking his place specifically because he didn't respect death is one of the best things about her lore in my opinion. that one of the biggest differences between her and those who failed attempts at ascension is that she did because of faith and not to spite it.
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carlyraejepsans · 20 days ago
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One thing I think people forget is that sans probably wouldn’t talk about missing his home and never being able to go back and giving up unless he absolutely felt he had to
with frisk he’s pretty sure that’s the time traveler that could very well end the entire world. He’s trying to reason with em as a someone he’s hoping could be a friend at that point because he’d really rather not have that happen
In geno is IS the end of the world and he’s hoping you’ll realize this is stupid and cruel and reset. It’s not like he’d have this conversation on a random Tuesday with papyrus
yeah agreed, sans goes out of his way to not talk to/with papyrus about their life before the underground. remember the newsletter q&a? (this is more a theory, but judging from their behavior i personally think papyrus is an amnesiac/sans thinks he is, and he's trying to spare him the grief of remembering).
his memories and mementos are stored behind his house for a reason, he's had his realization that he'll never go back already: there's no sense in reopening that wound again if he has an option to avoid the topic.
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scintillatingshortgirl19 · 11 months ago
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i am begging one single person in this entire show to consider, for perhaps one single second, THE POSSIBILITY THAT THERE IS A REASON HOUSE HATES HIS DAD THIS MUCH
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witchofthesouls · 1 day ago
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I'm going to follow up on the fantasy-horror thoughts to be expanded Transformers, so-
Medical/Biological Horror
I haven't really seen takes about established Cybertronian medical biology and the complications with the "humans into Cybertronians" trope.
Like we see the heavy emphasis on T-cogs across the iterations and how it's deeply connected to independence, identity, and person-hood, so how about an ex-human that lacks a T-cog?
Ironically, T-cogs have a lot of emphasis on that particular organ is similar to human hearts in terms of emotional, cultural, physical, and physical capabilities and significance. Similar to how humans are capable of donating hearts to others, Cybertronians can perform an equivalent procedure with T-cogs. (On a related side note, the phenomenon of 'cellular memory' has to be extremely appalling to the mechanical species. Not in the sense of upcycling parts, but in the sense that the organs, frame, and equipment still retain the echos of the last person to the point that it influences the new body.)
Imagine that once human inside a medbay as the medics tutted and sadly inscribe their new medical file about their new monoformer status. What a shame, they said. They could have been an excellent addition to (insert whatever frame kibble visible that correlates to a function), they said. Poor thing! With that kind of extrasensory equipment, they'll be a walking target, they said.
So that monoformer with no kibble or those visible beastformer traits without the means to completely escape... What. A. Shame.
Until a random Cybertronian sees that monoformer casually wheeling around with heelies. It's easy to wave away as a reinvention of training wheels, but then they notice those heelies disappear back into the monoformer's frame. The ex-human still has no T-cog. Sweat breaks out because said ex-human had done the fucking impossible.
They're paying closer attention now. They're seeing little micro-transformations happening. The subtle signs of a frame shifting to accommodate an area or space, the way fingertips would sharpen too easily with a file or with a raw cut as a tip is used to scrape away at something, the seams expanding and contracting, so something is happening, they just can't tell...
While this can overlap with the body/psychological horror aspect, I say we should take it more extreme. There had been takes with dysphoria, particularly with the play between mechanical parts and human organs, the differences in senses, and if 'sticky sexual interfacing' is part of it, then sexual hardware of both sets.
However, what about acceptance? The exploration of feeling truly at home in your own new skin? Even if it's high-tech and something out of a sci-fi film/video game with a platform that's incomprehensible because you don't understand the language it uses, but guess what? You can download a packet to fully comprehend a new language. You may not be fluent or comfortably at ease with speaking, but you can read and understand what's being said. A possibility of delving into human disabilities that translate into something easily curable or nonexistent or have well-established accommodations in a Cybertronian framework. Something like hormonal disorders or gastrointestinal issues due to upset gut biome would be wiped clean. Poor/limited eyesight can be compensated with a visor that can't be easily removed or taken away or the additional sensors that provide environmental data. Cybertron has a form of sign language with chirolinguistics where communication is done "by stimulating the nervecircuits in the fingers, wrist and palm of their conversational partner. It seems to be fairly common to know at least a little hand." TFWiki page And it pairs well with internal comms that double as cell phones or an unique user on platform where a Cybertronian can live chat or text another.
A massive tradeoff for this kind of comfort? You now have a visible soul.
Think about it, your soul can be directly handled, as in someone can physically go mess with your most distilled sense of self.
Humanity had long debated the existence of it via philosophy, spiritually, scientifically as well. The heart is the most recent popular choice, but major historical contenders had been the stomach and the mind as well as arguments of the soul isn't found in one specific organ but rather the bridge between them.
People swear by souls and the afterlife. There are many myths and legends that involve souls. Even the most doubtful had been deeply raised in a cultural framework of the concept via media usage, figurative speech, religious imagery, and depictions in art.
That has to be the most mind-blowing and deeply unsettling reality a former human must accept.
I see the comparisons of sparkeaters to vampires as they both prey on the living, but the more apt description should be the product of Harry Potter with Dementors as those Dark creatures eat souls.
So this touches on another genre-
Supernatural Horror
Human adaptability combined with the Earth transformation myths/magic would deeply terrify modern Cybertronians as those new cybered beings don't fit the established medical reality they function with.
This can easily tie very well with expanding Cybertronian folklore of otherworldly beings of their version of fae, demons, spirits, or yōkai. Beautiful, terrible beings that mimick Cybertronians too well... unless to look closer: the shadow missing or not matching (can be tied to Unicron), conflicting kibble, EM fields too wild with a chaotic rhythm no one else can match, colors that change to suddenly, a strange wardrobe (made of deaf creatures) that ripples and warps without a breeze, an mechanimal with too much intelligence glittering in its optics...
I'm not even fully delving into the rampant chaos of ex-humans having a host of adaptations suited for tolerating far more ranges of environmental stress and disease-resistance due to the rapid evolution by organic life compared to Cybertronian fauna. Remember, humans are animals. Highly intelligent apex predators that specialize in endurance/persistent pursuit with strong social and communal behaviors, and the cleverness to suit the environment from aquatic to deserts to wetlands to forests to grasslands to tundra. Humanity found ways to not just survive but to thrive in those biomes.
This opens a potential storyline where cybered humans become Cybertron's extremophiles, so that can easily translate into those beings capable of manipulating their own selves to a multitude of frames and shapes.
The example above with the human to monoformer was a show in how transformation mechanisms could be different between the species. If T-cogs are an inherently modern Cybertronian biological trait, then cybered!Earth natives should be either throwbacks or have another approach to it.
And that's the more muted fuckery, but what about straight-up transformations that were deemed unthinkable? Where unnatural formations keep twisting upon themselves, collapsing just to rise higher and higher? The sudden appearance of not one or two extra limbs, but dozens, even hundreds without a sequence as they try to compute how the hell they pull all that mass from nowhere? Armor plating, sure and steady, then turning into a substance that swallows everything and anything as a solid becomes a liquid.
The repression technology may or may not even work as it targets the frame's T-cog. What can it do to a mecha that doesn't have one?
Another aspect overlooked is the animal-human relationship in domestication of wild animals or how communities form symbiotic relationships with different kinds of wild fauna. Combined humanity's collective love for highly dangerous creatures... Wouldn't it be absolutely sick as hell if cyber!human got a sparkeater as their companion? It's still a wild 'animal,' not a fully tame one like a domesticated animal, so they're trying to tedtalk on a human's approach to curating a stable relationship with a predatory species while the rest of the Cybertronians are basically dead-white from sheer fright.
Or on the opposite yet equally delightful spectrum of said exhuman caring for orphaned creatures that reminds them of human pets (like a bunny or a mouse), but those 'cute babies' usually cause massive structural damage to city-states and a known mech-killer. Something like a Scraplet (because, let's be real, deep in your heart, you know a person that would try to keep it as a pet and succeed at it), so their tedtalk about behavioral training, 'reasonable precautions,' and emotional/physical fulfillment is filled with scientists who's curiosity (slightly to completely) overtakes any sense of self-preservation.
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trashcanwithsprinkles · 2 months ago
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debate
(topic: how many and what configuration of kids do they give off vibes of having (either at present or in the future)(partner is irrelevant in most cases, some could be single parents for all i care))
#the blue tier should be 'two or more' my bad#all tiers make no difference between adopted and biological kids with the obvious exception of the ones exclusively abt adopted kids#basically all of the tiers above could be adopted too it doesn't matter#the ones in the young category don't necesarily all give off vibes of having no kids#more that i can't picture it but it's not bc of personality. it literally is just bc they look too young#like obv most characters on the younger side outside of that tier are under the assumption that the kid appears in the future#but the young tier is just i am incapable of deciding bc i can't look at their face and my perceived age of them and reach a decision#hu tao is the exception i just cannot see her having kids#this is also assuming they'd all be decent parents. doesn't mean those in the no kids tier are there bc they'd be bad parents tho#heizou lovers feel free to give your hc i just don't know who your man is lmao#yall get done so dirty by the game#like tbh i'd put him in the no kids tier but i am aware i know very little of him so. erring on the side of caution here#honestly alhaitham could be in the one girl category also now that i think about it. nb kid for that man specifically#there are some characters y'all won't be able to convince me otherwise but like. i'm curious anyway#the parentheses are the reasoning for the choice not necesarily their actual kid obviously#the natlan gang is up in the air. kinda confident abt the mualani choice but kinich? not so much#realistically i could see plenty of them not having any kids but decided to keep the no kids tier as empty as possible in the interest of#y'know actually thinking about it. the ones there are bc i simply couldn't see it. ganyu and sethos are on thin ice tho
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tabithatwo · 2 years ago
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(x)
(this is a pls stop blaming juliette lewis for nat’s arc and death post <3)
#regardless of whether you loved the death or hated it YOU CAN STOP BLAMING JULIETTE NOW OKAY??#like even people who liked it overall but had qualms the party line is well I’m sure it was juliette leaving early so that’s why xyz#no! it was not! this was the plan <3 and idc if you hate love or nothing it I just think like making these excuses for things is weird#like do I get why some people might have assumed juliette might have left early sure yes but also idk like PEOPLE ARE FALLIBLE#showrunners are fallible! and that’s OKAY! they’re PEOPLE! and you CAN love every choice they make but jumping through hoops#to find *reasons* for the things you didn’t like is so interesting to me cause like…it’s okay!!! they can do a little thing you didn’t love!#you can even SAY you didn’t love it if you want and that’s okay too! or not! but stop blaming juliette lewis for whatever you didn’t like#also the rest of the article is an interesting read!#now I’ll do conjecture and tell you it is CONJECTURE for sure okay disclaimer#but after reading this article I think it is even possible Juliette’s anger with nats arc was partially BECAUSE she knew her death was soon#like maybe! who knows! not us! but I don’t even know how I became this hardcore juliette defender bc honestly I dosagree w her on a lot lol#but like I’ve seen people say oh she’s difficult and she made them do this and she’s a problem and she always does this#HELLO??? stop blaming women for shit baselessly??#(if you casually wondered if maybe she wanted to leave and didn’t say it like it was fact or use it to pin blame on her for stuff…#…this isn’t directed at you)#but some people got VICIOUS#juliette lewis#natalie scatorccio#yellowjackets
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Something I've been thinking a lot about lately is how everyone thought Egon had gone insane. What Happened that made them think that. They've fought a gigantic Stay Puft Marshmellow Man TWICE (counting the 2009 video game because iirc it's canon? Correct me if I'm wrong), fought an interdimensional god, fought a blood thirsty ruler that killed thousands and was hated by all that was trapped in a painting (and managed to get in to beat him by making THE STATUE OF LIBERTY start walking down the street with slime that reacted purely based on vibes), found an underground abandoned transit system full of the moodslime, had a bathtub try to eat Dana and her baby, fought a giant murderous black widow lady, fought the fisherman ghost who turned an entire hotel floor into the bottom of a ocean, and that's not even mentioning them getting trapped on an island that randomly raised up from underwater that had been abandoned for decades created by Ivor Shandor who worshipped Gozer. So what did he do or say that made everyone else think he'd gone insane?? All I can think is maybe he was acting strange / eratic before, but he's always been like that to some degree.
I don't know. It's something that I've been thinking about. The correct answer is 'it's not that deep and they needed a reason that the others weren't together anymore and weren't aware of Egons death or know what was going on,' but also. What Was He Saying that prompted everyone, including Ray, to think he lost his mind when he'd been right almost every time before that.
I'm genuinely so curious as to what he was up to before this. What was he doing. What insane idea was working on prior to this or was he even working on anything at all??
Also want to clarify this post isn't negative 😭 I really love the newer movies and their lore / the newer storyline / characters, I just like thinking about small stupid things like this. Gives me something to think about / speculate about / figure out an answer to.
#ghostbusters#egon spengler#nikolas posts#I have so many thoughts on it because I've just been rewatching the two movies on loop for the past few days.#All we got was Ray saying that he'd started talking about the end of the world (IIRC) and that he went insane and took everything#when he eventually left to deal with it on his own#which for the record it's extremely impressive that he would've stopped Gozer from returning BY HIMSELF. The only reason it hadn't worked#was because of the electricity issue#Hiding all the traps and setting up the proton packs to fire at the hell pit?? Insanity. He's just on a complete different level of existin#Like they were aware of Ivor Shandor and his plans long before??? They found his ISLAND DEDICATED TO GOZER who had full intention of#BRINGING THEM BACK#it's really Really REALLY not this deep but I have thoughts and I wanted to share them. Maybe someone else might have an idea I#couldn't think of or might have something to add.#I guess it could be a 'they beat Gozer once and assumed they were gone' but that wasn't the first time Gozer 'died' so??#if I missed something Please tell me. I haven't watched the newer movies as much as the older ones (I grew up watching them / playing#the game so I'm more familiar with the older lore and haven't had the chance to rewatch the newer ones 1000 times over unfortunately)#so it's entirely possible I missed something#I'd think maybe it was just because they were older but I really don't think thats the case. I have reasoning for it but I need to do#the math to make sure I'm getting the ages right by the time AfterLife happens.#really need to make a chart / timeline of all the events that happened and what year / month / day they happened. That's a project#for tomorrow perhaps.#anyways if anyones reading this sorry for the insane rambling and congrats for making it to the end#also this post isn't negative I adore the newer movies so much. I love them a lot and I genuinely don't really care about this at all#just a thing to think / ponder / speculate about if that makes sense#I enjoy thinking about stupid irrelevant stuff like this#so so so many thoughts
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zaddyazula · 5 months ago
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obviously i love strangelove’s character but she wasn’t written well… as a woman or as a lesbian…
#i wonder whose fault that is!#yes they did a “good” job with the queer parts of her character (partly)#like her love and admiration for the boss and how she was flawed#but do we remember the tape with paz? when she was unnecessarily portrayed as being predatory?#yes paz was technically 24 but they all thought she was 14 so it doesn’t make a difference#there was literally no reason to portray a canonically lesbian character that way.#they did it at other times as well with her giving cecile private baths#like they seem to have went out of their way to make her seem predatory as many times as possible#yes parts of her character could be argued to have been written well. i’m not denying that.#but unfortunately she suffers from being a woman in metal gear! and then suffers even more by being canonically queer#also this may just be my memory but i think in peace walker you could go onto her model in documents or something and she had a model in a#bikini. like 😐#no woman in metal gear is written as well as the male characters are. and that is because of kojima being a fucking weirdo#so it does slightly annoy me when people choose to ignore that and acclaim the writers for being so “inclusive” or whatever other bollocks#because they weren’t. they were weird about queer characters in all the games.#and i’m talking CANON queer characters. because i’m very sorry but only a small minority of mg characters are canonically queer#and because everyone lives in mgs-queerland people assume because snake doesn’t get written horribly despite not being explicitly portrayed#as queer they think that canonically queer characters get the same treatment and they don’t#this is sort of the thing with raiden and raikov as well#in a slightly different way but the same vein#and i love headcanoning mgs characters as lgbtq+! i really do and i do it all the time but unfortunately it is not canon (for the most part#that’s enough of my rant for now#mgs#strangelove#strangelove mgs#mgspw#metal gear solid#metal gear solid peace walker#zad talks
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lgbtlunaverse · 17 days ago
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Half the internet talking about how we just need to be more niceys to men and misogyny is the fault of mean internet feminists and the other half going "Let's try seperatism again!" I'm so tired. I want to be in community with men, especially marginalized men whose political goals align with mine, while trusting that any critique of misogyny won't immediately turn them into fascists. Is that too much to ask?
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starrysharks · 4 months ago
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chapter 1 of reassassination's nearly done script-wise! hopefully the next chapters won't take like 6 months of on-and-off work to complete lol
#but i have GOOD REASON as to why it took so long#1. i had no clue how exactly to write the characters and they literally swapped characterisation with every scene#luckily now i've solidified krankenstein as a paranoid control freak#and octavia as a superficially cool girl with a sailor's mouth and zero social awareness#honestly its so hard to explain her chara. basically: character who seems stoic and cool and mysterious but is actually just super autistic#2. i had NO CLUE how and when to expose information#now chapter 1 only gives a superficial look at krank and octavia's characters and the most basic info about postmortem#and the “rules” of octavia (perfect pendant etc)#and 3. i was writing it like a standalone for a while#i had to put a lot of changes into the script in order to turn the chapter into the foundation for a few opening “mini-arcs”#of which will give a lot of characterisation and purpose into postmortem highschool characters#like onion and jaundice#rather than being kind of disconnected like before#anyway now that im nearly done all i need to do is FINALFINALFINALise the designs#(which will probably have a shit ton more changes to make em actually drawable over and over again)#and design environments and props (like krankenstein medical clinic and postmortem as a whole)#even so i only want to start releasing the comic when at least a quarter of the scripts are done and the story is 100% finalised#i have a lot of freedom being out of school right now so i want to write as much as possible#so i guess it will release around late 2025 or mid 2026 in the best case scenario assuming something insane doesnt happen to me
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icewindandboringhorror · 7 months ago
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boy in silly sitting positions compilation
#cats#I especially like the last one where he just has one single paw poking out of that box for some reason lol#I still have costumes to post and like a billion other things.... grr... constantly failing at staying active on social media aughh#I think because currently my Main Focus is on trying to get my game done and stuff.. which basically just means sitting and writing all day#so there's not much to post about. Though I know the Good At Social Media thing to do would be to post about the#writing and share progress and talk about the game and characters or whatever to try to build interest or something but that is SOOO weird#to me.. I could maybe get it if it was like a tiny tiny discord groupchat of playtesters with like 5 people in#it.. But something about talking openly about things before they happen is weird to me?? Like presumptuous feeling or something#''oooo guess whats gonna happen LATER!!!'' like.. how do you know.. what if it doesnt. what if you dont finish it. what if its not the way#you think it's going to be. what if something changes. etc. Like I literally avoid movie trailers and game trailers for the same reason ghj#Even if it's not ME doing it it just feels... weird.. Maybe it has to do with my OCD and how I just don't like talking about ''future''#things in Certain Terms. Like if I was going to say ''Oh yeah sure. come over to my house in a few months''. I would have to follow it up#with like ''HOPEFULLY you can come over to my house in a few months'' or 'They'll come over in a few months MOST LIKELY''. Because just#stating that something will happen matter of factly takes for granted like.. what if somehting horrible happens and I DONT have a house#in a few months? or what if something bad happens to me. or to the person coming over? I can't ever DEFINITELY say with 100% certainty#that one could ACTUALLY come to my house in a few months. anything could change. So I have to allot for that in my phrasing. hbjjkn#There are a lot of situations where you're expected to just Assume Things but for some reason that bothers me. My brain literally does not#even Assume the most basic things.. like how do *I* know that just because it's someones birthday that they want to be wished a happy#birthday? what if they dont? everyone is different and has different preferences. I should check with them first. or wait until they public#ly announce that theyre accepting birthday wishes. I have to allot for all 5034859069 rare possibilities at any given time and never take#anything for certain. etc. ghjbjhbh.... ANYWAY.. I have been feeling a bit sick lately as usual.. but still slowly making progress on some#things. Moslty I need to edit costume photos. make sculptures. and work on the game. Going back reading some of the old writing from like#2018 and suprisingly I don't have to change that much of it? In fact I like it mostly. so that's good. I would be very interested if I were#playing the game myself. Though that doesnt mean much since my tastes are so niche lol..#Still really want to clear some of my million tumblr drafts as well... alas and aughh and ooughh and so on and so forth. Between all of my#evil appointments other such things...why cant I have one billion dollar to retire into relaxed hermit artist life of no stressors.. bleas
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wonder-worker · 8 months ago
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"[Elizabeth Woodville's] piety as queen seems to have been broadly conventional for a fifteenth-century royal, encompassing pilgrimages, membership of various fraternities, a particular devotion to her name saint, notable generosity to the Carthusians, and the foundation of a chantry at Westminster after her son was born there. ['On other occasions she supported planned religious foundations in London, […] made generous gifts to Eton College, and petitioned the pope to extend the circumstances in which indulgences could be acquired by observing the feast of the Visitation']. One possible indicator of a more personal, and more sophisticated, thread in her piety is a book of Hours of the Guardian Angel which Sutton and Visser-Fuchs have argued was commissioned for her, very possibly at her request."
-J.L. Laynesmith, "Elizabeth Woodville: The Knight's Widow", Later Plantagenet and Wars of the Roses Consorts: Power, Influence, Dynasty
#historicwomendaily#elizabeth woodville#my post#friendly reminder that there's nothing indicating that Elizabeth was exceptionally pious or that her piety was 'beyond purely conventional'#(something first claimed by Anne Crawford who simultaneously claimed that Elizabeth was 'grasping and totally lacking in scruple' so...)#EW's piety as queen may have stood out compared to former 15th century predecessors and definitely stood out compared to her husband#but her actions in themselves were not especially novel or 'beyond normal' and by themselves don't indicate unusual piety on her part#As Laynesmith's more recent research observes they seem to have been 'broadly conventional'#A conclusion arrived at Derek Neal as well who also points out that in general queens and elite noblewomen simply had wider means#of 'visible material expression of [their] personal devotion' - and also emphasizes how we should look at their wider circumstances#to understand their actions (eg: the death of Elizabeth's son George in 1479 as a motivating factor)#It's nice that we know a bit about Elizabeth's more personal piety - for eg she seems to have developed an attachment to Westminster Abbey#It's possible her (outward) piety increased across her queenship - she undertook most of her religious projects in later years#But again - none of them indicate the *level* of her piety (ie: they don't indicate that she was beyond conventionally pious)#By 1475 it seems that contemporaries identified Cecily Neville as the most personally devout from the Yorkist family#(though Elizabeth and even Cecily's sons were far greater patrons)#I think people also assume this because of her retirement to Westminster post 1485#which doesn't work because 1) we don't actually know when she retired? as Laynesmith says there is no actual evidence for the traditional#date of 12 February 1487#2) she had very secular reasons for retiring (grief over the death of her children? her lack of dower lands or estates which most other#widows had? her options were very limited; choosing to reside in the abbey is not particularly surprising. it's a massive and unneeded jump#to claim that it was motivated solely by piety (especially because it wasn't a complete 'retirement' in the way people assume it was)#I think historians have a habit of using her piety as a GOTCHA!' point against her vilification - which is a flawed and stupid argument#Elizabeth could be the most pious individual in the world and still be the pantomime villain Ricardians/Yorkists claim she was#They're not mutually exclusive; this line of thinking is useless#I think this also stems from the fact that we simply know very little about Elizabeth as an individual (ie: her hobbies/interests)#certainly far less than we do for other prominent women Margaret of Anjou; Elizabeth of York;; Cecily Neville or Margaret Beaufort#and I think rather than emphasizing that gap of knowledge her historians merely try to fill it up with 'she was pious!'#which is ... an incredibly lackluster take. I think it's better to just acknowledge that we don't know much about this historical figure#ie: I do wish that her piety and patronage was emphasized more yes. but it shouldn't flip too far to the other side either.
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quinns-art-box · 2 years ago
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tenko taking these two goofballs on her morning bike ride and it's a disaster
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sonknuxadow · 1 year ago
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theres multiple reasons i dont like s/urgeamy but one of the things ive seen people do with it that annoys me a bit is the idea that surge and kit are going to become good because surge is gonna fall in love with amy and thats gonna be her only motivation to change.. and im sorry but am i the only one who thinks it would suck so bad for such fun antagonists to instantly switch sides just because one of them was "fixed" by romance and no other reason
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dmc-questions-anon · 6 months ago
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Dante: What was it the old lady said? Was it "Don't talk to Rock for years and only do so once"? Yeah, that sounds about right.
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