#anti himiko toga

[khonaker]

Hi

I think ochako is one of the most under utilised and underrated characters. I'm not a fan of her character (no, i DONT hate her). She had so much of potential amd her fight with BK just proved she's more than a pretty face. I'm fully aware of the fact that this show is oversaturated with characters. But let's not forget that she is the main female lead of the show. My biggest issue with her is that she didn't get to do a god damn thing in the Stain arc. She joined the academy with the sole intention of making money, and that's exactly what Stain hates about the hero society. Their monetary outlook. She could have been a part of the arc, the build up was there. She could have shown Stain that yes, while there are heroes who are there solely for the financial gains, that doesn't make them bad people. She all she wanted was to help her family get out of the poor financial situation they were in. Instead, she gets the typical shonen lead heroine treatment- being the love interest and whose sole purpose in life is to be a satellite character to the male lead of the show.

All her effort in the UA sports festival to do her best against Bk, all the desires to make good income as a hero to help her family financially, devolved into a girl who becomes a blushing mess infront of her love interest.

They did her so dirty. She was one of the few female shonen characters who felt like she could be someone in life without having anything to do with matters of the heart.

Also, notice how it's other characters around her who enforce her this whole Deku crush on her. Mina, toga and Aoyama to name a few. These are the characters who constantly remind her of her feelings for deku, thus pushing her further and further away from the plot relevancy.

I find this very annoying and makes me sick to think that a girl with tremendous potential is now relegated to the role of a girl hopelessly in love.

One last question: So many people think she's a terrible person for wanting to make money. I'm like, what? Are you serious? (If you want me to give further explanations I will) but it's the most human and realistic thing to do when you're stuck in a financial rut.

Please let me know and thanks for reading my extremely long post

Cheers

Ooooooooooo Lordy.

(Cracks hands and neck)

First and foremost, I still love Ochako. But I can’t ignore what’s happened to her throughout the series.

Honestly, it’s been ages since I’ve had that exact thought about Ochako and Stain situation! While he had a valid point (that wasn’t further explored, HORIKOSHI) about there being heroes that didn’t have the EXACT same mentality as All Might, her duality of wanting to provide enough money to support her family all the while having the desire to save others for the sake of saving others would be honestly a culture shock to Stain. (Or he may go further into denial, it’s actually hard to say. Guy had a few screws loose.)

But it HONESTLY would have been interesting seeing these two interact! And not to replace anyone the Hosu trio! It honestly would have been cool seeing her trying to use her new Gunhead Martial Arts (though she probably would have been focused on saving Iida as Izuku and Shoto took on the role of the main fighters, but Stain could have also tried to go after them and Uraraka would attempt to hold her own against him.) And we would have had MOST of the Dekusquad there! (Asui had her own internship.) Hiw great would it have been seeing the Dekusquad fighting together! And Ochako going feral protecting Iida!

Yeah, she happened to be more focused only about her crush with Izuku as time went on, which made a lot of her early traits and accomplishments kinda fade away and be forgotten. But for the record, and I still stand by this. A girl having a crush on someone DOESN’T cheapen her in my opinion. It’s something that happens to many teenagers. And some of their interactions I think are handled well, like them talking about wanting to save their respective villains. But other times, yeah, it felt a bit excessive that Horikoshi had to stop and say, “Hey! Hey! Do you remember Ochako has a crush on Izuku?!?” I honestly was looking forward to seeing how she acted after she vowed to put her feelings aside during the provisional license exam. But…Hori just continued to drill it into our faces.

As for the biggest perpetrator of making Ochako only about Izuku, I lay on Toga’s feet. Mina, yeah, she brings up the crush as well, but it’s done more in good fun I feel. And I think Aoyama has done that once. (Now that I think about it, it’s kind of random how he suddenly knew about her crush. He never does it again.)

But Toga? Horikoshi could have used her for something else to make her relevant, but the ONLY thing she had connected to Ochako is their shared crush on Izuku. Others say theirs other themes between them, but I’m sorry. I don’t see it, or believe that it was handled effectively. Ochako had more than just a crush. Like you mentioned, her want to provide for her family. Her fighting spirit and prowess that she showed against Bakugou. She had things that could have been fleshed out more.

Toga was a wha-wha girl that embraced being a remorseless villain and happened to be crushing on the same guy Ochako was crushing on. That’s it. There’s nothing else really about Toga. And she became to Ochako what Bakugou became to Izuku: a detriment to her character and preventing her from becoming something MORE. (Sorry but not really if I sound cynical about Toga. I just got REALLY tired being demanded to care about her. Like some OTHER blonde.)

Speaking of which, your last question? I also never understood this. I get it for a quick joke and stuff like that. Hahaha. But when people were SERIOUS about holding that over Ochako’s head? I was like, “Did you not hear her entire motivation?!?” I was dumbfounded how people could possibly come to that conclusion.

I find it ESPECIALLY interesting NO ONE brings up that BAKUGOU also had the desire to be a hero for money,JUST TO BE RICH AND FAMOUS! But no, shit on Ochako for wanting to take care of her family! Filthy hypocrites. I honestly wish Horikoshi did a better job balancing both her looking out for heroes as well as wanting to have a good paying job for her family. I think both are completely character of her.

Anyways, you gave me a long post, I gave a long response. 😜 But honestly, thanks! I don’t honestly get these and I hope my answers or thoughts are interesting or understandable! Have a good one and thanks again!

@theuntamedangel

[problemswithbooks]

I keep thinking there are two major problems. First, similar to the heteromorph plotline, Horikoshi just did not spend any time exploring or explaining actual matters of quirks and second, he wants the focus to remain solely on child abuse as a crime. Toga's situation is being asked for us to be believed similar to Moonfish and Tabe? of the Yakuza(also described in Vigilantes) where the quirk dictates the body's needs over rationality. AFO made a similar excuse almost too about having a compulsion to steal quirks except it's he has control. Toga also is too normal to be considered abnormal primarily because he made those types of quirks seem totally abnormal and more like the brainless Nomus, driven by their base desires. The one character introduced late in Team Up Misdions had a quirk that would poison his own body and the government not having made arrangements for him is a heteromorph matter instead that is never explored and nothing like, say, Moonfish.

Also the implication is similar to Shinso's quirk being labelled or the Aoyama's fearing the quirkless label- the parents fear she is a born villain due to her quirk.

When it comes to Toga, Hori is way to vague. I think it's pretty clear he didn't put as much effort into her as he did Tenko and Touya. Heck, even Spinner who I'd say is not one of the main three villains, gets to narrate chapters. The Heteromorph stuff isn't explored as much as it should have been, but at least we get a lot of character growth fro Spinner.

I defiantly agree he didn't really explain or even stay consistent in his world building around Quirks and how much they control/compel people to act. Or even how people treat those who have negative Quirks. This is bad because Himiko's sympathetic angle is built around those things.

As you've pointed out the only characters we've seen who exhibit anything similar to Toga are Moonfish and Tabe. Both are very much side characters who barely show up for a more then a handful of chapters. Tabe gets a bit more characterization, considering he can control himself despite his Quirk because he refuses to hurt his friends and that he is given a few lines of backstory. Meanwhile Moonfish gets nothing despite him being on Toga's team in the beginning. I mean I don't even think if it's established if Moonfish is the way he is because of his Quirk or if he just is a cannibal of his own free will.

No one for the league even really interact with him before he's caught and none really care that's he's gone. He also doesn't make much of an appearance after the break out. I think, he might have been on Toga's team again, but it came to nothing and he's vanished again without ever learning a thing about him.

As for the the guy in the side story, I don't really count it. Supplemental material is fun, but it should be just that, a supplement. I firmly believe a story should be able to stand on it's own, so I take great issue with important plot relevant things being revealed in side stories. This is why the whole thing with Kurogiri and Aizawa's past bugs me because something that integral to the story should have been in the main manga--not a spin-off.

Then we get to Shinso.

To be perfectly honest the fandom's whole "Shinso was labled a villain due to his Quirk" have always bugged me. Maybe that was Hori's intent but it is not presented well. The kids may say his Quirk would be great for a villain, but they don't think he's a villain. They joke about him not using his Quirk on them, but they never seem to legitimately be afraid of him.

Even during the Sports Festival he isn't told he's acting like a villain or getting booed. Ojiro forfeits and doesn't like that he was controlled but he doesn't think Shinso is a villain, or even villainous. Izuku doesn't think he's bad either--he only yells at Shinso when he calls Ojiro a monkey, something we've learned now is a racial slur.

Even Shinso doesn't say he's treated like a villain. The main issue he has with his Quirk is that it isn't flashy. It's not powerful the way Bakugou, or Shoto's is, which makes becoming a Hero hard because standing out is very important. Shinso isn't seen as villainous because of his Quirk, he is seen as weak. On top of that after his fight he is cheered by his class and praised by the Pro-Heroes in the audience for having a Quirk that they would find very useful, some even wishing that was their power.

At the end of the day it doesn't feel like Toga is that compelled by her Quirk. Far to often she can be perfectly fine and talk and interact with her friends the same way as normal people do. She is not nearly as controlled by her Quirk as Tabe is or maybe Moonfish is (since it's not confirmed it's his Quirk compelling him to act).

If she only felt the need to drink blood from people she was attracted/romantically interested in that might explain it, but it's been shown that's not the case. She turns into and uses Twice's Quirk despite her not being romantically in love with him, and she berates herself for not being able to access Shigaraki's and Dabi's Quirks even though she loves them as friends. Most recently we even see that she was driven to suck the blood of a friend, not a crush.

So, we have two very conflicting ideas. Toga is both forced by her Quirk to drink blood, but on the other hand she's not. It really is only the whims and needs of the author that drive how much blood lust she has at any given time. If she needs to have a normal conversation with her freinds she's fine. If she needs to blush and flirt with Izuku and Ochako she's suddenly unable to stop her self from pulling out a knife.

It kneecaps any sympathy Toga should get because I just don't get why she goes from understanding how people work, and how to hold conversations to suddenly not understanding basic communication skills. I don't feel like her Quirk blinds her to what consent is or the idea that people feel pain when you stab them for blood, or that maybe someone might not want to maybe die to provide her with blood. Instead it seems like she can, when she wants to, not jump people for blood but just decides who gets that courtesy and who doesn't. The LoV don't get stabled, Izuku and Ochako do, and for Toga she thinks they should be happy with it, even though she probably doesn't do the same to her friends because they would be just as upset with her.

[violetlunette]

I've never like Toga since she's such a hypocrite. She knows how it feels when someone she cares about is killed, yet proceed to kill people without any remorse, not even considering the feelings of the victim's family. Not to mention her idea of "love," the urge to suck the blood of a loved one to the point of exsanguination. If that were the case, she would have killed Twice too, at some point.

Notes:

*Anti LoV

*Anti-Himiko Toga

*Himiko Toga Critical

Pretty much.

Tago’s quirk pushes her for blood, but she has been shown to hold back her urges to kill, she just CHOOSES NOT to. As you said, she understands the fear of death and the pain it can cause yet she continues to do it. And despite what others say, she never had to. It has been proven that she does not need to kill to satisfy her quirk.

Tago is selfish. She only cares about her own life and needs. She has empathy but purposely ignores others for her own desires. Even when looking at the results of her actions, and seeing an entire city destroyed because of her, all she thought of was herself.

Would it have been different if her parents had been better? Maybe.

That doesn’t change the fact that SHE still took a lot of lives with her own hands, helped others to take even more and, if not stopped, will continue to do so. And even if she does stop due to a power of love bullshit speech, that doesn’t erase the things she did.

Regardless of the reasons, she KNOWINGLY did all those things, knowing the outcome. She made a CHOICE knowing those choices would cause harm in some way to others.

The lives she stole can never come back. The pain she caused can never be mended. The very least that should be given to the people she hurt is the knowledge she won’t hurt anyone again and that she didn’t get away with it.

Sadly, she will. She’ll get away with all of it. Her violent assault on Saito, her killing spree, her acts of terrorism--all of that will be forgiven because the world of BNHA decided that her pain matters more than anyone else's.

[ultraericthered]

"Curious died?" No, Toga straight up killed her.

With that in mind, this eventuality is honestly kind of karmic. And I'm sure Curious and Toga will get along great in the afterlife, after the former's stopped laughing it up and the latter's stopped attacking her to drink her nonexistent blood, that is. :P

Damn Toga and Curious would've made the best duo. Watching Mean Girls, playing with animals, annoying Skeptic, the works.

Yeah, it would’ve been nice to see them interact after the fight. Too bad Curious died-

[itsnothingofinterest]

While the fate of the League is of course incredibly messed up, unfair, and infuriating; something that really grinds my gears is all the reactions to the League stans calling this unfairness out by going "well they had to die and deserved to, and they would have gone to prison otherwise anyway, it's not like there was any happy ending available for these horrible criminals," when, like...yes there was. They totally could have Vegeta'd it up in here; MHA is not a realistic series.

Like, Edgeshot survived using his own body to sew a guy's heart up by living as an eyeball with hair on a string.

Endeavor, the known horrible domestic abuser and outright rapist, is retiring publicly shamed (to an extent) but still to great wealth, recognition as a great hero, and with his entire free family having at least a positive opinion of the man.

And of course this latest chapter 429 implied that all those societal failings caused by the horrible MHA civilians neglecting or attacking people including children, the failings that created the League, the failings the League put their lives on the line to fix and utterly failed to fix because they all died completely ignored...got fixed anyway because Deku was so 'zomg inspirational' that suddenly the MHA civilians aren't horrible anymore. (Read in the tone of this video.)

In short, MHA is full of ridiculousness, injustice, and contrivance when Horikoshi wants a happier ending to occur.

But the League had to die because...because MHA is a deeply flawed story with bad writing and at best inconsistent morals. (And it kind of feels good to say that.) It wants at times to be realistic and even tragic, but it also wants to be optimistic and comic book-y to reward the heroes, and here at the end those elements do not mesh at all. It wrecks the whole thing to reveal that Hori might be kind of a hack.

[haine-kleine]

anyway. the ending was like That because it was Izuku's hero academia. it was his story told from his point of view and it concluded all the plot points he was concerned with, like his relationship with Bakugou, Allmight, the public's opinion on the heroes, what the new generation of heroes is going to be like, how Shouto is perceived by the public, Izuku's general relationship with his former classmates and Aizawa.

he never really cared about Shigaraki outside of their brief confrontation. he didn't really know Shigaraki as a person, and nor was he interested in getting to know him, even when he got the chance to peek into his past, Nana and Allmight had more reason to be interested in who Shigaraki the person was. to Izuku, Shigaraki started as a terrifying villain and ended as a crying boy he was unable to save. this is why, as he joins the rest of his classmates and becomes a pro hero, he imagines the ghost of Shigaraki looking over him, haunting him, reminding him of his failure but also inspiring him to try harder and 'keep reaching out'.

The villains were the ones concerned with their stories. Spinner wrote that book by himself, as Izuku's notes are being written at the point the book has already been published. Izuku never mentions any contents of that book nor Spinner or Mister Compress. Because they do not belong in his story, not really.

They belong with each other, in the League of Villains, as they have proven time and time again how important they are to each other and how far they are willing to go to protect their own. Shigaraki's thoughts before Izuku had killed him were all about the League. Kurogiri's last act was trying to save Shigaraki from AFO and the heroes. What kept Spinner's spirit from crumbling after losing everyone he had cared about was his burning desire to tell their story to others, to let their stories be heard. Touya finds no solace despite getting everything he had ever wanted from his family and being reunited with them - because his place was in the League of villains, the place where he was accepted just as he was, unconditionally.

the conflict of heroes versus the villains led to nothing but devastation and destruction for the villains. even those who were heard out and validated by the other party ended up becoming victims, or martyrs.

after that experience, after having a whole crowd of pro heroes, the people who made it their lives career to save others witness his destruction by the man who stole his body from him and by the boy who swore to save him, why would Shigaraki be interested in keeping in contact with these people, had he survived? why would Kurogiri go out of his way to let Shirakumo's friends know he had survived their students attempt to take his life and the life of the boy he wanted to save, all because they couldn't accept his affection for that boy outweighing their long gone friendship? why would Toga, when the reporters and the heroes saw her body after starting to transfuse all of her blood to Ochako and not even bothered to pick it up, to save her life or even to bury her?

here is how it went: Kurogiri did end up successfully saving Shigaraki, the fact going unnoticed by the heroes because both of their bodies were crumbling. he had also taken Toga, which is why her body wasn't picked up together with Ochako (and why Ochako doesn't have any memories of Toga's dead body, only of her final words to her). and then Kurogiri teleported them far away, where they healed and started planning how to get the remaining three LOV members back, while they are still alive.

they broke Spinner and Compress out of the prisons. In memory of Twice, Hawks had covered it up, as long as they don't resurface as villains.

Shigaraki and Toga had considered letting Touya stay together with his family, up until the news of Endeavor's disgraced villain son being on his deathbed got out. On the very next day, Shigaraki broke the tank Touya was residing in to pieces. Enji and his sidekicks had covered his eldest going missing by holding a funeral ceremony for him (the second one, this time knowing full well it's a fake funeral). Shouto was enraged with his father's decision and Enji used Shouto's just starting pro hero career as an excuse, don't you want to have a clean start, without the weight of mine and Touya's crimes weighting you down? It's not like Shouto has a choice in the matter, just as when he was a kid. The family wonders about the missing one's fate. Sometimes, Shouto gets messages from unknown numbers. He doesn't share them with anyone, except for Natsuo, who is still devastated about not using his one last chance to reconcile with the brother he had been so sorely missing for 8 years.

The ghosts of Toga, Shigaraki and Dabi live on, haunting the heroes who failed to save them. Himiko, Tenko and Touya also live on. They are very different from these ghosts.

[thelittlegirlinwonderland]

with the latest episodes of mha, can I just say I do not care for toga at all. yes, her backstory is tragic and her parents were awful but at some point she had to realize she was also part of the problem. people aren't scared of her because she likes blood, people fear her because she lacks boundaries and enjoys killing people.

imagine being izuku and having someone you met a total of three times(training camp, the provisional exam, and the shie hassaikai raid), and all three times included her attacking you, declare her love for you in the midst of a war. this complete stranger who has only tried to hurt you just drags you from your spot, ending in preventable deaths/injuries, to ask you to be her boyfriend. of course he thinks she's crazy. that is crazy.

i saw someone saying that toga was an example of queer romance, since her love isn't accepted by society. that's so stupid. i'm sorry. toga's idea of love is stabbing people, painting them in their own blood, obsessing over people who don't know her and when they rightfully freak out at her advances, she takes it as a personal attack against her.

maybe try not stabbing people and visit a blood bank

[flower-of-knighthood]

Why Toga didn't work for Me

Toga's plotline and how it ended felt hollow to me at best. To begin with, while tragic backstories can help make a character more sympathetic, characters with tragic backstories tend to lose their effectiveness in provoking sympathy from me when the course of action from said backstory is completely disproportionate such as Toga deciding to help Shigaraki kill pretty much everyone.

Secondly, the foundation of her plotline being the mental effects of her quirk which was only revealed after 100 chapters in, and the idea of Quirks affecting how people think while interesting should've been revealed a lot earlier and with more grace because shouldn't characters such as Mina have an urge to destroy things? Shouldn't Shinso have an urge to brainwash people, which undermines his mini arc? The point is the idea of Quirks having an effect on how individuals think is something that should've been brought up ages ago because it's not something that would be obscure like the Quirk Singularity theory, it's something that would be relevant in various fields and would be one of the fundamentals of how Quirks work.

It doesn’t help that it feels to me that Uraraka's response to Toga back in the first war arc of if you're going to hurt innocent people, I will stop you is treated as wrong by the narrative with Uraraka actually apologising to Toga for her treatment of her during their travesty of a rematch in the final arc.

And yes, I consider Uraraka's rematch with Toga a travesty because Uraraka spent literally most of the fight caring more about Toga's feelings then the victim's and wasting energy constantly trying to talk her down even after Uraraka got stabbed. Sure, it ultimately worked out with Toga deciding to die saving Uraraka from blood loss she inflicted, but that only happened because Uraraka decided let's not subdue the threat to literally everyone there before going talk no jutsu on her, and ended up getting stabbed for it.

You can have the most tragic backstory known to man, but it doesn't justify harm to innocent people. There has to come a point where the tragic backstory will no longer function as an get out of jail free card from responsibility.

You know what's the funny thing, people criticise Naruto for talk no jutsu on his enemies, but the thing is that each time Naruto actually waited until his enemy could no longer pose a threat to anyone before trying Talk No Jutsu.

[siblingskissing]

Togachako- Star Crossed Lovers

I love them your honor

[julieemarine]

Bakugo getting shoved in alongside Izuku, Shoto, and Ochaco when getting paired up with their arch-enemies is literally this meme.

[problemswithbooks]

It all feels like a retcon starting from the first look at toga’s backstory because it doesn’t sync up when you put all her actions together. I thought maybe hori was trying to say toga’s quirk became unfortunately linked to arousal after years of suppressing it and it being triggered by her feeling of admiration for her crushes. But yeah that would have been too mature to tackle for my hero though I could maybe see it with chainsaw man. So I don’t know get what’s going on right now except toga’s mentally ill because of her parents and society and he keeps trying to make last minute parallels between toga and touya.

I think the issue is that Hori never spent as much time or effort on Toga as he did with Shigaraki and Touya. Even now her backstory is rather limited in comparison. We got full chapters worth to explore what happened to Touya and Tenko but Toga's is a couple pages or panels here or there with everything being rather vague.

Hori likes using her for sexy pictures and drawing suggestive stuff with Ochako, but she ultimately isn't given as much thought as her male counter parts. Which given the already bad implications of her character has only made her even worse.

Take this latest chapter. We get this page for Quirk counseling.

It's just 2 panels that are honestly really vague. It also comes after her drinking blood from a bird her parents think she killed. Toga says it fell on the ground but that doesn't mean she didn't kill it (baby birds are often on the ground until they fully can fly, or it could have been injured), so that's not helpful either. On top of that it makes sense her parents would find the behavior bad regardless because it either means she killed an animal or picked up an already dead one and proceeded to eat it. Neither of those are great and both are harmful to her.

We just don't really get a good look at how the Quirk counseling worked. They say that they'll make her 'normal' but that doesn't mean they abused her. They could have just explained why it was wrong for her drink blood, like the health issues it could cause. On top of that Hori drops the 'it happens all the time in our current society' line, but we have never seen anyone else like Toga. Not even Stain was ever hinted at being like Toga despite their similar blood based powers.

This is like if we reduced the Touya chapters to a black screen with Enji commenting that he can't train him anymore and we didn't get to see how much Touya struggled with what he perceived as rejection, or how Enji completely ignored him afterwards. Or if we cut Shigaraki's father's abuse to just him yelling at him in black panels before he accidentally killed his family.

Then we get this. This honestly makes Toga look worse, not better in my opinion. We see that she drank blood from someone before she snapped at school. She says they got hurt so she kissed it better, but if you look at her, she is covered in quite a bit of blood. Maybe her friend did get hurt but they were either really badly hurt and bleeding a lot and Toga did not help them and instead started licking them, or she might have even made their injuries worse to get the blood she wants.

If Hori cared more about her character he would have been shown what happened here. Or in the very least put less blood if any on Toga, which would show she didn't hurt this person or ignore helping them with a serious injury because she can't think of anything but blood.

As it is we have no idea if her friend got really badly injured and Toga ignored helping to just feast on them, or if her friend told her to stop, or if she made the person's injures worse. Yes, her parents are wrong for saying Toga's not human, but if she's attacking injured friends that's a huge problem.

One of the biggest issues with Toga is that she is both portrayed as so obsessed and desperate for blood she can't comprehend why anyone might not like her shoving a straw in their neck, but at the same time she was and is at times able to be perfectly fine. She can't understand why Ochako or Izuku, in desperate situations caused in part by her might not be happy with her, but can also turn around and comfort Twice and understand that he feels responsible for the death of a team mate.

It's impossible for me to feel bad for her because when I read her chapters I just see a drawing of an offensive stereotype that does what ever the author wants them to do. Toga just doesn't feel like a person at all. She's nothing but the sexy shell of a teenage girl that Hori doesn't seem all that invested in past her being cute and giving him an excuse to have two girls being all touchy and hot.

[violetlunette]

If anon had to name just one single concept that's damaged fandom culture more than any other, just one single concept that has caused so many of today's entitled fandoms like the Dabi fans, Toga fans, etc., it's "relatability". Most of us judge people based on their actions, but fandoms judge morality by Which Characters We Personally Relate To. Dabi fans relate to child abuse, so "only Dabi's pain counts". Toga fans relate to mental trauma, so "only Toga's pain counts". And so on and so forth.

I understand that it’s easier to sympathize with characters when you understand their pain and why they do the things they do, and why that understanding makes it easier to forgive. However, for me there are some things that I can’t--and won’t—forgive. I sympathize with these two and feel bad for their pain, but that doesn’t mean their crimes were okay or should be overlooked.

[moonsb1996]

What is your opinion on these people?

Early in the morning, according to my home time Going to comment on things I disagree with about Toga Himiko, but not attacking anyone except the characters they love so much, especially the actions of said characters. And this is what they And some people received replies for expressing their disagreement with Himiko Toga's actions.

I only chose people who seemed to "pity" Himiko Toga to the point of not caring. What are her current actions? She is pitiful She has no support. It's Toga's parents' fault. It's society's fault. And it makes me wonder In that way, would Toga not be guilty because society, heroes, and her parents forced her to genocide the human race and all the other props? I even thought If Toga's clone was released in the War Refugees section because some hero (Ochako) chose to talk to Toga about their love. (Which many people call it a confession of love vomit) rather than "choosing to arrest" first and "talk" later. I really want to know the families of those supporting characters. Or if Toga's clone were to encounter a war refugee camp, how bloody would it be? Fan club: Oh! It's not Toga's fault. Refugees and props are the ones who have ended up in the Toga Clone Army's expansion zone. Sigh…These people only talked about Toga's past and didn't even mention her murder. Ah… prop characters can only be prop characters. It's like us readers who waste time reading MHA which is just an NPC by Horikoshi Kohei who sees us as stupider than monkeys.

[itsnothingofinterest]

Wild to me that people are looking at the new Hero Commission president being this guy:

And thinking: "oh yeah, he's gonna change things, make them better, bring about some much needed reform." Because I must've missed the part where he had any revelation that anything the hero system or the commission in particular were doing was wrong.

I mean treatment of villains is going to get so much worse between this guy ^ being in charge and every other reason we have to expect that treatment of villains will get worse. But even something as small as the ranking system, which I've seen suggested he'll do away with...but did we ever get a scene where he said he didn't like the ranking system?

I mean I remember him saying it could do with some improvement, but I also remember he really liked the idea of there being a number one hero to inspire people, it's part of why he tried to help Endeavor be that inspiring figure (The rest is him choosing the worst hero to be a fanboy of, but that shouldn't discount his personal logic).

And overall I just don't recall him ever having any problem with the existing way of things besides wanting more free time (and without giving any thought to what makes a villain, which he has not, that one's out of his hands), or else otherwise complaints about his personal annoyances being told what to do. But we never got that he thinks what he was told to do was wrong. Even Twice he still thinks of as "The pretty decent guy who it sucks I had to kill-which I definitely did, what does 'arrest' mean?" He even doubled down by calling for Toga's death. (Goodness sake, I give Enji shit but at least he knows when he did something bad.) So besides those little things; he had no criticisms, nor did he ever agree with people who did have criticisms. I'm just not seeing a lot of reason to think this is the guy who will improve things.

[harukamitsuki]

had a couple of reblogs on my last post, mentioning toga being a failed yandere and a bad character as a whole, specifically by @mikeellee @amethystoceandespiser and @kite2013 so this is for you guys.

and, yes, she is. she is both a bad example of a yandere, and a bad character.

when you think of yanderes you think of yuno gasai from mirai nikki or monika from ddlc, or even ayano aishi from yan sim or every single girl in higurashi.

and they're all excellent examples of yanderes.

the term 'yandere' comes from two words: 'yanderu', meaning "to be sick", and 'deredere', meaning "lovestruck". together, it the loose translation would be 'sick with love'.

yuno gasai is the best example of a yandere, encapsulating it in every way possible. she's sick and twisted, ready to sacrifice everything, herself included, just to be with yuki. she acts sweet and caring, but is truly a jealous, overprotective, dangerous girl underneath all that.

one of the first things she says to yuki is that she is willing to give up everything for him.

yanderes are supposed to be obsessed with love, and more specifically, with the target of their love.

love is the only reason they have to keep going.

and toga is not it.

because when she's first introduced, it isn't love that's her driving force. it's admiration. some may say it's a form of love, but it doesn't matter. yandere's are obsessed with romantic love specifically, and toga was not introduced as such.

even if she developed into a yandere after meeting izuku, or perhaps her nature was revealed far later, as was the case with homura from pmmm, it wouldn't matter as we still don't know who she's devoted to.

yeah, she's into izuku, but we don't see that devotion. a real yandere would have abandoned everything just to be with their love, but toga doesn't.

she is not a yandere, but horikoshi presents her in such a way, because they're one of the most popular tropes in Japan, and even in the west. appearing adorable and speaking cutely, and obsessed with blood.

what, are we supposed to assume her 'love' is blood? no, her obsession with blood is as a result of both her quirk, and how she envisions love.

blood is how she expresses her adoration. there's a stark difference in how she wants to see izuku's blood, and how she wants to see overhauls. with izuku, her face is flushed and she's almost shy in the way she says it. but with overhaul, she's full of fury. it isn't about wanting to become closer with him, it's about getting revenge for mangne's death.

so, yeah. terrible example of a yandere.

if i were to write her to be a proper yandere, i'd have her obsess over twice, who canonically had feelings for her. i'd have her destroy everything just for twice.

and i'd have izuku's appearance challenge her. suddenly, she can't tear everyone and everything else down, because she can't hurt him. maybe she'd have a mental breakdown over it, trying to figure out who to fight for, if it's okay to love more than one person, maybe even coming to the conclusion that it was never love - it was obsession.

i'd have her be a proper deconstruction of the yander archetype. not this failed version of a yandere.

as for her character...

her writing is really bad, which doesn't say much when most other characters in mha are badly written, but we're focusing on her today.

we are first introduced to her after the hosu arc, where she joins the lov due to believing stain was working with them.

why did she love stain? what specifically drew him to her? we don't know, and we never find out.

why is she so attracted to izuku? the many injuries he gets? but what was it specifically that caught her attention? no clue.

did she ever love twice back? why did she stick with shigiraki? how close is she to the villains other than twice?

we don't know.

there were so many ways to develop her. maybe she, dabi and spinner would reminisce about how they first found out about stain, which would also further delve into all of their motivations. maybe they would find out stain rejected the lov, and struggle on deciding whether to leave or not.

it'd be far more interesting if she actually wanted to damn everything to join izuku, but maybe he rejected her and so she turned against him.

maybe she could have been a good deconstruction of the yandere trope, maybe she could have been a well-written character, but she wasn't.

[thelittlegirlinwonderland]

What I'd Change about MHA

firstly, i'd put monoma in 1-a. i'd replace sato b/c i hate his character design and does he even do anything?

i'd make aizawa more of a stoic, scary looking guy but he just wants what's best for these kids. he doesn't lie to them or use ruses but he tends to push more and seems like a hardass to prepare them for the cutthroat life of heroics

i'd flesh out the characters more, their backstories, why they want to be heroes. i'd also build their relationships more. give them time to bond, spend time together outside of school without a disaster happening. filler type stuff

i like most of the plot up until the war arc, so i'd probably keep it, changing small things like stain. i think i'd make stain a former hero, like lady nagant, who saw corruption in his field and decided to handle it in the most extreme way. i would either get rid of stain attacking tensei or have it be a 'wrong place, wrong time' scenario where tensei found stain attempting to kill a different hero and wouldn't leave(similar to midoriya running in to save tenya)

ofa is one of the things about the og that annoys me. firstly, more than 9 users. probably 11-13. if it's supposed to be 2-3 hundred years since quirks, 9 doesn't make sense. especially since the first 3 were all around the same age and most of them died young. i'd also have more diverse users and quirks. i hate fa jin and gearshift, and danger sense and smokescreen don't make sense. blackwhip and float are great quirks. expand on the users' pasts as well. why were they chosen? what did they do with the quirk when they had it? also more izuku/vestige scenes. no random bakugou look alike user

i'd change a lot of the villain's stories. i'd change toga to actually be a victim of the system instead of just a blood-crazed lunatic. she was starved and didn't understand her cravings until she snapped and accidentally killed a classmate. from there, she's treated like a monster and pushed into the league who help her get the blood she needs which calms her down significantly. no wanting to become the people she loves and creepy harrasment of izuku and ochaco. just make her a scared teenage girl with no one else to go

as for shigaraki, when afo gets arrested show a slow change in his thought process, behavior, and lifestyle as he adjusts to life without the man who had been grooming and abusing him his entire life. make him realize afo isn't a helpful sensei but rather manipulating him. have him grow and reject afo and his ideas. have him start forming his own ideas of how he wants to change society

dabi is a tough one. i think i'd make him ostracized from his entire family. he had the quirk but not the body or mind for heroics. enji rejects him, rei can't stand his ambition, natsuo and fuyumi don't have anything in common and so he pushes them away, shoto is the masterpiece. this makes him more sullen and closed off. i'd have him run away instead of nearly dying and being save by afo. when he finds the league, he starts to open up more and develops more of a personality in this new family.

i wouldn't make kurogiri oboro. i think i'd scrap oboro as a whole. kurogiri is still a nomu but he has no ties to any heroes.

i'd have more people die in the war. more important heroes like all might, miruko, edgeshot, jeanist etc. bakugo stays dead, it's a tragedy that even someone as strong as him can't always win. maybe parents, friends, past classmates of the students because this is a war, collateral is going to happen. gran torino also should've died.

izuku: -make izuku's hair slowly turn white after he gets ofa so by the end it is completely white. this can be due to stress, having multiple quirks, getting a quirk when he didn't have one, etc. -all for one is his dad. this can explain why izuku can wield all of the past users' quirks, he's built to have multiple. now, this doesn't make afo a good person suddenly. he's still the man who groomed tenko and killed countless. maybe he just makes kids every now and then to get/make new quirks. it's just a game to him, he doesn't care about izuku or inko but it give izuku more personal stakes. -lean into izuku's analysis and intelligence more. -make monoma part of his friend group and have them bond over quirk analysis. -i think i'd make Mic his tutor. like how aizawa saw shinsou and decided to train him, mic sees izuku and his destructive quirk and decides to do something about it.