#anti grrm

[edennill]

GRRM may write more women than Tolkien, but as a woman I would feel much safer in Tolkien's world, and around the author himself

[spacerockfloater]

“The Targaryens/ Valyrians are not white supremacists and can’t be compared to European Colonisers!”

Oh? My bad then. I must have them confused with some other white folks who thought their appearance made them superior, brought whole continents to heel, exploited the lands of others for their own greed, destroyed whole civilizations and enslaved vulnerable people who unfortunately lacked the advanced weapons of mass destruction they possessed.

“Well, the Andals and the First Men were also colonisers, so they deserved it!”

No way! Are you actually telling me that every race has a history of violence because human nature itself is corrupt and we’re no better than animals fighting for their place on this earth? That’s so crazy and original. By the way, are you saying that people deserved to get colonised and enslaved because they were fighting other people in order to survive? Are you suggesting these “savages” should have been contained by the righteous white folks who came there to better their lives? Not to mention that the Andals and the First Men came to Westeros 12,000 and 6,000 years ago respectively, while the Targaryens attacked Westeros barely 130 years ago (literally just 3 - 4 generations) from the Dance of the Dragons? So are you comparing the morality of the people who migrated here, who were so primitive that barely even possessed weapons of steel, with that of the most advanced civilization ever built in the ASOIAF universe? That’s so interesting! It’s almost as if the Andals and the First Men didn’t know any better until it was too late and were trying to find a land that could accommodate their millions of people, so they were essentially fighting for survival, whereas the Targaryens who came from a race that had evolved philosophically, politically, academically and technologically wise, possessed enough wealth and land to sustain their little family, yet still chose to go to war against the land that nurtured them out of pure greed! Hmmm. Do you also believe that the Greeks had it coming when they were enslaved by the Ottomans and should just let go of the past because it’s been so long since they regained their freedom (barely 200 years ago btw, after 4 centuries of slavery), because their Ancient Ancestral Tribes migrated to Greece and conquered the land 3,500 years ago, a little after the age of bronze? No? Then you might see why that kind thinking is flawed.

Stop defending these inbred bastards with your full chest. We get it. They look badass. We all have a fave war criminal but all of the Targs need to be put to the sword, along with their fucking lizards. Purposely denying the parallels between the Targaryens/ Valyrians and the Colonisers/ Conquerors of our world screams white saviour complex.

[venusintheblindspots-blog]

And to add more on my previous post, all of the main female characters (with the exception of Arianne Martell) in the main series of ASOIAF are representations of white femininity.

Every single one.

And that is because they are literally white. It doesn’t make them bad characters or anything.

I’ve talked about it before hand, but anytime George is writing a character of color, especially a black woman, he uses racist stereotypes and imagery. Every time.

There’s a reason why Dorne and the Summer Isles are sexually liberated, and why the Dothraki are portrayed as vicious ‘savages’ with hardly any redeeming values to their culture.

There’s a reason why Arianne’s exposure to sex and intimacy at ten years old is not framed the same way as say, Sansa’s.

There’s a reason why Chataya and her daughter are brutalized and reminiscent of the Jezebel trope.

[katshuya]

No matter what George does. No matter if he twisted it into "Elia was ok and never felt humiliated nor used, and the Martells didn't mind what Rhaegar did" or if George decided never to talk about Elia. R x L will always be disgusting and not a tragic love story.

Any sane human being can see that.

Even in a creepy scenario where she was ok with it OR one where she didn't love Rhaegar, he will always be to blame, and he still used her.

That's why the R x L stans always try to either ignore her existence or reduce it into nothing and her into some kind of supernatural alien human that is ok with everything dirty done to her.

Because they know their oh so tragic, self insert true love story will always seem disgusting because of Elia's existence in the story.

No amount of excuses or fanarts will ever change this truth. No matter which characters George will make accepting and supporting of them (Ned, Arthur, Oberyn, Doran, Ashara, Lewyn and even Elia herself....ect). Why? Because it's unrealistic.

Even if R and L's were running away from Aerys, then suddenly *accidentally* saw a prophecy or fell in love.

OR Even if George made it that Rhaegar wouldn't have left her if she had been able to give him another child. It doesn't change that he abandoned her and their children in the worst way possible with no protection against Aerys and his loyal kingsguard. And even then, it's hard to believe she'd accept just because he told her : Hey, I see in my dreams that I have to have 3 children or we all die. Like, what is this? She almost died for that, no thanks to you and your one after another impregnation.

It's disgusting and not well-written at all.

That's just the plain truth.

That's why a huge part of the fandom dislikes it. Not because they "didn't read the books" or "they lack critical thinking".

It's actually because they know how to think instead of inserting themselves as not like other girls girl and shipping themselves with terrible husband and father, charismatic depressed prince charming.

Poor Rhaegar had a sense of doom following him and knew he'd die soon so Elia let him be? That's very idiotic.

No. Elia being fine with annulment or polygamy isn't normal unless she is forced to. And you know it.

[meanderingstar]

the way Daenerys treats Irri in the books is incredibly disturbing and I hate how it's overlooked by both the narrative and the majority of the fandom.

Daenerys uses Irri for sex at least twice over the course of the story, once in Storm and once in Dance. I really, truly cannot overstate how horrific the power imbalance between them is: Daenerys is her khaleesi, her queen and her employer; Irri was formerly a slave in her service and is now her maid with absolutely nowhere else to go. She has evidently been conditioned to believe that displaying absolute obedience to her higher-ups, including sexual services, is her "duty", which Daenerys recognizes and still actively exploits for her own pleasure. This is also why consent between them is utterly impossible – contrary to some asoiaf blogs who claim that consent was not a major issue in this situation (lol) or that Irri freely consented, Irri’s conditioning means that she will never be able to freely consent to someone like Daenerys, who is her employer and holds absolute power over her. Daenerys herself acknowledges this and feels guilty (damning in itself), but ends up using her in such a manner anyway, despite explicitly recognizing that Irri's kisses "tasted of duty" and nothing more.

What makes this even worse is that despite using her in this way in Storm, Daenerys has no issue saying that Irri and Jhiqui (who are her age and have had the same, if not worse, experiences than she has) are "only girls" in comparison to her. She also dismisses their (pretty sensible, imo?) concern about her touching sick and dead people by calling them "utter fools" and saying the Dothraki were only wise when it came to horses. She says all this AFTER sleeping with Irri, which makes it twice as bad - Daenerys considers her a little girl and a fool when it comes to advising her, but still finds it perfectly fine to use her for sex? This condescension extends to their sexual relationship as well, where Daenerys refers to Irri as "the maid", "her handmaid" and "the Dothraki girl" as she has sex with her. It's patronizing, disrespectful and exploitative at best, outright dehumanizing at worst.

While I highly doubt this was Grrm's intention, Daenerys's dynamic with Irri is clearly reminiscent of the horrific way Cersei uses Taena Merryweather. Dany is obviously not as vicious with Irri as Cersei was with Taena but that really doesn't change the fact that she was still a queen exploiting her employee's obedience and conditioned sense of "duty" for her own pleasure, made even worse by the fact that Irri, as a servant and former slave with no family, no connections and nowhere else to go, was 10x more vulnerable than Taena was and certainly more dependent on Dany. It's bizarre how Cersei's treatment of Taena is recognized as fucked up by most of the fandom but Daenerys's treatment of Irri is not, even though the power imbalance between them is infinitely worse. (also: Grrm writing about TWO white queens using their brown maids/ladies-in-waiting for sex is flat-out racist. I'm also extremely uncomfortable with how both wlw interactions are dubiously consensual at best and arguably revolve around Cersei/Dany's relationships with men to some extent: Cersei uses Taena to reenact her trauma by Robert, and Dany not only "pretended it was Drogo holding her...only somehow his face kept turning into Daario's" when she was having sex with Irri, but also explicitly states that "it was Daario she wanted, or perhaps Drogo, not Irri").

Certainly, Daenerys and Irri's dynamic is part and parcel of Grrm's fucked notion of consent and piss-poor writing of wlw relationships (both of which he should be called out for far more than he is, btw), but it doesn't change the fact that in-universe, these are Daenerys's textual actions. Grrm seems to believe that Drogo didn't rape Daenerys (a 13 year old who was forced into marriage) on their wedding night because she said "yes", just like he seems to believe that Jaime didn't coerce Cersei to have sex with him over their own son's dead body because she eventually responded to Jaime's advances, but I clearly recognize them as rape and coercion. The same logic and same standards apply to Daenerys and the way she uses and exploits Irri and she should be judged accordingly.

[idontreallyknow26]

We stan Criston for respecting sex workers and being the only feminist man in probably the entirety of GOT

And we hate Daemon for constantly making misogynistic remarks about any woman, generally his wives, that he doesn't like, emotionally neglecting his second wife, grooming Rhaenyra, cheating on Rhaenyra, neglecting his children, committing treason every other sentence, and that's not even half of it.

[chaosandstardust]

The way that the ASOIAF fandom gaslights itself should be studied. Every once in a while I see posts from people going "I believe it's coming" or "maybe he's already written everything he just doesn't want to face backlash so he's gonna wait until he's dead then release it" or "guys obviously he's rewriting everything." I'm so serious, the faith that some of you have is kinda incredible. Give me some of it. 🫡

(The reason they will never be finished is because grrm doesn't know how to stop adding shit and as a result it's made it impossible to finish; you can't wrap up a million strings in two books, it's not possible, and the way he writes he'd add 10 million more in the process making it even more impossible. And he makes way more money doing TV.)

[aangopologist]

Love how GRRM tried with every fiber of his being to make Team Green look like losers only for them to turn out more merciful and competent than Team Black

-Team Green only had 3 dragonriders Vs Team Black 7 dragonriders and they still make it hard for the blacks, to the point Daeron is considered the biggest threat to Rhaenyra.

-Daemon and Rhaenyra had Aegon's son killed and had their sights on the other one, but despite having tbe opportunity to, Aegon refused to kill Rhaenyra and Daemon's son.

-Daemon 50 smth ass had to die to defeat his nineteen year old nephew (in an incredibly illogical battle btw)

Martin knew he wanted the Blacks to "win" (in the sense their child sits on the throne because it's the beginning of the end for the Targaryens from now on) but didn't properly edit the story and as result ended making the Green look much better than he intended to

[alsethwisson]

If I was to choose single most f-ed up thing in Asoiaf, it would be whole thing about Danny Flint song. I have taken folklore studies, I know European folklore(s) well enough to confidently say: it’s total bullshit and pure rapexploitation on author’s part.

Folklore has its universal rules, universal narratives it uses to weave songs and stories. A woman pretending to be a man is one of those, and not once does it end with rape, much less gang rape. It has four possible outcomes: never discovered, discovered and rewarded, dead on discovery (usually via birth) or discovered and killed. Usually the latter is framed as defiance on her part - she goads her killer, shaming him and emasculating, and he is the villain of the story, a weakling unable to bear being bested by a woman.

If we play by the rules of folklore logic, Danny Flint would end either with her made single female lord-commander, or her killer being exposed and punished and she hailed as a hero.

Rape is never the endgame in folklore. It is only used either passingly in historical songs among other enemy atrocities, or as a starting point of revenge ballads. Never. and I can’t stress it enough, is rape used as comeuppance for a woman. Death is.

You can say “oh, but the song is not about rape, rape is what really happened”, but nope, the song is source material for those talking about this story. Just another grrm’s rapexploitation moment. Not the first, neither the last.

[catofoldstones]

WHY is there so much rape in ASOIAF? Hmm? Why did Lollys have to suffer so much? What’s the point of the black knights raping Craster’s daughter? Knights my ass. Like literally how does that push the story forward? HOW does that fulfill any theme in the books?

Fuck that. How does describing Sansa’s body like that serve any purpose, with grown men staring at her like that? Is this how he wants to portray girlhood and growing up? How does Dany being assaulted by Jorah and not having any power over it serve? It’s not even a commentary on no matter how powerful a woman (who’s literally just a girl right now) becomes she’s still susceptible to gendered violence. Also what does it say when you still want a powerful woman (🙄) get assaulted by her subordinate nonetheless?

What the fuck, George.

[tlaquetzqui]

George Rape-Rape’s thing about “oh Tolkien could afford to spend decades working out Elvish” is fucking ironic now that it’s been 12 years since A Dance with Dragons. You could’ve just said “Tolkien was a linguist and I’m not” and nobody would hold it against you. But you had to pretend he had advantages over you, which he absolutely did not, other than talent and not being a piece of shit.

Tolkien didn’t sit around with his thumb up his ass for three US election cycles while people mailed razor blades to his editor and gave one-star reviews to other fantasy writers’ first installments just for not being the concluding installments. You did, George.

[seventhofcrows]

George R.R Martin: Hey. I'm not finishing Game of Thrones.

Patrick Rothfuss: Hey. I'm also not finishing the Kingkiller Chronicles.

Me: Is anyone here about to complete their series anymore?

Brandon Sanderson: Releases Wind and Truth silently in the corner

[ai-megurine]

I hate GRRM so fucking much.

[katshuya]

wtf

elua did not deserve the winter rose crown at all!! it belongs to queen Lyanna Stark! your fake princess exists just to get between the best ship like the brown whore she is. there is no mention of flowers and elus in same sentence yet i see you fans draw her with flowers that rightfully belong to queen Lyanna. shows how desperate your side are. elia never lifted a finger to save even herself much less anyone else. why should she get crown over Lyanna, when flowers as motif belong to Lyanna (and Arya, yet sandra fans keep using it too in fake ugly arts).

Do you see this shit, people?

I love how they expose their true colors while hiding who they are.

The obvious hate for Elia in their posts as they pretend to try to give her identity by saying she only cared about becoming Queen and her son the next king while also saying Ashara probably loved more lyanna and was simply just one of many handmaidens for Elia and Rhaella probably wasn't close to Elia.

Yes, winter rose is lyanna's. I was talking about the crown, you idiot. So what? It doesn't change the fact that even your oh so great self insert, not like other girls character was reduced to glorified womb. Greenseer or not. With Rhaegar's love or not. It's not pretty at all.

But I guess that means nothing to you compared to screwing Rhaegar in your imagination.

Elia wasn't able to save herself, no thanks to your stupid prince charming, but your dear lyanna didn't save herself either. In fact, Rhaegar is also to blame for what happened to her, as well as she was complicit in her fate, too.

Elia will always exist to show how much this ship is disgusting, selfish, and cruel. That's why you are so angry. Otherwise, why did you say Elia was there just to get in between your self insert perfect ship where Rhaegar is in love with you?

You all know it shows the ugliness of this ship. Oh, sorry! I mean the GrEYnEss.

You want to blame someone and then blame the author.

Because Elia being there shows not only Rhaegar as a selfish monster but it doesn't paint lyanna as a nice girl at all if she went willingly no matter how much GRRM would talk about what a lovely winter rose she was. Age can excuse actions to how far?

Get out and touch a grass. How long can this fantasy of special oh so different girl swinging sword and making most handsome men fall for her and other girls jealous of her could continue to please you? If anything, it's making you mad because of how badly written it is.

A reminder, Sansa is Arya's sister, you ugly heart. I doubt your Arya would be happy reading what you wrote.

[persephone411]

Ok we know that G.R.R Martin was heavily “inspired” by European history when he wrote Game of thrones (ex. The Wall being the Hadrianswall in North England), the different families representing the different Countries of Europe ect, the list could go on and on)

But one of his least creative things have to be the wonders made by men , where he practically just copied the seven world wonders (ancient and modern)

Example:

The Great pyramids of Ghis = the pyramids of Gizeh

The Titan of Braavos = the Coloss of Rhodos (even the clothes of the Braavos are greek,plus the stance is practically identical)

The Wall= The Chinese Wall (one of the wonders of the modern world)

The Hightower castle was also in consideration, which is basically the lighthouse of Alexandria

At this point it not inspiration anymore, it’s just lazy and uncreative copying

[alethiaii]

YES GIRL, GIVE US NOTHING!