#acab includes peace police

[all-things-are-nothing-to-me]

Fuck the DNC, Kamala Harris, Joe Biden, the PSL, RCA, FRSO and all cops!

[a-very-tired-jew]

The very peaceful protests and their very peaceful actions. I previously posted about how the Columbia SJP has an infographic on terrorist groups and uses language justifying and endorsing their actions. Well here is the UCSC SJP's Instagram.

Fig. 1. Depicts a police car that was damaged by an IED on June 1st at the UCSC student Palestine protests.

Listen, I'm as ACAB as the next person. Hell, I'm an independent forensic consultant. I get to see first hand the fuckery that goes down when I get called in, regardless of what side I'm on. But this? This action here on the official UCSC SJP Instagram page? That is employing the same methods that recognized terrorist groups have used around the world. Jews have said for months that these "peaceful" protests were on track to becoming violent. When you shout and endorse the same rhetoric as terrorist groups that have repeatedly stated they want to kill Jews there is the eventuality that you will start using their same violent tactics. We've already seen these student protesters engage in the same behavior as Nazis by preventing Jewish students and faculty from attending their classes and buildings. We've seen them spit on us, threaten us, shout vile insults, attack us, and attempt to burn down / bomb / destroy our places of worship and business, and we have repeatedly said that it will get worse. Well here it is. Once you start trying to blow up vehicles in the street you're too far gone to call yourself peaceful protesters anymore, you’ve become terrorists. Plain and simple. And guess what? The picture on their Instagram has a descript that is equally chilling.

Fig. 2. Is a message that is attached to the photo in Fig. 1. and includes language that emphasizes violence and terrorist actions. This reads like a manifesto that is attempting to garner support from minority populations here in the USA by appealing to the issues they face. However, the language they are using is a giant warning klaxon because it undermines the actual severity of what these groups face by couching it within the ProPal Western Activist lexicon. Many people, myself included as a death expert, have pointed out that the term genocide as applied to the conflict is improper and does not meet the criteria. That doesn't stop these protesters from using it to appeal to emotion and attempt to guilt others into supporting their cause. It's clearly an attempt to gather support and drive others to violence. Nothing in here says that these are peaceful protesters. They are ready to lay down their lives for the Cause™ in a violent manner.

Glorifying martyrdom.

Red flag.

Death to amerikkka.

Red flag.

Knife to the throat of zionism.

Red flag. You already complained about the more benign Finding Out portion of employers flagging certain degrees from specific universities and wanting to know if their possible employee is an antisemite. The Finding Out portion of actually planting IEDs is much, much worse. At a certain point people will have to accept that the SJP/PSC system blatantly endorses and justifies violent terrorism. This is what Globalize the Intifada means. It means engaging in the same violent acts of the Second Intifada. It's a call to engage in violent terrorism. But ya'll don't want to accept that, regardless of how many times it's pointed out.

[yuri-alexseygaybitch]

"ACAB includes the peace police" you're so right worstie the people (including diasporic Palestinians) volunteering their time to put their bodies between you and the murderous agents of state violence to keep you from being arrested or beaten half to death or worse who might stop you from making a unilateral decision on behalf of hundreds of people to #escalate and throw hands with an army of legally impunible stormtroopers are *exactly* the same as said legally impunible stormtroopers. Should we start a zine? Should we declare a liberated zone? Should we tell Blackpowder Press??

[coriolisunset]

jesus fucking christ, this morning police in Pisa kettled and charged a peaceful pro-Palestine protest made up of mostly students, including minors from high school and MIDDLE SCHOOL.

a 16 yo girl was beaten by police who beat her in the head had to WALK TO THE AMBULANCE BLEEDING FROM HER SKULL because the pigs refused to let it drive past their blockade.

police violence isn't anything new in Italy (ACAB means all cops everywhere, after all) but this is especially disgusting considering the age of protesters and their low number (just 150, as it was a school morning and it was raining), and it goes to show just how strongly aligned with the zionist apartheid western authoritarians are

[evildilf2]

You know while I don’t think veterans need to die in mass or like need to have their civil liberties violated or whatever but I do think at the very least they should make peace with the fact that they are or were no better (many would rightfully say worse) than cops. “Kids are “policing” veterans in the hardcore scene even though they say ACAB” well I think that’s because ACAB might include you, man. I think that might be where the hostility is coming from.

[lizardbytheriver]

You cannot say "From the river to the sea, Palestine will be free" or "Free Palestine" because it is offensive to Israel and Israeli. In 2020, you could not say "ACAB", "Defund the Police", or "Abolish the Police" because it was offensive to the police. In 2023, you have vast amounts of peaceful protests for a Free Palestine. The Media is ignoring the peaceful protests, or claiming they are antisemitic. In 2020, you had vast amounts of peaceful protests for Black Lives Matter. However, the media chose to only focus on the violent protests. Eventually, people will see the similarities. The struggle for Palestinian Liberation is connected to the struggle for Black Liberation. We are not free, until we are all free. That includes Palestinians, Black Folk, Indigenous Folk, Asian Folk, Trans Folk, Gay Folk, Ace Folk, etc.

[anarcho-catboyism]

ACAB doesn't mean "only capitalist cops", ACAB doesn't mean "just the police SYSTEM", ACAB doesn't just mean "appointed officers".

ACAB includes every individual, badge or not, officer or not, that engages with the police system. ACAB includes the white Karen who calls the cops on black kids playing. ACAB includes the peace police who run to the riot police when protests aren't calm anymore. ACAB includes the prison guards. ACAB includes the nurses and psychiatrists that hold mentally ill people hostage in wards. ACAB includes the military here and overseas. ACAB includes the people telling the marginalized that harming fascists "makes you as bad as them".

ACAB includes any class traitor, any group that uses their authority to subjugate the working class under violently enforced laws that they don't have to worry about.

ALL COPS, BADGED OR NOT, ARE BASTARDS

[whomstwedointheshadows]

Season 6 Nandermo Prediction: Monty Python to Seinfeld to the Office Finale

In Honor of Reality TV House Flippers, I Present Vampires in Court TV

*CRACK ATTACK*

To honor Serial Killer Guillermo and the show subverting the reality/ sit-com format, I need the Staten Island Gang questing to face off the Big Bad. The Big Bad has a Network. They track them down, expanding their own territory, nutty vampire death sentences and leaning in to dark humor. Gore, bodies, glory everywhere. Evidence to one former familiar, everywhere, as vampires now help with cleaning up as as they are more equal in the house.

The Big Bad is revealed to be a holy terror and also cute as a bloodthirsty bunny. Bunnicula, the Big Bad, if you will.

See Murder Husband dream fighting together, Guillermo pledging to do whatever it takes to survive and come home together, overcoming this comically adorable foe. The fight is more glamor shots, inspiring questions of fan service and striking home Yes This Is Homoerotic and Camp until they win, plot feels rushed to audience but it’s clearly just a set up for Big Confession Time. Obviously they are Fully Realized and Ready for It, now show us!!

Vampires done vamping with the fallen head home, masses of dead-dead/undead cut up, ready for further dumping. Incriminating, but just the usual work for a familiar now shared. Matching gore and relief for Nandor and Guillermo, a picture of intimacy.

All these dead in the name of Flirting, they openly acknowledge, laugh together. Nandermo is here, the scene is tipping in to a Big Confession, Big Kiss… something…

In swarm the police, Humans, incongruous immediately with sense of culmination of fifteen years of pining. Trucks, helicopters, tanks against stakes. Completely lost the romance, dark humor into a Gritty True Crime NARRATIVE.

Narration of Colin Robinson expressing ACAB, but an energy vampire has to feed, won’t it be great when this airs? First acknowledgment the footage is broadcasting somewhere and he feeds from the viewer.

Too tired to kill them all, too many to immediately hypnotize. Nandor bats, at Guillermo insistence, now begins comical on-the-run and hypnosis witness tampering from the vampires. Wackiness includes decorating courtroom based on family side, sculpture and blood fountain delivery… but Guillermo somehow gets one day house arrest with his mother, Nandor does his best to arrange a tender Spa Day and they’re summoned back to night court. Night Court is of course, more nebulously supernatural and quickly kicks out of Mortal Prison into Farce with Consequences.

Mainly: Can someone explain the relationship of a rampaging slayer to his vampire former-master-warlord as they’re claiming new territory? How safe is the wider supernatural community, and are they like, a new conquering force or …another Thing? What to do about this?

Return of lawyer Lazlo, reference to hating the English during all the court proceedings (and damn isn’t this the ending of Monty Python and the Holy Grail? Seinfeld? -that was only because they were cowards that ran out of budget or wouldn’t get characters together, classic comedy half hours end with a wedding), public acknowledgement Guillermo’s a fucking slayer/serial killer to Silvia de la Cruz, seemingly friendly with Nandor and show of being peaceful amongst the crowd of supernaturals and, rather than fury of a Van Helsing, she shares she knew Memo had it bad for his boss. (Clearly, the Slayer bloodline doesn’t activate into killer mode, or is more controlled, when she understands them and isn’t surprised.)

Cue talkback scenes about an effing clip show in court as evidence, Nadja mostly focused on famous like OJ and explaining the web of who was horny when because what when presented with evidence, wearing matching wigs with Lazlo. Mimics Office Finale allowing for further commentary, still centered around present character interests. Definitely charting the course of Nandermo, getting more off camera stories of observing the Pining. Murder is framed in the context of caretaking and making Nandor horny, like they’re going out of their way to explain (to Silvia?) how involved her son is in their unit and vampire relations. Also, he’s a badass so no one fucks with him or those under his protection. Thank g- there’s this badass footage that doesn’t show Memo in too much danger or really, really hurt.

Cross examination of Nandermo by Lazlo, first kiss revealed years ago off screen, fucking all season, I love you’d exchanged but ‘I’ll be with you forever, whatever it takes’ WAS exchanged in the previous episode before battle, thus honeymoon glow and downright joyous-sexually charged battle.

Lawyer Lazlo: Do you think we have a fucking documentary crew and now we worry about courtrooms? Gizmo killed a theatre of vampires to save us and we took over the fucking council. Yes, we’re callous, we’re cruel, we’re insensitive to mortal and immortal suffering if it doesn’t concern ourselves. We’re killers, including our dramatic slayer here who’s the youngest but catching up on body count, and we’re a family. We love each other. We will protect each other. We’ll end anything that gets in our way, whatever it takes. Nandor, you’re up.

Nandor: *to put a button on the unable to drink blood, totally able to slay Guillermo arc, see previous fights up to Bunnicula, reference to be together forever, whatever it takes.*

Obviously Nandor has already discussed a big celebration for a possible yet-not-planned turning, but Guillermo suggested simple and ‘like a courthouse wedding, yes’ - Both understand the offer is on the table and Guillermo just says when he’s ready, and it’s okay if that turns out to be never. His hesitation has remained his ties with his Mom. It’s yes to all his life with Nandor, vampirism second concern when he’s accepted and ready as he can be for the consequences, specifically loosing his mom, who is not brain scramblie’d and here today, seeing all of Guillermo and his vampires.

Nandor, a strategist: welcome to our wedding!! Look at the public awe of your many conquered foes! You’re so amazing as a warrior and my closest friend. I am PROUD for EVERYONE to know you’re incredible and I’m head over heels for you, forever. Everyone includes your mom, as my family too, who is not killing all vampires on sight now! And everyone knows if they fuck with your vampire or slayer family, we’ll kill them and enjoy it together! Do you appreciate my intricate ritual of planning a wedding after you went and said yes to forever before I could propose after our many escalating battles together?

Guillermo: so, even with the documentary crew, we’ve always kept our intimacy for us. Yes, it was kinda toxic, but Nandor is my idiot, except when he’s a genius. And it feels good. To be proud of us. They celebrated me. So, let’s party.

Cut to everyone dirty, raunchy dancing, sloppy kissing, exceedingly graphic reception cut for rating. New glitter portrait of vampiric Nandor and Guillermo, kissing, sparkly bare chests in the Tigris, captioned ‘Honeymoon’

___

++Would love to see a parallel for the death of the historian in Monty Python leading to an arrest of King Arthur/Knights and the dead camera crew members leading to excessive workplace safety fines being the only lasting damage determined by the court.

+++Collin Robinson is somehow working for the prosecution, a corporate media outlet, and as expert testimony. No one is ever clear what the ‘trial’ actually is, he’s just fond of objections. Framing moves from court tv to royal wedding coverage, slowly edging the viewer wanting Nandermo confirmation about [yes, that is a glitter portrait from Nandor to Guillermo on 10 anniversary as master and familiar and here’s another one from later on their second anniversary.. of what? Well, how one can define a relationship is complex… oh! Let’s go frame by frame on these clips of their hands! ] confirming the bigger picture, Has segments devils advocating himself against Nancy Grace angry emotional vampire.

*** this is specifically a Crack!fic ideas playing with the idea all of Nandermo must be on camera, the viewer is primed for the next big step to be a confession or kiss, but what if we just jump straight to just married the dirty grinding, sloppy drunk kissing in public with all your family watching. Strikes me as a f-you to all the sweet chaste network gays, this is the suck and fuck show, babe

**** this is also a subversion of Guillermo resolving his arc as a vampire, having to be ‘ruthless’ enough, instead it’s about being assured in himself, what he wants, and cherished by those he loves. His found family accepting and making space for his family, because they care about his decisions and maybe he doesn’t have to choose, so they try. He’s gained the confidence in himself and is celebrated, welcomed, and supported by those he loves.

*****Listen, Nandor, was it kind of toxic to let your boyfriend get arrested and did you maybe plan a slaying rampage for the ‘gram- no one can quite prove, but good thinking if it was spur of the moment after the arrest, it tracks that a former warlord would yell about how awesome his spouse is and don’t fuck with us so they can have a bubble of peace due to the terror

[ladystormcrow]

❄️Share a snippet from a WIP of your choosing.

☔Is there a fic concept you have that you'd like to just explain and share because you're not sure you'll ever write it? If so, what is it?

🌤️Share your favorite piece of dialogue from your WIP.

❄️From the currently-being-worked-on second chapter of Trio Sonata:

Meg laid a hand on her shoulder. It was meant to be reassuring, but as Christine’s anxiety started to rise, it felt like a threat.

“Please tell me what’s really going on, Christine.” Her dark eyes were wide, intense, imploring. “Are you in danger? Is the Phantom threatening you?” She paused. “Did he do something to the vicomte?”

“No!” She flinched away from Meg’s touch. “It’s not like that. No one’s in danger.”

“Then why won’t you tell me?”

~~~

☔ I've mentioned in past asks that if I were to go back to my Megamind fanverse fics (Life Is What Happens and The Storm And The Stars), there are a number of things I would change that would probably require rewriting the story from the beginning.

The biggest ones involve Wayne/Music Man's relationship with my OC Danielle Dymond. I know it's a popular headcanon that Wayne is somewhere under the LGBTQ umbrella, and I would want to incorporate that more into his thoughts and backstory, and how it continues to impact him now (since being involved with a cis woman like Danielle doesn't make him straight). I would also choose to keep the Scott parents alive, since I feel like killing them off pre-story as I did missed out on a lot of plot potential for them finding out their son is alive, and exploring how they'll interact with Danielle and her family (not just the racial and social class differences, but how the Dymonds are a loving and supportive family, while the Scotts are ... not so much). I also wasn't a believer in ACAB when I wrote the original fic, and I would change Danielle's ending so that, instead of rejoining the police force, she stays at the community center and starts training volunteers for a neighborhood watch-esque organization.

One other big plot idea for these two that I planned to explore in a future fic involves Danielle unexpectedly getting pregnant. She does want the child, so Wayne, terrified that a potentially superpowered fetus might kill her, goes to Megamind and begs him to find a way to shut off his powers so she can safely carry the baby to term -- including offering himself up for Megamind to experiment on. Megamind then has to deal with the awkward, complicated feelings of finally discovering how to weaken his former rival, but not being able to enjoy it like he once would have.

~~~

🌤️ From Katabasis (which is still technically a WIP, thought it really is almost done), the whole coversation between Kira and SilSol in Chapter 8 is one of my favorites, but these lines in particular:

“... No apology can undo the harm my kind have done,” he said, after a long and weighted pause. “But I want to offer one anyway. Kira, I’m sorry. I’m so terribly sorry. Not just for what my dark shard did. For everything.” 

Kira lowered her wings, her shoulders tensing as she looked up at him. “And what? You want me to say I forgive you?”

SilSol did not answer, but the way his corona flickered suggested that was exactly what he’d been hoping. 

“Well, I don’t,” she snapped. “You’ve done nothing to deserve forgiveness. You killed people, you ruined our world, and as soon as you were one again, you ran away and left Jen and me to clean up your mess.” 

His corona dimmed abruptly. “That was never our intention. We feared bringing more harm to Thra if we stayed! We believed you were the rightful guardians of your world’s Crystal.” 

She thought of the ragged, wheedling Skeksis who had confronted her and Jen, desperately insisting he only wanted peace. How, as soon as it was clear they wouldn’t fall for his lies, he had tried to murder Jen and had given Kira to the others to be killed. “Did you truly believe that? Or were you just too afraid to face what you’d done?”

“Would you have wanted us to stay?” His tone was still calm, but there was an edge to it. 

Kira’s eyes narrowed in anger. “You could have at least done something. All you did was go home and try to forget everything.” She didn’t know this for sure - it was a guess based on their earlier story - but from the way SilSol’s corona turned gray, she knew her words had struck a nerve. “And you’re only here now because your own world’s in danger. You don’t care about Thra, or any of us.” 

“That is not true!” The glow in his eyes brightened like a flaring ember. “You are not the only one who worries for Jen now, Kira. I may have been skekSil the Chamberlain, but I was also urSol the Chanter. I raised Jen with urSu and the others. I loved him like my own child, and I still carry that love now. I want to save Thra not merely because it’s right, but because it means saving him!”

[nando161mando]

ACAB absolutely includes the peace police.

[agoddamn]

Madara more likable then Sasuke well yeah. Madara not connected to Itachi one of worst characters ever written. Who kishimoto screws over the entire uchiha clan backstory to pander too. Well single handling down playing the trauma of Narutos and the uzumaki clans backstory. With stupid shit like the uchiha were oppressed for being cops so there rebellion was justified. Well also wanking Itachi decision to murder them as traitors. Well pretending he supports Sasuke being a traitor when he doesn’t

That one post about how "I did it for the lulz" legit would be a better motivation for Itachi than what actually happened lmao

It's my position that if a plot could be foiled by the person in question describing what's happening out loud it's a bad plot and we don't need to waste time taking it seriously. "I'm gonna go commit citizen mass murder (which is typically not in my jurisdiction) without asking even one person if these orders are right." Come on, man.

Also, am I the only one who's noticed that there are some people that are super ACAB but when they talk about Naruto...? "Oh, the Uchiha were so oppressed by being cops! That's literally a war crime!" like ok bro I know it's a fucking cartoon, fiction doesn't need to meet the standards of reality...but if we're gonna play the war crimes/genocide card we're actively reaching for the standards of reality and we gotta acknowledge that if you control the police force and you can't manage to accrue any political influence...that's on you, man! LE is possibly the most corruptible profession ever. I cannot comprehend how the Uchiha fucked that up.

We have to start acknowledging the Doylist bad writing aspect at that point, because I cannot read "those poor police were so oppressed" with a straight face and I refuse to take it seriously.

Honestly, every character associated with the bullshit fake Konoha drama suffers heavily for it, including Sarutobi and Danzou (who end up either hate sinks who kick puppies or with their onscreen actions not remotely matching what happened because it was a retcon).

It drives me insane because it's not like we have a dearth of real-life references for corrupt governments! It's not that complicated a plot! We really did not need sheer silliness like Danzou kidnapping and brainwashing clan heirs (what??) or "aight I'm gonna go slit some baby throats at home" as if that can ever be explained by anything but "particularly stupid child," which Naruto as a series limbos through lasers to avoid because it would harsh the shonen buzz.

Just, like...hearing about this shit...

"'The darkness in Konoha'! Oh, this must be about how shinobi villages can never truly ally with one another because it would defeat the point of shinobi, so even as characters desire peace in a general sense they must continue to commit war because that's what their world is built to accommodate and it's one of those tragic paradox things"

"No it's about how one single dude publicly kidnapped and brainwashed and probably molested 4975259 famous kids because he's racist"

[daloy-politsey]

Top 10 Daloy Politsey Recordings in no Particular Order Part 2

Click here to see part 1

6) Since ACAB is global, there’s bound to be versions in languages other than English and Yiddish. Enjoy this Spanish version by Bestiärio.

7) Monsieur Jack on YouTube is super talented and played this version all by ear.

8) This version by Sprank includes the banger line “Fight law and order, disobey. There is no justice, there is no peace. Everybody say fuck the police.”

9) Of course, I couldn’t make this list without including Geoff Berner’s version released in 2011 that includes contemporary examples of police brutality in Canada.

10) And lastly, I’ll include a cover of Geoff Berner’s version by Slovenian band Campo Krizi. The vocals by Eva Brajkovič are just beautiful.

[smolstarthief]

Persona 5/Persona 5 Strikers: Pro-Police or Anti-Police?

Hoo boy... So this honestly has been a LONG time coming on my end because I have seen so much of that debate on social media (Twitter namely) and I can see the points of BOTH sides but there have been moments where it just got out of hand... Especially whenever people tried to put in a more grey/nuanced take only to be slammed and taken out of context. Even repeatedly mentioning the interrogation at the beginning of P5 which, I will admit has gotten tiresome. At least for me, I do still feel for Joker and I wished the game acknowledged his trauma more but there's a thing called, "beating a dead horse" and this is one along with "Haru says ACAB" in Strikers (which was done THREE TIMES in the same arc and it got annoying fast, like shut up already! We get it!). So, let's dive in a little bit:

MAJOR SPOILERS UNDER THE CUT!!!

Persona 5/Persona 5 Royal

Now let me just say I know! Police in Japan are just as bad if not worse than the West and I STILL hate the idea of Makoto wanting to become a cop for such naive reasons (especially with what happened to Sae, her own sister!)... But there are at least some of form of nuances sometimes and by that I mean, I can see what they were trying to do? I do agree that P5/P5S backpedaled SEVERELY by deciding to sweep issues under the rug after addressing them and not continuing from such. In fact I feel like it could have been a hell of a lot better. But P5 did something different compared to previous games and addresses the issues DIRECTLY right at the beginning of said game! It was tense and horrifying, but needed. Of course... They then sweep it under the rug and act like nothing traumatic happened to our protag which is NOT a good look at all and I'm still pissed off about it. In the main game's case, it's portrayed as more black and white with only a SMALL amount of nuance like that cop that was trying to help Futaba when she went out by herself and got lost (which people ignore entirely by the way). So I CAN see where people got the "anti-police" message from... But that's only the tip of the iceberg as it's ACTUALLY more about Systematic Corruption, not exactly or JUST police corruption. Namely in politics with Shido and the Conspiracy (which is apparently still somewhat around in Strikers until Owada's downfall) controlling everything all the way to law enforcement. The force had been basically under his payroll (including the corrupt SIU Director before his death) whether by force or not (mostly not in this case though). Now honestly, the police depicted there are undoubtedly rotten to the core save for a VERY SMALL handful (the cop that was trying to help Futaba which, again, gets ignored by several). Look at the interrogators who ruthlessly beat and drug a minor without any second thought or remorse for example. But again, the black and white narrative the game kept unwittingly doing ended up being to its detriment in a way. I'm not defending those assholes AT ALL! They deserved every punishment given to them! But for a game that goes on about grey morality... It doesn't quite deliver on that. Still though, it does emphasize that it's more of the fault of the whole corrupt system, not just one part of it. There needs to be change and reform which is what our MCs were trying to do in a way (more like inspiring change but still). In the end, it's all about the following:

Corruption and abuse of power.

Again the police depicted in this game were incompetent at best, corrupt at worse with very few silver linings. But it's not just them but rather the one person responsible for the whole mess. Who had them under his payroll? Who controlled them and by extension all of Tokyo? Who was willing to dispose of anyone who "outlives their usefulness" or is perceived as a threat to what he wants (including his own family)?

SHIDO AND BY EXTENSION THE CONSPIRACY

Bottom line: They are definitely a problem but it's not just them.

"But, Joker and his trauma?"

I definitely understand that and still do. I fully believe he has and still has trauma with the police. Easy! But... I do feel like people go too far with it sometimes. It's hard to explain but there have been moments where people either use it as a justification/argument against someone trying to provide a more nuanced view of things or... Dare I say, depict him like a "uwu soft traumatized boi." Like I said, it's hard to explain on my end so feel free to ignore it. Everyone deals with trauma differently so there is STRONG chance that I'm overanalyzing it. I just remember moments where I just feel a little, I guess annoyed? I'm not sure exactly but final thing: I understand what he went through and I can't imagine how long it would take to recover but I hope he DOES overcome it.

"Sae? Akechi?"

Yep, even though their jobs are different, they are by and large members of law enforcement no matter how you spin it. Both were broken in a way. Akechi is pretty easy to explain with how Shido negatively impacted his life but not much about Sae, who dealt with sexism/misogyny at her workplace along with the trauma of her father's (also a cop) death. She no doubt had some idealism only to be hit with the fact that she's gonna have to use underhanded/downright illegal tactics to get by and even rise up the ranks. She, therefore ended up (well, nearly) corrupted herself before coming to her senses. That's honestly one of the BIGGEST REASONS why I felt like Makoto joining the force to become a police commissioner isn't a good, even a downright naïve, idea. I honestly would have been somewhat fine with it if it weren't for that fact among other things. Regardless of her willpower, it will go south fast.

Now... Onto Strikers!

Persona 5 Strikers

Since the game came out and I started playing it, I still feel like the system is still beyond saving, especially when attempting to do it from the inside. But I don't mind the added nuances that P5 didn't do much of. It's still continuing the critiques, just shows more of what does happen within said system and even has an ACTUAL officer (Zenkichi) say, "Yeah, my job sucks, everyone's corrupt, there are much better ways to do things and make a change but not this. I'm only staying because I have a daughter to take care of and it's all I know. I'm no different from them." Was it all handled well? I wouldn't say "yes" (Joker's trauma is BARELY addressed at all of course) but a little better than what P5's narrative did which only addressed the issues but not exactly follow up on them. Now to be fair... In the system, regardless of where you live, any one within it who remotely tries to do something or speak against it either lose their jobs or even go "missing" irl. Those have happened and it's more proof that yeah, it's rotten to the core. There's no denying it but regardless, that's NOT what the game is about at all. At least that's what I feel about it as it's only PART of the narrative. I think Zenkichi puts it best here:

Speaking of Zenkichi... Oh boy... Now I definitely understand some of the criticisms with him but honestly, he was the best written (PT) character I've ever encountered! He was honestly the perfect representation of those that genuinely want to help and do good, only to be held back by an extremely harsh reality. It was already hinted at with Sae but here? It 100 percent confirms just how harsh and even cutthroat it can be if it could break someone's idealism so badly. Even Kaburagi of all people thinks the same thing Zenkichi said:

Then there's his past and it's a tragic one! But let's look more at the decisions he ended up making:

While it was no doubt done to protect his daughter, he ended making a selfish decision along with a selfless one (which was brilliant!) with not only allowing the cover up of his wife's death and denying justice for her, but also ruining an innocent person and their family's lives.

It's horrible, but also... There's a grey area/nuance as with the rest of his character. It was both understandable, but also wrong as he, as Akane's Shadow puts it:

He sacrificed his values, his morals, all for the sake of having a peace of mind. Speaking of Akane, she's also an interesting case in a way that she more or less perfectly represents the more "black and white" views on justice in general. Namely the more toxic/biased kind. Her reasons are also understandable but she was also acting selfishly by only focusing on how SHE was effected by Aoi's death and not even considering those that were also grieving her death and/or that people grieve/handle grief differently than her. But back on topic.

Her own views and beliefs that law enforcement basically SHOULD be dismantled (mostly out of said childish bias and black & white views) and it's framed as WRONG and it's very much correct on that. Chaos and order are two sides of the same coin, one can't exist without the other. When I say ACAB, I'm calling for reform, defund, have the corrupt held accountable for EVERYTHING and even face jail time for their crimes! Defund the police, have the ones that arrest, harm, and even murder out of bias (race, gender, etc.), lose their badges/jobs and locked up, make improvements! It's saying that there IS still corruption out there and there's no denying it. But fully eliminating the law in general will just lead to more problems. Now granted, she's young and clearly doesn't fully understand why those views are ultimately wrong but still... It was a very interesting subject to tackle and I feel like they handled it well.

Now back to Zenkichi, he was at first in denial about his decisions ultimately being the wrong ones too and even tries to justify it. Of course, his Shadow said otherwise and that was when he finally admitted that he really did act no different from the criminals he despised. But it also doesn't mean he can't redeem himself and that's what ultimately leads to his new resolve:

That right there along with everything else! There's the nuance! And ultimately despite some hiccups, Strikers handled the grey morality and nuance beautifully! Especially regarding law enforcement! Dare I say, even better than the base game! It continues the critiques with no problem but also showing different sides and areas of it! There is good and evil, but what about in-between? What about the more greyer area? It still says that there IS corruption, sometimes even beyond saving but... Sometimes a small silver lining is hidden somewhere.

Now, the ultimate question:

Is P5 & P5S (namely the latter) Pro-Police or Anti-Police?

Personally, my answer is this: Neither.

Why? What theme do they both have in common?

JUSTICE

Someone puts it best on Twitter that the games are more pro-justice and I fully agree!

P5/P5S gives the idea about following your OWN justice, your OWN moral code and rules, paving your OWN path and not let others dictate it! That's what the MCs ultimately start to learn in both games. Therefore it's pro-justice. Again, do I agree that the system is beyond saving? Yeah. Do I at least acknowledge and understand what the narratives are trying to say and nuances regardless even if I don't agree with some writing decisions (ex: Makoto wanting to become a commissioner despite everything)? Also yes. But at the same time, don't judge a book by its cover for other people (not just law enforcement and politics mind you). Especially some that genuinely DO want to help at best. That there is nuance and greyness, just have to look closely. Some of the MCs are still TERRIBLY written and executed (even annoying) but the message was still somewhat there.

Final Thoughts

Now I fully understand how you all feel of course! I still believe in ACAB and even I agree that maybe I'm one to talk and have a lot more to learn about the world... This is just my own attempt at putting my own two cents in. If you disagree, that's fine! This is just what I've felt should be at least talked about more often. And I tried to phrase it as best as I can without coming off as insensitive or ignorant and if I did, I sincerely apologize for that! I'm not trying to say, come off as a "bootlicker" or any of the sort. I'm just trying show discuss more of the grey areas and nuances that are, more often than not, constantly overlooked. How one interprets both games is ultimately up to them. You, the player. And this is my own interpretation. Simple as that. I hope you all have a good day/afternoon/evening!

[nexyra]

Okay so This is just a way to let out some frustration so I can put it out there and stop mulling on it bc I'm bad at this sort of stuff - Feel free to ignore it

I'm putting this under Read More; if your fav past-time is to call anyone who likes Ironwood's character or was disappointed by his V8 turn to villainy a stupid bootlicker who "should have seen the signs he was always a tyrant !!" please don't interact with this post. You're ultimately free to think what you want but honestly I see enough of that in the main tag when left alone, I don't need it on my blog it doesn't make me feel good.

Anyone else... well you can read if you're interested but you don't have to either. Feel free to respectfully disagree though, I'm not that bullheaded that I can't partake in a friendly argument =) I'll just be listing some things about Ironwood's reading by the FNDM who get old or draining as someone who doesn't like the V8-characterization they went with

Can people please stop just... copy/pasting real world issues on a world/characters that have nothing to do with them or a completely different context ?

Like,, I genuinely try to educate myself on real-world issues. I know I'm rather privileged so I try to listen and hear out people who speak out about the issues they live through day by day. I know why the "ACAB" moniker exists. I understand the problem that lies within the american police system (and likely other countries as well). I see why the army, on our blue planet, is criticized & its many failings. Etc, the list can go on...

But I'm sorry to say, Remnant isn't OUR Earth. Their Army's primary job is to fight actual evil soulless monsters, not people. The Ace Opps or Huntsmen are not an organization directly inherited from slave-hunting groups. James Ironwood isn't the US army general bombing Middle East. Clover Ebi isn't the racist cop you want in prison. So WHY are they treated as such by so many people ? Stories are not a 1-1 where you can take everything you know and just apply it to a completely different world.

Has Atlas been presented as a country that suffers from racism & classism ? Certainly. Has it be shown this way ? That's already more debatable since the only racist arguments we got were in Mantle (which is the city we're supposed to be rooting for so that's a weird choice but eh it's whatever). Are the characters, as persons, shown to evoke these issues in a way that deserve our scorn ? Not really.

Is Ironwood depicted as particularly racist for example ? I wouldn't say so seeing as one (or more considering Tortuga) of his Ace-Opps are Faunus & it seems perfectly accepted; and he hates Jacques Schnee's guts. So why does he get to shoulder all of our real-world issues as if he was responsible for them, in a context where (pre V8) his army had most likely never killed anything else than Grimm and was shown to elicit very positive reactions from most of the population (V3) ? (In direct contrast to the polarization that the US army might evoke for example.)

You can totally hate Ironwood because of the feelings he evoke, the trope he stems from or the parallels to be made. That doesn't mean however, that he IS truly guilty of every one of OUR world issues (pre-V8)

Just because classism is prevalent in Atlas society does not make Ironwood the figurehead & leader of this issue.

Is classism an issue in Atlas ? Yes. That's been made clear because of Mantle's state as well as Jacques Schnee entire existence & even Cinder's backstory. Does that mean every single one of Ironwood's decisions reeks of classism ? NO

Trust me, as someone who found Ironwood's V8 characterization not... well-executed & too much; there's nothing more annoying than being assaulted by posts about his fall going "it was so obvious !! look at -" only for them to then list reasons in a really biased way or even headcannons based on (again) irl problems. An exemple...

Reasons his turn was good that I see thrown around : "Ironwood left Mantle behind because he only wanted to save the rich. He's a selfish coward & an asshole !"

What we were actually given : "Ironwood suffers from PTSD, and faced with Salem's imminent arrival, he tried to save what he was CERTAIN to be able to protect aka the flying city and all the people on it including Mantle evacuees. There is absolutely no text backing the idea that he wanted to leave with Atlas because it's rich. We could even suppose that he would have left with the 'poor' Mantle if it was the flying city and rich people were hanging safely on the ground. There is indeed an issue with Atlas & Mantle disparity, but Ironwood isn't directly responsible for it."

Does that make his decision to leave Mantle behind a morally right one ? That's of course NOT what I'm saying. The situation is still very ambiguous. But the classism theme has NO place here.

"Ironwood leads Atlas & Mantle. As such, he inherently holds responsability for the issues plaguing it." THIS is an acceptable reading according to me. I would probably argue that even if Ironwood's the only Atlas leader we're shown; he actually only oversees the military & academy (where we haven't ever seen classism issues), so putting Atlas' classism issues on him still doesn't sound fair to me. However the idea & argument is sound.

Acknowledging only how his actions look/the tyrannical surface reading and not the reasonnable justifications or glimpses we were given (pre-V7) of Ironwood being more than his trope

I'll probably stop after this one, but the last thing that is both tiring & annoying after too much of it; is seeing people boil down all of Ironwood's character to the most basic summary, inherently written to paint him in a bad line. And then saying that everything led up to his downfall by using these watered-down versions of the show's events to justify it. Or worse (imo), saying that people who are not satisfied with his V8 characterization that THEY don't understand how good a character he is and don't really appreciate him.... All the while only ever highlighting his characters flaws. Please stop this.

"Ironwood brought an army to the peace Olympics why are you surprised he turned out this way ?" ==> Ironwood brought an army to a country where the civilians visibly have no issue with said-army, to protect a peaceful event that he KNOWS to be targeted by foes. It's definitely overzealous & his conviction that threats should be dealt with by blunt force IS one of his flaws; but pretending that he did it for fun or because he's a tyran is just as misplaced.

"Ironwood said he'd shoot Qrow if he were one of his men why are you surprised he shot Oscar ?" ==> Do I really need to flip through every joke in this show and consider it as absolute truth & proof that the character would enact these words if given the occasion; even when we're shown with certainty that they actually don't mean it ? (IW hugging Qrow to welcome him, refusing to attack Qrow when he's certain Qrow IS attacking him...)

"Ironwood has his military all over Mantle, there's a curfew, all of this is tyrannical why are you surprised he's also down for genocide" ==> Damn, it sure is criminal to have Mantle defended from the litteral monsters roaming inside & out, and to make sure with a curfew that the people are not at risk during the night. I wonder if any recent events could make us reconsider our stance on how evil a enforced curfew is. Mhmmm maybe a pandemic ? Nah I must be imagining things. For real though, at what point did Tyrian's framing/lies (IW has his soldiers all over Mantle because of politics/he's a tyran who refuses opposition) became the truth of the situation for the FDNM too ? Again Mantle's situations SUCK, and that's a problem in itself. Making up problematic reasoning for the situation is dishonest though.

To end this, I'll just make clear. I do not condone any of Ironwood's actions post-V7. I don't think he had to be the big hero of the Atlas arc. Nor that he was without faults. I merely think that he'd have been a better antagonist than villain. And that it'd have been nice to keep the ambiguity/morally greyness that surrounds him; the knowledge that he's TRYING hard to do what's best for everyone; that he has good intentions. That he cares about individuals too to a lesser degree, and that he had people who cared about him as a person.

For short... Ironwood as an antagonist with understandable issues, flaws & failures; making questionable choices but with good intentions ? Hell yeah. Ironwood as a villain, more irredeemable than Hazel, willing to kill people for NO reason or even wipe out a city ? I'm not convinced.

[kitkatopinions]

I'm tired of fantasy world writers being like 'oh, this is my allegory for racism in my fantasy world where actual racism doesn't exist, also I'm going to not do any research on how to properly include said allegory, badly portray it, make my main characters affected by this white or white passing, and then use racist stereotypes later.' Long post full of RWBY criticism ahead.

RWBY is terrible with the Faunus racism they chose to make part of their story. They made the White Fang an evil terrorist group, they made Blake lecture fellow Faunus about how they're the ones actually hurting themselves by using violence against each other, they framed comfortable and peaceful protest as the only good way despite establishing that peaceful protest didn't work, and they made their child slave coded character who literally got branded turn into nothing more than an abusive stalker and then had him killed without ever addressing the aforementioned child slavery. Also, the only Faunus among our main cast now that Sun is gone is one of the most privileged of the Faunus. Blake can pass as a human if she wants to, she grew up fairly rich, she has two loving parents, and she comes from an inherently powerful position as the daughter of the Chief. Having Blake be privileged would be absolutely fine, if she acknowledged her privilege, wasn’t the mouthpiece on Faunus rights, if she wasn’t the only Faunus in our main cast, and if she didn’t repeatedly lecture other Faunus.

On top of that, two of our main cast have been racist (within the narrative of the show) towards our main Faunus character, one of them learns from it (even though that as well was badly handled) and became the only member of Team RWBY to ever call out human's being racist after season three. Oh wait, except the other member of our main cast that was racist that never had it addressed because it was treated like a joke now has yelled at a racist once, in an incredibly tense situation, so I guess her racism is gone. It’s good that it’s gone, since CRWBY is pushing her and Blake as a couple, but it’s frustrating that her racism never even got a ‘that wasn’t funny’ and we never see Yang learn any better, because it feels like CRWBY brushed it off and acted like it was fun and quirky instead of treating it like the casual racism it was. They do a similar thing with Robyn in season seven which came out in 2019, when she calls Marrow ‘Wags.’ Also none of our main cast are ever seen protesting for Faunus rights (sans a two second flashback of child Blake at a rally and a non canon RWBY chibi cartoon.) I don't think Ruby - our main protagonist - has ever even mentioned Faunus rights. In a world where Adam was branded with the SDC logo under fifteen years ago at the most, racism and fighting racism should be a big part of the story, and instead, it's brushed to the side and used for the occasional 'we don't like racism btw' moment now that Blake got rid of a Faunus run terrorist group. To me, this implies that the number one threat to the Faunus… Was the Faunus, and although some humans are still anti-Faunus, no one has to devote their time or energy into fighting for equality. In season 7, Blake doesn’t even attend the rally of the political figure running against Jacques Schnee - who as far as I’m aware, is the only business owner or person in power who has ever displayed anti-Faunus racism in the show. By the way, please feel free to correct me if I’m wrong. It’s been a hot minute since I watched through the show.

Instead of attending a rally that seems very important for the Faunus, Blake goes dancing with her crush. It’s like she stopped caring about politics and rights after the White Fang got removed. That feels so bad. Also, I'll note that most of the actual POC Faunus that can't pass as white in this show are on the bad side (Sienna, Fennec, Corsac, Lionheart, Ilia, Marrow.) And either they die, or they must learn to give up their destructive ways and become better people. I’m not saying this was intentional, I’m saying it’s a pattern, it’s alarming, and the writers should’ve known better.

I believe Miles Luna and Kerry Shawcross have admitted that they mishandled Faunus racism, but first off, it still doesn’t excuse them because they were grown people putting out a product that premiered in 2013 and they should’ve known to do research and do better. But second off, I still feel like they haven't done the research they need to and continue to mishandle the racism by ignoring it when they want to and bringing it up only to let us as an audience know Weiss and Yang aren't racist anymore. They can’t just cut the Faunus from their storyline now, but they can’t just ignore it, and need to actually make it a better allegory. Honestly though, one of the big reasons I'm convinced that they still haven't done any real research on how to properly portray POC or racism is because of how terribly they're handling the Ace Ops.

They're writing a fantasy show, they aren't tied to real world portrayals of law enforcement, but they went the route of commentating on real world police, corrupt police, and use of excessive force. That's fine. But things are already pretty dicey just starting off because of how they've mishandled and continue to mishandle Faunus racism. Outside of Jacques Schnee and his company and business partners, I don't remember seeing Faunus racism in Atlas (not Mantle, Atlas.) If I'm wrong about that, again, please correct me, I may have missed it. But without seeing actual discrimination against Faunus within the police force, right off the bat, that's a mishandling of commentating on police brutality. But also, other than Clover who is now dead, the Ace Ops are all people of color. CRWBY made their bad cops all not white. Even Ironwood - who is white passing - is voiced by a person of color who has said he believes that James is Chinese American. I'll point out that being a Hunter is pretty much just being a cop with more freedom and seemingly less rules. Qrow (a Beacon Huntsman) goes around destroying public property and comments on how some hunters work outside of the law, and yet it's only the Ace Ops who are held to real world ACAB rules and everyone else gets to be a good cop/law enforcement officer. Ruby gets to proudly proclaim herself a Huntress, Weiss gets to arrest people, Jaune gets told that he deserves his Huntsman license, we've been getting told for seven seasons that Hunters help people and do what's right, and we're given long time Hunters and mentor figures like Oobleck, Glynda, Qrow, and now Robyn is being framed that way, and they back that up. Even training Atlas soldiers like Neon and Flynt are fine and fun. But only the Ace Ops are bad, corrupt law enforcement officers. So that way, we can have the entirely white passing Team RWBY beat up the entirely POC, not white passing Ace Ops. Even though Team RWBY is a byproduct of the same kind of program and even though we’ve seen the police discriminate against Faunus in Vale. If CRWBY wants their allegories to be taken seriously, they need to recognize that RWBY and co are also certified police. Also, it’s really not funny to see people use ACAB as a reason why the Ace Ops are of course bad, but then turn around and simp for Winter, and be like ‘We want Winter to be redeemed, but Harriet? What a bitch!’ Like… I’m side-eyeing that pretty hard.

Speaking of Winter, now she’s in charge of the Ace Ops. But unlike Marrow, Winter doesn’t just look sad sometimes and blindly only follow direct orders without protest. She’s actually feeling all kinds of things, and she’s actually being framed as strong, intelligent, and reasonable. I’m sure no one forgot this, but I’ll note it anyway; Winter is white. Having Winter be the only Ace Op to actually listen to JRY and do things without James explicitly telling her to (although I don’t consider what she did a betrayal or going behind his back) is dicey. They could’ve given this moment to Harriet and nothing would change. ‘This lady typically follows orders, is short tempered, and pushes down her emotions, but she can still recognize a fairly good idea when she sees one and can actually think for herself, so although this isn’t a betrayal, she compromises and lets Team JRY go after their friend.’ Yeah, idk guys, I feel like there was literally no reason to slot Winter in with the Ace Ops to be the lone voice of reason when Harriet could’ve become the new leader and played the exact same role. Instead, Winter gets to have a power move where she puts Harriet in her place. Winter is given actual depth and gets to put down the black woman who the writers have made display nothing but anger for the whole season. The fans rally behind Winter because she was given depth and hate Harriet because she has none, but that’s the fault of the writers. Btw, ‘this black woman won’t show any emotion besides anger’ is a racist stereotype. It would probably have taken like five minutes on google for Luna and Shawcross to have realized that it was a bad idea to write a black woman in any sort of position of power to be constantly angry + hiding her emotions. Elm is in the same boat as Harriet, and I was going to say it’s less severe, but then I remembered that she literally attacked Ren for talking about their emotions.

Look, my point is that RWBY as a show has never handled allegories like racism and corrupt police well, and either they should stop trying and stick to ‘make believe land is just different than the real world’ or start putting in the work and fix this. By the way, I’m not trying to make anyone feel bad for watching or even enjoying RWBY, but I hope people can watch it while recognizing that some of the things CRWBY has chosen to put into their show are destructive and that the creators need to be called out. I’ll continue to hope that most RWBY fans do recognize that RWBY is deeply flawed, but I’ve just been stewing recently about someone who told me that I shouldn’t have expected the show to address Faunus racism in the Atlas arcs because that ended when Adam died.

I want to make it totally clear that I agree with and support ACAB in the real world and I'm not against it being used in fantasy works, I just think CRWBY is doing a poor job of portraying it and many fans are misusing it and it feels disrespectful. This is an actual real world movement with actual real world consequences. It feels very bad to see people use it to argue that the writers who have never handled allegories of racism well can make an all POC group be a destructive, violent, easily controlled, easily beat group of corrupt cops that need a white woman and fellow cop to be the voice of reason.

[faelapis]

@babybeetlebongos asked me whether i thought more “forgiving media” like SU will not be looked fondly upon by history because it’s not as “violent” as your spops or your gravity falls, and i had a lot of thoughts about that. tw for discussion of real-life politics, hopefully with enough sensitivity to explain where i’m coming from without being extremely tacky. i’ll probably fail, and i’m very open to criticism here, but i’ll try.

many people conflate healing with violence, and change with punishment. i don’t think they’re right about that, i think some people mischaracterize where SU would fall within “the politics of the moment” in the short term, even though SU takes the much more long-term, “cultures actually need to change over time, and there’s reasons people are the way they are that are bigger than the individual, and nobody will change if you don’t give them reasons to think that the future includes them rather than punishes them for sociological phenomenon outside any individual’s control”.

because the thing is, systemic change and “punishing the bad guys” aren’t actually the same thing. they’re sometimes related, but they don’t have to be. i think the “peaceful vs violent protest” debate has obscured another debate altogether - which is individualism vs structuralism.

individualism posits that, infamously, there’s “no such thing as society”, we are all individuals and we are all accountable for our actions. we have perfectly free will, so therefore, anything we do can and should be used against us. 

structuralism posits that actually, we Do live in a society, and what we can and cannot do is extremely limited to our environments. everyone are shaped by their upbringings, socioeconomic status, culture, social norms, et cetera, and therefore, it’s more important to change society than to punish/reward individuals. our responsibility is collective, not just to ourselves. the point isn’t who is “bad”, the point is that society is the reason why many internalize bad beliefs, and that’s what we need to work on - it’s a collective failing that we haven’t, and we all need to take responsibility for *each other*.

and i think a lot of people who pretend to be for systemic change would settle for punishing their abusers, when it should really be the other way around. i really hate “individualistic leftism”, as a structural leftist myself.

to take the current political example, which, yes, i know is tacky and not the point, but it was what prompted the discussion so i think i have no choice but to address what the discussion actually became - defund the police is more important, imo, than punishing individual officers. one is transformational change on a large scale that actually makes life better for people. the other... is really just venting / individualizing things, as if it would fix anything. to me, the fix is not about punishing the bad guys, it’s changing the system as a whole.

i understand the idea of "why not both", i'm not against that, but i try to be consistently against individualistic framing. thinking punishing individuals fixes systems is equally a shitty liberal mindset as thinking that things will go “back to normal” once trump is out of office. it just has an edgier, more violent spin. 

and that’s what bothers me about the framing of media like spop or gravity falls as the “good, revolutionary” media to SU’s “bad, reformist :(” media lens. it’s really reductive, and it makes that key prioritization that “punishment > change”, which is a very conservative mindset. 

SU actually changes the system. the diamonds are no longer in power, and there is no hierarchy. everyone are slowly changing to find themselves in a world where everyone equally has the chance to do so. gravity falls and spop gets rid of the bad guy on top and thinks that fixes everything. to those latter shows, the status quo was actually fine, we just needed to get rid of the bad people. to SU, it’s the opposite - we can’t expect getting rid of the “bad guys” to “fix everything” (that’s what rose tried to do w/pink), because the sociological cultural norms of gemkind means that they’re taught to love the diamonds. so if you just kill them, you become their bad guys (the way everyone reacted to “killing” pink). you have to have the compassion to understand that to these people, this idolization is normal, and dismantle that normal without condemning the people as a whole. 

but that’s not as sexy as “valid to kill anyone who does The Bad Things. having revenge fantasies about punishing your abusers = good leftist praxis. we fix things by punishing individuals for social issues beyond their control”.

and what’s sad about that mindset is that it often, actually, doesn’t think things can truly get better. nothing that happened in spop stops more shadow weavers from popping up, because the sociological conditions that lead to abuse haven’t been dealt with. it doesn’t seem to think it CAN be proactively prevented, only punished once the children are already scarred.

SU is a lot more... hopeful yet deterministic, in a way? as in, it thinks about (and cares about) how we are influenced by each other. it wants to achieve social equality so that those power relationships don’t exist to influence us in negative ways anymore. with the understanding that nobody is above those influences (not even the “good” privileged people like steven*). whereas spop - and gravity falls - are very much not that. they are individualistic. you kill the bad guys on top and that solves eeeeverything. no cultures need to change. they just need to be intimidated into knowing the “good” people are on top now and obeying them.

(*future is basically saying there’s no good diamond to replace the bad ones, and nobody should be "on top”. it hurts everyone - the same way the expectations of patriarchy hurts everyone. we’ve molded the ones on top into thinking they must and should take responsibility for everything, when that is neither good nor realistic. we’re all, collectively, responsible for healing the traumatized & creating equal relationships. and we can’t do that by individual reward & punishment. as much as that would validate some people’s anger.)

and those people? they’re ultimately just venting their feelings. which is fine. many have been told that their personal anger is something to be demonized, so they vent by engaging in these validation circle-jerks about how good and important it is to be angry. and then many think they’re woke leftists FOR being angry, rather than anger being a personal emotion without inherent good or evil.

many of them have people who’ve hurt them personally that they want to hurt back, or they just wanna make sure to condemn the Bad People so nobody will think they side with or excuse the bad people. the idea is that somebody needs to hurt. so we just gotta make sure it’s the “right” people.

maybe one day, they will realize that actually, social issues are bigger than individuals - and this goes both ways. it can’t just mean “and so we can’t blame the poor, disadvantaged for not being A+ students”, it must also mean “and so dismantling cishet privilege is more important than punishing individual, ignorant cishet people”. that’s the only way to be consistently sociological in your framing.

we don’t decide our upbringings, social norms, who are demonized/deified by society, or who has unjust amounts of power. we’re shaped by our environments, and so, it’s more important to change those environments (and undo those power structures) than to kill individuals we consider particularly heinous. punishing those individuals will not lead to social change. it never has. people generally don’t think they have to change because others were made “examples” of. they revel in being in a “battle”. people like having a fixed bad guy to fight. cops like the power & sympathy it gives them.

the current protests... aren’t even “violent”, in the spop or gravity falls sense. they’re just... property damage and collective direct action, which is much more targeted at dismantling the system than to punish individuals. they’re not really violent. people aren’t killing individual cops, they’re demanding that THE SYSTEM AS A WHOLE change. its cop culture that’s bad, it doesn’t matter if the individual cop is good or bad. ACAB because the system sucks. even if you try to be a “good” cop, you’re likely to be fired for speaking up, because the whole culture is awful.

this is kinda similar to something SU is saying - changing the system is more important than figuring out who “the bad people” are and killing them. people think they’re doing the right thing, but ultimately, the structures around them are making them think the hierarchies they’re in are just. it’s the whole of cop culture that needs to change, and maybe the idea of cops in general is a bad one. the system is the problem, and it’s bigger than any individual... which in turn means, or SHOULD mean, that the system can be destroyed and the individuals within it can change, because they’re not really “the problem”. the idea of putting the individual responsible offers behind bars is a fine one, but... it’s more symbolic than truly transformational. the true transformation would be to defund the police. 

i know these media comparisons are inherently tacky. they are. anyone who thinks that is more important than what’s going on irl is being shitty about it. you should be donating, protesting, doing a million more important irl things.

but these tacky comparisons ARE happening, and some people do think “liking the right media” is praxis, so... if you really wanna fit gravity falls or spop into this, the analogy would be more akin to like. defeating the biggest, scariest cop, and thinking that’s somehow gonna change policing as an institution. or thinking that someone killing trump will make all the police & right-wingers go away.

basically, it’s conflating your vengeance with true change. it’s spitting on the leftist value of universal compassion in the face of the sociological nature of reality, in which Everyone are influenced by their privileges and lack thereof in ways that are bigger than individual circumstances (and thus can’t be undone by individual punishment), and so we’re all responsible. but you’d rather not be - because you’d rather see the right people burn than focus your anger at the world and at challenging yourself and your own privileges.