#ableist disabled people

[lordofdapies]

This is not a post about people with severe disabilities. @nightmaretour listed” people with fibromyalgia/pots/hEDs” first.

This is a post about silencing folk who are “less disabled” and shaming them into sharing the spotlight.

You aren’t even being coy about it.

If you were capable of self reflection you would be very ashamed of yourself right now. This is how they win.

You’re not trying to bring attention to severe disabilities. This is not how it’s done.

If you manage to raise yourself up this way, you’ll be sitting on a pile of shit

You don’t speak for me

[aetherial-boy]

Disabled people should be allowed to exist in public. Yes, I mean all disabled people.

That includes people with tic disorders.

That includes people who smell ‘bad’.

That includes people who can’t help being loud.

That includes people who move ‘strangely’.

That includes people with bulky mobility aids.

That includes people who drool.

That includes people who struggle with incontinence.

We all should get to exist, however that looks, and go out in public, use public transport, do activities outside our homes. And we should be allowed to do those things without being glared at or having ableist things said to us.

[giantkillerjack]

Today my therapist introduced me to a concept surrounding disability that she called "hLep".

[plain-text version of this post can be found under the cut]

Which is when you - in this case, you are a disabled person - ask someone for help ("I can't drink almond milk so can you get me some whole milk?", or "Please call Donna and ask her to pick up the car for me."), and they say yes, and then they do something that is not what you asked for but is what they think you should have asked for ("I know you said you wanted whole, but I got you skim milk because it's better for you!", "I didn't want to ruin Donna's day by asking her that, so I spent your money on an expensive towing service!") And then if you get annoyed at them for ignoring what you actually asked for - and often it has already happened repeatedly - they get angry because they "were just helping you! You should be grateful!!"

And my therapist pointed out that this is not "help", it's "hLep".

Sure, it looks like help; it kind of sounds like help too; and if it was adjusted just a little bit, it could be help. But it's not help. It's hLep.

At its best, it is patronizing and makes a person feel unvalued and un-listened-to. Always, it reinforces the false idea that disabled people can't be trusted with our own care. And at its worst, it results in disabled people losing our freedom and control over our lives, and also being unable to actually access what we need to survive.

So please, when a disabled person asks you for help on something, don't be a hLeper, be a helper! In other words: they know better than you what they need, and the best way you can honor the trust they've put in you is to believe that!

Also, I want to be very clear that the "getting angry at a disabled person's attempts to point out harmful behavior" part of this makes the whole thing WAY worse. Like it'd be one thing if my roommate bought me some passive-aggressive skim milk, but then they heard what I had to say, and they apologized and did better in the future - our relationship could bounce back from that. But it is very much another thing to have a crying shouting match with someone who is furious at you for saying something they did was ableist. Like, Christ, Jessica, remind me to never ask for your support ever again! You make me feel like if I asked you to call 911, you'd order a pizza because you know I'll feel better once I eat something!!

Edit: crediting my therapist by name with her permission - this term was coined by Nahime Aguirre Mtanous!

Edit again: I made an optional follow-up to this post after seeing the responses. Might help somebody. CW for me frankly talking about how dangerous hLep really is.

Plain-text version:

Today my therapist introduced me to a concept surrounding disability that she called "hLep".

Which is when you - in this case, you are a disabled person - ask someone for help ("I can't drink almond milk so can you get me some whole milk?", or "Please call Donna and ask her to pick up the car for me."), and they say yes, and then they do something that is not what you asked for but is what they think you should have asked for ("I know you said you wanted whole, but I got you skim milk because it's better for you!", "I didn't want to ruin Donna's day by asking her that, so I spent your money on an expensive towing service!") And then if you get annoyed at them for ignoring what you actually asked for - and often it has already happened repeatedly - they get angry because they "were just helping you! You should be grateful!!"

And my therapist pointed out that this is not "help", it's "hLep".

Sure, it looks like help; it kind of sounds like help too; and if it was adjusted just a little bit, it could be help. But it's not help. It's hLep.

At its best, it is patronizing and makes a person feel unvalued and un-listened-to. Always, it reinforces the false idea that disabled people can't be trusted with our own care. And at its worst, it results in disabled people losing our freedom and control over our lives, and also being unable to actually access what we need to survive.

So please, when a disabled person asks you for help on something, don't be a hLeper, be a helper! In other words: they know better than you what they need, and the best way you can honor the trust they've put in you is to believe that!

P.S. Also, I want to be very clear that the "getting angry at a disabled person's attempts to point out harmful behavior" part of this makes the whole thing WAY worse. Like it'd be one thing if my roommate bought me some passive-aggressive skim milk, but then they heard what I had to say, and they apologized and did better in the future - our relationship could bounce back from that. But it is very much another thing to have a crying shouting match with someone who is furious at you for saying something they did was ableist. Like, Christ, Jessica, remind me to never ask for your support ever again! You make me feel like if I asked you to call 911, you'd order a pizza because you know I'll feel better once I eat something!!

Edit: crediting my therapist by name with her permission - this term was coined by Nahime Aguirre Mtanous!

Edit again: I made an optional follow-up to this post after seeing the responses. Might help somebody. CW for me frankly talking about how dangerous hLep really is.

[everythingwasnormalhere]

There's so much wrong with "everyone is a little bit autistic"

Yes, allistic people might know a lot of facts about the things they like. Yes, allistic people might get a bit overwhelmed or underwhelmed sometimes. Yes, allistic people might not get an expression sometimes, mostly if it's the first time they hear it.

That doesn't make them autistic.

Those traits only make someone autistic when they become disabling. Because, big shock, autism is a disability. Yeah, even if someone is low support needs, because that doesn't mean they don't need any support at all.

Saying "everyone is a little bit autistic" is like saying "everyone struggles with this, so suck it up, you have no right to need help". Which is just pure ableist bullshit. It denies the fact that autistic people have higher support needs than NTs, no matter where in the autistic spectrum they are. We're not "neurospicy", we're disabled, and denying this fact is denying us the right to get the help we need, we deserve, to have a good life.

(yes, this rant is just because I made the awful decision of listening to "neurospicy (interlude)" by Jax. honestly I'd rather be called a slur than listen to that shit again.)

[noagskryf]

Do people not understand that even if someone was surrounded by money and food and water and clothing and shelter, if they physically cannot feed themselves or dress themselves, they would die? Because i feel like some people think that the Great Solution is eradicate poverty and not "accept that some disabled people do rely on constant care and no amount of resources can substitute the need for human help"

Obviously poverty and inequalities in society make it harder for disabled people to survive but i don't think some activists understand that disability itself is disabling and disability isn't just an outcome of ones circumstances

[thedisablednaturalist]

I think some of us ambulatory wheelchair users are getting pretty close to (or already are) throwing full time users and higher support needs disableds under the bus. And that shit needs to be shut down NOW.

It's the problem of: "how dare they treat us like those people!"

The problem with ableists isn't that they assume we can't walk The problem is they assume we don't need our wheelchairs if we can. That we don't need our handicapped placards or transport vehicles. That we are taking advantage of other "actually" disabled people, that the ableists also don't give a shit about unless they're using them as an excuse to be ableist.

The problem with ableists isn't that they assume we are intellectually and/or developmentally disabled. The problem is they assume that every intellectually/developmentally disabled person needs to be treated with baby talk, dismissal, and ignorance. That they don't see them as people and refuse to listen to intellectually and developmentally disabled voices without making fun of them.

Stop throwing people with higher support needs under the bus. Stop doing what the abled neurodivergent community did to all physically disabled people. Us cripples gotta stick together and fight for one another, not push one down to make ourselves somehow look better to ableist fucks.

[starfishinthedistance]

Friendly reminder that if you support reproductive rights and bodily autonomy but say that disabled people shouldn't have children because they'll pass down their genes which is "cruel" or "abusive", you do not support reproductive rights and bodily autonomy. Reproductive rights do not only concern abortion for cis white abled women.

[rjalker]

Dear people who aren't physically disabled who plan to write fantasy settings:

[ID: Several images taken from the Geordi La Forge yes and no meme format, with Geordi holding out a hand disapprovingly for the no section, then pointing in approval for the yes section.

The first image is the meme:

No: "Saying the existance of magic in your setting means there are no disabled people (this literally just means disabled people are killed. AKA eugenics)"

Yes: "Having disabled people who use magical mobility aids and other assistive devices. Realizing that someone is still disabled even if their prosthetic arm is made of magic instead of plastic."

This is followed by four more panels of yes section:

"Geordi la Forge is still literally disabled. His visor helping him does not erase his disability and make him magically abled."

"Toph from Avatar: The Last Airbender is still literally disabled even though her Earthbending helps her. It does not make her disability ~magically~ go away."

"Having your disability be accomodated does not mean the disability goes away. Having a prosthetic hand, even one that's made of magic, does not mean you're not disabled."

"Magical mobility aids do not mean disabled people don't exist. It just means they use magical mobility aids instead of plastic or metal ones. A limb made of magic is still a prosthetic even if it's made of the soul of the universe instead of plastic and metal."

Then another no panel: "'There's no disabled people beacuse magic'".

Then one last yes panel: "'Magic helps disabled people in a variety of ways'".

End ID.]

This also applies to science fiction; just because Luke Skywalker's prosthetic hand is super advanced doesn't mean it's no longer a prosthetic, or that he's not disabled. Same with Darth Vader - just because he has a suit that lets him breathe and walk around doesn't mean he's not disabled. (And Star Wars' propensity for making the villains visibly disabled while the heroes disabilities get covered up by super advanced prosthetics is a topic that deserves its own post, especially with how ableist some of the authors of the books are. Troy Denning is especially ableist)

Edit:

Because people keep being fucking obnoxious and ableist in the tags, yes,,, motherfuckers, if you refuse to have disabled people in your setting, that does make you fucking ableist. If you say that the magic is used to cure all disabled people and that's why they don't exist, that's fucking eugenics.

You cannot ""cure"", more like remove all disabilities without fucking eugenics. Magically automatically destroying disabled fetuses (a very fucking popular trope!) is eugenics.

The only way to fucking "cure" autism is to fucking kill all autistic people, also known as eugenics!

What about people with PTSD? Do you just fucking brainwash them so they aren't traumatized anymore?

Do you force all Deaf people to be able to hear? Do you force all blind people to be able to see? Do you force all anosmics to be able to smell?

Do you magically force everyone with a speech impediment to speak to your standards?

Do you force everyone born with bodily or facial differences to live up to your fucking standard of beauty?

You cannot fucking say "disablities don't exist in this universe because magic cures everything" without inherently saying that eugenics exists in your fucking universe.

Not all fucking disabilities need a cure. If you ""cured"" my autism I'd just be fucking dead. You'd literally just be changing me into what you think is fucking acceptable.

Stop fucking arguing in defence of ableists on my fucking post so you can pretend that eugenics has never been written about in magical settings when it is extremely fucking prevalent.

And while we're fucking at it, let your gods damned characters become disabled over the course of their story, and call them disabled within the fucking story. I don't care if they're a robot. I don't care if they have magic. Not all fucking damage can be fixed. Curses exist. Hardware can go out of fucking date and no longer be manufactured anywhere.

Let your characters become disabled and do not magically fucking cure them back to brand new every single time they get hurt. The only thing you accomplish by doing that is destroying any chance of ever having stakes.

No, "magical healing leaves scars on the mind from the memory of the injuries though!!!!" is not fucking good enough. Let your characters have scars. Let them become disabled. Stop being fucking ableist cowards.

Edit number fucking 2:

No, motherfuckers, you do not get to comment "if the disability was caused by magic it's not ableist to cure it with magic". You are the ableist this post is about. Shut the absolute fuck up, stop treating being disabled as the worst possible outcome, and just admit you're a fucking ableist. If you don't want your characters to become disabled, then don't fucking make them disabled.

[ID: The Garfield "you are not immune to propaganda" meme, now edited to read:

"If your first thought upon reading this post is, 'Oh, but it's okay to magically cure disabilities caused by magic!' Congrats…you are the exact sort of ableist jackass this post is about."

End ID.]

Edit number fucking 3:

Autistic people exist! People who are born with disabilities exist! You cannot create a setting where disabled people do not exist because we're all "cured" or "fixed" and not inherently say that you are killing disabled people as soon as they're born, or fucking aborting us as soon as you figure out we'd be born disabled! That's fucking eugenics!

There is no way to "cure" autism without eugenics! There is no way to "cure" people with body differences without eugenics! There is no way to make disabled people nonexistant in your setting without eugenics! Thinking you can and should "cure" and "fix" all disabilities IS EUGENICS!

Also:

[ID: A character shouting at the camera, now edited to read: "Shut up about Dungeons and Dragons! Shut up about Dungeons and Dragons! If the rules of Dungeons and Dragons are ableist, then fucking change them! It is your fucking personal responsability to be a better person than your bigoted society wants you to be!". End ID.]

[ID: White text on a dark brown background with white and black borders around the edges, that reads:

"I don't fucking know or care about Dungeons and Dragons.

This post is not about Dungeons and Dragons.

Do not fucking throw the rulebook of Dungeons and Dragons at me like it's some sort of 'Gotcha!'.

You will literally just be blocked like the rest of the ableist assholes who've already tried it.

If you play dungeons and dragons, it's your responsability to make your games not be ableist, even if it means breaking the rules.".

End ID.]

I do not fucking care what the ableist rules are in Dungeons of Dragons. Do not fucking throw ableist rules for a game I have never and will never play at me on a post I made so that people could learn how to make their settings less ableist. If the rules in Dungeons and Dragons are ableist, then fucking change them. If you don't want to change them, then stop fucking playing an ableist game.

Disabled people deserve to see ourselves represented in fiction just like everyone else, without any fucking requirements that we be "cured" or "fixed" before the story ends.

How the fuck would you feel if a trans and gay character's whole story revolved around going on a quest to become straight and cis, did so, and only then was allowed to live happily ever after?

Why do you fucking think suggesting people write stories about disabled people going on a quest to be cured because it's the only way they'll ever be happy is any less fucking offensive?

Also:

This post is NOT a place for you to talk about how disabled people in fiction should have the option of curing their disabilities. It's just not. That's the fucking default for this society. That is not a revolutionary concept. It's not novel. We fucking know this society wants us gone. A post about how disabled people deserve representation is not the place to talk about how "Well, actually, in fiction disabled people should be cured!" Like that's not the fucking universal default???????????

Edit #4:

Everyone needs to stop tagging this singing praise for Fullmetal Alchemist. A story that uses disability as a punishment and the characters are on a quest to cure their disabilities is not the amazing representation you're all claiming it is just because the character who is only disabled because of DIVINE PUNISHMENT uses prosthetics.

Read this post, and this one. Fullmetal Alchemist is a hell of a lot more ableist than you people are letting on.

guess what you can now find a PDF version of this post on the web archive.

Edit #5! August 23rd, 2023!

A) Everyone. Disabilities that can only exist in the magical setting are still disabilities.

Trying to cure the younger brother's magical disability of being a soul floating around in a magical suit of armour is, in fact, going on a quest to heal a disability!

It doesn't matter if the older brother doesn't want to get his limbs back when they're going on a quest to heal the younger brother's disability! Especially when they BOTH get magically healed at the end!

Magical disabilities that can only exist in that setting, but not real life, are still disabilities, and it's not okay to magically heal them either! What part of the Garfield meme on this post did you all choose to ignore?!

B) When you leave tags on a post you are reblogging, the original poster can see them! When you leave tags on this post, I can see them!

If you think this post is ""too aggressive"" then simply do not reblog it! Don't fucking tone police me on a post I've had to edit five times now due to the constant ableism people have been commenting since I made it!

I have been called the R slur by multiple people in response to this post! People have literally reblogged this post to defend eugenics abortions! You can't see these comments or replies anymore because I blocked the poster!

If you think minorities are being too aggressive by responding appropriately to bigotry, you're a bigot! And you should either not reblog the post at all, or at the very least, shut the fuck up and not tone police us!

Do not fucking put tags on this post complaining I'm being too aggressive! That's called tone policing and you're a bigot if you do it! Don't fucking do it on anyone else's posts either! They can see your tags too!

C) When I fucking say Harry Potter fans are banned from this post, yes, this means YOU!

Either stop supporting a billionaire who's literally using the profits from her bigoted shittily written books to fund REAL FUCKING GENOCIDE, or fuck off!

By continuing to support the Harry Potter series, you are literally giving JK Rowling free fucking advertising! You are encouraging more people to read the series and watch the movies, spending more money and giving her more fucking money with which to LITERALLY SHAPE A COUNTRY'S LAWS TO COMMIT GENOCIDE. She is literally fucking fighting to make being trans illegal! She is literally fucking fighting to have even more of autistic people's rights taken away!

You cannot fucking be a fan of the Harry Potter series in 2023 and call yourself an ally to all the minorities harmed by JK Rowling and the bigotry baked into her shitty series!

Read another book! The Web Archive has tons you can read for free! Literally every single book on gutenberg.org/ is free! Including audiobooks for some of them!

If you write Harry Potter fanfiction, simply fucking get rid of the names and identifiable features and start writing original fiction instead! It's literally free!

Not supporting a literal fucking genocidal billionaire costs LITERALLY NOTHING! And if you refuse to fucking stop supporting JK Rowling, which is what you are doing when you support the Harry Potter series and squeal over her OCs, you are not an ally to any fucking minority! No! Not even if you're trans yourself!

= = =

Edit again Nobember 28th 2023 because this comment is just. such a perfect example for all of you that think this doesn't happen.

butter-whore2 said, two hours before this edit:

kind of a fan of tumblr's slightly more algorithmically elements for reminding me of the hell's other people construct for themselves but this one hits like five of the boxes. How do people do this to themselves? it's such a bizarre way to act over media I genuinely do not believe is capable of stirring an emotional response the metaphysics of disability here are unintentionally really funny but disability is not a coherent ontological framework, it's a vague descriptor for literally thousands of different things none of which lend themselves to categorizing Moralizing over fiction is incredibly lame.

Liking harry potter is also incredibly lame, it's not morally wrong nor transphobic and you do not get to decide that lol. people literally do get "cured" of their disabilities all the time, many of them have a positive experience in doing so. this is not what eugenics is.

the anti abortion stuff lol

Literally how do you live like this? you guys don't even read real books I don't get it.

Archived version of the comment for posterity.

So yeah, lofl, block this fucker.

[nightmaretour]

If you consider yourself a disabled activist or ally and still go around saying shit like "Am I having a stroke?" or "I feel like I'm having a stroke!!" or "you/x must be having a stroke!" in a joking/insulting manner have you considered that maybe you aren't, you're just fucking ableist and I'm allowed to throw rocks at you

[ionlytalktodogs]

Controversial take but it’s actually not the job of random disabled people to educate your kids on disabilities. If your child stares, asks a rude question, or gets in the way of a disabled person, the responsibility falls on you to deal with that. It’s not the child’s fault for being curious or uneducated (that is quite literally the JOB of children) but it’s also not the job of a literal stranger to parent your kid for you.

[aroaceleovaldez]

one of the things that I found particularly interesting in Demigods of Olympus is that it finally gives the best direct comparison we've seen so far between Percy and another character's experiences in terms of academics and particularly ableist discrimination.

The way Zane describes his experiences and what we see in his POV is that, while he is similarly discriminated against for his "atypical" behavior and blame is placed on him, the only sorts of punishments he receives for this are relatively benign, such as an increase in counseling. (It is also notable that Zane is somewhat autistic-coded, such as having the "incorrect" scripts when speaking with adults and Sam explicitly reminding him to remember to make proper eye contact.) Percy, on the other hand, similarly experiences discrimination for "atypical" behavior, but whereas Zane is treated as "too smart for his own good" and given slaps on the wrist, Percy is automatically labeled as aggressive, destructive, and a trouble-maker based on preconceived assumptions about him and is more severely punished, such as being frequently expelled.

We rarely get this level of direct comparison between Percy's experiences and that of another character, particularly such similar experiences, so looking at the differences is really interesting to gauge what their different experiences with ableist discrimination is like - and how it could potentially tie into intersectionality and other forms of discrimination at play for them.

For instance, Zane's parents are generally heavily implied to be middle-class and/or generally financially secure, versus Percy who grew up poor, so it could be classism in combination with ableist discrimination. Alternatively, it could be intersectionality with racial discrimination, as neurodivergent behavior in people of color is significantly more likely to be punished more severely and labeled as aggressive or disruptive behavior due to racist preconceptions - particularly since we know Percy's experiences with ableist discrimination are also somewhat based on assumptions people make regarding his appearance. Both Zane and Percy are racially ambiguous - Zane's appearance essentially being completely unspecified, but Percy at least having some notable details such as having a deep tan complexion. If not racism, it could also be colorism, which in this context often has similar intersectionality. There's a lot of potential options.

It's just very interesting to me! I love having such a direct point of comparison to examine the experiences of two characters within.

[magnetothemagnificent]

"Neurospicy" is the same to me as "differently abled" and "handicapable" and "autism is a superpower".

[disabled-dragoon]

More and more I'm exposed to the trend of people seeing me, an ambulatory wheelchair user, out of my chair and feeling the need to express how "proud" or "happy" they are to see me walking and I need these people to understand that, while I know it's often coming from a good place, that is such a condescending, utterly demeaning thing to say to someone who uses any form of disability aid, not least a wheelchair user

[talkingattumble]

Chronic pain is. Such an unfathomable concept to people. I’ll be like “hey I’m gonna rest for an hour or two because I reached my limit on walking/exercise and I’m in a lot of pain right now” and then a family member or friend will say”actually this article says that’s really bad for you” and the article in question is always something like “Health Tips for the Average Normal Healthy Person by Mike Ablebodied”

Not to mention finding resources like. I’ll find resources by disabled people and it’ll be like “hey exercise is important, but find a way to workout that uses less spoons, and if you’re having a high pain day then take a break, and here’s some exercises you can do from bed”. And then I’ll find some able bodied persons fibromyalgia tips and it’s like “if you don’t walk sixteen miles every day your muscles will atrophy and you’ll die also your mobility aid makes you weak”. Guess which one of those sources I trust more. And now guess which sources the people around me always seem to find and listen to. Are these kinds of things common or am I just unlucky? Does anyone else have this problem?

[yuri-puppies]

deciding that affectionately referring to someone as a grandparent is some sort of ableist slur is one of the wildest takes i've seen in a while and it's genuinely baffling how much hold the idea has in certain sections of the fandom

i have such a positive association with that term as an expression of solidarity between disabled people

my (queer, neurodivergent, disabled) friend group in undergrad (in our 20s!) called ourselves "the grandmas" to express how alienated we felt from other young queers, to reclaim our "old lady bodies" and our "old-fashioned hobbies"

the middle aged and elderly folks saying my sibling and i "went old ahead of time" at low impact exercise and folk dancing classes were welcoming us into the fold and expressing solidarity

i hate the pain and fatigue of my disability, how unreliable it makes it and i occasionally resent the ways it excludes me from mainstream society

but i love elders and i'm glad to have been welcomed prematurely into their ranks

yes i know the linking of youth with ablebodiedness should be challenged, and i know my experiences aren't universal, but we also need to take things in the spirit intended. targeting disabled people expressing self-recognition through a fictional character or young folks poking fun of themselves for how disproportionately they perceive age is just weird and pointless

[identitty-dickruption]

I don't know who needs to hear this, but if you have disability accommodations at uni/school/work, you don't have to just use them for the disability you originally applied for them with. if you get no-questions-asked extensions on assignments or extra time on exams or whatever, you are allowed to lie about why you need those. take whatever these institutions will give you. being disabled can be shit for more reasons than just your face-value symptoms, and you deserve whatever you can get

this is ESPECIALLY true for those of us with stigmatised disorders that we haven't disclosed. when I struggle with uni work due to psychosis or addiction, I have no choice but to blame my autism or my chronic pain. and you know what? that is 100x better than trusting an ableist institution with sensitive information about yourself. don't feel guilty for lying about this stuff